Here's the thing. There is no point in having source material if you're going to deviate from it. You may as well create something new. All Amazon have done is waste a bazillion dollars on a name for a show that, due to having nothing to do with that name, will be a failure. And that's a good thing.
No, This is clearly motivated by ideology as much as money and from that perspective they are winning. They have earned accolades from all the institutions dominated by this woke pseudo religion, many people have furthered their careers and further entrenched this ideology culturally. They are eroding, one by one, the beautiful things in our culture that predate the coming of progressive wokeness, and are eliminating people who might take issue from the power centers, cultural centers, academia and media.
There's a very good point in doing that from their point of view. It muddies the water on beloved works and destroys the common culture of the people progressives want to demoralize. Whether or not it's successful is relatively immaterial, what matters is dividing the people who liked the originals over to what extent they do or don't like the "adaptations."
@@zakpodo They have had complete control for well over a decade now, but I think, maybe, that the tides are finally turning. I could be wrong of course, but I think change is finally coming. It seems most 'normies' are sick and tired of this nonsense.
It's always strange to me how people say "Who cares what the fans know about the lore?" and, in the same article, try to hold themselves as more educated than the fans.
It goes to show how insufferable fans are that people who think they know the lore 1. Dont even consider themselves fans so to not be associated with "fans" and 2. Dont interact with fans enough to realise that they dont know shit... It is trully impressive
@@adoniscreed4031 The mental gymnastics you shills go to is really impressive. Considering your toxic mindset causes you to drive your own supporters away. You can’t handle criticism because you want to always be right. It’s sad and pathetic. Because if you didn’t care, you wouldn’t be bringing negativity into the comment’s section (of videos talking about what’s wrong with this woke adaptation) and would be trying to have a real conversation about why the fans are responding the way they are.
Didn't Tolkien say it himself in the Lord of the Rings? The forces of darkness do not have the power to create. They take what good created and make twisted mockeries and perversions of it.
Disney's done it three times. Marvel, Star Wars, Pixar. Bought and paid for, took a look at existing material, said no thanks (once Endgame was done for Marvel) and maybe Amazon thought that looked cool. I mean look how well all those entities are doing!
Yup, when the EU got cancelled that was the same thing
2 года назад+333
Firing Tom Shippey, who attended King Edward's School in Birmingham, became a professional philologist, occupied Tolkien's professorial chair at the University of Leeds, and taught Old English at the University of Oxford to the syllabus that Tolkien had devised, tells you EVERYTHING you need to know about this show.
@@jorgelacayo5688 He was replaced with Mariana Rios Maldonaldo, the Diversity and Equality Officer at the University of Glasgow. They apparently know more about Tolkien than Tolkien himself did.
I just don’t understand how we can live in a time where businesses constantly put out shitty products and then insult, berate and lecture the paying costumers for not liking them. That should be a big no no in marketing 101.
When people sniff enough of their own farts, they eventually develop a taste for each others bullshit. They can simply not comprehend how the rest of us are not into eating shit.
@@ZeroB4NG well the problem is that many people still buy into this crap and support it financially. Disney star wars still made a ton of money. Many people are just regular movie goers, they are fine with mediocre products. Same as how many people buy a new fifa or cod game every year despite them being all almost identical.
It brings me peace to know that I am not the only one who hates seeing our culture destroyed by these cash grab intersectional shows. Keep up the good work!
I cannot believe a producer said that Middle Earth needs to “reflect what the world(?) actually looks like.” All our most beloved franchises are in the hands of people who don’t care or respect them in any way. They only look at them as potential sources of revenue. Disgusting.
No, that attitude has nothing to do with money. It's about reputation, prestige, clout, and political power. The people making decisions are already rich beyond fathoming. What they now want instead is the admiration of other woke celebrities and the politicians and cultural barons they worship.
@@nohints Correct. If it were about money, they wouldn't keep making these garbage woke movies and shows that consistently bomb and cost the companies untold millions of dollars. It's also about mental conditioning, trying to push their views on audiences as much as possible to brainwash the viewers into agreeing with them.
Get rid of those alt right Elves and show more empathy towards the poor and vulnerable orc and goblin refugees trying to make a better life for themselves in the lands of plenty, where man flesh is bountiful.
Never could have imagined thinking or wanting a Lord of the Rings product to fail, but I really do want this to fail, and expect it will. It deserves to fail and be a massive embarassment.
@@reek4062 Because the people writing it and supporting it are terrible hateful people. Some of them, like the actors, seem to just be doing their job, and I respect that, but the main writers and supporters are just terrible. Even if the show is decent I really am not interested in having anything to do with the creation of people who openly hate the genuine fans of these stories.
i HOPE the new show is the wokeist pile of dog shit that has ever been woken. i hope it is painful to watch for everyone with a functioning and even those with barely functioning brains feel and know something is very very wrong.
Well, Witcher TV show by Netflix was also criticized strongly already before the release. Very similar reasons. Yet, they still found enough fans to have good ratings and lot of viewers. Most of the people do not care about such things as being truthful to lore. They do not care about Sapkowski's books or Tolkien's books. They want cheap easy entertainment. And if you point somewhere in comments mistakes made by creators you can be even attacked by those fans in a pretty nasty manner. Alas, those who read are nowadays a minority.
Also them later after it flopped: "The people who don't like this are racist, sexist, misogynistic bigots." *see batwoman & Kevin Smith's He-Man for references.
Don't forget "Give me a bottle of champaign" to just cover over the boring parts of "why did it crash and burn?" It's not like we shouldn't be surprised about this blatant try to grab some cash of an established franchise, while not realizing that "do your own shitty thing" is way worse than "do a great copy, or in this case good apation".
Their answer to everything they poop on which subsequently fails is "racism". They then go to poop on something else and keep pooping until people stop being "racist". Either they stop being "racist" or get so worn down from constant mediocrity that society collectively sighs, sits down, and watches their garbage.
“How dare true Lord Of The Ring fans criticise a fanfic for ruining FANTASY novel and trying to make it reflect REAL WORLD issues”. The whole point of fantasy is to get lost into a fictional world. Why an intelligent person want fantasy to be like real life? That’s like making zombie movies but trying to remove mention of death.
The Amazon WoT 'adaptation' was outright vandalism completely infused with THE MESSAGE. The LotR 'adaptation' shows every sign of going down the same road. Just because Bezo's can afford to buy expensive art doesn't mean that he truly appreciates or understands it. History will remember him unkindly.
@@DaGARCE1 same. His honesty is really inspiring. At this point if you told me he's on drugs and drunk for every video, I'd say "well then keep them comin', it's clearly working!"
What Amazon did to The Wheel Of Time is simply unforgivable. They took a story that was perfectly and lovingly laid out by an amazing man who poured his life and soul into and turned into Current Year inane drivel, its one of the biggest tragedies in recent memory. If you can, I beg you my fellows, avail yourself of reading The Wheel Of Time, or even just listening to the audiobooks, you won’t regret it
Amazon did The Wheel of Time such a disservice. I was looking forward to it when I first learned there would be an adaptation, but I still set a low bar. Even then, it was so much worse than I could have predicted.
I wanted it to be good. I really did. I stayed hopeful the whole time and gave it the full series to win me... But it was awful. I will not be giving it a second chance.
Been watching the behind the scenes stuff of how they made the LOTR trilogy. To keep it short and simple, I’ll just say I highly doubt the people making this show are gonna meet the bar set by Peter Jackson. Even if you didn’t like some of the decisions made by him, you cannot deny the effort.
Loved the story Liv Tyler told about her dad waiting with her for her flight in the airport terminal, then he looks at what she's wearing and takes off his wool lined denim jacket, puts it on her and tells her no matter where she goes, always, always take a warm coat. She was wearing it over her white gown as she was having her elf ears applied and told the story.
For context, Jackson and company were given one shot to adapt what was believed to be an unadaptable story, including a set up that explained the world, the ring, the Second Ages ending, and the events of the Hobbit BEFORE the plot started. They had 2 years, 180m dollars, three movies, and 9 hours of runtime to do it. So yea, they HAD TO change some things. Structure, plotting, and the order of some events. All to make a coherent trilogy of movies. But it never came from a place of arrogance or hubris. Just necessity. Amazon have a billion dollar budget, 5 seasons, and a primed and ready fanbase already there largely because of the Jackson films. And theyre changing things and condensing material and ignoring the lore because they WANT TO. Because they want to tell THEIR STORY. And that just irks us. It irks us. And we dont have to like it.
what i dont understand is that we all KNOW that the way they're going about it is going to make it a massive flop. i know amazon probably won't cry over the money but still. are they so detached that they dont know what the rest of us know?
@@manfrombritain6816 Yes. They are that detached. It's insane to have such a high budget and multiple seasons already greenlighted and utterly waste all of it because someone wanted to tell their own fantasy story that for some reason was barely attached to the Tolkiens works. It's Witchers netflix 2.0 but with far bigger scope and budget attached to it.
It id insane how closely their approach to the entire butchering of the source material, and defenses of that destruction, mirrors that of Netflix's Witcher. Kinda frustrating, it literally looks the same. Same defenses, same attacks, same illogical changes, same focus on a fanfiction stuff rather than the story.. All they need now is yo also change how the magic works and we have a bingo.
@@user-ju6zx3rm8d Tolkien wrote a strong woman character in Eowyn. Not being a man was the point of the action there. Maybe not Tolkiens words but probly not really diverting the intent. If u want to see a woke angle it's there for u I guess or maybe just emphasis on the arrogance of evil disregarding where strength can lie?
Yup, that's like taking the Harad area south of Middle Earth and populating it with pale, redheaded irishmen for 'reasons'. Just imagine it. utterly pale irishmen with the reddest of hair ever seen just running around in a freaking desert... XD
Every little detail, every little element, every little molecule even in the LotR trilogy was made with love, passion and unbridled creativity inspired by the works of J.R.R. Tolkien. Everything Amazon does is out of selfishness an spite. In the realm of literature and fiction, Tolkien is a god and those who were touched by his spirit are enlightened. The creators behind _The Rangs of Powar_ are intellectual goblins trying to axe this marvelous oaken tree to create a campfire.
And then they have the nerve to say that the fans are the ones who are in the wrong by not rolling over and accepting it like the good little fans they want us to be.
That's the difference between Jackson and Amazon: Jackson approached Tolkien with enormous respect; the army of _yrch_ at Amazon show no respect to Tolkien at all.
There was a tidbit in the Silmarillion that only Eru could truly create something, and that those trying to create things without his aid (read: Morgoth and Sauron) would only be able to craft pale imitations, taking from what is already there and twisting it into some new, evil form. It's a damn shame that the writers at Amazon are trying to pull exactly that here.
J. J. Abrams needs some sort of special award for destroying the three greatest franchises in cinematic and television history: Star Trek, Star Wars, and now Lord of the Rings. That's one hell of a legacy.
Well said brother! There are two people you don't mess with: 1- The Zohan 2- Tolkien fans One click to ratio them all, One search to find them, One click to freak them out, And in the darkness bind them.
Releasing it on the anniversary of Tolkien's death is the most disrespectful thing they could have done. Almost signifying their intention to send the message that the old LOTR is dead, and the new woke dumpster fire is here to stay.
"The fanbase are fans. They like the source material because it's the source material they like. If you do something else, you risk alienating the fans on a monumental level. It's no longer Batman if he's a news reporter in a yellow trenchcoat with a pet bat." - _Neil Gaiman_
Too bad Neil Gaiman couldn't uphold to his own words, as evidence by the newly announced Sandman show and his defence of the show's race swapping of iconic characters like Death.
@@grimhat2 ‘race swapping’ one of the Endless isn’t a change that matters on any level, as long as it doesn’t impact the story. Quite honestly Neil Gaiman knows what he’s doing
Amazon never wanted to adapt LOTR, they just wanted a fantasy show of their own, to ride the "game of thrones" bandwagon (which is already dead and gone by now). So they slapped the "Lord of the Rings" brand on it because they wanted a pre-made fanbase of millions of people to draw money from, which is easier than making something new that doesn't have fans yet. They really think that just because something has "Lord of the Rings" on it, the fanbase will consume it without question, and thats not how it works. It didn't work with Disney and Star Wars, it didn't work with Star Trek, and it didn't work now. And the Tolkien fanbase KNOWS IT. We see throught their deception and know that they don't respect us OR the source material, they only respect money. Which is ironic, for because of that they are LOSING money big time, and will lose a lot more.
Agreed the BBC destroyed Doctor Her when it became a Woke gender swap of the original. You would thing that University students would take less than five years to learn something but apparently not, the next Doctor Her is a gay black man?
They will get away with it. Look up Star Trek Discovery. Renewed for season 4 and has nothing to do with Star Trek anymore, but the title and some name dropping. They totally stripped themselves from 50 years of canon. It's a terribly dumbed down show with the silliest stories one can make up, annoying, unlikable and imlausible characters and there are still people watching... Actually the show is so bad, in my opinion they are just testing how far they can push audiences.
The one thing I cannot wrap my head around is that new pre/sequels lately are willingly upsetting the fanbase and calling it a good thing. IF PEOPLE LIKED THE ORIGINAL AND YOU'RE MAKING THEM DISLIKE THE CONTINUATION, HOW IS THAT GOOD? IN WHAT UNIVERSE IS THAT THE DEFINITION OF GOOD?
Yes, Peter Jackson obviously made a mistake adhering close-enough-for-almost-everybody to Tolkien's story. Who the heck wants box office, money, awards and rewatchability anyway?
As a "normie" who's only watched the LOTR movies and played a few games, let me tell you that even us normies who are not super deep into the books and lore can tell that this is shit. If Amazon expects us to save their garbage show, they're wrong.
To the kids here too young to know a time before Jackson's incredible, impossible trilogy: you don't understand that Tolkien's world was considered unfilmable until then. His material is NOT cinema friendly in the slightest and the idea of Peter Jackson making movies based on them was met with a skepticism that was totally understandable. Everything these Amazon people are saying about it being hard to adapt is true, so much so that it probably shouldn't ever have even been attempted. Jackson's films were impossible, but he managed to pull it off because he had the skill, the passion, and a team of artists who were excited to be working on it. This Amazon thing, by comparison, is a homework assignment based on the Game of Thrones textbook. It's no different than one of the countless zombie shows made in The Walking Deads wake.
@@mikavirtanen7029 Well it isn't a great movie. It's totally find and valid to like it and be nostalgic for it, but it's not a good adaptation, and by today's standards it's awful. Back then I can imagine it was a big achievement, which I can respect, and I respect Ralph for trying so hard to make a great adaptation, it did seem like he loved the source matieral.
@@gianna526 While i concur that for each their own, "today's standards" are a total joke in 2022 if you don't count the special effects, and those have always been the one thing that has mattered to me the least. Must be the age thing but CGI bombardment and 3 second cuts don't much impress when it comes to movies.
I remember when it was announced. It did seem impossible and then pictures from the sets started leaking and...Wow! I remember when the pics of the Hobbit houses and Shire leaked. Just amazing how far they were willing to go. It was showing that aspect of it that got people excited and not just moaning. That someone was willing to go so far as to build the Shire to try to get right went a long way in getting audiences to even give it a chance. What these people are doing isn't the way to do it. Edit: I was fortunate enough to chat in an mIRC chat room with one of the owners of some of the property being used for filming so I got to see a bit more than others did.
