I did plant them all very close together and I may thin them out at some point. However, the sunflowers are planted at the same density on top of both the contractor paper and on the cardboard but the growth on top of cardboard is significantly diminished. The dense planting of the sunflowers does not appear to be a factor in why they are not growing well on top of cardboard compared to contractor paper.
Totally agree that would be ideal but I wanted to see what I could do in extreme conditions. We had a lot of wet weather and the cardboard broke down very quickly directly under the small layer of soil I added so the sunflower roots could grow through everything.
I put at least 6 inches of soil on top of cardboard. I tried with less and it didn't work as well. I tried again with more soil on top and that did the trick for me.
Thanks for sharing! Good to know what worked for you. My experiment was definitely extreme with the small amount of soil I used and more soil on top of the cardboard would have definitely helped but I’m still pretty shocked at the different between the excellent growth on contractor paper compared to cardboard.
Your cardboard is thicker than your contractor paper. Your amount of soil above the cardboard is too thin and your roots are most likely matting, instead of penetrating the cardboard, which will take time to decompose. You need more soil on your cardboard, so root have more space/time to grow, while waiting for the cardboard to decompose. If you don't want to wait, use thinner material, like contractor paper which decomposes faster. Really your issue is time it takes to decompose your root blocking layer and amount of soil your plants can use while waiting to punch through. Nothing to do with PFAS or "toxins" most likely.
Hmm interesting. I have checked and found the roots of the sunflowers reached the soil below the cardboard. It could be the sunflowers took longer to break through the thicker cardboard though and were stunted along the way.
Cardboard sheet mulching over grass is a common and effective practice among organic gardeners. I took this to the extreme with a thin layer of soil on top and it is definitely working very well where I used contractor paper
There's not enough organic matter on top of the cardboard. Also, did you wet the cardboard thoroughly before adding the organics? Looks dry. My guess is that since the paper is thinner it gets wet easier, and the roots can push through and reach the ground soil underneath.
The cardboard has been rained on consistently for many weeks. It got wet enough that is broke down in the middle and the sunflower roots were able to reach the soil below.
I thought the same thing as well but I checked and it degraded enough for the sunflower roots to reach the soil below. We’ve had a lot of wet weather this spring in the Midwest that has helped with decomposition.
Dude, you need to put way more soil on top of the cardboard. The idea is the plant has enough to start getting established and get roots down through the cardboard and into the soil below. Here you just have a thin layer that dries out and is so light it's probably full of gaps . Cardboard works very well put down in autumn with at least 5 nches of compost on top and watered thoroughly.
I totally agree my experiment was pretty extreme but I did confirm the sunflowers have made it through to the soil under the cardboard. The sunflowers growing on top of the contractor paper are thriving.
I love sitting down on the ground while working in the garden, just as you are doing here on the video. Just be sure to check for ticks at the end of the day. Your yard seems to have lots of biodiversity. Love it!
Yes I absolutely love sitting down and being in touch with nature and my garden. That’s why I’m not the biggest fan of really tall raised beds. I’d rather be immersed right in the action of everything. Your advice about ticks is VERY important. The diseases they carry are horrible. I try to fill my yard with as much variety and biodiversity as possible. I want live in a lovely pollinator food jungle.
@@yardtogarden looking into it, it's recycled cardboard. Tbh, I wouldn't personally worry too much about the forever chemicals in your mulch. If you eat seafood, you're probably eating more that way than whatever made it through the processing. Pfas is used to repell water so the cardboard, contract paper, and recycled cardboard is way less likely to have them than something like a laminated box.
Agreed but I’d still like to limit exposure where possible. I’ve now had many people say some cardboard is treated with formaldehyde, pesticides, or can be contaminated with chemicals depending on the source. Not sure the validity of everything but it’s worth taking into consideration.
@@yardtogarden oh it certainly can be. I'd personally still paper mulch or cardboard it if I need to over some of the other weed barrier options. I suspect for the boxes you get, your biggest concern would be the adhesives and any laminates. I work in chemical production so you'll never see the boxes from my work at my house, but the overabundance of Amazon boxes will probably make it into certain areas of my yard.
