Martin Rees: If Science is to Save Us, Part 1
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- Опубликовано: 14 май 2024
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A message from Lawrence Krauss for this episode:
This is the second podcast dialogue we are airing with renowned astrophysicist, Astronomer Royal, and former President of the Royal Society, Lord Martin Rees. The first time I sat down with Martin for the Podcast we discussed his life in science, and topics ranging from the state of modern cosmology to the potential conflicts between science and religion (which he views as minimal, and I don’t). Martin’s thinking, and his expertise, go far beyond these topics however. Based on his experience at the Royal Society, as an elected member of the House of Lords, and working with the Center for Existential Risk at Cambridge, Martin has thought carefully about the challenges we face as a society in the 21st century, and how science can be marshaled to help us address these challenges. He has written a new book on the subject called If Science is to Save Us. I thought it would be useful and interesting to sit down with Martin to discuss the ideas he raises there, and our conversation turned out to be so wide-ranging that we are presenting it in two separate episodes of the podcast. This is the first release, and I am sure you will find his thoughtful and incisive comments both provocative and inspiring. As always, I benefitted greatly from my conversation with him, and I hope you do as well.
Consider supporting the podcast and the Origins Project Foundation at originsproject.org/
The Origins Podcast, a production of The Origins Project Foundation, features in-depth conversations with some of the most interesting people in the world about the issues that impact all of us in the 21st century. Host, theoretical physicist, lecturer, and author, Lawrence M. Krauss, will be joined by guests from a wide range of fields, including science, the arts, and journalism. The topics discussed on The Origins Podcast reflect the full range of the human experience - exploring science and culture in a way that seeks to entertain, educate, and inspire.
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I was going to use my lunch break to catch up with some work but then RUclips recommended this video and there went all my plans! :') Completely worth it though, I'll be back after work to hear the rest. Thank you both so so much for this wonderful discussion.😊🙏
Just finished part 1, looking forward to part 2! :)
I really appreciate this conversation and the entire podcast!
Brilliant conversation, enjoyed it immensely ❤ thank you
It seems our most difficult problem is not one of science and technology but that of government/philosophy. When our best scientists reach a consensus how do we get our mass of humanity to support the necessary actions for solving the problems?
Hi Michael. Maybe the problem is that the economic system has a “lock-in” effect and unwanted externalities. Certainly if the needed actions were abundantly funded the work would get done. A clever work around would be to offer payments through a new institution and a new financial instrument. That way there’s no forced compliance but the work would be fairly rewarded. It’s the central idea of Ministry for the Future.
I think in the west, we can see clear examples of gov, philosophy, and junk science being indistinguishable and in lockstep...just as it has always been
lol what. reach a consensus on what, how?
so that we can lockdown the world to put it in economic disaster for 2 years, over a virus with the characteristics with which we haven ever done such a thing before in human history, because it would be braindead?
Thank you for bringing us these amazing people and enrich our lives! I am looking forward to every new podcast with great excitement .
Hey Lawrence, love your work, thank you for this wonderful episode 🙏 all the best, from the son of your old Gardener Vidal, in Australia 💜
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I have been impressed by your work proffeser and your guest's
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Mr. Rees eloquently dances around the subject of declining mental plasticity. He is very much aware.
We can't estimate "natural capital" because we have no way to fully appreciate the benefits nature provides. Every former estimate was found to continually underappreciate the benefits and complexity of organisms and their ecoaystems. Nature is priceless.
WE CAN ALWAYS DEPEND ON SCIENCE TO SAVE THE WORLD.
Science doesn't write or implement policy.
this question itself bogus. It shows how regressive these men, of a particular elite order are. These people are behaving like 14th century europeans, battling the black plagues and praying
to god "If you save us"... "Save us". These mainstream scientists are basically religious about science. The kind of science they speak of, serves just about 15% of the world's population. The kind of science they speak of, is still based on extraction, mining, colonization and destruction of the ecosystem. A bullshit discourse, given climate change, global warming, mass exodus, rising sea levels and abrupt climate breakdown will smash any science or non-science without distinguishing. Lawrence Krauss represents science which serves one master, that is late-capitalism in essence.
Science got us into this mess. But yeah maybe solar geoengineering will help. Who knows
I can't tell if this is sarcasm or not. The all caps thing indicates the intent was not straightforward.
Science will not save us from ourselves.
I think a conversation like this should always start at defining the core concepts. It's because too many disciplines call themselves science but they aren't really - e.g many of the social sciences.
