I am in the same boat as you ... but if we try this video method we'll consider a lot of echos trash that can be used as food ... so we'll be able to roll more times for a great to perfect peace... the problem is that we'll run out of tunners instead
When the double tacet field event comes up always prioritise that to use your wave plates on... in AR 77 right now and more than anything. Echo uograde mats are the most useful late game... cuz that's all you do... level up echoes. So when those events come up you get 3 (double tacet fields) do that for the day
Knowing my luck, i'm confident this is very hard or almost impossible to achieve, but thank you for setting a good model of how to handle an efficient statmaxxing, it really helped me.
More one tip: Go until lvl10 for 1 Cost echo cause its more easy to farm and discard this one, and risk more on Cost 3 and go until 15 cause its more hard to find Cost 3 with match elements that you want
3 things to get good echo stats 1. Resources 2. Patience 3. Luck If you are rushing in building a character to a more perfect build (maybe close enough), you're gonna waste a lot of resources. As long as TOA is manageable on ur end, just build them slowly and roll some echos if you have time and resources.
If I used this method I would still be building my first dps, considering that I got the second crit stat in the 4th and 5th upgrade most of the time. What I do is upgrading until lv 20. If it has at least a crit stat, I go all the way to 25 and if it ends up with just a crit stat I use that echo as exp for the next. A lv 25 echo raises the next to 22 so no need for more exp tubes, same for the lv 22 since it give a lv 20 echo. A lv 20 echo gives a lv 17 echo so now I need 10 purple tubes to go back to 20. I honestly prefer wasting a bit more resources than echos since there's no way I going back farming in the overworld
if you go to the echo tab and click the trash icon at the bottom you can discard your useless leveled echos (you get the same amount of exp and tuners back) so those 2 levels on lvl 22 wont go to waste
@@MrGoodra17 Damn lvl 20 is too high man too much exp needed I think. For me lvl 15 is good enough to know whether to continue upgrade or not, but hey to each its own. 👍
@WinkyF2P even doing this I wasted almost every echo I had, there's no way that I would throw away a 4 cost echo after it took me over 100 tries to get the right main stat
You know his guide will be very accurate based on his speech impediment alone, this isn't your casual "achually" this is "Achhtually 2". If you're in a card game tournament with this guy he'll sweep you under the table.
After watching your video I realized my average atk% is 1600to 1800 which is very bad that's why I was thinking why i lack damage with 275 critic damage
@@Lig-Crzy09 Yeah like I said bruh, ATK% does make a huge difference. If your main dps has high ATK stats, you don't need Verina support for that team at all.
Thanks so much for this guidance. I'm pretty sure all but 1 of my echoes would be discarded lol. Would you say this summarizes your criteria - I changed leveling to 20 instead of 25 given the much higher mat cost to go from 20-25 only to find out that's it's not good? If the Echo has any of the following main stats, discard it: Flat ATK ≤ 40 Basic Attack Bonus Heavy Attack Bonus HP% Flat HP DEF% Flat DEF Does the Echo have any of these main stats? Yes → Discard No → Proceed to Initial Tuning Step If the Echo is level 1, tune it to level 10. If it is level 3 or 4, tune it to level 15 before proceeding. 1. Does the Echo have at least one or both Crit substats (Crit Rate or Crit Damage) and/or Attack %? Yes → Proceed to Step 2 No → Discard 2. Is Crit Damage 16.8% or higher, or Crit Rate 8.4% or higher? Yes → Upgrade to level 20 and assess further No → Proceed to Step 3 3. Are the Crit Rate (7.5%+), Crit Damage (15%+ if present), and Attack % (8.6%+) rolls high? Yes → Upgrade to level 20 and assess further No → Proceed to Step 4 4. Is there at least one other useful substat (e.g., Energy Regen, Liberation/Skill Bonus)? Yes → Upgrade to level 20 and assess further No → Discard 5. After upgrading to level 20, did the Echo gain an undesirable substat (e.g., DEF) or lack sufficient desirable stats (Crit Rate, Crit Damage, or Attack %)? Yes → Discard No → Keep and fully upgrade to level 25
@@neil10365 Wow you gotta chill with the long essay bro lolx. Now I have to show respect by at least replying to this. Yes it pretty much sums up my criteria, but if you find it too demanding then it's ok to be less strict a bit especially for your 3-costs echoes because they are harder to farm. Like I said in my guide, the echo expectation/criteria that you set at the start is going to define what quality of echo you will get. Never underestimate ATK%. Keep rocking buddy! 💪😆
I spent almost 200 gold tubes of echo xp on just a single 3 cost when jinxhi released and i didn't have the super high expectations, i just wanted the thing to have mid to high crit rate nothing else. My experience since then is don't actually have expectations that are too high you'll just get frustrated. You can make up for lower rolls by just playing better(because the difference won't be that exagerated). Example people failing to clear with a full team in ToA and then you see danjin solo runs.
Okay, I see some valid points in your tips, but as you said it'll take hundreds of exp mats and thousands of tuners just for 1 set. And we already have at least 2 good characters in every element, meaning thousands of exp and tens of thousands of tuner if not more. You should've said something like "it'll take some time but eventually you'll have 2-3 perfect sets for any character"
I don't have an issue with premium tuners and since they made it so we can forge the lower ranks to upper ranks, it's a lot easier. The exp materials on the other hand gives me headaches. They are never enough.
Thank you. Really appreciated. But I think this is worth doing after you pass mid game and already have some mediocre echos and now must improve your echos to the next level. You don't wanna do this at beginning or even mid game. But I'm in a point of the game that this really fits. Love it
@@verzanii You know what you got a point there too, go easy on your first 2 echo sets to get yourself started, then third echo set onwards I would go hard, aim for the best echoes.
I agree for the most part, although, there are some things I'd change. If you insist on either 3 perfect stats or 4-5 decent ones which are about as good taken together, then you can just upgrade to lv 5, and if the first bonus isn't attack %, crit % or crit damage throw it away. At least for 1 cost echo, which you've plenty to spare. Next point is basic attack, which is actually a decent secondary stat. Ideally, you want all basic attack stacked on one character in the team and you basic attack when you've nothing else to do. However, the reason it's underrated is basic attack boosts dodge counter damage. In general, basic attack is better on a main dps and resonance skill damage is better for a sub-dps. I'd also argue being open-minded helps. Especially 5 useful stats, but "not what you wanted" scenarios. For example accepting combos like this "attack%, flat attack, crit damage, energy and resonance liberation" will save you tons of materials. Sure, it feels bad to be missing crit%, but objectively speaking, that combination is lucky/strong. Finally, I'm 99% sure there is going to be new/better sonata echo sets added to the game in the future. So min-maxed sets may still end up obsolete.
@@wanderingwatcher3981 Thx bruh, but I have alot of echo exp to spare, I'm ok with going lvl 15 first, I only care about tuners. Man there's no way Kuro will make the new echo sets power creep the old ones, that would be devastating. It's still gonna be a long time anyway. 😂
@@WinkyF2P np, when I said obsolete I mean that players would prefer to redo the grind, even it is just a small gain. I don't think the new sets would be strictly better. I'm not sure if you've noticed, but kuro have been designing their new characters around the existing set bonuses. From early on, I knew a min-maxed basic attack Havoc user was going to be released, and now Camellya is out. They will eventually need to new sets to make new archetypes within the different elements. Like a havoc character not based around basic/heavy attack for example. Also, they need players to be engaged in farming new echoes for many years to come. The sets with the biggest chance of becoming obsolete would be the aero/spectral sets. Gaining a damage bonus upon intro skill is nice, but it's not that consistent with low uptime so even if the new set just give something other than bonus damage it might still end up being better. The fire set on the other hand seem like a very safe investment.
