Why did they hide the El Primero in this watch?
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- Опубликовано: 6 сен 2024
- Today we have a beautiful Ebel 1911 chronograph on the bench, with the legendary and beautiful Zenith El Primero movement inside. Join me for a look at the movement in detail, with a discussion on its history and peculiarities, and also a look at Ebel as a brand.
We go on a couple of tangents as usual, including a bit about the never-ending and proudly held male boneheadedness :)
Merry Christmas and a happy new year to all!
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That is beautiful! It's a crime it doesn't have a display case back.
Hello Matty, thanks for watching! Yep, this watch would probably sell more of they displayed the movement...
@@VintageWatchServices Well, they replaced this watch with the Modulor using their Lemania-based Caliber 137 in 1995, so it must be the secondary market you are talking about. But Ebel sold these pretty well considering their market targets, and given Ebel's strong position with luxury quartz watches of their own manufacture. The Ebel Ref 1134901 on strap sold for about $5800 in 1994--the last catalog in which it appeared--which I believe was more than a Daytona with the dumbed-down Zenith movement at the time. Times have changed!
This watch was sold from approx. 1983 through 1995. Back then, display case backs were extremely rare. Imagine, Patek Philippe didn't have them at all. Just with the start over of A. Lange & Söhne from Glashütte in 1996 after the end of the communist aera in former East Germany and showing ALL their beautiful decorated movements under a crystal, this trend started. But at that point in time, the el Primero movement was already gone from the Ebel 1911 and the decline of Ebel was already under way.
Apart from the display case back (that you actually don’t see when wearing that watch), I have to admit that this watch has it’s downsides, e.g. the housing isn’t really water-proof (only 3 ATM means you can wear it when washing your hands), and it’s quite sensitive for shocks, e.g. cycling only on smooth roads and such kind of things. These are things, where a Daytona has clear advantages. Still a Daytona doesn’t have the classy appearance of this vintage watch.
Really enjoyable and informative video. I've been lucky enough to have had two Zenith watches - an autosport from the 1960s and an amazingly accurate hand wound, from the early 1970s. These were treasures, which I've now passd on to new owners who appreciate the heritage and workmanship of the Zenith brand.
that movement is a work of art. The craftmanship that went in designing a movement like this from drawings to the real deal is insane 😍
Hello Kenneth, thanks for watching and I fully agree! These movements were made long before computer aided design was a thing, and the effort needed was monumentally more than nowadays when there are even specific programs that will basically eliminate all the design flaws for you before making any parts!
One of the most interesting brands, Ebel, and one of the very few iconic designs the 90's, the 1911. Marc Busser said this is one of his favorites watches.
Interesting to watch you do this. I bought my 1911 back in 2006 because of the El Primero movement. I love it. Mine has a black face and the two tone metal strap. Very underrated watches- most people have no idea about them, and the later ones don’t have the same appeal.
Mine dates back to the 80s when Ebel commissioned the movements and this brought the Primero movement back into production.
Beautiful watch really. I continue to enjoy your videos, for your exceptionally thoughtful and thorough approach to your work, but also for your historical perspectives and your humor. Thank you so much and Happy New Year!
Thanks so much, that's very nice to hear :) Happy new year to you also!
To see a master watchmaker at work like this even makes me question how meticulous, careful, and precise I am working in my own job (electronics) 😂 The level of mechanical detail in the movement and attention to service is extraordinary. We can appreciate this all the more when captured so expertly with the excellent camerawork and running commentary.
Thanks so much! 😊
You never cease to amaze me in your vast knowledge on all things watch and more.
I enjoy watching and listening. Thank you.
Never get tired of watching you Stian. I am in awe of your skill. Thank you. All the best. Mick.
Thanks so much, Mick ☺️
Good Lord that's a lot of work!
I just bought a solid gold ebel zenith chronograph that was in mint condition. Greatest watch I've ever owned. My watch guy I'm sure can do the work of cleaning it, but hopefully it won't be for quite some time as the watch appears to be mint. It looks like you have to be a master in order to take apart clean and put the watch back together properly. It's hard for me to wrap my head around the complexity of this watch. I actually feel honored to own this watch. I first learned and wanted this watch when I saw Don Johnson wear it on Miami vice. Your channel is wonderfully fascinating!
It is interesting to note that the Zenith television (and indeed the Zenith electronics) are gone while Zenith watches are still ticking.
I have a Zenith Chronomaster moonphase, and it's nice to see what my movement looks like from inside (although the El Primero cal. 410 is better finished and has a full calendar and moonphase). This explains the rather tall bill from the last service of my watch.