Interesting! The main thing I was worried about was the Bermuda grass in my front lawn. I’ve done lawn conversions before with just grass clippings or woodchips but the Bermuda grass is a different animal.
The sunflower roots can't get through the cardboard, and there isn't much soil above to work with. You probably have planted some jerusalem artichokes for a sunflower directly in the lawn, grass would be no obstacle for them.
I checked under the cardboard and confirmed the roots have made it through. Jerusalem artichokes would be a GREAT idea and I did plant these in other parts of the yard but ran out before I took on this project. When I’ve done this type of lawn conversion in the past I started with potatoes which do great growing up through many layers of mulch and whatever you want to throw on top.
No I did not! For the first year I put down a thick layer of grass clippings on grass cut as short as possible and then planted seedlings in the soil underneath everything with the mulch surrounding them. The grass underneath will immediately start to weaken and by the time the seedlings spread out their roots there will be very little competition and they should grow well. If you are worried about aggressive weeds in the grass you can cut out sections of it and flip it over to reveal the soil and roots underneath, so basically put these cut out sections grass side down toward the ground. Then you can plant on top and spread grass clippings as mulch on top. I have done this in some areas in my yard as well. With this method you can plant seeds with a thin layer of mulch on top. Best to plant seeds or tubers that grow easily first year and can come up through mulch such as sunflowers, potatoes, onion sets, garlic, etc. strawberries can be grown on top of everything to fill in the gaps and act as a really good ground cover. With any of these methods I recommend trying it on a small section of your yard first so you can see what works best before committing to converting larger areas. For extremely aggressive weeds and grass like Bermuda grass I would be hesitant to convert grass without a very thick layer of woodchips possibly with contractor paper below that and then planted VERY densely as to shade out any Bermuda grass that might try to creep in.
Seen and used cardboard a lot. Have never seen planting on top of the cardboard. Always made a hole or placed right up to a few inches from stem or trunk.
Takes a LONG time for cardboard to break down. If you verimicompost, the worms break down the cardboard better. The paper breaks down faster. Fabric barrier can cause molding & fungal growth.
I thought the same thing and although the cardboard is not completely broken down I was surprised at how fast the roots of the sunflowers were able to penetrate through to the soil underneath. Here in the Midwest we get a ton of rain which helps speed the process along.
@@yardtogarden the roots penetrated the paper, not the cardboard. I put cardboard down in my yard (NW AZ) to help suppress weeds & have plans to build a brick planter (no mortar) in top. The soil & all the great garden critters ( worms, rolly pollies, etc) & watering the plants will help with the breakdown. It will still take time, but the planter depth & soil depth will help with it.
Yes I completely understand holes in the cardboard would have been ideal but I wanted to see what the sunflowers could do and sure enough the roots made it through the cardboard already to the soil below.
This was definitely an extreme experiment to see if sunflowers could grow with just a little bit of soil on top of cardboard. We’ve had a lot of wet weather here in the Midwest, this spring and early summer and that allowed the cardboard to break down enough for the sunflower roots to reach the soil below I’ve confirmed this with both the cardboard sunflowers and the ones on top of contractor paper.
I did! Fortunately I added a bit of soil on top and I’ve also confirmed the roots of the sunflowers have reached the soil below on both the cardboard and contractor paper.
You may think weed fabric is bad but someone before me put it down on top of thick, heavy white plastic that weighs a ton and I think I need a machete to cut through it. Unbelievable stuff. And yes, you have to spray weeds in the warm weather because the mulch breaks down to become a growing compound.
Oh no! That sounds like my nightmare. The best way I’ve found to remove it if that’s your aim is to remove as much of the material from on top of it, find one end, and start rolling it up like a sushi roll. That works better than tearing it off price by piece.
@@yardtogarden Unfortunately they planted crepe myrtles and lilacs at the top of the bank (with an asphalt prarking spot on the top level side) and the roots of the trees are on top of that plastic and on top, underneath and woven thru the weed fabric on top of the plastic. Wanna come help?
