Is PVP As Dire As You Think It Is in Destiny 2?
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- Опубликовано: 21 сен 2024
- Has Destiny 2 Crucible PVP lost its magic? Is it as bad as you think or even as it feels? It's time to do an end of season checkup on PVP and see where we're sitting and think about where we could go from here.
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Whatever is happening in PVP doesn’t inspire me to play. I don’t think I’m alone in this
I can't put my finger on it. Whether I have a good or a bad game, its the same lackluster feeling after every match. Just doesn't hit the same anymore. I used to able to play for at least an hour 2 straight of PvP but now it's like 3-4 matches and I have brain rot.
Man I feel the same way. I used to play pvp for hours but I get bored so fast now. Not sure if it’s the lack of good rewards or the meta but something about it just can’t hold my interest for more than a few games.
I'm with ya
Imo it's the checkmate changes it makes it much more boring.
#metoo
If PvP matches dropped loot like Onslaught did I’d be playing it way more
yep, just bribe us to eat a shitty meta.
True
Back in D1, god roll weapons would drop from matches like Eyasluna, Matador and Yf Longbow. Maybe have PVP and some PVE weapons that are actually good drop from matches you might see some increase in the player base.
I literally internally scream Everytime I see the enemy team full of conditional finality. Like....are you serious my guy
They gotta get that kd as high as possible in the uncompetitive space shooter📢📢
@@rhyshuber9981 while I'm just trying to think of new innovative builds for all things warlock to keep my ADHD happy
@@peegeeop4513 literally me in titan lmao💀
Conditional finality is not that serious....
@@jamaledwards8118 if it wasn't then why does it have the most used energy weapon since it's release outside of random forerunner spam weekends
As a PVE main the times I have fun in PVP are when it is just casual fun things like Iron Banner where it doesn't really matter if you win or lose. I play PVP for the loot so anything that gives me more loot would be welcome. The least fun I have in PVP is in trials because it feels like a constant stomp fest with barely any loot to show for it. My solution? 1 guaranteed trials weapon drop every round regardless of a win and a card that starts on a loss but has the max win streak bonus.
The issue with measuring skill for lobby balancing is that people are not mathematical figures. Sometimes they play well and sometimes they play poorly. Even on professional sports there are blowouts. There are multitudes of factors to take into account for whether or not someone will perform well in a match and it’s difficult to account for all of them while also considering connection and queue times.
Yeah but at the same token you can tell pretty easily that some players are "typically" at the higher end of the skill gap, to be fully honest every argument against skill based match making just boils down to Sweat Lords don't want to face other try hard Sweat Lords and just want as many bs pub stomps as possible.
Absolutely true. The way I've always approached pvp is being off-meta. Sure, the meta guns can be strong and overpowering, but I find them boring and cookie cutter. How am I gonna be engaged with a player, or match for that matter, if everyone uses Conditional Finality and Igneous Hammer with every warlock running transversive/Ophidian and every hunter running Stompees? I like the variety of playstyles from different players, when the meta becomes so overwhelming that it drowns out other people's specific builds, players just become Stompees Hunter#456 or Solar Warlock#783
@@TheOldOwl8this is actually soooooo true! They’re soo good at the game… but so bad at the game that they cant compete against people of their own skill level. So they want easy matches to destroy players lower than them to feel good.
What they dont understand is that you *cannot* divorce difficulty from high skill. Difficultly comes with the territory whether they like it or not. That means no more kill streaks. No more 40+ bombs. No more epic plays. No more high KDs. No more looking like you’re a god amongst peasants. No more super easy games. And thats why alot of the main pvp streamers use vpn’s to sneak and cheat their way into bot lobbies just to get super easy games that look good on RUclips. 🤣 they’re losers.
@@Kumari_44 You can try and mock me but I am right, Sweat lords always hate playing other Sweat Lords why do you think they always bitch and moan that SBMM should be removed from everything? Why is it that the average and the casual enjoy and ask for it but the no life meta humping sweats always pitch a fit and demand it be removed?
Oh look its the guy who messages racial things after he losses games nice to see you @sliq
Bagging all the iggy and conditional stans after i kill them with Cerberus+1 is what keeps me coming back
2021 me losing my shit we eating good with the focus fire buff
I just got bagged by one of those while I was using erianas and claws of ahamkara
based af
I do the same but using two year 1 sidearms, i love to see teams of virgins using meta, ugly ass weapons while running away from an old cod player with 2 pistols that do the exact same😂😂
Can agree with the point at 9:00 - I've stopped wanting to play PVP because I'm constantly getting bad matchups. I know I'm not great at the PVP side of the game, but I'm finding it really rough, the times when I do try to dip my toes into it, to learn and improve when I'm stomped so thoroughly that I'm wishing for the Final Shape to be enacted to save me from the torment.
You'd be calcified with someone's guardian squatting in your corpse.