I also like that you comment on the construction and design of the movements you service. There are strong and weak points on most constructions of any kind, and these "movement reviews" are hard to come by. If possible it would be great if you could go into even more details on the construction, quality and reliability of the movements featured in your videos.
Hei Amund, thanks for watching! I do try to comment on these things indeed as I think it's interesting myself :) I'll keep doing that although I'm a bit worried that going into too much detail will make it too technical for a lot of viewers. Let's see!
An extremely complicated movement handled by a master,thanks you for showing .
Wasn't a fan of that watch at first glance but, I enjoyed the craftsmanship and complexity if the movement as you disassembled it and gave it's history. Then you put it on your wrist and my attitude flipped 180 degrees. Seeing that watch in a showcase I would pass it by but if I saw it being worn I would definitely compliment the person wearing it for their beautiful watch. Or maybe it just looks good on you? 😊 Happy Christmas.
Thanks a lot for sharing that, much appreciated! And very cool to know I made the watch look good 😂
A happy Christmas and happy new year to you also 🎄🎉🎊✨
Excellent video--my fifth today in a post-subscribing binge. As an Ebel (and Zenith) enthusiast, let me offer a few details for posterity. 1. Charles Vermot wasn't merely a "worker" at Zenith. He'd been hired by Martel in 1936, and by 1976 when he was resisting orders from Zenith Electronics (of USA), he was in charge of production at Zenith. He retired soon after. It was the request from Pierre-Alain Blum of Ebel in 1982 that brought him out of retirement. 2. The El Primero in the video is a caliber 40.0, which was made in the transition year of 1986. Prior to that time, the Ebel Chronograph used a wave bracelet and was working through a stock of 70's-era Zenith Movements that were marked 3019PHC. Vermot had hidden away four or five thousand ebauches, and Ebel purchased those initially in 1982. Based on that sale Zenith Watch Co. and it's owner Dixi Machine decided to restart production using re-established old tooling, and used a new designation: 40.0. That run was successful enough to attract interest from Rolex, and in response to that contract developed new tooling that went into service in 1987, according to Rossler. Those movements were marked "400", and later Ebels have Zenith 400's in them. 3. Ebel started the 1911 series in 1986, at the 75th anniversary of the company. These used the new 1911-style link bracelent instead of the prior wave bracelet. 4. So, an Ebel Chronograph with a 40.0 and a link bracelet can be dated to 1986-1987, a year after Ebel placed these on the wrists of the actors in the hit TV show "Miami Vice". 5. Ebel was a haute de gamme company at least until the last decade, including during the first decade of Movado ownership. They've drifted downmarket since then, but their production standards are still quite good. (My own example of the 1134901 is identical to the one in the video, with a Zenith 40.0, but includes the bracelet. Time to get it serviced again!)
Thanks so much for sharing your amazing knowledge, Rick!
I had no idea of the complexity of the gear trains etc in watches until I watched you videos, you sir are very talented and skilled.
Thank you very much, Tony! There are a lot parts indeed :)
I’m always impress to see watchmaker working on chronograph !! Perfect job !
Lots of watch to do and repair and I will be better like that ! 🙂
Thanks a lot Alain!! More to come in the new year :)
I purchased a 1911 not too long ago, and this is my first glance at the movement :)
It's a nice watch!👍
Love your sense of humor.
😊👍
That is a pretty fiddly keyless works. Fabulous service and conversation, Stian, as always. It always amazes me how these movement companies keep showing up in many different brands. I look forward to the 6139 service.
Yep, they overthought that one a bit... tiny wheels and parts moving back and forth very frequently is not such a good idea for longevity :)
I have a soft spot for Ebel, was in the Gulf for sometime and saw some very beautiful ones. And Zenith of course is that, zenith.
Ebel is a bit underrated indeed, although I'm not crazy about their recent direction. And yes, Zenith is just that!
That's a beautiful watch. Thanks for the share and the history lesson. It's a pleaseure to watch you do your thing. Blessings.
Great to hear that you had a wonderful Christmas and that the account manager didn't raise any concerns about her missing Q Tips and Tins of Sardines from the pantry cub board. Great work as always and continue to enjoy your festive season. Looking forward to more downloads in 2022. Regards from New Zealand.
