Commenters Have SPOKEN | Dual Wield Fix Part 2
HTML-код
- Опубликовано: 19 авг 2024
- I heard all your comments and Questions about Dual Wielding in D&D and I had to do a quick turn around with this response video! You all said that Hexblade Warlocks and Hunters Mark would BREAK my Two Weapon Fighting 5e Fix. Here is my Homebrew Theories, Tips, and ⏬ More ⏬
📢 Videos Mentioned
1️⃣ Original Dual Wield Video: • Dual Wield SUCKS in D&...
💜 Support on Patreon: / thedungeoncoach
------------------------------- 💥 MORE Content 🎬 -------------------------------
🎆 RUclips MEMBER 🎆 Exclusive Content for Members:
JOIN: / @thedungeoncoach
🎞️ Video Explaining How RUclips Memberships Work: • Video
🛑 SUBSCRIBE 🚨 and Turn on the 🔔 for more Quick and Efficient Videos!
www.youtube.co...
▶️ Playlists ✅
🥇 Homebrew Rule Systems:
• Homebrew Rules (Systems)
🥈 Homebrew Creation Station:
• Homebrew Creation (Ite...
🥉 Dungeon Master Guide:
• Dungeon Masters Guide ...
📼 Most Recent Video: www.tubebuddy....
------------------------------- ❤️ Support the Channel 💜 -------------------------------
🐲 JOIN PATREON: / thedungeoncoach
🔴 JOIN RUclips Member: / @thedungeoncoach
⚔️ DM Guild FREE "Pay what you want" Downloadable D&D Content:
📜 www.dmsguild.c...
👕 Merch Shop: teespring.com/...
------------------------------- 💎 D&D Shop 🎁 -------------------------------
⛰️ 2D Modular Dungeon Craft BEST Terrain: 1985games.com/...
📚 D&D Books I Use and Recommend: www.amazon.com...
🎲 DM Supply Crate of what I use: www.amazon.com...
🏰 CHEAPEST Miniatures: www.amazon.com...
🎥 RUclips Camera and Film Gear: www.amazon.com...
💲 Affiliate Links 🔗 I get a small kick back from purchases from these links
I really do appreciate it and it helps grow the channel, while getting yall cool stuff!
AND I only put out the best stuff in my "shop"!
------------------------------- 🔮 Channel Sponsor 🌌 -------------------------------
✎ NeverEnding: bit.ly/CoachNe...
💸 NeverEnding Kickstarter: bit.ly/DC_NE_KS
🖼️ Amature Animation Platform to bring your story to LIFE!
🎨 Check out either link above and you'll see what this thing is capable of!
------------------------------- 📱 Social Media 📸 -------------------------------
🐲 Patreon: / thedungeoncoach
⌨️ Discord: / discord
🙋♂️ Facebook: / thedungeoncoach
🕊️ Twitter: / thedungeoncoach
💬 TikTok: Search "The Dungeon Coach"
📧 For marketing/business/sponsorship inquiries, email: thedungeoncoach@gmail.com
------------------------------- 🎖️ About Channel 🏆 -------------------------------
I try my hardest to make quick and efficient videos to make your games more creative and more fun! My goal is to get people thinking outside of the box when it comes to D&D. I want players and DM's to come together and create a game experience that is as unforgettable as the ones I have had over the years!
I have been BLOWN AWAY by the support of my community and how fast we have been growing. I started the channel mid November and we already blew past my first few goals.
🎉 NEW GOAL 🎆: 10,000 SUBSCRIBERS before the end of the year!
www.youtube.co...
Thank you so much for your support in growing this little channel of ours, to get out there and help more people! So stay creative and think outside that box!! PEACE! ✌️
------------------------------- 🔺 Credits 🔻 -------------------------------
🧑 PDF Creator: Mark M on Twitter @trepidventuring
🖌️ Image & Text Editor: AvalonInk @ www.avalonink.com
⌨️ Video Editor: Zack Newman
#dnd #DungeonsandDragons #homebrew
I appreciated all the comments on the last video so much I decided to make a whole video for y’all! 💜
Don't do this homebrew, here's why: Dual wielding drawbacks *do not matter to all classes* such as the Rogue or Bard (Lore College) who don't get a second attack and can't use two-handed weapons. Dual wielding benefits these classes the most b/c it allows them to compete with the martial classes who get two attacks and/or can use two-handed weapons. Your proposed alternative changes little for classes who only get one attack, but unfairly gives four attacks to martial classes who can make two attacks. The intent is only one extra attack roll per turn rather than two or more extra attack rolls per turn. You've basically made the Fighter Brute subclass which never made it into the game because of balancing issues. My concern is not breaking the game, rather, I'm concerned with trivializing a power or trivializing a class. I would rather simplify and speed up combat and I think rules as written suit that end better. By the way, I hate Battle Masters with a passion and I love Champions. I don't play fighter to roll skill dice.
"Let it happen"
"Make it work"
"You're in control"
I love this advice because it is all about teamwork and fun at the table.
You see it!! 💜❤️💜
And another important one he mentioned, "Talk to your players."
I really like the suggestion about instead of criticising homebrews, ask yourself, "How can I make it work?"
yeah, everyone criticize, but is always good to give a new opinion, sometimes can be bad, but you might have the best answer for it and no1 should judge you if you try to give your point of view
And if u r looking for a home rule abot dual wielding, try to use them for inspiration... If it doesn't work for u, just change whatever u need...
Thanks! It’s what I always try and do when I hear stuff!
@@guanacoasesino6495 well said!!
This is the KEY for "positive home-brewing". Too often I see people react very badly to homebrew stuff, to the point of being even plain hostile to homebrewer. But only because a homebrewer shares a house rules online, regardless of the quality of the house rules itself (which is always very subjective), the reasons for doing so are almost never to offend or ruin your game, but mostly because they just want to share it, hopefully to help others improves their game, gather feedback or just to spark their imagination so that they can figuring out the best version for themselves. And if you totally disagree with it, that is perfectly okay too. But just because you don't agree with the shared house rules, you are still not justified to trash or make a person feels bad for even thinking about sharing it. You can of course respectfully criticize and point out alternative solutions or possibile problems with that house rules, but being dismissive or aggressive just makes you a jerk
7:27 - we lost a player running a bard a few momths back.. instead of recruiting a new soul to fill the role, we instead gave the inspiration mechanic to our battlemaster to spend superior dice as bardic inspiration... it's been working incredibly well. 100% recommend.
