Half Nelson: Deconstructing The "White Savior" Trope
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- Опубликовано: 14 авг 2024
- [SPOILERS: The Blind Side, Dances With Wolves, Dangerous Minds, Freedom Writers, Gran Torino, Green Book, Half Nelson, Hardball, Hidden Figures, Lawrence of Arabia, The Blind Side, The Help, To Kill A Mockingbird]
Half Nelson was released in 2006, written by filmmaking duo Ryan Fleck and Anna Boden and directed by Fleck. Despite being highly acclaimed in critic’s circles, earning Ryan Gosling his first Academy Award nomination for Best Actor at only 26 years old, the film didn’t receive the widespread notoriety I feel it is more than deserving of.
Upon watching the film, it immediately became and remains one of my favorites, not just because of its exquisite writing and powerhouse acting, but because of its brilliant deconstruction of what is referred to as “The White-Savior Trope”.
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[00:00] - Intro
[01:32] - What Is "The White Savior Trope"?
[03:33] - How "Half Nelson" Subverts It
[12:02] - A Different Kind Of Ending...
[14:31] - Patrons
MUSIC:
All music written & performed by Broken Social Scene: "Stars & Sons", "Shampoo Suicide", Lover's Spit", "Da Da Da Da" 
Кино
The white Savior trope.
It’s racism, but for people who proclaim to be anti-racist.
Indubitably so. This whole video reminds me of that poster the Smithsonian put up last year. They took it down immediately afterward because it was actually racist.
@@TwinTails100 what did the poster say?
poor poor heterosexual white males - hounded I tell you, hounded!
@@TwinTails100 bruh lmao, forward planning is apparently apart of “white culture.” This would be fucking hilarious if it wasn’t posted by the fucking Smithsonian lmao.
Yeah... this is a perfect example of good intentions leading to condescending results
It seems like the movie puts a bigger emphasis on supporting rather than saving. That's such a great message.
Wonderfully said 👍
I really like that. I have a friend who consistently feels she needs to “save” people, and I’m trying to figure out how to tell her that sometimes just being there to support is more than enough.
@@Paul94096 Yeah, my mom is like that too.
I've worked in family and community support for mostly Indigenous Australians for many years and am depressed at how often this trope pops up in real life with white social workers - particularly those from religious organisations. Always better to provide the tools for agency and ongoing support. Just a few days ago I had a long discussion with someone who felt patronised and disempowered by the "help" his young white social worker was giving. It certainly doesn't help that the things we see on screen perpetuate these imbalances of power.
@@grahamcrawford4773 Wow. As someone from a Catholic family, I can attest that religion sometimes gives you a sense of purpose to help others. The down side is it can create people who think they know what’s best for you. They can be very patronizing. I hate that the indigenous Australians are dealing with that. It’s cool that you do that kinda work, though. It’s also great that you are noticing this pattern in your day to day life. I’m trying to get a community outreach worker job in my own country. I mostly hope to make connections with my community and be a useful member of society, even if I don’t make a huge difference. I hope that makes sense. 😂
I love the ending because it’s realistic and plausible. It doesn’t resolve everything, but it’s optimistic. “They don’t save each other, they instead inspire one another to save themselves,” couldn’t have said it better myself.
yes
Gosling did his very best to be not typecast as the hearthrob of the romcom genre and he succeeded. My favourite actor in Hollywood rn. This movie was so good.
👍
Oh that was really cool to see that be subverted too. Like he’s hot and gets ladies, but ends up usually just doing one night stands, ALWAYS being drugged up, and not only that but arrives at his date’s place (I can’t remember, wasn’t she another teacher?) either high or drunk, almost assaults her before she has to punch him to get him off of her, as he fails miserably to find a connection with a date. It’s great stuff and shows how low he can be in another way.
But then he circled back around
As a kid, I liked white saviour movies because I thought they had great messages. It was only when I got older that I realised how stereotypical they are. These movies simplify the concept of racism so much that it’s insulting, especially since it thinks that all it takes is one non-racist white guy/girl to fix these issues.
Well those issues aren’t being fixed by the impoverished population and probably never will be
@@300zxss the whole countries getting poorer by the minute by the time the elites are done and they get along they will only be able to give each other crumbs which is the sad part
Jewish liberal Hollywood loves these movies
There's a comedian is who has become very popular in the last 12 months called Shane Gillis. He has a joke about people claiming they're not racist, to which he assigns an explanation that "it's like hunger... you're not hungry right now, sure! But on your way home from work, a cheeseburger cuts you off. You weren't hungry all day!"
There's a tendency amongst "liberal" (in the disparaging vernacular of Trump) types to view things as a right or wrong, good or bad, yes or no. Frankly, my knee-jerk reaction to the joke was a chuckle and a grimace, and then to try to figure out whether I should laugh or not, which is symptomatic of this dichotomous judgment. The white savior trope falls very satisfactorily into this hole. The viewer wants to experience the feeling of being correct, of being right, of being accepted - accepted within the group either literally or subjectively. I say subjectively because when you are a part of a group, you know what provides you with membership, and there doesn't need to be anyone around in order for you to feel those membership regulations. If you follow them, you feel safe and secure - if you don't follow them, you'll feel uneasy, you'll feel anxious. So what happens when the requirements don't match up with what you feel is ultimately true? In Half Nelson, I think we see the aftermath of this.