@@yardtogarden Carpet will last a very long time and what about the chemicals in your water that you use on your garden with chlorine, Fluoride. What about the concrete you use for your house or fence post that leach out calcium hydroxide or The cleaning chemicals like bleach you use for your toilet If there is a septic tank. Don't get me started about how many things come off of your car when you drive it, such as zinc, copper, lead, magnesium etc etc in your driveway that get washed out into your yard when it rains. Lol
@@yardtogarden Carpet will last a very long time and what about the chemicals in your water that you use on your garden with chlorine, Fluoride. What about the concrete you use for your house or fence post that leach out calcium hydroxide or The cleaning chemicals like bleach you use for your toilet If there is a septic tank. Don't get me started about how many things come off of your car when you drive it, such as zinc, copper, lead, magnesium etc etc in your driveway that get washed out into your yard when it rains. Lol
I don’t water my garden we get plenty of rain here in the Midwest and I plant densely and mulch heavily I used t-posts that are removable and didn’t use any kind of concrete or chemicals to set them I use only vinegar based cleaning products without toxic chemicals
The sunflowers look too dense. Thinning may help
I did plant them all very close together and I may thin them out at some point.
However, the sunflowers are planted at the same density on top of both the contractor paper and on the cardboard but the growth on top of cardboard is significantly diminished.
The dense planting of the sunflowers does not appear to be a factor in why they are not growing well on top of cardboard compared to contractor paper.
you need to apply compost on top pf the cardboard to help it break down faster
Totally agree that would be ideal but I wanted to see what I could do in extreme conditions. We had a lot of wet weather and the cardboard broke down very quickly directly under the small layer of soil I added so the sunflower roots could grow through everything.
I put at least 6 inches of soil on top of cardboard. I tried with less and it didn't work as well. I tried again with more soil on top and that did the trick for me.
Thanks for sharing! Good to know what worked for you.
My experiment was definitely extreme with the small amount of soil I used and more soil on top of the cardboard would have definitely helped but I’m still pretty shocked at the different between the excellent growth on contractor paper compared to cardboard.
Your cardboard is thicker than your contractor paper.
Your amount of soil above the cardboard is too thin and your roots are most likely matting, instead of penetrating the cardboard, which will take time to decompose.
You need more soil on your cardboard, so root have more space/time to grow, while waiting for the cardboard to decompose.
If you don't want to wait, use thinner material, like contractor paper which decomposes faster.
Really your issue is time it takes to decompose your root blocking layer and amount of soil your plants can use while waiting to punch through.
Nothing to do with PFAS or "toxins" most likely.
Hmm interesting. I have checked and found the roots of the sunflowers reached the soil below the cardboard. It could be the sunflowers took longer to break through the thicker cardboard though and were stunted along the way.
I would never think to grow a flower on top of cardboard.
Cardboard sheet mulching over grass is a common and effective practice among organic gardeners. I took this to the extreme with a thin layer of soil on top and it is definitely working very well where I used contractor paper
Oh neat!
Yes it is!
There's not enough organic matter on top of the cardboard. Also, did you wet the cardboard thoroughly before adding the organics? Looks dry.
My guess is that since the paper is thinner it gets wet easier, and the roots can push through and reach the ground soil underneath.
The cardboard has been rained on consistently for many weeks. It got wet enough that is broke down in the middle and the sunflower roots were able to reach the soil below.
I would say that the cardboard is taking too long to degrade.
I thought the same thing as well but I checked and it degraded enough for the sunflower roots to reach the soil below. We’ve had a lot of wet weather this spring in the Midwest that has helped with decomposition.
Dude, you need to put way more soil on top of the cardboard. The idea is the plant has enough to start getting established and get roots down through the cardboard and into the soil below. Here you just have a thin layer that dries out and is so light it's probably full of gaps . Cardboard works very well put down in autumn with at least 5 nches of compost on top and watered thoroughly.
I totally agree my experiment was pretty extreme but I did confirm the sunflowers have made it through to the soil under the cardboard. The sunflowers growing on top of the contractor paper are thriving.
