The fundamental problem is that the Sequel trilogy poisoned everything, love or hate the prequels, they never broke the universe, and once the universe is broken, the only thing that will fix it, the only thing, is to retcon the broken elements out of canon.
It doesn't need to change, it has to revolve around its core ideas, but with different spin on things. You know, kinda like prequels did with originals
Rogue One and Andor are only disney products that genuinely feel Star Wars. Andor in particular is not only a good Star Wars show but truly a good show that have actual story and real life characters with their motives and weaknessess.
These series don't look like Star Wars, it's just some kind of war with Star Wars costumes. Of course, it's cool that they made the empire scary, but this is only 1 plus out of a thousand cons
Funny, nobody else described sequels so well yet so shortly. As 3 horseman of the apocalypse. First the conquest, hearts of fans were captured by the force awakens, yet as excited as we were for the possibilities for the future, we didn't know what happened was the begining of the end. Second was War, War is how i would describe what happend to fandom after the last jedi, strife, total divide, some have already lost hope, others were satisfied, both ready to defend their own. Third was famine, even though we were fed more star wars, with other movies between trilogy, and animated shows, we were starving, we knew that we were starved, good content taken away from us. And the fourth, Death.
Yeah, but I wasn't fooled. I got called all sorts of nasty names by family of all people. Simply because I smelled bullshit and wouldn't shut up about it. Kinda like how they wouldn't stop praising the bloody thing. They don't call me names anymore. In fact, we don't speak at all anymore because of this crap. All for the simple fact they don't want to admit I was right. 3 horsemen is right in several ways.
@SpaceCrowProductions They're really selfish people, and this was the straw that broke my back. Normally, in any debate or argument, I get my point across without making a scene or swearing profusely. This was the time they decided not to listen and then told me to shut up. They've never done that before, and once I stopped talking, I had epiphany. They never listened to me at all. Not once in their selfish lives did they ever take my point of view into consideration. Even though they would routinely ask for it. I figured out it was just a way to give me what I want and shut me up at the same time. While they went and did whatever they wanted, instead of what they asked for. Not much I can do until they reach out with reason. Every other time has just been to backhanded compliment me with insults. We're getting older, and I have no patience for nonsense. So I play the longest silent game I possibly can. 2 years and still going.
I didn't like Andor at first, he wasn't a character I was interested in, and the first 2 episodes were boring, but then it just elevated. The story was complex but well thought out, the stakes were believable, the dialogue was VERY good, and the acting was superb. The background scenery was great, and the effects were excellent. The quality of the show is way better than the others. It just goes to show that if you make an adult Star Wars show without silly gimmicks and just a good story well executed you can make a good show. Unfortunately, by this time fans were so jaded, no one was watching, and didn't really care about a character with no future. Imagine if Andor was set 100 years after the Skywalker Saga, when a new enemy has surfaced. It would be a great show to set up the universe for new heroes and villains.
Same here. I really didn't like it, the reason I went easier on it in the video is because it isn't objectively terrible, it is just very disappointing.
It’s one of the reasons I never jumped on the Skywalker saga train, it has nothing on the Kotor stories created by non Disney artists. Star Wars has so much potential but they will never materialize because it has to be sanitized in order to appeal to the masses.
@@SpaceCrowProductions So Star Wars and Star Trek never had to be sanitized in order to appeal to the masses! But now modern non-artists want them to be sanitized for the anti-nerds who think they need to be more diverse to appeal to everybody, by making insulting new stories that only appeal to the vocal minority on twitter who see themselves as the masses.
@@SpaceCrowProductions The problem was that they first tried to stick to the try and true instead of evolving, then they tried to appeal the racist fanboys.. Much as I dislike Last Jedi, a lot of the criticism was bad faith racism
I was talking to my brother in law earlier this week about the IP, the zealotry in management, and their unwillingness to ask WHY things happen in a story. If they wanted Rey to go toe-to-toe with Ren and hold her own, the fix could have been as simple as giving her a saber-pike, a weapon with which we had already been shown she could wield an approximation of. Quite frankly it just feels like low effort gruel from disney a lot of the time. And all fixed with that simple question: "Why?"
Obvious thing that needs pointing out: When the shills say "The Acolyte is going to save Star Wars" they are admitting that the ftanchise has been ruined and is dying. Don't let them squirm away from that when the Acolyte fails.
A great point that I forgot to adress. Indeed with every paid article about saving Star Wars, another paid article defending a previous work of trash is debunked lol
Under this management, yes. It is arguably irredeemable. A big and I mean BIG shift in management in the right direction could work, but that is hopeful speculation.
@@SpaceCrowProductions I think the time for that has come and gone, my friend. Even if they replaced everyone from the top down to the bottom, I doubt fans are going to come back except for those who are brand loyal regardless of the poor quality. Who knows, maybe my view will changed, but to me... I don't see any hope of salvation for Star Wars, even if they finally got rid of Kathleen Kennedy and all her lackies.
Uh i'm sorry. As poorly executed as Holdo was the idea of a female leader who's confident isn't bad. Ahsoka and other female characters are great, and much of the bleating about girl bosses is from guys who think women should be subservient. If a guy shows confidence people praise him while a woman is slammed. It's the same thing with Captain Marvel (and how the trolls were upset that she manhandled a sexist bully who forced himself into her space)
I just got so tired of constantly being disappointed.. Stopped watching Star Wars content quite a while ago because if this. The part in the video where you talked about missing good Star Wars, getting excited to watch it in the cinema etc, that struck a cord with me. If only.. But I really don't expect that to happen ever again honestly. Sad.