Dunn (pun intended, probably) has already felt unwelcome in his groups for a significant period of time. Notably, the character was originally written to be 35, but they shifted some dialogue around to justify having the 27 year-old Gosling play the role. We don't see the details of it, but we are shown evidence. The dilapidated apartment living, the strained relationship with parents and siblings, the distance between himself and almost everyone else, and of course the drug addiction. It all points to someone who has not received the acceptance and, frankly, love that all humans need to some extent. In his case, there was clearly some love shown to him throughout, whether by co-workers and love interests (old and new), but he doesn't trust it at all. Why? Because of the saviour complex. His acceptance within his group depends on it. So what is his group?
Specifically, Dunn's group is his family and whatever friends he might find. More generally, it is America. And what are America's long-standing group requirements? To create value for others, which you are then encouraged to keep and enjoy. But there is a caveat: that value is measured by money. Dunn obviously resents this caveat, which is plainly obvious in the family dinner scene, particularly in how the mother becomes cold and the father becomes somewhat bullying about Dunn's lack of a career and personal life. And yet he feels deeply, deeply lonely and hurt by his exclusion. It is precisely this moment that Dunn goes off the deep end and enters into a massive bender.
So why did I start this all with the Shane Gillis joke? Because solving that conundrum can be done without just becoming oblivious to the issue in the first place, and it is through the resolution to the movie. Drey accepts Dunn with his warts because she appreciates his company and the ability to relate with him. Dunn accepts this help because he lets go of his need to be the saviour. So yes, it is possible to be in a bad mood and think some racist stuff, and that's ok. It's actually just funny. If you accept yourself for being straight and crooked, strong and weak, black and white, all simultaneously, then you can move on with what's in front of you and the people beside you.
Lots of honesty in this film. It's not about fixing, but rather understanding, relating, accepting and supporting.
You comment and your mentality stems from the idiotic assumption that white people are default racists of Planet Earth. Racism isn't an issue that needs to be "fixed" by white people, because most racism doesn't come FROM white people. Whites are the LEAST racist demographic on Earth, which is why almost every white nation is a melting pot of diversity and inclusion while most non-white nations are racially homogenous. If you want to see where most of the racism comes from these days, spend an hour browsing Black Twitter.
This may be me justifying, but this is why I love Lawrence of Arabia. Though he keeps trying to help, he becomes resigned to the fact that his efforts have done very little to liberate Arabia. He's forced to become a killer, but feels ashamed for enjoying himself, enjoying the attention. He feeds into the savior narrative until he comes to terms with how helpless his and their situation became.
Half Nelson is terrific and I'm glad to see a review on it; doesn't seem like many ppl caught this one. This, fracture, and Lars and the Real Girl have incredible performances from Gosling.
Bingo. I actually had a section in the script about how Lawrence of Arabia really subverts the trope as well but cut it for time.
@@MacabreStorytelling ahh, I'd love to hear the intricacies of your take cause LoA is one of my favs. Idk if this is a new series or not, but count me in on these trope vids. Also, I know you've got tons on your plate but was wondering if there's any update regarding the 5 pt plot structure? Those were my favorite series you've done. I've found them quite informative, and dare I say inspirational.
@@thankyoujodi yeah o gotta get back on that. It’ll be a comin!
Lars is a great movie too. But when I watch Ryan in Driver i don't see what everyone else sees in that movie. I think "ugh he's just doing the quiet weirdo from Lars again"
@@MichaelSotoCE haha I always think of the striking similarities between it and Eastern Promises.
The deadpan "namely his addiction to crack cocaine" absolutely murdered me, and I am once again questioning the quality of my sense of humour.
It was hard not to make it a bit of a shock laugh lol
@@MacabreStorytelling I can see that, also, the phrase "crack cocaine" always gets me.
I'm a pretty easy audience man, I should get paid to laugh at mildly funny stand up shows, just to warm up the crowds.
I laughed. I'm sorry.
Though I'm black, I usually hate these type of films because subverting usually means being poorly presented or virtue signaling which are just as bad as white savior movies but I really enjoyed this video and want to check out this movie. Thanks for this.
👍
Where I'm from it's not uncommon to be in a classroom where every student is latino and our teacher is white. But I like how this movie just feels natural. Theres some tension at the beginning but I never feels all consuming. Ryan's character teaches, and his students listen. Reminds me of my middle school sometimes.
The movie dangerous minds makes me cringe so much cause it turns every interaction into a confrontation.
Half Nelson is also really is one of the best films about the flaws of teachers also to a degree, sometimes we forget as students to teachers just how human they are and how crushing it can be if we respected them only to see them fall.