Hard sciences also lost a bit of their reputation, when we learnt that corporations where corrupting scientists to write fraudulent papers (tobacco and oil industries). This was a catastrophe in my view, because science and scientists used to be very trusted by the public. Ever since, at least in the West, there is no social institution left that ppl trust. We saw during Covid the consequences of this.
On the other hand, I would love to read the book, but in my mind still resonates the complaining of Kant: we have made such a progress in science and technology, but too little in morals. We are basically perry savages especially when grouped.
We even got worse in the last decades with social media amplifying narcissism and sociopathic features.
From this perspective, Science may be our demise - which was btw a conjecture of distinguished physicists like Sagan, I believe.
Excellent conversation. A major concern is that our planet cannot support, currently, exponential growth, whereas capitalism today requires it. My hope is that there is more discussion and insight into this subject before we face a global wake-up call. Optimistic nevertheless.
Humblee
Indeed Fer (same name as me... Quite rare... ;-)), these conversations are so fascinating, inspiring and thought provoking that they cross my plans regularly; I have the same experience... Wonderful!!
Find The Origins channel on RUclips.
What a nice and very erudite gentleman. Very good to see the young Mr. Krauss listening so attentively. Great upbeat chat. Loved it, even with its terrible glossing over of the elephant that starts at around 42 mins. Krauss gets very close to ridding himself of "scientism" at 52 mins. Frankenstein indeed!
I have to say, Lawrence, that given the weight of the topic, the duck is hilarious!
Hi, Science can help very much, implement good ideas, and avoid great dangers, for humanity, thank you guys great minds. ...
True science seeks the knowledge of HOW.
Implementing good ideas is human conscience and foresight.
@@steveflorida8699 I would add wisdom to that 😊
I would listen on Spotify, but these podcasts are much lower in volume than other podcasts I listen to. It’s a shame as I quite enjoy listening to what Lawrence has to say.
noice one mate
I have a feeling those crying follow the science most loud are the most corrupt ones
Unlike Americans and English I'm an Australian, freedom of will, freedom to think is the separation between you and me.
30:00 DeSantis is Yale undergrad, Harvard Law, Lawrence, but his Surgeon General, Joseph A. Ladapo, MD, PhD., received his medical degree from Harvard and PhD in Health Policy from Harvard Graduate School of Arts and Sciences. He completed his clinical training in internal medicine at the Beth Israel Deaconess Medical Center, where he received the Harvard Medical School Class of 2012 Resident Teaching Award and the Daniel E. Ford Award in Health Services and Outcomes Research from John Hopkins University.
Lawrence, we all occasionally speak in willful ignorance through fear and bias, but please do better in the future. DeSantis is a politician, but a highly educated one.
Joseph Goebbels had a Ph.D from Heidelberg in German literature.
Perhaps you would be well served to go back and reread the Limits to Growth. It's standard run model predicted that the crisis would come in the 2030-40 range. We've had a 50 -70% decrease in wildlife biomass since the report was written.
Thank you for bringing up population growth being the cause for biodiversity loss. The extinction rate is rapidly increasing and significant instability of ecosystems already exist. There is no greater cause for species exrinction than the birth of a human due to the massive footprints. We overshoot resource regrowth every year.
As a resident of the US, my ezistence is tremendously diminished by the knowledge and experience of having too high of a human population in the US. I see the destructuon due to human consumption every day and I know what has already been lost. Extinction is forever.
this question itself bogus. It shows how regressive these men, of a particular elite order are. These people are behaving like 14th century europeans, battling the black plagues and praying
to god "If you save us"... "Save us". These mainstream scientists are basically religious about science. The kind of science they speak of, serves just about 15% of the world's population. The kind of science they speak of, is still based on extraction, mining, colonization and destruction of the ecosystem. A bullshit discourse, given climate change, global warming, mass exodus, rising sea levels and abrupt climate breakdown will smash any science or non-science without distinguishing. Lawrence Krauss represents science which serves one master, that is late-capitalism in essence. As for "a resident of the US" You consume 4 times more than an average citizen of the earth. So get lost...
I mostly agree with this, but I don't have many ideas for solutions. I think people just keep being prolific in advancing and accepting new technologies because they think it will make their lives better, and to me that is highly debatable
The conversation was long on the need for the public to be alarmed by global warming.
However, Short on scientific/technical solutions... mere rambling on.
The Album 2112/Rush
Disagree with Rees about population and his dismissal of Ehrlich. Maybe Krauss should talk to a scientist who thought a lot about these issues, like Tom Murphy
22:44
Rees would make a good alien, and I mean that as a compliment.
Those who have already advantaged themselves and theirs are loath to give up the status quo!