@@Kreau ....that's actually kinda horrifying that I want to retract my statement 🤣
@@thebryanmyersthe bottom line is people just don't like getting stomped regardless of what it's by.
@@OSTATEboi419 see, I don't think that's totally the case. I'm getting my ass handed to me in the fighting games I'm learning, but I'm aware of the curve for them, plus I can easily go back and learn what to do differently.
It's hard to know how to be better in D2 outside of better aim and maybe learning how to build for pvp instead of pve
10:20 TV was spitting facts. I loved hearing that cause I’ve felt the same way. The guys who can’t put down the meta are dependent on it. They have to run it everywhere. The game isn’t fun if they aren’t stomping. They are also the first people to back out of a match if it starts to go the other way. Get’em, TV!
What meta crutches do to a mf. They're fundamentally bad at PvP so they have to crutch OP, skilless strats/weapons. I fought a guy who started losing after sweating his balls off, tbagged me, then quit mid-game to protect his K/D and win-rate lmao. People are losers and need to touch grass and reevaluate their priorities.
His name was Gabyota#3051 btw. Invisibility + Chaperone + Igneous crutches Hunter. He had every meta crutch in the book and still got bodied lmao. I made sure to clip it to laugh at him.
@@MrMultiPlatform lmao who tf are you, bro is LOST
I all but stopped suffering through PVP this season. Have not had fun in that mode in quite awhile
I don't know if it's just my matchmaking, but my lobbies have been absolutely terrible! I'm currently ranked Plat II as I barely play survival yet the majority of my casual control games are sweatier than comp/trials.
Over the past week of me playing, over 3/4 of my games have ended in either a mercy or with half of either team leaving halfway through the match. I get killed by the same weapon in every engagement, Igneous Hammer or Luna's Howl, I just want to go into control and try out new pvp weapons, but if I dare try that I will guaranteed be in the negative. Special weapons and abilities have become rampant once again too, I end up getting killed more from grenade/melee spams than a gun play, not to mention the snowballing effect that special ammo regeneration presents.
On the other side of things, the "balancing" of lobbies with "the first best going to one team, the second best (or next best two, I can't remember) going to the other...", so on and so forth, all this does is makes the majority of my games glorified 1 vs 1's; the majority of my games end with two players being well above positive (sometimes in the tens for their Kd's), and the rest barely above a 1.0 if not negative. In most cases when I'm top fragging or end up winning a game, its because I'm the person in the glorified 1 vs 1 and end up putting others in the exact same spot, just like you said.
I understand the argument of "Get Good" as I often preach it myself. I have worked hard over the past few expansions to get better in crucible and learn how to play engagements, how to move around and play cover/revive's, and everything else, and I've been able to raise my seasonal Kda from being around a 1.3, to the past two season being above a 2.0 Kda, with my best average being a 2.4. With the current matchmaking, I can only go so far when I play on a team with players that don't know how to play together and don't know how to take on engagements, I'm just tired of it but yet I keep playing hoping it will get better.
What's the definition of insanity again? Doing the same thing over and over expecting different results? Because that's what my crucible experience has slowly become.
I've been going through and cleaning my vault very slowly, trying "new" weapons (good to god rolls that have been sitting in my vault for a year...) and I remember a time where I used to love doing that. Seeing what craziness I can get up to with this new stable like a lazer roll, or this outlaw kill clip sidearm... That fun has left in the past several years. I'm average at best and can keep a 1 or so k/d messing around, but if(when) I get in a super sweaty lobby, it doesn't even feel like that weapon I'm testing to see how it performs (or how much fun it is) can keep up with the meta, even after a day of putting in the work to try and get used to its quirks.
lol I love intervention-mode TV. It’s the full-time sweats and the lobby unbalancing that have me relaxing in other games right now.
7:14 this snipe was dirty af 💀
I’ve stayed away from watching pvp videos and been loving PVP for the past 4 weeks. So seeing this video title was def a shock. Is it really that bad? The new territory mode has been super fun
No fucking way I find ballislife on a destiny 2 comment section about pvp
@@KingZ120😂fr bro
@@KingZ120 get used to it.. been a player since D1 day 1
@@ballislife nah I just didn’t expected it lol no hate brodi
I gotta say I have been noticing that it’s been getting more sweaty and I have run into a ton of lagging opponents more than before
The lag started getting more noticeable since the free update
@@hotzauhsebro right?
tbh I recently started playing trials for some god rolls in pve and I feel like it has been less sweaty than the first time I tried it seasons ago, might just because I'm on a flawed card
@@johnkeyes9482 oh I have no issues with Trials bro but when I’m trying to relax in QP that’s when it gets real sweaty lmao
@@Awfully_good True. I'm glad that you guys are not in Asia server, what a mess down here.