🤣 No trouble in paradise! Have a merry Christmas and a happy new year and more to come in the new year :)
Excellent work Stian, thank you for what yo do for us on this channel! Looking forward already for your next project! All the best wishes for you and your family! Merry Christmas and Happy New Year! Dan
Thanks a lot Dan, that's very nice to hear :) A Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year to you and yours also!
Very smart looking watch.
I once read that Ebel was bought by Porsche Design for their in-house movements when IWC stopped supplying them.
Hello, thanks for watching! I'm not aware of that, but Ebel indeed used to have a strong in-house movement capability and the Movado group intended them to be the movement provider for the group. Exactly when that fell apart I'm not sure of, but Movado has made a few odd decisions that last few years.
Thank you, Stian, for sharing another fabulous movement with us. I hope you and the rest of the VWS family have a safe and enjoyable New Year.
Thanks so much Bullnose and a merry Christmas and happy new year to you also 🎄🎊🎅
After 11 hrs of flight , I notice your new video. It is very relaxing to watch. How complicate is this “complication” . Very elegant watch.
Thanks, that's very nice to hear! It's a beautiful watch for sure though obviously not everyone's cup of tea.
As far as complications go, this one is relatively traditional for a three register chronograph, so not too crazy :)
I love the idea of a dress chronograph - to time the intervals between Martinis.
😂
THIS.
When I restored my grandfather's Vienna Regulator pendulum clock (the first clock I ever fixed), I found a few broken parts such as the chime flirt had been bodged by my grandad (in the case of the chime flirt, he had soldered on part of the shaft of a jeweller's screwdriver). Eventually, I was able to source genuine replacements, from the same manufacturer (Gebruder Resch) and from about the same period (mid-1880s). So I don't regard it as a chimera, a mixture of old and new parts, but a sympathetic restoration.
Sounds like a loving restoration! And that's the most important thing :)
@@VintageWatchServicesYes indeed, and I find the tick and the chime most comforting. I remember when I’d cleaned all the parts in my baby ultrasonic cleaner, straightened iffy pivots, reassembled and oiled the movement, and finally re-hung the weights. It wouldn’t run, although the movement worked fluently. So I started to try to put it in beat, one tiny turn at a time. Finally, at 03:00, I heard, “tick-tock… tick-tock”, and I knew then I was on the right track. I got it fully in beat the next day, and I even managed to get it so the accrued timekeeping error was largely erased by winding the clock (no remontoire here!) It’s a beautifully decorative case, and I’ve sanded it, re-stained it and waxed it so it practically glows. I’m never going to sell it.
@@Dragonblaster1 That's a very nice story and you should absolutely keep it :) It'll forever be an item of pride!
Outstanding work as usual informative with a subtle touch of humour
Thanks so much Abigail! More to come in the new year :)
I like the attention you pay to the details. I think a watch like this deserves a lot of attention. Good health and success in the new year 👍👏🇧🇬
Thanks so much Bojidar and to you also!
Great story of the guy who hid the drawings, machines etc in the wall, well done
Thanks a lot George :) It's a great little piece of watch history!
Have a Zenith Rainbow Flyback ( el Primero 405 ) with transparent caseback , nicely finished. Also have Rainbow, de luca and Chronomaster COSC - Chronometer 18 kt, all with el Primero 400 . Guess that Chronomaster - movement is also nicely decorated but never looked inside.
Thanks for watching Heiko and that's quite the collection you have then! The El Primero is one of the very finest movements ever made and those watches of yours will only grow in value :)
Love your videos ..and love this watch..and real 'looker'. Great movement and a lovely face. Looks super with that strap too. Well done..👍
Love it! All new information about Ebel and El Primero - many thanks. Terrific videography.
Great to hear, Milan, thanks ! More to come in the new year :)
Interesting watch Stian. Thanks for the video, all your hard work and witty comments over the last year. Merry Christmas, Howard
Thanks a lot Howard! A merry Christmas and happy new year to you also :) 🎊🎅🎉
Watching these videos is rapidly turning into an addiction!!! Seeing them torn apart and put back together is like watching a tennis match.... does he win, or does he go down to defeat!! Great narration surely helps and you do a great job there too!!!
Thanks a lot Dave, that's great to hear :) They're fascinating creations, these little mechanical machines we call watches 😁
Thank you for another interesting video. What a technical machine! The El Primero really does have an incredible array of parts. I was also impressed with the complexity of both sides of the watch, the keyless works side as well as the train/chronometer side.
