did this by just connecting 2 identical #6's to each other. Used insulated joiners on both rails and it works perfectly. I did not need the narrow track spacing so shortening the diverging tracks wasn't necessary. Now I am working to get my EcOS and ds64's to throw both turnouts simultaneously. Great video Mike, always relevant even if 7 years old.
I recently put two Kato #6s together using Mike’s suggestion not to cut the rails across the center crossover - and it works beautifully! The shorter diverging rail on each turnout (the one that connects to the frog) can be carefully slid out of the ties and then, after cutting the diverging trackbed of both turnouts to fit together, as shown in the video, the longer diverging rail can be inserted in its place. Note that the longer rail will need to be cut shorter by a few millimeters to fit. There is a metal contact below each removed diverging rail that pokes up through the trackbed and you must take care not to bend it and then to make sure each diverging rail that is inserted back into the ties go over its respective contact for a good electrical connection. If the polarity of the two parallel tracks is the same, there is no need to cut gaps in the diverging rails, but track power must of course be provided at least to the points end of both turnouts. Mike, an update: I am in error. Your rule of gapping the frog ends and providing power from the point ends applies here as well. The frogs are insulated and #6s are power-routing, so in theory at least, a single crossover of #6s should not need gaps across the diverging route if both parallel tracks have the same phase, just as Kato's #4 single crossover has no gaps in the diverging routes. However, the #6 internal electrical mechanisms are not always perfectly aligned, so I discovered having no gaps causes intermittent shorts - so gap BOTH diverging rails between the two turnouts in the single crossover. You don't have to gap the rails at the break between the turnouts, but be sure NOT to cut the gaps in each diverging rail between its adjacent frog and the metal contact below the diverging rail or that rail section will have no power!
A very dangerous modification if you want to risk damaging 2 number 6 turnouts. They are $32 a piece at the local dealer. I can get the double crossover for $65.
The staggered insulated rails works fine in DCC, we use them all the time with Peco electrofrog crossovers. Its supposed to be better for wheels to stager them and if an auto reverser is involved is supposed to be a better electrically. I don't know if DC likes stagger insulated joiners.
Hi Mike, thanks for using my question and showing us the turnouts. Up till now I've never had the courage to attempt this, and as I model the modern era on my layout I was using #6 Code 80 Atlas turnouts to achieve this and keep my rolling stock happy. After weathering and ballasting the track it pretty well all blends together. While we're on the topic of Kato turnouts, have you had a chance to look at the new #4 single crossovers? If so any thoughts on performance etc? Thanks for all the helpful videos, looking forward to the next one. Frank
***** I am not fond of #4's either but I am about to notch all of mine and make them work because 1 I don't have the money to convert to #6's and 2 because I don't have the SPACE for it either...hopefully notching them will do the trick and stop the derailments...I don't want #4449 to hit the floor again....got lucky the first time and nothing broke...
Did you install this and test run it? Any followup on the gap position? I don't see that making a difference, since the two sides need to be in electrical agreement to crossover, anyway. I have mine cut (roadbed) and still have the bare rails untrimmed. Thanks
Never installed it but know it worked. It does not matter on gap placement. Since Kato did not see fit to make them, maybe I should and sell them. Thanks , Mike
Could that be done with a turnout and a crossing? The aim would be to keep the spacing between tracks while allowing the outer train to get inside of the loop.
I am using the kato double track and I will be using single cross overs produced by kato, 20-231, and my ? is how do you isolate or wire it? You stated that one needs to put the insulated joiners at the wide end of the switch for just one switch but two switches heading into each other ? I see there are gapes cut in the rail between inside and outside tracks of the switch which is like installing those insulators at the wide end of the switch. Do I still need to isolate both directions the outside rails of the switch?
I am a little confused on the purpose of the rail gaps you cut. could you explain for me please. if I was just slapping together 2 #6s for a crossover (unmodified) would I have to cut gaps or do something special ?
Tom Emslie We know #4's work but some folks did not want the sharp radius turnout for their crossing so we used #6's her to prove it can be done. Thanks , Mike
@@N-Scale I just recently got into N scale being O 2rail most of my time, Kato has always made great stuff, I'm afraid of doing your project on 2 sets of #6 turnouts, I'll be at the train store tomorrow and see what else I can get for this newfound love for N scale haha
@@Mason.deyneka If you have tried to program road # it could be the # is not matching. There are so many reasons the loco would take off without a command.
did this by just connecting 2 identical #6's to each other. Used insulated joiners on both rails and it works perfectly. I did not need the narrow track spacing so shortening the diverging tracks wasn't necessary. Now I am working to get my EcOS and ds64's to throw both turnouts simultaneously. Great video Mike, always relevant even if 7 years old.
2 #6 turnouts back to back WILL NOT mate up to Kato double track.
Mike
I recently put two Kato #6s together using Mike’s suggestion not to cut the rails across the center crossover - and it works beautifully! The shorter diverging rail on each turnout (the one that connects to the frog) can be carefully slid out of the ties and then, after cutting the diverging trackbed of both turnouts to fit together, as shown in the video, the longer diverging rail can be inserted in its place. Note that the longer rail will need to be cut shorter by a few millimeters to fit. There is a metal contact below each removed diverging rail that pokes up through the trackbed and you must take care not to bend it and then to make sure each diverging rail that is inserted back into the ties go over its respective contact for a good electrical connection. If the polarity of the two parallel tracks is the same, there is no need to cut gaps in the diverging rails, but track power must of course be provided at least to the points end of both turnouts.