I started playing destiny when the very first alpha came out on Xbox 360. Hugely into pvp all through d1 and d2. Ive went flawless more times then I can count, completed so so so many raids. Haven’t played destiny in about a year and a half. Don’t feel the need to play anymore and honestly feel better now that I’m not stressed to get on a video games every Tuesday and Friday
Destiny pvp will always have a special place in my heart. I play pve to get gear for pvp and it will ALWAYS be that way for me.
I started D2 this year and am still a PVE main. I started dabbling in PvP over the last month plus and i have actually started enjoying 6's, dabble in 3's, and even ventured into trials (don't think I will venture there again). I appreciate the comment about ppl taking 6's so serious and being super sweaty about it. That definitely turns me off of PvP sometimes.
I feel so weak in pvp, everyone seems to one shot me and I do no damage to them. My internet is always good.
As someone who has enjoyed and consistently played d2 pvp since forsaken, this last year is the first time that i seriously cannot enjoy it. All the special ammo/super/ability nerfs have caused d2 to go full circle, back to its launch, before forsaken, which no one liked. I don't know why we never learn from our mistakes. The same thing happened at the end of d1 when they killed special ammo and left the game in that state. Both game used to be so fun. Now they're just there for snobs who think primary aim gunskill should be the only thing that matters.
Only pop on for my destiny pvp fix. Been stuck on an aggressive lightweight bow playstyle. Was the highlight of my day to go against you out of my random play sessions. Made my whole day.
The main issue for me is honestly just how terrible it feels to fight against half of the subclasses we have, while half of them may not be op or even considered great, getting killed by something like a stasis well, fighting some titan just for him to pop barricade and basically be at full health again with his overshield, or getting snaring slammed by a hunter from basically the skybox all just feel terrible to fight against, even worse honestly than dying to the same weapons over and over again. That and the new special ammo system and damage of a lot of our primary weapons are why I personally quit PvP and part of why it feels so bad trying to get back into it.
This is a comment on the video
Indeed it is
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This is a comment to your reply on the comment on this video@@Felwinters.Lie69
@@Felwinters.Lie69this is a reply to the reply of the comment.
@@itsLeels This is the reply for the reply of the reply of the comment leaving a thumbs up.
I stopped playing pvp and my life improved.
I just came back to the game for the first time after the witch queen. PVP was always my favorite part of destiny. I am having a lot of fun now that things have been un sunset. Just being able to jump in with none of the new loot and bottom fragging has been fun for me, genuinely.
From the perspective of a super casual PVP player, I am having fun, so if you are thinking about jumping in and just playing casually I think now is a great time.
Not gonna lie...im out here grindin for shiny guns...🤷♂️
Yea, the special ammo having to get crates in comp means we will never play it until they change it back. No bars to fill up. Just stop bungie. Give players 2 shots per life & 1 shot if you kill someone with special. Like we have been for 6 years. That’s it. My god.
I live for pvp and have taken a few year hiatus from it to mainly only play path of exile. Cant wait to push it this expansion!
I've just been trying to have fun with The Prophet. Trying to master that hipfire fantasy with the legendary. It's super fun. I just got a godroll 6/6 (for me) Igneous Hammer as my first time ever getting Adept Igneous, and I've only used it for 2 matches. Yes it's a monster, but I really like weapons on the fun side. Also, the only non-cringe shotguns are slugs. They feel way more rewarding than any other shotgun.
In my opinion problems with PVP:
1) Maps: A lot of garbage maps which need to get rid of, cause a lot of ppl just leaving when see them.
2) Matchmaking: Now matchmaking is sucks, when system arrange noobies in your team and against you "pro" players who kills when you even don't see him and most of them with sweaty loadouts, laggers, just hell of cheaters.
3) Rewards: Need provide with a reward for playing, new cool guns, ornaments, high stat armor etc.
4) Connection to already running match: This system need to change when system connect you in running match need provide with some super energy and special ammo or just don't connect.
I have played with some old friends some life long friends and now some new friends because this season and hype-train toward the final shape has them all going nuts. Crucible has been really fun too. Most games are pretty close and sometimes i see my gamertag on the top. I am an above average guardian being a beta veteran. I have taken breaks in the past, But right now is not one of them. New Maps in trials, fun meta shifts. Its a great time for me and my friends personally in destiny. If you are board or tired of the same old weapons switch it up. Heck switch up your class, be a warlock if you main hunter. Try a crayon eater if you like to go punch stuff. Just have fun, And we have what looks to be a very cool expansion ahead of us. :)
This video aged like milk. Final shape pvp is making me want to gouge my eyes out.
Personal reason I've not been playing PVP - ability spam is back now that checkmate is no longer the standard. While the special ammo meter has stuck around and made PVP less special ammo heavy, AND the sandbox changes/autorilfe nerf have made things more skill driven, I haven't had a fun game of sixes since ability charge rates returned to "standard".