@@debanydoombringer1385 Same here, man. I think the first bit of news I heard that forced me to come to terms with the idea that it was really happening was the casting of Elijah Wood as Frodo, which immediately told me whoever this Peter Jackson guy is gets it.
Tolkien’s whole universe is so complex and fascinating, there is no way it is skeletal material or there aren’t enough characters. The history of Arda rivals the history of Europe, which is what Tolkien created his fantasy world for.
THE great historian of Tolkien. Who knew his son well and I believed interview Tolkien. Knew Tolkien lore inside and out. Why was he thrown off the show? Hmmmm?
Actually not what Tolkien said, taken out of context. It actually says "The Shadow that bred them can only mock, it cannot make[...]". I agree with the sentiment but misquoting Tolkien is harmful to our argument.
"The Shadow that bred them can only mock, it cannot make: not real new things of its own"..."it only ruined them and twisted them" is the real quote/excerpt
What i find odd is that... it has been pretty standard lore that male and female dwarfs are undistinguished to non dwarfs. I.e. they both have beards, dress the same and act the same. So in the new trans era.... amazon decided to feminise the female dwarfs?
Because their brave and bold black dwarf lady would look fucking moronic with a beard, and they knew it. Rather than own it, they thought they'd just try and play it safe, but oh well
It's sad to see people who clearly hate JRR Tolkien making a series based on his work. The plan is simple.. take things everyone loves and twist it to push a progressive agenda. Anyone who questions this will be labeled in some browbeat fashion.
And all of us who see it coming, because we've seen it happen with 34 other franchises, are dismissed out of hand...our complaints treated as bigotry and reactionary ire, and as though we can be tricked into liking this by being tricked into thinking it's never happened before. Sorry, we're not starting with a blank slate, but with all the awful foreknowledge we need of what Hollywood has become and who dominates that god-awful shithole. We know it will be a disaster. We know why it will be a disaster; we know how it will be a disaster. All their little "Pissing off fans is a good thing!" articles won't obscure that for an instant because we've already read this article dozens of times immediately before dozens of franchises were murdered and made into skinsuits for progressive subversion.
They just want to destroy something they have no stake in and that many love To hurt someone how they're obviously hurting is their intent. We need to hold the line against these grifters that grifted in.
The more time that passes, the greater my appreciation for what Peter Jackson (and his fellow writers, producers, actors, prop personnel, etc) managed to achieve. I remember when Peter Jackson's LOTR was being filmed and discussed. I was honestly terrified. I was terribly afraid of them messing up Middle Earth, messing up my beloved characters, messing up the powerful messages from Tolkien. They released short glimpses of filming, and at least it looked beautiful. But I was still afraid of what they might do to the story and characters. It was not perfect by any stretch. But I honestly cannot fault any of their story choices. Given the enormity of the task, the complexity of the story, the power and importance of SO MANY moments that had to be dropped, I cannot fault their choices. Not perfect, hell no. But astounding. From the moment I saw the movies in the theater to this very day, the storytelling choices they made were amazing. May all the Gods bless Peter Jackson and his crew for this achievement. Mostly, may all the Gods bless them for their conviction to doing their absolute best to bring Tolkien's story to the screen.
Yup, they were literally trying to avoid changing anything they saw as 'we can make it work in movie format' due to wanting to keep the loyalty to the source material as much as possible.
This will be the equivalent of starship troopers and starship troopers 3, 4, and so on. The lotr trilogy is fantastic, the hobbit trilogy is good, albeit not as good, everything else (especially this dumpster fire), will be, much like starship troopers pitiful sequels, utter trash, and will go down in history as such.
It's so infuriating when they take this attitude. They stand on the shoulders of legends and, instead of being grateful, they take a giant, steaming dump on their heads. Arrogant, self-centered narcissists, all.
Thats what Kevin smith did to he man. Decided to beat down a series he obviously didn't like and didn't try to do right by. Then threw a screaming fit on video berating he man fans who didn't like his woke steaming dump on a series they liked and just wanted to see again.
@@MephiticMiasma At least pigeons are innocent, there isn't much they can do about their behavior. These people, part of the most intelligent race, are behaving exactly like animals with less capability. Quite sad really.
Wow. Showing a compilation of articles that ends with: "And that's a good thing." says it all for me. At least they make it easy for us ordinary viewers, so we can easily avoid the garbage they are preparing for us.
Aw, Man, it's so sad more or less the only Sides are toxic Masculinity, Flawed Masculinity and Woke-Masculinity. I mean, we as a Society COULD tackle the fact that yeeeeah, traditional Masculinity was kinda not good, but instead we get Wokeness, which helps no one, duh. I wished we could all stop yelling at each other and maybe watch and consider channels like Salari and Pop Culture Detective.
They're trying to get the highest amount of views with the least amount of actual work put in. This is the reason why all these articles are carbon copies of one another, and why they are essentially just ragebaiting.
they have two problem: 1) they don't want to actually make a series about the source material; they want to make their own series, but have the fanbase of the source material watch it. 2) they don't have the ability to adapt the source material. they have taken on a project they don't have the talent to pull off. together, those two problems are fatal.
The problem is that they want to write their own stories that fit in with their own values. However, those stories don't sell well, so they end up co-opting known brands and franchises. See Wheel of Time, see Star Trek, see Star Wars, see Disney's own stories. They're so focused on their own wokeness that they can't tell a good story with good characters, and they have to use these brands.
Thing is, they have a perfect example of the correct approach with the Peter Jackson movies. He made a particular point to respect the source material and it was massively successful. So they know what works, what is successful, but they rejected this. How stupid are these people?
Have said it before, and I'll say it again - Boycott this abomination folks. Don't even let idle curiosity bring you to press the watch button for the first episode. The only way that Amazon will get even the slightest of hints that what they're doing is unacceptable is to have them watch their viewer ratio plummet into the fire. Make it happen.
If I was head of LOTR I would do everything in my power to respect the lore, and make the many generations fans of the books and films happy. It’s not that difficult.
Indeed, the problem is the Hollywood entertainment people live and work in an echo chamber where they think everyone likes "the message" because everyone they associate with does.
God what a beautiful way to end the video. Aragorns speech somehow tied perfectly into the problems that were addressed in the video. Well done Sir. Big LOTR fan here, and I have been since I first saw the Fellowship as a kid. The trilogy served for the perfect introduction into epic adventure stories. It feels so wrong to water that down with a show that’s rewriting the past events from the original movies. Nobody wants that. And never did I think when growing up that I’d be scared for the future or past of Middle Earth.
The only thing I'm looking forward to regarding this fiasco is the savage reviews it's going to inevitably get. Good laughs Nerdrotic!😂 "And that's a good thing!"
OH YEAH....gonna be a helluva lot of videos coming from this "fellowship" of like minded channels.We really SHOULD be thanking Amazon,they're about to provide us all ton of enjoyable content.....just NOT QUITE in the way that they intended ....😂
Not to mention that it's yet another opportunity for fence sitters to realise that there's a war being waged against decency and everything that is good. And the enemy are the wokeists.
Fans and customers are important in any business and community. You are basically giving them a reason to earn you money and support. Bullying the fans and potential customers has always been a business and marketing idea fail for decades. They do not want us? Fine. They got what they deserved. We will take our money and support elsewhere. The internet is a small place, if you think about it, and not the outside world.
this is why communism utterly hates the free market, and democracy... the people have the power, they have the voting right. communists cannot force their agendas on people in the free world... if the people don't like it, they can always ignore it, or bash it into oblivion!!! communists, really hated people having the wealth and power to challenge their propaganda and agendas, that is why they are trying so hard right now to destroy the US economy though biden's marxist spending policies!!!
But wait, if they call me a sexist, racist, man-baby maybe it will make me want to pay for their product this time. (Nah, it will just make me feel even more resentment and ensure that I am not interested in Amazon’s future products).
I agree, the reporter trying to tell people the appropriate way to interpret an adaption drove me nuts. It’s my time and money who are you to tell me that I have to spend it a certain way?
For anyone wanting to understand the outrage over casting, here is the very simple reason. LOTR is an iconically European story written so uniquely within that nationality and lore that it really is subject to being an artistic achievement of Caucasian heritage. Some consider it to be culturally disrespectful to vandalize iconically ethnic artistic works, hence the outrage.
I don't think they are absolutely locked into 5 seasons. There is no contract with any third party. If the reviews and viewership are bad enough they might decide to cancel everything after the 2nd season. That's what I am hoping and praying for.
The modders behind LotR: Realms in Exile (a mod for Crusader Kings 3) have managed to invent characters and lore for their mod without enraging Tolkien fans or taking a dump on Middle Earth. The ammount of respect for Tolkien and his mythos is the foundation for any good adaptation. No amount of production value helps if you can't even get that right.
I'll never understand this thirst for sticking it to the fans. If you're adapting an existing franchise, the fans are your guaranteed audience if you get it right. If you lose them, what do you have? You may as well just start with your own IP.
Leftists are evil, soulless, and jealous terrorists. We have souls. They do not. We are sane. They are not. They know, deep down. They can't handle it, so they wish to destroy us and the world. Collectively, they are nihilism incarnate.
Why do they go after successful, popular IPs, you ask? Because they know that *anything* original they could come up with would be the same, stupid, senseless, idiotic and vomit inducing drivel they wrote, only without the popular IP's wrapper........It's all a game to suck people in.......
It's about simultaneously destroying something they perceive as a "symbol of white supremacy" and "hetero-normative behavior" and pushing their ideology onto anyone and everyone as the only acceptable viewpoint. They are trying to forcibly shift societal and cultural perception to fit how they see the world.
"...and that's a good thing." That part was great! You should definitely keep that going. It's not only sickening on its face, but the way you laid them all out just shows how one-dimensional and simplistic their tactics actually are if you only know what to look for.
I've been thinking for a while now that we need some central source of all the wokified, gender-bent, blackwashed, generally destroyed IPs/characters/etc. in recent years. There must be dozens by now. I know of quite a few myself and I barely pay attention to this crap.
Destroying franchises and upsetting original fans is NOT a good thing ... Just ask ghostbusters 2016, terminator and Doctor Who just to name a few of those! Using the wheel of time as a good example shows how dense the writer really is.
I loved the book series of WoT. When I heard that there was going to be a live action series, all I felt was anxiety. Anxiety that it was going to be bad, given that it was being made current time. Unfortunately, my anxiety was well founded. I saw mayhaps the first five minutes and could count the number of "creative liberties" they made to this series. Too many.
These fools can even adapt things like Star Wars that have 30 years of fleshed out characters that were properly written because of one Unified lore. They think they can make up anything good by themselves? Haha laughable. That’s why they target these popular franchises to spread their messages because they can’t create.
One of three things will happen here, I speculate: 1) The creatives will claim "original stories" and then strip mine whatever they can get their hands on, including fan fiction/art, etc. Evidence of this happening in the industry before already exists. OR 2) The creatives will "borrow inspiration" from 6-12 other popular/obscure fantasy franchises and just use its storylines and characters, with some common fantasy Hollywood fantasy tropes thrown in. Evidence already exists of this happening. OR 3) A combination of 1 and 2.
As soon as they say that the cast should reflect what the real world looks like, you know it will suck completely. You know what kinds of minds you are dealing with. They can't fix it now.
I have read all the books, watched all the movies up to this point. When I heard there was a beardless dwarf I lost interest in this one. A change that tolkien WOULDA supported would be a redemption story for an orc. JRR Tolkien always regretted making them essentially irredeemable.
The Gorbag and Shadrat chat (after the Shelob but) always captivated me. It made me realise that the Orcs were actually unwilling in this, even if they were nasty and evil in general, they weren't interested in world domination. It would have been amazing if Tolkien fleshed the Orcs out a bit more because there was alot he could have done with it.
@@Tom-sd9jb On their own Orcs were tribalistic and spent most of the time fighting each other. The real trouble starts when an actual dark power controls them in one direction. Their origins are also a bit unclear, because Tolkien couldn't exactly decide if Orcs were their own race, or started as elves heavily mutated by Morgoth. I think it's a bit of loose end, because Morgoth was not supposed to be able to create new life, as only Eru could do that. Aule did create dwarves, but Eru gave them free will, though Morgoth was way stronger than Aule, at least until he started to spread himself into Arda, dragons and whatever else.
Yessss. There was always sentences in every page insulting the orcs, but in the end you could see how much Tolkien loved them, because you do not give characters you hate those dialogs. I always felt like Tolkien would have wanted a redemption arc for them.
I just saw The Northman. Strangely enough, there was no forced "diversity", no _current year_ agenda. Amazingly, the movie was awesome and felt respectful of the source.
Saw it this past week - first showing of the day, and quite a few people in the theater. It felt so good to see a film that was true to itself and took pains to be accurate. Brilliant film! We need to find and support these authentic works whenever we can.
I do consider myself a Tolkien purist, and I wasn't happy with PJ's LOTR not simply because there were changes, but because of their manner. There were changes that I approved of because they were simply necessary to shorten the material, such as dropping Tom Bombadil or replacing Erkenbrand with Éomer, or condensing the timeline. My issue was with the changes that went against the spirit of the work, such as Aragorn breaking the codes of honour multiple times, or Sam's violence against Gollum, or profound changes to the characters, such as Faramir or Denethor. However, compared to what Amazon is doing, PJ's changes are like a skin rash against terminal cancer. Second Age events have two focal points - the events in Númenor, leading to its fall, and the forging of the Rings, the subsequent war and Sauron's ultimate fall in the war of the Last Alliance. Galadriel on a revenge quest adds nothing to these events (and actually detracts from what needs to be focused on), and Hobbits have no place there, just like a nobody healer and her even more nobody son, along with a random Sylvan Elf, because they play ZERO role in these events. Any original characters need to be connected to the major events in a meaningful way, such as Celebrimbor's fellow smiths, or Elendili and King's Men both in Númenor and in Middle-Earth and their allies, and they need to play a role in those events, not just be affected by them. Everything I have seen so far is just terrible writing, by people who apparently don't understand how things work if you want to create a successful story.
the argument that they need to drop some things because of time constraints (which i agree with is necessary if its a movie, perhaps not necessarily if its a series) gets a bit hollowed out when they also add quite a few things that arent in the books. like the fairly long scene with the orcs on wolves attacking rohan civilians for example, that was in my view completely unnecessary and added nothing to the story. i will say this, there is one "diversity" element actually in the books that could have been kept in the movies to satisfy the diversity enthusiasts, and it is The Drúedain, also known as Woses, Wild Men of the Woods or Púkel-men.
The bits with Faramir and Denethor probably frustrate me the most of the ones listed, because it profoundly changed their characters in ways I don't know was really necessary, though I do think it would have been a good story regardless if it was part of the book
@@fourshore502 Couldn't agree more on the unnecessary additions, those were terribly frustrating (and mostly also quite stupid). Adding those while dropping such "minor" details like the reckoning with Saruman in the theatre edition... A good point on the diversity, but since it was quite a minor plot element, it's one of those cuts I am comfortable with ;-) Gimli proposing, and Aragorn considering, breaking his word to the Dead to release them after they went all gooseberry jam on Minas Tirith troubles me way more ;-)
I love how they're taking amazing stories written by genius writers and just using the titles as a means to push their own filth onto the screen. Because they knew, that if they tried to write a series that stood alone, in the fantasy genre, it would not gain any traction. They gave us hope with WoT, but we learned...and saw the destruction and horrid bile that is their agenda.
What I enjoyed most about LOTR other than the story were the character interactions and how they truly cared and protected one another. As a viewer you grew to like and and admire their fortitude. It was truly a work of art that restored my hope in film, which unfortunately didn't last.