Half Nelson is a true gem I stumbled on Prime. Personally I think it’s one of the best movies I’ve ever seen. The story, the way it’s shot, the acting, Ryan Gosling giving his best performance I think I’ve ever seen from him. Truly captures loneliness, guilt, depression, addiction, and small acts of care or just how even the slightest bit of love can help someone. Such a beautiful movie that had me smiling with that final shot, yet feeling the characters emotions throughout the whole movie.
Good video overall, though I might slightly disagree with framing Gran Torino as a square white savior movie. It might tick a few of the boxes, but I don't think the film as a whole falls into that category. Walt was not a good character at the start of the story through his bigotry, abrasive and uncaring nature, and unwillingness to confront his post traumatic stress from Korea which makes him lash out in angry and violent ways. In the context of the story Walt would probably have remained that way if not for Thao and Sue taking an interest in seeing him change. I think that the ending is a bit too sappy, and the Asian gang subplot probably could have been left out. The way Walt sacrifices himself are a little too over the top and does the movie's story a disservice. It still remains a story of letting go of your hate and trying to find mutual understanding.
Yeah the ending really is what drives it home, especially with (SPOILERS) Walter literally falling back into a Jesus pose after getting shot. It's like... holy hell we get it.
@Tom Ffrench I agree that there are parts of it that absolutely are. Walt’s death is almost silly with how it’s important it is and how the scene was presented. If that hadn’t happened I think it would be more apparent that Thao was the one saving Walt, not the other way around. Walt as a result of knowing Thao and his family made him let go of his hate and reconnect with the world in a positive way, but what did Thao get out of his relationship with Walt? How to get a job? How to talk to people? He could’ve gotten that from another relative like his sister maybe. If there had been no gang subplot it could’ve been a perfect drama, but I guess since it was Clint Eastwood there had to be action and showing how tough he is even though he’s old.
I think adding in a gang was to give a theme about how for some people, the neighbor that the past has once lived is not as peaceful as it is today. Especially when Walt says, "Up with kids these days?". I should know since one of my aunts use to live in the Southern California, and what use to be a peaceful town in the 60s is now all “ghetto”. Now I can’t speak for everyone but I think this is now, how most cities have become. Now maybe it should have been a bit more subtle, but I think it's not a huge issue with the movie completely.
i just recently re watched james camerons avatar and… yeeeeah
This has been one of my fav films for years and this is a spectacular analysis of it. Well done Mac!
❤️
It would be interesting to see an inverse of this. A black character saving a white character (or group) from their setting. Now that I’m typing this, I think a movie about that black guy that made friends with, and eventually turned around, all those KKK members, would be a great way to subvert the trope. I can’t think of his name.
Daryl Davis 👍
@@MacabreStorytelling yup! Great story.
That would be an interesting start, but I don't think that "only" inversing situations is really subversive though. Even with that great "friendship over ideology to change people" story.
Isn't that just the plot of the black klansmen by spike lee?
Doesn't the Magical Negro trope do something like this? Except in that case the black character doesn't save the white characters out of a noble desire to right wrongs and certainly not as a path to self-actualization, it happens just through them being themselves, because... they're magical. In both tropes the white characters are who the audience is meant to identify with, and they're both a "I'm not racist" comfort fantasy - in one case because you're willing to help black people, in the other because you're willing to accept their help.
It's a good movie cause its not filled with archetypes. The characters are realistic just trying to survive with the hand they have been dealt. I like how ultimately its about friendship and true friendship is when people challenge you to grow.
Dang seeing some of these replies makes me think it’s smart to put something out like this every once in a while to weed out the “don’t make this political” people. My respect for you has increased if that balances it out lol
Ugh. It’s amazing too because this is probably the most lax political analysis I’ve done in terms of media and yet it just triggers the reactionaries 😬
Honestly, I don't mind having someone with privilege take action & use that socioeconomic power to make a difference, an ally is an ally, but the trope was getting oversaturated in media.
Precisely. It's about prevalence, not necessarily on individual basis.
🤮🤮🤮🤮
The Wire deconstructed the white savior trope in season 4. It was approached masterfully
With you on that. And yet all the way through the season I was thinking "come on, let these kids come out of this okay", like the simple-mimded softy I am! Viewers must have thought, as I did, that the makers had lost their minds, throwing the focus of such a pretigious, challenging show onto a quartet of kids. What they ended up making together was so good it was astonishing.
Finally someone said like as a black person I don't wanna be mad cause I see the intentions are there but at the same time it's frustrating because it's horrible representation
true
you should be mad
Gosling acts in movies that break the tropes of white men but is somehow also the role model for white men
It's mostly him being in relatable roles. With all visual mediums there's also a lot of 'see what you want' though, even if unintentional.
every generation of actors has a male who is simultaneously the model of modern masculinity while also subverting certain parts of it. it's like an onion that gets a layer peeled off every once and a while
@@juststripes3392 that's not true at all. film as a medium is very specific in what it shows you and how it makes you feel. yes, there is some projection by us as a society but filmmakers are cognizant of this and incorporate it into their filmmaking. ryan is cast in these roles specifically because he is perfect for them, not simply because we like him.