YES YES YES!!! 100% the stuff I would do! Brilliant
We lost our bard last campaign too, their souls live on through us
Coach posting a whole new video to answer our comments is 10/10 top tier
Thanks dude! I never had such an outpouring so I HAD TO! 💜
Keep in mind, your content, presentation, editing and everything keep increasing. So of course your newer videos are outperforming the old ones. You are *at-least* level 3 now. So pick your subclass because it’s only going to keep going up from here!
So he's... *Gained XP to Level 3*? (I'm sorry)
@@macenanoro826 No, Milestone! But yeah 🥳
What a great comment!! Thanks for that bro, put a bit smile on my face
@@macenanoro826 oooooo I’m giving you 300xp for that joke! Well played!
Yo, this was wholesome asf ☺
I personally don't have the mental capacity to think about all these interactions, so I'm grateful to the people that do think about that and (politely) share their analysis.
Hahahaha I love that, let the others crunch all the numbers!!
One comment I gotta say, “main hand/off-hand” are 3e hold overs is a term that isn’t used in 5e PHB. There is no difference which weapon or hand you use. The rule basically is bonus action to get one more attack when using two weapons.
That said when duel wielding in real life. You don’t usually use the two blades fo fight multiple opponents. The advantage is being able to attack, overwhelm, and defend from various angles which would be limited w one weapon. That said the rolling the duel wield into one attack makes a lot of sense.
Your 100% right, didn’t mention that, but agreed! Went and checked... so weird
I'd just like to represent Min-maxxers everywhere and say we appreciate the ideas
Hahaha I know right! I could totally see some awesome min maxed dual wielders from this lol
Maybe even worse than my double greatsword magic Barb from Pathfinder 1e 😂
I like the inspiration of the goblin boss statblock. If I recall correctly, they can make two attacks, but the second attack is disadvantage. So perhaps allow a player to make the off hand attack for free at disadvantage or for a bonus action as a straight roll. This also prevents a rogue from using the free offhand attack for sneak attacks.
Ooooo I love it and great example!
Can rogues use sneak attack twice in one turn?
@@relzyn5545 no. They can make 1 per turn, but say they miss the first attack with their attack action. They could then strike with a bonus action to make a second attack which could proc sneak attack. EXCEPT in this design because you can't have disadvantage at all to get sneak attack (clearly stated in sneak attack description).
Note, it's possible to get sneak attack twice in a round. Not turn, round. This works by using your reaction to make an attack that qualifies for sneak attack
I Honestly always felt fighters base class should be what "Battle master" is, and the way WOTC puts out new content it seems like they also feel the same, this is why i think Tashas added a Fighting style to give a battle master maneuver, they already have a feat to give one. as well as one of the only sub classes (other than beast master ranger) to gain new stuff and then they made a whole section for Battlemaster builds.
I've been making this argument for a while. Appreciate seeing it from someone else
I love how this is a true DM coach moment. If it is fun or you can make it fun you are the DM. You can do it. Use your DM super powers for fun.
Honestly that’s the feeling I had to go make the video! Had to do a quick turn around but was a good “coach moment” 👍🏼💪🏼
Things like lore, setting, story, and flavor interest me more than mechanics. So the idea about Ranger's Hunter's Mark and Favored Enemy synergising really speaks to me. Lore and flavor combining with mechanics in a way that just feels right. I imagine something like a mass combat, when out of the melee, a member of the Ranger's Favored Enemy presents itself. The Ranger's eyes narrow, their arms seem to take on new strength, weapons flashing almost faster than the eyes can see to take down this hated foe. I get chills. :)
My ranger homebrew (without Spellcasting) replaces Hunter's Mark with almost exactly that! 🤩
@@skeetazaurus I love spell-less Rangers!
Dude... I got chills reading your comment!! For real! OOOOOOOOO YEA!!
I really appreciate your videos and how you are never dismissive of opposing views. I have disagreed with several of them, but you are still probably the closest RUclipsr to my philosophy of homebrew. Thank you.
I have thought about dual wielding several times, but never really fixed it for a few reasons:
1. I haven't had a player take much interest in dual wielding yet. (Technically I have one, but he plays casters almost exclusively, so it hasn't come up.)
2. While dual wielding RAW feels bad, this fix feels OP, even if it is mathematically not.
3. I really want to have something more unique and interesting just more attacks.
Thanks for that, for real! It’s hard to be 100% synced up so I’ll take it! 😄
I totally see your issues, I’ll say this... I am very hesitant to give out more attacks, so the fact that I did is because that’s the “feel” I think that works? But I’m not gonna lie combining them together into one roll sounds like a good idea too
Maybe shield is defense, 2h is damage, and dual wield is accuracy? So flat simple +2 to hit like ranger archery fighting style? Just riffing
I love that idea for the fighter rework. You have just filled my time for the next week.
Hahahahaha literally lol’d I’ll tell ya... just feels right!!
You know, when I first looked at the Fighter in 5e and saw all those Battle Master maneuvers, I immediately wrote it off feeling that was way too complicated for a Fighter, and I never really thought much of the class after that. Back when Psionic subclass UAs came out, and then when they finally came out in Tasha's, I was annoyed that their Psi Die became like Superiority Dice instead of something unique to psionic folk. This caused me to look at Battle Master again, and I was left wondering why these were part of the base class? I have no idea what I was thinking when I first saw this.
Although what I really think I would like to see is have a neutral place for these maneuvers, much like how spells have their own section. I feel like the maneuvers should be reworked so they could be performed by any martial class, but Fighters can spend superiority die to enhance those maneuvers.