We're too far down the road on both SW and Indy. Two of the greatest adventure franchises have been driven into the ground by the Coffee Bringer, Kathleen Kennedy. As a person who saw A New Hope and Raiders first run in the cinema, I say let them go. I stuck with them thinking we would get better content.....but kept getting burned movie after movie.......series after series. Andor and Rogue One are the exception.....probably because KK was on vacation or drinking binge at those times.
Dont let these new products ruin great memories mate, treat it for what they are: corporate decisions. Nothing can undo the great memories Indy and Star Wars gave us in their prime
The only real follow up to the first three Star War movies was Thrawn trilogy, every book had me waiting for the next to see what would happen, the prequels to me just had empty eye candy.
@@drake000666 that’s why I said it’s run it’s course after the prequels. Sure we still had the EU but Dave Filoni and his TCW series sorta ruined that and then Disney decided to cancel the EU all together. Star Wars is dead.
@@drake000666 Even the Thrawn trilogy isn't that great when you reread it years later. Thrawn makes decisions like "Oh, let's humiliate and threaten the Noghri.....the people who are LITERALLY my bodyguards and the deadliest assassins in the universe.". Then he Mary Sues his way through until the end of the trilogy where the plot armor fails and all his bad decisions come back on him at once.
I get your point completely. Star Wars is partly what got me into movies, I will stick by wanting it to grow and get better forever, even when it seems hopeless
None of us should be surprised. Star Wars was bought by Disney NOT because they had an artistic vision for it, but to make money. They only care about it being a money machine for them. That's why they put so much effort into marketing & production, and so little into planning & writing. There's risk mitigation built into it. Media sells when it panders to opinions in the zeitgeist of the day. Disney doesn't WANT to make something timeless - they want to make something lucrative. The problem is that for this IP that's an unsustainable business model. The original series had a certain creative vision paired with new film methods and a return to morals-based storytelling that really hit home. The prequels continued new film methods, and where it fell short in dialogue it made up for in overall writing (the writing of the prequel arc itself is very impressive, even if execution was a little shakey). The Sequels, though, are just...lost. they TRY to have a motif to them, but it's just clunky and irregular. It does not have any strong suit going for it. Even the filmmaking is honestly not that innovative feeling - the world now feels too shiny, sweeping, or overpaced. The Sequels really could have been decent, but the planning caused them to fall flat on their face like a sprinter who trips as soon as they start running - they did not plan their paces. Then came Mando which hinted at a return to older storytelling with more traditional morals-based story in a "western" world. Honestly half the time it was "Space" Bonanza, which is fine! Many people in this era have not seen Bonanza or older shows like it. But then it did a 180 and turned into surface-level flashy gimmicks and endless cameos. The story literally lost itself, getting drowned out by its external influences. How? Why? Because the studio got greedy and wanted to squeeze more money out of it. You can see the same patterns in Kenobi, Boba Fett, etc - the stories just don't really make sense when you think about it, and the more packed full of cameos and references the worse it seems to get. Andor is the golden exception. I have NO idea how Disney let that one out. It doesn't seem like a money maker, does it? Personally I loved Cassian since Rogue One, but he's not 'popular'. The show premise doesn't rely on cameos or references to popular story tangents. It seems hard to believe Disney would have green lit it. Maybe they thought of it as a hail mary attempt to cover more ground. Or MAYBE someone convinced the studio to just give it a try. MAYBE Tony Gilroy et al got a foot in the door to explain the value of quality storytelling. A good story CREATES references, not relies on them. But Disney is a business machine that requires cash to burn as its fuel, and it will continue to pump out low-quality cash-grab content until the viewer base is absolutely exhausted (until the series longer makes money). Think about that: They will pump out star wars content until it no longer makes money. There is no elegant retirement in mind for it. It will end in a very sorry state. But maybe... MAYBE... once in a while other storiea like Andor will slip through the cracks. Or maybe we'll just all move on to other things anyway
Jessie Gender made the point that Disney wants star wars to be apolitical when in fact the OT and prequels were VERY political. Hell Lando himself was added because Lucas heard people criticizing the lack of diversity and realized "hey they actually have a point". The OT was VERY left wing (the Empire is the US in Nam, the rebels are the viet cong).....Hell he wanted Toshiro Mifune to be Obi Wan. The prequels were also not subtle in criticizing George Bush. Disney however doesn't want controversy, so they make things as lightweight as they can.
I’m liberal as hell. I am an LGBTQ+ supporting anti-racist feminist. And I am SICK of people like Kathleen Kennedy saying that I’m sexist and racist because I don’t like the crap they’re selling. All I want is good Star Wars stories and Lucasfilm/Disney is failing.
@@SpaceCrowProductions The original trilogy was bold in a lot of ways; even Return of the Jedi, which had ewoks and an over emphasis on happiness, had the balls to actually REDEEM the terrifying villain and show him as a broken man who hates himself ANH had the empire based on America as well. As flawed as the prequels were in execution they tried to tell a different story.
@@SpaceCrowProductions Filoni is fine. The problem is more that Disney doesn't like boldness. The original movies were very very left wing (the Empire was based on the United States in Vietnam, and the Rebels were the Viet Cong). Even the prequels cheerfully ripped into Republicans and the war on terror. But that doesn't fit Disney's agenda so they try to water it down.
Star wars? That those 6 movies released out of order? I think so, for my life, I'm not aware of any additional Star wars past those 6 films. Well, except for the fanfiction we see, good or Disney, which isn't cannon anyway...so
@@SpaceCrowProductions Johnson is good when he's playing with his own sandbox and characters. You can be as subversive as you want there. But when you use existing characters you have to build on what came before.
It's not narcissitic at all. Wanting minorities to be just as prominent is admirable and any sane person would want the same thing. she never said acolyte was to exclude white people.