In "Moxie", the protagonist Vivian is inspired to distribute an anonymous zine to combat the rampant sexism in her school by Lucy, the no nonsense new girl who is Afro Latina. While I enjoyed the book and movie overall, I feel like they missed the potential to make Lucy the protagonist instead, since she seemed to be a more compelling character, and didn't need anyone to "guide" her.
Yes daddy Mac's back
Great video as always, I guess I never really noticed how many films had the white savior trope, I liked hardball and the blind side. I’m genuinely moved by someone with no agenda caring about someone else regardless of color but I can see how it can diminish the agency of POC. Very informative.
Yeah that is not to say the films are "bad" but when the framing is the same film to film to film, it starts to form a pattern that is hard to ignore.
@@MacabreStorytelling I think this is something that needs to brought up / stand out in these types of videos more. It seems kinda obvious but I think putting it to the forefront that these are about recognizable patterns more than the movies themselves can help to make the message more impactful imo
Yup. You’re definitely up there as one of my favorite essayists.
"How do I reach these kiiiiids?"
I’ll always love Dances with Wolves. Such a comforting wholesome movie.
I love this movie but can we please discuss them dancing on each other in the gym??? I could never get over that scene, it gave me ick vibes.
Yes throughout the movie I was worried something inappropriate was going to happen. Thankfully that was as far as it ever went but it was definitely sketchy
@@fangal12 thank you. I knew I wasn't overreacting and I wonder what the writers were trying to say by putting that scene in there.
I think it was included to show how bad his addiction is, he is so out of his face he forgets he's dancing with a twelve year old. I've met people who are heavy addicts in the midst of it they don't even know where they are or what they are doing. Then wake up in the morning with half memories and lots of shame.
Its kinda of amazing how I've watched this movie so many times ( I love Ryan Gosling) I never thought about the message or white savior or anything. I just really liked the movie.
One "yay you are back!" to feed the algorithm
Another cracking video. Absolutley one of my favourite channels. Thank you for bringing the existence of ‘Half Nelson’ to my attention. It sounds well worth a watch.
I don’t watch many films, and consequently I’ve never seen ‘To Kill A Mockingbird’ either. But I don’t find the story of Atticus Finch, as set out in the book, a good fit for the trope you describe. To summarise the thesis: the black character in peril is used as little more than a stimulus for the arc of the white character who, in saving them, gains glory and self-improvement, whilst masking the fact that the hardships faced by the black characters derive from our shared culpability in tolerating systemic inequality, not in the wilful misdeeds of a minority.
Yes, in TKAM Tom Robinson is utterly without agency, but this is the point. Black people are so without rights in this period that Tom has no facility to help himself when a great injustice befalls him, and his fellows have no facility to help him either. He is so marginalised we barely hear from him. But then it’s not Tom's story, nor his lawyer's; it’s seen through the eyes of Atticus' daughter, Scout.
[SPOILERS HEREAFTER] Atticus knows his attempt to help Tom will be futile, and will put his own family in danger, but he does it anyway on the principle that it is the right thing to do, and believing that no one else will do it properly, and in hope that a lost argument well presented might at least precipitate more enlightenment in future. He duly fails - hence objectively he isn't presented as any kind of saviour, white or otherwise - and Tom dies. Atticus is saintly to start with, so his attempt to save Tom is not part of a development arc. He shows benevolence to many white people in his community, not just to Tom. But he himself leans for support upon his exceptionally wise housekeeper, Calpurnia, who is black. So, in my view, there is no match-up to the trope. Not in the book, at least.
I saw "Green Book", one of the films used as an example of the White Savior trope in fiction but I don't think it's 100% accurate to say that the film was about Tony Lip saving Don Shirley. There are plenty of moments in the film where Shirley saves Lip and Lip is depicted from the beginning as being somewhat of an ignorant racist, not one of the "good ones" at all. There are no real angelic qualities attributed to Lip or any sense of helplessness attributed to Shirley, both characters have very solid agency. I think it is better to say that Green Book is a closer look at the concept of Privilege and how privilege looks among different people, Tony was a working class White man where Don was a wealthy, Black, Jazz musician. The film explores their identities and how this affects the privileges they have in society.
Yeah not every "white savior"-esque narrative checks all the boxes I mentioned, however with Green Book the main point of contention was the way they altered their relationship. I would check out Shirley's son's take on the movie for more info on that 👍
@@MacabreStorytelling Ah yeah I remember reading something about that when I saw the film a few years ago, mainly about how Lip and Shirley were NOT friends in any capacity, or something to that power. I'll read more about Shirley's son's take on the film to get better context.
Edit: So apparently Lip took Shirley to historically black communities across the United States and never went anywhere segregated. On top of that, Shirley's depiction in the film was described by his family as woefully inaccurate, namely about him being a lonely and bitter man who was estranged from his family whereas in reality he kept in contact with them until his death in 2013.
That really sucks to hear as I think Lip going to these black communities and having to confront his own prejudices as opposed to protecting Shirley would have been more interesting, maybe him finding common experiences or feelings in the people he met in these places.