I am in LOVE with the "F- it, why not?" Attitude of this channel
I've never felt so enabled to be creative
Many of your homebrews don't translate 1 to 1 to games I DM, but the ideas behind them are inspiration for me in adjusting some of the less desirable systems in the games I do DM.
Omg... that’s the goal dude... YES, that makes my day dude! For real, that’s the whole point of what I’m trying to do! 👌🏼
Yes! I literally do the same homebrew for my fighters. I remove the Battle Master and give superiority dice/maneuvers to all fighters starting at level 2.
Yes! Perfect! You have to give it then so they can have it before the lvl 3 subclass! So your dead on! 👌🏼
wow I haven't found a channel this nice in a long time. I like your style, keep going man!
I honestly appreciate that and am trying to be a “game changer” 👌🏼 so thank you
Your intro to this video was PERFECT. You explained that a bunch of comments pointed to a couple of specific issues with your idea. You explained that you'd already thought about those but you didn't specifically address them in the video. Admitting to your minor oversight shows character.
However, then you go on to explain how you would change Hunter's Mark or Hex or any other kind of buff to keep it from being OP. This sounds like your 'this fixes a deficit I see with dual-wielding creates more problems than it solves.
You DID highlight the most important point: It's all about the fun.
Well done all around.
“It creates more problems than it solves”
So THAT is when you don’t use the homebrew 👌🏼 if you ever feel that way that’s what I’m meaning about not using it 👍🏼
But 100% thank you for that, I try to keep things clear and organized!
i like waiting to watch the whole video before commenting about it but this is great just from the beginning
That means even more then! 💜
I just found your videos today and I've been watching all of them, love the content! This is the variation on dual wielding that I've been working on implementing in some of my games:
"When you take the Attack action or cast a spell that allows you to make a melee weapon attack and attack with a light melee weapon that you’re holding in one hand, you can make an attack with a different light melee weapon that you’re holding in your other hand, adding only your proficiency modifier to the attack roll, unless your primary modifier is negative. Alternatively, you can use a bonus action to make this attack normally. You don’t add your ability modifier to the damage of the bonus attack, unless that modifier is negative. "
Only adding the proficiency modifier helps the scaling of the attack bonus as the game goes on, instead of a rolled 20 main stat at 1st level getting a huge bonus to this attack at early level and it never changes. This also lets characters like eldritch knights still get that cool dual wield gameplay while also being able to cast cantrips like GFB. It helps to not break how hunter's mark/hex works, so no variations there. If you want to go for the dual wielding opportunity to get extra hex damage, then you can either take a small penalty to your attack, or you can commit the full bonus action to it for full accuracy if your bonus action isn't being used this turn. I also added in an extra feature to the Dual Wielder feat to help dual wielders keep up in damage and not fall quite as far behind:
"At the start of your turn, if you have movement available, you can choose to reduce your speed to 0. You cannot increase your movement on this turn. If you do this, you can make your off-hand strike as part of the Attack action in addition to making it with a bonus action."
This little extra makes it so that you can stand still and basically become a small whirlwind of attacks, but it requires you to have the proper footing to be able to do so, meaning if you're grappled or restrained you're not going to be able to do this.
WOW! What a great home brewer you are!! Combined so many things beautifully into one! Glad to have you as part of the crew man!! Thanks for that!
Generating homebrew based off discussions about homebrew, is the epitome of the homebrewing process. Well done. 😁
My heart literally warmed up from that comment!!
When I watched the first videos, I felt heavy anxiety over homebrew in general and fixing something that on the surface doesn't or shouldn't feel broken, but the book itself is a guideline... official content is just a homebrew with a brand name. This video helped me realize that everything about this game is really just a case by case basis.
It's good to have ideas like this for every situation the game may provide, but there's nothing that says it HAS to be applied in every situation in which it comes up. I appreciate the concept of "I'm just thinking of ways to tackle these problems if they become problems and for every other occasion just go by the book" and having roleplay reasons and making stuff make sense in the story is one of my favorite things about D&D. Every game, every table, every player, character, and party is different. What works for one story may not work for another.
There's no one size fits all to D&D. I spend a lot of time worrying that too much homebrew cracks the ice on the thin sheet known as the social contract of gameplay. Sometimes I feel like the balance is there for a reason. There's a reason certain classes to certain things like damage better than other especially at certain levels, but after this video I love trying to find compromises within the gameplay. Changing the game to make it more enjoyable isn't "fixing the game" or "breaking the game", it's adapting to what works between players, between players and DMs. Granted sometimes it feels like giving a non-min/maxer the feat "min/max initiate" and sometimes that bothers me, but it's like you said. It's not about broad-brushing D&D. It's about having an extra blade in your Swiss Army Knife of knowledge to whip out at the precise moment such a utensil might come in handy.
Homie just used his bonus action to give us all this extra DM advice! :D
Hahahhhahaa sundays are my “Action” and Wednesday’s are my “Bonus Action” dude... you just blew my mind!!!
Your talk of the Fighter fix gets me super pumped for your Monk fix! Those 2 subjects/videos are going to be amazing!
I’m planning on BOTH of them!! 100% haha
I disagree with some of the points you said, but I respect your perspective and the options presented. If you and your groups are having fun then more power to you. We just have different styles and I wish you the best as a fellow Homebrew DM.
P.s. I fully agree with the customization and work around for spells instead of simply shutting it down.
Well said man, I respect the hell out of that! Because if I were to play with you and your group I’m sure we’d use different rules and we’d all find the right balance for us to have a blast!
That's an interesting complaint about your homebrew Help action bc I thought it would make a Bard even more powered since they could then bonus action Bardic Inspiration, Help action, giving both a d10 and the Bardic Inspiration die! An Uber Bard!
Yeah, but it would be kinda sad to have your class feature be way less powerful than a regular action you could take
@@AliceIsSleepy that's true but it would only be momentarily less useful as the BI die does scale up, eventually to a d12. Sure that's at a higher level and not many campaigns reach those later levels but adding 2d10 on an ability check, attack roll, or saving throw is never not bad. Plus just straight advantage from the Help action instead in addition to the BI die sounds like a lot too in a vacuum
Wow I love that so much! Never thought of that!!
