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How does the 35 Whelen Compare to the .375 H&H and 30-06?
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- Опубликовано: 28 май 2021
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Who is Ron Spomer
For 44 years I’ve had the good fortune to photograph and write about my passion - the outdoor life. Wild creatures and wild places have always stirred me - from the first flushing pheasant that frightened me out of my socks in grandpa’s cornfield to the last whitetail that dismissed me with a wag of its tail. In my attempts to connect with this natural wonder, to become an integral part of our ecosystem and capture a bit of its mystery, I’ve photographed, hiked, hunted, birded, and fished across much of this planet. I've seen the beauty that everyone should see, survived adventures that everyone should experience. I may not have climbed the highest mountains, canoed the wildest rivers, caught the largest fish or shot the biggest bucks, but I’ve tried. Perhaps you have, too. And that’s the essential thing. Being out there, an active participant in our outdoor world.
All loading, handloading, gunsmithing, shooting and associated activities and demonstrations depicted in our videos are conducted by trained, certified, professional gun handlers, instructors, and shooters for instructional and entertainment purposes only with emphasis on safety and responsible gun handling. Always check at least 3 industry handloading manuals for handloading data, 2 or 3 online ballistic calculators for ballistic data. Do not attempt to duplicate, mimic, or replicate anything you see in our videos. Firearms, ammunition, and constituent parts can be extremely dangerous if not used safely.
Produced by: @red11media
Disclaimer
All loading, handloading, gunsmithing, shooting and associated activities and demonstrations depicted in our videos are conducted by trained, certified, professional gun handlers, instructors, and shooters for instructional and entertainment purposes only with emphasis on safety and responsible gun handling. Always check at least 3 industry handloading manuals for handloading data, 2 or 3 online ballistic calculators for ballistic data. Do not modify any cartridge or firearm beyond what the manufacturer recommends. Do not attempt to duplicate, mimic, or replicate anything you see in our videos. Firearms, ammunition, and constituent parts can be extremely dangerous if not used safely.
My USAF career took me all over Alaska and the Aleutians . My initial purchase was a 44 mag SW 29 and a old side by side Knickerbocker 12 gauge that I got second hand for general use while fishing . It was the firearms I observed the old hands carrying . I watch, listen and learn. First encounter i had with a bad bear was at a neighbors house and it was hell bent on getting in the house . As soon as it busted down the door he hit it with a 250gr Whelen and it dropped . I was at the gun shop the next day after and got an old Sporterized 98 Mauser in 35 Whelen ...... afterwards a bunch of my hunting & fishing buddies praised the caliber yet they were hard to find. I observed one on the rack and dozens of used 375 H&H's on the rack . I still have that 35 Whelen today, taken moose, elk , mule deer, black bear. I have many hunting calibers but that initial incident with the pissed off grizzly bear and the 35 Whelen set the standard caliber in the Rockies, Canada and Alaska for the rest of my life thus far for ME ...... Love that caliber. Listened and learned and experienced from others. Great video Ron Spomer .....
Thank you for having down to earth, friendly, truthful, informative talks. More people ruin things with their unfriendlyness, BS, and attitude.
Thanks fed up. I try to keep it real and treat others with respect.
Amen Ron keep up the great work, we appreciate it a lot.
Ron I could hang with you all day and never get bored...love to visit your neck of the woods
Thanks arborist. Be careful what you wish for!
“The poor man’s magnum,” as it was endearingly referred to.
As a former hand-loader for the 35 Whelen. Early 1970's to the 1980's. The Whelen was originally designed via a "German Mauser Action," and a 35 caliber barrel. That's what I had, German markings on the action. Intended, and was used, to hunt the African big 5. My Speer Manual for reloading Ammunition No.#: 8, pg. 307 220 Gr. Flat Nose, Using 60.0 grains 4895 powder, Muzzle Vel. Listed @ 2675. Using 58.0 grains 4895 powder, Muzzle Vel. Listed @ 2607. Using 56.0 grains 4895 powder, Muzzle Vel. Listed @ 2534..
In my "New Seventh Edition," Handloader's Digest, Edited by John T. Amber, Editor of GUN DIGEST, page 120. 35 Whelen
The 35 Whelen has an interesting history. It was designed by James Howe, of Griffin and Howe, partially in response to letters from Leslie Simpson and Stewart Edward White, suggesting that a good all-round rifle for African use would be one of 333 to 350 caliber, with a bullet of 250-300 grains (ideally 275) at 2500 fps. Both men (along with Roy Chapman Andrews and the Rev. Dr. Harry Cadwell, who were active in Asia,) perhaps the finest big game shots our country has produced, were aware of the outstanding performance of the 318 Westley-Richards with a 250-grain bullet, the 333 Jeffrey with a 300-grain bullet and the 350 Rigby with a 310-grain bullet on thin skinned dangerous and non-dangerous game in Africa. It is of passing interest that the bullet for the old British 333 Jeffery is much like the 300-grain copper tube bullet which Winchester introduced for the 338 Magnum.