@@WouldUKindly47 I just don't get how people can write real life people in such a disingenuous way. Just the thought of it puts a pit in my stomach. If this were fictional that'd be one thing, or if the inaccuracies were something like the names of the bars they went to. But something to that degree is frustrating at best
Nailed it! I'm gonna re-watch that movie right now!
Ryan Gosling is a really good actor. Any chance of an analysis on "Lars and The Real Girl" and how it subverts love stories?
This film ran on IFC about a year after it came out i completely forgot how great it was, i appreciated the nuance view on addiction how someone can be a good person who cares about others while struggling themselves
i remember seeing this years ago. RIP 'saturday night at the movies' on TVO. so many classics.
i really enjoyed this video
I never knew white savior was the name of the trope, but I would see it in movies and hate it. Shiit like dancing with wolves and the one with the white teacher just pissed me off lol
White English teacher played that teacher movie for us. Yuck.
@@thankyoujodi well it was based on a true story so....... both the Mathew Perry and Swank movies.
@@jbo4547 they changed the race of the teacher. Lawrence of Arabia was based on a true story as well, just a better one.
@@thankyoujodi true. the Mathew Perry one was actually a white guy tho.
A digression, but it really pets my peeve when people toss "Last Samurai" in with the "White Savior" trope-group
If anything, I see "The Last Samurai" as (partially) a deconstruction of said trope -- for one thing, the Samurai don't win because Tom Cruise character joins their side (in fact, they still lose, irrespective of his personal arc or actions).
Secondly, Tom Cruise character doesn't join the Shogunate Side because he wants to save them; I think it would be more accurate to say that the Samurai *save* him, giving him an apparent purpose and path to redemption or, at least, resolution.
Thirdly, and this is historian coming out, the plot and characters are based on realistic if not strictly accurate history -- the timeline is anachronistic, and the samurai are romantically idealized, but the Last Samurai is taking place during the "Meiji Revolution/Restoration" -- to somewhat grossly oversimplify, this was a Japanese Civil War with one side, headed by the Heavenly Emperor Meiji, fighting to forcibly modernize Japan, opposed by a more conservative and at times reactionary daimyo and samurai class, who saw their power and privileges disappear. Part of the modernizing effort involved hiring foreign "experts" from countries like Germany and France and Great Britain to fundamentally reform Japan's economy, political structure and military. I bring this up because a number of people whom I've spoken with who had seen the film or knew of it and thought of it as a "White Savior" type film had no idea at all about the historicity of the film -- meaning, they had no clue the Meiji Restoration was a thing, let alone an important historic event in both Japanese and world history. Apparently, most of these people merely assumed the events are complete fiction, rather than being (admittedly loosely) on historical realities.
I still haven't seen Lawrence of Arabia, but based on what I know about both the film and the actual T E Lawrence, I'm willing to bet my history degree that calling it a "white savior" work would be disingenuous at best...
Yeah LOA is actually a complete deconstruction of the trope since by the end Lawrence realizes he is so out of his depth and is trying to reign over a people and region he didn’t take the time to really understand.
@@MacabreStorytelling
I know in the film they portray him as either naive or ignorant of the infamous Sykes-Piquot Agreement, knowledge of which was actually one of his motivations for pushing the Arabs to be more assertive and aggressive, especially in taking Jerusalem…
I’ll see it one of these days, probably sooner rather than later, since if you recommend it, it must be something I’d like, based on the other films and shows you’ve reviewed that I subsequently enjoyed lol
Addendum: Lawrence was actually chosen as liaison specifically because he was a knowledgeable Arabian-phile, so if they portray him as a “fish out of water”… well, that’s an interesting decision, probably made to help the audience connect
Paul Mooney had same thinking I had, saying “White man on poster saying Last Samurai, what’s next Movie called Last Negro starring with Tom Hanks.” I did watch movie felt like gonna be white hero troupe but surprisingly was the conflict of Japan and Tom Cruise character that amazing not showing him a savior but as neutral character watching the fall of the old way of Japan. Tbh it’s paranoia from seeing countless movies of white ppl playing any race character and being norm.
Simply put..the Samurai saves Cruise in that movie…that movie is so fuckin far from a “white savior” movie I find it ignorant when people claim it is. Like someone mentions the Paul Mooney joke on the Chappelle Show…
Beautiful video. Well thought out and spoken. Thanks so much for making it!
I always loved this movie but didn’t know why. Thank you
beautifully put
Awesome video, I wonder how has this channel stayed under my radar for so long
❤👍
Grand Torino is far from a perfect movie, but I would say that its protagonist was shown as being very flawed.
I thought that movie was more about redemption for all those years of being mean/racist, and all the people he killed in Korea. All of his attempts to "save" Tao, only lead to him getting into more trouble. It wasn't until he sacrifices himself, that Tao is actually saved. It showed that despite what old conservatives think, people in areas of extreme poverty/gang violence, cannot always just work their way out of it. It took the arrest of the gang members who Walt had angered, for Tao to actually be free.
Yeah for the most part it defies convention… but the ending sacrifice was a bit much IMO. Especially when he falls into the Jesus pose 😬
@@MacabreStorytelling the Jesus pose was the cherry on top that I ended up choking on
This is one of my favorite movies. I'm so glad to see it revisited
I wish I could be a patron but I’m broke
Could you pls do a review of the general portrayal of fathers, and what stories deviate from the common tropes?