The only way I see this fixed is to make it as a second universe that's non canon like it was done to Legends (note I think it was good that Legends was made as non canon since things there went way out of hand but this is so much worse in so little time)
SW needs saving from femenists. That's all there is to say. Why save Star Wars? Because you got to respect it for the universe and lore created there. Something like that doesn't happen every day. If I showed you a picture of an obscure SW spacecraft and said it's just a spacecraft, you'll know it's SW at first glance. That loyalty to the look of the universe is to be admired.
Uh feminism isn't the problem; centrism and a desire to not experiment is. A confident female isn't a bad thing yet such a character is always called a bitch. The kind of people bleating about SJWs and feminists are the kind of people who think that men should be allowed to beat and rape women, that women should be chattel, and minorities either shouldn't exist or be subservient. Having more people of color in the franchise is probably one of the only things disney is doing RIGHT.
I have very mixed feelings about a lot of the disney stuff: 1.) Mandalorian: I rather liked the first two seasons. Din is a great character (as is Baby Yoda), and it addressed some of the only problems I had with the OT (the tuskens were racial stereotypes; the Mandalorian made them a lot more nuanced. Whatever problems the show has, I will always applaud that). The scene with Bill Burr and his former commander was utterly chilling, and the Dark Troopers was a nice tip of the cap to the EU. 2.) TLJ: I can respect that Jonson wanted to be different be ignored established characterization to make it work, and he ignored logic as well. 3.) RoS: I admit Harrison Ford's cameo was genuinely nice, but otherwise it was tepid. 4.) TFA: I liked it on an instinctive level but it was what made the problems start. One thing that came out is that Michael Arndt was originally supposed to do Episode VII but wanted more time, at which point they shitcanned him. Boba Fett was disappointing; I would have liked a more ruthless Boba Fett. High Republic I haven't read but I think the idea is fantastic. Seeing the Old Jedi in their glory days before everything went so wrong.
1:09 see at first I was pissed at you for shitting on rogue one, but then I remembered it was the first mediocre one after so much bad and one amazballz one tnataint so great in retrospect so even that is nostalgia now
Deborah Chow is not a bad director. She directed episodes 3, 7 and 21 of the Mandalorian and in my opinion those were well directed. My guess is that Disney just did not give her enough time to work on the Obi Wan show.
The way I see it is that she had way more freedom with Obi Wan. And that show is directed worse than a college project lol. But maybe youre right, her direction wasn't an issue with mando that is fair.
They want it, they can have it. Now instead of watching Star Wars and the franchise they love, women can have them and men can cheat more to make up the difference.
The fact that we have fans that will watch literally anything Disney puts out and praises it despite the Quality being bad. It has Star Wars in the Title. Its the entire Fanbase. We watched and supported Rogue One and that was an unnecessary cash grab. We watch The Mandlorian despite the massive holes in the story, we even Support Andor which is so boring because once again were watching how the Rebellion got started again. We know how bad the Empire are, we know the Rebellion is small, we know how Andor will die. Andor is piss poor fanfiction with Star Wars in the title. All these series have extremely low Stakes. Nothing of importance is happening, we don’t care about the characters, they feel like bad fanfiction, we just get keys jangling and nostalgia. Until the fanbase treats all projects like they Treated Solo, we're gonna always get storys that take place between Revenge of the Sith, and A New Hope. The samething again and again. Star Wars needs to move towards the future.
Andor actually shows the nitty gritty of the Empire's evil. We saw high profile atrocities like Alderaan, but we don't see the banal evil of mundane fascism. Andor shows that.
Star Wars doesnt even need saving. If you say Star Wars is dead your not even a true fan. Yes Star Wars had its hit and misses with a few shows but who cares.. it's Star Wars, and its going to be around for along time. As a fan myself I like the new shows though i don't like most of them. Kenobi was a 6/10 for me BOBF was a 5/10 for me. And Mando season 3 was a 5/10 for me. But the other shows like Andor and Ahsoka were a 8/10 for me. I love both legends and canon. Before anyone call me a shill just note that Darth Revan is my favorite character adter Anakin/Vader.
Eh, if we're going to be honest, the Fandom is part of the issue. Especially their focus on diversity. To look at the show Kenobi (as that was the one that broke me on Star Wars): The biggest problem was not Reva. Sure, she's a crap character but she wasn't the worst problem. It was the out-and-out character breaks. For example, the Emperor, a LEGENDARILY PARANOID figure, who has just had a surviving member of the Jedi Council make an assassination run on his #2 and what does he do? He decides to tease Vader about it. No attempt to find and eliminate Kenobi (and, in a bureaucracy-heavy organization such as the Empire, it's not going to be hard to find the requisition forms for the troops that Reva took to the moisture farm), no security crackdowns on Alderaan or Tatooine, not even doubling down on his own security. Just teasing. And, of course: "My Brother is dead......Well, seeya." But the break point for me was seeing Kenobi tell Anakin about learning mercy then immediately showing why mercy is a chump move. This was where I broke. And this is where the Fandom is part of the problem. Instead of focusing on legitimately terrible issues, too many of the Fandom focuses on "The Message" which, in turn, is a terrible look. You can list out Reva's terrible decisions but, as soon as your criticism starts wanderiing into "diversity checkbox" complaints, you lose a lot of legitimacy as you make yourself look like someone wielding a Tiki Torch in Charlottesville.
The whole concept of Kenobi was completely wrong from inception. Kenobi's job was to look after Luke, not Leia. All they wanted to do was have a nostalgia bait show to have another fight between Kenobi and Vader. Just a cash grab.
I agree that Reva wasn't the biggest problem, but she was one of the main ones. The reason I highlighted it is because she is a very fitting example of the scummy strategy disney uses to avoid talking about real issues with their content.