The 35 Whelen was the first of three efforts by Griffin and Howe to produce a cartridge that would meet this ideal. All were in 35 caliber. The 35 Whelen is simply the 30-06 necked up 35 caliber, and it's about as easy to form from '06 as is the 270. Later, an "improved" version of the 35 Whelen, with venturi shoulders like Weatherby cartridges, was made up, but it never caught on. The 35 Whelen, while never offered as a factory round (although some gunsmiths used to sell properly formed brass for it) has racked up a tremendous record all over the world, rivaling the 375 Holland & Holland in its effectiveness. It was originally designed, partially, as a substitute for the 375 H&H, since rifles for it could be made up using inexpensive 30-06 actions rather than costly magnum-length Mauser actions. it has killed, with aplomb and efficiency, all of the trophy animals in the world, with the possible exception of the "Big Three" (elephant, rhinoceros, and cape buffalo.) It can be loaded down to 35 Remington speeds for light {Sic} recoil and pot-shooting, or loaded up to provide terrific stopping power --- more than should be needed by a competent rifleman facing American big game. Although not legal in certain parts of Africa for dangerous game (some countries require that rifles of at least 375 or 400 caliber be used,) solid nose bullets are available so that, in a pinch, it probably would serve. It is easy to rebarrel an action to this cartridge --- it does not even require opening up the bolt face or free-boring; the rimless brass for it, as with the 358, is cheaper and easier to manufacture than the belted brass necessary for the 350 Remington, 35 Griffin and Howe (or Holland and Holland, as it is sometimes known) and 358 Norma Magnum. There is still a great future awaiting the 35 Whelen and, now that the 22-250 has been legitimized, perhaps we can hope that the 35 Whelen will meet with the same good fortune.
I believe that the 35 Whelen was offered by Remington in the classic series, 7600 Gamemaster also the 750 series. Ruger also chambered for this cartridge, the 77 series, I believe.. CVA is right now chambering their single shot rifle for the 35 Whelen.
@@thomasflickinger1949 I bought a CVA .35 Whelen and had to send it back because the head space was incorrect. They did not have another one to replace it so I ended up with another caliber. I'm fine with the rifle I got from them but it wasn't what I wanted. I ended up buying a beautiful Lipsey's Ruger #1 in .35 Whelen. I doubt I'll ever buy another CVA.
.35 Whelen and 9.3x62mm built for similar goals/different continents. Big bore, standard action for big game in either North America or Africa.
Nice distinction! The Whelen being outstanding for North America, while the 9.3x62 is superb for Africa. 👍
My .35 Whelen is my elk rifle. It's all I use it for. I happen to like the 225 Grn Nosler Partion. I have taken 9 elk with it, my longest shot at 343 lasered. I think it's a great cartridge. If I ever get the chance to hunt Alaska, It's definitely going with me.
I have all three, the 35 Whelen is a damn fine cartridge. 225 gr Partition is my favorite loaded in it.
I haven’t used the partition yet they are always sold out. I use the accubonds on deer and it hits like a hammer.
I've have some experience with the 35 caliber and it gets the job done on any thing in North America. I've used my 375 H&H but average hunting the 35 kills just as dead without the extra recoil or weight. I'm just getting old and the air is thin. I've never had to track a animal hit with my 35. If its not broke why fix it. Just a old farts opinion.
I find the older one gets, less is more. The 35 Whelen makes a hell of a lot of sense, especially with a 1:12” twist.
I've never had to track any animal after a shot. Not ever.
I've taken African plains game and even cape buffalo with my 9.3x62. That was one shot, and a stone dead buff within 40yds. 👍
Finally, been waiting for this- 338-06 next please!
@buszero1 I think you're my doppelganger. Sound exactly like me😅
Yes 338-06 falls short of 338 win mag by very little in my Hornaday manual. An Elmer Keith original. The 35 Whelen is still a great cartridge as is anything based on the 3006
The only reason I don't have a 338-06 is because it is still a wildcat.
@@russellkeeling9712 Pretty sure 338-06 was legitimized by A-Square and approved by SAAMI in the late 90s. Weatherby even made factory rifles in the caliber for a while. So it technically not a wildcat
@@urmominabox87it may as well be, you can’t find any factory ammo anywhere.
Remington 760 and 7600 pumps in 35 Whelen are fantastic guns. I have the older 760 and it’s been great for elk and moose and even whitetail in northern Saskatchewan. Got mine of a family friend that harvested many game animals before it came to me. Sometimes ammo is hard to find. It’s not so pretty anymore but has filled freezers for many seasons.
If it fills the freezer, it's beautiful. Looks aren't everything.
These are awesome rifles that are sadly way too hard to find. I hope Remington gets sorted out after this buyout and rises like a Phoenix with a 7600 carbine stainless synthetic in 35 Whelen. The kinda rifle you could walk to hell and back with.
@@ssfd739 I think a reproduction Garand in stainless with a synthetic stock, chambered in .35 Whelan would be another candidate, but it undoubtedly would be a little pricey.
@@ssfd739 the 35 whelen 7600 carbine was al over the market for $619 for the last couple years. Started out as a limited run and then just kept pumping them out. Mine would not feed and accuracy was poor. It went back to Remington for both issues. It still jams non stop and has poor accuracy. Your not missing anything by not picking one up. They are not the whelen pumps produced around 88’.
@@tripplebeards3427 I have a 1952 Remington 760 in 35 whelen (30-06 rebore to 358) and its my most accurate rifle I own. Your issue is Remington - not the 35 Whelen. They over extended before they went bankrupt and it showed in the quality control. I had a 2013 Marlin - 'Remlin' in 35 Remington and it kept breaking barrel band screws so it went back to Remington. They sent it back with a new barrel and then it was NEVER right. After the 5th time back for warranty issues, they sent me back a new rifle (2015) and it seems to have been gone through before I got it as its flawless and feeds nearly every bullet I've tried - 105gr-265gr...very accurate too. Remington screwed up alot in that period... hopefully Marlin - now under Ruger will be back to its glory. Hoping the same for Remington
In some southern states, the .35 Whelen is the round of choice during what is called "primitive weapon" season for deer. In Mississippi and Louisiana, a primitive weapon is defined as any single shot breech loader .35 caliber or greater. While many use a .45/70 during this season, others (myself included) prefer the flatter shooting .35 Whelen. We are hunting whitetail deer, so the 200 gr is plenty of power in a bullet. I use a CVA rifle and love to hunt with it.
