I think CRT TVs also played a big part in the perceived quality of old cameras and even video games from that era. CRTs had better contrast, color, motion clarity, and a kind of natural anti-aliasing ability that LCD monitors and TVs have never been able to match until very recently
The smearing looks like it is caused by the signal being interlaced and the capture card/software just puts two half frames together, the most basic way to make progressive frames out of interlaced frames. Modern deinterlacing can make it look a lot better than this, as can be seen in the firewire capture. My guess would be that other analog capture cards that just present as UVC devices could be used as a source in Final Cut and benefit from the same deinterlacing algorithm that was used on the firewire import.
so basically, if Elgato updated their software to incorporate the newer algorithms they could more closely match the results of the better connection. Correct?
Yeah that’s definitely the Elgato capture card. The issues is one of two things, the device only allows a single filed to passthrough or attempting to detinterlace but does it improperly which causes that ghosting effect with big motions. Unfortunately, I have not been able to find a device for Mac that passes both fields unharmed.
@11:00 I'll add that standard definition video/video games on a 20'' CRT, seen from a couch across the room, DOES look better than seeing that same content on a modern display. There's so much about that situation that helps smooth over and compensate for a low quality source. Add nostalgia back in and of course we remember it all looking better than it really did.
Yes. Also digital codecs were designed with CRT TV limitations in mind. When I had a GeForce 2 MX with TV-out, DivX titles looked fantastic on my TV, but not so good with my CRT monitor. With a Composite video output like the N64 had, you don't need antialiasing... the screen is too blurry anyways. That said, I'm sure the captured video can be improved by adding a sharpness filter. Even on a Full HD camera, try dialing down the Sharpness control to 0 and you'll see how soft it actually is. It's not just the image capturing, it's all the processing that's done by the cameras or phones (my pixel 7 pro sharpens too much for my taste)
I'm glad you had a chance (and the spare cash) to test out the centipede adapter route. I was one of the original commenters on your previous video and for the record, I described it as "marginally better video than any RCA output capture/conversion", and your experience here mirrors my own. Thanks for the follow up video with examples for others to see!
Thank you! It's definitely better, but I have a hard time thinking that I'd want to recommend it to anyone who isn't already a big camera nerd (and I mean that as a term of endearment 😁 )
Having worked with it professionally at the time, I can say it's definitely far better, especially when captured correctly with the correct (native) settings. Both Elgato and Final Cut, and QuickTime reprocess, compress & convert the footage to a file they prefer, and quality loss does occur. The system I worked on at the time used Adobe Premiere and kept the footage completely in it's native colorspace and interlacing settings. The main difference really became evident when you did any type of fx, color correction/stylizing, or frame rate changes. I remember one indie short -film project I worked on in 2003, the director wasn't happy with the way the actress looked in one low light shot when he was editing it with the editor in FCP. I did my own cut on the system I was using (called a Canopus DV Rex M1 RT, with Adobe Premiere) and the same scene looked completely different. His captured footage on FCP on a Mac was unusable. The reds in her face were so compressed, it was unbelievable, and would've looked terrible in the theater. My DV Rex system with Premiere looked great, just as we shot it! That was the moment I first understood the difference in compression and color handling. That was the thing I hated about firewire... The way(in your settings) you captured your footage really made a difference. Wasn't as easy as dragging & dropping a file like these days.
@tombuck this was mentioned in the comments, but I’ll repeat it here: Let’s see a video upscaling topic. It could be fun and interesting. Even current cameras need it; many mirrorless cameras will overheat when recording in 4K. For that reason, I shoot in 2K to avoid the time limits. It would be super cool to see what upscaling could do / or not do.
This is definitely interesting. It's not something I know a ton about, but before I had my Sony cameras I spent about a year upscaling Canon footage from 1080 to 4K, and while it definitely doesn't look as good as native 4K, I was pretty happy with it.
I had the XL1. Loved it. Actually sold it to get back into photography along with video, so I purchased the Canon T2i. That was about 13 years ago and now it is crazy to think how far cameras have come in such short time.
It may have been cheaper to just buy an older MacBook Pro with FireWire and importing the footage on it using iMovie. Then send the footage to a new device via any media you like. However, older devices are SLOW and that Elgato capture device is pretty handy if your using it for other devices too.
You know what, you're probably right. You could pick up a 2008 MacBook Pro with a native FW800 port and install a 1tb SSD into it for probably less than $150.
You're absolutely right. The footage from the XL1 looked amazing at the time and is still pretty good if you don't mind it not being super definition. It still looks old and has that late 90's blurriness and grain to it. It's great if you're wanting to shoot something and give it a nostalgia feel, though.
Cool stuff - I remember, vaguely, back when I was shooting Mini DV (often with the XL1!) I had some deck, probably a Sony, that had firewire and I'd use that for capture to save the wear and tear on the camera. I also remember a friend of mine had a setup with a similar deck where he could just connect a (firewire) hard drive and it would dump the footage on the hard drive without a computer. The drag, of course, was that if you shot an hour of footage, it would take that long to just get it into your computer. And you are 100% on the nostalgia factor for the look. I remember seeing the footage "in the day" and thinking "why would you ever need anything better than this?" but we weren't comparing it to "reality", we were comparing it to whatever came before.
I absolutely loved shooting with my Sony VX1000 years ago as a young dude skateboarding with friends. I wish I kept it with how much I ended up falling in love with videography over the years.
“The Pimp-my-ride version of workflows” made my day. I literally laughed out loud. 😂 Very cool video, and cool that you followed up on something from a comment section.
The elgato is solid. I converted tons of my grandfathers old vhs c footage. Highly recommend using a vcr in lieu of the camcorder for those. I had a camcorder start smelling like it was burning. Apparently it doesn’t like playing for long periods of time…. Also I didn’t know Final Cut would break of long clips. Wish I would have known that several years back lol
I still have an old mac pro from 2007 staying around here. I has a Blackmagic Decklink with SDI, HDMI and analog inputs and even it is a professional capture card it is always the best way do transfer digital footage via a digital connection because the convertion from digital to analog leads to a loss of quality. And for the XL-1 the d/a converter (digital to analoge) was one of the things that were not so good as most of the camera. The point is if you use firewire to transfer your footage you don't lose any quality because what gets transfered is exactly the datastream that was written to the tape while shooting the video and it gave you a much better usable footage for post production especially for color correction. I started working in the film an video industry in 1996, which allowed me to experience all the developments in the industry. That was such a cool time and in the early nineties as a teenager i dreamed of that what consumer cameras are capable today.
Instead of all those adapters, just get an old Mac Mini that still has a FireWire port for DV capture. They're dirt cheap, costing only a fraction of those adapters and even less than the Elgato. Not to mention that they're also more reliable. Especially if you replace the original HDD with an SSD.