@@ManderBoii Congratulations buddy, I have been waiting for the first guy to notice that ever since my very first video. We are best friends now, so you have to subscribe. Lmaox! 😂
Something I do follow and it works is that in the first 3 sub stat rolls better have two crit stats otherwise I don't consider leveling up further (there might be some exceptions though depending the characters). Now if you need at least something to make the character usable, aim for lv20 echoes with at least one crit substat. I would not lower my standards any less than this.
“Anything over 130% er is overkill” Unless you’re going for Shorekeeper’s 240% ER for the full buff. Also it depends on the character. Especially for Jiyan and Camellya, who need heavy dmg and basic dmg bonuses respectively.
That Heavy dmg comment was more of a ... get a stat that is good for multiple characters, else you're just building a set for 1 character, namely Jiyan for Heavy dmg. So yeah, it actually depends on the goal of the set.
My random stranger on YT tip for stats for any game like this: You're only one is your best one. Start somewhere reasonable that matches the build you want to end up at. One Piece at a time is the goal.
i agree with u except for basic/heavy being deadlast. they are on the same tier as skill/ liberation since some chars use liberation, some use basic . perfect example being havoc mc and camellya. you are saying echos are interchangeable then if i switch my liberation pc from havoc mc to camellya, its a dmg drop. skill is useless for camellya but good for danjin and so on
@@AbbasSifawi Don't need to aim for Heavy ATK really he will still be strong with high ATK stats, your other aero chars will be using the same aero set in the future and they won't benefit from Heavy ATK, that's my point. 👍
I liked the tips ... but as I don't like to share echos, I would adapt the rule for res liberation to be the niche that your character uses, for example skill dmg > basic atk dmg instead of res liberation dmg for encore ... and change the atk% for HP% and DEF% for characters that scales with the respective status (like taoqi with def) .... just to make it clear I decide this thinking in the final objective to not share the echos
@@williamg5495 My goal is to also save mats in the long run, 1 set for each echo set is enought, but as a min-max player myself, I can totally understand and respect your niche optimization towards certain characters. Keep rocking buddy! 👊
@@WinkyF2P yes, and you explained very well your point, it made a lot of sense to me, and I'll try to apply that concept now that I have some good teams, but still not able to clear the tower 36, if the problem are not the average echos, than is skill issue of mine lmao also thanks for the good guide!!!
Importance, or, usefulness of ATK% differs from character to character. Fully leveled Zezhi with her 5-star weapon has 1084 atk, while Changli with her weapon has 1300. This is the reason I've been okay with 3 cost echo that has ATK% as main stat on Changli, as that particular echo has amazing sub stats. On costs of echo rolling: 2500 tuners (plus maybe 750 as returns from discarded/merged echoes?) is VERY LITTLE! You're saying you upgraded 325 sub stats TOTAL (3250 tuners) across all echoes to get all this? What's that, around 70 echoes to +15 (3 sub stats revealed), and a few more to +20 (4 sub stats revealed), and 10 of those echoes to full upgrade? That's INSANELY lucky. Is my math wrong? I've been echo farming for Carlotta daily (missed only 2 days when I didn't track and kill all 3-cost echoes for her set), and I have ONE 1-cost echo with double crits and ATK%. I'd probably have to farm for 4-5 months at this rate (1-2 echoes per month) to get her equipped with a full echo set before I could even play her (since she wouldn't have an echo set equipped because everything gets discarded at failed +10 or +15 due to roll failure!) And how many new characters are out by then?😆 My thoughts, this method is not possible for me: I've purchased battle pass since 1.0 so I have a lot of materials, and therefore most of my waveplates go into getting more echoes+upgrade materials from Tacet Field clearing. I also *always* purchase echo material when there's a choice, and I've fully cleared *every* event too. 100% exploration obviously. I've leveled ZERO 4-star characters (minus Baizhi, but she only needs mediocre echoes to be good), and I've completely skipped leveling three "standard" 5-star characters too to further focus my resources. It's still not enough to keep doing this, for me. Out of echo materials soon, and Carlotta not in gear (2400 premium tuners left). At current rate I'd need about 7,000 tuners per character/set (around 950 sub stat rolls?) to get them in gear. Honestly I'm not sure how someone can get even one good enough echo with 200 sub stat roll attempts... but 200 sub stat rolls per echo slot does sound like you have a chance at least. Which would make a full set 1000 (10,000 tuners total spent).
Yep I build my camellia with all double crit stat echo set plus atk% And in this process I lost like 200 to 300 echos And without signature I have 68%crit and 235% crit dmg
For me, I tend to favor double crit and ER. More ER more Resonance Liberation. Very hard to achieve, but currently I've finished building XY, H.Rover, Jinhsi, Yinlin, Zhezhi and Jiyan echoes. With all double crit and required ER. Very smooth rotation but it took all my sanity just to farm it. Now with double reward on Tacet Field, I'm gonna farm tuner for my Changli. Got all double crit, but very low ER. Feels very "heavy" to play.
If you like how it plays then alright, tho I feel like you are gearing all your characters like support/sub-dps, trying to maximize resonance liberation and not on-field effectiveness. From a damage perspective ER is worse then attack % for your main dps for this reason, you have to fight with someone and most of the time resonance liberation isn't going to be usable. Changli is a character I own, and have done the math for her, so I feel confident in saying that she definitely benefit from attack % or even resonance skill % over ER. It was a few months ago, so I don't remember exact numbers but her damage is roughly 45-50% resonance skill damage, 20-25% resonance liberation and the rest basic attack. After getting crit%/critDMG you want attack% or resonance skill%, attack% because it boost all her damage and resonance skill% because it boost her dominant damage type. The perfect set for Changli would be: crit%/critDMG/attack%/resonance skill%/ER. attack % is equal to or just slightly better then resonance skill%. The reason is that you typically already have +100% attack from all sources combined so that additional attack% from substats are about equal to resonance skill% boosting 50% of her damage. This is helpful to know when building her, you only need crit%, critDMG and attack % or resonance skill% for a good piece. This added flexibility of either attack% or resonance skill% makes twice as easy to get good echoes for her.
@wanderingwatcher3981 Agreed, but I prefer smooth rotation. I like it when I swap to main dps I already have ult to use. My Changli echoes are still not done, only 71% CR, 278% CD and 108% ER (preferably 120-130% ER) with 28% Resonance skill damage bonus. While it's good enough to clear the TOA, I can't do that to my queen and want to maximize her damage. It feels very "heavy" when I swap to her and she still doesn't have RL ready yet.
Hmm.. Your way actually.. does take too much resources but saves you alot of them in the future, since you said you are building your echo set to be able to use on other characters... Im gonna try this on 2.0 update.. though i don't think my resources are gonna be enough for my bad luck on substats 😆 Anyways, really nice guide 👍
Considering for your way I still need to max the echo (more about that a bit below), sticking with temporary/average pieces till I get sth better ain't a waste - even more so when I can't still use unlevelled echoes as fodder + using levelled piece as fodder still only "refunds" part of used mats. Having average set as base to later on upgrade will always be better than having nothing at all, when you set expectations high. High expectations should be always used as target post starting set. Simply to have anything to work around with. I also disagree on the list of "useless" substats - 1-2 of last available slots should always be the bonus of main source of dmg, regardless of what that is. not all resonance skills and liberation deal dmg in the first place. Regarding the maxing or not - base is actually lvl 20 and pass only if you there got 2 actually useless subs (real useless, not your opinion useless). why? because no double substats & thus bigger chance of missing wanted ones. More than enough people across platforms did reliable sheets with thousands upon thousands of users who submitted their rolls for calcs proving 4 being the base. Not 5 basically only because of the exp cost. Really hoped for the video to be anything reliable, in the end of the day it's just a big "imho" not really based on anything :/
@@hirukoiwakura142 Bruh you gotta chill with the long essay man. Sure go for avg echoes for your first 2 sets to get started, then 3rd set onwards aim for the best echoes, how's that? If you paid attention to my guide carefully, I tailored it to aim for only 1 echo set per attribute type, the goal is to also save mats in the long run. The list of useless substats is formed because those substats do not generally benefit most chars out there.