I'd personally let the bard add inspiration to the help action with no extra actions
March Monster Madness!!!
Also brilliant idea on fighters and the superiority die.
OMG March Monster Madness!!!!!!! YESSSS! Brilliant
Hi Coach. I know this video is now 6 months old but I have only recently stumbled upon your stuff. I love your work and it is great inspiration for me. Based on your homebrew, I thought I'd share what I came up with for TWF, which is a bit of column A and a bit of column B
Normally - RAW
Two Weapon Fighting Style - When you use attack action, you can make attack with main hand and offhand. You cannot make an extra attack with a bonus action.
Extra attack feature - When you use the attack action, you can make one free attack with offhand (so 3 attacks in total). You can make an additional attack (4th attack) with offhand weapon by using a bonus action if you have the dual wield feat or two weapon fighting style.
Dual Wielder, Two Weapon Fighting Style, and Extra Attack - Attacks with offhand weapon do not cost bonus actions - you can make two attacks with main hand and 2 attacks with offhand using attack action.
Might be a bit more complicated? but I think it rewards players who put all the options into TWF and they should be really the best at it.
Dude! I've been saying the thing about battlemaster fighters at my home table for a while! I really appreciate the perspective, and integrating the alternative Homebrew into this response video
What if you just make that duel wield feature one of the "Fighting Styles" for classes who can get a fighting style? Then if your warlock really wants to dip into a class just to pick it up, it's totally justified. Just like any other multi class. Just a thought.
I’d sign off on that! Heck yea! I’ve given it out as a “bonus level up perk” too!
Rewatching an old video and this (@15:55) got me to thinking about Miyamoto Musashi - probably one of the greatest swordsmen to ever live. He was a dual-wielder as well.
"Base fighter should be the one having the maneuvers!" THANK YOU, IVE BEEN SAYING THIS FOR YEARS NOW!
I've been DMing for a few years now, but other systems, never D&D. One of my groups said they were interested in moving to D&D, so I'll start soon, and although I want to experience RAW D&D I feel it will be heavily homebrewed since session 2 (initiative won't stand long). As soon as someone says they want to dual wield this will be their level-up perk.
I LOVE this as a level up perk
I've been working on re-working D&D to use a Two-Action economy rather than Action + sometimes Bonus Action, and one of the areas I've been struggling with is Duel Wielding. But this video really helped! I think I know what I'm gonna do now. Thank you so much! 🥰
I really like that concept of 1 roll 2 weapon swing. That way you can have the bruiser two weapon wielder instead of the finesse dual wielder.
It’s smooth and quick too!
The bard being outshone by the homebrew help rule is....totally not an issue. Helping is an action. Inspiring is a bonus action. A bard with the home rule can do both, and be super helpful.
I like your DMing style. Giving in game reasons for leveling up? That's cool.
YES then they level up and it literally MAKES SENSE 😄
@@TheDungeonCoach I'll have to keep that in mind for when I eventually DM a game. It should be a lot of fun.
I think this is a great video that really shows off how great the community and DC are.
A 'fix' I've been thinking of based on DC's 'free action' is this.
Instead of the other weapon making an extra attack, which runs the risk of stacking certain bonuses too much, the off hand weapon simply adds it's damage die to the main hand damage attacks.
For example, a shortsword with a dagger in the off hand, will deal d6+d4+modifiers.
It achieves the same thing, allowing you to add double the str/dex modifier if they pick up the dual wielder feat, but means you roll less attacking dice and can't stack things like hex and hunters mark.
It could be more 'swingy' with a crit or miss being more noticeable but I think it should work quite nicely.
Edit: just realised DC suggests something very similar this towards the end of the video 😅
Hahaha thanks bro AND we’re synced up too!
Haven't had a chance to watch yet, because I'm at work, but i look forward to it. Love how responsive you are to your community.
I’d be nothing without you guys! So I can’t imagine not! 👍🏼
Finally watched it. Honestly at my table, I'd make the first one not take a bonus, then the player who still wants to dual wield, knowing that they won't do as much damage gets more perks as they level up. I like the idea of level up perks that the players can't choose. It allows you to make the characters fun and unique without having to worry about power gamers.
This video reminded me of a magic item I homebrewed that served as a warlocks patron at the same time. Basically, an Arch Fey pissed of a God and a Devil at the same time by stealing 2 swords and they both independently decided to seal her in the sword she stole from them at the exact same time, fusing the swords and trapping the Fey. The sword leveled with the player giving more powers including pulling the power of one of the two swords specifically and at the planed peak of its power temporarily unfuses the blade and bestows the Dual Wielding Feat for the duration.
Just want to state this but if the power of the blade is inversely correlated with the strength of the seal and if it goes much farther than I had planned then the seal would just break. Not like the Fey was much of a real threat, They were just a prankster that went a little too far that time.
I've been absolutely loving making homebrew features (so far I have at least one for each class except Artificer [I can't think of anything!]), and your videos have been inspiring me a lot, so thank you!
I can't stop making up ones for Artificers! Lol
Looking for ideas?
@@christianstarr9188 Honestly..? yes. please.
@@umbra4729 come to DC's discord, it's a brainstorming paradise🧙♂️
For sure someone like you needs to be on our discord!
Thanks for that too 👍🏼😄
I like your help action homebrew, I've always done: help in combat is the same as it consumes an action, and help for skills checks are limited to the helping player rolling the same check (investigation let's say) and passing a dc10. If the helper fails, no biggy, if the helper passes, they grant advantage. I also sometimes ask how they help. It adds a little extra work to make it still worth it, but not the defacto "I help him do acrobatics better because why not, it's free advantage right?"
when dual wielding, on successful hit with attack, add half of the off hand weapon damage die size as a damage bonus (+3 on d6, +4 on d8, etc). Using both weapons at once should not be two attacks, it’s a single attack just like using both hands to swing a single weapon.