Honestly, you’re not losing much from a *good* analog capture (s-video, uncompressed capture, smart deinterlacint in post, etc) versus DV. I can’t stand DV25 compression, analog helps mask some of the obvious blocking
another good video by Tom Buck, explaining some sensitive and tricky issues ... speaking of differences in various resolutions' image qualities, and the "perceived reality" topic (or trick of the mind?), another point we all probably miss today is the monitor resolution ... back in the day, we shot in SD (480i mostly) and watched the final footage on a 480i CRT monitor as well, mostly @ max 20" size, especially if we were pros working in studios ... but even when viewed on a 27" (or occasionally larger size) SD CRT monitor, the image still looked just fine ... great even, at times, depending on the camera/lens/lighting etc used ... now, we're watching the same darn old low-res footage on at least 30" if not larger size LCD / OLED etc monitors, that are at least 1080p in resolution, aren't we? so, maybe it's not too far off to say that we're being a little unfair towards that old resolution and the related equipment in use .... even today, sometimes i watch old (oten ancient) B&W or color Hollywood movies at 480 scan rate on 4K LCD monitors as big as 50" and they look great, IF they have been digitized properly ... (while at the same time some 1080 videos on the same monitor don't look as good as expected ...) but yes, these days, even 720p is no longer HD really, with 1080 FHD video going bust even though it's still a really fine hi-res resolution imo ... also, i have also watched some really old Hi-band videos (recorded on U-matic tape for example, that is also SD quality btw, vs the older 240 tv resolution that was prevalent until the mid 1970s in most countries) yet remastered in such a good way they look extremely fine even on modern large hi-res LCD monitors, especially in terms of good color corrections if not in resolution ...
I bought a fire wire PCIE add in card with a Texas instruments chipset. That worked with my Sony hi8 camcorder but not my cannon hdv camcorder. So I bought a fire wire PCIE add in card with a VA chipset. That worked with both hdv and hi8. I had to install the 1394 OHCI legacy driver for windows 10 to recognize the PCIE add in cards.
Ohhh yes…I went down the “adapter needs an adapter to another adapter” rabbit hole a couple years ago. Not only for MiniDV, but also my old ADVC 110 box for VHS and hi8 capture…same kind of device as the Elgato, just…old, and FireWire.
For recovering old family videos frontape, if the MiniDV tape goes through a gap with corrupted data, it would just stop importing which is why I went with the analogue route. Plus, having to convert from AVI to a more modern H.264 MP4 format is an additional step that can be an additional hassle.
G'day Tom. Re perceived reality, I think your comments are very similar to what I've experienced in the world of Amateur Radio (Ham Radio to some). I grew up on a farm and from the early 1980's, we used UHF-CB radios in each vehicle. These radios used FM for voice - and sounds very nice for radio. Other radio bands at the time used AM & SSB (single side band) - although I never used those two modes. About 15 years ago I got my Amateur Radio license and soon realised that many people used SSB as a voice transmission mode. Having lived with FM voice for many years, then trying SSB, I thought oh, how does everyone put up with this mode. It was terrible on the ears. But after a few days of listening to SSB voice, I got used to it and happy with it to date. Same goes when some of the digital voice modes started appearing in Amateur Radio, some of them were terrible. But again, after a week or so of listening, I got used to it. Some of it is still terrible but a couple of other digital voice modes are ok on the ears. Sorry about the long explanation. Back in the day, we were happy with 480 or 525 lines. Then along came 780 lines digital (standard def I think) and we thought woweee! Then not long after 1080 and same again with when 4K came along. With low grades of voice and/or video transmission, our brain has been filling in the gaps. Then there's a whole another discussion about vinyl & CD's compared to MP3 and cheap ear phones. The younger people of today have grown up with MP3 and are probably very happy with that as they've never heard anything better. But then play them some music on vinyl or CD into a decent audio system and it blows their minds how much better it sounds compared to MP3's. Anyway, a great video once again - keep up the great work 🙂
I found HDV FireWire capture a bit tricky on FCPX. You need to monitor the audio as it can easily just record picture only…as I found out. Canon HV30 is a little HD gem, I can record ProRes via the HDMI out. Sweet! Great vid as always Tom
If the footage is on 8mm, Hi8 or VHS-C tapes your import is best you can use S-video. If the camcorder had PCM sound recording it could dup over it whilst keeping the original sound track. The FM analogue and digital could be played together but would because of the age now be adrift and have latency (an echo). Digital 8 camcorders or decks will not playback the digital PCM track. Anything added as commentary after the recording is not transferred over Firewire or analogue outputs. However the digital transfer of Hi8 and 8mm tapes is of a high quality and easier to achieve than converting though other devices. When you have DV or mini-DV the Firewire or iLink import is an exact digital copy however it might not export the data time stamp of the clips. These can be shown on a television when using the S-video or composite video output. If you want to see the original date time stamp you have to play through the tapes twice and possibly record both. Most often you only need a transfer of the whole tape but some software will create hundreds of short clips which you then have to edit back together. Import from a DV can also convert the format and recompress the footage. Rather import RAW then do the editing and only compress to MPG, MKV, M4A etc the final cut. This process is a lot slower and even on a fast CPU (3GHz i7) can take days for a few hours of material compared to a direct to DVD ready import which is done in real time as the tape is played but edits are then working with heavily compressed source and progressive edits each adding its own compression degrading the image quality finally saved. Windows 10 has discontinued support for Firewire. So even if the computer has the ports and had worked 10 years ago using them it might not now. Adding a lead from a motherboard to provide Firewire on the back panel of a desktop might not work. Getting pin out information of the motherboard and cable has to be double checked as an incorrectly inserted header can damage the digital board on the camcorder or deck used. A lot of home camcorder recordings particularly Hi8 and 8mm were transferred to cheaper and lower resolution VHS tapes often recording over off air programmes. This was due to the high cost of Hi8 tapes which were also not so readily available comparted to VHS and it was easier to slip in a VHS tape already connected to the TV than wire up a camcorder. So when transferring the pauses and gaps from the camcorder had commercial TV clips in the middle. The roll in and out is often broken up. I have been asked to transfer to DVD footage from VHS and 8mm tapes but then they realise no family members has a DVD player anymore and not all DVD players will play back DVD-R or DVD+R recordings. I have been transferring to USB memory sticks and advising them to make back up copies immediately.
I keep around an old Firewire 400/800 PCI card for my gaming PC just in case. Tough, I could see doing the Mac Tax solution for sure, since i edit on a Mac. Love me some old school camcorders!
This is why I never throw away old computers that are still working, you never know when you might need a firewire-port ;) And never underestimate the power of the good old CRT tv’s ;) Had a similar idea some days ago, re-importing some footage from my old SONY HANDYCAM DCR-PC9E PAL MINIDV CAMCORDER (sorry for uppercase, copied from a website, couldn’t be bothered to type in the whole camera name ;) I have two tapes from a bachelor party and a concert, that I 14 years ago put on my channel here on youtube, the footage itself is even older I think, and the guys at the bachelor party played in a band, so I made a music video from the bachelor party video intercutting with concert footage from a festival. That video was imported through firewire to a pc running premiere, and cut in premiere, but it’s also interlaced footage, so it looks *really* not great since I, to save computing power and space, exported the movie in a *not to great quality* for distribution online. So my plan is to a) see if I can build a similar plugception chain to the one you have (tried something similar on my rme hammerfall audio card that runs on a hdspe card into the pcmcia-port on my old laptop, trying to build a chain going from that to usb 2 to usb 3 to thunderbolt ++ is * not* something you wanna try) and if that isn’t working I’ll try to start my old pc and Premiere and se if I can dump the source footage that way since storage is no longer an issue. Then my plan is to take that interlaced footage and pretty it up as much as possible de-interlacing with the correct direction/upper/lower field first, and even try to AI upscale it, and then re-cut the music video exactly like the original, should be fun … Also: not sure if you know this tip about tapes, but we used to «prime» the dv-tapes, ie recording a full pass of blackness (lens cap on) onto the tape before use - that way, when recording actual footage on the tape, *if* there where gaps in our recordings the import wouldn’t stop because of loss of signal :) Not applicable to your already recorded old tapes, but if you’re doing some new recordings it makes the import much smoother :)
That is a pretty wild workflow- definitely curious if AI can make things looks better than we've been able to in the past. By the way, I had no idea about "priming" tapes! Makes a lot of sense now.