Great video! Personally I think that Disney doesn't understand Star Wars on a fundamental level. From an outside view it would appear that SW is all about the Jedi vs the Sith and the constant good vs evil struggle. There's a lot of that, but I think that Star Wars is a lot more of that George Lucas weirdness/silliness. For example, the goofy looking creatures, the weird alien languages, the dumb names, the Disney aliens are kind of boring. Disney would NEVER, come up with a character like Watto, not in a million years. Or even Jar Jar Binks, which is a stupid fkn character, hated by many, but that's what makes Star Wars, not the blue (good) vs red (evil) stuff.
As a fan of movies and games if a directors 1st first words are about their sexuality or something imma immediately check out of anything else you gotta say. Cause maybe its just me... but your gender or preferred prounouns have nothing to do with making entertaining products.
@ryanmoore6259 Why? Why is it so important for me to know that Tim Drake is gay in Gotham Knights for example? What does that do for the game? Might be a cool little fun fact, about him but literally does nothing for me in terms of his character. I don't need to know his sexuality when my goal is to stop a bad guy from doing crimes in Gotham city.
I hate rogue one and I hate andor and a lot of people feel the same way, so no, rogue one and andor are not universally praised and liked and they are extremely far far from great, these two fanfictions are just as divisive as all of Disney Star Wars put out.
I know they are not universally liked, a lot of people hated Andor especially. I'm personally not a fan of Rogue one but I loved Andor. I respect your point though, to each their own.
"Okay, I think we're at the point where we need to admit that this was never really a great franchise and we keep trying and trying and trying to find this thing that was never really actually there" "Yep, Star Wars Was Never Good"
I like Star Wars :) I would get this point if it weren't for the OG trilogy, and calling them objectively bad would be a wild stretch imo. But to each their own mate
I really didn't like it but objectively it wasn't awful. I just hated it due to more subjective reasons, which is why I remained diplomatic for this topic of a video, focusing on a bigger picture.
This bloke says he has Star Wars fatigue - yet when they do something new with queer characters he’s still not happy 🤦🏻♂️ sheesh 🙄 some people are just determined to be unhappy
Literally nothing needs saving. The vocal minority of the fandumb just has really good fan base within incel communities. But StarWars has been and always will be okay. This is just a weird rationale but if that’s what you need to get thru it I understand
I agree that the incels are a massive problem but there are issues. Disney doesn't like being bold and prefers cookie cutter stories. The OT was great BECAUSE it was so bold; even ANH was bold for it's time (coming out when everything was bleak), while ROTJ took the time to subvert the "evil dragon needs to be slain" idea by making Vader a broken man in need of help. Even the prequels, while flawed, tried to tell a different and ambitious story. You can say that Lucas failed but he at least tried something different to the point you can respect his intent. Rian Jonson botched it badly but he tried to do something different; granted he sucked at it but he at least tried.
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The fundamental problem is that the Sequel trilogy poisoned everything, love or hate the prequels, they never broke the universe, and once the universe is broken, the only thing that will fix it, the only thing, is to retcon the broken elements out of canon.
Well said.
people were saying midi chlorians broke the universe 20 years ago
SW doesn't need to be saved. It needs to change.
It doesn't need to change, it has to revolve around its core ideas, but with different spin on things. You know, kinda like prequels did with originals
Evolve is a more apt word. Improve on what is functioning and take steps to shed what doesn't.
It needs to be mourned.
@@nathanvarade5820 Nothing is functioning at the moment, that's the problem.
@@yamadoyato6055 Of course. I was referring the management and the mindset at the Lucasfilm. Which I don't even know if it will happen...
Rogue One and Andor are only disney products that genuinely feel Star Wars. Andor in particular is not only a good Star Wars show but truly a good show that have actual story and real life characters with their motives and weaknessess.
lol andor is just as garbage as the rest
These series don't look like Star Wars, it's just some kind of war with Star Wars costumes.
Of course, it's cool that they made the empire scary, but this is only 1 plus out of a thousand cons
@@vladlenvolkov9034 don’t even look like good costumes . Look like 4th grade level
Funny, nobody else described sequels so well yet so shortly. As 3 horseman of the apocalypse.
First the conquest, hearts of fans were captured by the force awakens, yet as excited as we were for the possibilities for the future, we didn't know what happened was the begining of the end.
Second was War, War is how i would describe what happend to fandom after the last jedi, strife, total divide, some have already lost hope, others were satisfied, both ready to defend their own.
Third was famine, even though we were fed more star wars, with other movies between trilogy, and animated shows, we were starving, we knew that we were starved, good content taken away from us.
And the fourth, Death.
Thanks mate, I was pretty proud of that one and you made it even better now lol
Yeah, but I wasn't fooled. I got called all sorts of nasty names by family of all people. Simply because I smelled bullshit and wouldn't shut up about it. Kinda like how they wouldn't stop praising the bloody thing. They don't call me names anymore. In fact, we don't speak at all anymore because of this crap. All for the simple fact they don't want to admit I was right. 3 horsemen is right in several ways.
@@gamervet4760 man, that sucks to hear, I hope things smooth out eventually. Consider your opinion justified tho, you were right all along lol
@SpaceCrowProductions They're really selfish people, and this was the straw that broke my back. Normally, in any debate or argument, I get my point across without making a scene or swearing profusely. This was the time they decided not to listen and then told me to shut up. They've never done that before, and once I stopped talking, I had epiphany. They never listened to me at all. Not once in their selfish lives did they ever take my point of view into consideration. Even though they would routinely ask for it. I figured out it was just a way to give me what I want and shut me up at the same time. While they went and did whatever they wanted, instead of what they asked for. Not much I can do until they reach out with reason. Every other time has just been to backhanded compliment me with insults. We're getting older, and I have no patience for nonsense. So I play the longest silent game I possibly can. 2 years and still going.