Also, on crits (regardless of weapon or fighting style) just have character score max possible damage and don’t roll anything. That way there’s no chance that you Crit but only deal small damage.
That's amazing!! It's the best fix I have found so far! Thank you man!
The only thing I would change is that you roll a dice a size smaller when dual wielding
Oh my lord! Coach! I want to see that fighter fix! I already added your ranger fix too my games, I love fighters and that sounds sooooo freaking rad!
Pagnabros, the guy who did that ranger fix, has a bunch more stuff. I really like his take on the fighter and it is basically what the coach described in the video.
@@billyamberson2183 Ill have to check that out!
Like billy said that would be a great resource for a SOLID fix that’s out there right now! And it’s on the Patreon under digital rewards that you already have too!
@@TheDungeonCoach well hot dog
Loving your recommendations, keep up the good work. I've got 3 Rogues in my party at the moment, so I may try to make somethingblike this work.
A friend of mine and I were talking about dual wielding last week so it's fortuitous to come across this video right now. Getting rid of the bonus action is a must, it seems to be over punitive when you're already losing AC or bigger damage dice. I thought it would make more sense to get a number of off hand attacks equal to half your main hand attacks rounded down with a minimum of one, this way martial classes rightly get more benefit while still being useful to other classes. Along with this, maybe the free attacks don't get damage bonuses UNLESS you spend a bonus action, reflecting the extra attention and effort needed to use the off hand efficiently.
DC this might be my favorite video you have made. The way you explain why you do Homebrew in the first place is great. You have talked about it in different videos but this really hit home for me. Making sure it feels right...I have been following you since the 6e April Fools video, keep up the great work! Always excited to see you post a new video!
I have never liked the bonus action aspect to two handed weapons and you gave some great ideas I might try in my games. For a long time I didn't even know the second swing was a bonus action so maybe if nothing else I'll allow one offhand swing a turn to stay as a free action.
Hahaha brilliant you were accidentally doing that same thing, bet it felt great 👍🏼 love it
Just saw this video (and the first one) show up in my feed, but this is really clever. I like this adjustment and really makes me think about how to possibly tweak them to better execute what I'm looking for with dual wield.
Dual wield has always been jam. I started studying Filipino Kali in early 90s specifically because of reading the Drizzt novels. Every edition of D&D has fallen short of accurately replicating game mechanics that go with dual wielding, so trying to figure out a good way to better incorporate it without overpowering or overshadowing the other fighting styles has always been problematic. But this is a really neat method, so thanks so much!!
Also, those people complaining about historical accuracy, in a general examination they are embarrassingly wrong, but in the narrow situations they are envisioning then their arguments are valid. So, even if there is supposed to be some degree of historical accuracy in their campaigns, dual wield absolutely has every right to be front and center with sword and board and pikes and spears.
Great content, gonna check out more of this channel. Thanks!
Love this response! The only thing I didn't like about the first video was the possible issue with hunters mark etc. and I'm glad you addressed it
Yea bro SOOOOO many people said that! Felt like I dropped the ball!
@@TheDungeonCoach You make consistently amazing content and admit when you make small missteps along the way. Keep doing what you're doing because it's great!
Bruh, you are killing it. Love this stuff! As a new DM, I'm pretty excited on trying out the Dual wielding homebrew idea.
The perfect dual wielder that I envision when trying to make this work is Gannicus from Spartacus. Plot armor aside, it was combat turned into a performance art, and that’s what the players are trying to create. I like your approach to the problem and the variety of solutions you addressed.
Love this video, Coach. Your transparency and outlook are downright inspirational. Your videos actually pushed me to start making DnD content of my own!
YEA!? Wow dude that’s awesome! We need more creative minds out there!
Really loved both the duel wield videos. But I was really interested about how u give all fighters superiority die could u make a video about how u work that in.
I really have to thank you, part of which is a thank you in advance.
I really like some of your ideas, and those should be possible for me to tweak and include.
I'm currently working on a homebrew setting, in which I plan to play with some friends.
Thing is, it's a low magic setting, with more or less just two options for use of magic: either you're born with the ability to use magic (from either being the offspring of a nymph, which would give elemental spells, similar to elemental bending from Avatar, or from a draconic bloodline), or by using dragon infused items, so my setting will likely focus more on the martial classes.
I love that! I like magic being more rare! Sounds like fun!!
Damn, I'm so glad that you made a collab with Lunch Break Heroes so I could find this awesomeness! Thank you for upgrading my games by miles with some outside the box thinking that's really well thought out!
Always cool to see where people came from! Thanks for that! AND you said outside the box lol 💜
Happy to see you talk about how 5e failed us (Generally a fan) on twf. Or rather how to make it what we want to see.
I have another suggestion which could also be a cool video topic I'd like to see, Homebrew Capstones! Some classes imo have lackluster or outright terrible Capstones and a video on changing them or just tweaking them so that they're really good and thematic would be cool to see. I say this bc a simple change in the Fighter's capstone would be a really cool way of making your first twf homebrew feel good bc fighters would still be able to attack 4 times with twf and just have a unique capstone. Other classes that I feel would be included would be Monk, Sorcerer, Bard, and Warlock (Warlock is simple, just make the 1 minute spell slot restoration an action instead ;)
Some of the capstones are TERRIBLE!!! 100% making this a video topic to write down!!
I tie it to Dexterity bonus. The feat gives you a bonus action, but that's for ANYONE, whether you have a good Dex or not. You take the feat, you can fight with two weapons, one in each hand, using your bonus action for the second weapon. But if you have a high enough dex bonus, you don't need the bonus action, you're quick-handed enough for it be a part of your attack action, and if you have Extra Attack, you need a dex bonus equal to or higher than your number of regular attacks as granted by Extra Attack. Then you get as many attacks with your off hand, up to your dex bonus as you gain with your main hand with Extra Attack. I do something similar with manual bows, with a homebrew archery feat (Snap Shot) that gives anyone who takes the feat an extra shot as a bonus action, unless they have a high dex bonus, then they get extra shots as part of their attack action, and if they have Extra Attack, each Extra Attack allows another shot, if their dexterity bonus is equal to or higher than the number of attacks granted by Extra Attack.