Just a quick question. Is your CVA a break down version. And if so is the barell interchangeable.
@@davidheath2427 I think the answer is yes and yes. The fore grip removes with the pulling of a lever, allowing the barrel to easily rotate off. Conceivably, any other CVA centerfire barrel could be put in its place.
@@paulcrow4827 thank you for your reply
Got the same setup for the same reason.
" Primitive " 🤣🤣🤣 yeah, right. But I'm not complaining.😁
@@sadwingsraging3044 100% I don't make the rules, just follow them. Who am I to argue with the government?
Ron, you're an amazing ambassador for the sport, and such a great presenter! Love these videos!
The “soft shove” recoil theory is just a coping mechanism that us magnum shooters say to convince ourselves that our rifles aren’t about to destroy us 😂
I believe when evaluated as a bell curve on a timing chart, the .375 H&H hits a higher recoil velocity than a .30-06 or a .338 WM, but it does it over a longer period of time, and therefore gives one the feeling of a shove, rather than a kick. I've shot many .338 WM rounds and many .375 H&H rounds from identical rifles and can assure you I would choose the felt recoil of the .375 H&H every time.
Thats funny!
I shoot a lot of harder recoiling guns. I prefer to shoot .45-70 (even hot loads) more than I do 3” or 3.5” magnum turkey loads from my 12ga. The .45-70 feels like it gently pushed through me whereas the magnum turkey loads feel like I’m getting slugged by Mike Tyson.
@@vinpribek3903 So you're saying the 375 takes longer to reach its top recoil velocity, thus its actual recoil energy is spread out more gradually over time? Hmmm. When I see calculated recoil velocity numbers I assume they reflect the velocity when the bullet leaves the muzzle since this is when it (bullet) is at its top velocity. Would not the rifle, then, be recoiling at its top velocity?
That's the same "stuff" they say about the 9.3x62 but I'd rather shoot it than my 300 WM! Cast bullets are your friend for general practice - I use a 250gr in my 9.3x62
Col.Whelen's famous line: "Only accurate rifles are interesting."
He also said, "The .30-'06 is never a mistake."
He would not find my Mini 14 interesting.
Col. Townsend Whelen also said: "The 30/06 is never a mistake!" 😊👍
@@idleonlooker1078 I think another comment here already beat you to this quote.
@@georgewhitworth9742 Maybe, but who says it's a disadvantage to mention it now and again, huh? 👍
.35 Whelen is probably one of the best Black Bear rounds availible and for me I would use it out West on Grizly and Brown Bear....
Not going to lie. It is certainly intriguing to me. I am mostly a one hunting rifle guy, buy if I go up to Alberta, BC or Alaska, I will want more than my .270 I think. I always thought I'd go for a .375 H&H or a .338 Lapua. .35 Whelen might deserve more of a look from me.
@@F14Goose37 Your .270 Win is plenty for pretty much anything in Alberta, within reasonable ranges. I live in Alberta, and I've killed countless WT deer, moose and elk with it. If you're proficient with your .270 Win, you would be very happy with it here, unless you're shooting at extended ranges.
I do hunt elk on the open prairie in Southern Alberta, where most shots are 500 yards, or a little longer. There, I use a 300 RUM, but for everything else, it's the .270 Win for me!
@@ABmacs I shoot a 140gr Berger VLD load in my .270, and I am pretty confident that I could take any North American game with it at reasonable ranges. The longest I have shot an animal was 539 on a coues deer, and that is honestly about as far as I care to shoot at an animal anymore (steel is a different story, but I still spend exponentially more time behind a bow than I do behind my rifle). Much longer than that, and bullet flight time is a serious consideration, and downrange energy starts coming in to play. I have zero experience with moose or black bear, or guided hunts up north for that matter. I have heard that a lot of guides would prefer you carried more rifle than a .270 though. I thought something with decent 200-300 yd performance that can anchor a moose or a grizzly on an "oh shit" less than ideal shot placement sounded like a good idea.
@@F14Goose37 The bullet face of the .35 cals is what makes the difference. It's in that sweet spot between 30 cal and 40 cal rounds. It's kinda the best of both worlds type round. The larger bullet face gives it tons of shock effect but it being below 40 cal also gives it a better penetration value. The energy dump at target is devastaing.
@@F14Goose37 I think it's a great option, especially in the Remington 7600. It has a lot of energy and the pump offers much faster follow up shots than a bolt action.
So, I've got a 35 Whelen and a 30-06. Had a 7mm Rem Mag but there was something wrong with that rifle. Anyway, I've had the 35 Whelen for about 8yrs now. My longest successful shot ever was made with that 35 and was somewhere between 250 and 300yds on a mule deer facing me here in Wyoming. That 180gr Barnes Vortex entered the deer's chest and came out the deer's hip. I've yet to take an elk or any other large game with it but, I have no doubt it will do the job.
Another interesting comparison would be the 35 Whelen and the 338 Win Mag.
The 338 Win for sure.