I didn't like Andor at first, he wasn't a character I was interested in, and the first 2 episodes were boring, but then it just elevated. The story was complex but well thought out, the stakes were believable, the dialogue was VERY good, and the acting was superb. The background scenery was great, and the effects were excellent. The quality of the show is way better than the others. It just goes to show that if you make an adult Star Wars show without silly gimmicks and just a good story well executed you can make a good show. Unfortunately, by this time fans were so jaded, no one was watching, and didn't really care about a character with no future.
Imagine if Andor was set 100 years after the Skywalker Saga, when a new enemy has surfaced. It would be a great show to set up the universe for new heroes and villains.
Absolutely, Andor is a slow burn that gets better with every episode imo. The Andy Serkis/Stellan monologues were just superb moments, very memorable.
Ahsoka did it for me. The very last time I dared to hope. I loved CW/Rebels. I got Star Wars : A New Disappointment
Same here. I really didn't like it, the reason I went easier on it in the video is because it isn't objectively terrible, it is just very disappointing.
If anything, we still have Legends or EU (how its really called). Its clearly better in every way, not perfect but far better than disney.
That is true, I'm just a sucker for good movies and Star Wars is one of the main reasons for that passion
Disney needs to pay me money to watch this shit now. I'm totally done with Star Wars poops unless they're sending me checks in mail.
Understandable lol. And it might be the right choice, the only one that could make a difference in the long run, tanked viewership.
It’s one of the reasons I never jumped on the Skywalker saga train, it has nothing on the Kotor stories created by non Disney artists. Star Wars has so much potential but they will never materialize because it has to be sanitized in order to appeal to the masses.
But thats the thing, Star Wars USED TO appeal to the masses, rightfully so. Now it tries to appeal to a vocal minority on twitter.
@@SpaceCrowProductions So Star Wars and Star Trek never had to be sanitized in order to appeal to the masses! But now modern non-artists want them to be sanitized for the anti-nerds who think they need to be more diverse to appeal to everybody, by making insulting new stories that only appeal to the vocal minority on twitter who see themselves as the masses.
@@SpaceCrowProductions The problem was that they first tried to stick to the try and true instead of evolving, then they tried to appeal the racist fanboys..
Much as I dislike Last Jedi, a lot of the criticism was bad faith racism
@@SpaceCrowProductions I wouldn't say that. It tries to appeal to a lot of incels
I was talking to my brother in law earlier this week about the IP, the zealotry in management, and their unwillingness to ask WHY things happen in a story. If they wanted Rey to go toe-to-toe with Ren and hold her own, the fix could have been as simple as giving her a saber-pike, a weapon with which we had already been shown she could wield an approximation of. Quite frankly it just feels like low effort gruel from disney a lot of the time. And all fixed with that simple question: "Why?"
"Why?" A question too few dare to ask at disney these days, well said.
Obvious thing that needs pointing out: When the shills say "The Acolyte is going to save Star Wars" they are admitting that the ftanchise has been ruined and is dying. Don't let them squirm away from that when the Acolyte fails.
A great point that I forgot to adress. Indeed with every paid article about saving Star Wars, another paid article defending a previous work of trash is debunked lol
Glad someone understands Not all hope is lost if Disney can just Fire KK 👀👀🙄
Man, I wish... I wish every day
I don't think it can be saved. At this point, it'd just be better to just stop and let it fade away.
Under this management, yes. It is arguably irredeemable. A big and I mean BIG shift in management in the right direction could work, but that is hopeful speculation.
@@SpaceCrowProductions I think the time for that has come and gone, my friend. Even if they replaced everyone from the top down to the bottom, I doubt fans are going to come back except for those who are brand loyal regardless of the poor quality. Who knows, maybe my view will changed, but to me... I don't see any hope of salvation for Star Wars, even if they finally got rid of Kathleen Kennedy and all her lackies.
Not Just Star Wars, but Disney management in general. Iger hasn't been doing a good job.
Enough of the annoying girl bosses that's what's running starwars
Uh i'm sorry. As poorly executed as Holdo was the idea of a female leader who's confident isn't bad. Ahsoka and other female characters are great, and much of the bleating about girl bosses is from guys who think women should be subservient.
If a guy shows confidence people praise him while a woman is slammed.
It's the same thing with Captain Marvel (and how the trolls were upset that she manhandled a sexist bully who forced himself into her space)
I just got so tired of constantly being disappointed.. Stopped watching Star Wars content quite a while ago because if this. The part in the video where you talked about missing good Star Wars, getting excited to watch it in the cinema etc, that struck a cord with me. If only.. But I really don't expect that to happen ever again honestly. Sad.
We're too far down the road on both SW and Indy. Two of the greatest adventure franchises have been driven into the ground by the Coffee Bringer, Kathleen Kennedy. As a person who saw A New Hope and Raiders first run in the cinema, I say let them go. I stuck with them thinking we would get better content.....but kept getting burned movie after movie.......series after series. Andor and Rogue One are the exception.....probably because KK was on vacation or drinking binge at those times.
Dont let these new products ruin great memories mate, treat it for what they are: corporate decisions. Nothing can undo the great memories Indy and Star Wars gave us in their prime
It’s beyond saving tbh.
From a certain point of view...
I think you hit the nail on the head you’ve identified how we got here. Now we just need someone who can change it for the better.
My thoughts exactly. Love your video topics so far btw, keep up the good work, m8!
Thanks mate, will do so :)
I think Star Wars had it’s time and ran it’s course after the prequels.
