Online Watch Prices ARE GOING TO GO UP!! - RANT - Chrono24
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- Опубликовано: 18 окт 2024
- Online Watch Prices ARE GOING TO GO UP!! - RANT - Chrono24
In today's episode of Federico Talks Watches I talk about the future of of online watches and online watch pricing. Chrono24 has decided to raise there fees today with VERY short notice and this will affect the market. Let me know what you guys think below!
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Fed, another option would be for the dealers to remove inventory from Chrono24. If Chrono24 has 1/2 the available inventory visible, they may see the light.
That is also a possibility. The monthly membership fee won't be worth it if we don't make sales at the new inflated prices.
Due to fees charged by E-Bay and Pay Pal, I stopped using them as a sales venue. I suspect Chrono24 may see more than a few dealers ( that have websites ) remove inventory. I feel your paid Fed.
@@FedericoTalksWatches No Fed, it is absoulety what you and any other dealer that does business on chrono24 should do. No question. Myself hearing that a company is doing this to you guys, secures that I will never do business on chrono24. Just like ebay. They're doing it to themselves. NO ONE IS GOING TO PAY MORE FOR WATCH JUST BECAUSE IT'S ON CHRONO24
Chrono24 should maybe...... Just go away. I think I would have said bye bye to them. Every one of you guys should just stop doing business through them.
michael jordan Whether Chrono 24 is smart or not remains to be seen. It’s only smart to raise prices if you can get away with it. It’s stupid if you can’t. Sounds more like a wager, or a Hail Mary play, to me.
I WILL NOT BE BUYING JACK FROM CHRONO24...ALWAYS STICKING IT TO THE CONSUMER!
me too, no way I am using C24
This is all leading to a big bubble burst. Swiss watch prices are getting out of control and this market will burst. Once the economy takes a hit, one of the first things to feel the blow will be luxury items like 5-50k watches. Everyone is trying to cash in now because they know this cannot last.
I think Chrono24 underestimates the innovation possible with increased financial pressure. Someone will capitalize on this change
I must admit that I have never bought a watch from Chrono24 but usually went there to see what the most I should pay for a watch.
They are also a aware of this, that many use them as a pricing guide. They are trying a new monetization strategy... Kinda crazy though
I use it for that purpose only. Then say to myself how much do dealers shell out for it. And it’s way below what Chrono24 advertises. So it makes no sense to sell my timepieces.
I guess if I look for something on their website, I'll use a vpn, and change servers on both ends.
I see that the Rolex prices have gone up. I'm sorry but some of the prices are starting to get ridiculous.
100% Agreed.
Over priced
Hell ye. I mean.. If it's gonna continue like this I'm gonna lose the passion for watches. I know it's connected to demand and supply but the value increase of a regular sub these past years is just.. ugh. Bubble. The pricing is out of control.
its because of videos like this! whats going to happen is eventually just like everything the rolex will lose value once the market gets saturated
Yes, It's overhyped atm. And soon it will.
Not to be a dick, but I can’t say I have much sympathy...
Grey market was appealing because it kept the AD humble. Now, it seems like the grey market is drying up the stock and charging whatever they want.
Can’t seem to get a discount at the AD, nor get a good price (aside from very few select models) on the grey market.
K.D.P. Ross not entirely true...grey market dealers will take a lot of undesirable models [at a discount] in order to get access to a lot of highly desirable models. They used to get the highly desirable models at a discount too but that doesn’t seem to be the case anymore since the demand is so high.
THAT is why the profit margins are so low. Also why you can get Daytonas, hulks, Batmans, etc pretty casually if you have the coin.
I've never bought a watch through Chron24. They are a middle-man. Going to the source will net the best price. Find the watch you want then contact the dealer directly.
Fed, long time fan and small business owner myself. Feeling the squeeze sucks and thanks for you honesty. Squeezing the middle market dealers is obviously better Chrono’s bottom
line. Maybe the watch companies themselves (Rolex and AP) are pressuring them to keep grey market dealers scrambling for inventory while it dries up?
Chrono24 may double their commissions, but they need half of the inventory (which is already insanely huge), to make the same amount of money.