I am glad you brought up how many playlists there are. I will never understand why a game with a relatively small player base would have so many playlists available at all times. sometimes I just bounce around the playlists trying to find where everybody is. Just have quickplay, comp, and a rotating fun game mode, then trials on weekends. covers all bases imo.
I think until they make some sort of change to igneous, I don’t think much will change, because most of the weapon choices have to be able to compete with igneous specifically
I don't remember the last time I had a had a match that didn't end with landslide victory or defeat
I’m still playing the game with 99% of 3,900 hours in PVP. If no PVP, no D2 for me. But that doesn’t mean i’m happy with state of PvP. Totally agree with what Vanguard covered in this video!
People play meta because of different reasons, but most important: winning. You can't tell people to not play the best optimal options against normal off-meta pics if winning and success is a factor for rewards. This applies both to PvP and PvE.
10:20 Realest a PvP content creator has ever been. I love 6s, but it’s hard to go in and enjoy myself now that I’m pushing 40 with 20 year olds who play full meta ALL THE TIME.
quick take, in my experience, matchmaking hasn't been too bad, other than long queue times, its just the team balance thats pretty rough
I have been playing solo in 6v6 for almost 10 years now, and I am not bored because the gun play and the use of space magic is so cool in destiny compared to other games. I really like to discover new weapons and make a build good and fun to play, this why I am staying.
It's the same in the New Territory playlist. Conditional + Hammer, emoting, and crouch spamming. I can deal with it, but my teammates tend to up and leave once we hit 3-25. At that point I either take the beating or take the open door.
It's just no fun anymore. 'They' want a healthy pvp population, but almost always squeeze out people who want to have fun, or maybe even improve at the game.
Sadly that is a playerbase/"we" problem. Not much you can do about scumbag tryhard players whose only fun is making others miserable.
TRUE VANGUARD. You. Are. Speaking 🗣️
It feels nice to be in good company🤝
I got HUNDREDS of down votes saying how I think everyone has the RIGHT to play how they want. But I sure as hell don’t have to respect it. If you’re cheesing, if you’re cheating, if you’re using full blown meta, crouch spamming smg and cloudstrike, igneous and conditional. You. Are. LAMEEEEE.
There’s HUNDREDS of guns in this game, each unique and have a different feel. And you are so boring you can only use TWO????
TV speaks for the philosophers
That season of the Deep AR looks insane. I never went that far into that seasons story
While I do play PvP & enjoy it, I think you're bang on with the loot issue.
Specifically crucible engrams feel pretty worthless compared to other vendors. I often find myself sitting at the cap because turning them in is literally just a chore.
I gave up on PvP more than a year ago as the matchmaking was terrible. Being a bit to the left of the bell curve seemed to mean that I matched almost exclusively against players I couldn't hope to beat. The fun went a long time before I gave up but I persisted for a bit in the hope it would improve. Having said that, I tried Iron Banner at the start of this season and the lobbies did seem to have improved. Maybe it's time to try again...
My experiences last time playing PvP:
Conditional Igneous gamers.
Getting bagged after getting headshot by Chaperone when using Round Robin + Recluse
Getting told by the enemy that I suck bad at the game despite not playing for a very long time.
Constantly being matched against teams when playing solo in 6's.
While D2 PvP has amazing gunplay, the playerbase at times doesn't help retaining players imo. I would like to get better at PvP, but the players in the game don't make me want to keep playing.
I practically cheered in my head when you said the part about the sweats and tryhards using the Conditional/Igneous or using Peacekeepers with every flavor of SMG ever basically driving people away and then blaming it on Bungie and justifying their sweaty loadout use on the situation because I agree with you. I just wanna chill, not turn on my AC to cool myself down after 5 rounds in Control lol
nothing will break my heart more than chasing Not Forgotten for a whole season, just for it to get put into the monumement of lost light for glimmer and legendary shards. AND THEN NERFING MAGNIFICENT HOWL. :((
I feel the same but w redrix.
A lot of good stuff here. As a casual PvP player, dead center bell curve skill (I hope?), I think the lack of chase is the #1 drag, with a #2 being "it's not fun to get on a losing streak." For #1: The rep I flipped most this long ass season was IB (6 times?) because I wanted a good multimach and a tusk, plus there is some fun armor, and the best earnable shaders are always on second reset.
A good way to avoid brutal stompings would be to have a larger pool, and to your point, I think constricting the modes would increase the pool. Maybe have game modes rotate hourly so there is one 6, one 3, and one comp mode running at a time.
I agree in part but sure I am glad some one in the community at least attempted to toggle the argument. GG man
As someone that has returned to destiny after playing a lot of league, overwatch, and even some cod, I’m enjoying pvp a lot actually. The meta isn’t perfect by any means, but gunplay feels rewarding and some major gripes I had a few years ago have been toned down.