I'm becoming convinced that all these attacks on our mythos are meant to castrate society, and belittle fans. These people are taking ips and making vanity pics with them, without regard for the reviews of the general population, presenting them as genuine attempts at entertainment. And I have no doubt they are genuinely entertained by our reactions to their abominations. Stay awesome brother
Its commie cultural war. Destroy established norms and force their garbage and try to make social pariahs out of anyone who oposes them. Even if they arent being paid, their winnies usefull idiots
I love when studios leave original audiences behind to make a movie woke. Because the audience they are pandering to doesn't care, therefore nobody ends up caring. Exactly why most recent SW movies failed
The only time when a studio cares about a fan, is when said fan is a revenue stream. They have ZERO loyalty to, and ZERO commitment to, fans of a franchise. It has always been a comfortable setup where the creator/customer relationship means they create and you are expected to pay for whatever they create. With their current attitude, I would say that people are waking up to the fact that you are no longer limited to what a handful of studios decides you get to watch. :/
Imagine having a billion dollars to produce something based on Tolkien's 2nd Age. My main goal would have been to stay true to the source material. It's sad, they could have done something truly amazing.
to be fair, even when you stay true to the source material, adapting the silmarillion into a film/series is no easy task and will probably disappoint a lot of fans
@@Schnitzelwirt4life it would be cool if they employed hard core LOTR fans with youtube channels dedicted to LOTR to proof their script and present changes to get it correct.
Silmarillion as a book sucks tbh. Like the hobbit is a kids adventure and rocks. Lotr is like a King Arthur style Adventure mega novel. Silmarillion is idk what ? A series of Beowulf style sagas ? I’ve read it and none of it sticks with me
Once again, Nerdrotic is SPOT ON...hitting the nail on the head! STAY IN THE SPIRIT OF TOLKIN, make MINOR CHANGES, introduce IN CONTEXT characters who SUPPORT TOLKIN's characters! DO NOT USE TOLKIN TO PUSH MORONIC SOCIAL AGENDAS!
"Purists" aren't a group within the Tolkien fandom. It *is* the Tolkien fandom. Tolkien wrote a detailed world of characters and history that these hacks have no right to trash.
False. I am a Tolkien reader since 40 years but I don't consider myself a blind zealot who would burn something based on speculations and else. A fictional universe is there to evolve. It was there to support works like the roleplay MERP or the game Lotro online. Two pieces with new characters (and a new balrog) that were supported and praised by members of the so called fans. Fans : the words itself means a lot. Blind people which could be compared to ISIS members. Open up your mind people.
It's like arguing that quantum physicists are bad cuz they know their material well - yet dun agree with your bullshit idea of quarks and howi t affects Patriarchy in society, etc.
I've never wanted a show to fail as much as I want "Rings of Prime" to fail; I find all of what has been revealed about it to be a damn shame. Why dont they make a series about the book of Revelation or Genesis and load it up with identity politics and diversity tropes?
Every time one these articles drops, you can tell that behind the scenes, the "reporters" working on the write up about the show are just being instructed to write that all the obvious flaws and faux pas reported to exist about the show are good things. It's just mindless gruel cope slop for the dead inside woke viewers who just can't consume a good story without needing to somehow see themselves in it. What's next, Watership Down, but all the rabbits are trans, with pink fur?
@DEZZNUTZ 1001 They couldn't be more blatant, if after the interview, they threw in a link to Amazon Prime on a promotion afterwards. It's like since GB: ATC (2016), they really believe that with enough media B.S, they can change people to watch something they throughly dislike.
No, pleaseeee dont....dont change my rabbits... I must say, that last (Netflix?) version was bad enough ( in comparation with previous film and show (great 2d animation...show where every rabbit was visually different with huge character differences))
It's even worse then you describe coz that suggests there are any woke viewers.... except maybe from the few crazy Reylo shippers, that you can count on 1 hand, there aren't any. I guess 'that's a good thing' is pointing to how these activists have managed to subvert yet another franchise to their woke politics.... or to dust coz I don't think many LOTR fans will even want to watch it. It's like the new Indiana Jones... I'm a huge fan of the explorer adventurer archeologist genre.... but there is no way in hell I'm gonna watch Indiana Jones 5 coz I already know it's gonna be a 3 times shitshow all over.
Been watching "old" movies and TV the last year or so (stuff from the 80s,90s mostly) and DAMN I miss those days. Even the early 2000s stuff is lightyears better than current work, the difference in quality is staggering. 80s stuff I took for granted as a kid has so many layers I never understood back then. Rewatching the Jackson trilogy for the first time in ages made me appreciate his work all over again, it was beautiful. This show will be the "last gasp" of the religion of Woke, the winds are changing and people have finally reached the breaking point.
Yeah for sure. I realized my old vhs and dvd collection will never get dusty bc I'd rather watch them than the shit that's out now. Recently saw "a few good men" why can't we get more of that??
Whenever a piece of artistic work has to come out and 'preemptively' address anything, especially so-called 'purists', you know it's going to be dreadful.
Watching fans protect Tolkien's work warms my cold dead heart like the undead oathbreakers seeing Andúril reforged knowing it is their moment to enter the fray of battle one last time
Never has the phrase “Standing on the shoulders on giants” been more appropriate. These people are disgraceful vultures who hold nothing but contempt for Tolkien and those of us who love his works. Tolkien’s work changed my life as a young man and have had a profound impact on me. I still remember seeing FotR in theaters when I was 5. My mom read The Hobbit to my brother and I when we were little, before the LotR movies came out, and I fell in love with it. I read all of Tolkien’s works by the age of 12 and continue to read them to this day. They are absolutely timeless and easily the most profound works I’ve ever come across in the fantasy genre. What they’re doing is sickening, I’ve honestly never been more upset about an IP being subverted. When they came for Star Wars, WoT, and the others, that was one thing. But now they’re coming for a foundational piece of Western literature and actively trying to corrupt it. I’ve never been a “let’s boycott this” kinda guy. But at this point, please, I’m begging everyone out there who loves Tolkien, DO NOT WATCH THIS. Even for a “let’s see how bad it is” kinda thing. Don’t give it attention and let it fucking die in flames like it should.
You've never been a “let’s boycott this” kind of guy? Then you've been the "kinda guy" to stand back and watch when others have been outraged when the stuff they love was being trashed and called for a boycott. Which makes calling out for others to help you now, a hypocrite. You have glibly said, "When they came for Star Wars, WoT, and the others, that was one thing" i.e. it didn't matter much as far as you were concerned. Well allow me to educate you of the fact that Star Wars influenced far more people than Tolkien ever did and was therefore every bit as much of a cultural treasure; indeed, it was far more important. Star Wars transcended the movie industry and has literally reshaped the world we live in. For a start, on the most basic and obvious level (although it's likely that only film academics generally know it) Star Wars single-handedly revitalised the movie industry by making cinema-going popular again. If you examine the cinema-going trend historically it had been a failing pastime year on year until the release of Star Wars in 1977. From then on its popularity rocketed and the particular success of George Lucas (intertwined with that of Steven Spielberg) infiltrated the entire industry from actual film making, through sound via Skywalker Sound Systems, and visual effects via Industrial Light and Magic (both owned by Lucas), and merchandising. This is just mentioning the direct impact of the work of Lucas which was only possible because of the success of Star Wars. The cultural impact of this one film was off the charts. The 'blockbuster' film, and hugely successful film 'franchises' emerged out of the desire for bigger and more spectacular special effect movies; and the special effects technologies that were invented literally for the Star Wars franchise, specifically the ultra high speed cameras used for making explosions look massive, were soon exploited in the field of science enabling huge advances in the study of things that happen faster than the human eye can see; and being able to see super-fast things happening as slowly as desired has helped scientists understand new things in all manner of fields such as engineering and ballistics. The super computers that were invented to handle the compositing of special effects shots have advanced super computers for use in things like modelling artificial environments for studies in practically every field of science. Yet even on the simple level of children growing up, more of them had posters of their favourite Star Wars characters on their bedroom walls (not to mention every other conceivable aspect of merchandising) than were ever influenced by Tolkien. Even the peter jackson trilogy owes its existence to the success of Star Wars and Industrial Light and Magic. Weta got all their technology and expertise from Lucas' I.L.M. Then think of all the costume and makeup technologies that went into the LotR films that were developed on the back of the ground-breaking work done in these fields in the original Star Wars trilogy. I won't be giving any attention to this Amazon garbage, don't worry about that; but let's not claim that we shouldn't watch now that it's Tolkien's work that is being exploited. This evil zeitgeist of cultural vandalism in the name of feminism and identity politics was always wrong and had everyone kicked up a stink when it was 'only' Star Wars, Star Trek, Dr Who, etc. then it might not be happening to Tolkien now at all.
@@KeldorDAntrell Unfortunately, that's how lots of people learn about the systematic dismantling of good stories. Not necessarily because they're hypocrites, but because they bought the lie that this bullshit article peddles. When it finally landed on their doorstep, they realized we weren't crazy, after all.
@@KeldorDAntrell Poor star wars fan obsessed by a comment who was made concerning about destructuration of litterature masterpiece. Your sw stew had nothing on paper except a void of scenario, nothing to treasure and cheer with on scholarship programm , no moral scale to learn at anybody. Star Wars is a poor universe, a poor movie who gets older really bad. A poor story and poor on practically everything. Except, yes, it was a new concept on cinema industry. Second of all, Jackson maybe followed Lucas path except with way more talent and absolute perfectionnism. Not to mention story of LOTR came on 40's, way more before SW universe. So about what source material are you talking? The build-up of LOTR took 8 years, the pre-production one entire year, 16 at 18 other months just for shooting and another year for editing and post-production. Every bit of set was imagined, drawed, created, made and build by Metaworkshop mesmerizing dedicated crew. Every weapon, every coat, every button, every armor, every plate and chair, every make-up, were entirely created and made by people of talent beyond recognization. It's a jewell of cinematographic industry wich every of 3 movies stomped any SW movie on everything. Story, filmmaking, editing, MUSIC, feelings, acting, speeches, writting, photography, epicness, practical effects, VFX effects, sets, build-up of a universe and retranscription t the screen, make-up, impact on soul and memories, money gross, awards..17 Oscars. There is in fact nothing to compare with. It's not because limited as hell people like you were much more to like a thing that it's making this thing better. In fact, yes factually, there is nothing to do between LOTR cosmos and SW world. It's not the same league. At all. LOTR will always clamp Star Wars in everything. Deal with it.
In this day and age 22yr olds are writing editors of dictionaries and requesting definitions of words be changed to reflect modern wokeness. Websters changed the definition of Racism because a young woman complained people were using its existing definition of the word to prove they weren't racists. The editors granted her request. Its disturbing these journalists are using updated definitions in their arguments.
FINALLY more and more people are opening their eyes to what I noticed many years ago: the panderisation of zoomers (people born 1991-2001) There has never been a generation so pandered to and given more special treatment than zoomers. These are the same people who spread covid, destroyed the education system, defaced landmarks and deplatformed innocent people. Despite this, they keep being HANDED everything. Name me one, ONE, franchise that hasnt been handed to them, that doesnt have a cast comprising exclusively of people born in that year group. Oh right, there is one…the Mario film announced that it was only going to have ONE zoomer in the cast…and how did Zoomers react to this? By throwing a MASSIVE COLLECTIVE hissy fit! Indeed, they are SO USED to special treatment, that they just couldn’t fathom not being given it.
I fucking hate it when suits smell money in something I love. They NEVER make it for me or anyone who loves the property. They are making it for the lowest common denominator which will inevitably piss off the real fans for no long term gain as the lowest common denominator wont care about their watered-down Hershy-squirt of a project anyway. They can make a movie for me, or they can make one for a Karen. It takes phenomenal skills to pull off a project that appeals to both. Talent most people who work for large corporations lack. Look Amazon's game studio. Did they make games for gamers? No, they made games for shareholders. It was all about the greed with little though to actual game mechanics or story.
Out of all the fandoms to piss off, why go after the LoTR fans? Other fandoms are far more forgiving than them, and Amazon tries this? They have no idea what pile they're stepping into.
If the Tolkien ABSOLUTISTS are cast as trolls or vandals, then media probably won't cover them or even cancel them. At least Twitter under Elon would probably allow the Tolkien fans to convince the public that the Lord of the Rings by Amazon contradicts the canon story. Generally speaking, the common people that will watch LotR-Amazon probably don't even know most of the opinions of Tolkien fans. And if the Tolkien fans tell the common people about the problems in a bombastic way, or if the media companies successfully label the Tolkien fans as a small group of unpleasant basement-dwelling nerds, then the general public will ignore the Tolkien fans.
@@animejanai4657 I would agree for the most part, except it's true fans that keep a franchise going. How many normies would be ecstatic about seeing the uncut trilogy? Multiple times? That's what Amazon doesn't understand, and only now is Disney starting to figure out.
I am just struggling to understand why they believed a Tolkien fan would be interested to watch characters not created by Tolkien in an adaptation of Tolkien's work? They are creating entire new characters and stories shared between them, while also radically changing original characters. The arrogance of these people is hard to grasp.
@@queenberuthiel5469 The only things this guys possibly understand are money and fear. So let them smell the fire. It didn't have to be this way, but it is. "Let it be fear"
Gary your analysis is great as always. I'm 100% with you. The reason they have to create new characters is because none of the established characters have the compromised morals that Amazon needs to push the woke agenda.
Holy crap. You just kept saying "that's a good thing" with article after article. I didn't realize that was such a common messaging technique that they've been using like the "tHrEaTs To OuR dEmOcRaCy." Thanks for the laugh, nerdrodic!
Yep, it’s projecting, like they’ll keep denying things when they get called out on it. Eventually, they’ll come clean, and be like: “So what that we did that”, then they’ll go on about how you deserved to have it happen.
Inflation and why it's a good thing still has to be one of my favorites. It's one thing to do it with fictional stuff. It's a whole new level to try to use it for the real world.
Tauriel in the Hobbit would have been absolutely fine without the silly "love triangle" I could tolerate it slightly but it would have been better if she was a soldier simply unable to follow the Kings isolationist orders.
As a fan of Robert Jordan’s Wheel of Time books, I am sad at what has been done to a great series of books, but also, kinda happy that it happened so that the Tolkien fans had the opportunity to see exactly the kind of trash Amazon was going make out of Lord of the Rings. Here’s hoping Amazon cuts their losses and just cancels the whole thing.... and the WoT(fan fiction) tv show too.
Never read the books, really liked the series, can't wait for new season... Whenever an IP is translated to series or film just don't expect it to be the same, expect it to be a "Wheel of Time"-inspired story... Nerds are so extremely whiny, whether it is Star Wars, Star Trek, LotR or whatever IP fan-base... You take it far to seriously, just wait and see, if it is bad it is bad, if it is good it is good. And it can be good while deviating massively from the established lore and it can be bad while strictly adhering to the lore.
@@GeraltofRivia22 obviously it’s not about the money... they spent a ridiculously large amount of money on the show, but the effects, sets, even costumes look so cheap that if I was in the accounting department of Amazon, I would be pushing to investigate for embezzlement.
Amazon is one of the few companies that could scrap this disaster and start over from scratch. If they don't their investment in LOTR will be near worthless.
Seems Amazon is going to have to learn the hard way those "Toxic fans" they love to whine about are the ones who spend money on your franchises. Who do you think bought all that Lord of the Rings merch over the years keeping the cash fat and happy?