@@falba1492 As an old former guide and packer, I hate the 338 WM. Only had one hunter who showed up with one who could actually shoot it well. All the rest, and a lot showed up at elk camp with a brand new 338, flinched on every shot. In the hands of someone who is a cool shot that has practised with it and can handle the recoil, I am sure it is a great cartridge. But my experience with the general run of hunters is that a 30-06 or less, is all they can shoot accurately.
@@mikewyd53 - Your observation doesn’t surprise me one bit. Most of my friends are terrified of my 338 Win, and much prefer the ever popular 6.5 CR, or a 7mm-08. They can’t handle the recoil. But by that assumption, no one should shoot a magnum cartridge. I love the energy my 338 WinMag brings to bear, and could shoot well below 1 MOA from day one (5 shot groups). I feel the same way about guys driving Ferrari’s in my city, but it’s the drivers not the car. Too much power is not always a good thing.
@@mikewyd53 That doesn't make the 338 WM a bad cartridge. It just means that a lot of people are sensitive to recoil. Weak shoulders and low pain tolerance I suppose.
There are way harder hitting rifles that people shoot accurately all the time. Like the 338 Lapua, judging by the ballistics it would have to be harder recoiling than the WM.
I suspect a lot of people buy these big Magnum guns when they are not prepared for how hard it's going to bang their shoulder, it takes some getting used to. The 30.06 is pretty uncomfortable for most people who are not used to heavy recoil. So when these guys get the even bigger ones like the 338 Winchester Magnum they start flinching a lot.
@@mikewyd53 I agree it's hard to practice with a gun that punishes you and you will take that to the field you must be comfortable with your gun that's why I like the .270
I think adding the 8mm Mauser to the comparison between the 35 Whelen and 30-06 would have been interesting.
That would be a 9.3x 62 . Almost identical to the 35 Whelen. You might want to look at the 338- 06 now a standard round too. All very interesting and very comparable. What fun I have just reading about and comparing loading data out of various reloading manuals. At age 72 it about my limit nowadays after 60 years in the hunting fields. Have fun, be safe.
I hunt moose and elk with the Whelen here in Canada. I have reloaded from 200 grain to 250 grain bullets and shot elk and moose with all. I have settled on the 200 gr Barnes ttsx because it gives decent bc coupled with great velocity. The Barnes, being solid copper, are the longest 200 gr bullets in 35 cal. With this bullet, IMR 8208 Xbr gives fantastic velocity yet staying well within book specs. That's 2935 fps out a 24" Rem 700 tube. I find this load/powder combo devastating on elk and moose.
Love my Whelen for Sambar deer in Australia 🙌
I hunt Maine white tails with my Remington 7600, in 35 Whelen. After punching neat little holes through big bucks with a 270 and having them run for ever, I have switched. Last years deer ran only to the freezer ;)
You need better bullets for the .270
@@fruitfarmfords8243 lol The 270 with a 150 grain is overkill for whitetail. Period. That's an elk rifle up to 400 yards.
Sorry 00buck the comment wasn't for you
@@justinhren3431 130gr Hornady SST at just about 3100fps is big medicine for whitetail. Up to 375yds they are still packing explosive expansion, probably much further, but i only have experience to 375.
I think it’s important to remember here that a Maine whitetail hunt and a Georgia whitetail hunt are two totally different subjects. The 7600 in 35 Whelen is a sweet setup, not taking anything away from a .270 bolt with a floated barrel on a bipod. It’s just different hunting. Old Hal knows the truth.
I’ve used the 35 whelen on deer and it is an absolute hammer. Using a federal bonded 225 grain “bear claws” nothing I ever connected with even took an extra step but it also destroyed any meat in about a 6”-8” radius to the entrance wound. My plan is to use it for big black bear when hunting them from the ground because I’m my mind, stopping power like that gives me peace of mind.
The H&H 375 cartridge was once loaded with Cordite propellants like many of the cartridges made for hunting in Africa by British gun makers. The gun of choice at that time was a double rifle. The long case provided added space for the round sticks of cordite propellants. It was first offered in a rimmed case then designed with a belt case for bolt action guns. Holland & Holland designed the first belted cartridge as well.
The 35 Whelen idea made a cost effective non-belted magnum cartridge. The 30-06 case made it easy and simple to convert to 35 Whelen just with a set of reloading dies. It is also quite accurate loaded with hard cast lead bullets; this made it less costly too. There are always lots of used 30-06 rifles around and just changing out the barrel is uncomplicated if you want a beltless magnum class cartridge.
Yes. Cordite for the high temps encountered in Africa, or similar climate. The whole reason for the long case.
Ron... I love your videos ❤️
The 35's are my favorite caliber!
Thanks for sharing this brother 🙂
Glad you like them! Thanks.
35 Remington is my boy.....so a 35 that goes farther I know I would love.
Thank you for your demonstration of proper bolt gun manipulation (@16:58). So tired of seeing 'expert' riflemen trying to work the bolt with their fingertips when the lift should be with a strong smack of the palm which then rolls around to pull the bolt to the rear smartly, then reverses (still with palm) to push it back home and locked. Very nice!
Thanks for pointing this out. Fingertip bolt manipulation always makes me cringe.
Another great episode Ron! Love your perspective on this grand old cartridge. I've had great respect for the .35 Whelen since boyhood.
When, as a much younger guy, I bought a Mod.70 in .300 WinMag. In hindsight, it should have been a .35 Whelen.
Didn't have a practical use for that hotrod living east of The Old Muddy.
I think the Whelen cartridge would have been exciting and fun to handload too.