Is I.W. Harper 12 year bourbon as smooth as i say it is? Tune into the Dramguard to find out
Agree with you on this. I see the same names regularly when I play and far too often games get mercied or one team just stomps on the other one. I feel like there could be a better way of balancing teams than what we have right now.
New pinnacle weapons though! And more loot, materials etc would help boost the player base.
Aa a pvp main heres my ideas on how to fix pvp tho its in an alright place
1. Make the base crucible loot actually worth it
2. Tone down conditional and iggy
3. Tune some of the most frustrating builds to fight against ( void barrier spam, decoy spam, and osmiomancy spam)
Ok as a pve main saying ron has a high conpletion rate is because of conditional isnt a lie but its omiting that ron is so absurdly easy even compaired to vog that almost any player can make it through the entire thing without learning a mechanic.
Honestly, i used to play endless amounts of PvP D1 into the first few years of D2. When there was content draughts, that’s all i would do. About 4 years ago I pretty much quit the game and started playing casually on and off around new DLC’s. Recently had a buddy get me back in the game for Final Shape prep…I’ve played a couple matches just to get some rewards. What’s killing PvP is the grind…everything is so build and ability based right now that you almost need specific builds for PvP or you’re starting with a handicap. In order to make those builds you need rare in game currency. It’s a vicious loop.
One of my fav activities with the boys was random loadout PvP nights. I think the crew has gotten together maybe a few times over the past year or 2 and basically it’s we will play till someone rage quits because lag or lobby imbalance or sus game play.
"Lobby balancing and the way they quantify player skill". I think this has long been a core design limitation of Crucible that raises frustrations for a lot of players. It's wild to me that you can go to destinytracker and its Elo system will be able to predict which team will win with about 90% accuracy (and if it says the odds are severe, those matches are often mercies/blowouts). Yet Bungie still can't manage (or actively chooses not to do so) to put together an internal system of similar merit.
I quit because of conditional. As a bubble main, the fact that that gun hasnt been nerfed pushed me away 3 months ago. Havent played since in any meaningful capacity
I've definitely felt the lobby balancing issues, and divided populations. It just isn't fun to sit in a queue for 15 minutes and then have the game mercy, then break the teams apart, then sit in another queue only for 80% of the players from the last game to be put into the new match.
And I don't know that I've noticed any improvement to connection quality in games either.
Been playing D1 lately. PVP is a blast. Lobbys can be tough to get some weeks, but when you can get in on a good weekend it’s really fun. Try it out.
That's exactly how I feel why do people play it If they hate it?
I took a two month break from destiny because I was just getting burned out of sweat city in pvp. I don't mind it in comp, or trials, but in quickplay it was too much. I came back because I just missed pvp. The games where it's fun, it's amazing. But those games are not as frequent as I'd like.
Ultimately, I'm not playing pvp for the rewards, but for the gameplay and the fun I can find there.
Great video!! Everything is on point!! Bungie and players should take notes.
My top weapon the past few weeks have been nechrocasm on hunter its so fun use dusk fields with the hunter arms to increase radius slows down enemies making those explosive kills with nechy more likes and easier to get
Okay my experience with PVP is the following. Firstly the lobby balancing is just terrible, the amount of wins I get compared to stomped matches is terrible. I'm a PS main so playing against Xbox users usually guarantees that I will be one shot to every weapon they have. I could litterally push a whole clip from a hand cannon into a play for them to turn round and one shot me with the same weapon. The hit detection is woefull as well, I suffer from ADHD as well so the moment the games don't give me any reward or satisfaction for my playtime I'm out. So I usually play PVP in bouts and then I stop for a while. I've played trials, never been flawless but just seems everytime I get one or two wins then I get 3 to 4 games where I'm stomped and again I'm not going to hand around and keep trying to go flawless in that kind of setting. There just seems too many network and server issues to have a consistent experience. When they used SBMM I had the time of my life, it was great. Then the sweats complained about how they were matching other sweats and the games were getting too hard to win and then Bungie back tracked. Sweats got a taste of what the casual population were experiencing and they didn't like it at all. I mean looking at your PVP play video and they are nothing like I experience that's for sure. I could have won a lot of matches looking at the gameplay so maybe it is networking, maybe being in Australia our latency is the issue who knows. All I know is what I'm seeing in your videos is NOTHING like what I experience in PVP that's for sure.
I still love trying out new rolls and gear in pvp, once i find something that i gel with or that fits a build i then vault it and try somthing else. Haven't used iggy hammer in aages since it felt too easy to use and wasn't improving my play. I love using off meta picks and seeing what i can learn and improve upon.
Yeah as a D1 vet and Trials sherpa, I only still play Destiny PvP because the gun feel is still unmatched. Im just tired of having to run Crucible Prosperity to get two measly drops at the end of a match full of sweaties, when Onslaught is literally drowning people in shiny rolls.
