I love writing in a pov that is so close to the character's mind that it feels like you're almost reading them refer to themselves in 3rd person, it's just so fun to me 😂
I'm having an interesting POV experience with the novel I'm currently writing. The lead character dissociates as a response to trauma so while they are dissociating I add more distance, then I get closer when they get through it. I don't really know if that's allowed but it feels right for the story.
I don't think that's how dissociation works or even feel like. If you wanted to show dissociation you still keep that close psychic distance, you'll just change what the POV character experiences. For example, you'll drop the visceral body sensations and make everything feel distant off to your POV character. Sounds will feel like they're an echo from another room, pain will become dull, thoughts will become sluggish, events will seem less real and more dreamlike; though all the while the psychic distance will still be close. Creating a larger psychic distance will just make the reader feel like they’re further away from the POV character, not the POV character feeling they’re further away from reality.
I've done something similar in my last book - I think what you're describing works just fine and adds an interesting dimension. My main character is also the narrator commenting on past events - the superior knowledge falls away after the scene has been set and then the character grows through their arc from the inferior position. This works well if the main character ends up in a dangerous or dodgy situation. Starting with that information in quite a general way and distant way, backed up to the personal experiences in the past that led to the negative situation will create a sense of intrigue. The effect works, for sure 👍
@@johnnydavidcreative I don't think this works. Dissociation is a real psychological condition. It's supposed to be the patient--in this case the POV character--dissocociating from reality and their body. Psychic distance has nothing to do with that, it's simply how close the reader is to the narrator, it has nothing to do with the narrator's experience of reality. If you want to SHOW dissociation to the reader you'll simply SHOW the experience through the POV character's eyes. Not distance the reader from the narrator.
@@JerodimusPrime I see, yes, got it, thank you for your reply. It's really cool looking at these techniques and understanding the finer points of certain writing dynamics. Grateful for your explanation. Have a good day and stay safe 🙏 👍
You explained this very clearly. Thank you for doing these videos. I don't have the money for classes so this is a lifesaver. Thank you for your effort and time.
I think the zoom out in the example, looks good to use in an introduction, because it's intriguing, much better than the zoom in which is more traditional, almost boring. That's probably because we get to "know" the person anyway and if this is the main aim, I don't feel order really counts in this case. Anyone else feels this way?
I am currently writing a novel in 1st person plural point of view and it is really fascinating. It is like 3rd person but it can only be told from the team perspective.
Personally, I loooooove a story with a distant point of view. They're rare finds these days, but so rewarding when the author pulls it off. My favorite example is Cormac McCarthy's All the Pretty Horses, which rarely includes anything specific that a character is thinking, but it is _masterful_ at leading the reader to everything between the lines.
The second example with Joan is still okay to use, drop the ladt sentence, and it works just as well as the first example. I WANT A REFUND! But seriously, there's nothing wrong with it. It sounds just as good.
I was writing a close third person POV and i noticed that adding a second person POV (I thought that would be interesting) created some distance... Distance in the sense that it felt like the narrator paused the story to speak to the reader
Hi, I am working on a book where I want to have altering perspectives. There is the main character, who will be speaking in first person, and then there is another character who is involved in the main character's life who I want to convey the perspective of. Like you said, the first person POV is the closest, so would it be the one to choose for the character? Or if not, would the one you talked about in the video work? Thank you
'A woodpecker pecks the wood outsode.' Is objective. There isn't even a person there to perceive it. How can that be closer? It's so distant that there doesn't even need to be anybody there and it's true.
sempre assisto seus vídeos e mesmo que sejam para a escrita em inglês, funcionam muito bem para o português também. é um tópico muito interessante, obrigada pelo vídeo!
This was helpful. Thank you. However, I had to rewind and listen again, a few times, because you have a touch of vocal fry on the ends of your sentences (that raspy sound that signifies you're running out of air) which makes the ends of sentences hard to understand. I hope you don't mind me mentioning this.