Another cool/fun cartridge is the .45-70 Gov't, as were many of the original cartridges chambered in rifles such as the Mod.99 Savage, Ruger No.1s, and lever action Winchester and Marlins, etc.
You really do a great job Ron, and I appreciate your fine efforts! There is so much to learn in our wonderful shooting sports!
The simple act of putting these cartridges side by side and pointing to them as you talk adds so much clarity and depth to the discussion. Not sure why more commentators don't use this technique.
I'm from Melbourne Australia and the 35 Whelan is very popular for hound hunting on sambar deer. I own a Remington 7600 carbine in 35 Whelan and it is about perfect for this type of hunting. I also own a 9.3x62 and for stalking sambar this too in my humble opinion is about perfect also. The majority of shots are inside of 100 yards so 200 yards is a long way. The next size animal up from sambar is Elk. I also own a Sako 375 H+H and a Winchester Model 70 in 458 Win Mag. They all have their place but for hunting here down under the 35 Whelan can cover (with the right projectile) anything here from pigs to water buff. Thanks for sharing!
Thank you, thank you, Ron for reviewing one of my FAVORITE cartridges...the 35 Whelen & the 358 Winchester are two of my great joys in life....i grew up a country boy...OMG you made my day when i read the title..i had to watch ASAP...
thanks again keep up the great work, love your channel
Very welcome
What is generally unknown is that the .35 Whelan is probably the most efficient cartridge ever developed as far as energy produced per grain of powder weight.
That’s an excellent point. If you were living on moose or elk in the 30’s, 70’s, or the 2023 inflation crisis; a guy could afford a little practice.
.
338/06 be
338/06 beats the the 35 whelen in all aspects.
@@ssfd739 after the massive increase of inflation over the past 2 years, worst debt and deficits started in 2017, Never in my wildest dreams could I of dreamed the damn democrats would be our nations saviors lol man the world's gone upsidedown at this point.
But you're right, nothing quite like our 35 whelen lever action. Hopefully we will start seeing more new available options, both the ammo and rifles
@@johnserrano9689 We have no saviors in politics. The 1.75 trillion dollar infrastructure bill they want to pass, for this year alone, is 8 years worth of gdp. That is, all the money American citizens and businesses earns for the next 8 years, and that would be without interest. 8 years, for 1 year of "infrastructure" (which is loaded with taxes like a national mileage tax)...They are intentionally bankrupting us.
A BLR in .35 Whelen would be an ideal large and dangerous game combo. Thanks for sharing.
Great Show. 35 and 375 whelen are great options, coming out of a non-mag. case. The 06 family are just hard to beat for the amount of powder/performance/recoil.
Must love the 30-06 😍 Never needed a 375H&H 🤷♂️
Ive been using a 9.3x62 for 5 years now, and inside 300 yards it’s a do-all cartridge
Had a 35 and have a 9.3x62. The 9.3 is definitely more accurate. Could be the rifles of course.
@@barktwid7057 isn't the cartridge. It's the Rifle. Make a good load to the 35, and it is the same results. 😀
Do all for big game? Lol definitely not a varmint round and far from a do-all.
Ron - I have recently found your channel after years (and years, and years) of seeing your name on countless excellent articles in various hunting and reloading mags. I love it! It's great to put a voice to all those words, and you are doing fantastic, interesting videos. Carry on, man!
Nice coverage on a cartridge I've been thinking about for years. Thanks Ron!
Colonel Townsend Whelen... Thank you for a fantastic cartridge. I have one and absolutely love it. It's a beast of a cartridge and it's my black bear cartridge.
Thank you for an interesting video!
A comparison between .35 whelen and 9,3x62 would be interesting. A .366 in a one millimeter shorter case to a .358 in a one millimeter longer case. They sound like they are similar enough!
Case capacity runs 75 to 77 grains H2O depending on brass (PPU vs NORMA) in my factory Savage 9.3x62. A slight edge in handloading. Both have lots of cast boolit designs available.
@@louielindenmayer6653 I don't find that anywhere. As a matter of fact I find the Whelen has about 4 grains more in water capacity.
I have a Ruger M77 in 35 Whelen that I purchased on a lark and it quickly became my favorite rifle. Love the caliber. Your excellent video did it justice. Thank you.
Thank you William.
Another GREAT episode, Ron! I'll be waiting on the episode on the .358 Winchester, another cartridge that is very under-appreciated.
This was an excellent, and informative video. However, I would truly like to see you cover the 338 Federal, and the 338-06 A Square.
When I was shopping for a model 700 in 1990 the salesman tried to sell me a 35 whelen , i had never heard of it at the time. I settled on the .300 win mag. I'm still hunting with it
Been waiting for this! Heck yeah!
Great stuff. Thank you. Appreciate the comparison.
Thank you, Ron! I hope everyone gives it a thumbs up!
Great video! I hope you make another comparing it to the 9.3 X 62. Please do the stats for the 225 grain hot loads from Buffalo Bore or similar for the 35 Whelen and compare it to the 286 grain 9.3.
Working on it!
And add the 9,3x64
Or 9.3/57Mauser
@@CU65LATER that is better suited to compare with the 358 Winchester and the new 350 Legend.
@@fabulousoffroaddesigns5080 Yes true ..Just saying...
I had never even heard of a .35 Whelen until yesterday. A new friend of mine asked me if I wanted to go with him to the gun club to sight in his friends hunting rifle, so I said sure! Turns out it was a .35 Whelen. I shot it a few times, not bad.