Keep up the honest work and keep pounding out videos. I love your approach to timepieces!
Thank you for the head's up. I bought 2 watches through them the past 2 months. I guess this is the end for me on that platform. Too bad because their platform is great. And their trusted checkout did make it carefree for the consumer. But some websites like yours are great and I check it frequently. I won't have an issue buying from you and some other websites directly and that is what i am going to do from that point forward. I have my eyes on that bronze tudor you have listed.
Dont renew your membership. Your gratest window is your youtube channel
Simple solution / decision
Dump Chrono 24..
Not that easy, I do a decent business on Chrono24. But we are definitely re evaluating.
@@FedericoTalksWatches
Maybe a group of dealers can band together and send a message to Chrono 24...
Power in numbers..
I'm working on better solution - orolo.co - a search engine for watches from only the top dealers. Happy to add Delray Watch.
And Delray is now on Orolo \o/
Chrono24 is a terrible company. I bought a gold yachtmaster with them. My watch got stuck in customs for almost 4 months, I had to fight with Chrono24. I was able to get a letter from customs that stated the Rolex was a fake. I truly believe that if I was not an attorney and somewhat familiar with imports, I would still not have gotten my money back. When it comes to online purchases it’s best to stick to eBay!
I agree with you Fed, interesting moves lately in this sector like Chrono24 vs the new ‘eBay Verified’ thing where they may charge as much as a 20% fee just to verify your watch is real, then list it for you like they do with handbags. Maybe chrono 24 looked at that and thought they would be way cheaper so are trying to even it out in the worst way for dealers
Fed, sorry if I have a hard time believing that the average margin is only what you’ re saying. So as an example the hottest boys on the block at present- Daytona ceramic or Pepsi- what are you offering a punter for as new unworn B&P ? $17,500-18,000? If dealers are only making 8-9% ?
Because There are many dealers involved. I buy a daytona from a dealer who buys it from another dealer who also buys it from another dealer. There are usually many middle men in most deals.
HOWEVER if I have to buy one to keep in stock then I will definitely be making a higher margin. But most sales are watches that are requests and you have to source.... If I sell a daytona for 18000, I will probably stock it at 16,500.
Federico Talks Watches Thank you.
Hmm doesn't eBay and Stock X charge 10% fees? Doubling it over night is a lot, but 5% doesn't sound too excessive. eBay also has way worse quality of users.
I want a sea dweller 50th anniversary but no one has it. Chrono24 has a bunch and i would pay $1200 more than retail. Should I wait until authorize dealers get one or just buy on their website?
It sounds like desperation on their part. Any business resorting to doubling their fees practically overnight has gotten something in its business model wrong. What kind of company do they think they are? A pharmaceutical company? :) They aren't selling chemo drugs.
Thanks for letting us (me) know. Bought my alpinist on Chrono24 earlier this year. Nice place to compare prices, but lately I've noticed a general rise in prices overall. Looks like things are only getting started.
You just made me understand why I got charged a fee by chrono 24 once, for a watch I never ended up getting, from a dealer (essential watches) who ended up selling it to someone else. The saleswoman, Irene, was so rude about the whole situation too and had tried to make me buy direct from her via bank transfer. Which i refused. They have a great inventory, but highly recommend you guys shop elsewhere.
Because of its international platform, Chrono has the largest and most varied inventory than any other single website. Today's inventory is 407k watches. That being said, the prices on Chrono are rarely anything to get excited about. (And now the listed price are likely going to be increasing?!) I use Chrono more for research than for purchase. I browse Chrono to find watches I might be interested in, get a reference number then start searching elsewhere to find the same watch at better prices. So my recommendation to dealers is to optimize your internet presence and sell there. That's where I'm spending my money.
And... that will be the downfall of Chrono24. I never used that platform to buy, but I looked all of the time. Now I'll probably just go directly to the sellers site. I can only assume I'm not alone.
Its a very good platform. But this will definitely affect pricing.
Definitely not alone.
As a guy hoping to save for a watch, seeing the price increases for tons of watches, i am getting lost on where the hell to do business... This time period feels overwhelming. I hope the market pricing will go down in a year or two rather this constant creep up...