However, I give out more feats than the base game assumes.
I give out more feats too btw, but yea I’ve never heard of tying it to dex like that interesting!
Really appreciated the follow up vid!
I have a homebrew you guys might like. I think of action economy over the 6 second round like this. An action is 4 seconds and a bonus action is 2 seconds. Then movement is free because it's happening during the actions.
The homebrew part is that because of this I allow my players to give up their action for the turn in order to get 2 more bonus actions.
Yes it seems SUPER strong at a glance, but it actually really isn't because it prevents most attacking. It also fixes a lot of bonus action economy issues.
For example a guardian aasamar who wants to activate his wings, attack using a spiritual weapon attack that's already active, and throw out a healing word.
I just went through most of a campaign with a rouge power gamer and it still didn't break anything, even with triple dash.
Love it! I’d sign off on this lol
@@TheDungeonCoach I'm actually about to start up a new campaign and I'm gonna also be trying out your dual wielding rules. It will really help balance out my homebrew rules for oversized weapons
Love your attention to story and game. Making the rules fit what you are trying to achieve seems a far more satisfying approach and more likely to keep the players and the DM happy. Really like what you are doing with the channel.
Bonus perks on level ups seems like a really smart way to tune party balance in a campaign to campaign manner.
What I use is what wotc had included in the first one dnd playtest (before they walked it back in future ones) which is that dual wielding still gives you one offhand attack per turn but it's free instead of costing your bonus action.
The way I run 2 weapon fighting is that you get to attack with both weapons for each attack that you have with a few conditions:
You must have a dexterity of at least 12 to two weapon fight.
Both weapons must target the same creature.
The 2nd weapon only gets half your proficiency bonus. (This helps balance the avg damage output when getting to add your ability modifier to both weapons against the avg damage from heavy 2 handed weapons. Because while getting to add the ability modifier twice increases maximum possible damage above that of the two handed weapon it reduces the likelihood of the hit with the 2nd weapon)
Both attacks count as a single attack for the purposes of any additional effects such as: smites, hex, hunters mark, etc.
Homebrew ideas:
I very like rules. But i very like creativity. So We dont use inspiration. We use cool point. If you are role playing, do something that you can meta play but you twist it and do something good you get points.
When you want do something that rules dont alove (like: lightning spell in Water to hit all enemys, use bonus action like action or when you are unconscious and try to get up, write all of your anger and get pass your limit.) I Say that: ok, you can do that for 1-100000 cool point. Its working in my table. I know this not for every one.
I give you a cool point for making that Homebrew!
I so strongly agree with the importance of how features feel. In the end all the mechanics are just there to make you feel like you are your character in the world.
Exactly the idea of swinging your one sword 2/3/4 times and then your other sword 1 time every time just feels wrong.
Love these ideas!
I just binge watched some of your videos and as a DM, would love to play on your table as a player, you look like you know what your doing and you have really cool ideas.
Wow! Thank you so much for that that really does mean a lot to me. I am trying to get things set up to be able to stream some games!!
Your such a genuine guy! This video was great and for a response to commenters i don’t think it could have gone any better! Thanks and keep up great work, and looking forward to your monster month videos ;)
Thank you for that! I will have to do Wednesday follow ups to videos with big reactions! I feel so connected to the community, y’all are awesome!
This, in my opinion, is peak DM theory. I love it.
I've attempted to balance it out by doing it like this in my game. Looking forward to see how it's going to work out: When dual wielding you can make an additional attack with your off-hand as a FREE Action. This attack cannot affect any other target than your main target and you do not gain benefits like hunter’s mark or sneak attack from the off-hand attack. You can still use a bonus action to do an off-hand attack to attack another target than your main target and gain the benefit of your sneak attack or hunter’s mark.
well, on my table i have homebrew a feat that you can use your reaction to have an extra attack if you are attacking the same target. it works great here!
In my games I only give the bonus attack for the first extra attack (i.e. 4 attacks at level 5 but only up to 6 at level 20) but also make it so they don't need the feat to draw both weapons at once and instead of getting that bonus, I make it so the feat adds +1 damage to all attacks when dual wielding. But I also allow anyone to take that penalty equal to their proficiency to attack rolls in exchange for twice as much to their damage. So it helps even everything out nicely.
I played a dual wielder and my DM removed the offhand penalty, I found it was pretty fair. your homebrew sounds interesting too. i 10000000% agree with battle master maneuvers.
Midway comment re: you're in control - to those who don't like his homebrew on dual wield, this is yet another way you can give dual wielding value. Give that dual wielding player matching homebrewed swords that proc special effects when you hit with one and then the other, or something like that. Now it's flavorful and strong enough to go with that build
hunter mark already has concentration and It would suck to hunter mark a dragon hit it 4 times and then have to either cast it again wait until the dragon dies to place it on another target so there are 3 options with your homebrew. 1 Tell the ranger to bad so sad, 2 allow the ranger to switch targets is while the dragon is still alive and maybe those for hits on the dragon back by hitting another hostile creature 4 times that has hunter mark on them now, or 3 the one I like throw the ranger a bone and allow them to go all in because their hitting a creature in melee range with 2 weapons with a max ac of 17 without multiclassing, feats, magical or homebrew equipment while concentrating on a spell without proficiency in con saves.
Thank you for making a follow up on the other video, coach! It shows how much you care for the community you're building. If you're taking any kind of questions or suggestions from RUclips, I have something i've been meaning to ask (and anyone in the community is more than welcome to respond with their experiences). Recently i've had some problems balancing combat with my players. Two of the group are really into making these ludicrous combos, but they're also really into rp, so i never had any reason to stop them - it's their idea of fun. Damage-wise, this was easily circumvented by adding more hp to their enemies. Problem is, recently one of my players decided to part with their character because she was feeling really underwhelmed with what she was able to do. We tried to talk about some solutions, something that would make her damage-dealing class stronger and tie it to her background, but nothing seemed to fit what she felt was honest, so she decided to switch classes, and it was a very moving departure of the old character from the party. It is the second time this exact same thing occurs in a game of mine: because two players do so much damage, others feel kind of useless. How do you think this could be handled? I never want to not allow my players to do what they enjoy and limit them too much. I want everyone to have fun but it seems there's no way to make everyone feel happy when there's comboing players in scene.