I'd say in Gran Torino both characters save each other
Agreed... until the ending which I'd say is WAY too heavy handed and sort of sours the more reciprocal relationship the film established leading up til that point.
@@MacabreStorytelling I guess I just didn't saw it that way. In most redemption stories the main character makes a huge sacrifice in which they put someone else's life before theirs. In a way, it is sort of their final punishment as well as their last noble act. It is more of a trope of the redemption genre. Other examples include Hummingbird, Sling Blade and Tyrannosaur (three films barely anyone has seen, and yet they have plenty to teach us all... wink wink).
Oh absolutely. It isn't about the individual films (Gran Torino is a GREAT movie) simply about the prevalence of this one framing.
@@MacabreStorytelling What can I say? I write a lot and I'm a sucker for some tropes. Not this one tho. I fucking hate that Sandra Bullock film.
Man, Ryan Gosling is hot
This is really really good.
This is wonderful, the way you describe the movie and present the concepts.
❤️
Great video as always! You’re such a gem!
The Bilind Side gets destroyed by critics for this. If it were not a true story it would be the most flagrant example, but it is a true story. 100% true.
Not all that true...
@@MacabreStorytelling Yeah I thought about that right after I posted the comment. The part about them taking him in and him making the NFL is true. But I'm sure they embellished the hell out of it, making Sandra Bullock's character out to be the fearless white savior. I think the psychology behind this type of collective delusion is a little too nuanced for the casual viewer to not dismiss as just another attempt to accuse all white people of being secretly or subconsciously racist. The fact that a lot of white people have good intentions but carry some subconscious prejudices and racial biases is something that is understandably frustrating for both black and white to talk about. Black people have to live out their own subjective experiences as a consequence of it, and the segment white people who dont hold hateful racial ideas in their beliefs, have to accept blind spots in their thinking.
@@lukeyaple5949 The problem is in real life, he had a community supporting him. They made him look incredibly dumb in the whole movie, and like Sandra Bullock was his sole savior. In real life, there were other mentors, and other people who genuinely helped him. It also removed the actual work he put in. He genuinely studied and actually improved himself outside of Sandra Bullock but the movie couldn’t have that. The real character spent a lot of time learning football but in the move, a magical Sandra Bullock takes him to the next level. That movie was literally white woman elevates black man by simply existing and throwing him ketchup bottles to up his football game.
But kotaku and vaush told me that white protagonists are bad
I imagine it's a moot point to try and offer any defense here as I get the feeling your minds made up here, but I'm not sure Vaush has ever said that or would think that.
@@gregvs.theworld451 True or not, I could believe Vaush has said something like that at some point.
@@giantclaw138 I mean, maybe, but as a watcher of his content I might offer as a joke? Like look I know Vaush is a contentious figure in leftism and I'm not looking to draw the ire of anti Vaush people for having the audacity to watch and enjoy his content, but I like to think he usually offers more nuance than that, and would probably denounce someone who did have such a reductive take as "white protagonists are bad".
This is a ridiculous statement
@@gregvs.theworld451 I have not seen that particular statement but after watching him talk about other subjects, it's certainly something I can see him saying.
Same here, I watched thIs movie because of that Ebert episode. It blew my mind, made me rethink Ryan Gosling as an actor.
Holy fuck mac, you never fail to amaze me with your videos
I'll be honest, I am that kind of person to knee-jerk on political/cultural topics because I sense it can create contention or messy reactions around, however I'm now more open-minded to engage with them after this vid. There was a really clear understanding and insight you showed and used to highlight a clear topic that was important to address and elaborate on. Media that are in this genre should go more into substantive depth about people helping each other through struggles in a more realistic (sometimes unattractive) way, but also focus less on giving a very simplistic, surface-level type of cliche that meets a demographic market or audience. From what I understand, a movie that can go into more depth and complexity of human struggles and execute it well, is a movie that really taps into that high-potential of quality that makes it less than just a saviour story and more of an appreciated piece of media that we can all take a note from.
These topics are tricky because they dance around tricky subject matter but that's the way it is sometimes. Good vid Mac!
This kind of videos is my favorite and it is inspiring how well it is made since I really want to make similar content kudos to you man your content is amazing keep it up
🙏❤
Just to be thorough I'd like to point out the other version of the white savior, wherein a white person goes to a foreign land and helps the natives with his inate awesomeness.
Avatar for example. Or Kingdom of Heaven where Orlando Bloom transforms a Middle-Eastern dirt farm into an oasis, something the locals never managed to do, but he did though he was a blacksmith who lived in England until 15min ago. The Last Samurai though is NOT a white savior film, I've heard people point it out. Tom Cruise is the one that gets saved.
The director's cut is a MUCH better movie, and much better at fleshing Orlando's character. Its revealed he was an Engineer and a farmer. Tbh, I dont think that 5 minutes of showing him improving his fief is a white saviour trope. The movie was focused on religion and war. It may have been a way to show him being much more talented at peaceful occupations.