Federico, going forward, are you allowed to price your watches differently on your site and chrono24? Or would you advise to contact directly to avail oneself of the 'direct to dealer discount'?
We can price differently
It doesn't matter if dealers are putting up prices. Dealers need to sell. I regularly make offers on Chrono 500 to 600 euros under the list price and get a sale.
Chrono24 is 💩 the prices you see there are higher than the most expensive watchmaking jewelry in my city, it's just not worth it.
I stopped selling guitars on Ebay years ago for the same reason. The fees made it impossible to make a profit. I couldn't raise prices to cover the fees because their is a lot of retail competition for merchandise same as mine. Personally, I don't shop for lowest price, I shop with trusted merchangts either online or in person.
Hey I have a question about selling on chrono24 is it safe because I’m selling a watch more then 20000 dollars
I understand why Chrono 24 would raise their cut but 100% is extreme however what do you think would have been an acceptable increase without causing dealers to react?
I got my IWC Aquatimer 3548 from a Japanese based dealer who listed the watch on chrono24. Chrono 24 gives the dealers added exposure but I contacted directly the seller and got it outside of chrono24 for less money! Let them prove that I was the same buyer screw them and Ebay...I win and the seller wins!
Its up to the seller to prove to chrono24 that it was a different buyer. Its not always easy unfortunately.
Holding off on watch purchases until this settles out....just checked out your inventory on Delray Watch Supply. Com - amazing merchandise!!!
How can one get into the high end watch business(rolex or Bretling}? I thing buying privatly is the best way to buy? or from the dealer( Ottawa Canada has only one dealer(rolex-Tudor watch} It seems like a small % business and high risk-how do you make any money? Thanks Al. (from Ontario}.
If you don’t have trusted resellers relationships then eBay and C24 was a good place to ensure peace of mind. It’s the number 1 concern when buying preowned or gray. The higher the risk the higher the returns so you could get the deal of a lifetime or get shafted. You pay more for the guarantees because it lowers risk. So the first you should do is to find guys you trust then these fees do not apply to you. Can you find better prices than Delray? Maybe but if it’s a couple hundred more on a $4000 watch, to me it’s worth it. Especially if you have a guy like Fed, you know he’ll back you up if there’s a problem. Of course if you don’t mind paying full retail at an AD then none of this applies to you either.
I actually had a really hard time trying to list my hulk on chrono24. They put me through 7 layers and still haven’t approved me. I gave up. Terrible set up
You’re not over reacting. Perhaps, it is time to follow Marc @ Long Island Watch. He’s walking away from Amazon. I have dealt with Marc. He,is honest and fair. Sorry for plugging him on your channel, but you sell different kinds of products. Je is not competition to your business. Keep on keepin’ on Fed!
Jeffery Neu and he make excellent videos all about watches!
Sorry, just making sure that I understand: you are saying that they are doubling their cut from 3 to 6%? Meaning that is 3% more for the seller/buyer? Meaning for example, USD150 more for a USD5000 watch? I understand that is a bad business practice, but it doesn't sound that horribly bad. But probably I'm wrong. Anyway, thanks for the video.
Daniel Gallego He is saying that the overall profit margin for selling watches on Chrono24 is slim to begin with. 100% increase cuts into his business model deeper than he would like to afford. He has choices. And number one choice would be to dump Chrono24. Other vehicles available for Fed to advertise his wears.
Federico, good things don't last. I use Chrono24 but now I'll have to consider working directly with the dealers for better pricing. Thank you for the FYI.
Since, I just red bad comments regarding this topic, I want to share my experience.
I just bought my first luxury watch (Navitimer A23322 silver dial and bracelet!) on Chrono24 from luxury time, who is considered a trusted german dealer for 3.5k in topnotch condition.
For me I see it as a fair prize and I´m over the moon with it.
Customer support was available also. So Thumbs up from me for Chrono24.
For the dealers and your situation, I totally get it.
I don't know anything about the dealer side of the watch business but it does seem to me that it would have been a good idea for Chrono24 to have an explanation of the increase and the short notice. If there's value added for the dealer then it makes sense to increase fees. For example, if there's been a huge increase in exposure to buyers, then that should be worth something to dealers. Conversely, if there's been a large increase in expenses for Chrono24 then maybe it could have been part of their explanation. As it is, what it sounds like is they've changed their accounting practices, which usually happens when there's a change in ownership, but could happen for other reasons, such as a new round of financing.