@@tombuck That Priming-trick saved me a *lot* of manual labour :) Premiere even back then did have a rudimentary scene/clip detection on import from DV-tape I think, not sure if it was based one some kind of timecode data from the dv tape or not. The killer was having to deal with interlaced footage though, the smearing of two half frames into a progressive format for computer screens on export did work pretty well though, but I imagine Davinci and other editors might do a better job of it now ;) at least I *hope* it will. The ultimate score would be if I could import the premiere project and use the cut info for making the new edit though, gonna try and see if it’s possible :)
Very nice video! I'd also like to add, having used both of these transferring methods, that QuickTime gives you the best quality for sure, but boy you better have a large drive if you want to digitize more than a couple of tapes since it uses a very high bitrate. That's good if you need it for archiving the most precious clips ever or if you need to edit the footage and then re-encode it, but be prepared to have a 25/30GB video file easily for a 120-minute tape. On the other hand, Elgato files look objectively worse, but in my case (family stuff, vacations, lunches with relatives, and birthdays), I took the hit in quality since my dad and grandpa never used professional equipment to begin with (and some of the VHS had mold on them) so the difference was not that visible. However, Elgato software got me 3/4GB files for the same 120-minute tape. That made it viable to buy ten 500GB USB drives (2016) and gift them to my relatives over Christmas with all my dad and grandpa's almost 90 tapes digitized in video files ready to be played on everything, everywhere, since the file size and bitrate were manageable by every device, even a low-end TV or a mobile phone if it came to it. That was more important to me than pure 1:1 quality but only to be played on my NAS since it was so ungodly big and clunky for the everyday device of my relatives. So basically, it's a quality tradeoff and you have to consider it if you're planning on digitizing a lot of old tapes but Elgato struck the best quality/size balance in my case, your mileage may vary.
Hey Tom, really enjoyed the video. Have you ever tried using an external recorder like an atomos ninja v? I have a Sony vx2000 with bad play head so it's something i've been considering. again, awesome video. just subscribed
Very interesting comparison with video games. I do play game cube games but not on HDTV. I bought old LCD with native 480p resolution to have pixel perfect results. This is way better also because there’s a feeling to play on old TVs
I have the Elgato Video Capture but I've only used it to import VHS/Beta. For MiniDV, I've only used Firewire in a 2011 MacMini Intel i5 2.35GHz - which made it a bit easier(maybe?) than if I were to import into more modern Macs. This was all back in 2020 during the pandemic so it's been awhile but I was using iMovie to import. Worked pretty easy - just hit the button and come back an hour later (it was that real-time import that I really hated about those days of video editing). I still have a bunch of MiniDV tapes that I shot in the Philippines on a Sony TRV-900. I need to get back to importing those to see how it looks!
"Nothing is going to make someone mistake a 20 plus year-old-camcorder like this, standard definition, 480 lines of resolution for like a modern 4K or 8K camera." While I agree on the claim that 4K and 8K are completely out of the reach of a camera like this, when it comes to 720p/1080p I beg to differ. Mike Krumlauf on RUclips has some fantastic XL footage that demonstrates it is possible to extract some amazing-looking visuals from these cams. I also wanted to say that when you capture interlace video with Quicktime it will automatically apply a deinterlacing and softening filter to your footage, which already ties you in to the look that it thinks is best. My philosophy has always been that you want to work with the most raw of footage that you can start with... meaning raw interlaced DVCPRO video directly transferred via FireWire. From here you can take any direction you like with the footage. Good SD interlace video starts with good deinterlacing. This step is crucial can make or break the rest of the project. The closer you can get to natively looking progressive footage, the better off you'll be. I personally capture via FireWire then bring that into FFMPEG and process my video through QTGMC deinterlacing. The result is an extremely high-quality progressive image that you'd be hard-pressed to know that it ever came from an interlaced source. From here there are a variety of very high-quality open-source upscaling options --I'm not talking that Topaz Labs bloat. Tons of custom AI-trained models exist that deliver better results. This is a very brief overview and barely scratches the surface, but I promise you: in the right hands, XL footage can (and does) look spectacular.
Love the series on the xl. I could afford that so i got the GL2. Not sure if the XL2 could do this but one neat feature that the GL was able to do was hook it up to your VCR and allow pass through. So i could capture my VHS videos through the GL2 through the FireWire. If the did make this now, i would definitely want to buy one. I love my FX30 because of the zoom knob and ability to use a zoom controller.
Great video.. I needed that comparison. Of course I'd really like to go firewire but jumping through those hoops isn't worth that extra bit of quality especially when these are old home movies that me and my family might watch a handful of times in our lives and if I didn't have side by side comparisons wouldn't know the difference. Just for kicks I used Topaz's upscaling along with a stabilization filter and it's made a pretty darn big difference in the videos. The problem with that is time it takes to process.. even with a i9 13900k/rtx4090 it can take 3 minutes per 1 minute of footage at least.. and with 15-20 hours of converted videos this could take a long time.
You just keep going with the camcorders that are almost as old as me. Knock yourself out but as a guy that still has 2000 mini-DV tapes I don't miss this old tech at all.
I don't miss HAVING to use the tech, but I still find it fascinating! And having a tub of old tapes rotting away definitely makes me nervous, so having a good way to save that footage brings a lot of peace of mind. But yeah, give me an SD card any day!
I pulled some footage off of some old DV tapes the other day using a PC and it was a total nightmare, mind you my PC has native firewire support on the motherboard, and even then, not easy. Had issues with setting the right DV output type from the camera and then matching that to Premiere's options, field order, etc. But the cool thing about DV footage is that it is interlaced which means you get higher framerate footage and you can convert it over to high frame rate progressive footage. Also found out that RUclips still has legacy support for interlaced footage and the DV/HDV resolution standards.
It's cheaper to just get a period macbook in decent condition and use it solely for capturing Firewire footage. It's what I did. Helps I have an older version of Adobe and it all runs like clockwork.
I would be curious what Topaz Video AI would do as far as enhancing the video. I have used it to make 720p videos 1080p and to upscale 1080p to 2K (took 3.5 hours of processing). I used to have the Dazzle with Pinnacle Studio to upload VHS to digital. Fun times playing with old cameras and old video.
As an aside to your aside to your aside, it seems as if you might be keeping backups/archives of your various videos from over the years. Do you depend on Cloud storage or do you have a NAS (Network Attached Storage)? If you've gone the NAS route, I'd like to see a video of your experiences.