Thanks a lot Doug! It's a wonderful watch and movement and at some point every collector should have one :)
Have a merry Christmas and a happy new year! 🎊🎅✨
Wow. This is fascinating
Stian I had mentioned a few weeks ago I bought a pair of curved brass watchmakers tweezers I just got them today 1\13/22 mailed to me from England over the pond here to New York Long Island to be exact. I find they’re easier on the wrist ✨ I admire your watch repair skills. We’re losing too many mechanical minded logical people. ✨✌🏻😎 ☕️
Thanks a lot for that! I do see quite a few young watchmakers coming up, so hopefully there is a backstop :)
Another great video with commentary! Also, would love to have a watch with an El Primero movement. Very nice looking movement.
Getting a Movado or MVMT would be akin to getting a lump of coal in your stocking!
My view anyway.
Merry Christmas!
Cheers!
Hehe, I quite agree with you on a MVMT being a lump of coal, just a bit less useful 😂
A merry Christmas and happy new year to you also! 🎄🎊🎁🎉
I have one that needs servicing to fix the chrono function. Can you get the single part I need that broke?
To be honest, I'm not fan of golden cases or bezels. But the movement is awesome.... Very nice work on such a complicated movement, and great video as always. Thank you again for sharing another master class. Happy new year!!
Thanks a lot for that! The case and dial are not everyone's styling for sure but within its context it's very well executed.
More to come in the new year! 🎉🎊😊
Lesson learned! His boss at work didn't know what he was doing. Save those specs/designs/molds/etcétera... History awaits you!
P.S.
I completely agree with you about hiding such a movement. Bad call.
Yep, that movement is way too beautiful to hide...
Fantastic movement and service.
I think I spotted some crocodile tears as the strap whimpered, " pardon me. Could I have a little attention too, please?".
Thanks a lot, Peter! 😂
Another excellent, informative and entertaining video!! I look forward to every new video, thanks again!!
Thanks a lot, Joshua, that's really great to hear :) More to come in the new year!
Excellent video!
Question: does anyone know if the Ebel 8137241 has the same internals/movement as the 8134901?
I have been trying to find the all gold version of the 8134901 with little luck, however the 8137241 looks a lot like the 8134901 with a different dial.
As I have the dial for the 8134901, I wonder if I buy the 8137241, can I put the 8134901 dial on it?
The El Primero Chronomaster is an awesome watch I know. But the high beatrate does wear out parts faster unfortunately. The 36,000 VPH is awesome to watch go in person. I had been trying to find one for about 2 years and finally got lucky a week ago.
Thanks for watching! It's a bit of a myth that the 36000vph beat rate wears out watches, given that it's really only the balance and the pallet fork that rotate a bit faster than in 28800vph watches. The relatively few 36000vph watches around is more likely down to the fact that very few people have their watches serviced as often as they should anyway, and then there's a chance of bad publicity for the makers if something goes wrong 😉
I love ebel. I have a diver with the cal 8810 lemania, good movement too
Very nice! It's a bit of an underrated brand indeed.
Thanks Stian, another great video. Some useful tips here for when I service my first chrono. Merry Christmas.
Thanks a lot Boyd, and a merry Christmas and happy new year to you also! 🎊🎅🎉
Gorgeous time piece; "layout has been well thought out".
Thanks a lot John! It's a beautiful piece for sure although the styling isn't everyone's taste 👍
Really enjoyed your video, great quality and great narration, have always liked the Ebel watches.
Thanks a lot Anthony! More to come in the Happy New Year!
Lovely video. not knowing better, would it be a faux pas to have the back replaced with a viewing back?
Thanks! It would make the watch un-original to put on a display back, but it's pretty much a crime that they didn't make one on a movement like this...
@@VintageWatchServices weeeeellll, since it literally pops on and off. no one said a person couldn't have two backs.
Excellent work
A beautiful piece and as usual you did a fantastic job!
Thanks so much 😊
At the height of the Quartz crisis in the late 70s/early 80s the legions of expert mechanical watch technicians in Switzerland and globally must’ve gone through hell when they realised millions of electronic quartz modules were being mass produced cheaply in the Far East, and the traditional watch industry. Ironic that it was Swiss and US microelectronics research pioneers in quartz technology who were welcomed with open arms in Japan when the European watch and consumer electronics industries were very hesitant and refused to buy into the new tech.
It was a crazy time for sure... The Swiss really brought it upon themselves with a strange mix of arrogance and laziness, imo. Pin pallet movements were the real victims of quartz, as they were the cheap alternative currently on the market, and initially quartz watches were extremely expensive. That many Swiss manufacturers didn't see the writing on the wall earlier was a tragedy that could have been avoided.