"judging a book by it's cover" no, it's judging a show we'll have to pay for based on advertising material designed specifically to entice us to buy it. No one should have to pay for product to know if product is bad. You don't have to step in a cow turd to know you don't want to step in a cow turd.
I know. It's stupid. As if it's similar with picking up a book at a library. It is buying that darn book and finding it awful and wishing you didn't buy and read it.
Not to worry. We have trusted critics like Nerdrotic & Critical Drinker to watch the first episodes for us before we shell out a dime. Thanks, guys. I feel your pain.
and anyhow, you should judge books by their cover. That doesn't mean you come to some final conclusion over some superficial detail. But if all you have is a cover, that's all you have to work with till the book is printed. If someone wants us to have different feelings about this project, they should provide the details that suggest a different judgement is more appropriate than the one we are making based on what they have so far provided.
You stepped in a cow turd and why that's a good thing! You paid for a bad product and why that's a good thing! The newest head lines fresh off the press.
"Do not judge a book by it's cover." No. That's not the problem. The problem is how they marketed it. They're supposed to convince me to watch the show or film. They're are not entitled to my money or time. If I see a trailer of an existing franchise and in this case tramples over that franchise in a contemptible and malignant way, fueled with a repugnant ideology. I'm out. You lost me at the starting line.
@@oblivionsa7973 I've started calling them the Algebra people since they started adding numbers to it. Just seems easier than trying to remember the quadratic equation they have going on now.
"Dont judge a book by its cover" is the single most mindlessly moronic attitude masquerading as wisdom. Literally, the books cover is its most important marleting assset. It gives a customer an immediate sense of genre, the story, the tone, the taget market, and the style of the book. It literally exists to convince you to read the book. And if your covers shit, and misrepresents the story or doesnt appeal to your customers, its your fault. Not theirs. I'm a writer. These are facts. Trailers are the covers to the show's book. They done fucked up their cover.
I don't get this from a business perspective, most of these franchises are established franchises, that means that there is not a whole lot of room for growth. It does mean there is a large group of people ready and waiting to buy your product. Pissing the fans off, is not a good business decision. And I understand there is a lot of ideological hoe ha going on as well, but big business execs don't care. They expect a line graph, with profit margins, and that line better be going up. From a logical perspective this does not make sense and if I were a shareholder I would be furious that this even has such a big chance at failure.
This comment is spot on. I really don't get how big corporations (who do have a lot of target marketing staff) could not see that this is going to be a complete failure from a financial standpoint. After all profits are really the single thing these companies care about. And pushing some agenda while pissing off most of your fanbase won't create those profits, since you loose a massive tolkien fanbase than you cannot easily substitute by a few leftist people. (since these people usually aren't really interested in medival looking stuff in the first place). So this is not only ruining a masterpiece of fiction but also a complete missinvestment.
Business? See below. Even with a plethora of Leftist cultural saboteurs, most of these problems would not appear were it not for the the fact that a few economic giants control the media. As it is now, they can absorb the financial losses associated with "woke culture" without much worry because they have no real competition and their buddies in finance will simply create more money for them out of thin air; that's how modern finance and government granted money monopoly works. More important to them is "The Message", which is designed to destroy those pesky White people in the USA and elsewhere who are the bulwark against their globalist plans.
You missunderstand it. They do not buy a franchise. They buy the customers of that product by buying the ip. By doing that (atleast) in theory you can make sure your project will not fail, will be hyped and you can shove down their throat any agenda that you have. In paper. In reality ppl realise some way or form this and simply stop giving a f@ck. (What a strange language, giving a f@ck…)
Same could be said for all the other franchises that where ruined. Apparently the big business exces did care enough. Star Wars, Star Trek, WoT, Doctor Who, Batwoman and the list goes on and on. There where big business execs on the top there as well? And it seems they did not expect a line graph, with profit margins.
I like how this writer felt confident enough in their opinion write this piece with "and that's a good thing in it," and then still hedged the crap out of their position throughout the article... lots of conviction in this one I see.
For me, it's more the blatant lack of self-awareness of contradicting oneself in the article. Don't these article writers double-check their own articles to see if it makes sense (or at least have someone give them a second opinion on it)? As well as the writer at least acknowledges TWICE in the article that it COULD be a failure. Which not only means the writer is confused, but also actually strengthens the case for source material in favor of the PURISTS. Thanks Looper. You should have that writer write some more articles on LOTR. We could sure use the help. :/
Yeah its spineless. They are selling the headline, and trying to win the argument with an article that doesn't support it. "Well if you actually read the article..."
And yet "fans" on the LOTR facebook pages still defend this stuff! "have you seen it yet?" they cry! "Sick of all the negative neckbeards who know everything" etc. Wait for their voices to fall silent when this shitshow hits the fan.
I very much suspect these are not fans; these are just mindless consumers of products who pretend to be fans in love with the lore. They are very much akin to the worshippers of the Star Wars sequel trilogy. They are not looking forward to examine the degree to which the series relates to the source material. They are looking forward to CGI and "the message". They could not discern a good plot if their lives depended on it.
I think the biggest thing that goes wrong in their story will be the time scale. They run a whole second age in one or two human lifespans. IE it will be nothing like second age. It's just Tolkien in name, nothing else. If they do that nothing in the series can possibly follow the lore. Nothing. Not one thing.
I'm starting to wonder - is it the same person writing the same article (slightly adapted for every outlet), or just people copying each other's articles? I mean, even the headings are more or less the same? :/
"I got bitten by a shark, and that's a good thing!" "I got robbed and my house burned down, and that's a good thing!" Blah blah blah these whiny writers and their snarky hottakes...🙄
Speaking of being robbed, Seth Rogen would still be laughing when he is robbed and stripped naked on a curb beside a restaurant. He supports people having their stuff stolen.
"This is going to upset the fans" should be when a studio pumps the brakes and reevaluates their decisions. With woke hollywood, it's a point of pride instead.
Mmmm...don't really agree that's what they should do. If all they are thinking is "what will the fans like?" then they can't have considered the source material deeply enough to successfully convey it. Instead of being in-your-face activist, it will end up stilted, commercial, and shallow. Both are equally unwatchable, one for being offensive and possibly boring and the other for *definitely* being boring. The first thing they need to do is understand the story. Not just *what* appeals to people (whether fans or people introduced to it by their movie/show), but *why* it might appeal to them.
@@sarahgould5435 while I agree that no one should look at production as a hollow question of "what does X want?" It's mostly about what will work. What resonates. If you target an audience, you make what they want. Then you add what that audience "likes." You tone it *reasonably* with your *target audience's* views. Meaning don't build a movie around a message aimed at correcting your target audience's views. Instead it should be built on the thing they love, with love for it, and for the sake of loving it. Not shame fans, not change fans, not update materials to fit different morals/views, not to back a stance, not to give jobs to people based on intrinsic characteristics, not to make it your own, etc.
agreed and that is the real reason these crappy writers attach their stuff under famous names because their stuff would never get people to buy it without tricking them by using a big name
Ah yes, Looper, planting the seeds so that the disaster can be blamed on having to create new characters (alone) that will have caused the Epic Failure it is going to be. They are planting these nuggets to divert attention away from destroying the Lore in favor of The Message - and that 'Message' is going to again prove financially catastrophic. And they only have themselves and their Message to blame. Long may the Rings of Power burn and melt into the Void.
The Message is the highest god for these people. Other things can only be good in how they are able to be used for The Message. Thats why people that arent pleased when changes are made to better support The Message are clearly Sinners and bigots.
Clearly they believe that their “reactionary” tactics in the past were the problem. By not passing off the fans *before* the show/movie aired they gave us time to organize and find the weak points in their arguments. They have decided that the best defense is an early offense
@@ravengrey6874 Well, it hasn't stopped them from doing what they always do - attack any critics prematurely, because let's face it, they can't help themselves. Although I have to say, I DO find it strange that the response to LOTR criticism has been so "muted" - it almost feels like the studios told the digital media outlets to stop their nonsense or lose their media access, or something. :/
"For a 21st century audience." You know why Tolkien's original work, and Peter Jackson's adaptation, will be the cash-cows that never run dry? Because they weren't written for a 21st century audience. They were written for a timeless audience. Catering to the fad of the day.... will feed you for that day only. I hope for your sake you have carefully measured out the actual volume of the demographic you so seek to butter your bread, and found it to be sufficient to mitigate your astronomical financial overheads.
That "fad of the day" will not even feed them today because noone wants to see it. In this case I doubt that even absolute normies and cons00mers will flock in enough numbers to it to justify all the money and time spent on creating this show.
That's why they are called classics, their work never gets old the only good thing about this show is that people who got some curiosity will search for the original material and hopefully see what kind of mess they've just watched. I just hope there ain't gonna be some idiots like it happened to Berserk where they tried to cancel the manga because it was ''too violent''.
![Seungmin "그렇게, 천천히, 우리(As we are)" | [Stray Kids : SKZ-PLAYER]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/kAzmhLHePqU/mqdefault.jpg)
Here's the thing. There is no point in having source material if you're going to deviate from it. You may as well create something new. All Amazon have done is waste a bazillion dollars on a name for a show that, due to having nothing to do with that name, will be a failure. And that's a good thing.
Seriously, you're just writing your own thing and slapping something else's name on it.
No, This is clearly motivated by ideology as much as money and from that perspective they are winning.
They have earned accolades from all the institutions dominated by this woke pseudo religion, many people have furthered their careers and further entrenched this ideology culturally.
They are eroding, one by one, the beautiful things in our culture that predate the coming of progressive wokeness, and are eliminating people who might take issue from the power centers, cultural centers, academia and media.
There's a very good point in doing that from their point of view. It muddies the water on beloved works and destroys the common culture of the people progressives want to demoralize. Whether or not it's successful is relatively immaterial, what matters is dividing the people who liked the originals over to what extent they do or don't like the "adaptations."
@@zakpodo They have had complete control for well over a decade now, but I think, maybe, that the tides are finally turning. I could be wrong of course, but I think change is finally coming. It seems most 'normies' are sick and tired of this nonsense.
@@menthols4625 And as soon as good quality alternatives to the woke machine exist, they will jump ship. It's up to us to create those alternatives.
It's always strange to me how people say "Who cares what the fans know about the lore?" and, in the same article, try to hold themselves as more educated than the fans.
It goes to show how insufferable fans are that people who think they know the lore 1. Dont even consider themselves fans so to not be associated with "fans" and 2. Dont interact with fans enough to realise that they dont know shit...
It is trully impressive
It's a classic of the "educated class", to argue that one should have the cake one has eaten and do so smugly.
The classic "shut up i know more than you" tactic. A classic in that it never works.
@@adoniscreed4031 The mental gymnastics you shills go to is really impressive. Considering your toxic mindset causes you to drive your own supporters away. You can’t handle criticism because you want to always be right. It’s sad and pathetic. Because if you didn’t care, you wouldn’t be bringing negativity into the comment’s section (of videos talking about what’s wrong with this woke adaptation) and would be trying to have a real conversation about why the fans are responding the way they are.
I like how they call themselves fans but then want to change it. ROFL
I’m glad that “that’s a good thing” is now code for, “we are going to lose money.” I guess it actually is a good thing…ironic.
Reeee he said race of Men! Reeeeee. The proper bigoted response is race of persons capable of being man or woman or any 88 other genders.
perfect Comment!
"Soylent Green IS people...and why that's a GOOD THING!" -MSM (Eventually...)
It could be a way to show that the fans and customers are right since you should never bully them.
They dont want to make money. They want to cause controversy
Didn't Tolkien say it himself in the Lord of the Rings?
The forces of darkness do not have the power to create. They take what good created and make twisted mockeries and perversions of it.
Top comment right here I commend you!
Underrated comment
BAM!
Imagine paying millions of dollars for a franchise just to throw all of that material into the trash-bin.
Disney's done it three times. Marvel, Star Wars, Pixar.
Bought and paid for, took a look at existing material, said no thanks (once Endgame was done for Marvel) and maybe Amazon thought that looked cool.
I mean look how well all those entities are doing!
It looks like they only buy the name.
I don't have to imagine. Rise of Skywalker exists.
Yup, when the EU got cancelled that was the same thing
Firing Tom Shippey, who attended King Edward's School in Birmingham, became a professional philologist, occupied Tolkien's professorial chair at the University of Leeds, and taught Old English at the University of Oxford to the syllabus that Tolkien had devised, tells you EVERYTHING you need to know about this show.
@@jorgelacayo5688 He was replaced with Mariana Rios Maldonaldo, the Diversity and Equality Officer at the University of Glasgow. They apparently know more about Tolkien than Tolkien himself did.
@@Ozymandias1 "Diversity and Equality Officer", really?
I understand Shipley was fired because he broke his NDA
I still can't believe they fired someone with his credentials.
@@twidman8882 They usually make exceptions for people with his level of talent..
They were intimidated by his intelligence..
I just don’t understand how we can live in a time where businesses constantly put out shitty products and then insult, berate and lecture the paying costumers for not liking them. That should be a big no no in marketing 101.
When people sniff enough of their own farts, they eventually develop a taste for each others bullshit.
They can simply not comprehend how the rest of us are not into eating shit.
@@ZeroB4NG well the problem is that many people still buy into this crap and support it financially. Disney star wars still made a ton of money. Many people are just regular movie goers, they are fine with mediocre products. Same as how many people buy a new fifa or cod game every year despite them being all almost identical.
It’s because they hate us.
That's because they are not in this to sell content to fans, they are there for THE MESSAGE.
You would think right...but not in woke Clown World.
It brings me peace to know that I am not the only one who hates seeing our culture destroyed by these cash grab intersectional shows. Keep up the good work!
I cannot believe a producer said that Middle Earth needs to “reflect what the world(?) actually looks like.” All our most beloved franchises are in the hands of people who don’t care or respect them in any way. They only look at them as potential sources of revenue. Disgusting.
No, that attitude has nothing to do with money. It's about reputation, prestige, clout, and political power. The people making decisions are already rich beyond fathoming. What they now want instead is the admiration of other woke celebrities and the politicians and cultural barons they worship.
Uhm its fantasy world. Maybe irs not supposed to reflect the current world which is trash btw.
@@nohints Correct.
If it were about money, they wouldn't keep making these garbage woke movies and shows that consistently bomb and cost the companies untold millions of dollars.
It's also about mental conditioning, trying to push their views on audiences as much as possible to brainwash the viewers into agreeing with them.
Get rid of those alt right Elves and show more empathy towards the poor and vulnerable orc and goblin refugees trying to make a better life for themselves in the lands of plenty, where man flesh is bountiful.
@@moretriflenowplz1837 I highly doubt orcs will be in it since that's raaaccciist.
Showrunners: "The stories are strong, my lord. Their lore goes deep."
Jeff: "Rip them all down!"
"The old world will burn in the fires of industry. Forests will fall. A new order will rise. We have only to remove those that oppose us."
@@sclarin2 I haven't seen the new show, is it really like embodying Saruman?? 😅
You know full well that we'll get gay dwarfs, bi elves, and the orcs will dramatically shade towards white.
This comment is on point.
Never could have imagined thinking or wanting a Lord of the Rings product to fail, but I really do want this to fail, and expect it will. It deserves to fail and be a massive embarassment.
Why would you want this to fail?