As I said I don't know much about it but an explanation should have come along with, because as it stands they've obviously alienated many with their blunt approach. I sell used industrial equipment online, and I find a few kind words, plus staying away from a combative stance, is what makes things go.
Thanks for the heads up, did they say they were going to improve anything with that bump in price? I mean any justification from their part? you would hope they would pass that along to either you or the customer (buyer) in some way.. improved website, or special warranty, or something...
Hmm buying direct carry's a masive risk for buyers who are not experts, using the trusted route seems better dont you think. cost a little more but no risk.
Well for what I see (last week) Submariner and Submariner Date price has gone down. My AD was offering it straight away without waiting list. So I assume either a new model will be released or this Supercase is not so requested anymore.
Fed-you make some very good points. Thanks for speaking up. I hope that Chrono24 weighs in on this. For now, I will contact the dealers directly.
Thanks for watching David.
The question I have is what prompted the commission increase? I’d have to understand Chrono24’s financials to better understand this. That said, the manner in which Chrono24 did this is pretty bad. Full Disclosure: In just the past two months I bought a JLC and an Omega through Chrono24. Now I’m thinking to myself: “Just in the nick of time!”
I’m too new to watches to be comfortable to buy anything over 1k online, but I do like browsing Chrono24 just to see what people deem the watch’s are worth.
Chrono 24 has become greedy. Time to leave them and use other sources to promote yourself.
I've seen that the shoe website StockX is also selling watches. How do they compare to chrono24 or another site?
Crazy fees, very few if any dealers use em.
Here is another thought Fed...perhaps it's time for dealers to form a cooperative member-owner model. Dealers would be more aligned and incentivized to collaborate and boost sales. A % of the sale goes to the coop, then at the end of the year any profits would be distributed to the member-owners. Get a few dealers on board and it could create a chain reaction, more would join. Make its HQ in US or UK bc of common law/commercial law advantage, also formed as a nonprofit. Easier to resolve disputes relative to other jurisdictions. Hmm....
Hi David, have you ever heard of competition law? It exists to regulate cartel agreements and governs anti trust guidelines. The business model you are suggesting is ticking very much all their boxes to file a lawsuit against it. Anyway, the market will find its ways to deal with Chrono24 :)
@@HSalamista The cooperative business model in the US exists in many industries, (utilities, agriculture, etc) has been around a long time and is not cartel-like behavior. It might not be a runner here as the large brand houses might react to it in an adverse way. Market participants in any industry have found ways to adapt and improve business practices. Some type of cooperative model among dealers might work to improve supply and pricing among the member-owner independent dealers, which is why they exist. The one significant difference here is that w/utilities and agriculture, the products tend to be fungible and are a commodity, ie electricity, almonds, wheat, etc. This does not describe the watch industry, although I was thinking from a distribution vs commodity perspective.
David Williams Hi David, the moment you’ve mentioned pricing, you are getting into trouble! Alignments of pricing strategy is the foundation for a lawsuit and a classic cartel trademark. The other thing is, chrono24 is servicing clients from around the world and sells watches from all around the world. So clearly you got to obey several legislations including the one from EU, which is tough as nails when it comes to cartel behavior.
What I'm scared of is that because Chrono24 is practically every other guy's main pricing guide (even just in private transactions), eventually watches on every OTHER platform (and even in private transactions) will also rise in price. Similar to a classic case of cost-push inflation. AND TO THINK PRICES ARE ALREADY SO HIGH
Yes, end of the day, market price of a good is the price people are willing to buy it at. I get that. But the increase in watch prices over the past few years are pretty bubble-like if you ask me. Let's see how this turns out.
new to the watch game and recently browsed Chrono24 to create a wishlist.... every watch on my list could be found cheaper on other sites
Thanks for the heads up. Love the Seiko World Time clock in the background.
Prices are going up and up. Surely we cant be far away before we reach another slump in the market?