I do have a NAS! The Synology DS920+. It's definitely been great, but our home internet is really bad, so I haven't been able to really experience the full versatility. It's been amazing as an archive, but I definitely can't edit directly from it or anything, and transferring files takes forever.
And… if your camera doesn't have a FW800 port, you'll need a FW800 to FW400 adapter. And if it has a Sony iLink port, you'll need an adapter to go from that to FW400. I kid you not, I have captured via this entire chain, and it miraculously still works. And if anyone asked me to do it again they'd get a stern look and a shake of the head.
It would be awesome to somehow put a modern sensor into the body of an XL-1. And go around looking like someone stuck in the past, but capturing 4k footage with decent Canon lenses!
A DVD played back on a CRT tv looks so good and crisp. Upscaled onto a modern LED TV? Looks like trash. That said, I think MiniDV-Firewire is the route to go unless you're streaming straight from the camera analog outputs to an small form factor SD record deck.
Hey, I just got an XL1 from an old school teacher. I just want to record car meets with the XL1, and im not doing anything professional. Is there a way to record without a tape? Like have something plugged into the camera while I record so it just takes the footage im taking at that moment in time?
I recently got an XL1 and am trying to go tapeless with it. Everything works except the display still shows up in frame (battery life, time, mode, etc.), since I'm recording via my recorder and not the actual camera. Is there a way to get rid of this?
Well, Is this possible on a flash memory card camcorder? (Mine is a Sony Handycam) Like I have a RCA cable for my Sony Handycam and record them through a capture card? 🤔 (P.S. I don’t have a firewire btw) But at 1:19 The adapter on an adapter got me. 😄 It’s more like you plug in an adapter on an adapter and then another one! 😂
I've used these RCA to HDMI adapters in the past: geni.us/acxCUI They're pretty cheap and work reasonably well. It's been a fun way to use old camcorders with things like the ATEM Mini or other capture card.
@@tombuck This is perfect for my Standard Definition vid capturing, Because the RCA video signal gives me a feeling of an old analog video signal. (Kinda) But I’ll try it out, If that’s gonna work for my video production. 😁 By the way, Thanks for a recommendation! =D
In the Netflix Kanye west documentary, Coodie (who's recorded the entire documentary) was using a Canon Gl1, and the footage looks so gorgeous. i don kwon if was product of a remastering software or AI but looks so clean. Btw thanks for this and past video about thus camera, i loved to learn about it.
Hey Tom! Would FireWire to hdmi work as well when connected to a a legato capture cart or even directly to an atomic ninja and keep the best quality of the recording? I started out my career with the canon xha1 and although I sold it yrs ago I still have my wedding on some minidv and would love to bring it back over to this decade. I’ll have to buy a used minidv camcorder with FireWire that supports 1080.
This is a good question! I might be wrong, but I don't think it would work. There are these inexpensive RCA to HDMI adapters that you can then run into a modern capture card: geni.us/acxCUI They work surprisingly well overall, and technically support 1080 (but I don't know how that works since I don't think RCA can be 1080, so I think maybe they upscale it?).
@@tombuck after I posted this I took 2 sec to look into it and you are right. Any recommendations on a cheap 1080 minidv cassette camcorder with FireWire?
@@JaredHoyman I have a Sony HD camcorder HDR-HC7E (this is a PAL model) although HD and 1080i the image is 1440x1080 not full HD. It will playback all my mini-DV tapes but only at their original resolution. It has iLink (in and out) and the export will break up the tape into separately recorded sections but not provide the original data time stamp. The model choice for mini-DV tapes recoding in 1080i is very limited. They had already moved to SD card recording.
I think I had a Sony handycam for skateboarding. And looking at the footage now just is so bad, ha ha. They are good memories, but we are so lucky now. Where a standard cell phone would make a better video these days.
Sennheiser Mk4 sE elektrnic S7mk ev sütütyosu için seslendirme ve vokal için hangisi uygundur sizce ? Mk 4 almaya değermi yoksa sE 7Mk yeterli olur mu ?
I’ve had problems with FireWire video import from my Sony handycam (forget model) on my 2020 iMac ever since I updated my macOS, is this still an issue for anyone? I’m going to try it on my new silicon MacBook and see if it works but I do miss the quality of the FireWire import via QuickTime/imovie (iMovie also auto cuts your footage like fcp)
XL1 video taken on the Costa Dorada in Spain, maybe early 2000s. This was originally copied by FireWire direct to my Windows PC desktop at the time. ruclips.net/video/TGYrdjpT1IA/видео.html
It would super useful to have some through of Mini DV Videorecorder that simply connect via USB 3.0 to the PC than u only had drop in the Tape and hit Capture in the Software 😂
I have a Sony mini DV HD camcorder HDR-HC7E. It has iLink and mini USB connections. As Windows 10 no longer supports Firewire is is easier to use USB. I have the same issues with film scanners and now use their USB. As these date from around 2005-07 it is USB 2.0 and slower than Firewire not that it makes much difference as transfer is in real time, not a digital to digital fast transfer.
I think CRT TVs also played a big part in the perceived quality of old cameras and even video games from that era. CRTs had better contrast, color, motion clarity, and a kind of natural anti-aliasing ability that LCD monitors and TVs have never been able to match until very recently
YUP
“Yo dawg, I heard you like adapters…” 😂 You made my day with this “Pimp My Ride” approach to connecting old tech to new tech! Love your videos!!! 🤩🏆💪🏼
Haha, I was so close to cutting that out, so I'm glad I left it in 😅
@@tombuck Your intuition to leave it in won out!! That was the best part 🤣
I bought a Sony HVR-MRC1 which takes the firewire output and records to CF Cards as RAW DV or mpeg2.
I had one of those on a Sony Z5 camcorder; wonderful little gadget!
The smearing looks like it is caused by the signal being interlaced and the capture card/software just puts two half frames together, the most basic way to make progressive frames out of interlaced frames. Modern deinterlacing can make it look a lot better than this, as can be seen in the firewire capture.
My guess would be that other analog capture cards that just present as UVC devices could be used as a source in Final Cut and benefit from the same deinterlacing algorithm that was used on the firewire import.
so basically, if Elgato updated their software to incorporate the newer algorithms they could more closely match the results of the better connection. Correct?
Yeah that’s definitely the Elgato capture card. The issues is one of two things, the device only allows a single filed to passthrough or attempting to detinterlace but does it improperly which causes that ghosting effect with big motions. Unfortunately, I have not been able to find a device for Mac that passes both fields unharmed.
@11:00 I'll add that standard definition video/video games on a 20'' CRT, seen from a couch across the room, DOES look better than seeing that same content on a modern display. There's so much about that situation that helps smooth over and compensate for a low quality source. Add nostalgia back in and of course we remember it all looking better than it really did.
Yes. Also digital codecs were designed with CRT TV limitations in mind. When I had a GeForce 2 MX with TV-out, DivX titles looked fantastic on my TV, but not so good with my CRT monitor. With a Composite video output like the N64 had, you don't need antialiasing... the screen is too blurry anyways.