Hm, so are there books where the narrator is a separate character from the protagonist? Does he have his own personality? Can that happen by accident? And I don't mean books where the narrator tells the story, e.g. Let me tell you about Sir Robert Melonhead, he was a notorious pirate.
Can you talk about what “free indirect speech” is? I know authors like Jane Austen, Virginia Woolf, and even Sally Rooney use this in their novels. But is it the same as a close third point of view? Or is it different?
Free indirect narration is essentially just a fancy term for extremely close 3rd person, where the 3rd person narrator takes on all the characteristics of the protagonist. Imagine it like 1st person but in 3rd person!
I can give you an example the started hearing and talking after she was hit by lightning 🌩 it just start her to saying words and hear things she say cause God told her that
But if we eliminated fiĺters like "she hears" how do we know the character is actually hearing the sound and it's not only the narrator describing things to us that the character is not yet aware of
Keep strong. Dont forget that despite the evil in this world, God is full of justice, mercy and love. Justice said we broke His perfect law - causing the world's previous perfection to be destroyed - and therefore we deserve Hell (like a punishment in any legal system but this is eternal as His perfect law is eternal too). Don't think you fit in that category? Ever done one of these?: lying, stealing - regardless of how small the object EVER, hating others - which is murder in God's perfect law, lusting (plus God sees our entire thought life). Justice says "the soul that sins shall die". BUT, mercy said "I dont want to give them what they deserve. I don't want them to be cut off from Me. I love them despite all they have done/will do against Me. I want to give My children another chance. I want them to come home and live in My love again". And love said "Jesus, God's Son, came down as a Man, our representative, suffering every temptation, pain and struggle we have ever faced, yet without sin. He took all our sins (past/present/ even future) to the cross and then crucified EVERY ONE on our behalf. Justice was paid on the cross so that we can be free from Hell's punishment, experience Gods mercy of forgiveness of sin and live in His love. If we turn from the sins we have committed and repent (turn away from our sin and pursue the opposite direction of love through Christ) He will, overtime, recreate us back into that previously perfect image through The Holy Spirit which Jesus sends to all who accept Him as their personal Lord and Savior of their life. He is in Heaven right now preparing a place for us so that He can take His faithful, believing children home with Him when He returns. He will ressurrect us from death when He returns, giving mercy to those who accept His love, instruction and teachings in their life, and give justice to those who refuse it. He doesn't want ANY of us to go to Hell and die for continuing in evil and rejecting His way to life, thats why He died FOR us. He wants us to be His and begin to follow His life of love and service through Him (not ourselves as it's impossible without depending on His power and instruction). So long as we keep our hearts near to Christ through His strength, strive to obey His will of perfect love revealed in the Bible, and ask Him to help us in the midst of (very certain) pitfalls and struggles, we will, in time, win the victory over sin, pain and DEATH through Christ. Even if you are willing to be made willing, or struggling or doubtful, simply be honest and tell Him that. He is not intimidated by ANY sin or struggle you are facing. ANY. He hears and will answer. If we pray for Him to come in, regardless of the condition, then He will. NOTE: You are NEVER too sinful or messed up that God cannot turn your life around through Jesus. EVER. If you have any questions let me know Xx
I love writing in a pov that is so close to the character's mind that it feels like you're almost reading them refer to themselves in 3rd person, it's just so fun to me 😂
Kkkkkkk MI 7
Wowza! I've sensed this, but it's always seemed so...nebulous. Good job clearing it up! Thanks!
I'm having an interesting POV experience with the novel I'm currently writing. The lead character dissociates as a response to trauma so while they are dissociating I add more distance, then I get closer when they get through it. I don't really know if that's allowed but it feels right for the story.