Thanks for the comparison!
You’re welcome!
I love sitting down on the ground while working in the garden, just as you are doing here on the video. Just be sure to check for ticks at the end of the day.
Your yard seems to have lots of biodiversity. Love it!
Yes I absolutely love sitting down and being in touch with nature and my garden. That’s why I’m not the biggest fan of really tall raised beds. I’d rather be immersed right in the action of everything.
Your advice about ticks is VERY important. The diseases they carry are horrible.
I try to fill my yard with as much variety and biodiversity as possible. I want live in a lovely pollinator food jungle.
@@yardtogarden We're on the same wave length. 🤓
Perfect 🤩
They make biodegradable landscape fabric. Garden paper and paper mulch are other names.
Oh interesting I haven’t heard of the biodegradable version. Thanks for the input!
@@yardtogarden looking into it, it's recycled cardboard. Tbh, I wouldn't personally worry too much about the forever chemicals in your mulch. If you eat seafood, you're probably eating more that way than whatever made it through the processing.
Pfas is used to repell water so the cardboard, contract paper, and recycled cardboard is way less likely to have them than something like a laminated box.
Agreed but I’d still like to limit exposure where possible.
I’ve now had many people say some cardboard is treated with formaldehyde, pesticides, or can be contaminated with chemicals depending on the source. Not sure the validity of everything but it’s worth taking into consideration.
@@yardtogarden oh it certainly can be. I'd personally still paper mulch or cardboard it if I need to over some of the other weed barrier options. I suspect for the boxes you get, your biggest concern would be the adhesives and any laminates. I work in chemical production so you'll never see the boxes from my work at my house, but the overabundance of Amazon boxes will probably make it into certain areas of my yard.
Interesting! The main thing I was worried about was the Bermuda grass in my front lawn. I’ve done lawn conversions before with just grass clippings or woodchips but the Bermuda grass is a different animal.
The sunflower roots can't get through the cardboard, and there isn't much soil above to work with.
You probably have planted some jerusalem artichokes for a sunflower directly in the lawn, grass would be no obstacle for them.
I checked under the cardboard and confirmed the roots have made it through.
Jerusalem artichokes would be a GREAT idea and I did plant these in other parts of the yard but ran out before I took on this project.
When I’ve done this type of lawn conversion in the past I started with potatoes which do great growing up through many layers of mulch and whatever you want to throw on top.
So when you put down the grass clippings, did you then add soil on top of the grass clippings to plant into?
No I did not!
For the first year I put down a thick layer of grass clippings on grass cut as short as possible and then planted seedlings in the soil underneath everything with the mulch surrounding them. The grass underneath will immediately start to weaken and by the time the seedlings spread out their roots there will be very little competition and they should grow well.
If you are worried about aggressive weeds in the grass you can cut out sections of it and flip it over to reveal the soil and roots underneath, so basically put these cut out sections grass side down toward the ground. Then you can plant on top and spread grass clippings as mulch on top. I have done this in some areas in my yard as well. With this method you can plant seeds with a thin layer of mulch on top. Best to plant seeds or tubers that grow easily first year and can come up through mulch such as sunflowers, potatoes, onion sets, garlic, etc. strawberries can be grown on top of everything to fill in the gaps and act as a really good ground cover.
With any of these methods I recommend trying it on a small section of your yard first so you can see what works best before committing to converting larger areas.
For extremely aggressive weeds and grass like Bermuda grass I would be hesitant to convert grass without a very thick layer of woodchips possibly with contractor paper below that and then planted VERY densely as to shade out any Bermuda grass that might try to creep in.
@@yardtogarden oh okay thanks so much!!
@@gianfrancopaladino961You’re welcome! Happy gardening 👨🌾
There is glue used in corrugated cardboard.
Yes I’ve heard that and I’ve also heard the glue is supposed to be plant based and compostable
Seen and used cardboard a lot. Have never seen planting on top of the cardboard. Always made a hole or placed right up to a few inches from stem or trunk.
Yes that is what you usually SHOULD do but I wanted to experiment with a tiny bit of soil and see what the sunflowers could do.