Hello Stian, third time's acharm (this is the 3rd of your videos that I have watched today). What a beautiful watch! I can see that I'm going to need to practice, practice, practice! Kind regards.
👍
I alway's appreciate your suttle humor. "Sardine Oil" HA!! Another great job and video!! Thank you.
Thanks so much Brett! More to come in the new year :)
Superb work Steun, Merry Christmas and happy New Year 👍👍👍
Thanks a lot Luke! A merry Christmas and happy new year to you also :) 🎄🎊🎉
Seeing these videos Im jealous of your line of work... this is more fun than doing a paper pushing job in a random office.
It sure is 😁
I have a Zenith el primero pilot watch, but the chrono seconds hand when is at 0 (12 o'clock) is a millimiter to the left, is not completely centered when reset, that its driving me crazy... :(
Another excellent video Stian, hope i got your name right, lovely watch with Zenith movement cleaned and oiled your usual high standard thanks for showing us, it's Boxing day here in the UK so happy new year to you and your family hope you're all ok.
Thanks so much Dave and that's perfect spelling :) A happy Christmas and new year to you and yours also! 🎄🎊🎉
Sir wish you and all your family members Happy Christmas and new year.
Thanks so much Mohamed, that's very kind of you :)
The watch really is as good as it looks, i like the lack of angles on the case very nice
Thanks a lot, George! It's a beautiful watch although certainly not everyone's taste :)
Another fine job and Merry Christmas
Thanks a lot David, and a merry Christmas and happy new year to you also! 🎉🎄🎊✨
Gorgeous watch!
Thanks Ben! More to come in the new year :)
In many watch servicing videos I have viewed, no mention is made of cleaning the back of the dial. In some cases the entire watch has been found to be heavily oiled and soiled but never has the watch dial back cleaning been mentioned. I trust this does happen but is not considered to be of interest? I just thought that for completeness a video should at least mention that this aspect has been covered, otherwise the dial would only recontaminate the movement upon refitting.
Hello Robert, if the watch is soaked in oil then the back of the dial should indeed also be cleaned. That is however very rare, and most times you wouldn't need to clean the back of the dial. You always have to take a look at it to be sure of course :)
Great movement, interesting and informative video. Best wishes for 2022.
Thanks so much Clive and to you also! 🎊🎉🎅
If you realllly wanted to, you could fashion a custom back cover with a display crystal. All it takes is the right tooling, eh?
Very informative and enjoyable video. Thank you for sharing.
Thanks for watching, Steve!
Yes I'm a watch nerd, How much for the El Primero? Outstanding video.
Hello Larry, if you're seriously interested in the El Primero you can mail me at stian@vintagewatchservices.eu :)
Beautiful watch.
Thanks a lot!
Nice video, thanks Stian. Hope you had a great Christmas, wishing you a great 2022. I’m getting withdrawal symptoms, can’t wait for the next video! Will you do any focusing on fixing specific issues or using specific tools?
Thanks Boyd! There is one coming up on Saturday about radium 👍
@@VintageWatchServices thanks Stian! Can you read minds, I was only thinking today it would be great to see a professional video on radium, since I saw a hobbiests view today (mike at my retro watches), so you are a genius!
I have the same watch with two tone bracelet and it’s one of my favorite chronographs. Love you channel! Are u based in Switzerland 🇨🇭?
Yes I am!
Another Great episode!
Thanks so much! More to come in the new year :)
Can I ask what's the base charge to service the 400 movement?? Assuming nothing needs to be replaced.
Hello, the base cost is CHF 520.
Amazing job my friend. I have a question, as a new El Primero owner I've noticed something that I haven't heard on other watches - there is an audible faint click when the rotor spins 1-2 turns, it seems that it's the same click that is heard when you wind the watch manually very slowly. I assume this is normal operation of this movement? I'm wondering because on other automatics all I could hear is the rotor wooshing away, no clicking whatsoever (even when winding them via the crown). Would appreciate your input on this!
Hello, thanks for watching! That is indeed most likely the sound you hear, but it should take a bit more than 1-2 rotations. And when winding with the crown you should be able to hear the clicking if you put the watch to your ear.
@@VintageWatchServices Thank you for your answer! Yes I can indeed hear the clicking when winding the watch with the crown, and at a certain point every 12 clicks or so I hear a double click - I assume that's the clutch mechanism preventing overwinding? You were right, I guess it is a bit more than 2 rotations of the rotor. The watch is titanium so maybe that increases the volume of the click a bit. I was suprised as I thought the automatic winding works in some different way but it is in fact connected to the click too.