I don't think that's how dissociation works or even feel like. If you wanted to show dissociation you still keep that close psychic distance, you'll just change what the POV character experiences. For example, you'll drop the visceral body sensations and make everything feel distant off to your POV character. Sounds will feel like they're an echo from another room, pain will become dull, thoughts will become sluggish, events will seem less real and more dreamlike; though all the while the psychic distance will still be close.
Creating a larger psychic distance will just make the reader feel like they’re further away from the POV character, not the POV character feeling they’re further away from reality.
I've done something similar in my last book - I think what you're describing works just fine and adds an interesting dimension.
My main character is also the narrator commenting on past events - the superior knowledge falls away after the scene has been set and then the character grows through their arc from the inferior position. This works well if the main character ends up in a dangerous or dodgy situation. Starting with that information in quite a general way and distant way, backed up to the personal experiences in the past that led to the negative situation will create a sense of intrigue. The effect works, for sure 👍
@@johnnydavidcreative
I don't think this works. Dissociation is a real psychological condition. It's supposed to be the patient--in this case the POV character--dissocociating from reality and their body. Psychic distance has nothing to do with that, it's simply how close the reader is to the narrator, it has nothing to do with the narrator's experience of reality.
If you want to SHOW dissociation to the reader you'll simply SHOW the experience through the POV character's eyes. Not distance the reader from the narrator.
@@JerodimusPrime I see, yes, got it, thank you for your reply. It's really cool looking at these techniques and understanding the finer points of certain writing dynamics. Grateful for your explanation. Have a good day and stay safe 🙏 👍
@@johnnydavidcreative You're welcome. Have a good day and stay safe too, friend.
You explained this very clearly. Thank you for doing these videos. I don't have the money for classes so this is a lifesaver. Thank you for your effort and time.
t h I s. I’m obsessed w POV and I love how you explain it
I think the zoom out in the example, looks good to use in an introduction, because it's intriguing, much better than the zoom in which is more traditional, almost boring. That's probably because we get to "know" the person anyway and if this is the main aim, I don't feel order really counts in this case. Anyone else feels this way?
Beautifully explained.
wow! This answered all my questions! thank you so much!!
That was a huge help! Thanks!
I am currently writing a novel in 1st person plural point of view and it is really fascinating. It is like 3rd person but it can only be told from the team perspective.
Excellent, thank you!
Thank you for sharing
Personally, I loooooove a story with a distant point of view. They're rare finds these days, but so rewarding when the author pulls it off. My favorite example is Cormac McCarthy's All the Pretty Horses, which rarely includes anything specific that a character is thinking, but it is _masterful_ at leading the reader to everything between the lines.
He watched the Reedsy video. I wonder if I'll be able to apply these techniques. Did I do it right? He thought.
The second example with Joan is still okay to use, drop the ladt sentence, and it works just as well as the first example. I WANT A REFUND!
But seriously, there's nothing wrong with it. It sounds just as good.
I was writing a close third person POV and i noticed that adding a second person POV (I thought that would be interesting) created some distance... Distance in the sense that it felt like the narrator paused the story to speak to the reader
You are awesome- thank you!!
I definitely want to write my stories close to the characters because mine really struggle to do things, so you have to be close to them.
Thanks!
Very helpful ❤️
Thanks
Hi,
I am working on a book where I want to have altering perspectives. There is the main character, who will be speaking in first person, and then there is another character who is involved in the main character's life who I want to convey the perspective of. Like you said, the first person POV is the closest, so would it be the one to choose for the character? Or if not, would the one you talked about in the video work?
Thank you
'A woodpecker pecks the wood outsode.' Is objective. There isn't even a person there to perceive it. How can that be closer? It's so distant that there doesn't even need to be anybody there and it's true.
Exactly! I am asking the same thing too. It makes it difficult top whether the narrator knows something that the character doesn't yet know
The character would have to hear the woodpecker pecking, otherwise why would you add a detail like that?