Thanks Ron for the sharing, enjoyed it.
35 Whelen took off in Mississippi when Fish and Game had caliber requirements for the primative deer season. Now there's a boat load of single shot 35 Whelens out here. Good cartridge. Thanks for the review.
I have been fortunate to hunt with both, and if you like the 30-06 loaded with 180g bullets, you’ll love the 35 Whelen loaded with 225g bullets - after all, who would not like a “30-06 on Steroids”. The 35 Whelen is a fabulous cartridge and when using handloaded ammo it really outperforms.
Great video, Ron. Would love to see a head to head comparison of the 35 Whelen and the .338 / 06. The .338 has a higher sectional density in comparable bullet weights.
Man I like the way you break down the details. Wish I was hunting something that required that round.
I have hunted with all the above mostly Alaska. I have come down to the 33806 Ackley improved. Recoil is nice, shoots flat , and it flattens most everything. 👍👍😀
I’d also love to see a video discussing the 7.5X55 Swiss cartridge!
When Remington brought out there M7600 pump Action rifle in 35Whelen it really took off here in Australia but in the last 10 years or so the 9.3x62 Mauser seems to have taken its place if you want something bigger than the 30/06 without going to a magnum cartridge.
Hey i see you aussie guys in news. Whats going on. Can you guys fight back. My uncle was in ww 2 and said you guys were great fighters. On and off the battle field.
@@Peter-od7op I will need more than text words to reply to this question so I will try to make a video in response. Cheers Shane
@@averageaussieshooter9696 ty
@@Peter-od7op Put up a reply video on my page, hope it comes across ok!!
@@averageaussieshooter9696 ty for reply
The last year or so the quality of your videos are absolutely skyrocketing. Im a huge fan. Cant wait for the 6.5swede video ;)
Thanks Raging. I don't really know what I'm doing, but I get by with a little help from my friends.
Another great video, thanks Ron.
Great video! Thanks so much for this one. I have owned (and still own) several 35 Whelen's. It is an excellent round and deserves to be much more popular. There's nothing on this continent anywhere that can't be handled properly with it and appropriate factory ammo or better yet- handloads. Mine would be one of the last I'd ever part with if I had to give up most my guns. I have owned several 375's and 30-06's as well (still own a 30-06). With today's high tech bullets and the Nosler partition in spitzer form, SD doesn't matter near as much as it used to with traditional cup and core bullets. The 35 with 225's at 2700 (or a bit more) is right in there with the 338 Win mag and has a lot less recoil and comes in lighter rifles. One thing charts never consider is frontal area and the 35 is a lot closer to the 375 than it is to the 30-06 in that regard. I am convinced frontal area matters and makes a difference in killing effect. Can you tell I love my 35 W? LOL
In Europe we hunt a lot with 9,3 X 62.. I’ll like to see a competitive whit tha 35W
It’s actually very similar, but the 9.3 can handle heavier bullets, and Whelen can be a bit faster.
Thank you Ron, excellent, understandable information provided as always! BTW: I just bought my first 35 Whelen. A five year hunt for one and now its mine! Love it!
That thang hits hard.. appreciate all the info.ive waited a long time to learn all this information..most all my life..thank you very much
You are so welcome
I really enjoy these videos, i would be interested to see a video on the 338 Win mag.
A really good round but you just showed why the 30-06 is so versatile
The fact that the 30-06 is extremely versatile does not mean that other cartridges can't be versatile, too. As many users of the 375 H&H Mag. have pointed out, it's their "better" versatile cartridge where dangerous game roams while the 30-06 is more versatile across most of North America except, perhaps, where big grizzlies roam.
@@RonSpomerOutdoors do you think that the 30.06 is insufficient for grizzlies?
@@actionjksn just gotta hit them right in kisser. Probably with a harder bullet as well thatll smash through bone. Id imagine a basic soft point used for black bear wouldnt be as good unless you smoke it right in the face.
It’s hard to believe after the last 100yrs arm wrestling over cartridge and case design, but man has stretched many a griz by dumping powder down a muzzle and jamming a glorified fishing sinker on top of it. The history of these old cartridges and gear is so fascinating. It helps me appreciate the irony in us thinking we are so tough, in our $100 long johns, with a GPS in one hand and a .338 Bazooka in the other. The human race is known for brains over braun and the timeline of the North American hunter is no exception.
@@ssfd739 all ya need is a 3006,
Great video, Ron.
Proud to have immediate access to a custom 1895 Winchester and a Remington 700 CDL in 35 Whelen.
God bless the Colonel.
Great video explaining the Whelen’s origin and some history which I enjoy. Heard about that round for many years but never really learned about that cartridge. Thanks to you Ron, I now know. Seems like you there would have to be some sentimental factor in buying one and hunting with that hefty cartridge. Thanks Ron!
Glad you enjoyed it, John.
The belt on the 375 H&H has no affect on feeding in my experience. In fact I say the 375 H&H is one of the smoothest feeding cartridges and that is one of the reasons it remains so popular for DG in Africa. It’s gentle taper allows that round to feed smoothly and reliably in hot, dusty, humid conditions when staring down Black Death.
Amen
I'd say it has more to do with taking up magazine space as opposed to feeding, i.e. that could be case diameter as opposed to a useless belt that very few cartridges use. Does that mean the venerable 375 is no good? He'll no, but the belt is definitely not needed.
@@frankgulla8782 but the belt IS needed for headspacing on rounds that have very minimal shoulders.
Paul Deahl yup, the shape of the front end is more important for smooth feeding than the shape of the rear end.