@@PoltergeistWorks The automatic winding indeed most often works through the ratchet (or crown wheel) and thereby the click. This is since there otherwise would have to be a separate click or similar to stop the barrel from unwinding when the automatic winding is active. Less complexity is generally better :)
@@VintageWatchServices True. Then it has to be that same sound of the ratchet as I really don't even have to put the watch to my ear to hear it when I wind it with the crown, same as when it's wound by the rotor. I was a bit worried for a moment as most of my watches are manual wind and the only other automatic is an Aquis Cal. 400, this one has more of a constant buzz or micro clicks when the rotor spins - no distinctive click when winding from the crown either...
Hello, nice video and a Happy beautiful and healthy new year! 10x
Thanks Tiberiu, and to you also!
Diese Uhr ist ja ein Wunderwerk der Technik.
Danke fürs zuschauen! Ja, es ist ein wunderbares Uhrwerk und eine feine Uhr :)
I hope Santa's made all your dreams came true! Another great restoration! Thank you for sharing your great professionalism with us, and btw, all the comments you make on the work, are great to hear! Best wishes for a stunning 2022! Another question: is it true that the only pallet of the anchor that should be lubricated is the exit one? Thank you!
Hello Fabrizio, thanks so much and best wishes in 2022 for you also!
You typically lubricate only one pallet stone indeed and most would do the exit stone. It doesn't have to be, though, and some also lubricate both stones before installing the pallet fork. There are a lot of ways to do things in watchmaking 😉
@@VintageWatchServices Thank you! Also a great discovery too: an El primero movement inside an Ebel chrono!
My mentor Sandy, is an awesome watchmaker. She is the person that tought me the discipline and best practices in watchmaking. I'm a much better troubleshooter and technician because of her lessons and influence.
Thanks for the chill session Boss. You do good work.🫡🤝
Thanks for sharing!
If ever there was a watch brand deserving of rapprochement, it is Ebel. Founded in 1911 in La Chaux-De-Fonds, Switzerland, its canny owners successfully navigated the turbulent seas of the watch market for more than 80 years, until a change of ownership and a change in fashion knocked them off course. Ebel survived the Second World War as one of the suppliers of ATP watches to the British Army. The brand embraced quartz, becoming the supplier of high-end movements to Cartier, among others, and yet its prescient leadership also foresaw the return of mechanical watchmaking, working with Zenith to resurrect the El Primero for their 1982 Sport Classic Chrono line. This watch made Ebel a hit in the 1980s, gracing Sonny Crockett’s wrist in Miami Vice, the rolled-back suit cuffs ensuring plenty of screen time.
Ebel was not complacent. Once Rolex adopted the El Primero for their Daytona, it knew its movement supply was liable to get squeezed. For this reason, it looked to develop its own movement. The brand settled on Calibre 1340, the first automatic movement created by Lemania in 1970. This was another movement in need of resuscitation, as it had been supplanted by the 5100 series, which was cheaper to produce. After the redesign and improvement of a number of elements, this became Ebel Calibre 137.
In the background, other changes were afoot. Ebel was sold to Investcorp, a Bahrainian investment company and while it became stablemates with its movement supplier, Lemania, along with Breguet and Chaumet, a period of stagnation followed. In the wider world, fashions were changing and watches were becoming bigger and bulkier in design. The Investcorp management failed to respond to this and, in 1995, the Ebel 1911, Le Modulor (a reference to the modular nature of the chronograph construction) was launched.
The design was too sleek and too elegant to compete with the likes of Breitling, IWC and Panerai. Ebel’s fortunes faltered and it was sold in 1999 to LVMH. As it already owned Zenith and TAG Heuer, LVMH didn’t need another mechanical sports watch brand and so Ebel was pushed into a quartz ladies’ niche. Four years later, LVMH offloaded Ebel to the Movado group, who had no such qualms about macho watches. Movado took the Ebel 1911 case design, pumped it up to 44.5mm and relaunched it as the BTR (“back to roots”) collection.
Now that case sizes have moved back from the ludicrous to the reasonable, it is worth taking a look at the 1911, Le Modulor. Not housing the El Primero increases the affordability, while reducing servicing costs, and the overall look is the same. The movement is largely the same as the Calibre 582 used by Breguet in its Type XX, so you know you’re getting quality.