Having high expectations for your echoes is completely fine, but do you have the resources required for it? Unless you are a whale or extremely lucky I guess.
Bro you have no idea some of us are so unlucky. Ive spent 2 patches farming for Changli only to get all less than avg rolls on all my crit/atk. like literally all are 6.9% crit and 13% crit dmg with decent atk%. She could still clear her side of the tower, but the rest of my roster's dps really got a hard time full clearing. My advice is to NOT go for these near perfect vertical investments from the start. Just aim for 3/4 chars with double crit stats on all or at max 1 missing if they have really good rolls (even 1-2 sets with this setup can cost upto a patch like me). only after that should you dabble into substat optimizations as described here.
I did that and then realized my Havoc set sucks now, so my next plan is to waste mats again on my Havoc set which already have double Crits on them to get better substats lolx. 😂
Is throwing away a 3 piece actually efficient, though? I mean, imagine you throw it away, and you get a 0 piece. I think keeping it would be more efficient. Without needing to level up any further if you feel that strongly. Efficiency is also about time. Not everyone can spend all day farming spare echoes.
This video is genuinely good advice. Truly it is. but at the same time, watching this video gave me a simmilar feeling as being an asian kid and getting berated by my parent cause i didnt get A++ grades at school.
Funny is i have those substas to all my dps. It goes like this; -Jiyan Attack% 2540+ Crit.rate% 50.7 Crit.DMG% 291 -Xiangli yao Attack% 2462 Crit.Rate% 63.2 Crit.DMG% 291 -Jinhsi Attack% 2482 Crit.rate% 70 Crit.DMG 276 Their energy regen% is decent but its really not that a big problem for me if your dps can destroy a mobs within a few seconds.
@@rezaaswin2034 There's no need to aim for BA bonus and HA bonus even though certain niche chars can benefit from them, ATK% will always be better in any situation.
So i did the calculation, you have about ~0.3496% chance to get CR+CDM+ATK on the first 3 rolls back to back, the 5 stars gacha rate on a single pull is 0.8%(including losing 50/50,0.4% if only count limited characters), meaning it's easier to get a 5 stars in a single pull than getting a piece of CR+CDM+ATK echo lol
@@bearhey7964 Well then we don't need to worry about getting Double Crit + ATK% for the first 3 substats then lolx. It only happened to me once I remembered, but getting 2 of those substats is already good enough.
@@WinkyF2P math, P1=3/13 P2=2/12 P3=1/11, P(n)=P1*P2*P3*P4...*Pn, so the first 3, P(3)=P1*P2*P3=3/13*2/12*1/11=1/286=0.0034965035=0.34965035% so it's ~0.3496%
@@WinkyF2P oh i think i mistaken a different game gacha rate, apparently it's 0.8% 5stars gacha rate(including losing 50/50 who is not the limited character) not 0.4%(winning 50/50 limited character), so i guess it's WAY easier(pretty much double the chance) to get a 5stars in a single pull than getting a echo piece with CR+CDM+ATK in first 3 xdd
@@MateusOliveira-ye4yf It's totally up to you bruh, not that big of a difference. Me.. I put one of them ATK% gonna use that piece for a very long time for all support chars. 👍
@@MateusOliveira-ye4yf Yeah buddy that is exactly what I'm saying, I'm already doing that myself. That one ATK% 3-costs moonlit piece is gonna save you alot of mats. 😊👍
2500 tuners for 2 sets a completed echo takes 50 even if we half that for the average echo, 25, means you got 10 hits out of 100 echoes "i have just about the same echo luck as the average guy" no, no you dont, ive ran through like 30 echoes to get a single electro dmg% with double crit, i lucked out with heavy, skill and attack on one, but the other has skill and double hp, 10% echoes being not only usable, but good is beyond insane luck, even usable is insane also on the not using auto select, you get refunded materials and the shell credit price also does not go up, i just now tested this with using a purple on 600 exp, and it didnt cost me any more, aswell as giving me back a blue, meaning i actually lost the equivelant of 1 blue, nothing wasted (though this is different below level 25) now after saying that lemme say that i dont like the auto select because it doesnt prioritise higher ones first, so i still do it manually, but it matters very little to not at all
is very hard asfuck to get double crit + atk% or another atk bonus % but still posible if u re using the clock to refining echoes every 7 minutes and 15 seconds it give u the most hight chanceof re roll a crit stat% everything else its luck
@@WinkyF2P its called echomancing u can get info about it easily there are a group of people just discovered by accident if they tune a echo at the exact time will get hight chance to get certain stats for example every 7 minutes and 15 seconds u will get around 14-15 % more to roll a crit stat% or even double crit if u are lucky enought
They need to get rid of the tuners or change the echoes to be "resettable" when you get bad rolls. I don't mind losing my tuners, but we are losing tuners, the echos and XP. This is very punitive.
i\ve been palying since yinlin. and using those tips since then. (minus the lowest/highest stat number because it's already hard enough) i got only 2 that fullfill those criterias (both on 4 star echoes). i'm just not lucky.
@@fateslayer47 You should, but if you're planning to use the same havoc set on your other havoc chars then you don't need to aim for BA bonus. Camellya' s sign weap already have more than enough BA bonus anw.
@@fateslayer47 No prob buddy. Me personally, I hate seeing BA or HA bonus substats popping up because not all dps chars can use them. I rather see res skill or lib bonus. 😵
@@WinkyF2P Yeah makes sense. Thank you so much for uploading such a great guide. Keep up the great work. Also, would you please make a video about substats manipulation? (tuning echoes every 15 seconds for either even or odd minutes)
@@fateslayer47 Hmm... I can't really make a video guide on something that I don't believe in. I have seen videos and spreadsheets about that echo tuning mechanic before, but I'm not buying it. I also tested it out myself and I'm still not convinced. I think it's still based on your RNG luck at the end of the day. 🤗
this is only applicable if you have tons of echoes farmed but for casual players who are relying on tacet fields for echoes, this method is not very helpful
@@rcg7269 That is true but as for casuals I think no matter what method you used, your echoes will always be mid because you don't have alot of echo options to choose from.
always just level up to 10 bro then see if the first 2 substats are to your liking before you go all out on tuners. Built my Yao within 2 weeks. He will be perfect after I got his weapon. He is only 68/230 rn but he hits around 190k
@@jivekiwi I agree buddy, healing bonus bellbourne is definitely a super rare drop, I only got 3 all these time, which is why you should just use ATK% or HP% ones. 😉
That's the odd thing though, your crit rate state is pretty bad still. Like 7.5% crit rate is only acceptable if you've got really good rolls on everything else. Let alone a 6.3%, which I saw a lot of.