Damn that sucks. As a side note to that, I bought a watch I found on chrono24 tried to message the dealer on chrono24, their messaging system didn't work and it took them two weeks to get back to me at which point they told me it didnt work and to try again. They're useless as a company, I'd already bought the watch outside their platform.
So I don’t know you but I do enjoy your videos and you sound like a pretty reasonable guy. You aren’t complaining they make a profit sounds like you’re fine with that no business can stay in business and not make a profit but I completely agree with you to double their profits and only give you three weeks notice is pretty crappy. Sounds like they gave you short notice to box you in and not give you a choice if it all possible I would find another tool or resource where you can market and sell your products. I would not want to continue to do business with a company that treated me and my customers like that. Good luck in your decision and I hope everything works out and you continue to be successful. Rick
This is bubble, better buy new, buy modern watches from AD, and private reputable pre owned dealers like Fed. Dont buy watches to sell, better save and buy whatch u want :))
+1
I gave you a thumbs up just for your name... Shota Rustaveli ;)
So what will the ceramic bezel stainless Daytona now cost... 50k? Sarcastic, I know, but Ridiculous prices! I have always felt good about buying directly from AD new inventory and skipping these sort of venues.
Buy direct from the dealers. Skip chrono24.
Thanks so much fed for video ! I appreciate the heads up.
Well I look at Chronol 24 just like I look at eBay and if I see something I like I do a Google search for that seller and usually I can find them and I purposely go directly to them so that they don't have to pay a middleman. And now I find out that Chrono 24 still charges the dealer if I choose to go through the Dealer's website
I've used Chrono24 as a buyer and had two bad transactions. Their Escrow service is shit! They don't only hold money from the dealer but also from the buyer. In my case, they tried to negotiate partial refunds for repairs instead of awarding me full refunds. What the dealers offered in compensation wouldn't come close to the cost of the repairs. Essentially the two different dealers I bought from posted misleading listings and then tried to dump their broken watches on me. I agreed to a partial refund on the first transaction but insisted on a full refund on the second. I lost around $600 total for the costs of a repair and a return. Not only that but I also left negative (but, in my opinion, fair and courteous) feedback on a dealer. The dealer had the option to respond to it publicly and did so. After a few days, Chrono24 removed the negative feedback, restored his ratings to 5 stars and I saw the broken watch re-listed again with the same misleading information. Honestly, as a buyer, I get better protection from eBay, PayPal, and even my credit card, than I did with Chrono24. Fuck Chrono24, those dirty scumbags! You don't need them Fed.
Thanks for the heads-up.
Thank you for sharing that helpful insider information with your loyal viewers. This is why we watch, and why we come back for more.
Do they verify if the timepiece is authentic?
Chrono 24 does have to make there money. However the way they did it is not cool at all. I think that dealers need to starting thinking about getting off of Chrono 24. Me personally I wont be buying from them anymore. I'm not made out of money so getting the best price I can is important to me. Fed great video, thanks for letting us know. I'm definitely going to be checking out that JLC on your website.
The watch market is in the shitter expect for some Rolex models and vintage Rolex. The rest of the brands are struggling for the most part.
I was going to buy a big watch from Chrono24 but now I’ll wait to see the impact of their decision on the prices.
How big ?
@@marktuyet 69 mm
WOW bold statement on Chrono24. Appreciate the insight as a consumer I had no idea.
Kind of a bummer. I love chrono24 (for browsing/price checking), and I imagine this will have a more than insignificant effect on the number of dealers and watches on that platform.
I don't blame any dealer for passing that increased cost to the consumer either. It's a business, that's what you do.
But as usual, bottom line is deal direct with the seller in every situation which it's feasible. I hate paying middlemen. I know they exist for a reason but they can avoided sometimes.
Yes, same goes to the inflation... it doesn't make sense.
Couldn’t agree more Federico, if they want more money to ‘invest’ into Chrono 24 then try upping sales through their website to get more commission rather than doubling commission fees! If anything, Chrono 24 will now go the way of EBay with customers very aware of better prices by going direct to the dealer. Mad and bad decision in my opinion, and everyone else’s by the sounds of it!