That said, I'm sure the captured video can be improved by adding a sharpness filter. Even on a Full HD camera, try dialing down the Sharpness control to 0 and you'll see how soft it actually is. It's not just the image capturing, it's all the processing that's done by the cameras or phones (my pixel 7 pro sharpens too much for my taste)
Bruh.. I just got my first professional camera from when I was younger, the Canon XL1s! This was like 4 days ago, timing is awesome!!
So cool you were able to get one!
I'm glad you had a chance (and the spare cash) to test out the centipede adapter route. I was one of the original commenters on your previous video and for the record, I described it as "marginally better video than any RCA output capture/conversion", and your experience here mirrors my own.
Thanks for the follow up video with examples for others to see!
Thank you! It's definitely better, but I have a hard time thinking that I'd want to recommend it to anyone who isn't already a big camera nerd (and I mean that as a term of endearment 😁 )
Having worked with it professionally at the time, I can say it's definitely far better, especially when captured correctly with the correct (native) settings. Both Elgato and Final Cut, and QuickTime reprocess, compress & convert the footage to a file they prefer, and quality loss does occur. The system I worked on at the time used Adobe Premiere and kept the footage completely in it's native colorspace and interlacing settings.
The main difference really became evident when you did any type of fx, color correction/stylizing, or frame rate changes. I remember one indie short
-film project I worked on in 2003, the director wasn't happy with the way the actress looked in one low light shot when he was editing it with the editor in FCP. I did my own cut on the system I was using
(called a Canopus DV Rex M1 RT, with Adobe Premiere) and the same scene looked completely different. His captured footage on FCP on a Mac was unusable. The reds in her face were so compressed, it was unbelievable, and would've looked terrible in the theater. My DV Rex system with Premiere looked great, just as we shot it! That was the moment I first understood the difference in compression and color handling.
That was the thing I hated about firewire... The way(in your settings) you captured your footage really made a difference. Wasn't as easy as dragging & dropping a file like these days.
@tombuck this was mentioned in the comments, but I’ll repeat it here: Let’s see a video upscaling topic. It could be fun and interesting. Even current cameras need it; many mirrorless cameras will overheat when recording in 4K. For that reason, I shoot in 2K to avoid the time limits. It would be super cool to see what upscaling could do / or not do.
This is definitely interesting. It's not something I know a ton about, but before I had my Sony cameras I spent about a year upscaling Canon footage from 1080 to 4K, and while it definitely doesn't look as good as native 4K, I was pretty happy with it.
I had the XL1. Loved it. Actually sold it to get back into photography along with video, so I purchased the Canon T2i. That was about 13 years ago and now it is crazy to think how far cameras have come in such short time.
I had the T2i too! My first dslr that could shoot video.
It may have been cheaper to just buy an older MacBook Pro with FireWire and importing the footage on it using iMovie. Then send the footage to a new device via any media you like.
However, older devices are SLOW and that Elgato capture device is pretty handy if your using it for other devices too.
You know what, you're probably right. You could pick up a 2008 MacBook Pro with a native FW800 port and install a 1tb SSD into it for probably less than $150.
That's true! Just have a dedicated transfer computer 🤔
So the cable extensions cost just about as much an actual 2008 apple computer?😂 that's wild
You're absolutely right. The footage from the XL1 looked amazing at the time and is still pretty good if you don't mind it not being super definition. It still looks old and has that late 90's blurriness and grain to it. It's great if you're wanting to shoot something and give it a nostalgia feel, though.
Solid video! Working with FireWire is so confusing now and this video is going to be a great help
I put it off for literally years 🫠
Cool stuff - I remember, vaguely, back when I was shooting Mini DV (often with the XL1!) I had some deck, probably a Sony, that had firewire and I'd use that for capture to save the wear and tear on the camera. I also remember a friend of mine had a setup with a similar deck where he could just connect a (firewire) hard drive and it would dump the footage on the hard drive without a computer. The drag, of course, was that if you shot an hour of footage, it would take that long to just get it into your computer. And you are 100% on the nostalgia factor for the look. I remember seeing the footage "in the day" and thinking "why would you ever need anything better than this?" but we weren't comparing it to "reality", we were comparing it to whatever came before.
I absolutely loved shooting with my Sony VX1000 years ago as a young dude skateboarding with friends. I wish I kept it with how much I ended up falling in love with videography over the years.
That's the ultimate skate video camera!
Check out some of the Sony VX1000 camera documentaries. Even as newer cameras came out the VX1000 was preferred.
Ah, FireWire. I remember those days. 😅
“The Pimp-my-ride version of workflows” made my day. I literally laughed out loud. 😂 Very cool video, and cool that you followed up on something from a comment section.
The elgato is solid. I converted tons of my grandfathers old vhs c footage. Highly recommend using a vcr in lieu of the camcorder for those. I had a camcorder start smelling like it was burning. Apparently it doesn’t like playing for long periods of time…. Also I didn’t know Final Cut would break of long clips. Wish I would have known that several years back lol
Yeah, I had no idea it would break up clips! Super handy.
I still have an old mac pro from 2007 staying around here. I has a Blackmagic Decklink with SDI, HDMI and analog inputs and even it is a professional capture card it is always the best way do transfer digital footage via a digital connection because the convertion from digital to analog leads to a loss of quality. And for the XL-1 the d/a converter (digital to analoge) was one of the things that were not so good as most of the camera. The point is if you use firewire to transfer your footage you don't lose any quality because what gets transfered is exactly the datastream that was written to the tape while shooting the video and it gave you a much better usable footage for post production especially for color correction.
I started working in the film an video industry in 1996, which allowed me to experience all the developments in the industry. That was such a cool time and in the early nineties as a teenager i dreamed of that what consumer cameras are capable today.
Instead of all those adapters, just get an old Mac Mini that still has a FireWire port for DV capture. They're dirt cheap, costing only a fraction of those adapters and even less than the Elgato. Not to mention that they're also more reliable. Especially if you replace the original HDD with an SSD.
I still have all of my old analog cameras, sony, canon gl series and panasonics.
Honestly, you’re not losing much from a *good* analog capture (s-video, uncompressed capture, smart deinterlacint in post, etc) versus DV. I can’t stand DV25 compression, analog helps mask some of the obvious blocking
I was honestly pretty impressed with how well the analog footage held up overall.
another good video by Tom Buck, explaining some sensitive and tricky issues ...
speaking of differences in various resolutions' image qualities, and the "perceived reality" topic (or trick of the mind?), another point we all probably miss today is the monitor resolution ...
back in the day, we shot in SD (480i mostly) and watched the final footage on a 480i CRT monitor as well, mostly @ max 20" size, especially if we were pros working in studios ... but even when viewed on a 27" (or occasionally larger size) SD CRT monitor, the image still looked just fine ... great even, at times, depending on the camera/lens/lighting etc used ...
now, we're watching the same darn old low-res footage on at least 30" if not larger size LCD / OLED etc monitors, that are at least 1080p in resolution, aren't we?
so, maybe it's not too far off to say that we're being a little unfair towards that old resolution and the related equipment in use .... even today, sometimes i watch old (oten ancient) B&W or color Hollywood movies at 480 scan rate on 4K LCD monitors as big as 50" and they look great, IF they have been digitized properly ... (while at the same time some 1080 videos on the same monitor don't look as good as expected ...)
but yes, these days, even 720p is no longer HD really, with 1080 FHD video going bust even though it's still a really fine hi-res resolution imo ...
also, i have also watched some really old Hi-band videos (recorded on U-matic tape for example, that is also SD quality btw, vs the older 240 tv resolution that was prevalent until the mid 1970s in most countries) yet remastered in such a good way they look extremely fine even on modern large hi-res LCD monitors, especially in terms of good color corrections if not in resolution ...