@@luvtahandload7692 the 400 whelen had a lot less shoulder and didn't have a belt, a lot of rounds that have belts most handloaders will head space them off the shoulder.
Thanks again for making this video on the .35 Whelen... I really don’t think that it has had nearly enough exposure.. and I I really feel that if more people knew about... more people would own a rifle chambered in it.
Great video as always. I was very happy to hear you will be doing a video on the 358 winchester and I am still waiting for a 358 win vs 35 whelen video. I just really love these two calibers. Thank you Ron for all you do
You are welcome, Mccray
Hi Ron
Great video Mate Whalen sounds like an interesting Guy , thanks for your time, Steve from Australia .
I'd like to see a video on how these cartridges compare to the 9.3 x 62 mauser.
Very similar actually. Just look at any loading manual.
@@falba1492 When hand loaded they are no different , but factory loads is a big difference
@@huckstirred7112 - I haven’t bought factory ammo for rifles in years, so I’m bias in always looking at hand loads. Besides, if you’re shooting a 35 Whelen, I’d bet you’re reloading. Not much of that on the shelves.
@@falba1492 I can't find anything I want on the shelves . If I didn't hand load I couldn't shoot
I would love to have a rifle in .35 Whelen. I would be interested to see a comparison of the 9.3x62 mm to the .35 Whelen and the .375 H&H.
9.3x64 Brenneke is a beast.
If you're shooting up to 300yds, take the 9.3x62 over the Whelen and you won't ever regret it. Before the 375HH the 9.3x62 was the all purpose calibre in Africa that's taken everything - including elephant! I took plains game and cape buff with mine. Everything was a one-shot kill. The 40" buff took a single quatering on shot through the chest, lumbered for 40yds, and dropped dead. I found that bullet beside the last rib on the right hand side. That's about 54" of straight line penetration, using a Woodleigh 286gr projectile at 2400fps. IMO the 9.3x62 has the edge over the Whelen - and ammo is more easily found since its' very popular in Europe, Alaska, Australia and Africa. 👍
had a buddy of mine that loaded all kinds of 35 Whelen loads using projectiles normally used for .380 acp 9mm 38 special 357 mag he really played around with the caliber and is still playing around with it.
I really appreciate the calm demeanor and the history. This isnt the normal for firearm youtubers.
This is exactly the way I want to spend my time off.
35 Whelen and 338-06 are pretty interesting. There are a lot of .358 cal bullets to choose from for the Whelen though. I think Midway had about 50.
Nope they do not. I look all the time and there are not so many bullets out there. Right now there are really none I know of. I don't shoot pistol bullets from mine so I don't count those.
I own a 350 Remington magnum, not that it makes a difference but l think it is 100 feet per second faster than the 35, l had a elk hunting buddy in the late 80's that had a custom 35 Whelan that he bragged on and had built just because he wanted to compeat with me lol, funny how us gun fanatics like to argue about caliber choice.
Well, your buddy's rifle held 2 more rounds in the magazine.
@@thehoneybadger8089 The 350 Rem mag (I own 2) is faster with lighter bullets. With 250 grain bullets loaded deep you run out of capacity and get the same ballistics as the Whelen. Now if he had got a 9.3x62 he'd have been able to razz you a bit.
350 rem mag is a great cartridge I live in Alaska and have killed everything in the state with it I shoot 250 tax bullets at 2800fps big power short action good choice sir
@@pauljensen7007 🤣Exactly how long did it take you to kill everything in the State of Alaska?😂 Does the US Fish and Wildlife Service have you on their "Most Wanted" list?😉🙃🌵
@@thehoneybadger8089 well not everything everything.
bears both kinds and moose
Excellent!
Thank you for the video and information about a cartridge I have not heard of. I was just getting into hunting and was starting to learn about different rifle calibers, but life stepped in and I started driving a semi otr and just didn't have time for it. I am getting close to retirement now and that old itch to hunt is coming back. I have a Thompson center in 308 for deer, but I have been thinking about building a magnum caliber for out to 500 yards. I have have also kicked around either a 270,243, 25-06, 223/556, 220swift and other similar calibers for long distance groundhogs and just light recoil long range targets for fun.
Col. Townsend Whelen was also involved with the development of the 22 Hornet cartridge.
35 Whelen is a Dream. Hits like a ton of bricks. Like the 30-06 and to be honest surpasses the Aught 6 in versatility. From light pistol varmint loads to being famed by Hemingway I believe as being one of the best for the Fatal Big Cats of Africa, moose, Grizzly, and elk all have felt the power... it really is a beast. With Modern powders, great new bullet technology this round is a very reliable at 400yards. I can't say enough about it.
Was looking for an Elk brush gun and asked you do do this video (THANKS!!!) on the 35 Whelen. I ended up buying a CVA scout break action, heavy barrel and it kicks considerably more then a .30-06. I had to break it so I could handle it. But now I know more of what this cartridge can do. I just wanted a 200 yard gun and seems I found a perfect fit. Thanks again!! I also have a 1903A3 action I'm going to build into a 35 Whelen.
Woohoo a new Spomer video my Saturday has been made love these cartridge videos
Glad you like them!
Ron,
Have you done an episodes on obscure cartridges? Besides the 35 Whelen, the 8MM Remington Mag comes to mind. One of my uncle’s has one and all I can say is damn impressive.
The Whelens’ appeal for me was the retained kinetic energy at extended ranges.
Love your easy demeanor with which you cover your topics. Keep up the great content.