I mean it is true but it shouldn't have to be that way imo
@@SpaceCrowProductions well unfortunately it is that way
The only real follow up to the first three Star War movies was Thrawn trilogy, every book had me waiting for the next to see what would happen, the prequels to me just had empty eye candy.
@@drake000666 that’s why I said it’s run it’s course after the prequels. Sure we still had the EU but Dave Filoni and his TCW series sorta ruined that and then Disney decided to cancel the EU all together. Star Wars is dead.
@@drake000666 Even the Thrawn trilogy isn't that great when you reread it years later. Thrawn makes decisions like "Oh, let's humiliate and threaten the Noghri.....the people who are LITERALLY my bodyguards and the deadliest assassins in the universe.". Then he Mary Sues his way through until the end of the trilogy where the plot armor fails and all his bad decisions come back on him at once.
Rogue one was the only decent Disney starwars
Decent, but far from great imo.
@@SpaceCrowProductions I actually kinda liked Solo to be honest. The first two seasons of Mandalorian were pretty good.
It can't and won't be saved. Itnis time to move on. 😢
I get your point completely. Star Wars is partly what got me into movies, I will stick by wanting it to grow and get better forever, even when it seems hopeless
Or just stick to the stuff that works.
None of us should be surprised. Star Wars was bought by Disney NOT because they had an artistic vision for it, but to make money. They only care about it being a money machine for them. That's why they put so much effort into marketing & production, and so little into planning & writing. There's risk mitigation built into it. Media sells when it panders to opinions in the zeitgeist of the day. Disney doesn't WANT to make something timeless - they want to make something lucrative. The problem is that for this IP that's an unsustainable business model. The original series had a certain creative vision paired with new film methods and a return to morals-based storytelling that really hit home. The prequels continued new film methods, and where it fell short in dialogue it made up for in overall writing (the writing of the prequel arc itself is very impressive, even if execution was a little shakey). The Sequels, though, are just...lost. they TRY to have a motif to them, but it's just clunky and irregular. It does not have any strong suit going for it. Even the filmmaking is honestly not that innovative feeling - the world now feels too shiny, sweeping, or overpaced. The Sequels really could have been decent, but the planning caused them to fall flat on their face like a sprinter who trips as soon as they start running - they did not plan their paces. Then came Mando which hinted at a return to older storytelling with more traditional morals-based story in a "western" world. Honestly half the time it was "Space" Bonanza, which is fine! Many people in this era have not seen Bonanza or older shows like it. But then it did a 180 and turned into surface-level flashy gimmicks and endless cameos. The story literally lost itself, getting drowned out by its external influences. How? Why? Because the studio got greedy and wanted to squeeze more money out of it. You can see the same patterns in Kenobi, Boba Fett, etc - the stories just don't really make sense when you think about it, and the more packed full of cameos and references the worse it seems to get. Andor is the golden exception. I have NO idea how Disney let that one out. It doesn't seem like a money maker, does it? Personally I loved Cassian since Rogue One, but he's not 'popular'. The show premise doesn't rely on cameos or references to popular story tangents. It seems hard to believe Disney would have green lit it. Maybe they thought of it as a hail mary attempt to cover more ground. Or MAYBE someone convinced the studio to just give it a try. MAYBE Tony Gilroy et al got a foot in the door to explain the value of quality storytelling. A good story CREATES references, not relies on them. But Disney is a business machine that requires cash to burn as its fuel, and it will continue to pump out low-quality cash-grab content until the viewer base is absolutely exhausted (until the series longer makes money). Think about that: They will pump out star wars content until it no longer makes money. There is no elegant retirement in mind for it. It will end in a very sorry state. But maybe... MAYBE... once in a while other storiea like Andor will slip through the cracks. Or maybe we'll just all move on to other things anyway
Well said mate.
Jessie Gender made the point that Disney wants star wars to be apolitical when in fact the OT and prequels were VERY political. Hell Lando himself was added because Lucas heard people criticizing the lack of diversity and realized "hey they actually have a point".
The OT was VERY left wing (the Empire is the US in Nam, the rebels are the viet cong).....Hell he wanted Toshiro Mifune to be Obi Wan.
The prequels were also not subtle in criticizing George Bush.
Disney however doesn't want controversy, so they make things as lightweight as they can.
I’m liberal as hell. I am an LGBTQ+ supporting anti-racist feminist. And I am SICK of people like Kathleen Kennedy saying that I’m sexist and racist because I don’t like the crap they’re selling. All I want is good Star Wars stories and Lucasfilm/Disney is failing.
I wish there were more like you mate. Politics is not why these movies/shows suck, politics is used to hide how much they suck imo.
@@SpaceCrowProductions The original trilogy was bold in a lot of ways; even Return of the Jedi, which had ewoks and an over emphasis on happiness, had the balls to actually REDEEM the terrifying villain and show him as a broken man who hates himself
ANH had the empire based on America as well.
As flawed as the prequels were in execution they tried to tell a different story.
Got this on my feed. Good solid piece of work. Keep it up. Liked and subscribed.
Appreciate it mate, will keep it up :)
SW not worth saving...as long as Iger, KK , Filoni and all their ilk remain with influence over the franchise.
Well said, and exactly my point. The issue lies at the top.
@@SpaceCrowProductions Filoni is fine. The problem is more that Disney doesn't like boldness. The original movies were very very left wing (the Empire was based on the United States in Vietnam, and the Rebels were the Viet Cong). Even the prequels cheerfully ripped into Republicans and the war on terror.
But that doesn't fit Disney's agenda so they try to water it down.
Star wars? That those 6 movies released out of order? I think so, for my life, I'm not aware of any additional Star wars past those 6 films. Well, except for the fanfiction we see, good or Disney, which isn't cannon anyway...so
I look at it the same way lol. My head canon is the only canon I care about, TLJ Luke is not my childhood idol.