@@reek4062 Because the people writing it and supporting it are terrible hateful people. Some of them, like the actors, seem to just be doing their job, and I respect that, but the main writers and supporters are just terrible. Even if the show is decent I really am not interested in having anything to do with the creation of people who openly hate the genuine fans of these stories.
i HOPE the new show is the wokeist pile of dog shit that has ever been woken. i hope it is painful to watch for everyone with a functioning and even those with barely functioning brains feel and know something is very very wrong.
Its not a LOTR product, thats just a skinsuit.
Well, Witcher TV show by Netflix was also criticized strongly already before the release. Very similar reasons. Yet, they still found enough fans to have good ratings and lot of viewers. Most of the people do not care about such things as being truthful to lore. They do not care about Sapkowski's books or Tolkien's books. They want cheap easy entertainment. And if you point somewhere in comments mistakes made by creators you can be even attacked by those fans in a pretty nasty manner. Alas, those who read are nowadays a minority.
Them now: "It's gonna upset the fans, that's a good thing!"
Them later: "Why did it crash and burn? Why wasn't it a massive success?"
Also them later after it flopped: "The people who don't like this are racist, sexist, misogynistic bigots."
*see batwoman & Kevin Smith's He-Man for references.
Don't forget "Give me a bottle of champaign" to just cover over the boring parts of "why did it crash and burn?"
It's not like we shouldn't be surprised about this blatant try to grab some cash of an established franchise, while not realizing that "do your own shitty thing" is way worse than "do a great copy, or in this case good apation".
Their answer to everything they poop on which subsequently fails is "racism". They then go to poop on something else and keep pooping until people stop being "racist". Either they stop being "racist" or get so worn down from constant mediocrity that society collectively sighs, sits down, and watches their garbage.
The answer is obviously to blame the so-called-fans.
“How dare true Lord Of The Ring fans criticise a fanfic for ruining FANTASY novel and trying to make it reflect REAL WORLD issues”.
The whole point of fantasy is to get lost into a fictional world. Why an intelligent person want fantasy to be like real life? That’s like making zombie movies but trying to remove mention of death.
The Amazon WoT 'adaptation' was outright vandalism completely infused with THE MESSAGE. The LotR 'adaptation' shows every sign of going down the same road. Just because Bezo's can afford to buy expensive art doesn't mean that he truly appreciates or understands it. History will remember him unkindly.
Not as long as he gets to write it.
Whenever I read "The Message" in quote I read it in Drinkers voice. I can't help it
@@DaGARCE1 same. His honesty is really inspiring. At this point if you told me he's on drugs and drunk for every video, I'd say "well then keep them comin', it's clearly working!"
I watched 10 minutes of WoT and then HAD to turn it off.
That was just ridiculous.
What they did to Wheel of Time was criminal.
Amazon's stock is dropping and they reported a $4 Billion dollar loss. ...and that's a good thing
What Amazon did to The Wheel Of Time is simply unforgivable. They took a story that was perfectly and lovingly laid out by an amazing man who poured his life and soul into and turned into Current Year inane drivel, its one of the biggest tragedies in recent memory. If you can, I beg you my fellows, avail yourself of reading The Wheel Of Time, or even just listening to the audiobooks, you won’t regret it
Amazon did The Wheel of Time such a disservice. I was looking forward to it when I first learned there would be an adaptation, but I still set a low bar. Even then, it was so much worse than I could have predicted.
I wanted it to be good. I really did. I stayed hopeful the whole time and gave it the full series to win me... But it was awful. I will not be giving it a second chance.
i fear how amazon may corrupt the new stargate
@@doctorritos2114 NOOOOO
Don't know why you are upset, I really liked it.
Media executive: Wait.. how does decreasing our audience make us money?
Activist: It doesn't.. and that's a good thing.
“Losing a billion dollars is tight!”
Well they hate capitalism. While living in a capitalist nation. Make that make sense.
I can already hear them saying “well we don’t want those bigots to watch the show anyway”
@@snusemcgoose1001 Yep, I can hear it.
@@asarishepard8171 Marxists are bunch of hypocrites.
Been watching the behind the scenes stuff of how they made the LOTR trilogy. To keep it short and simple, I’ll just say I highly doubt the people making this show are gonna meet the bar set by Peter Jackson. Even if you didn’t like some of the decisions made by him, you cannot deny the effort.
100% they bled for that film
@@redactedc1928 and broken toes and other things :)
They are gonna be intentionally limbo-ing right under that bar,slip,and crack their skulls open on the pavement....bring popcorn! 🍿
I have nothing to do with this show whatsoever - Peter Jackson.
Loved the story Liv Tyler told about her dad waiting with her for her flight in the airport terminal, then he looks at what she's wearing and takes off his wool lined denim jacket, puts it on her and tells her no matter where she goes, always, always take a warm coat.
She was wearing it over her white gown as she was having her elf ears applied and told the story.
For context, Jackson and company were given one shot to adapt what was believed to be an unadaptable story, including a set up that explained the world, the ring, the Second Ages ending, and the events of the Hobbit BEFORE the plot started.
They had 2 years, 180m dollars, three movies, and 9 hours of runtime to do it.
So yea, they HAD TO change some things. Structure, plotting, and the order of some events. All to make a coherent trilogy of movies. But it never came from a place of arrogance or hubris. Just necessity.
Amazon have a billion dollar budget, 5 seasons, and a primed and ready fanbase already there largely because of the Jackson films. And theyre changing things and condensing material and ignoring the lore because they WANT TO. Because they want to tell THEIR STORY. And that just irks us.
It irks us. And we dont have to like it.
what i dont understand is that we all KNOW that the way they're going about it is going to make it a massive flop. i know amazon probably won't cry over the money but still. are they so detached that they dont know what the rest of us know?
@@manfrombritain6816 Yes. They are that detached. It's insane to have such a high budget and multiple seasons already greenlighted and utterly waste all of it because someone wanted to tell their own fantasy story that for some reason was barely attached to the Tolkiens works. It's Witchers netflix 2.0 but with far bigger scope and budget attached to it.
except for the whole "i am no man" in part 3, i agree
It id insane how closely their approach to the entire butchering of the source material, and defenses of that destruction, mirrors that of Netflix's Witcher.
Kinda frustrating, it literally looks the same. Same defenses, same attacks, same illogical changes, same focus on a fanfiction stuff rather than the story..
All they need now is yo also change how the magic works and we have a bingo.
@@user-ju6zx3rm8d Tolkien wrote a strong woman character in Eowyn. Not being a man was the point of the action there. Maybe not Tolkiens words but probly not really diverting the intent. If u want to see a woke angle it's there for u I guess or maybe just emphasis on the arrogance of evil disregarding where strength can lie?
A high fantasy series that “represents what the world actually looks like”. Ah, alright then. I guess everyone missed the briefing then.
By that metric they should also have Wi-Fi and smartphones.
Yup, that's like taking the Harad area south of Middle Earth and populating it with pale, redheaded irishmen for 'reasons'. Just imagine it. utterly pale irishmen with the reddest of hair ever seen just running around in a freaking desert... XD
Yes, but they forgot Europe was, and still is White culture.
Every little detail, every little element, every little molecule even in the LotR trilogy was made with love, passion and unbridled creativity inspired by the works of J.R.R. Tolkien.
Everything Amazon does is out of selfishness an spite. In the realm of literature and fiction, Tolkien is a god and those who were touched by his spirit are enlightened. The creators behind _The Rangs of Powar_ are intellectual goblins trying to axe this marvelous oaken tree to create a campfire.
And then they have the nerve to say that the fans are the ones who are in the wrong by not rolling over and accepting it like the good little fans they want us to be.
That's the difference between Jackson and Amazon: Jackson approached Tolkien with enormous respect; the army of _yrch_ at Amazon show no respect to Tolkien at all.
We cannot get out,
The shadows move in the dark,
We cannot get out,
They are coming
…
Drums, drums
…
LOTR:Rings of power directors show up
There was a tidbit in the Silmarillion that only Eru could truly create something, and that those trying to create things without his aid (read: Morgoth and Sauron) would only be able to craft pale imitations, taking from what is already there and twisting it into some new, evil form.
It's a damn shame that the writers at Amazon are trying to pull exactly that here.
@@ivanbraginsky8224 That is a very good observation and yes, it is ironic that they became the very thing Tolkien despised.
J. J. Abrams needs some sort of special award for destroying the three greatest franchises in cinematic and television history: Star Trek, Star Wars, and now Lord of the Rings. That's one hell of a legacy.
Well said brother!
There are two people you don't mess with:
1- The Zohan
2- Tolkien fans
One click to ratio them all,
One search to find them,
One click to freak them out,
And in the darkness bind them.
its zohans cousins who are responsible far this garbage your certainly not men of the west
Releasing it on the anniversary of Tolkien's death is the most disrespectful thing they could have done. Almost signifying their intention to send the message that the old LOTR is dead, and the new woke dumpster fire is here to stay.
It’s like he would be dying a second time.
I know I can use the internet, but.... they really did that? :(((
"The fanbase are fans. They like the source material because it's the source material they like. If you do something else, you risk alienating the fans on a monumental level. It's no longer Batman if he's a news reporter in a yellow trenchcoat with a pet bat."
- _Neil Gaiman_
Neil Gaiman's the best lol
Yet another reason as to why he's one of my favorite writers!
Too bad Neil Gaiman couldn't uphold to his own words, as evidence by the newly announced Sandman show and his defence of the show's race swapping of iconic characters like Death.
Ngl, that concept sounds like a Batman anime! 🤣 Except then Batman would be a high school girl.
@@grimhat2 ‘race swapping’ one of the Endless isn’t a change that matters on any level, as long as it doesn’t impact the story. Quite honestly Neil Gaiman knows what he’s doing
"A day may come when the courage of men fails, when we forsake our friends and break all bonds of fellowship," and that's a good thing! - Sauron
Amazon never wanted to adapt LOTR, they just wanted a fantasy show of their own, to ride the "game of thrones" bandwagon (which is already dead and gone by now). So they slapped the "Lord of the Rings" brand on it because they wanted a pre-made fanbase of millions of people to draw money from, which is easier than making something new that doesn't have fans yet. They really think that just because something has "Lord of the Rings" on it, the fanbase will consume it without question, and thats not how it works. It didn't work with Disney and Star Wars, it didn't work with Star Trek, and it didn't work now.
And the Tolkien fanbase KNOWS IT. We see throught their deception and know that they don't respect us OR the source material, they only respect money. Which is ironic, for because of that they are LOSING money big time, and will lose a lot more.
👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼
Hear, hear!
Kind of a bad time to get on the game of thrones bandwagon when the show ended in a whimper.
Agreed the BBC destroyed Doctor Her when it became a Woke gender swap of the original. You would thing that University students would take less than five years to learn something but apparently not, the next Doctor Her is a gay black man?
They will get away with it. Look up Star Trek Discovery. Renewed for season 4 and has nothing to do with Star Trek anymore, but the title and some name dropping. They totally stripped themselves from 50 years of canon. It's a terribly dumbed down show with the silliest stories one can make up, annoying, unlikable and imlausible characters and there are still people watching... Actually the show is so bad, in my opinion they are just testing how far they can push audiences.
The one thing I cannot wrap my head around is that new pre/sequels lately are willingly upsetting the fanbase and calling it a good thing.
IF PEOPLE LIKED THE ORIGINAL AND YOU'RE MAKING THEM DISLIKE THE CONTINUATION, HOW IS THAT GOOD? IN WHAT UNIVERSE IS THAT THE DEFINITION OF GOOD?
Yes, Peter Jackson obviously made a mistake adhering close-enough-for-almost-everybody to Tolkien's story. Who the heck wants box office, money, awards and rewatchability anyway?
But the ColOnIIzERs defeated my great great great grandparents.....
IMHO the greatest trilogy of all time
So much respect to the author and cannon vs this
travesty that purposely craps on Tolkien
And the eternal love & admiration of the fans😍😘
@@frankgesuele6298 Peter Jackson is like Caesar: knows what the people want, gives it to them, and they love him for it...
As a "normie" who's only watched the LOTR movies and played a few games, let me tell you that even us normies who are not super deep into the books and lore can tell that this is shit. If Amazon expects us to save their garbage show, they're wrong.
Thank God
I'm surprised that Galadriel isn't an Ork slaying drag queen.
@@mickk8519 Don't spoil the second episode, dude!
They're looking for an invisible audience of radical leftist normies. That's why they paid influencers, and we know how well that crap worked.
Good normie.
To the kids here too young to know a time before Jackson's incredible, impossible trilogy: you don't understand that Tolkien's world was considered unfilmable until then. His material is NOT cinema friendly in the slightest and the idea of Peter Jackson making movies based on them was met with a skepticism that was totally understandable. Everything these Amazon people are saying about it being hard to adapt is true, so much so that it probably shouldn't ever have even been attempted. Jackson's films were impossible, but he managed to pull it off because he had the skill, the passion, and a team of artists who were excited to be working on it. This Amazon thing, by comparison, is a homework assignment based on the Game of Thrones textbook. It's no different than one of the countless zombie shows made in The Walking Deads wake.
I actually liked Ralp Bakshi's 1978 rotoscope version, and i had read the books before that movie was released.
@@mikavirtanen7029 Well it isn't a great movie. It's totally find and valid to like it and be nostalgic for it, but it's not a good adaptation, and by today's standards it's awful. Back then I can imagine it was a big achievement, which I can respect, and I respect Ralph for trying so hard to make a great adaptation, it did seem like he loved the source matieral.
@@gianna526 While i concur that for each their own, "today's standards" are a total joke in 2022 if you don't count the special effects, and those have always been the one thing that has mattered to me the least. Must be the age thing but CGI bombardment and 3 second cuts don't much impress when it comes to movies.
I remember when it was announced. It did seem impossible and then pictures from the sets started leaking and...Wow! I remember when the pics of the Hobbit houses and Shire leaked. Just amazing how far they were willing to go. It was showing that aspect of it that got people excited and not just moaning. That someone was willing to go so far as to build the Shire to try to get right went a long way in getting audiences to even give it a chance. What these people are doing isn't the way to do it.
Edit: I was fortunate enough to chat in an mIRC chat room with one of the owners of some of the property being used for filming so I got to see a bit more than others did.
@@debanydoombringer1385 Same here, man. I think the first bit of news I heard that forced me to come to terms with the idea that it was really happening was the casting of Elijah Wood as Frodo, which immediately told me whoever this Peter Jackson guy is gets it.
Tolkien’s whole universe is so complex and fascinating, there is no way it is skeletal material or there aren’t enough characters. The history of Arda rivals the history of Europe, which is what Tolkien created his fantasy world for.
It rivals the lore of old religions…. Manly the Germanic Norse religions…. Tolkien did take a lot from them though.
"Evil cannot create anything new, they can only corrupt and ruin what good forces have invented or made". J.R.R Tolkien
Nose Rings of Power or Lord of the Reeeeee
THE great historian of Tolkien. Who knew his son well and I believed interview Tolkien. Knew Tolkien lore inside and out. Why was he thrown off the show? Hmmmm?
@@rbu2136 NO WAY.....REALLY? !
Actually not what Tolkien said, taken out of context. It actually says "The Shadow that bred them can only mock, it cannot make[...]". I agree with the sentiment but misquoting Tolkien is harmful to our argument.
"The Shadow that bred them can only mock, it cannot make: not real new things of its own"..."it only ruined them and twisted them" is the real quote/excerpt
What i find odd is that... it has been pretty standard lore that male and female dwarfs are undistinguished to non dwarfs.