Thanks, will do!
Sir, I very much enjoy your video's Love learning about cartridges and the other things you cover. Thank you sir.
Thanks for watching, Red Sky.
It is great caliber, closer to the older 9,3x62 than to the 3006 I believe. 9,3 x62 is way more popular here in Europe but the 35 Whelen did had it's momentum back in the 80´s and early 90´s when Remington introduced it into the European markets. Most popular rifle loading it was the Remington 7400 semi auto but many bolt actions, like Heym SR21 were sold too. I do have one of Heym´s Stuzen shooting very well during our wild boar Monteria type of hunts.
I know it wasn't a option but the .338 win mag gets my vote
I second that.
If you look at the data, you can get similar velocity with up to 20% less powder, but you can always get faster loads with the 338. It’s an interesting trade off.
MINE TOO, I USE IT ON EVERY THING IN ALBERTA
Great information brother! I bought a CVA single shot stainless in 35 Whelen a few months ago and was finally able to purchase 3 boxes of 200 grain Hornady Superformance a few days ago. I cannot wait to shoot it and whitetail deer hunt with it here in MO this Fall. Thanks again for the best video I've found on the cartridge.
I bought the same CVA .35 two years ago. I killed a buck last year that maybe made it 20 yards. I killed another this year and it dropped in its tracks at 100 yards. I was impressed to say the least. I used Remington 200 grain Cor loks.
Thats all I could find at the time, but I have shot them for 30 years in my 06' and they have been great. Looks like they are gonna be fine in the Whelen too.
Thanks for this video I've been looking into a new caliber for hunting thick brush and I think I just found it due to this video
Add the 9.3 mm x 62 mm to your comparison.
Pre dates them all and a fine cartridge too.
@@johnf3f810 I own two 9.3x62, absolutely love them. One of my favorite cartridges. Especially when u load them to modern pressures around 60,000 psi. Right now both rifles are pushing 286 grain bullets at 2500-2510 FPS. And are absolute hammers on whitetail.
@@andrewcleveland holy cow dude. you pushing that with Big Game or something else? They're pretty much absolute hammers on all but the biggest and most dangerous critters.
I will say this - my 286 gr loads are around 2420, and they are, IMO, pretty brutal to shoot off the bench. But off sticks or freehand, not a big deal at all. Same with my 45-70 shooting 425 or 525 gr at ~1625. Just no fun at all to shoot off the bench.
But TBH, everything I've ever shot that was .33 or bigger was no fun off the bench, either.
@@smokedbrisket3033 yeah I use big game in both 9.3x62. I got the data from the 24 hour campfire forums. There is a huge amount of load data there, a lot from writer John Barnes. In my 98 Mauser I use 66 grains, and my sauer I use 65 grains. And yeah the 9.3 can be a little tough of the bench, especially in a lightweight rifle. My 416 rem Mag, and 416 Taylor are both far worse off the bench though. There are still several countries in Africa where the 9.3x62 is still legal for dangerous game. And it’s still one of the most beloved African cartridges of all time. Just an all around lovely cartridge.
@@andrewcleveland I have some Woodleigh 320 RN coming in. Can't wait to shoot those.
35 Whelen is pretty much an American 9.3x62mm
@Lonny E Honestly for the same reason .35 Whelen hasn't as a whole. There's no need for the cartridge for majority of game in the United States. .308, .30-06, .270, and .243 Winchester pretty well tackle just about everything in the hunting department within the US.
Your opening comment about the Whelen being a .30-06 on steroids made me smile and I had to watch this presentation because a friend of mine shoots a .35 Whelen and those are exactly the words he uses to describe it. Very informative and enjoyable video.
That was very informative !!
I've killed 9 elk with my 35. 225grain Barnes , it literally puts things to sleep on impact
My elk count with the Whelen is about the same. I have opted for the 200 gr Barnes ttsx.... And yes, it's lights out. I have made some bad shots too.... Lights out anyway.
Funny I was just looking at a 7600 in the 35 whelen oldie but effective goldie.
quite possibly the coolest rifle in an even cooler cartridge! Buy it! (if it's in your budget) Damn man..
@@Rampant_Colt yeah around $1500 Australia already put a deposit on it.
I have had my 7600 in 35 whelen for over 30 years. It's a very good shooter as I can cloverleaf at 100 yards with it and it knocks game down very hard ...!
Wow, all these famous names and they were all basically mates back in the day. What an awesome piece of history, thanks for sharing with us Ron!
Glad you enjoyed it
Ron this info is so awesome. Thank you for your service. Old school and a bada$$
Thanks Walt.
I’d like to see a comparison of the .35 Whelen and the .350 Remington Magnum. I’ll pit my .350 with a 225 grain pill against anything on the North American continent.
A more favorable comparison would be the 300winmag, 300weatherbymag, and the 338winmag.
You forgot the 7mm mag.
@@Geekygordon Comparing 30cals
What a sweet coincidence that I was just listening to the Vortex Nation Podcast talking about the .35 Whelen a couple days ago and then you drop this to keep me thinking about that awesome “just right” cartridge.
A buddy of mine has one and loves it. I have looked for one a couple times when I am at a gun store. I have seen it in the Ruger No 1, but that is too pricey. I know that Remington had it in a bolt action and a pump. If I were to get it, I most likely would get it in the CVA Hunter or Scout single shot rifles for about $350.
Ruger also chambered it in their model 77 , Remington in their 7600. Reason they are hard to find is like Ron said. However, the hunters that have them usually hang onto them.
Great info