Me personally would put up with everything Disney SW if they would only retcon TLJ
TLJ was the root of many problems, but not all imo. TLJ was a shitty ego trip for Johnson. The issues with the streaming content lies elsewhere.
@@SpaceCrowProductionsI can see that
@@SpaceCrowProductions Johnson is good when he's playing with his own sandbox and characters. You can be as subversive as you want there. But when you use existing characters you have to build on what came before.
I don't care if The Acolyte is a good show, I won't give any view to Leslye Headland and her narcissistic ideology.
Same, and I won't give a cent to Disney unless the current leadership is fired and things change. Maybe not even then.
It's not narcissitic at all. Wanting minorities to be just as prominent is admirable and any sane person would want the same thing. she never said acolyte was to exclude white people.
The 4th horsemen was solo 😮🤣🤣🤣
It was so forgetable it doesn't deserve a horse :)
Great video, you deserve more subs my friend.
Thanks a lot mate, we'll get there :) my goal is 1000 subs this year.
The only way I see this fixed is to make it as a second universe that's non canon like it was done to Legends (note I think it was good that Legends was made as non canon since things there went way out of hand but this is so much worse in so little time)
Anything to retcon it all I can get behind :)
SW needs saving from femenists. That's all there is to say. Why save Star Wars? Because you got to respect it for the universe and lore created there. Something like that doesn't happen every day. If I showed you a picture of an obscure SW spacecraft and said it's just a spacecraft, you'll know it's SW at first glance. That loyalty to the look of the universe is to be admired.
Uh feminism isn't the problem; centrism and a desire to not experiment is. A confident female isn't a bad thing yet such a character is always called a bitch.
The kind of people bleating about SJWs and feminists are the kind of people who think that men should be allowed to beat and rape women, that women should be chattel, and minorities either shouldn't exist or be subservient.
Having more people of color in the franchise is probably one of the only things disney is doing RIGHT.
I have very mixed feelings about a lot of the disney stuff:
1.) Mandalorian: I rather liked the first two seasons. Din is a great character (as is Baby Yoda), and it addressed some of the only problems I had with the OT (the tuskens were racial stereotypes; the Mandalorian made them a lot more nuanced. Whatever problems the show has, I will always applaud that). The scene with Bill Burr and his former commander was utterly chilling, and the Dark Troopers was a nice tip of the cap to the EU.
2.) TLJ: I can respect that Jonson wanted to be different be ignored established characterization to make it work, and he ignored logic as well.
3.) RoS: I admit Harrison Ford's cameo was genuinely nice, but otherwise it was tepid.
4.) TFA: I liked it on an instinctive level but it was what made the problems start.
One thing that came out is that Michael Arndt was originally supposed to do Episode VII but wanted more time, at which point they shitcanned him.
Boba Fett was disappointing; I would have liked a more ruthless Boba Fett.
High Republic I haven't read but I think the idea is fantastic. Seeing the Old Jedi in their glory days before everything went so wrong.
Nothing needs saving.
1:09 see at first I was pissed at you for shitting on rogue one, but then I remembered it was the first mediocre one after so much bad and one amazballz one tnataint so great in retrospect so even that is nostalgia now
Had the same experience mate, upon rewatch, it really isn't a great script but a well made movie nontheless.
Deborah Chow is not a bad director. She directed episodes 3, 7 and 21 of the Mandalorian and in my opinion those were well directed. My guess is that Disney just did not give her enough time to work on the Obi Wan show.
The way I see it is that she had way more freedom with Obi Wan. And that show is directed worse than a college project lol. But maybe youre right, her direction wasn't an issue with mando that is fair.
Or gave her too much freedom which is equally harmful
@@SpaceCrowProductions I liked the scene where Vader and Kenobi have their second fight. It showed that at the very least Hayden CAN act.
They want it, they can have it. Now instead of watching Star Wars and the franchise they love, women can have them and men can cheat more to make up the difference.
The fact that we have fans that will watch literally anything Disney puts out and praises it despite the Quality being bad. It has Star Wars in the Title. Its the entire Fanbase. We watched and supported Rogue One and that was an unnecessary cash grab. We watch The Mandlorian despite the massive holes in the story, we even Support Andor which is so boring because once again were watching how the Rebellion got started again. We know how bad the Empire are, we know the Rebellion is small, we know how Andor will die. Andor is piss poor fanfiction with Star Wars in the title. All these series have extremely low Stakes. Nothing of importance is happening, we don’t care about the characters, they feel like bad fanfiction, we just get keys jangling and nostalgia. Until the fanbase treats all projects like they Treated Solo, we're gonna always get storys that take place between Revenge of the Sith, and A New Hope. The samething again and again. Star Wars needs to move towards the future.
Andor actually shows the nitty gritty of the Empire's evil. We saw high profile atrocities like Alderaan, but we don't see the banal evil of mundane fascism. Andor shows that.
Star Wars doesnt even need saving. If you say Star Wars is dead your not even a true fan. Yes Star Wars had its hit and misses with a few shows but who cares.. it's Star Wars, and its going to be around for along time. As a fan myself I like the new shows though i don't like most of them. Kenobi was a 6/10 for me BOBF was a 5/10 for me. And Mando season 3 was a 5/10 for me. But the other shows like Andor and Ahsoka were a 8/10 for me. I love both legends and canon. Before anyone call me a shill just note that Darth Revan is my favorite character adter Anakin/Vader.
Consume product while waiting for next product
@@MrWepx-hy6sn your point?
Eh, if we're going to be honest, the Fandom is part of the issue. Especially their focus on diversity.