As a primarily PvE player (mostly do raids, GMs, Coil lately), the times where I touch PvP are when there's good PvE loot. Forced myself through 26 different Adept Cataphracts for Env/Bait and had a good time but not enough for me to go back w/o friends in any PvP modes. It's honestly just boring w/o true incentive. That's my only problem-not meta, not gameplay, not anything else. I'm not gonna bother until there's something worth chasing
it's also that there are plenty of games where I feel like I have no impact. Sure, I have my own pop off games, but the ones wherein it feels like I just don't get to play the game even in quickplay. I love just playing random stuff but then there's the random conditional every other death and it's like man get me out of here 😂
I love the new Collision game mode. Looking forward to Bungie fixing the transmat vice crates for special
Imagine if Bungie would implement a "just for fun non meta playlist" in Destiny 2 and the ten most popular weapons of the latest Trials of Osiris weekend as well as the most popular hunter, titan and warlock subclass would not be allowed in that playlist, at the description of this playlist Bungie would always tell the players which weapons and subclasses are the ones that are not allowed for this week and if someone doesn't switches of his meta tryhard loadout Bungie would replace his weapons and loadout with a terrible blue auto rifle, a blue sidearm and the least popular subclass for that match. I think Bungie would never implement a non meta playlist like that but i think a lot of people would love this playlist like crazy :D
That would pose the issue of things like the community grouping together to throttle certain weapons, and weapons that're used because they're fun or feel nice instead of being highly effective. Also it wouldn't fix a lot of annoying weapons that just don't top the charts because they're so broken they aren't fun.
Bungie sent out the player statistics today. I've spent 65% of my time in the last 7 years in PVP. And to be honest the competition keeps me coming back. I don't play much 6v6 it's mostly comp and trials because when I play pvp I want to try hard and get better. I've never thought of pvp as a party mode that's what I use pve for. And I'm just an average player but yea it's the competition for me. Only time I play 6v6 is to test builds to see if they are viable in 3v3
10:20 final warning + glacio or hc of your choice on floatlock is so much fun
Taking a break from PvP because i wanna go into PvP with a fresh new Subclass to try out. What keeps me coming back is simply its combat and gunplay. Granted its nothing but mostly meta, the game has a phenominal gunplay that makes me come back day in and day out.
I have a theory of why games are fun. Some of the funnest games I’ve ever played (Destiny included at one point) were fun because they were chaotic. Initially they are chaotic because you as a player don’t know what is possible and you don’t know how to respond but it’s fine you’re learning. What has happened over time in multiple titles is the removal of the chaos. This sentiment typically comes from high end players (I consider myself high end) who have a style of play and don’t like to be pushed off from it by something they deem “easy”.
The idea that come to mind is checkmate, a rehashing of D2Y1 that only sweats liked spurned on by the “top players” in the community knowing damn well their personal stock in the game just went way up by eliminating the number of threats lesser skilled players can leverage against them therefore eliminating the chaos of the typical match therefore making the game boring. The engagements are the same, no thinking required just shoot at the enemy and if you’re losing run away to double back later.
I am of the opinion that checkmate needs to go, primary weapon TTK needs to be faster across the board, special ammo need not be picked up from a box (isn’t the worst though) and abilities and exotics need to be plentiful and potent. Everyone hated shatter dive and Antaeus wards but looking back I had the most fun learning how to dissect those play styles and I’m a better player for it.
As a formerly avid pvp player and someone who went flawless regularly in all of D1 and for the majority of D2, pvp just isn't fun for me anymore. Every single game I play feels like a world championship with 100 millions dollars on the line, which is a feeling I actually like, but not when it's EVERY. SINGLE. MATCH. My skills have also drastically declined where it feels my opposition has only gotten better. I'm suffering from my former success. So now I just stay completely out of pvp with the exception of occasionally going into trials and being a burden on my friends who are better than me whenever it's a weapon I'd like to farm that weekend.
Just for a reference point I have managed to keep my overall k/d a respectable 1.73 but I have to sweat my ass off to not let it drop any harder and my trials k/d has dropped all the way down to 1.25.
To answer your question on why I sweat in sixes: I'm not a good pvp player (2.8 KDA if I'm remembering correctly) and my connection is "average" so after sitting through ten minutes of destiny saying "Evaluating guardians" at 12/12 just for 2 guys to back out or get sent to another game I want that feel good chemical from top fragging as a late join to the losing team on my tenth mercy game of the night. Nothing feels worse than going through all that just to get absolutely mopped by what feels like the top .01% of pvp sweats with an 11/5 god roll igneous hammer and a conditional finality with a freaking catalyst some how. Point is, it feels nice to get kills, and not everyone has the time nor mental stability to throw together a joke build to have "fun" (if you do, good on you! I still won't feel bad for farming you while screaming at my PC about your teammate gunning me 100% of the time with a Luna's howl and throwing knives (he's just Better))
10:46 dude I used to handicap myself back in Halo 3 when we were destroying the enemy team. I havent heard anyone bring up sportsmanship in over a decade.