@@naterivers6107 Yes the overall CR for my electro set is bad, believe me that shit bugs me everyday, but I have no choice I accepted it at that time because of the overall high ATK. I'm still planning to improve the overall CR in the near future. 😤
@@naterivers6107 Camellya heh.. I managed to improve my havoc set tremendously though.. here check it out bro! ruclips.net/video/rV0FtQqYwJs/видео.htmlsi=LQv4nORarCDit4l1
2500 tuners for BOTH Electro AND Spectro sets? Nah, either you're lying, or you got INCREDIBLY lucky with your tuning. 6500 tuners went to my Changli alone, and her set is far from perfect.
hmm. while its expected approach the very late game its not good at midgame. In most cases you need 130 ER in case on Yunlin even 140. So you need 4 good substat and with high rolls for her only....then similar for XiangliYao ... cant happen. Cos I need also 2 fusion sets, 2 havoc, 3 moonlit etc. als Wuwa devs are a bit slow. we should had a new 2 sets at this time.
@@WinkyF2P I use Encore and Changli regulary + Chixia occasionally. still thats not the problem. the problem is how much grind and resources you need to get 4 good substats
@@ixirion Well damn if that's the case then just slap your moonlit set onto 1 of them it's ok man. The same logic applies to Havoc Rover + Danjin. Upgrading 2 different sets of the same echo set is just a waste of mats bruh. 😥
@@WinkyF2P swaping echoes around is waste of time my man. also outside of speedruning the5% dps doesnt matter. also you again missed the topic that even you dont have 1 set fully maxed XD I agree the leveling ideas have merit but again its super late game effort and can lead to burnout.
unfortunately this will only be possible when they rework/ upgrade the echoes system, in the current model this is just luck... I for example been playing since day one and just have literally 5 echoes with crit dmg 15%+ AND crit rate lol Building characters in Wuthering Waves feels really bad man
My suggestion would be allowing us to reroll only 1 substats on each echo using shell credits and the amount gets doubled everytime we reroll a substats.
Getting double Crit + Atk% is not hard......its VERY HARD are u kidding me bruh?! XD
Double crit+atk+whatever dmg type the char needs like liberation+ER:D
Man… I have been tuning echoes for 3 months and I’ve never seen a single high Crit. with any other good sub stats… for real…
double crit + atk% not hard, one of the the most LMAO thing i've heard in WW guide XD
@@MadBearut i see it once in a blue moon. XD
@@Morax024
I’m so jealous
The main problem is i ran out of echoes exp materials, so even I've got two crit stats I'm happy with that 💀👏
if the game allow us to use trash echo as exp then i'll be doing it if not i rather go build other character
@@AnishCreationsAnime I have more than enough echo exp items but I have a tuners problem lolx 😂
I am in the same boat as you ... but if we try this video method we'll consider a lot of echos trash that can be used as food ... so we'll be able to roll more times for a great to perfect peace... the problem is that we'll run out of tunners instead
When the double tacet field event comes up always prioritise that to use your wave plates on... in AR 77 right now and more than anything. Echo uograde mats are the most useful late game... cuz that's all you do... level up echoes. So when those events come up you get 3 (double tacet fields) do that for the day
Ikr
This video has the same energy with :" If youre sad, be happy." 😅
@@Written_in_the_Starss lolx.. Yep.. !! 😋
the high echo expectancy sounded so asian
its like you saying ONLY A OR ELSE ALL IS AVERAGE
@@rkyrsc2 Well I can't argue with that lolx 😎
Knowing my luck, i'm confident this is very hard or almost impossible to achieve, but thank you for setting a good model of how to handle an efficient statmaxxing, it really helped me.
Thx bruh appreciate it 😆
this was an incredible guide, thanks man!
@@spark9_ Np man keep rocking buddy! 😎👊
The real tip is: #1 Be lucky.
@@unholyarthur1 Amen!
😂😅
More one tip: Go until lvl10 for 1 Cost echo cause its more easy to farm and discard this one, and risk more on Cost 3 and go until 15 cause its more hard to find Cost 3 with match elements that you want
@@araujoas I tend to be less strict for my 3 costs too because I hate farming them 😤
Brother I have hard time farming 1 costs 😂
3 things to get good echo stats
1. Resources
2. Patience
3. Luck
If you are rushing in building a character to a more perfect build (maybe close enough), you're gonna waste a lot of resources. As long as TOA is manageable on ur end, just build them slowly and roll some echos if you have time and resources.
@@silver-ゲームチャンネル Holy..
If I used this method I would still be building my first dps, considering that I got the second crit stat in the 4th and 5th upgrade most of the time.
What I do is upgrading until lv 20. If it has at least a crit stat, I go all the way to 25 and if it ends up with just a crit stat I use that echo as exp for the next.
A lv 25 echo raises the next to 22 so no need for more exp tubes, same for the lv 22 since it give a lv 20 echo. A lv 20 echo gives a lv 17 echo so now I need 10 purple tubes to go back to 20.
I honestly prefer wasting a bit more resources than echos since there's no way I going back farming in the overworld
I do the same
otherwise you're just wasting a lot of 3 cost echoes his way and god knows I'm not farming for those elemental 3 costs...
if you go to the echo tab and click the trash icon at the bottom you can discard your useless leveled echos (you get the same amount of exp and tuners back) so those 2 levels on lvl 22 wont go to waste
@@MrGoodra17 Damn lvl 20 is too high man too much exp needed I think. For me lvl 15 is good enough to know whether to continue upgrade or not, but hey to each its own. 👍
@@Vel_Here I do tend to be less strict for my 3 costs too because I hate farming them, that's why a few of them have only 1 crit.
@WinkyF2P even doing this I wasted almost every echo I had, there's no way that I would throw away a 4 cost echo after it took me over 100 tries to get the right main stat
Sorry took longer than I expected to make this video. Alot of editing involved compared to my other videos.
Hope you guys enjoyed this one! 😋
You know his guide will be very accurate based on his speech impediment alone, this isn't your casual "achually" this is "Achhtually 2". If you're in a card game tournament with this guy he'll sweep you under the table.
@@KingShado69 That's true I do have a little speech impediment thing lmaox 🤭
@@WinkyF2P Kekw! 😂
You the man, thanks for the tips and tricks!
@@ZeylonHunter 💪😉👍
lets gooo!! always wanted a guide like this.. thanks for the tips man..❣
@@sammyl3umas354 Np man pound it 🤜
🤜
Thanks bro, good video
@@edgaryon Appreciate it bro 😘
Who said that luck matters actually devalues deduction and perseverance of the player.
Thank you sharing your experience.
@@nvmage Ma man! 😎
Thanks you so much, i really need this. This is a thorough strategy
@@dt4493 Np man good luck in your echoes lolx
After watching your video I realized my average atk% is 1600to 1800 which is very bad that's why I was thinking why i lack damage with 275 critic damage
@@Lig-Crzy09 Yeah like I said bruh, ATK% does make a huge difference. If your main dps has high ATK stats, you don't need Verina support for that team at all.
Thanks so much for this guidance. I'm pretty sure all but 1 of my echoes would be discarded lol. Would you say this summarizes your criteria - I changed leveling to 20 instead of 25 given the much higher mat cost to go from 20-25 only to find out that's it's not good?
If the Echo has any of the following main stats, discard it:
Flat ATK ≤ 40
Basic Attack Bonus
Heavy Attack Bonus
HP%
Flat HP
DEF%
Flat DEF
Does the Echo have any of these main stats?
Yes → Discard
No → Proceed to Initial Tuning Step
If the Echo is level 1, tune it to level 10. If it is level 3 or 4, tune it to level 15 before proceeding.
1. Does the Echo have at least one or both Crit substats (Crit Rate or Crit Damage) and/or Attack %?
Yes → Proceed to Step 2
No → Discard
2. Is Crit Damage 16.8% or higher, or Crit Rate 8.4% or higher?
Yes → Upgrade to level 20 and assess further
No → Proceed to Step 3
3. Are the Crit Rate (7.5%+), Crit Damage (15%+ if present), and Attack % (8.6%+) rolls high?
Yes → Upgrade to level 20 and assess further
No → Proceed to Step 4
4. Is there at least one other useful substat (e.g., Energy Regen, Liberation/Skill Bonus)?
Yes → Upgrade to level 20 and assess further
No → Discard
5. After upgrading to level 20, did the Echo gain an undesirable substat (e.g., DEF) or lack sufficient desirable stats (Crit Rate, Crit Damage, or Attack %)?