Thanks for watching Henk, and for your great and very insightful comment. I felt I was a bit too short in my comments about the brand and they are indeed chugging along nicely. It has been a bit of a journey for them for sure and what seemed to be a really strong resurgence a decade ago has faded quite a bit, no thanks to Movado group. Let's see how they fare over the next decade 👍
@@VintageWatchServices The last thing I want to do is criticize your work. I might lead to you stop making these beautiful videos. My point is that at the time this movement was manufactured I believe EBEL was not only the owner but also the producer.
The ‘biggest’ omission in your video was of course that the entire crew of Miami Vice wore these watches with Sonny Crockett the full gold one. But maybe I’m just old enough to have seen Miami Vice and you are still very young 😊
Can a clear back be put on watches like this ? I do a lot of precision machining and always wondered if a standard back could be hollowed out and a sapphire disk fitted into the ring remaining. Maybe this process could be done by buying a substitute back so you can put the watch back to the original if you want. Not just on this watch in particular but on others that have stunning mechanicals inside that cant's be seen. Many times when you "Pop" the back of a time piece it is the most exciting part.....seeing those beautifully machined and hand-crafted parts. Peace and Happy New Year......Hope it's better than 2021
Hello, thanks for watching! It's difficult to do so with an existing case back given the relatively thin metal in it, but it's not too difficult to make a new display case backs for such watches. You will find such on eBay for some of the more common watches like seiko GS/KS56
i think its 3600 not 36000 really cool to see a Zenith watch on the table Happy New Year.
Thanks for watching! If it says 3600 somewhere that would indeed be a very slow tick tock 😁 I'll check the text and see if I see it
I've always been a fan of Roman numerals on time pieces, very classic and elegant. One thing that drives me crazy is when IIII is used to indicate 4 rather than the subtractive IV. Apparently this is acceptable usage, it appears on most Roman numeral time pieces, even antique ones, so it isn't a new trend either. That being said, we don't use VIIII to indicate 9, we use IX. There _is_ a right way to do things, and if you're not doing it the right way, you're doing it wrong.
I have noticed Omega does this on their Devilles. One of the most remarkable Danish kings was Christian IV - definitely not Christian IIII(!)
Hello Caledon, thanks for watching! It is indeed commonplace that the number 4 in Roman numerals on watch dials is miswritten as IIII rather than the correct IV. It's not for a lack of knowledge, however, it's a conscious choice to make the dial seem more balanced. Most buyers aren't aware of the proper rules for using Roman numerals, so in a cynical way it makes perfect sense... just not for purists :)
It's almost an intentional misuse, just to see if you're actually paying attention. It gives the face an extra flare, a classy orneriness.
nice swiss watch, i like u say hello boy and girl thank you for upload this service.. like rolex movement nice jod bro
Thanks a lot!
good afternoon i have an el primero a386 mk3 1971 that i havent wear it for ages , i want to take it for a service and i am afraid how much will it cost....
Hello Floris, if you send me a mail at stian@vintagewatchservices.eu with some photos and information about the watch, I can let you know
Thank you for the great video, now I understand much better how a chronograph works.
I recently started working on watches myself as a hobby. I live in Switzerland (you said in an older video you did too), do you have any recommendations for good online shops?
Most have terrible websites where it's no fun to order or have very long delivery times.
Best regards and thanks for the great work
That's very nice to hear :) The Swiss are indeed living in the past century when it comes to websites... I use Horotec and Bergeon for most things but have to look at their PDF or paper catalogs sometimes. Quite incredible in 2022...
Can I ask you something? Are you from Norway? You have a very Norwegian way to pronounce your name and a typical Scandinavian accent 🙃
Nice video btw! I regularly watch your uploads
Thanks Tom! Yes, I'm indeed Norwegian :)
@@VintageWatchServices Det er kult 😁 rimelig populær kanal du har fått igang her.
Ser ut som den har en stødig vekst også. Gratulerer!
Hilsen Drammenser'n 😊👍
Great video once again, thank you. have searched all over for a similar pair of brass tweezers but can't find anywhere, could you let me know where you found them? Happy Christmas and wishing you a great new year.
Thanks and happy Christmas to you also, Neil! My tweezers are from Regine Horology and I used to buy them from beco-technic.com, but now that I'm in Switzerland I buy directly from the manufacturer. Horotec have similar ones, only with bent tips instead on curved.
Wonderful! My friend has this same watch and she loves wearing it. One question I have is that in the instruction manual it warns the when setting the hour and minutes Hands they must not be turned backwards as it may damage the movement. Could you explain why this is and what it would damage please? Happy new year as well!