I bought a fire wire PCIE add in card with a Texas instruments chipset. That worked with my Sony hi8 camcorder but not my cannon hdv camcorder. So I bought a fire wire PCIE add in card with a VA chipset. That worked with both hdv and hi8. I had to install the 1394 OHCI legacy driver for windows 10 to recognize the PCIE add in cards.
Ohhh yes…I went down the “adapter needs an adapter to another adapter” rabbit hole a couple years ago. Not only for MiniDV, but also my old ADVC 110 box for VHS and hi8 capture…same kind of device as the Elgato, just…old, and FireWire.
super helpful, cheers Tom
Thank you!
For recovering old family videos frontape, if the MiniDV tape goes through a gap with corrupted data, it would just stop importing which is why I went with the analogue route. Plus, having to convert from AVI to a more modern H.264 MP4 format is an additional step that can be an additional hassle.
For FCPX, ALWAYS play the tape and then hit import. My Canon GL2 keep glitching and I finally figured out that this was the reason :)
G'day Tom. Re perceived reality, I think your comments are very similar to what I've experienced in the world of Amateur Radio (Ham Radio to some). I grew up on a farm and from the early 1980's, we used UHF-CB radios in each vehicle. These radios used FM for voice - and sounds very nice for radio. Other radio bands at the time used AM & SSB (single side band) - although I never used those two modes. About 15 years ago I got my Amateur Radio license and soon realised that many people used SSB as a voice transmission mode. Having lived with FM voice for many years, then trying SSB, I thought oh, how does everyone put up with this mode. It was terrible on the ears. But after a few days of listening to SSB voice, I got used to it and happy with it to date. Same goes when some of the digital voice modes started appearing in Amateur Radio, some of them were terrible. But again, after a week or so of listening, I got used to it. Some of it is still terrible but a couple of other digital voice modes are ok on the ears. Sorry about the long explanation. Back in the day, we were happy with 480 or 525 lines. Then along came 780 lines digital (standard def I think) and we thought woweee! Then not long after 1080 and same again with when 4K came along. With low grades of voice and/or video transmission, our brain has been filling in the gaps. Then there's a whole another discussion about vinyl & CD's compared to MP3 and cheap ear phones. The younger people of today have grown up with MP3 and are probably very happy with that as they've never heard anything better. But then play them some music on vinyl or CD into a decent audio system and it blows their minds how much better it sounds compared to MP3's. Anyway, a great video once again - keep up the great work 🙂
I found HDV FireWire capture a bit tricky on FCPX. You need to monitor the audio as it can easily just record picture only…as I found out. Canon HV30 is a little HD gem, I can record ProRes via the HDMI out. Sweet! Great vid as always Tom
you can put a firewire card in a external thunderbolt enclosure also. but go the SDI Route much better.
If the footage is on 8mm, Hi8 or VHS-C tapes your import is best you can use S-video. If the camcorder had PCM sound recording it could dup over it whilst keeping the original sound track. The FM analogue and digital could be played together but would because of the age now be adrift and have latency (an echo). Digital 8 camcorders or decks will not playback the digital PCM track. Anything added as commentary after the recording is not transferred over Firewire or analogue outputs. However the digital transfer of Hi8 and 8mm tapes is of a high quality and easier to achieve than converting though other devices.
When you have DV or mini-DV the Firewire or iLink import is an exact digital copy however it might not export the data time stamp of the clips. These can be shown on a television when using the S-video or composite video output. If you want to see the original date time stamp you have to play through the tapes twice and possibly record both. Most often you only need a transfer of the whole tape but some software will create hundreds of short clips which you then have to edit back together. Import from a DV can also convert the format and recompress the footage. Rather import RAW then do the editing and only compress to MPG, MKV, M4A etc the final cut. This process is a lot slower and even on a fast CPU (3GHz i7) can take days for a few hours of material compared to a direct to DVD ready import which is done in real time as the tape is played but edits are then working with heavily compressed source and progressive edits each adding its own compression degrading the image quality finally saved.
Windows 10 has discontinued support for Firewire. So even if the computer has the ports and had worked 10 years ago using them it might not now. Adding a lead from a motherboard to provide Firewire on the back panel of a desktop might not work. Getting pin out information of the motherboard and cable has to be double checked as an incorrectly inserted header can damage the digital board on the camcorder or deck used.
A lot of home camcorder recordings particularly Hi8 and 8mm were transferred to cheaper and lower resolution VHS tapes often recording over off air programmes. This was due to the high cost of Hi8 tapes which were also not so readily available comparted to VHS and it was easier to slip in a VHS tape already connected to the TV than wire up a camcorder. So when transferring the pauses and gaps from the camcorder had commercial TV clips in the middle. The roll in and out is often broken up. I have been asked to transfer to DVD footage from VHS and 8mm tapes but then they realise no family members has a DVD player anymore and not all DVD players will play back DVD-R or DVD+R recordings. I have been transferring to USB memory sticks and advising them to make back up copies immediately.
I keep around an old Firewire 400/800 PCI card for my gaming PC just in case. Tough, I could see doing the Mac Tax solution for sure, since i edit on a Mac. Love me some old school camcorders!
This is why I never throw away old computers that are still working, you never know when you might need a firewire-port ;)
And never underestimate the power of the good old CRT tv’s ;)
Had a similar idea some days ago, re-importing some footage from my old SONY HANDYCAM DCR-PC9E PAL MINIDV CAMCORDER (sorry for uppercase, copied from a website, couldn’t be bothered to type in the whole camera name ;)
I have two tapes from a bachelor party and a concert, that I 14 years ago put on my channel here on youtube, the footage itself is even older I think, and the guys at the bachelor party played in a band, so I made a music video from the bachelor party video intercutting with concert footage from a festival.
That video was imported through firewire to a pc running premiere, and cut in premiere, but it’s also interlaced footage, so it looks *really* not great since I, to save computing power and space, exported the movie in a *not to great quality* for distribution online.
So my plan is to a) see if I can build a similar plugception chain to the one you have (tried something similar on my rme hammerfall audio card that runs on a hdspe card into the pcmcia-port on my old laptop, trying to build a chain going from that to usb 2 to usb 3 to thunderbolt ++ is * not* something you wanna try) and if that isn’t working I’ll try to start my old pc and Premiere and se if I can dump the source footage that way since storage is no longer an issue.
Then my plan is to take that interlaced footage and pretty it up as much as possible de-interlacing with the correct direction/upper/lower field first, and even try to AI upscale it, and then re-cut the music video exactly like the original, should be fun …
Also: not sure if you know this tip about tapes, but we used to «prime» the dv-tapes, ie recording a full pass of blackness (lens cap on) onto the tape before use - that way, when recording actual footage on the tape, *if* there where gaps in our recordings the import wouldn’t stop because of loss of signal :) Not applicable to your already recorded old tapes, but if you’re doing some new recordings it makes the import much smoother :)
That is a pretty wild workflow- definitely curious if AI can make things looks better than we've been able to in the past.