Takes a LONG time for cardboard to break down. If you verimicompost, the worms break down the cardboard better. The paper breaks down faster.
Fabric barrier can cause molding & fungal growth.
I thought the same thing and although the cardboard is not completely broken down I was surprised at how fast the roots of the sunflowers were able to penetrate through to the soil underneath.
Here in the Midwest we get a ton of rain which helps speed the process along.
@@yardtogarden the roots penetrated the paper, not the cardboard. I put cardboard down in my yard (NW AZ) to help suppress weeds & have plans to build a brick planter (no mortar) in top. The soil & all the great garden critters ( worms, rolly pollies, etc) & watering the plants will help with the breakdown. It will still take time, but the planter depth & soil depth will help with it.
I have checked the roots on both the contractor paper and the cardboard and the roots have reached the soil underneath.
@@yardtogarden interesting…🤔
I know I thought so as well
I did the same but you have to create holes in the cardboard and contractor paper
Yes I completely understand holes in the cardboard would have been ideal but I wanted to see what the sunflowers could do and sure enough the roots made it through the cardboard already to the soil below.
A hole needs to be put through cardboard as the young roots make a U turn when they hit the card board duh
This was definitely an extreme experiment to see if sunflowers could grow with just a little bit of soil on top of cardboard. We’ve had a lot of wet weather here in the Midwest, this spring and early summer and that allowed the cardboard to break down enough for the sunflower roots to reach the soil below I’ve confirmed this with both the cardboard sunflowers and the ones on top of contractor paper.
Wait a minute, you planted your seeds on *top* of the cardboard? There-s your problem right there. Either run it to either side or cut holes in it.
I did! Fortunately I added a bit of soil on top and I’ve also confirmed the roots of the sunflowers have reached the soil below on both the cardboard and contractor paper.
You may think weed fabric is bad but someone before me put it down on top of thick, heavy white plastic that weighs a ton and I think I need a machete to cut through it. Unbelievable stuff. And yes, you have to spray weeds in the warm weather because the mulch breaks down to become a growing compound.
Oh no! That sounds like my nightmare. The best way I’ve found to remove it if that’s your aim is to remove as much of the material from on top of it, find one end, and start rolling it up like a sushi roll. That works better than tearing it off price by piece.
@@yardtogarden Unfortunately they planted crepe myrtles and lilacs at the top of the bank (with an asphalt prarking spot on the top level side) and the roots of the trees are on top of that plastic and on top, underneath and woven thru the weed fabric on top of the plastic. Wanna come help?
Wow that would not be a simple fix then. I hope you have a future with plastic free gardening at some point (maybe not this location)
Use old carpet.
I’m looking for something that will breakdown over time and I suspect old carpet has the potential to leach chemicals into the soil.
@@yardtogarden Carpet will last a very long time and what about the chemicals in your water that you use on your garden with chlorine, Fluoride. What about the concrete you use for your house or fence post that leach out calcium hydroxide or The cleaning chemicals like bleach you use for your toilet If there is a septic tank. Don't get me started about how many things come off of your car when you drive it, such as zinc, copper, lead, magnesium etc etc in your driveway that get washed out into your yard when it rains. Lol
@@yardtogarden Carpet will last a very long time and what about the chemicals in your water that you use on your garden with chlorine, Fluoride. What about the concrete you use for your house or fence post that leach out calcium hydroxide or The cleaning chemicals like bleach you use for your toilet If there is a septic tank. Don't get me started about how many things come off of your car when you drive it, such as zinc, copper, lead, magnesium etc etc in your driveway that get washed out into your yard when it rains. Lol
I don’t water my garden we get plenty of rain here in the Midwest and I plant densely and mulch heavily
I used t-posts that are removable and didn’t use any kind of concrete or chemicals to set them
I use only vinegar based cleaning products without toxic chemicals
You may not be able to avoid all exposure that is true. But you can work to reduce where possible and minimize risk.
The guy is nine too bright.
This was an extreme experiment to see if sunflowers could grow in pretty harsh conditions.