Hello Ian, I know Zenith says that in their EP manuals, but it is most likely a relic from the old days. Nowadays basically all movements have built in features which ensure that a watch will not get damaged by a simple thing like this. It is something that used to apply to date/calendar watches, where the automatic switch-over could be damaged if turning the hands backwards in the period it was engaged (typically from around 9pm to 2am). It's still good practice to always turn the hands clock-wise and always recommended, but as a manufacturer one cannot rely on all customers following good practice, so they made it idiot-proof :)
Merry Christmas, Stian! Holiday greetings and best wishes to you and your family!
The Ebel that you worked on is a very handsome piece. One question: how do you know that the bezel is made of gold? Is it marked or does the technical communication tell you that?
Thanks so much Frank, and a merry Christmas and happy new year to you also 🎄🎉🎅
This model comes with a gold bezel, but it's probably marked also. I didn't really check since I know the model, voor you could also weigh it.
Season's best to you and your family Stian!
Once again a plethora of knowledge! I had heard of Ebel before, but had no idea that some housed premium calibres. It's really a nice looking watch!
I always wondered about hi beat (36K vph) movements wearing more. Some have said that "modern" lubricants negate any excessive wear but I'm wondering what your professional opinion is.
Hello Randy, thanks so much and the same to you and yours :)
There's very little actual information out there on why some manufacturers went back from 36000 to 28800, and there's similarly little information on whether 36000 leads to more wear. I suspect wear isn't really the issue, more that a 36000 train requires a lighter balance and some more fine engineering than a 28800 train while the benefits aren't that much bigger. Also, the lubricants need to be replaced at least as and probably more frequently than lower beat movements. This is in fact a pretty big issue, given that most watch owners don't service their watches often enough at 5 year intervals. Watches breaking down due to this would potentially lead to publicity issues for the manufacturer. Hence the total case for making a 36000 watch isn't necessarily that attractive. .
@@VintageWatchServices thanks for your thoughtful reply, best wishes to you for the coming year.
Вы отличный специалист! Приятно посмотреть 👍
Thanks so much :)
@VintageWatchServices Прежде чем приступать к сложному ремонту механизмов, который случается нечасто, я смотрю подобные видео, чтобы освежить память и найти вас. на этот раз это были Zenith El Primero 4061 с кремниевым спусковым механизмом. Все прошло отлично! Спасибо!
Wow, very cool!
I think he’s exited about the next watchmaker conference with more gals involved. How to go without the wife tho 😱
Love to know what that service would have cost and if the el Primero movt is much more complicated to work on than other chronographs from that era???
Best for the New Year
🌞
Thanks for watching, Eddie! Would be nice with some more girls for sure 😉
We would charge about 400 CHF for a three register chronograph service, and that's only for the work. And parts would be extra. That's even a pretty good price :) So it can indeed be pretty costly for such watches.
This movement isn't particularly complicated, no. It's a relatively traditional column wheel chronograph with a couple of unusual things thrown in.
A merry Christmas and happy new year to you also! 🎊🎉✨
Nice as usually ;) But I would like to polish that gold bezel little bit ;)
Thanks! There'll be a full out video coming soon where everything gets polished 😉
until then, ........ta ta. Last episode the gap was a little shorter. Hope you and family are having a great holiday season.
Thanks for watching Richard, and the same to you! 🎄🎊✨
Great…but is the grease you put onto the pallets fork, good ALSO for the 5 Hz frequency, as per the El Primero movement (36,000 bit per hour)?
Hello Ricky, thanks for watching! Yes, moebius 9415 is specifically intended for high beat movements, 28800 and higher. Nowadays a lot of people use it for any beat rate movement, though.
@@VintageWatchServices thanks indeed Maestro!
Fabulous watch very good video,could you please tell me what make are your brass tweezers
Many thanks Pete
Thanks a lot Pete! My tweezers are from Regine Horology and I used to buy them from beco-technic.com, but now that I'm in Switzerland I buy directly from the manufacturer. Horotec have similar ones only with bent tips instead of curved ones.
Fab movement but I would not want such a 'flashy' case if you paid me to wear it! Happy christmas!
Thanks Keith and to you also! The case and dial are certainly not everyone's taste but for what it is, it looks great :)
@@VintageWatchServices I feel guilty now - my comment was worthy of Ebeneezer Scrooge from Dickens 'A Christmas Carol'!
@@keithmatthews1673 😂 No worries, it's not everyone's cup of tea
I wear my 1911 tekton titanium chronograph