Yes → Discard
No → Keep and fully upgrade to level 25
@@neil10365 Wow you gotta chill with the long essay bro lolx. Now I have to show respect by at least replying to this.
Yes it pretty much sums up my criteria, but if you find it too demanding then it's ok to be less strict a bit especially for your 3-costs echoes because they are harder to farm.
Like I said in my guide, the echo expectation/criteria that you set at the start is going to define what quality of echo you will get.
Never underestimate ATK%.
Keep rocking buddy! 💪😆
@@neil10365 1 more thing, having 1 useless substats on an echo is ok, it's pretty normal, but 2 useless substats is not ok for me.
@@WinkyF2P Cool thanks for replying, hope your channel goes from strength to strength!
@@neil10365 Thx bruh appreciate it , gotta keep grinding man, that's how it is. 👊
I actually liked the explanation of the thinking process.
@@dustinhughes5034 I like that you like the explanation of the thinking process 😂
I had a general understanding of this before but this really helped me out. Thanks
@@unblockablelegoblock4839 Awesome!
Great video
useful information
you got a new subscriber
@@محمدالسياف-ر1ك 🤗🤗
My genral role is:
Upgrade the echo to 15
If u have 2 crits or 1 crit and atk%, then lvl it up in hopes to get the missing stat (crit or atk%)
@@Mighty_Yhwach Hey isn't that exactly the same as mine lolx, except that I'm also picky about high or low rolls.
Thanks man. You helped me a lot ❤
@@SunnyBQ Np bruh now pound my ass! 🤜
I spent almost 200 gold tubes of echo xp on just a single 3 cost when jinxhi released and i didn't have the super high expectations, i just wanted the thing to have mid to high crit rate nothing else. My experience since then is don't actually have expectations that are too high you'll just get frustrated. You can make up for lower rolls by just playing better(because the difference won't be that exagerated). Example people failing to clear with a full team in ToA and then you see danjin solo runs.
@@Anonymous-sd6hq Take it easy buddy 🤗
U deserve my sub for this one😁
@@billy_dummy4974 Ma man! 👊
Okay, I see some valid points in your tips, but as you said it'll take hundreds of exp mats and thousands of tuners just for 1 set. And we already have at least 2 good characters in every element, meaning thousands of exp and tens of thousands of tuner if not more.
You should've said something like "it'll take some time but eventually you'll have 2-3 perfect sets for any character"
@@MegaAzer555 That's cool 🤗
I don't have an issue with premium tuners and since they made it so we can forge the lower ranks to upper ranks, it's a lot easier. The exp materials on the other hand gives me headaches. They are never enough.
@@Furukn Wow I have the opposite problem, seems like I have been tuning substats more often than leveling echoes.
tnx man!!! im new at gacha game and also this wuthering waves. thank you and this video of urs is extremely informative tnx tnx and goodluck
@@minttinted1895 Appreciated that bruh! 😆
Thank you. Really appreciated. But I think this is worth doing after you pass mid game and already have some mediocre echos and now must improve your echos to the next level. You don't wanna do this at beginning or even mid game. But I'm in a point of the game that this really fits. Love it
@@verzanii You know what you got a point there too, go easy on your first 2 echo sets to get yourself started, then third echo set onwards I would go hard, aim for the best echoes.
I agree for the most part, although, there are some things I'd change. If you insist on either 3 perfect stats or 4-5 decent ones which are about as good taken together, then you can just upgrade to lv 5, and if the first bonus isn't attack %, crit % or crit damage throw it away. At least for 1 cost echo, which you've plenty to spare.
Next point is basic attack, which is actually a decent secondary stat. Ideally, you want all basic attack stacked on one character in the team and you basic attack when you've nothing else to do. However, the reason it's underrated is basic attack boosts dodge counter damage. In general, basic attack is better on a main dps and resonance skill damage is better for a sub-dps.
I'd also argue being open-minded helps. Especially 5 useful stats, but "not what you wanted" scenarios. For example accepting combos like this "attack%, flat attack, crit damage, energy and resonance liberation" will save you tons of materials. Sure, it feels bad to be missing crit%, but objectively speaking, that combination is lucky/strong.
Finally, I'm 99% sure there is going to be new/better sonata echo sets added to the game in the future. So min-maxed sets may still end up obsolete.
@@wanderingwatcher3981 Thx bruh, but I have alot of echo exp to spare, I'm ok with going lvl 15 first, I only care about tuners.
Man there's no way Kuro will make the new echo sets power creep the old ones, that would be devastating. It's still gonna be a long time anyway. 😂
@@WinkyF2P np, when I said obsolete I mean that players would prefer to redo the grind, even it is just a small gain. I don't think the new sets would be strictly better. I'm not sure if you've noticed, but kuro have been designing their new characters around the existing set bonuses. From early on, I knew a min-maxed basic attack Havoc user was going to be released, and now Camellya is out. They will eventually need to new sets to make new archetypes within the different elements. Like a havoc character not based around basic/heavy attack for example. Also, they need players to be engaged in farming new echoes for many years to come. The sets with the biggest chance of becoming obsolete would be the aero/spectral sets. Gaining a damage bonus upon intro skill is nice, but it's not that consistent with low uptime so even if the new set just give something other than bonus damage it might still end up being better. The fire set on the other hand seem like a very safe investment.
@@wanderingwatcher3981 Brother man I totally respect your passion, but damn you have got to chill with the long essay man. 😂
@@WinkyF2P hehe, noted, after posting it I was like "I could have shortened that"
@@wanderingwatcher3981 👊😆
This video really did help me 😊
@@anubisENEAD I'm happy to know 😉
Great tips and advice 💯
@@Catrigo24 Thx bruh keep rocking! 😎👊
Ok, but the village of Dali in the background. That’s my favorite FFIX piece 🔥
@@ManderBoii Congratulations buddy, I have been waiting for the first guy to notice that ever since my very first video. We are best friends now, so you have to subscribe. Lmaox! 😂
Something I do follow and it works is that in the first 3 sub stat rolls better have two crit stats otherwise I don't consider leveling up further (there might be some exceptions though depending the characters).
Now if you need at least something to make the character usable, aim for lv20 echoes with at least one crit substat. I would not lower my standards any less than this.
@@eherden2169 Damn bruh and they called me crazy, your standards are even higher than mine. 😵
@@WinkyF2P Genshin's and HSR artifact/relic farm trauma left me like this.
Can't believe this works ! I got my jiyan to 42/281 in 10 mins I would always go 25+ and got bankrupt on tubes lmao.
@@thewanderingartists That's crazy bruh, you were gambling with 5 substats rolls at once everytime before this. 😱
Just got back into the game video helped with what stats to look for thank you
@@mikebrown476 Awesome welcome back buddy! 😆
Same here, just got back in the game few days into 1.4. Definetly gonna put the guide to use for my Camellya's echos!
@@Hara09zk If you don't have camellya' s sign weap, then you might wana aim for a little BA bonus as well. 😎👍
@@WinkyF2P Yep i did get her sig as well.
@@Hara09zk Oh that's cool, then you don't need to worry about BA bonus substats at all. 😊
Thanks buddy, i was only of those who lvl to 25 XD
@@Gr0s3d Np man but oh boy you must have wasted alot of mats by now 😱
“Anything over 130% er is overkill”
Unless you’re going for Shorekeeper’s 240% ER for the full buff.