I think the definition of terror needs some more thought. I agree it's better we don't know. Leak or no leak and from which side. Anyone with the knowledge and expertise should be regulated and monitored.... Instead the pope should talk about birth control to Africans.
I respect Lawrence as a scientist, however he needs to improve his interviewing skills. Ask a question and stop rambling on. There is more of Lawrence speaking than Lord Rees. Despite this, I admire what Lawrence is doing.
Manhatten style project by industry to find methods of recycling most plastics.
How is it possible to be informed when being is informed by cash. Not enough to earn 10 times the average wage?
Well done Krauss, 1 hour 33min before you sneer at religion.
Maybe AI could help us past this era of stupidity and greed?
AI will wind up in the hands of the greediest and most power-hungry and be used primarily for their own totalitarian purposes.
I fear the answer may be a benevolent despot!
How would we make sure he stays benevolent, and what does it mean. I'm sure Putin is quite benevolent to his buddies
Lucy jumps out of the trees, hay presto universities.
Was very disappointed to hear you interrupting and talking over Martin Rees in regards to the potential future danger of lab leaks. He appeared to be making a valid point and was trying to explain, but you basically cut him off, disagreeing but not giving evidence to the contrary and just brushing him off.
So part 1 is about insulting people...righto
😯
Are you saying Rees collected all 3 cash prizes? He must be a Hebrew.
First
Oh. Here's a cookie for the child.
if the environmentalist cared that much they would be up in arms demonstrating about nord stream and the potential use of depleted uranium ammunition in Ukraine or the talk of tactical nuclear weapons, but no, proving they are just tools,
"Motorcyclists should be required to wear helmets" - How about skydivers, or skateboarders, or skiers, or bicyclists, or hang gliders, or horse riders? I know many of these people do, but is it mandated by law and should it be? Kids aren't required to wear seatbelts in school buses, nor passengers on public buses and trains and motorcyclists aren't required to wear them either but the general public is required to wear them in the privacy of their car? Many public debates could be had in these areas with inconclusive results.
More lies! You say you were "lucky enough to have this conversation with Martin Rees" when clearly it was all staged!
Just joking of course. Enjoying the discussion as always...
Yeah nord stream 2 was a nasty business do we know who did that yet and have they been brought to social justice yet, if not why not?
About science "saving us":It may save US ( the people paying attention to science) bit it won't save THEM ( the majority of people out there ) because the majority of people out there are not intellectuals.
I did a thumbs up… and a 👎just for fun 😽
P.S. People who are not intellectuals usually make a good living being that way.For instance I've never seen Donald Trump at a physics lecture yet.
Professor Rees should give back that dirty Templeton money.
Are you seriously comparing Africa to Europe after the Marshall plan? Africa isn't going to "leap frog" anywhere. Genetic differences do exist.
As brilliant as Mssrs Krauss and Rees are, I found this to be a remarkably uninformed conversation. Regarding climate change, it, like biodiversity loss and plastic pollution, is a symptom of a greater threat, overshoot. Overshoot is clearly a function of overpopulation. The only non-coercive way to limit population is the provision of education and opportunity to women worldwide. Regarding the cause of the Covid pandemic, whether or not there was a lab leak is irrelevant in light of the fact that zoonotic viral transmission is a much more likely cause of future pandemics as humans increasingly impinge on habitats.
I really appreciate the Origins podcast and am enjoying this episode, but the suggestion that SARS-CoV-2 came from a lab really illustrates your and Martin Rees's lack of knowledge of the virus and the findings of various investigations is lacking. The vast majority of genomic evidence strongly supports a natural origin for this virus as well as all of the other viruses that have caused large scale epidemics as well as global pandemics over the past 100+ years.
😂😂😂😂 you are a "true believer".
Science itself is not bad or good but when it's in the hands of the capitalists it has always done harm
How about communists?
I can't imagine a more inappropriate and unfounded comment. What's remarkable is the hubris and bizarre sense of confidence you possess.
That is just nonsense pulled out of no where.
Respected British anthropology professor, Dr. Edward Dutton, has demonstrated that “LEFTISM” is due to genetic mutations caused by poor breeding strategies.
🤡
To put it simply, in recent decades, those persons who exhibit leftist traits such as egalitarianism, feminism, gynocentrism, socialism, multiculturalism, transvestism, homosexuality, perverse morality, and laziness, have been reproducing at rates far exceeding the previous norm, leading to an explosion of insane, narcissistic SOCIOPATHS in (mostly) Western societies.
Well, your name says it all..
Bill Gates, Greta, etc...we need more people like them? Erm, that's possibly the stupidest thing Martin has ever said
He looks so lordy lol