I.e. they both have beards, dress the same and act the same.
So in the new trans era.... amazon decided to feminise the female dwarfs?
Very good point lol
Because their brave and bold black dwarf lady would look fucking moronic with a beard, and they knew it. Rather than own it, they thought they'd just try and play it safe, but oh well
Gotta please everyone but the fans!
It's sad to see people who clearly hate JRR Tolkien making a series based on his work. The plan is simple.. take things everyone loves and twist it to push a progressive agenda. Anyone who questions this will be labeled in some browbeat fashion.
And all of us who see it coming, because we've seen it happen with 34 other franchises, are dismissed out of hand...our complaints treated as bigotry and reactionary ire, and as though we can be tricked into liking this by being tricked into thinking it's never happened before. Sorry, we're not starting with a blank slate, but with all the awful foreknowledge we need of what Hollywood has become and who dominates that god-awful shithole.
We know it will be a disaster. We know why it will be a disaster; we know how it will be a disaster. All their little "Pissing off fans is a good thing!" articles won't obscure that for an instant because we've already read this article dozens of times immediately before dozens of franchises were murdered and made into skinsuits for progressive subversion.
That man is rolling in his grave.
They just want to destroy something they have no stake in and that many love
To hurt someone how they're obviously hurting is their intent. We need to hold the line against these grifters that grifted in.
TOKEN!
I'd like to add as a leftist, that I'm not digging this at all.
The more time that passes, the greater my appreciation for what Peter Jackson (and his fellow writers, producers, actors, prop personnel, etc) managed to achieve. I remember when Peter Jackson's LOTR was being filmed and discussed. I was honestly terrified. I was terribly afraid of them messing up Middle Earth, messing up my beloved characters, messing up the powerful messages from Tolkien. They released short glimpses of filming, and at least it looked beautiful. But I was still afraid of what they might do to the story and characters. It was not perfect by any stretch. But I honestly cannot fault any of their story choices. Given the enormity of the task, the complexity of the story, the power and importance of SO MANY moments that had to be dropped, I cannot fault their choices. Not perfect, hell no. But astounding. From the moment I saw the movies in the theater to this very day, the storytelling choices they made were amazing. May all the Gods bless Peter Jackson and his crew for this achievement. Mostly, may all the Gods bless them for their conviction to doing their absolute best to bring Tolkien's story to the screen.
Indeed, they made for epic cinematic experiences. Unbelievable that (no doubt due to studio intervention) he managed to mess up The Hobbit so badly
Yup, they were literally trying to avoid changing anything they saw as 'we can make it work in movie format' due to wanting to keep the loyalty to the source material as much as possible.
This will be the equivalent of starship troopers and starship troopers 3, 4, and so on. The lotr trilogy is fantastic, the hobbit trilogy is good, albeit not as good, everything else (especially this dumpster fire), will be, much like starship troopers pitiful sequels, utter trash, and will go down in history as such.
@@triumphant39 The Hobbit was a movie too long (I feel 2 movies would have kept the pace well and felt content-full enough).
@@triumphant39 those lo-budget sequels were soooooo bad! 😆😆😆
"...and thats a good thing!" is always one of the biggest red flags
Martha Stewart's catch phrase.
It's so infuriating when they take this attitude. They stand on the shoulders of legends and, instead of being grateful, they take a giant, steaming dump on their heads.
Arrogant, self-centered narcissists, all.
pigeons.
@@MephiticMiasma The trouble with that thought is, "pigeons" don't actually know any better. These people are calculating in their destruction.
Thats what Kevin smith did to he man. Decided to beat down a series he obviously didn't like and didn't try to do right by. Then threw a screaming fit on video berating he man fans who didn't like his woke steaming dump on a series they liked and just wanted to see again.
@@MephiticMiasma At least pigeons are innocent, there isn't much they can do about their behavior. These people, part of the most intelligent race, are behaving exactly like animals with less capability. Quite sad really.
Wow. Showing a compilation of articles that ends with: "And that's a good thing." says it all for me.
At least they make it easy for us ordinary viewers, so we can easily avoid the garbage they are preparing for us.
Aw, Man, it's so sad more or less the only
Sides are toxic Masculinity, Flawed Masculinity and Woke-Masculinity.
I mean, we as a Society COULD tackle the fact that yeeeeah, traditional Masculinity
was kinda not good, but instead we get Wokeness, which helps no one, duh.
I wished we could all stop yelling at each other and maybe watch and consider
channels like Salari and Pop Culture Detective.
Gaslighting: The Article Series
They're trying to get the highest amount of views with the least amount of actual work put in. This is the reason why all these articles are carbon copies of one another, and why they are essentially just ragebaiting.
It shows how unified "the message" is, and across all media.
Next time someone tells me "...and thats a good thing" when it obviously isn't I'll just stop giving them my time and money.
they have two problem:
1) they don't want to actually make a series about the source material; they want to make their own series, but have the fanbase of the source material watch it.
2) they don't have the ability to adapt the source material. they have taken on a project they don't have the talent to pull off.
together, those two problems are fatal.
Could be worse. See halo.
@@jeremyanderson3819 wasn’t as bad as this mess
@@johnmarkarth2249 No it's worse. As soon as "Masterchief" removes his helmet, i knew this shit ain't Halo.
The problem is that they want to write their own stories that fit in with their own values. However, those stories don't sell well, so they end up co-opting known brands and franchises. See Wheel of Time, see Star Trek, see Star Wars, see Disney's own stories. They're so focused on their own wokeness that they can't tell a good story with good characters, and they have to use these brands.
Thing is, they have a perfect example of the correct approach with the Peter Jackson movies. He made a particular point to respect the source material and it was massively successful. So they know what works, what is successful, but they rejected this. How stupid are these people?
Have said it before, and I'll say it again - Boycott this abomination folks. Don't even let idle curiosity bring you to press the watch button for the first episode. The only way that Amazon will get even the slightest of hints that what they're doing is unacceptable is to have them watch their viewer ratio plummet into the fire.
Make it happen.
I'll watch Critical Drinker and Robot Head having goooooooooooooooood dump on it.
@@IlyaDemidov a most excellent plan; think a vast majority of us here will be joining you!
If I was head of LOTR I would do everything in my power to respect the lore, and make the many generations fans of the books and films happy. It’s not that difficult.
It was never about the lore to these people
@@scottydu81 nope, they’re just trying to destroy everything that we love. Cultural Marxism.
@@chalkdemon8019 Out with the old, in with the new
Indeed, the problem is the Hollywood entertainment people live and work in an echo chamber where they think everyone likes "the message" because everyone they associate with does.
Me too... And i'm not a full life fan...
They destroy coherent things, they deserve war.
God what a beautiful way to end the video. Aragorns speech somehow tied perfectly into the problems that were addressed in the video. Well done Sir. Big LOTR fan here, and I have been since I first saw the Fellowship as a kid. The trilogy served for the perfect introduction into epic adventure stories. It feels so wrong to water that down with a show that’s rewriting the past events from the original movies. Nobody wants that. And never did I think when growing up that I’d be scared for the future or past of Middle Earth.
The only thing I'm looking forward to regarding this fiasco is the savage reviews it's going to inevitably get. Good laughs Nerdrotic!😂
"And that's a good thing!"
OH YEAH....gonna be a helluva lot of videos coming from this "fellowship" of like minded channels.We really SHOULD be thanking Amazon,they're about to provide us all ton of enjoyable content.....just NOT QUITE in the way that they intended ....😂
Not to mention that it's yet another opportunity for fence sitters to realise that there's a war being waged against decency and everything that is good. And the enemy are the wokeists.
Giving it views just to shit on it is counter productive
@@darnis6497 See, there's this thing called "piracy",right? ( stop me if I'm speaking too fast for you...😉 🏴☠️)
@@benjamingrant5970 "Drink Up Me Hearties, Yo Ho!"
Fans and customers are important in any business and community. You are basically giving them a reason to earn you money and support. Bullying the fans and potential customers has always been a business and marketing idea fail for decades. They do not want us? Fine. They got what they deserved. We will take our money and support elsewhere. The internet is a small place, if you think about it, and not the outside world.
Not even that hard. Torrenting exists.. wtf are they thinking.
@@AngerOfTheLand Probably think VPNs still aren't an internet requirement. This show is screwed.
this is why communism utterly hates the free market, and democracy... the people have the power, they have the voting right. communists cannot force their agendas on people in the free world... if the people don't like it, they can always ignore it, or bash it into oblivion!!!
communists, really hated people having the wealth and power to challenge their propaganda and agendas, that is why they are trying so hard right now to destroy the US economy though biden's marxist spending policies!!!
But wait, if they call me a sexist, racist, man-baby maybe it will make me want to pay for their product this time.
(Nah, it will just make me feel even more resentment and ensure that I am not interested in Amazon’s future products).
I agree, the reporter trying to tell people the appropriate way to interpret an adaption drove me nuts. It’s my time and money who are you to tell me that I have to spend it a certain way?
Don't forget about how inflation isn't real, but also it is a good thing
That "...and it's a good thing" line goes beyond just terrible writing
For anyone wanting to understand the outrage over casting, here is the very simple reason. LOTR is an iconically European story written so uniquely within that nationality and lore that it really is subject to being an artistic achievement of Caucasian heritage. Some consider it to be culturally disrespectful to vandalize iconically ethnic artistic works, hence the outrage.
I hope they're locked into making the 5 seasons. I want this crap to be the most expensive mistake Amazon makes
And the reviews trashing it will be glorious. Hey, were gonna get some entertainment somehow.
They are filming the second season already arent they?
This is going to be glorious.
@@asarishepard8171 Biden's new and illegal Ministry of Truth will hide the bad reviews.
@@Tnscla Hopefully there'll be tonnes memes about this trashfire.
I don't think they are absolutely locked into 5 seasons. There is no contract with any third party. If the reviews and viewership are bad enough they might decide to cancel everything after the 2nd season. That's what I am hoping and praying for.
The modders behind LotR: Realms in Exile (a mod for Crusader Kings 3) have managed to invent characters and lore for their mod without enraging Tolkien fans or taking a dump on Middle Earth. The ammount of respect for Tolkien and his mythos is the foundation for any good adaptation. No amount of production value helps if you can't even get that right.
It's hard to stay true to the source material when it gets in the way of political agendas.
They respected the style in which the characters in the original source material were created.
I'll never understand this thirst for sticking it to the fans. If you're adapting an existing franchise, the fans are your guaranteed audience if you get it right. If you lose them, what do you have? You may as well just start with your own IP.
Leftists are evil, soulless, and jealous terrorists. We have souls. They do not. We are sane. They are not. They know, deep down. They can't handle it, so they wish to destroy us and the world. Collectively, they are nihilism incarnate.
It's because they hate u and see themselves above the average person
They want to destroy what you love, they don't care about the things they trash.
Why do they go after successful, popular IPs, you ask? Because they know that *anything* original they could come up with would be the same, stupid, senseless, idiotic and vomit inducing drivel they wrote, only without the popular IP's wrapper........It's all a game to suck people in.......
It's about simultaneously destroying something they perceive as a "symbol of white supremacy" and "hetero-normative behavior" and pushing their ideology onto anyone and everyone as the only acceptable viewpoint. They are trying to forcibly shift societal and cultural perception to fit how they see the world.
Number one rule when adapting Tolkien: You do not know better than Tolkien.
"...and that's a good thing." That part was great! You should definitely keep that going. It's not only sickening on its face, but the way you laid them all out just shows how one-dimensional and simplistic their tactics actually are if you only know what to look for.
we need a compilation of it
I've been thinking for a while now that we need some central source of all the wokified, gender-bent, blackwashed, generally destroyed IPs/characters/etc. in recent years. There must be dozens by now. I know of quite a few myself and I barely pay attention to this crap.
The source material says "The white page can be overwritten"
So that's a good thing.
Destroying franchises and upsetting original fans is NOT a good thing ... Just ask ghostbusters 2016, terminator and Doctor Who
just to name a few of those! Using the wheel of time as a good example shows how dense the writer really is.
I loved the book series of WoT. When I heard that there was going to be a live action series, all I felt was anxiety. Anxiety that it was going to be bad, given that it was being made current time. Unfortunately, my anxiety was well founded. I saw mayhaps the first five minutes and could count the number of "creative liberties" they made to this series. Too many.
It's a good thing in their eyes, when destroying everything people love is their motive.
These fools can even adapt things like Star Wars that have 30 years of fleshed out characters that were properly written because of one Unified lore. They think they can make up anything good by themselves? Haha laughable. That’s why they target these popular franchises to spread their messages because they can’t create.
They are evil. Its simple, really.
@@ImpKnt80 I agree
One of three things will happen here, I speculate:
1) The creatives will claim "original stories" and then strip mine whatever they can get their hands on, including fan fiction/art, etc. Evidence of this happening in the industry before already exists.
OR
2) The creatives will "borrow inspiration" from 6-12 other popular/obscure fantasy franchises and just use its storylines and characters, with some common fantasy Hollywood fantasy tropes thrown in. Evidence already exists of this happening.
OR
3) A combination of 1 and 2.
As soon as they say that the cast should reflect what the real world looks like, you know it will suck completely. You know what kinds of minds you are dealing with. They can't fix it now.
I have read all the books, watched all the movies up to this point. When I heard there was a beardless dwarf I lost interest in this one. A change that tolkien WOULDA supported would be a redemption story for an orc. JRR Tolkien always regretted making them essentially irredeemable.
The Gorbag and Shadrat chat (after the Shelob but) always captivated me. It made me realise that the Orcs were actually unwilling in this, even if they were nasty and evil in general, they weren't interested in world domination.
It would have been amazing if Tolkien fleshed the Orcs out a bit more because there was alot he could have done with it.
@@Tom-sd9jb On their own Orcs were tribalistic and spent most of the time fighting each other. The real trouble starts when an actual dark power controls them in one direction. Their origins are also a bit unclear, because Tolkien couldn't exactly decide if Orcs were their own race, or started as elves heavily mutated by Morgoth. I think it's a bit of loose end, because Morgoth was not supposed to be able to create new life, as only Eru could do that. Aule did create dwarves, but Eru gave them free will, though Morgoth was way stronger than Aule, at least until he started to spread himself into Arda, dragons and whatever else.
Yessss. There was always sentences in every page insulting the orcs, but in the end you could see how much Tolkien loved them, because you do not give characters you hate those dialogs. I always felt like Tolkien would have wanted a redemption arc for them.
@@masterexploder9668 Could just say that not even the elves really know. Not like they were observing what happened in Utumno.
Uh-huh. So what do you think Numenor should look like then?
I just saw The Northman.
Strangely enough, there was no forced "diversity", no _current year_ agenda.
Amazingly, the movie was awesome and felt respectful of the source.
It’s releasing in my country next week, thank god its doesnt have color blind cast “vikings” and im saying this a poc. Excited to see it now
Such a good movie, incredibly violent, but very good. It felt so refreshing to watch it
@@Sarah_2094 what type of poc, say what you are, poc doesn't really narrow it down.
Saw it this past week - first showing of the day, and quite a few people in the theater. It felt so good to see a film that was true to itself and took pains to be accurate. Brilliant film! We need to find and support these authentic works whenever we can.
Hmmmmmm.........now I need to check this movie out. I've heard too many positive things about it........