Also it depends on the character. Especially for Jiyan and Camellya, who need heavy dmg and basic dmg bonuses respectively.
That Heavy dmg comment was more of a ... get a stat that is good for multiple characters, else you're just building a set for 1 character, namely Jiyan for Heavy dmg. So yeah, it actually depends on the goal of the set.
@@amaria7072 The echo guide is of course for main and sub dps only, healer support is another different story.
Nice guide
@@olafshouse Thx buddy 😋
thank you bro
@@GutoMake Keep rocking buddy! 😆
flat atk 40 isnt trash tbh
My random stranger on YT tip for stats for any game like this: You're only one is your best one. Start somewhere reasonable that matches the build you want to end up at. One Piece at a time is the goal.
i agree with u except for basic/heavy being deadlast. they are on the same tier as skill/ liberation since some chars use liberation, some use basic . perfect example being havoc mc and camellya.
you are saying echos are interchangeable then if i switch my liberation pc from havoc mc to camellya, its a dmg drop. skill is useless for camellya but good for danjin and so on
@@hareshrk6259 That's cool debatable, that's why I will always aim for ATK% then just accept whatever the last 2 substats are. 😉
Jiyan echoes are hard to build cz he really needs that heavy atck% so basically he needs heavy atck crit rate/dmg and atck%
@@AbbasSifawi Don't need to aim for Heavy ATK really he will still be strong with high ATK stats, your other aero chars will be using the same aero set in the future and they won't benefit from Heavy ATK, that's my point. 👍
@@WinkyF2Pi see your point but the “Pro way” to build him is with heavy atck or your be loosing alot of dmg
@@AbbasSifawi Ok that's cool that's true can't argue with that, but man that means you must have a higher echo expectation than I do lolx. 😱
@@WinkyF2P great video btw very informative im a new subscriber
@@AbbasSifawi Thx man appreciate that bruh
I liked the tips ... but as I don't like to share echos, I would adapt the rule for res liberation to be the niche that your character uses, for example skill dmg > basic atk dmg instead of res liberation dmg for encore ... and change the atk% for HP% and DEF% for characters that scales with the respective status (like taoqi with def) .... just to make it clear I decide this thinking in the final objective to not share the echos
@@williamg5495 My goal is to also save mats in the long run, 1 set for each echo set is enought, but as a min-max player myself, I can totally understand and respect your niche optimization towards certain characters. Keep rocking buddy! 👊
@@WinkyF2P yes, and you explained very well your point, it made a lot of sense to me, and I'll try to apply that concept now that I have some good teams, but still not able to clear the tower 36, if the problem are not the average echos, than is skill issue of mine lmao
also thanks for the good guide!!!
Bro said he spent 400 upgrade materials on his full build and I spent 400 on only getting one piece double crit... I love my luck
@@TYLER-tl3tg Try wearing red underwear 🤭👙
Importance, or, usefulness of ATK% differs from character to character. Fully leveled Zezhi with her 5-star weapon has 1084 atk, while Changli with her weapon has 1300. This is the reason I've been okay with 3 cost echo that has ATK% as main stat on Changli, as that particular echo has amazing sub stats.
On costs of echo rolling:
2500 tuners (plus maybe 750 as returns from discarded/merged echoes?) is VERY LITTLE! You're saying you upgraded 325 sub stats TOTAL (3250 tuners) across all echoes to get all this? What's that, around 70 echoes to +15 (3 sub stats revealed), and a few more to +20 (4 sub stats revealed), and 10 of those echoes to full upgrade? That's INSANELY lucky. Is my math wrong?
I've been echo farming for Carlotta daily (missed only 2 days when I didn't track and kill all 3-cost echoes for her set), and I have ONE 1-cost echo with double crits and ATK%. I'd probably have to farm for 4-5 months at this rate (1-2 echoes per month) to get her equipped with a full echo set before I could even play her (since she wouldn't have an echo set equipped because everything gets discarded at failed +10 or +15 due to roll failure!) And how many new characters are out by then?😆
My thoughts, this method is not possible for me:
I've purchased battle pass since 1.0 so I have a lot of materials, and therefore most of my waveplates go into getting more echoes+upgrade materials from Tacet Field clearing. I also *always* purchase echo material when there's a choice, and I've fully cleared *every* event too. 100% exploration obviously. I've leveled ZERO 4-star characters (minus Baizhi, but she only needs mediocre echoes to be good), and I've completely skipped leveling three "standard" 5-star characters too to further focus my resources. It's still not enough to keep doing this, for me. Out of echo materials soon, and Carlotta not in gear (2400 premium tuners left). At current rate I'd need about 7,000 tuners per character/set (around 950 sub stat rolls?) to get them in gear.
Honestly I'm not sure how someone can get even one good enough echo with 200 sub stat roll attempts... but 200 sub stat rolls per echo slot does sound like you have a chance at least. Which would make a full set 1000 (10,000 tuners total spent).
nice vid!
@@pin885 👊👊
Yep I build my camellia with all double crit stat echo set plus atk%
And in this process I lost like 200 to 300 echos
And without signature I have 68%crit and 235% crit dmg
@@chinmay_077 That's not bad 😎👍
I need to have this mindset in life
@@stripessin It's ok I don't have that kind of mindset in life too only in game lmaox 😂
@@WinkyF2P 😂
For me, I tend to favor double crit and ER. More ER more Resonance Liberation. Very hard to achieve, but currently I've finished building XY, H.Rover, Jinhsi, Yinlin, Zhezhi and Jiyan echoes. With all double crit and required ER.
Very smooth rotation but it took all my sanity just to farm it. Now with double reward on Tacet Field, I'm gonna farm tuner for my Changli. Got all double crit, but very low ER. Feels very "heavy" to play.
@@cloudhudston1844 Man that's alot of echo sets you have there, I haven't even started on my glacio set yet. 😥
If you like how it plays then alright, tho I feel like you are gearing all your characters like support/sub-dps, trying to maximize resonance liberation and not on-field effectiveness. From a damage perspective ER is worse then attack % for your main dps for this reason, you have to fight with someone and most of the time resonance liberation isn't going to be usable.
Changli is a character I own, and have done the math for her, so I feel confident in saying that she definitely benefit from attack % or even resonance skill % over ER. It was a few months ago, so I don't remember exact numbers but her damage is roughly 45-50% resonance skill damage, 20-25% resonance liberation and the rest basic attack. After getting crit%/critDMG you want attack% or resonance skill%, attack% because it boost all her damage and resonance skill% because it boost her dominant damage type. The perfect set for Changli would be: crit%/critDMG/attack%/resonance skill%/ER. attack % is equal to or just slightly better then resonance skill%. The reason is that you typically already have +100% attack from all sources combined so that additional attack% from substats are about equal to resonance skill% boosting 50% of her damage. This is helpful to know when building her, you only need crit%, critDMG and attack % or resonance skill% for a good piece. This added flexibility of either attack% or resonance skill% makes twice as easy to get good echoes for her.
@wanderingwatcher3981 Agreed, but I prefer smooth rotation. I like it when I swap to main dps I already have ult to use. My Changli echoes are still not done, only 71% CR, 278% CD and 108% ER (preferably 120-130% ER) with 28% Resonance skill damage bonus. While it's good enough to clear the TOA, I can't do that to my queen and want to maximize her damage. It feels very "heavy" when I swap to her and she still doesn't have RL ready yet.
Hmm..