It's always elitist nerds saying 'get gud' regarding entertainment these days.
I’m barely hanging on at this point. Comp is basically unplayable due to massive imbalance in the lobbies. Control is way too sweaty and I just don’t really engage with the other modes much since I have limited time to play throughout the week. I’ll usually play trials throughout the weekend but having a less hype weapon featured or one I have farmed a ton really diminishes that as well. Some weeks I’ll just play a little trials and either hit the golden chest or fall at the gates a few times and then decide the juice isn’t worth the squeeze for a trace rifle or glaive. Since I also enjoy pve it’s been easy to really ignore PvP to grind onslaught and play pantheon. I loved the late season addition of the prophet and the summoner and I’d like to see more like that moving forward. I think it would be good to have less guns in rotation but change them more frequently and bring back older weapons more often. It’s just stale as hell having multiple weeks in a row where the featured weapon is a snoozer.
Hey vanguard, are you gonna comment on the recent sniper nerf again? I honestly think there isn't a point to snipe (aggressively) anymore just because shotguns/fusion just do a way better job at it now..and seems like majority of the player base uses shotguns anyway
I gave up on COD when D1 came out and didn't look back until D2 pvp became a streamers paradise.
It's still shit to this day.
Gonna have to check out x defiant I guess.
The leveling in xdefiant is painfully slow but other than that the game is great
I still love PvP but am chasing loot in Onslaught like crazy since the shinys are going away. There’s great PvP loot there!
I put about 5500 hours into destiny. I wanted to be the guy that everyone could go to for help in any activity. I can sherpa every raid and dungeon and also carry to the lighthouse. All the points you went into are what made me stop playing pvp. Mainly the point you made about how everyone sweats in just regular control. Like I get if you're using meta in comp or trials but like, it's so tiring only seeing the meta.
Pre forsaken was the glory days for me. Ran around double hand cannon and had fun. Couldn't fight anyone without getting shotgun blasted, fusion rifled or titan shoulder charged. One shot kill methods kills the fun for me. Yeah, it makes sense shotguns , rockets and supers kill in one shot it's just everywhere compared to before forsaken change. I came back after years to try do bounties for before the shape; I still got it, but it's too fusterating with one shot method always available. This gunslinger is laying down his pvp holster. Pve is where reside now.
Granted the PVE has been hitting on some high notes in these past months. There is just so much to do especially before final shape as well. If you don't want to miss out on the available loot etc. I find myself getting on, farming the stuff I want then being too tired to slug through pvp after the fact. I've barely played pvp and I'm a pvp main. Haven't even played on the new maps.
I play this game for the pvp. Ive spent 52 percent of my time in crucible and I've played 3k hours. I've always enjoyed it but it can always use some improvements.
I've tried to get into PVP so many times over the years. As someone who loved Halo, it holds a lot of appeal on paper. The problem for me at least is that it's just not fun. Good PVP games are fun and rewarding even for the losing team, maybe the gameplay is just inherently entertaining or maybe you have a chance of getting a good drop or making progress towards a goal even if you perform badly. There has to be a carrot on the end of the stick.
There's no carrot in Crucible. Even if Bungie added amazing weapons that incentivized people to play, it would still be a similar experience to Trials, where you just get farmed and locked out of the Flawless pool by people who have already been Flawless 18 times that weekend. There's no sportsmanship or experimentation, everyone just abuses meta loadouts, so the only interactions you have are against maybe three varieties of playstyle. You get killed by the same weapon over and over again. It also means that I can't experiment or have fun with new playstyles, because it only lowers my chances of winning. Winning wouldn't matter so much if every loss wasn't a frustrating steamroll. Remember when people were jumping off the map in Trials because it was quicker and easier than just being farmed by tryhards? That's the PVP experience for a lot of people in a nutshell.
How do you fix that?
- More objective game modes where K/D is less of a factor. I absolutely loved Rift for the one weekend it was in Iron Banner because it allowed me to be valuable to the team and make reputation progress without having to win duels with Stompees Hunters, but of course those same people complained because Rift didn't let them slay out, and we never got the game mode featured again.
- The meta needs to be dismantled and there needs to be room for experimentation. People need to be able to try builds and weapons that don't come from a RUclips video and actually stand some chance of performing well. The way Bungie balances Crucible is far too restrictive. There's a myth that we can take the gear we earn in the wider world into PVP, but we can't. If you want to win you go on RUclips, find the meta loadout for that season, and farm those drops until you and everyone else on your team has identical loadouts.