I do consider myself a Tolkien purist, and I wasn't happy with PJ's LOTR not simply because there were changes, but because of their manner. There were changes that I approved of because they were simply necessary to shorten the material, such as dropping Tom Bombadil or replacing Erkenbrand with Éomer, or condensing the timeline. My issue was with the changes that went against the spirit of the work, such as Aragorn breaking the codes of honour multiple times, or Sam's violence against Gollum, or profound changes to the characters, such as Faramir or Denethor.
However, compared to what Amazon is doing, PJ's changes are like a skin rash against terminal cancer. Second Age events have two focal points - the events in Númenor, leading to its fall, and the forging of the Rings, the subsequent war and Sauron's ultimate fall in the war of the Last Alliance. Galadriel on a revenge quest adds nothing to these events (and actually detracts from what needs to be focused on), and Hobbits have no place there, just like a nobody healer and her even more nobody son, along with a random Sylvan Elf, because they play ZERO role in these events. Any original characters need to be connected to the major events in a meaningful way, such as Celebrimbor's fellow smiths, or Elendili and King's Men both in Númenor and in Middle-Earth and their allies, and they need to play a role in those events, not just be affected by them. Everything I have seen so far is just terrible writing, by people who apparently don't understand how things work if you want to create a successful story.
Great comment. I definitely agree!
the argument that they need to drop some things because of time constraints (which i agree with is necessary if its a movie, perhaps not necessarily if its a series) gets a bit hollowed out when they also add quite a few things that arent in the books. like the fairly long scene with the orcs on wolves attacking rohan civilians for example, that was in my view completely unnecessary and added nothing to the story.
i will say this, there is one "diversity" element actually in the books that could have been kept in the movies to satisfy the diversity enthusiasts, and it is The Drúedain, also known as Woses, Wild Men of the Woods or Púkel-men.
The bits with Faramir and Denethor probably frustrate me the most of the ones listed, because it profoundly changed their characters in ways I don't know was really necessary, though I do think it would have been a good story regardless if it was part of the book
Hello Irena, could you explain me please what you mean by Aragorn breaking rules of honor?
@@fourshore502 Couldn't agree more on the unnecessary additions, those were terribly frustrating (and mostly also quite stupid). Adding those while dropping such "minor" details like the reckoning with Saruman in the theatre edition...
A good point on the diversity, but since it was quite a minor plot element, it's one of those cuts I am comfortable with ;-) Gimli proposing, and Aragorn considering, breaking his word to the Dead to release them after they went all gooseberry jam on Minas Tirith troubles me way more ;-)
I love how they're taking amazing stories written by genius writers and just using the titles as a means to push their own filth onto the screen. Because they knew, that if they tried to write a series that stood alone, in the fantasy genre, it would not gain any traction. They gave us hope with WoT, but we learned...and saw the destruction and horrid bile that is their agenda.
What I enjoyed most about LOTR other than the story were the character interactions and how they truly cared and protected one another. As a viewer you grew to like and and admire their fortitude. It was truly a work of art that restored my hope in film, which unfortunately didn't last.
No, there was not enough diversity, inclusion or equity.
That's why I burnt all my lord of the rings signed first edition novels
I'm becoming convinced that all these attacks on our mythos are meant to castrate society, and belittle fans. These people are taking ips and making vanity pics with them, without regard for the reviews of the general population, presenting them as genuine attempts at entertainment.
And I have no doubt they are genuinely entertained by our reactions to their abominations.
Stay awesome brother
They don't want us to enjoy even our fantasy worlds. We must suffer everywhere like their schizophrenic minds.
Its commie cultural war. Destroy established norms and force their garbage and try to make social pariahs out of anyone who oposes them. Even if they arent being paid, their winnies usefull idiots
It's like animal husbandry. They control our culture, they controle us...
Yes. It's called cultural Marxism
These people can only hate, they hate that others love something so much and in their miserable existence make it their lifes goal to destroy it.
I love when studios leave original audiences behind to make a movie woke. Because the audience they are pandering to doesn't care, therefore nobody ends up caring. Exactly why most recent SW movies failed
The only time when a studio cares about a fan, is when said fan is a revenue stream. They have ZERO loyalty to, and ZERO commitment to, fans of a franchise. It has always been a comfortable setup where the creator/customer relationship means they create and you are expected to pay for whatever they create. With their current attitude, I would say that people are waking up to the fact that you are no longer limited to what a handful of studios decides you get to watch. :/
I love it when you dig a hole, bury the word, and continally use it for attention. It is a failure of the english language.
@@JoseManley Huh?
"Don't judge an adaptation by its promotional material!" That's literally the point of promotional material...
Imagine having a billion dollars to produce something based on Tolkien's 2nd Age. My main goal would have been to stay true to the source material. It's sad, they could have done something truly amazing.
to be fair, even when you stay true to the source material, adapting the silmarillion into a film/series is no easy task and will probably disappoint a lot of fans
@@Schnitzelwirt4life it would be cool if they employed hard core LOTR fans with youtube channels dedicted to LOTR to proof their script and present changes to get it correct.
The producers of this series' main goal will be to use the name of Tolkien to peddle modern day sentiments held by a minority of very vocal idiots.
Silmarillion as a book sucks tbh. Like the hobbit is a kids adventure and rocks. Lotr is like a King Arthur style Adventure mega novel. Silmarillion is idk what ? A series of Beowulf style sagas ? I’ve read it and none of it sticks with me
The 2nd age is so dope. How could they fuck this up
Once again, Nerdrotic is SPOT ON...hitting the nail on the head! STAY IN THE SPIRIT OF TOLKIN, make MINOR CHANGES, introduce IN CONTEXT characters who SUPPORT TOLKIN's characters! DO NOT USE TOLKIN TO PUSH MORONIC SOCIAL AGENDAS!
"Purists" aren't a group within the Tolkien fandom. It *is* the Tolkien fandom. Tolkien wrote a detailed world of characters and history that these hacks have no right to trash.
amen
"purists aren't a group within the Tolkien fandom" yes it is, it's the guys who hate the Lotr movie trilogy. Whereas most fans love them.
So what do you think Numenor should look like?
False. I am a Tolkien reader since 40 years but I don't consider myself a blind zealot who would burn something based on speculations and else. A fictional universe is there to evolve. It was there to support works like the roleplay MERP or the game Lotro online. Two pieces with new characters (and a new balrog) that were supported and praised by members of the so called fans. Fans : the words itself means a lot. Blind people which could be compared to ISIS members. Open up your mind people.
It's like arguing that quantum physicists are bad cuz they know their material well - yet dun agree with your bullshit idea of quarks and howi t affects Patriarchy in society, etc.
I've never wanted a show to fail as much as I want "Rings of Prime" to fail; I find all of what has been revealed about it to be a damn shame.
Why dont they make a series about the book of Revelation or Genesis and load it up with identity politics and diversity tropes?
As a Christian, please nooo!
Every time one these articles drops, you can tell that behind the scenes, the "reporters" working on the write up about the show are just being instructed to write that all the obvious flaws and faux pas reported to exist about the show are good things.
It's just mindless gruel cope slop for the dead inside woke viewers who just can't consume a good story without needing to somehow see themselves in it.
What's next, Watership Down, but all the rabbits are trans, with pink fur?
@DEZZNUTZ 1001 They couldn't be more blatant, if after the interview, they threw in a link to Amazon Prime on a promotion afterwards. It's like since GB: ATC (2016), they really believe that with enough media B.S, they can change people to watch something they throughly dislike.
DON'T GIVE THEM IDEAS.
Plague dogs
No, pleaseeee dont....dont change my rabbits... I must say, that last (Netflix?) version was bad enough ( in comparation with previous film and show (great 2d animation...show where every rabbit was visually different with huge character differences))
It's even worse then you describe coz that suggests there are any woke viewers.... except maybe from the few crazy Reylo shippers, that you can count on 1 hand, there aren't any. I guess 'that's a good thing' is pointing to how these activists have managed to subvert yet another franchise to their woke politics.... or to dust coz I don't think many LOTR fans will even want to watch it. It's like the new Indiana Jones... I'm a huge fan of the explorer adventurer archeologist genre.... but there is no way in hell I'm gonna watch Indiana Jones 5 coz I already know it's gonna be a 3 times shitshow all over.
I met someone doing editing of these films and they told me that the management overseeing the project is the most vile people imaginable ...
So curious to know the tea... 🍵
Been watching "old" movies and TV the last year or so (stuff from the 80s,90s mostly) and DAMN I miss those days. Even the early 2000s stuff is lightyears better than current work, the difference in quality is staggering. 80s stuff I took for granted as a kid has so many layers I never understood back then. Rewatching the Jackson trilogy for the first time in ages made me appreciate his work all over again, it was beautiful. This show will be the "last gasp" of the religion of Woke, the winds are changing and people have finally reached the breaking point.
Yeah for sure. I realized my old vhs and dvd collection will never get dusty bc I'd rather watch them than the shit that's out now. Recently saw "a few good men" why can't we get more of that??
Ok boomer
@@preciousypenguino same. I've been going through shows like Columbo, Murder She Wrote, and thr Carol Burnette Show.
Whenever a piece of artistic work has to come out and 'preemptively' address anything, especially so-called 'purists', you know it's going to be dreadful.
Watching fans protect Tolkien's work warms my cold dead heart like the undead oathbreakers seeing Andúril reforged
knowing it is their moment to enter the fray of battle one last time
Never has the phrase “Standing on the shoulders on giants” been more appropriate.
These people are disgraceful vultures who hold nothing but contempt for Tolkien and those of us who love his works. Tolkien’s work changed my life as a young man and have had a profound impact on me. I still remember seeing FotR in theaters when I was 5. My mom read The Hobbit to my brother and I when we were little, before the LotR movies came out, and I fell in love with it. I read all of Tolkien’s works by the age of 12 and continue to read them to this day. They are absolutely timeless and easily the most profound works I’ve ever come across in the fantasy genre.
What they’re doing is sickening, I’ve honestly never been more upset about an IP being subverted. When they came for Star Wars, WoT, and the others, that was one thing. But now they’re coming for a foundational piece of Western literature and actively trying to corrupt it.
I’ve never been a “let’s boycott this” kinda guy. But at this point, please, I’m begging everyone out there who loves Tolkien, DO NOT WATCH THIS. Even for a “let’s see how bad it is” kinda thing. Don’t give it attention and let it fucking die in flames like it should.
Ill watch it. But not on amazon. They dont deserve any attention.
You've never been a “let’s boycott this” kind of guy? Then you've been the "kinda guy" to stand back and watch when others have been outraged when the stuff they love was being trashed and called for a boycott. Which makes calling out for others to help you now, a hypocrite.
You have glibly said, "When they came for Star Wars, WoT, and the others, that was one thing" i.e. it didn't matter much as far as you were concerned. Well allow me to educate you of the fact that Star Wars influenced far more people than Tolkien ever did and was therefore every bit as much of a cultural treasure; indeed, it was far more important. Star Wars transcended the movie industry and has literally reshaped the world we live in. For a start, on the most basic and obvious level (although it's likely that only film academics generally know it) Star Wars single-handedly revitalised the movie industry by making cinema-going popular again. If you examine the cinema-going trend historically it had been a failing pastime year on year until the release of Star Wars in 1977. From then on its popularity rocketed and the particular success of George Lucas (intertwined with that of Steven Spielberg) infiltrated the entire industry from actual film making, through sound via Skywalker Sound Systems, and visual effects via Industrial Light and Magic (both owned by Lucas), and merchandising. This is just mentioning the direct impact of the work of Lucas which was only possible because of the success of Star Wars.
The cultural impact of this one film was off the charts. The 'blockbuster' film, and hugely successful film 'franchises' emerged out of the desire for bigger and more spectacular special effect movies; and the special effects technologies that were invented literally for the Star Wars franchise, specifically the ultra high speed cameras used for making explosions look massive, were soon exploited in the field of science enabling huge advances in the study of things that happen faster than the human eye can see; and being able to see super-fast things happening as slowly as desired has helped scientists understand new things in all manner of fields such as engineering and ballistics. The super computers that were invented to handle the compositing of special effects shots have advanced super computers for use in things like modelling artificial environments for studies in practically every field of science.
Yet even on the simple level of children growing up, more of them had posters of their favourite Star Wars characters on their bedroom walls (not to mention every other conceivable aspect of merchandising) than were ever influenced by Tolkien. Even the peter jackson trilogy owes its existence to the success of Star Wars and Industrial Light and Magic. Weta got all their technology and expertise from Lucas' I.L.M. Then think of all the costume and makeup technologies that went into the LotR films that were developed on the back of the ground-breaking work done in these fields in the original Star Wars trilogy.
I won't be giving any attention to this Amazon garbage, don't worry about that; but let's not claim that we shouldn't watch now that it's Tolkien's work that is being exploited. This evil zeitgeist of cultural vandalism in the name of feminism and identity politics was always wrong and had everyone kicked up a stink when it was 'only' Star Wars, Star Trek, Dr Who, etc. then it might not be happening to Tolkien now at all.
@@KeldorDAntrell Unfortunately, that's how lots of people learn about the systematic dismantling of good stories. Not necessarily because they're hypocrites, but because they bought the lie that this bullshit article peddles. When it finally landed on their doorstep, they realized we weren't crazy, after all.
@@KeldorDAntrell Poor star wars fan obsessed by a comment who was made concerning about destructuration of litterature masterpiece.
Your sw stew had nothing on paper except a void of scenario, nothing to treasure and cheer with on scholarship programm , no moral scale to learn at anybody.
Star Wars is a poor universe, a poor movie who gets older really bad. A poor story and poor on practically everything.
Except, yes, it was a new concept on cinema industry.
Second of all, Jackson maybe followed Lucas path except with way more talent and absolute perfectionnism. Not to mention story of LOTR came on 40's, way more before SW universe. So about what source material are you talking?
The build-up of LOTR took 8 years, the pre-production one entire year, 16 at 18 other months just for shooting and another year for editing and post-production.
Every bit of set was imagined, drawed, created, made and build by Metaworkshop mesmerizing dedicated crew. Every weapon, every coat, every button, every armor, every plate and chair, every make-up, were entirely created and made by people of talent beyond recognization.
It's a jewell of cinematographic industry wich every of 3 movies stomped any SW movie on everything.
Story, filmmaking, editing, MUSIC, feelings, acting, speeches, writting, photography, epicness, practical effects, VFX effects, sets, build-up of a universe and retranscription t the screen, make-up, impact on soul and memories, money gross, awards..17 Oscars.
There is in fact nothing to compare with.
It's not because limited as hell people like you were much more to like a thing that it's making this thing better.
In fact, yes factually, there is nothing to do between LOTR cosmos and SW world.
It's not the same league. At all.
LOTR will always clamp Star Wars in everything.
Deal with it.
They are the pigeons shitting on the shoulders of the Colossus
Honestly this channel is truly a blessing.
In this day and age 22yr olds are writing editors of dictionaries and requesting definitions of words be changed to reflect modern wokeness. Websters changed the definition of Racism because a young woman complained people were using its existing definition of the word to prove they weren't racists.
The editors granted her request. Its disturbing these journalists are using updated definitions in their arguments.
What’s disturbing is that people are so fucking weak minded that they’ll bend over backwards for the fucking cowards and thieves.
That's newspeak for you.
FINALLY more and more people are opening their eyes to what I noticed many years ago: the panderisation of zoomers (people born 1991-2001) There has never been a generation so pandered to and given more special treatment than zoomers. These are the same people
who spread covid, destroyed the education system, defaced landmarks and deplatformed innocent people.
Despite this, they keep being HANDED everything.