Thanks to anyone who give their thoughts in advance, and have a nice day!
100% bonus level up perks is what I do for this!!! I have a video coming out in one month and a PDF for April is bonus level up perks!
I also have 2 videos on the channel about them too! (One is older)
But honestly this is something I do for my patrons and stuff too!
So my basic solution: watch those videos and give the under performing players buffs to be stronger
If you are interested, I’d say join my Patreon and I’d love to see what that player is playing and what issues they were having and give you specific solutions for it
I hope you understand this form purely a time perspective on my end.
Hope this helps
@@TheDungeonCoach Right! You always talk about them, I’ll be happy to see it more closely how you handle them. Thank you 🙏
Some homebrew combat for yall to spice things up and keep players engaged in the story of the combat. I call it Narrative Nefariousness. In between players turns, the DM will say something about the combat. (ex. The snake wraps around your ally, Belfore, it begins to constrict) If nothing is done to aid that character or stop whatever the DM has said then there will be a penalty. In this example it would be that Belfore is restrained. I like this because it makes combat more community based. Like players will be interacting more during the combat!
I love when players interject like that!
Ex-Rules Lawyer, Instigator, and Insanity Driven Surrealism DM here. Always had a knack for things that bring fun ideas like this to the table. I ask all of you for help. Friend of mine keeps asking for my unnatural wisdom in the games cores roles and mechanics in the game when writing his overly self centered hokebrew. To explain, he's a good friend, a very dedicated dungeon master, but not a very prepared writer. I have helped him crack a few codes, we made some insane homebrews that I'm proud of, but it has gone too far from an ambition to a poorly drawn out necessity almost workaholic obsession to make these homebrew archetypes that follow the niche idea he thought was cools. Its been a year round since these started, but he has definitely been driven to explode his creativity. I don't know how to help him anymore. I can only keep so much creativity for my games, let alone lend him my unnecessary amounts of knowledge in the game (I only have 4-5 years under my belt as fellow math rocks addict, and I'm only 19 mind you). I ask for you guy's wisdom, how can I help him stop, he's burning a very nice passion to obsession, and although I'm the only one currently noting it, I only wish to prevent a situation I've already had once with another person who has already exploded and I wasn't able to act. I want to act soon, and I come to this comment section for help.
Enjoyed the follow up. I’m now very curious about your thought on the fighter/battle master mix in. I like the ideas as a fighter who recently took the martial adept feat along with changing my fighting style to get a couple superiority dice. I’d love to hear more about exactly how you would choose mix these in and scale them. Looking forward to that eventually video.
I DM for a group friends, and 1 guy out of the group of 5, is a hardcore optimizer who doesn't necessarily pick the strongest class for the purpose of being strongest of the group, but instead tries to make his characters cover the most ground in terms of combat ability, skills, and other features. I find it interesting, but sometimes he forgets that he is part of a group.
Heard once that the battle master maneuvers were originally going to be apart of the base fighter class for 5e, but WoTC thought it was too complicated and so moved it to a subclass option. I love fighters, but having maneuvers as a core class mechanic would have made the class really shine and feel fully fleshed out rather than a monk with heavy armor.
Wow yea I can totally see that being a thing they did to keeping simple
Dual wielding WAS a thing historically, at least in rapier fighting. But it was not used „living blender style“, but rather as an additional means to parry and bind the opponents weapon. Here’s my take on the 5e rules: let the player decide whether they use their bonus action to attack with their off-hand, or add +2 to their AC once, to be able to deflect an incoming attack (among other BA possibilities). That way the dual wielder feat would still be viable, by reducing the need for spending a bonus action.
I absolutely agree, as a fighter main, with your fix for them.
Never felt the need to play anything else other than BM because all the rest felt boring and mechanically uninspired.
Dual wielding was a thing, however the off-hand tended to be used for a parrying dagger or similar small weapon (short sword is too big). Rather than using a shield, many duelists would use a parrying dagger to primarily parry/deflect attacks. HOWEVER, fighting being what it is, if an opening presented itself the parrying dagger would be used to stab someone. That's where I think the bonus action off-hand attack concept comes in logically.
I give a host of options with my dual wielders:
- You keep the RAW bonus action to attack with the off-hand, but also allow the off-hand weapon to function as the Defensive Duelist feat. Thus you can use it once per round like a shield to increase your AC, while still getting the slight increase in damage from dual wielding weapons. Instead of using your proficiency bonus, roll the damage die of the weapon used.
- You can use your bonus action to attack with your off-hand weapon. If you hit with your off-hand weapon, you may use a reaction to attack a second time with your main-hand attack.
- You may use a bonus action to attack with your off-hand weapon and give your main-hand attack advantage (so you have to make the choice *before* you roll that main-hand attack).
When they choose their class specialization they also choose one of the above options, as if it was their personal dual wielding fighting style.
I do imagine in 6 edition they'll give the battle master maneuvers to the core fighter and have sub classes give unique maneuvers such a archer sub class gets the precision attack but maneuvers like disarming or goading are available for all fighters.
YEEEESSSS 100% agree
5:53 This is me. A combination of being fairly inexperienced and just not caring all that much. I'm not looking for the most insane combo my class can do. Hell. To my detriment sometimes I like finding some way of taking shocking grasp with characters because I love it so much. Even when it's not a great idea.