- SBMM. Aggressive, restrictive SBMM, more aggressive than we've ever seen and far more punishing for the best players. I should never be matched with the people in True Vanguard or Aztecross' skill bracket, it's insane. I can't even start developing my skills and gamesense and build towards that level because I get put in the ring with Mike Tyson.
Maybe you don't like more accessible game modes, you think SBMM is the worst thing to happen to Crucible, and you think the meta is in a good place. That's fine, but the people who are happy with the state of affairs are 6% of the population. People like me are happy to just never engage with PVP, but for the people who enjoy PVP and want to play with a larger pool of people, I think the status quo has to be shaken up.
For me, yes.
In addition to all the server issues, melee de-syncing, spawning, SBMM, poor team-balancing, Bungie's passive approach to cheaters and third-party devices, the March 5th sandbox changes still don't sit well for me nearly three months later.
Body-shots are explicably useless in most cases, sniper usage is gone, the ability cooldown nerf isn't felt whatsoever. Namely, the health and damage values are the worst part, creating too great of an emphasis on precision, catering to both the extremely high-skilled and cheaters.
D2 is a strange game. When you're steeped in it for as long as we are, the oddities fade away. But when you play other shoots you remember that it can just be really strange bout hitreg and the like. That's not a big deal. But the prospect wasn't just playing PvP to win, it was improvement. It was immersing yourself in every breadth of D2, getting weapons from strange places and testing them on your friends. I don't have friends to play with anymore. I don't find as much novelty out of the same gun archtypes in stale metas. And I don't have faith in D2 to persist passed the Final Shape to make it worth honing my skills in. It's no one thing.
Too much banger PVE content in the past 2 months. I’ve had no time to just enjoy the new maps.
Great video totally appreciate your commentary !! I only do PVP if I absolutely have to. I used to love it but not really anymore. It’s just too sweaty.
Putting lucrative (PVE meta worthy) loot in PVP would upset a lot of players for whom it's very much outside of their comfort zone. Typically trials weapons are not designed to be meta in PVE, like conditional finality is useful in both activities.
Do you think Bungie should risk that? Thanks for the video TV!
D3 needs to be a pvp focused game. Battle royal, competetive ranked system for solo and teams... heck if marathon does well, then add an extraction mode. Pve elements are nice like story mode etc.. but it needs to be pvp focussed at its core. The darkness is dead, what left? No point introducing a new enemy to fight for the next 10 years... make crucible a blood sport, and base a whole game around it
What I want to see is rotating/random modifiers every single match. Load into Eternity, but oops! the random modifier for this match is scout rifles cannot deal crit damage and glaives have 50% increased melee range. Here comes cauldron and this match we have 500% increase in grenade regen speed and supers are disabled! I think some fun silly things like that would really make for more fun, lighthearted pvp in casual playlists.
First off, i just got my new adept igneous last week and really wanted to try it out on some poor blue berries. Otherwise im using perpetual and a sidearm, although i believe that side arms and autorifles might also be considered meta
50% of my playtime in D2 has been in the crucible, but I don’t even touch it anymore. I saw somebody else say it, lots of stuff just feels bad to be killed by. Mainly abilities and heavy ammo 2 minutes into the game.
I suck at pvp, but waded into it to finish the super black quest. And actually had fun. I used malfeasance, randomly and it was good. I had fun got into meaningful gun fights helped my team… I was shocked.
Well whatever they did to special ammo in comp. its basically year one double primary again. Just the color of the ammo changed. Trials is kinda fun though as a solo who doesn't take it seriously in the slightest
Came back recently and I’ve been loving Checkmate control
I'm a 6s gamer. I think we're in a pretty great spot right now. The sandbox is the best I can really expect it to be.
That all being said, i really haven't played at all the last month or so. I loved the new maps, but there was never a new territory 6s mode. That would have been huge.
I'm still playing the PvE side of the game. Pantheon and Onslaught have been so enjoyable. But recently I've found myself solo queuing apex mixtape instead of soloing control.
Your portion about high skill players never taking off meta and is very true. I love experimenting with some crazy stuff, but I'll eventually go back to a strong loadout I'm comfortable with.
My favorite loadout this season has been centrifuse/feedback fence/ arc titan. It's a powerhouse and I have so much fun playing with it. But there are some games where I have to slow down because I'm just being mean.
Idk what can change about the 'sweat' problem in gaming. I just want good duels, quick decisions, and lots of action. I think that's what most players want.
At the end of the day, the only things I dislike about crucible are bad maps and bad matchmaking. But those are an issue in every game.
but tbh, i still play pvp just because I love it. No other game can come close to the fun I have in destiny pvp STILL. What would make people come play more is if there were crucible specific exotics to chase, I'm talking a randomly dropped gun or quest for a sick exotic. Or objective based ornament grinds for exotic weapons. Like, GET 1000 KILLS WITH BASTION IN PVP TO GET THIS ORNAMENT THATS REALLY COOL
ya know, something akin to a COD camo grind.