Mike, an update: I am in error. Your rule of gapping the frog ends and providing power from the point ends applies here as well. The frogs are insulated and #6s are power-routing, so in theory at least, a single crossover of #6s should not need gaps across the diverging route if both parallel tracks have the same phase, just as Kato's #4 single crossover has no gaps in the diverging routes. However, the #6 internal electrical mechanisms are not always perfectly aligned, so I discovered having no gaps causes intermittent shorts - so gap BOTH diverging rails between the two turnouts in the single crossover. You don't have to gap the rails at the break between the turnouts, but be sure NOT to cut the gaps in each diverging rail between its adjacent frog and the metal contact below the diverging rail or that rail section will have no power!
Thanks Steven !!
Great tip Mike. Them you for sharing.
Peter CPRail8748 Thanks Peter , I hope some will give it a try.
Mike
Thanks for sharing this video and information
You are welcome. Mike
A very dangerous modification if you want to risk damaging 2 number 6 turnouts. They are $32 a piece at the local dealer. I can get the double crossover for $65.
Not everyone wants a double crossover and at those prices you should be shopping with us possibly.
Thanks , Mike
The staggered insulated rails works fine in DCC, we use them all the time with Peco electrofrog crossovers. Its supposed to be better for wheels to stager them and if an auto reverser is involved is supposed to be a better electrically. I don't know if DC likes stagger insulated joiners.
Roy Maynard Thanks Roy , after I thought about it I realized it would work.
Thanks Mike
Hi Mike, thanks for using my question and showing us the turnouts. Up till now I've never had the courage to attempt this, and as I model the modern era on my layout I was using #6 Code 80 Atlas turnouts to achieve this and keep my rolling stock happy. After weathering and ballasting the track it pretty well all blends together.
While we're on the topic of Kato turnouts, have you had a chance to look at the new #4 single crossovers? If so any thoughts on performance etc?
Thanks for all the helpful videos, looking forward to the next one.
Frank
dexterdog62 Thanks Frank , I am never too fond of anything related to the #4's
Thanks Frank , Mike
***** I am not fond of #4's either but I am about to notch all of mine and make them work because 1 I don't have the money to convert to #6's and 2 because I don't have the SPACE for it either...hopefully notching them will do the trick and stop the derailments...I don't want #4449 to hit the floor again....got lucky the first time and nothing broke...
dexterdog62 Thanks Frank and I did a video on one but they are designed just like the #4 and would likely display the same issues.
Thanks , Mike
***** Hope you do some reading on the #4s as there is another issue where the point rail mates to the stock rail as well.
Thanks , Mike
I would love to see the process to wire a 2 aspect block signal to a standard #4 ATLAS turnout to show straight and diverging routes.
Did you install this and test run it? Any followup on the gap position? I don't see that making a difference, since the two sides need to be in electrical agreement to crossover, anyway. I have mine cut (roadbed) and still have the bare rails untrimmed. Thanks
Never installed it but know it worked. It does not matter on gap placement.
Since Kato did not see fit to make them, maybe I should and sell them.
Thanks , Mike
Could that be done with a turnout and a crossing? The aim would be to keep the spacing between tracks while allowing the outer train to get inside of the loop.
That is the object of this video. It can be done easily with the Kato double Crossover.
Mike
@@N-Scale Many thanks.
I am using the kato double track and I will be using single cross overs produced by kato, 20-231, and my ? is how do you isolate or wire it? You stated that one needs to put the insulated joiners at the wide end of the switch for just one switch but two switches heading into each other ? I see there are gapes cut in the rail between inside and outside tracks of the switch which is like installing those insulators at the wide end of the switch. Do I still need to isolate both directions the outside rails of the switch?
No insulators needed on it.
Mike
I am a little confused on the purpose of the rail gaps you cut. could you explain for me please. if I was just slapping together 2 #6s for a crossover (unmodified) would I have to cut gaps or do something special ?
+James Smith You need gaps or you have a short between inner and outer rails.
Mike
I have done this using #4 turnouts. I did not have to trim either one. They just snap together
Tom Emslie We know #4's work but some folks did not want the sharp radius turnout for their crossing so we used #6's her to prove it can be done.
Thanks , Mike
@@nscalemodeltrainshowtochan4479 shame that they havent released a #6 crossover yet, #4 is too sharp for my longer models.
@@AbelG8781 That is why I made this one.
Mike
@@N-Scale I just recently got into N scale being O 2rail most of my time, Kato has always made great stuff, I'm afraid of doing your project on 2 sets of #6 turnouts, I'll be at the train store tomorrow and see what else I can get for this newfound love for N scale haha
Nice! Thank you!
Your Welcome , Mike.
Have you seen Tomix track but also a Tomix turnout
Yes. We used to sell it but NO ONE is using it. It is a China competitor to Kato
what is the difference between a #4 and a #6 turn out thanks in advance
The diverging rail is sharper on a # 4 vs. #6 and in Kato they are constructed totally different.
Thanks , Mike
can this be done using #4 switches
Yes but Kato already makes them built up
Is there a way to fix a short?
If the gaps are correct there should not be a short unless a feeder is reversed somewhere on the layout.
Is that what it could be? I put my engine on the track and as soon as I put it in forward or reverse it starts moving even if I don’t touch the speed
@@Mason.deyneka DC or DCC???????
@@N-Scale dcc
@@Mason.deyneka If you have tried to program road # it could be the # is not matching. There are so many reasons the loco would take off without a command.