History nerd wise, the lower classes of any region in the world at that time would be hesitant to change things on land not considered theirs- You may improve the Lord/Emir/whoever's land, but when they show up, would they be happy you did it without asking?
@@stevenrothwell19 Whilst the director's cut is indeed better I have to disagree. After a few days of being in Jerusalem he appears to know more about warfare, agriculture and siege battles than battle-hardened warriors who had been there for years. It's silly.
@@MarkArandjus I dont want to get into the weeds of this, as I'm biased from being a fan of the movie. At a certain point Historical movies still have to have main characters, and sometimes historically these people did stuff and were good at it. There is a deleted scene (or in the director's cut, it's been awhile) in which he discusses siegecraft with the German swordsman. That implies warfare experience. (I wish there was a movie of that whole party, It would have been cool as hell to see the adventures of the English sergeant/Arab Warrior/German swordsman/French Knight across the Holy Land). When it comes to agriculture, there is never any time he compares himself to others, it just shows him directing and participating in improvement of his fief. Orlando is the main character of the movie, the only people he is a saviour to is the Christians (mostly portrayed as/by Europeans, who form the worst of the villians in the film). I respectfully disagree with him being labeled "white saviour". Orlando's character loses everything (albeit saving a bad situation) and winds up back in France. Thank you for your reply.
Thanks for making me aware of this movie. I'll check it out.
Why do I feel like I’ve just attended an AA meeting?
my connection to this movie is so unreal case i was like dan addicted to something not drug, he was trying so hard to be a better person and hid it from his family like i did in the past, and the soundtrack man of this movie damn broken social scene songs was on the point in every scene
In my film class, our teacher asked us if we thought that the relationship between Dan and Dre (the teacher and the student) was appropriate or not. I’m curious to know what other people outside of my classroom think.
I was questioning this because there is a lot of overstepping boundaries in it
I just watched half Nelson and as a teenage girl the whole ‘is this inappropriate’ question was in my mind the whole time, but I think its obvious that both Dre and dan genuinely care for one another. They want be there for each other and seeing that in a film is nice as i think these types of relationships are usually written into films with the addition of seemingly innocent but actually inappropriate jokes and what not. And obviously those types of relationships are very common (wayyy too common) so seeing something like this was cool and different. I’m not sure if this answers your question but in the end i didn’t think it was inappropriate (maybe overstepping some personal boundaries in the way that asking someone why they are addicted to drugs might be but not inappropriate).
Thankyou for your analysis. I enjoyed listening to it.
🙏
Ah man I think about Dan n Drey’s relationship a LOT
Would the film *The Way Back* count as another subversion of the trope in that the MC's spiralling personal descent is cut off as the best thing for his team is that he take a seat on the sidelines and fix himself first?
I enjoyed the movie because I'm also a burnt out workaholic in his late 30s that is forced to see the world move on without me
The difference between saving and helping.
👍
U bodied this video. Great work! 🙂
This video is a “feel good” video.
Its been ten years since the last time i heard from this movie...its one of the better gosling movies. Drive is better tho
Listen...
@@MacabreStorytellingoh yeah? lars and the real girl was better...
@@ozy667 ooo dope take 👍
Drive is goated
your videos are so good
I'm glad you included clips of The Help. It is honestly one of the most baffling examples of the trope that I've seen.
I thought the movie was based on a true story in some way. Nope. 100% fiction. The fact that a bunch of white people came together and wrote that pile of self congratulatory dogshit is appalling. It deserved way more backlash than it got.
I would say Dany’s arc in “A Dance with Dragons” also does a decent job at subverting the white savior trope. Same with “Dune” (the book, not the 1984 movie).
6 months late, but have you SEEN the new Dune movie? White savior is painted all over it lol. Worse than the 80s one imo
@@DonkeyBoyVids have to disagree with you. Paul is literally freaking out because he foresees the horrific carnage of the holy war he will unleash on the universe, and it’ll be beyond his control. Nothing white savior about that.
@@benderthepirate that's fair, still, a lot of what was shown with his character fit into maybe not "white savior" stereotypes but definitely white superiority. If you disagree that's okay though I'm not married to the concept, just from my (admittedly one) viewing of the movie that's what I got.
@@DonkeyBoyVids in that case, I suggest watching it again. Or at least watch the scene of Paul’s vision of the upcoming war.
@@benderthepirate I don't think one scene is going to change underlying subtext, but I do think it's worth another watch for more depth into the subject.
2:00 hell yeah lol
I love how this guy and I heard of the movie from the same exact youtube video.
Brother...
Didn't watch the video because I don't know two thirds of these movies, including Half Nelson, and don't want to be spoilt - but what are your thoughts on The Last Samurai? That's often presented as a prime example of the White Saviour trope. Great channel btw ;)
Thanks! Yeah very similar problems to dances with wolves. Does make it a “bad” movie but the framing is just hella wierd.