Your way actually.. does take too much resources but saves you alot of them in the future, since you said you are building your echo set to be able to use on other characters... Im gonna try this on 2.0 update.. though i don't think my resources are gonna be enough for my bad luck on substats 😆
Anyways, really nice guide 👍
@@thebestbotever5040 Yippy..!! 😋
2:20 Naw I would have rerolled that shit the second I saw the HP% stat
Considering for your way I still need to max the echo (more about that a bit below), sticking with temporary/average pieces till I get sth better ain't a waste - even more so when I can't still use unlevelled echoes as fodder + using levelled piece as fodder still only "refunds" part of used mats. Having average set as base to later on upgrade will always be better than having nothing at all, when you set expectations high.
High expectations should be always used as target post starting set. Simply to have anything to work around with. I also disagree on the list of "useless" substats - 1-2 of last available slots should always be the bonus of main source of dmg, regardless of what that is. not all resonance skills and liberation deal dmg in the first place.
Regarding the maxing or not - base is actually lvl 20 and pass only if you there got 2 actually useless subs (real useless, not your opinion useless). why? because no double substats & thus bigger chance of missing wanted ones. More than enough people across platforms did reliable sheets with thousands upon thousands of users who submitted their rolls for calcs proving 4 being the base. Not 5 basically only because of the exp cost.
Really hoped for the video to be anything reliable, in the end of the day it's just a big "imho" not really based on anything :/
@@hirukoiwakura142 Bruh you gotta chill with the long essay man.
Sure go for avg echoes for your first 2 sets to get started, then 3rd set onwards aim for the best echoes, how's that?
If you paid attention to my guide carefully, I tailored it to aim for only 1 echo set per attribute type, the goal is to also save mats in the long run. The list of useless substats is formed because those substats do not generally benefit most chars out there.
Having high expectations for your echoes is completely fine, but do you have the resources required for it? Unless you are a whale or extremely lucky I guess.
@@CyrusYew If you are a day 1 player like me then we should have about the same amount of mats invested on echoes now
uncle roger plays wuwa
hahahaha
Indeed 🎉😂. When we f**ked up in upgrading echoes = "haiiyaaa" 😂
@@DSYNJ Lmao must be my ascent 😬
Thank you❤
@@Notmeskye Hehe.. 🤭
For me, only CR + CD per echo is enough to get the resonator CR at least 90% above and CD at 200% and above, I've never got the double CR + Atk% ;|
@@reissaonwuwa Hold on buddy, CR 90%? Damn that's overly overkill. 😱
Bro you have no idea some of us are so unlucky. Ive spent 2 patches farming for Changli only to get all less than avg rolls on all my crit/atk. like literally all are 6.9% crit and 13% crit dmg with decent atk%. She could still clear her side of the tower, but the rest of my roster's dps really got a hard time full clearing. My advice is to NOT go for these near perfect vertical investments from the start. Just aim for 3/4 chars with double crit stats on all or at max 1 missing if they have really good rolls (even 1-2 sets with this setup can cost upto a patch like me). only after that should you dabble into substat optimizations as described here.
I did that and then realized my Havoc set sucks now, so my next plan is to waste mats again on my Havoc set which already have double Crits on them to get better substats lolx. 😂
i only get 3 piece of 2crit + 2 atk echo so far
Wait am I the only that just max tune echos and got double crit + atk% almost every time?
@@hanlyheng8165 Seriously... 😵
Is throwing away a 3 piece actually efficient, though? I mean, imagine you throw it away, and you get a 0 piece. I think keeping it would be more efficient. Without needing to level up any further if you feel that strongly. Efficiency is also about time. Not everyone can spend all day farming spare echoes.
Still sounds lucky to me.
I've been playing since day one i only got two double crit my highest crit rate is 49
This video is genuinely good advice. Truly it is.
but at the same time, watching this video gave me a simmilar feeling as being an asian kid and getting berated by my parent cause i didnt get A++ grades at school.
@@Andus345 Lmaoz indeed 😬
Funny is i have those substas to all my dps. It goes like this;
-Jiyan
Attack% 2540+
Crit.rate% 50.7
Crit.DMG% 291
-Xiangli yao
Attack% 2462
Crit.Rate% 63.2
Crit.DMG% 291
-Jinhsi
Attack% 2482
Crit.rate% 70
Crit.DMG 276
Their energy regen% is decent but its really not that a big problem for me if your dps can destroy a mobs within a few seconds.
@@kramlyn2412 Damn bruh those are cracked, you been having insane echo luck man? 😯
I assume you use one 3cost atk instead of elemental dmg, am i right?
i dont think heavy attack is useless for jiyan.and basic attack will be good for zhezhi and camellya
@@rezaaswin2034 There's no need to aim for BA bonus and HA bonus even though certain niche chars can benefit from them, ATK% will always be better in any situation.
So i did the calculation, you have about ~0.3496% chance to get CR+CDM+ATK on the first 3 rolls back to back, the 5 stars gacha rate on a single pull is 0.8%(including losing 50/50,0.4% if only count limited characters), meaning it's easier to get a 5 stars in a single pull than getting a piece of CR+CDM+ATK echo lol
@@bearhey7964 Well then we don't need to worry about getting Double Crit + ATK% for the first 3 substats then lolx. It only happened to me once I remembered, but getting 2 of those substats is already good enough.
@@bearhey7964 How the hell did you arrived with those numbers anw bruh? 😵💫
@@WinkyF2P math, P1=3/13 P2=2/12 P3=1/11, P(n)=P1*P2*P3*P4...*Pn, so the first 3, P(3)=P1*P2*P3=3/13*2/12*1/11=1/286=0.0034965035=0.34965035% so it's ~0.3496%
@@WinkyF2P oh i think i mistaken a different game gacha rate, apparently it's 0.8% 5stars gacha rate(including losing 50/50 who is not the limited character) not 0.4%(winning 50/50 limited character), so i guess it's WAY easier(pretty much double the chance) to get a 5stars in a single pull than getting a echo piece with CR+CDM+ATK in first 3 xdd
@@bearhey7964 man you crazy but I like it 😆
But not enough for me i understand. But I'm lame, at some point I realized I'm going to be. But thanks for the advice!
@@horvathviktor6528 Bruh chill lolx 😯
As for the Moonlit Clouds set, the echos cost 3, should I look for elemental damage or even atk%, since it would be a universal set? thanks
@@MateusOliveira-ye4yf It's totally up to you bruh, not that big of a difference. Me.. I put one of them ATK% gonna use that piece for a very long time for all support chars. 👍
@WinkyF2P so you recommend farming 1 echo elemental cost 3 of each element and keeping 1 atk%
@@MateusOliveira-ye4yf Yeah buddy that is exactly what I'm saying, I'm already doing that myself. That one ATK% 3-costs moonlit piece is gonna save you alot of mats. 😊👍
2500 tuners for 2 sets
a completed echo takes 50
even if we half that for the average echo, 25, means you got 10 hits out of 100 echoes
"i have just about the same echo luck as the average guy"
no, no you dont, ive ran through like 30 echoes to get a single electro dmg% with double crit, i lucked out with heavy, skill and attack on one, but the other has skill and double hp, 10% echoes being not only usable, but good is beyond insane luck, even usable is insane
also on the not using auto select, you get refunded materials and the shell credit price also does not go up, i just now tested this with using a purple on 600 exp, and it didnt cost me any more, aswell as giving me back a blue, meaning i actually lost the equivelant of 1 blue, nothing wasted (though this is different below level 25)
now after saying that lemme say that i dont like the auto select because it doesnt prioritise higher ones first, so i still do it manually, but it matters very little to not at all
is very hard asfuck to get double crit + atk% or another atk bonus % but still posible if u re using the clock to refining echoes every 7 minutes and 15 seconds it give u the most hight chanceof re roll a crit stat% everything else its luck
@@Samtax44 What is this 7 mins reroll Crit thing you're talking about bruh? Some hidden mechanic? 🤔
@@WinkyF2P its called echomancing u can get info about it easily there are a group of people just discovered by accident if they tune a echo at the exact time will get hight chance to get certain stats for example every 7 minutes and 15 seconds u will get around 14-15 % more to roll a crit stat% or even double crit if u are lucky enought
Double crit not impossible but when you add attack at there that frustration😂😂😂
@@tonyblairs1888 Yep no pain no gain brother! 💪😆
Basically : "be lucky."😂to
how many tuners do you have before upgrading?