By the way, I had no idea about "priming" tapes! Makes a lot of sense now.
@@tombuck That Priming-trick saved me a *lot* of manual labour :) Premiere even back then did have a rudimentary scene/clip detection on import from DV-tape I think, not sure if it was based one some kind of timecode data from the dv tape or not.
The killer was having to deal with interlaced footage though, the smearing of two half frames into a progressive format for computer screens on export did work pretty well though, but I imagine Davinci and other editors might do a better job of it now ;) at least I *hope* it will. The ultimate score would be if I could import the premiere project and use the cut info for making the new edit though, gonna try and see if it’s possible :)
Very nice video! I'd also like to add, having used both of these transferring methods, that QuickTime gives you the best quality for sure, but boy you better have a large drive if you want to digitize more than a couple of tapes since it uses a very high bitrate. That's good if you need it for archiving the most precious clips ever or if you need to edit the footage and then re-encode it, but be prepared to have a 25/30GB video file easily for a 120-minute tape. On the other hand, Elgato files look objectively worse, but in my case (family stuff, vacations, lunches with relatives, and birthdays), I took the hit in quality since my dad and grandpa never used professional equipment to begin with (and some of the VHS had mold on them) so the difference was not that visible. However, Elgato software got me 3/4GB files for the same 120-minute tape. That made it viable to buy ten 500GB USB drives (2016) and gift them to my relatives over Christmas with all my dad and grandpa's almost 90 tapes digitized in video files ready to be played on everything, everywhere, since the file size and bitrate were manageable by every device, even a low-end TV or a mobile phone if it came to it. That was more important to me than pure 1:1 quality but only to be played on my NAS since it was so ungodly big and clunky for the everyday device of my relatives. So basically, it's a quality tradeoff and you have to consider it if you're planning on digitizing a lot of old tapes but Elgato struck the best quality/size balance in my case, your mileage may vary.
Another option is an analog upscaler, such as RetroTink 5x, and capture via HDMI at HD.
Hey Tom, really enjoyed the video. Have you ever tried using an external recorder like an atomos ninja v? I have a Sony vx2000 with bad play head so it's something i've been considering. again, awesome video. just subscribed
I haven't! But I have seen videos of people rigging up "tapeless" camcorders in different ways, and it always seemed like a fun project.
Very interesting comparison with video games. I do play game cube games but not on HDTV. I bought old LCD with native 480p resolution to have pixel perfect results. This is way better also because there’s a feeling to play on old TVs
There's definitely something special about experiencing them the true "old school" way 😎
What you need for flawless video ingest over FireWire is a 2009 MacBook Pro with Premiere Pro 12. 👍
I have the Elgato Video Capture but I've only used it to import VHS/Beta. For MiniDV, I've only used Firewire in a 2011 MacMini Intel i5 2.35GHz - which made it a bit easier(maybe?) than if I were to import into more modern Macs. This was all back in 2020 during the pandemic so it's been awhile but I was using iMovie to import. Worked pretty easy - just hit the button and come back an hour later (it was that real-time import that I really hated about those days of video editing). I still have a bunch of MiniDV tapes that I shot in the Philippines on a Sony TRV-900. I need to get back to importing those to see how it looks!
"Nothing is going to make someone mistake a 20 plus year-old-camcorder like this, standard definition, 480 lines of resolution for like a modern 4K or 8K camera."
While I agree on the claim that 4K and 8K are completely out of the reach of a camera like this, when it comes to 720p/1080p I beg to differ. Mike Krumlauf on RUclips has some fantastic XL footage that demonstrates it is possible to extract some amazing-looking visuals from these cams.
I also wanted to say that when you capture interlace video with Quicktime it will automatically apply a deinterlacing and softening filter to your footage, which already ties you in to the look that it thinks is best. My philosophy has always been that you want to work with the most raw of footage that you can start with... meaning raw interlaced DVCPRO video directly transferred via FireWire.
From here you can take any direction you like with the footage. Good SD interlace video starts with good deinterlacing. This step is crucial can make or break the rest of the project.
The closer you can get to natively looking progressive footage, the better off you'll be. I personally capture via FireWire then bring that into FFMPEG and process my video through QTGMC deinterlacing. The result is an extremely high-quality progressive image that you'd be hard-pressed to know that it ever came from an interlaced source.
From here there are a variety of very high-quality open-source upscaling options --I'm not talking that Topaz Labs bloat. Tons of custom AI-trained models exist that deliver better results.
This is a very brief overview and barely scratches the surface, but I promise you: in the right hands, XL footage can (and does) look spectacular.
Love the series on the xl. I could afford that so i got the GL2. Not sure if the XL2 could do this but one neat feature that the GL was able to do was hook it up to your VCR and allow pass through. So i could capture my VHS videos through the GL2 through the FireWire. If the did make this now, i would definitely want to buy one. I love my FX30 because of the zoom knob and ability to use a zoom controller.
Great video.. I needed that comparison. Of course I'd really like to go firewire but jumping through those hoops isn't worth that extra bit of quality especially when these are old home movies that me and my family might watch a handful of times in our lives and if I didn't have side by side comparisons wouldn't know the difference. Just for kicks I used Topaz's upscaling along with a stabilization filter and it's made a pretty darn big difference in the videos. The problem with that is time it takes to process.. even with a i9 13900k/rtx4090 it can take 3 minutes per 1 minute of footage at least.. and with 15-20 hours of converted videos this could take a long time.
I miss that camera. Should never had gotten rid of it.
Man we are lucky to have modern cameras!😂
You just keep going with the camcorders that are almost as old as me. Knock yourself out but as a guy that still has 2000 mini-DV tapes I don't miss this old tech at all.
I don't miss HAVING to use the tech, but I still find it fascinating! And having a tub of old tapes rotting away definitely makes me nervous, so having a good way to save that footage brings a lot of peace of mind. But yeah, give me an SD card any day!
I pulled some footage off of some old DV tapes the other day using a PC and it was a total nightmare, mind you my PC has native firewire support on the motherboard, and even then, not easy. Had issues with setting the right DV output type from the camera and then matching that to Premiere's options, field order, etc. But the cool thing about DV footage is that it is interlaced which means you get higher framerate footage and you can convert it over to high frame rate progressive footage. Also found out that RUclips still has legacy support for interlaced footage and the DV/HDV resolution standards.
Pretty sure Resolve has a capture source function too.
It's cheaper to just get a period macbook in decent condition and use it solely for capturing Firewire footage. It's what I did. Helps I have an older version of Adobe and it all runs like clockwork.
I would be curious what Topaz Video AI would do as far as enhancing the video. I have used it to make 720p videos 1080p and to upscale 1080p to 2K (took 3.5 hours of processing). I used to have the Dazzle with Pinnacle Studio to upload VHS to digital. Fun times playing with old cameras and old video.
Great idea! I wonder how much it could improve things?