Name me one, ONE, franchise that hasnt been handed to them, that doesnt have a cast comprising exclusively of people born in that year group.
Oh right, there is one…the Mario film announced that it was only going to have ONE zoomer in the cast…and how did Zoomers react to this? By throwing a MASSIVE COLLECTIVE hissy fit! Indeed, they are SO USED to special treatment, that they just couldn’t fathom not being given it.
I fucking hate it when suits smell money in something I love. They NEVER make it for me or anyone who loves the property. They are making it for the lowest common denominator which will inevitably piss off the real fans for no long term gain as the lowest common denominator wont care about their watered-down Hershy-squirt of a project anyway. They can make a movie for me, or they can make one for a Karen. It takes phenomenal skills to pull off a project that appeals to both. Talent most people who work for large corporations lack. Look Amazon's game studio. Did they make games for gamers? No, they made games for shareholders. It was all about the greed with little though to actual game mechanics or story.
The issue is they’re so fucking dumb that they don’t realize that just sticking to the original will make more money!
Out of all the fandoms to piss off, why go after the LoTR fans? Other fandoms are far more forgiving than them, and Amazon tries this? They have no idea what pile they're stepping into.
If the Tolkien ABSOLUTISTS are cast as trolls or vandals, then media probably won't cover them or even cancel them. At least Twitter under Elon would probably allow the Tolkien fans to convince the public that the Lord of the Rings by Amazon contradicts the canon story. Generally speaking, the common people that will watch LotR-Amazon probably don't even know most of the opinions of Tolkien fans. And if the Tolkien fans tell the common people about the problems in a bombastic way, or if the media companies successfully label the Tolkien fans as a small group of unpleasant basement-dwelling nerds, then the general public will ignore the Tolkien fans.
@@animejanai4657 I would agree for the most part, except it's true fans that keep a franchise going. How many normies would be ecstatic about seeing the uncut trilogy? Multiple times? That's what Amazon doesn't understand, and only now is Disney starting to figure out.
War is coming let’s make this a epic failure
It's supposed to reflect the Old English Myths, NOT modern day 🤦♀️🤦♂️🤦♀️🤦♂️🤦♀️
I am just struggling to understand why they believed a Tolkien fan would be interested to watch characters not created by Tolkien in an adaptation of Tolkien's work?
They are creating entire new characters and stories shared between them, while also radically changing original characters. The arrogance of these people is hard to grasp.
As I seat here, in silence, amidst the ashes of everything I held dear I smile. My eyes are wide open. I'm free.
@@vespenegas261 free to be miserable
@@M4dM4n96 When this whole thing collapses on it self it will signify the end of the era of shit retаrded writing. I'm all antsipation.
Right?
It's just that simple.
@@queenberuthiel5469 The only things this guys possibly understand are money and fear. So let them smell the fire. It didn't have to be this way, but it is. "Let it be fear"
Gary your analysis is great as always. I'm 100% with you. The reason they have to create new characters is because none of the established characters have the compromised morals that Amazon needs to push the woke agenda.
Holy crap. You just kept saying "that's a good thing" with article after article. I didn't realize that was such a common messaging technique that they've been using like the "tHrEaTs To OuR dEmOcRaCy." Thanks for the laugh, nerdrodic!
Yep, it’s projecting, like they’ll keep denying things when they get called out on it. Eventually, they’ll come clean, and be like: “So what that we did that”, then they’ll go on about how you deserved to have it happen.
"IT'S A TRIUMPH!"
Inflation and why it's a good thing still has to be one of my favorites. It's one thing to do it with fictional stuff. It's a whole new level to try to use it for the real world.
@@debanydoombringer1385 maybe they'd believe an article called, "why hanging from a noose is a good thing"
Tauriel in the Hobbit would have been absolutely fine without the silly "love triangle" I could tolerate it slightly but it would have been better if she was a soldier simply unable to follow the Kings isolationist orders.
As a fan of Robert Jordan’s Wheel of Time books, I am sad at what has been done to a great series of books, but also, kinda happy that it happened so that the Tolkien fans had the opportunity to see exactly the kind of trash Amazon was going make out of Lord of the Rings. Here’s hoping Amazon cuts their losses and just cancels the whole thing.... and the WoT(fan fiction) tv show too.
I couldn't watch WoT. I knew they were going to screw it up. I was excited at first until I started reading, then I noped right out.
Never read the books, really liked the series, can't wait for new season... Whenever an IP is translated to series or film just don't expect it to be the same, expect it to be a "Wheel of Time"-inspired story... Nerds are so extremely whiny, whether it is Star Wars, Star Trek, LotR or whatever IP fan-base... You take it far to seriously, just wait and see, if it is bad it is bad, if it is good it is good. And it can be good while deviating massively from the established lore and it can be bad while strictly adhering to the lore.
They won't, it's not about the money.
Haven’t read the books but the show felt very generic. Lost interest after four or five episodes.
@@GeraltofRivia22 obviously it’s not about the money... they spent a ridiculously large amount of money on the show, but the effects, sets, even costumes look so cheap that if I was in the accounting department of Amazon, I would be pushing to investigate for embezzlement.
Amazon is one of the few companies that could scrap this disaster and start over from scratch. If they don't their investment in LOTR will be near worthless.
@Anjelica Snorcket🎭 Seriously? Yikes.
Seems Amazon is going to have to learn the hard way those "Toxic fans" they love to whine about are the ones who spend money on your franchises. Who do you think bought all that Lord of the Rings merch over the years keeping the cash fat and happy?
It's amazing that the concept of 'pandering to the fans' has been lost. Aka. make what people want, not what YOU want people to buy.
What's the point of having source material if they are gonna ignore it
"judging a book by it's cover"
no, it's judging a show we'll have to pay for based on advertising material designed specifically to entice us to buy it.
No one should have to pay for product to know if product is bad.
You don't have to step in a cow turd to know you don't want to step in a cow turd.
I know. It's stupid. As if it's similar with picking up a book at a library. It is buying that darn book and finding it awful and wishing you didn't buy and read it.
Not to worry. We have trusted critics like Nerdrotic & Critical Drinker to watch the first episodes for us before we shell out a dime. Thanks, guys. I feel your pain.
and anyhow, you should judge books by their cover. That doesn't mean you come to some final conclusion over some superficial detail. But if all you have is a cover, that's all you have to work with till the book is printed. If someone wants us to have different feelings about this project, they should provide the details that suggest a different judgement is more appropriate than the one we are making based on what they have so far provided.
You stepped in a cow turd and why that's a good thing!
You paid for a bad product and why that's a good thing!
The newest head lines fresh off the press.
"Do not judge a book by it's cover."
No. That's not the problem. The problem is how they marketed it. They're supposed to convince me to watch the show or film. They're are not entitled to my money or time.
If I see a trailer of an existing franchise and in this case tramples over that franchise in a contemptible and malignant way, fueled with a repugnant ideology. I'm out. You lost me at the starting line.
Right. Judging a TV series in the same way one judges a book by its cover would mean that we judge the TV series by its title card.
"Wait, you mean you won't just mindlessly buy or watch something because it has 'Lord of the Rings' on it like we do with anything 'LGBTQRSTUVWXYZ?'"
How dare you use a trailer to judge a product, when that's literally the point of a trailer.
@@oblivionsa7973 I've started calling them the Algebra people since they started adding numbers to it. Just seems easier than trying to remember the quadratic equation they have going on now.
"Dont judge a book by its cover" is the single most mindlessly moronic attitude masquerading as wisdom. Literally, the books cover is its most important marleting assset. It gives a customer an immediate sense of genre, the story, the tone, the taget market, and the style of the book. It literally exists to convince you to read the book.
And if your covers shit, and misrepresents the story or doesnt appeal to your customers, its your fault. Not theirs.
I'm a writer. These are facts. Trailers are the covers to the show's book. They done fucked up their cover.
I don't get this from a business perspective, most of these franchises are established franchises, that means that there is not a whole lot of room for growth. It does mean there is a large group of people ready and waiting to buy your product. Pissing the fans off, is not a good business decision. And I understand there is a lot of ideological hoe ha going on as well, but big business execs don't care. They expect a line graph, with profit margins, and that line better be going up. From a logical perspective this does not make sense and if I were a shareholder I would be furious that this even has such a big chance at failure.
Someone is mighty interested in pushing "the message"as Critical Drinker would say. That someone has a ton of money.
This comment is spot on.
I really don't get how big corporations (who do have a lot of target marketing staff) could not see that this is going to be a complete failure from a financial standpoint.
After all profits are really the single thing these companies care about. And pushing some agenda while pissing off most of your fanbase won't create those profits, since you loose a massive tolkien fanbase than you cannot easily substitute by a few leftist people. (since these people usually aren't really interested in medival looking stuff in the first place). So this is not only ruining a masterpiece of fiction but also a complete missinvestment.
Business? See below. Even with a plethora of Leftist cultural saboteurs, most of these problems would not appear were it not for the the fact that a few economic giants control the media. As it is now, they can absorb the financial losses associated with "woke culture" without much worry because they have no real competition and their buddies in finance will simply create more money for them out of thin air; that's how modern finance and government granted money monopoly works. More important to them is "The Message", which is designed to destroy those pesky White people in the USA and elsewhere who are the bulwark against their globalist plans.
You missunderstand it. They do not buy a franchise. They buy the customers of that product by buying the ip. By doing that (atleast) in theory you can make sure your project will not fail, will be hyped and you can shove down their throat any agenda that you have. In paper. In reality ppl realise some way or form this and simply stop giving a f@ck. (What a strange language, giving a f@ck…)
Same could be said for all the other franchises that where ruined. Apparently the big business exces did care enough. Star Wars, Star Trek, WoT, Doctor Who, Batwoman and the list goes on and on. There where big business execs on the top there as well? And it seems they did not expect a line graph, with profit margins.
Nerdrotic, your smooth dude. Your on pace, and I like your cool and hilarious " That's a good thing ".
Keep 'em great guy!
I like how this writer felt confident enough in their opinion write this piece with "and that's a good thing in it," and then still hedged the crap out of their position throughout the article... lots of conviction in this one I see.
For me, it's more the blatant lack of self-awareness of contradicting oneself in the article. Don't these article writers double-check their own articles to see if it makes sense (or at least have someone give them a second opinion on it)?
As well as the writer at least acknowledges TWICE in the article that it COULD be a failure. Which not only means the writer is confused, but also actually strengthens the case for source material in favor of the PURISTS.
Thanks Looper. You should have that writer write some more articles on LOTR. We could sure use the help. :/
Yeah its spineless. They are selling the headline, and trying to win the argument with an article that doesn't support it. "Well if you actually read the article..."
And yet "fans" on the LOTR facebook pages still defend this stuff! "have you seen it yet?" they cry! "Sick of all the negative neckbeards who know everything" etc. Wait for their voices to fall silent when this shitshow hits the fan.
"lifelong fans" with weeks-old accounts? I've seen it happen on Gerry Anderson, too. They're part of the marketing budget, at this point.
I very much suspect these are not fans; these are just mindless consumers of products who pretend to be fans in love with the lore. They are very much akin to the worshippers of the Star Wars sequel trilogy. They are not looking forward to examine the degree to which the series relates to the source material. They are looking forward to CGI and "the message". They could not discern a good plot if their lives depended on it.
I think the biggest thing that goes wrong in their story will be the time scale. They run a whole second age in one or two human lifespans. IE it will be nothing like second age. It's just Tolkien in name, nothing else. If they do that nothing in the series can possibly follow the lore. Nothing. Not one thing.
The unsolved mysteries part was golden!
If they have to constantly tell you "it's a good thing", then it really, really isn't good. At all.
I'm starting to wonder - is it the same person writing the same article (slightly adapted for every outlet), or just people copying each other's articles? I mean, even the headings are more or less the same? :/
"I got bitten by a shark, and that's a good thing!"
"I got robbed and my house burned down, and that's a good thing!"
Blah blah blah these whiny writers and their snarky hottakes...🙄
Speaking of being robbed, Seth Rogen would still be laughing when he is robbed and stripped naked on a curb beside a restaurant. He supports people having their stuff stolen.
"This is going to upset the fans" should be when a studio pumps the brakes and reevaluates their decisions. With woke hollywood, it's a point of pride instead.
Mmmm...don't really agree that's what they should do. If all they are thinking is "what will the fans like?" then they can't have considered the source material deeply enough to successfully convey it. Instead of being in-your-face activist, it will end up stilted, commercial, and shallow. Both are equally unwatchable, one for being offensive and possibly boring and the other for *definitely* being boring. The first thing they need to do is understand the story. Not just *what* appeals to people (whether fans or people introduced to it by their movie/show), but *why* it might appeal to them.
@@sarahgould5435 while I agree that no one should look at production as a hollow question of "what does X want?" It's mostly about what will work. What resonates. If you target an audience, you make what they want. Then you add what that audience "likes." You tone it *reasonably* with your *target audience's* views. Meaning don't build a movie around a message aimed at correcting your target audience's views. Instead it should be built on the thing they love, with love for it, and for the sake of loving it.
Not shame fans, not change fans, not update materials to fit different morals/views, not to back a stance, not to give jobs to people based on intrinsic characteristics, not to make it your own, etc.
"Our target audience is going to hate this product" its what It actually says
"... hitching your agenda wagon to the work of your betters."
This is solid gold right here in so many ways on so many levels.
agreed and that is the real reason these crappy writers attach their stuff under famous names because their stuff would never get people to buy it without tricking them by using a big name
Ah yes, Looper, planting the seeds so that the disaster can be blamed on having to create new characters (alone) that will have caused the Epic Failure it is going to be. They are planting these nuggets to divert attention away from destroying the Lore in favor of The Message - and that 'Message' is going to again prove financially catastrophic. And they only have themselves and their Message to blame. Long may the Rings of Power burn and melt into the Void.
The Message is the highest god for these people. Other things can only be good in how they are able to be used for The Message. Thats why people that arent pleased when changes are made to better support The Message are clearly Sinners and bigots.
Clearly they believe that their “reactionary” tactics in the past were the problem. By not passing off the fans *before* the show/movie aired they gave us time to organize and find the weak points in their arguments. They have decided that the best defense is an early offense
@@ravengrey6874 Well, it hasn't stopped them from doing what they always do - attack any critics prematurely, because let's face it, they can't help themselves. Although I have to say, I DO find it strange that the response to LOTR criticism has been so "muted" - it almost feels like the studios told the digital media outlets to stop their nonsense or lose their media access, or something. :/
"For a 21st century audience."
You know why Tolkien's original work, and Peter Jackson's adaptation, will be the cash-cows that never run dry?
Because they weren't written for a 21st century audience. They were written for a timeless audience.
Catering to the fad of the day.... will feed you for that day only.
I hope for your sake you have carefully measured out the actual volume of the demographic you so seek to butter your bread, and found it to be sufficient to mitigate your astronomical financial overheads.
That "fad of the day" will not even feed them today because noone wants to see it. In this case I doubt that even absolute normies and cons00mers will flock in enough numbers to it to justify all the money and time spent on creating this show.
It's the age of built-in obsolescence. In this case, it's junk before it even hits the shelves.
That's why they are called classics, their work never gets old the only good thing about this show is that people who got some curiosity will search for the original material and hopefully see what kind of mess they've just watched.
I just hope there ain't gonna be some idiots like it happened to Berserk where they tried to cancel the manga because it was ''too violent''.
💯
Exactly…catering to such a small % of the population can’t be a good thing in any business model