@@irvinchua1139 I always save up until at least 1500 tuners before going for a big echo upgrade session, I'm not worried about echo exp items.
They need to get rid of the tuners or change the echoes to be "resettable" when you get bad rolls.
I don't mind losing my tuners, but we are losing tuners, the echos and XP. This is very punitive.
dude i have been playing since release and i have very rarely seen crit dmg 15%+
@@toufiq309 For real? Damn bruh.. 😥
You are doing it wrong 🚫
You are unlucky ✅️
i\ve been palying since yinlin. and using those tips since then. (minus the lowest/highest stat number because it's already hard enough)
i got only 2 that fullfill those criterias (both on 4 star echoes). i'm just not lucky.
@@primohikari8087 Damn bruh that's sad, but for me it's playing since day 1 so I would naturally have more mats than you.
So I shouldn't try to get basic attack damage bonus for camellya?
@@fateslayer47 You should, but if you're planning to use the same havoc set on your other havoc chars then you don't need to aim for BA bonus. Camellya' s sign weap already have more than enough BA bonus anw.
@WinkyF2P thanks, I was worried about not having enough basic attack bonus on my substats despite having her signature weapon.
@@fateslayer47 No prob buddy. Me personally, I hate seeing BA or HA bonus substats popping up because not all dps chars can use them. I rather see res skill or lib bonus. 😵
@@WinkyF2P Yeah makes sense. Thank you so much for uploading such a great guide. Keep up the great work.
Also, would you please make a video about substats manipulation? (tuning echoes every 15 seconds for either even or odd minutes)
@@fateslayer47 Hmm... I can't really make a video guide on something that I don't believe in. I have seen videos and spreadsheets about that echo tuning mechanic before, but I'm not buying it. I also tested it out myself and I'm still not convinced. I think it's still based on your RNG luck at the end of the day. 🤗
I got double crit and double attack on my dreamless is that good for camellya?
@@S_P_I_R_I_T.X That's good for any char honestly except for healer of course 😉
@@WinkyF2P thanks i was confused 💕
this is only applicable if you have tons of echoes farmed
but for casual players who are relying on tacet fields for echoes, this method is not very helpful
@@rcg7269 That is true but as for casuals I think no matter what method you used, your echoes will always be mid because you don't have alot of echo options to choose from.
At 12:40 that is what i got from My piece for Jinhsi imao😂
@@Ayanokoji30 Damn bruh I only seen that kind of 3 substats combination once in these 6 months 😂
I think you are too good at content making, but bad in accent on english, i see big content creator here, i invested subscribe, hope u get succed
@@rulers1464 Thx man buddy 🤗
I been tuning echo but its dam hard
I haven't able to even full build my xiangliyao yet😢
The problem is not enough material
always just level up to 10 bro then see if the first 2 substats are to your liking before you go all out on tuners. Built my Yao within 2 weeks. He will be perfect after I got his weapon. He is only 68/230 rn but he hits around 190k
@@Lig-Crzy09 Yep my main problem is tuners only. I have enough echo exp items but not tuners. 😤
@@WinkyF2P same as me hell difficult to get tuners at this point of the game
You need to calm down mate! :)
Took me at least 100 tries just to get that bellborne with heal bonus and that's just one Echo! Lol
@@jivekiwi I agree buddy, healing bonus bellbourne is definitely a super rare drop, I only got 3 all these time, which is why you should just use ATK% or HP% ones. 😉
This is not Genshin. Echoes don't matter. Get 50/200, and getting good is enough.
Echos do matter are you stupid? Echos legit make your character
Brothers in crist Just pray 100 times a day to god and rng jesus🙏🙏🙏
Is hard to farming echo, i am solo player
@@verina_chan Casual bro?
That's the odd thing though, your crit rate state is pretty bad still. Like 7.5% crit rate is only acceptable if you've got really good rolls on everything else. Let alone a 6.3%, which I saw a lot of.
@@naterivers6107 Yes the overall CR for my electro set is bad, believe me that shit bugs me everyday, but I have no choice I accepted it at that time because of the overall high ATK. I'm still planning to improve the overall CR in the near future. 😤
@@WinkyF2P Trust me, I get the grind. I've spent weeks on Camellya alone.
@@naterivers6107 Camellya heh.. I managed to improve my havoc set tremendously though.. here check it out bro!
ruclips.net/video/rV0FtQqYwJs/видео.htmlsi=LQv4nORarCDit4l1
2500 tuners for BOTH Electro AND Spectro sets? Nah, either you're lying, or you got INCREDIBLY lucky with your tuning. 6500 tuners went to my Changli alone, and her set is far from perfect.
@@JoyBoyAlter No freaking way 6k tuners for a fusion set and still not done? Damn bruh..!!
Welp, my camelya has
2150 atk
53 cr
256 cd
Good enough for me
@@SkeithTheCursedWave666 You can do better my friend, I believe in you. 👊
hmm. while its expected approach the very late game its not good at midgame. In most cases you need 130 ER in case on Yunlin even 140. So you need 4 good substat and with high rolls for her only....then similar for XiangliYao ... cant happen. Cos I need also 2 fusion sets, 2 havoc, 3 moonlit etc.
als Wuwa devs are a bit slow. we should had a new 2 sets at this time.
@@ixirion Wait hold up buddy why do you need 2 different fusion sets and 2 havoc sets? That's crazy!
@@WinkyF2P I use Encore and Changli regulary + Chixia occasionally.
still thats not the problem. the problem is how much grind and resources you need to get 4 good substats
@@ixirion Well damn if that's the case then just slap your moonlit set onto 1 of them it's ok man. The same logic applies to Havoc Rover + Danjin. Upgrading 2 different sets of the same echo set is just a waste of mats bruh. 😥
@@WinkyF2P swaping echoes around is waste of time my man.
also outside of speedruning the5% dps doesnt matter.
also you again missed the topic that even you dont have 1 set fully maxed XD
I agree the leveling ideas have merit but again its super late game effort and can lead to burnout.
I just need 1 1 cost for camellya . 😂.
@@marupurusaivamsi4802 No 3-costs issue?
@WinkyF2P nah. Only aero is the only mf echo 3 cost killing me
@@marupurusaivamsi4802 Same here 😵💫
unfortunately this will only be possible when they rework/ upgrade the echoes system, in the current model this is just luck... I for example been playing since day one and just have literally 5 echoes with crit dmg 15%+ AND crit rate lol Building characters in Wuthering Waves feels really bad man
My suggestion would be allowing us to reroll only 1 substats on each echo using shell credits and the amount gets doubled everytime we reroll a substats.
"Its not hard" yeah deadass if u dont have a proper real job and just grinding all the echo on the world map every single day
@@Zenbu711 Who said it's not hard?
We have to be F2p with whale mentality
@@johngeorge5091 Im F2P it's possible, It's more like a min-max mentality lolx. 😬
Bro cooked sparta build
Why give up
Do it
Just do it
@@Emptiness771 Raawrh..!! 😎💪
do u think double crit + attk is enough, nooooo, u need heavy attack for jiyan, and resonance skill for jinshi and so on 😂😂😂