As an aside to your aside to your aside, it seems as if you might be keeping backups/archives of your various videos from over the years. Do you depend on Cloud storage or do you have a NAS (Network Attached Storage)? If you've gone the NAS route, I'd like to see a video of your experiences.
I do have a NAS! The Synology DS920+. It's definitely been great, but our home internet is really bad, so I haven't been able to really experience the full versatility. It's been amazing as an archive, but I definitely can't edit directly from it or anything, and transferring files takes forever.
Great work and very considerate script to all kinds of different opinions on the subject. I wouldn't bother with the firewire.
And… if your camera doesn't have a FW800 port, you'll need a FW800 to FW400 adapter. And if it has a Sony iLink port, you'll need an adapter to go from that to FW400.
I kid you not, I have captured via this entire chain, and it miraculously still works. And if anyone asked me to do it again they'd get a stern look and a shake of the head.
Yep! haha
I actually cut out a bit about FW800/400 just to try and keep things somewhat simple.
could you do a video on color correcting footage imported from older camcorders?
It would be awesome to somehow put a modern sensor into the body of an XL-1. And go around looking like someone stuck in the past, but capturing 4k footage with decent Canon lenses!
You can also find an old MacBook with FireWire for about the same or less than just the $90 FireWire adapter, I was able to find one for about $70 😂
A DVD played back on a CRT tv looks so good and crisp. Upscaled onto a modern LED TV? Looks like trash. That said, I think MiniDV-Firewire is the route to go unless you're streaming straight from the camera analog outputs to an small form factor SD record deck.
Hey, I just got an XL1 from an old school teacher. I just want to record car meets with the XL1, and im not doing anything professional. Is there a way to record without a tape? Like have something plugged into the camera while I record so it just takes the footage im taking at that moment in time?
I recently got an XL1 and am trying to go tapeless with it. Everything works except the display still shows up in frame (battery life, time, mode, etc.), since I'm recording via my recorder and not the actual camera. Is there a way to get rid of this?
Well, Is this possible on a flash memory card camcorder? (Mine is a Sony Handycam) Like I have a RCA cable for my Sony Handycam and record them through a capture card? 🤔
(P.S. I don’t have a firewire btw)
But at 1:19
The adapter on an adapter got me. 😄
It’s more like you plug in an adapter on an adapter and then another one! 😂
I've used these RCA to HDMI adapters in the past: geni.us/acxCUI
They're pretty cheap and work reasonably well. It's been a fun way to use old camcorders with things like the ATEM Mini or other capture card.
@@tombuck This is perfect for my Standard Definition vid capturing, Because the RCA video signal gives me a feeling of an old analog video signal. (Kinda)
But I’ll try it out, If that’s gonna work for my video production. 😁
By the way, Thanks for a recommendation! =D
@0:18 the bloop sound effect hahahaha
That Camera has SDI output i think, i had one, use SDI To thunderbolt from Blackmagic, like $100
In the Netflix Kanye west documentary, Coodie (who's recorded the entire documentary) was using a Canon Gl1, and the footage looks so gorgeous. i don kwon if was product of a remastering software or AI but looks so clean. Btw thanks for this and past video about thus camera, i loved to learn about it.
Hey Tom! Would FireWire to hdmi work as well when connected to a a legato capture cart or even directly to an atomic ninja and keep the best quality of the recording? I started out my career with the canon xha1 and although I sold it yrs ago I still have my wedding on some minidv and would love to bring it back over to this decade. I’ll have to buy a used minidv camcorder with FireWire that supports 1080.
This is a good question! I might be wrong, but I don't think it would work. There are these inexpensive RCA to HDMI adapters that you can then run into a modern capture card: geni.us/acxCUI
They work surprisingly well overall, and technically support 1080 (but I don't know how that works since I don't think RCA can be 1080, so I think maybe they upscale it?).
@@tombuck after I posted this I took 2 sec to look into it and you are right. Any recommendations on a cheap 1080 minidv cassette camcorder with FireWire?
@@JaredHoyman I have a Sony HD camcorder HDR-HC7E (this is a PAL model) although HD and 1080i the image is 1440x1080 not full HD. It will playback all my mini-DV tapes but only at their original resolution. It has iLink (in and out) and the export will break up the tape into separately recorded sections but not provide the original data time stamp. The model choice for mini-DV tapes recoding in 1080i is very limited. They had already moved to SD card recording.
@@geraldmcmullon2465 thank you.
I think I had a Sony handycam for skateboarding. And looking at the footage now just is so bad, ha ha. They are good memories, but we are so lucky now. Where a standard cell phone would make a better video these days.
very informative thank you! what macOS you're on? i think it stopped working for premiere since macOS Mojave.... 😞 (with firewire)
I'm currently on Sonoma. Final Cut still imports just fine, but I know that Resolve doesn't work with FireWire, and I'm not sure about Premiere.
Hey... when it comes to your irretrievable memories if you can get the maximum return then it behooves you to try and capture them.
Very true.
Why didnt this show up in my feed?!
couldn't you just get a usb-c to firewire adapter? Why the thunderbolt cable? Doesn't usb-c work with thunderbolt ports, just slowed down?
Maybe you could, but I couldn't find one that actually worked and ended up wasting a lot of money on adapters.
Sennheiser Mk4 sE elektrnic S7mk ev sütütyosu için seslendirme ve vokal için hangisi uygundur sizce ? Mk 4 almaya değermi yoksa sE 7Mk yeterli olur mu ?
Masterpiece!! You're a Genius. An instant subscribe from me, my Good Brother! Peace
Is the FireWire import, importing at 59.97i? Vs the Elgato doing 29.97? That would make a smearing effect that you might not notice otherwise.
i love my vx1000. aka the dongle daisy chain
I’ve had problems with FireWire video import from my Sony handycam (forget model) on my 2020 iMac ever since I updated my macOS, is this still an issue for anyone? I’m going to try it on my new silicon MacBook and see if it works but I do miss the quality of the FireWire import via QuickTime/imovie (iMovie also auto cuts your footage like fcp)
Why you doing the hard way? my Sony deck has SDI Output, put your dvcam in the deck, then SDI To SDI capture card.
XL1 video taken on the Costa Dorada in Spain, maybe early 2000s. This was originally copied by FireWire direct to my Windows PC desktop at the time. ruclips.net/video/TGYrdjpT1IA/видео.html
This is really cool footage!
Posted 46 seconds ago!
On a desktop computer you can just add a 10 dollar PCIE firewire card... 😅
Someone offer me this Camcorder Canon XL-1S fullset for 100 us dollar,is it worth the price?
If it works, then yes!
It must be hard to be a Mac user
It would super useful to have some through of Mini DV Videorecorder that simply connect via USB 3.0 to the PC than u only had drop in the Tape and hit Capture in the Software 😂
I have a Sony mini DV HD camcorder HDR-HC7E. It has iLink and mini USB connections. As Windows 10 no longer supports Firewire is is easier to use USB. I have the same issues with film scanners and now use their USB. As these date from around 2005-07 it is USB 2.0 and slower than Firewire not that it makes much difference as transfer is in real time, not a digital to digital fast transfer.
@9m40s “a little smearing”? How about massive artifacting. Yuck. No contest. Firewire wins.
It's super bad in the freeze frame, but when the actual video is playing, it's not quite as horrific.