And I love your attitude of bringing everyone up instead of bringing the powerful player down. I once stumbled upon a way to get insanely good AC in the early levels. I got lucky with my rolls, so I was able to max out 2 stats. I was a Barbarian with unarmoured defense. So with 18 AC from unarmoured defense and a shield I had 20 AC. Plus a shield I had 20 AC as a level 1 Barbarian. Which felt really nice. I had sacrificed my damage to do this since I used my only 2 great rolls on Con and Dex instead of Con and Str like a Barbarian normally would. I was going for being tanky. That was the point. The DM decided that it was too powerful, so my sword and shield character wouldn't ever be able to find a shield for a LONG time (he outright told me this) and the shield I had happened to break soon after. Like, I wasn't trying to make anything broken, but I found a really cool combo I enjoyed and it was just kind of yanked away from me. I like the DM, he's a good friend of mine, but I can't say it didn't create a feels bad moment.
Don't be sorry, your content is appreciated!
Thanks for that! For real
@@TheDungeonCoach Yeah man!
I used the idea of the extra attacks as a feat instead of a rule therefore there is a “cost”, doing the math, the ranger with hunters mark is still doing less damage than a GWM Polearm build, the fighter at level 20 will do slightly less than the GWM, the hexblade is again not as strong as the usual polearm build, the only one that becomes overpowered will be the swords bard (according to math) because they can now learn spirit shroud and upcast it, for balance I added an “improved hunter mark” for the ranger as a level 4 spell that can be upcasted to level 5 max, so that the damage will keep up and will not stagnate. And you are right you know if your party is min maxing and can act accordingly
I really like the idea of the offhand weapon attacks always being one fewer attack than you take with your main hand. That lets it scale at roughly the same level for each class regardless of whether they're using hunter's mark or Hex, or if they're going full fighter for a ton of attacks. Maybe. I'd have to actually run the math to be sure.
I just found you. I love your creativity and out-of-the-box-thinking... LOL. Seriously, fun stuff. Cheers!
Totally agree with the sentiment of "all fighters should have Battlemaster as a base class feature!" My players and I have similar homebrew rules. We would love to see what your take is!
My idea to fix the boring fighter class would be to rework fighting styles. As they stand, they are really passive numerical buffs and you're kinda locked by you choice of weapon.
What I would do instead is design ~10 Bonus Action fighting styles and ~10 Reaction fighting style. A PC can pick 1 Bonus Action fighting style (something like a shove or grapple, maybe blind an opponent) and 1 Reaction fighting style (like a parry) when they would take a fighting style. This way, they get to use their fighting style each turn, make the most out of their action economy and pull off martial tactics that spells casters don't have access to.
I love your points here. There is one thing I've been disagreeing with you in a few videos, and that's the "if you don't have a ___ character at the table, then who cares." For anyone who doesn't know what I mean, in this video at 07:01 DC says he has a homebrew for the Help action that negates Bardic Inspiration. For a group that isn't playing several campaigns together, I agree it's no big deal. But the caveat that I think is important is that it makes players not want to play certain character options in subsequent campaigns. If everyone can drink potions as a bonus action or grant 1d10 with the Help action, I wouldn't want to play a Bard or Thief. In fact, if I DID play one of those, then everyone else at the table might be disappointed or confused that they suddenly can't do those things they used to because it would negate my class features. EDIT: Thieves can't use potions as bonus actions because Use an Object doesn't work with magic items. My mistake!
To DC's credit, I like that he says he's not a pitiful lil DM who becomes victim to these things. He can make changes to adjust. I agree, but I felt strongly enough about the point to point out the caveat so everyone can weigh it. It's an example of yes-but-no. It's not absolutely true or false, it's just something to consider. :) You can make anything work! In the examples I gave, a Thief or Bard could be given another feature to offset the negation of any abilities that have been homebrewed for everyone to use. These could be level-up perks like what DC suggested.
When I hear homebrew ideas that I think could be problematic, I try to be a problem solver instead of a problem reporter. Anyone can report a problem or throw up a red flag, but few people take the time to build up an idea to make it work.
Technically a Thief using a potion as a bonus action is also homebrew, because potions are magical and the dmg says this on page 141, "If an item requires an action to activate, that action isn't a function of the Use an Object action, so a feature such as the rogue's Fast Hands can't be used to activate the item." Crawford also confirmed this in sage advice. Granted not liking homebrew because it conflicts with your homebrew is totally legitimate in your game.
@@casualPandy Edit: Yes, you are correct, potions count as magic items so the rule in the DMG applies. My mistake!
@@FlutesLoot No worries, It's a super common misconception that's caused partially by the book and where they place stuff. Like for this stuff in particular there's like 3 different locations and two books you need to hop to for a single raw interpretation.
@@casualPandy Yea it feels like running laps in middle school, again!
So I’d LOVE to tackle this comment in a live stream or full video!
I would simply say this
If you came to me at ANY point As a player of mine and told me what you wanted to be, what you wanted to do, what your class fantasy was... we’d find what class was the core of that feeling and be that... then... refused less of currently or whatever homebrews we were using would tweak things around as needed to make YOU shine in those ways and stand out no matter what. I’d adapt my end of the table in maybe the types of enemies or the rarity of health potions, LOTS of stuff.
And as you played, YES I would further tweak with level up perks so you wouldn’t even notice the “competition/ similarity” to the homebrew rules in place 👌🏼
I think my main concern and balance issue is. It makes fighter a way better duel wielder then any other class. When they get Extra Attack (2) or (3) they can effectively do it double the amount of times then any other extra attack class and they get the extra feats and fighting style to not even need mc. So that plus action surge is already beating any other class
Another reason my fighter fix is to take those attacks away
Two weapon fighting: When you take the attack action and are wielding 2 light melee weapon, one on each hand, you can make ONE addictional light weapon attack as part of the same action. You don't add your ability modifier for this bonus attack.
I think this preatty solve the bonus action problem, does remain balanced and work with fighting style and the feat.
I like ya thinking ma man. Playful and dynamic, obviously subjective what's right and wrong based on what you feel from your game. I feel sorry for you having to remind people to think openly. Keep it up man, stoked for the 5.5 edition ur making.
Thank you these!!! Your one pool of inspiration for this game! Your ideas gives a lot of tools for give my players those little boost in their characters.