Last samurai is a terrible “example” to exemplify this trope. Tom Cruise accomplishes nothing but give the Samurai the tactical insight they need to lose the battle with their honor intact. The Samurai culture saves him from alcoholism and PTSD, and adopts him by allowing him to take a wife and live their lifestyle. If it were a white savior film, he would have influenced their culture with his superiority, and saved them from impending doom.
@@MechAdv you're actually right, I always felt that those who discredited this film as white savior movie were just parroting talking points
The samurai save Cruise…not the other way around
Good stuff. Not sure I agree on the Green Book checking enough boxes to fit a white savior narrative. But overall good work man.
This is a fantastic video and a fantastic movie that has been forgotten about. I never specifically thought of this angle, but it makes me think it’s probably why I’ve always liked it so much. It’s just not what you think it is
Really interesting stuff.
Do you have any plans on making a video discussing The Leftovers? You've mentioned as one of your favorites and was wondering if you would ever tackle a long form analysis type video for it.
Great analysis. I forgot how good this movie was.
Very well explained thanks
I got reminded of this video because of Michael Oher's lawsuit against his family (for The Blind Side). Yeah, bleak world we live in.
Holy shit this channel is growing
This isn’t even our final form…
This is one of my favorite movies
Love this review.
Can the next one be on the backlash on the new Kevin Smith Masters of the Universe series and give us your take on whether or not it's another failure of a series like The Last of Us 2 and HBO Watchmen?
excellent analysis
He did do that Indian cabby accent
Idk if this comment will get attention. But I think the movie Grizzles, which is about a native lacrosse team in Alaska, has the look of a white savior trope but it's more like... this guy, who happened to be white, showed these troubled kids lacrosse and got their community to actually care about the future of these kids. BUT, he didnt do it by himself. There was no way the adults would let a white guy try to change things on the rez, they were convinced by the elder and the kids themselves.
This October internet will be on fire about WSC. But if stars align right and we witness DUNE part2 and 3 - oh boy we are in for a feast of WSC deconstruction.
I’m interested to see how the upcoming dune film handles this. In the book, Paul subverts the white savior trope in a different way, namely by using his charisma and special abilities to hijack a native religion, seize political power, and forge a tribal culture into an army with which he can take revenge on his enemies. It’s a dark critique of colonialism, religious extremism, and the cult of personality. I wonder if the new film will reflect this, or if it will play Paul straight as a more two-dimensional white savior.
What are your thoughts on the movie Blood Diamond?
I hate diamonds now haha.
I know hardball isn't a great movie. I still love it though.
wow great vid
If the white saviour narrative was flawed, then simply flipping it along a racial axis doesn't result in anything less flawed.
Not really
The great thing about "Half Nelson" is that it doesn't step into this trap either.
It is way more balanced than this, maybe not entirely naturalistic but as close as Hollywood ever got.
"Half Nelson" is such an analytic, character driven, critical, daring, great, honest, human, humble, precise, realistic, succinct, touching, well observed film, that it is really incredible that something like it was getting made in our time.
I just wish that Hollywood were still or again making movies like this one.
It shows you don't need a mega-budget to make a fantastic film.
Nice
Captain Corcoran is the first white savior story change my mind
Lol what’s with some of these comments yikes
The nature of YT 🙄
Wonderful video. Thank you.
PS: is there a chance that you analyze the story of spec ops the line? I really love to see your take on story of that game
I think there is still a positive message to the "White savior" narratives. In many cases, the angelic white person usually learns a lesson. I also think it closes the gap between people who wouldn't normally speak to one another. While there is certainly work to be done with narratives, I think overall there's nothing really wrong with movies like The Help, Green Book, ect. We should be looking into the merits and flaws into each movie rather than lumping them into this insulting category.
I don’t think anyone claims the films are bad persay rather the critique is with the same framing of these narratives seen over and over again.
@@MacabreStorytelling If you have everything, and you're willing to risk it, you put yourself under a great deal of social scrutiny from your peers and actual danger. You'd be an outcast from the people who look like you. Abraham Lincoln found this out the hard way. But it does take a couple of people who are willing to go against the grain of society to make things happen sometimes. I can see how this being a cliché archetype is possible, I just think some movies do it pretty well while others do not. The movie you recommended sounds great though, it seems like the mark of a talented writer. I'm not really one for deconstruction (especially in my superhero movies, yuck) but this one seems very well done. Thoughtful and elegant. I do think movies with a white protagonist help race relations more often than hurting them. Shout out to Lethal Weapon. I know that's not apart of the topic, I just like it. Lol. It's nice to see people who look like me interacting with White people and getting along, I guess.
@@nokeksgiven yeah, it's possible. But it's also possible that I find value in heroics. It might be that the heroes of our day used to show little boys the standard for treating people as well what good and bad at a baseline look like. It might also be that I don't think I'm a cynic at heart. I think you're right about it being done well (shoutout to Watchmen and The Boys), but those were stories that made me care about characters I didn't know of until I read the books. It's mostly done with established characters nowadays which really gets to me (Captain A is a Nazi, the men you knew are all trash, ect).
HOW DO I REACH THESE KIIIIIIIIIDS
Damn Ryan Gosling was so skinny back then.