Narrator starts close and gets amnesia. Distant narrator
well good luck with that
❤
sempre assisto seus vídeos e mesmo que sejam para a escrita em inglês, funcionam muito bem para o português também. é um tópico muito interessante, obrigada pelo vídeo!
This was helpful. Thank you. However, I had to rewind and listen again, a few times, because you have a touch of vocal fry on the ends of your sentences (that raspy sound that signifies you're running out of air) which makes the ends of sentences hard to understand. I hope you don't mind me mentioning this.
Psychic distance? An interesting concept in literature. . .
Hm, so are there books where the narrator is a separate character from the protagonist? Does he have his own personality? Can that happen by accident? And I don't mean books where the narrator tells the story, e.g. Let me tell you about Sir Robert Melonhead, he was a notorious pirate.
Can you talk about what “free indirect speech” is? I know authors like Jane Austen, Virginia Woolf, and even Sally Rooney use this in their novels. But is it the same as a close third point of view? Or is it different?
Free indirect narration is essentially just a fancy term for extremely close 3rd person, where the 3rd person narrator takes on all the characteristics of the protagonist. Imagine it like 1st person but in 3rd person!
I can give you an example the started hearing and talking after she was hit by lightning 🌩 it just start her to saying words and hear things she say cause God told her that
Hi Shaelin
But if we eliminated fiĺters like "she hears" how do we know the character is actually hearing the sound and it's not only the narrator describing things to us that the character is not yet aware of
Something happened to my text that created a RUclips link. Don't click on it unless you want to be lost in cyberspace!
1
Can it be used for foreshadowing??
Keep strong. Dont forget that despite the evil in this world, God is full of justice, mercy and love.
Justice said we broke His perfect law - causing the world's previous perfection to be destroyed - and therefore we deserve Hell (like a punishment in any legal system but this is eternal as His perfect law is eternal too). Don't think you fit in that category? Ever done one of these?: lying, stealing - regardless of how small the object EVER, hating others - which is murder in God's perfect law, lusting (plus God sees our entire thought life). Justice says "the soul that sins shall die".
BUT, mercy said "I dont want to give them what they deserve. I don't want them to be cut off from Me. I love them despite all they have done/will do against Me. I want to give My children another chance. I want them to come home and live in My love again".
And love said "Jesus, God's Son, came down as a Man, our representative, suffering every temptation, pain and struggle we have ever faced, yet without sin. He took all our sins (past/present/ even future) to the cross and then crucified EVERY ONE on our behalf. Justice was paid on the cross so that we can be free from Hell's punishment, experience Gods mercy of forgiveness of sin and live in His love. If we turn from the sins we have committed and repent (turn away from our sin and pursue the opposite direction of love through Christ) He will, overtime, recreate us back into that previously perfect image through The Holy Spirit which Jesus sends to all who accept Him as their personal Lord and Savior of their life.
He is in Heaven right now preparing a place for us so that He can take His faithful, believing children home with Him when He returns. He will ressurrect us from death when He returns, giving mercy to those who accept His love, instruction and teachings in their life, and give justice to those who refuse it.
He doesn't want ANY of us to go to Hell and die for continuing in evil and rejecting His way to life, thats why He died FOR us. He wants us to be His and begin to follow His life of love and service through Him (not ourselves as it's impossible without depending on His power and instruction). So long as we keep our hearts near to Christ through His strength, strive to obey His will of perfect love revealed in the Bible, and ask Him to help us in the midst of (very certain) pitfalls and struggles, we will, in time, win the victory over sin, pain and DEATH through Christ. Even if you are willing to be made willing, or struggling or doubtful, simply be honest and tell Him that. He is not intimidated by ANY sin or struggle you are facing. ANY. He hears and will answer. If we pray for Him to come in, regardless of the condition, then He will.
NOTE: You are NEVER too sinful or messed up that God cannot turn your life around through Jesus. EVER.
If you have any questions let me know
Xx
Lol the mailman thing. TOPICAL JOKE!