Wonder if this will also inflate the Market Value of some watches
Thanks for the head's up Federico. This sounds a little like what photobucket did a few years ago; from pretty much no fee for the basic use of the site, to like $460.Then, the locked down any pics you had ever posted to any website, and with no notice. Way to destroy your business. Chrono24 will feel the bite too. Dumb.
That just increases their fee. So it’s really not helping to rise prices.
Wow 100% rise in fees. They must be taking a cue from big pharma.
Yea, stop listing with Chrono 24
Damn, that's a steep increase! Pretty rude :(
Wouldn't be surpriced if some dealers withdraw their inventory from chrono24
I think their customer service sucks... the endorse dishonest sellers, sellers who mis-describe, try to get your to make purchases outside the platform, smuggle goods etc and their protection is only binary (you can have your money back or keep the watch) but when one turns up on a completely ruined strap (after being described as mint condition) they won't ask them to replace the strap and tell you "condition is subjective" Chrono24 is good for locating watches but they really didn't seem to take my numerous issues with a dealer seriously.
So was it minutes or seconds before Fed got a call from the owner of Chrono24?
Why not reduce the fees, the more watches are put on the website? you have only 2 watches, you pay the full price. You have 20 watches on the website, reduced percentages.
Not aimed at you Federico but a lot of watch dealers are scumbags who offer way below a reasonable offer. If you as a seller don’t know better they will rip you off. Watch prices are crazy all over currently, everyone wants to make money, at the end of the day if something is to expensive the customers just won’t buy. Good informative video regardless, good luck.
They must be nuts. I have bought 2 fairly inexpensive watches from Europe (I'm in the U.K.) and it all went smoothly. However to double in 3 weeks their percentage is crazy. If they had said from 2019 it would be bad enough but I mostly use it as a guide for pricing now. Don't think I will be buying any now I realise the prices will be significantly inflated.
Greedy Buggers!
Hopefully they change their mind.
I totally agree with you on this one! Keep up the good work and best of luck!
Thanks Dr. Chreih
Sounds like it’s no better than eBay now. And they have buyer protections there as well. 🤷🏻♂️
If their legacy fee was 2.5%, it sounds like they were previously just passing on their payment processing fees; and now at 5% are taking a 2.5% commission for themselves.
I use chrono24 only for searching reference numbers and finding new models of watches lmao
Well, guess I won't be using chrono24 ever. That's not good business.
Thanks for the heads up Fed.
Hey Fed! I definitely think you should dump them too if you can. I think if you keep them and have lower prices only on Delray Watches and they use that mechanism where they suspect you sold the watch through a Chrono24 message, I think you will end up losing more. Definitely consider it. I think it’s bogus...Chrono24 needs to have a more consumer centric model and appeal to its sellers and buyers if they want people to use their platform
I guess I'll buy before sellers raise prices then
No good short notice. Not good they offer same (good) service as before but nothing extra for the new higher price. That being said, Chrono 24 may just be executing their business plan. They got the market penetration and positioning. Now, they start yielding heavy on it. I got great results buying by these guys. But at the end of the day, you buy from the dealer and is his service what will make you come back.
Funny you’re talking about Chrono24.. I’ve been trying to get this longines chono they don’t want to work with me lol
Appreciate the heads up, Fed.
Totall makes sense Fed. Will definitely buy direct from the dealer.
I just would not buy from those dealers that raise prices. There is plenty of em or just buy from private people. Ps. 3 weeks notice is pretty bad...
Dealer prices go up so do privates prices. Unfortunately this is very common. No one wants the be the cheapest when selling a luxury watch and people use chrono24 as a price guide.
High end pieces, AD for me...good rant..Federico...Trust is everything in the watch world...
What does ebay charge?
Is it true that Rolex are increasing prices by 5% on October first anyone heard anything.
never bought anything on chrono24 and now i for sure wont. The dealers should just all leave, bet they would change the rates back.
Great info! Thank you! I think Chrono24 is making mistake!
Same model as Baselworld. What happened to Baselworld this year?
Appreciate you taking a stance on this. 100% hike, < 3 weeks notice. Way-to-go (out of business) Chrono24. Buy direct to trusted Dealers like Fed@Delray