To look at the show Kenobi (as that was the one that broke me on Star Wars): The biggest problem was not Reva. Sure, she's a crap character but she wasn't the worst problem.
It was the out-and-out character breaks.
For example, the Emperor, a LEGENDARILY PARANOID figure, who has just had a surviving member of the Jedi Council make an assassination run on his #2 and what does he do? He decides to tease Vader about it. No attempt to find and eliminate Kenobi (and, in a bureaucracy-heavy organization such as the Empire, it's not going to be hard to find the requisition forms for the troops that Reva took to the moisture farm), no security crackdowns on Alderaan or Tatooine, not even doubling down on his own security. Just teasing.
And, of course: "My Brother is dead......Well, seeya."
But the break point for me was seeing Kenobi tell Anakin about learning mercy then immediately showing why mercy is a chump move. This was where I broke.
And this is where the Fandom is part of the problem. Instead of focusing on legitimately terrible issues, too many of the Fandom focuses on "The Message" which, in turn, is a terrible look. You can list out Reva's terrible decisions but, as soon as your criticism starts wanderiing into "diversity checkbox" complaints, you lose a lot of legitimacy as you make yourself look like someone wielding a Tiki Torch in Charlottesville.
The whole concept of Kenobi was completely wrong from inception. Kenobi's job was to look after Luke, not Leia. All they wanted to do was have a nostalgia bait show to have another fight between Kenobi and Vader. Just a cash grab.
I agree that Reva wasn't the biggest problem, but she was one of the main ones. The reason I highlighted it is because she is a very fitting example of the scummy strategy disney uses to avoid talking about real issues with their content.
@@SpaceCrowProductions At the very least it showed that Hayden can actually act.
Great video! Personally I think that Disney doesn't understand Star Wars on a fundamental level.
From an outside view it would appear that SW is all about the Jedi vs the Sith and the constant good vs evil struggle. There's a lot of that, but I think that Star Wars is a lot more of that George Lucas weirdness/silliness. For example, the goofy looking creatures, the weird alien languages, the dumb names, the Disney aliens are kind of boring.
Disney would NEVER, come up with a character like Watto, not in a million years. Or even Jar Jar Binks, which is a stupid fkn character, hated by many, but that's what makes Star Wars, not the blue (good) vs red (evil) stuff.
Thanks mate, well said!
I wonder if we have reached a point where there is more bad Star Wars than good Star Wars.
@@davepost7675 I think we did, a long time ago :(
It's dead.
But somehow... Star Wars has returned.
@@SpaceCrowProductions no ones really gone
bro making fire videos
As a fan of movies and games if a directors 1st first words are about their sexuality or something imma immediately check out of anything else you gotta say. Cause maybe its just me... but your gender or preferred prounouns have nothing to do with making entertaining products.
That's a childish thing. We NEED to have sexuality and diversity.
@ryanmoore6259 Why? Why is it so important for me to know that Tim Drake is gay in Gotham Knights for example? What does that do for the game? Might be a cool little fun fact, about him but literally does nothing for me in terms of his character. I don't need to know his sexuality when my goal is to stop a bad guy from doing crimes in Gotham city.
@ryanmoore6259 I am not against those things but we don't NEED it in games.
I hate rogue one and I hate andor and a lot of people feel the same way, so no, rogue one and andor are not universally praised and liked and they are extremely far far from great, these two fanfictions are just as divisive as all of Disney Star Wars put out.
I know they are not universally liked, a lot of people hated Andor especially. I'm personally not a fan of Rogue one but I loved Andor. I respect your point though, to each their own.
"Okay, I think we're at the point where we need to admit that this was never really a great franchise and we keep trying and trying and trying to find this thing that was never really actually there"
"Yep, Star Wars Was Never Good"
I like Star Wars :) I would get this point if it weren't for the OG trilogy, and calling them objectively bad would be a wild stretch imo. But to each their own mate
@@SpaceCrowProductions Honestly only Star Wars 77 and Empire
strikes back are the only movies that I’d actually call “good”.
@@cole_man.exe_2002 ANH is fun; I'd give it a 7 because the second act goes on a little long. ROTJ has GREAT moments.
@@cole_man.exe_2002 ROTJ has both good AND bad moments; Luke's battle with Vader and the Endor space fight are among the greatest scenes of all time
Ahsoka was okay? Lol they’re all just bad
I really didn't like it but objectively it wasn't awful. I just hated it due to more subjective reasons, which is why I remained diplomatic for this topic of a video, focusing on a bigger picture.
This bloke says he has Star Wars fatigue - yet when they do something new with queer characters he’s still not happy 🤦🏻♂️ sheesh 🙄 some people are just determined to be unhappy
I must be hard to please. Lol.
@@SpaceCrowProductions I will say that having more queer and poc characters is a good thing. The Sand People are also given a lot more nuance.
Literally nothing needs saving. The vocal minority of the fandumb just has really good fan base within incel communities. But StarWars has been and always will be okay. This is just a weird rationale but if that’s what you need to get thru it I understand
So you’re just gonna blatantly ignore how bad all these shows were? 💀
That's completely offensive and you must not even understand Star Wars, or good stories in general. What a sad loser.
I agree that the incels are a massive problem but there are issues. Disney doesn't like being bold and prefers cookie cutter stories. The OT was great BECAUSE it was so bold; even ANH was bold for it's time (coming out when everything was bleak), while ROTJ took the time to subvert the "evil dragon needs to be slain" idea by making Vader a broken man in need of help.
Even the prequels, while flawed, tried to tell a different and ambitious story. You can say that Lucas failed but he at least tried something different to the point you can respect his intent.
Rian Jonson botched it badly but he tried to do something different; granted he sucked at it but he at least tried.