I love how the little turbo makes 765 hp/ 815 ft lbs, and Richard is saying, "listen thats cool, but just go with the 1100 hp, unit, it's what you really want"
Depends what you like. I would give up top end for instant gratification on the bottom. I don’t want to have to rev 6 or 7 k to get that hard pulling feeling.
The bigger turbo even made more power down around 3000-3500rpm. I think a lot of us are reluctant to turn up the hp screw since we're limited by the strength of the block, trans, rear end etc.
I love seeing this kind of information. Not every build is for a racecar, and this is the kind of info I am after for more of my streetcar build stuff.
You did twin eBay GT-45s on a BBC, love to see that on the 416! How ‘bout no intercooler and blow through an 8-injector Sniper on a tall single plane with E-85? OTOH, a simple 4.8 or 5.3 with bolt on Holley or Hooker crossover turbo manifold and a single GT-45 or S475 with a similar blow through setup would be more in line with our budgets.
@@sixx6sixx107 To explain, compressors have a air flow curve and move x amount of air efficiently, so the general rule is 2cfm per horsepower, so 2000 cfm = 1000 hp roughly.. x 2 = 2000 hp, you run into a few limitations along the way mainly head flow and exhaust back pressure, not counting the engines ability to make.. 2000 hp. Boost in means exhaust out, so having to small of a exhaust turbine *which is what an exhaust side of a turbo is called btw* makes the turbo spool really fast but limits top end power. Having to big of an exhaust turbine means the turbo rpm doesn't get efficient till higher exhaust flow/rpm. You can put to big of an exhaust side on and make no boost. So it's a balancing act depending on how you use the engine combination. I know you used to be able to look up flow charts for turbos on various websites, you can look up a compressor side for an airflow you need for the power you want, say you want to make 1500 hp on a single turbo you know you will need 3000+ cfm to reach that number and you want to run the turbo about 75-80% flow for it to be efficient and have a bit left over for fine tuning, once you determine how big and which compressor side you need you start sizing the exhaust side. Exhaust size and flow can be used to tune where the compressor makes the boost you need in a rpm range that fits your needs. so a single 1500hp turbo need 1500hp worth of exhaust flow, on a twin turbo 1500hp setup the turbines are sized for 750hp each and are much smaller. The engine size determines how much exhaust can be made, more air in = more air out the bigger the engine the more power it can make given enough cylinder head to move that air. So... how do fast yah wanna go?
Hey Richard how about an other guy turbo comparison, old 7.3 turbos, maybe a turbo from a 466 international engine, grab one from a front end loader stuff like that
What you are saying makes perfect sense for a street engine. I did a Jeep 4.0 with a small turbo specifically for the response. It has a mild comp cam, an Edelbrock head and headers. I have a rpm ceiling of 5k. The turbo itself is a cheap T3/T4 hybrid off Ebay. It holds 10 psi from 2200 to 5000. Seems to work great for my application. Intended usage plays a big part in turbo selection also. The small one like you did would be great for a work truck. I use mine for offroad and the boost response is very beneficial.
I've got a hx40w on my 4.0. full boost doesn't happen till 3500 and I think it's perfect. Out of the picture till you dip into it, but the boost response is still excellent. It's downright fast.
I'd like to see how this applies with big displacement/low rpm engines. Like in your other guy's series. Cad 500 and the Buick 455, also curious about how the 500ci Mopar stroker would fair also.
@@hondaservicecenter Agreed. The rpm point would make more sense on a centrifugal supercharger, but it's the exhaust flow that determines the spool on the turbo...just look at the diesels.
Could you explain the AR on the exhaust side? I noticed you mentioned it before. But to better understand the concept of it would be nice especially a comparison. Thanks Richard the content is awesome!!!
What would you recommend on a boosted engine timing vs boost. More timing less boost, more boost less timing would be pretty cool to see a video and explanation as to why for which.
Can you do a video on turbo placement,turbo clocking,WG placement,WG welded straight to the backhousing and differences that makes,blow off valve placement,pretty much everything having to do with different placements of components of a turbo kit and the advantages and disadvantages...............and maybe one day build a Mule 434cid SBC or a 440cid SBC with a huge single or big twin turbos and EFI not blow-thru carburetor or build a 454cid LSX with a huge single or big twins I've only really seen 427cid or smaller with turbos when it comes to an LS engine and 430cid and bigger or either N/A or Nitrous but hardly ever any boosted applications except maybe one with a twin screw blower here and there or a small Procharger but nothing that big with turbos even when it comes down to other engines like a BBC I've only really seen 572cid and smaller with a turbo 632cid and bigger either have Nitrous,Procharger,Twin Screw,or N/A maybe you can get a speciality engine builder who builds big cubic inch engines to come on the channel and explain why or maybe even be willing to bring a big cubic inch BBC on the channel and test it out and see what happens maybe even bring a "Semi-Hemi" a BBC with Hemi heads on it 632cid or bigger with a huge single or big twins on EFI with billet intake, CNC ported,polished and milled billet heads,and block, and billet aluminum or titanium rods,and a billet steel crankshaft with a special grind solid roller turbo cam,incanell and titanium valves,and of course shaft rockers and roller everything
I agree with your idea of a little bigger turbo, as long as people realize when boost goes up, air temps go up, now you need an intercooler, and maybe race gas. Your original Ebay turbo, budget build, just got expensive and it’s no longer a daily driver!
Jay Dunbar I found out the hard way, that even on E85 you may still need an intercooler. I have a bunch of ashtrays because of that. Air temps can mess with E85 too!
Your closing statement is what gets me. I bought a truck to ls swap and right now I’m thinking 500whp quick spooling street truck. Kind of a cross between auto cross and drag build. I like the idea of a s366, or a 72/68. Both will make low 600hp if needed. But should I go bigger to shift the power up? This is where research fails and real world experience is needed.
Hey Richard please remember to sleep when measuring back pressure are U taking the reading pre or post turbo Do you think there is anything to be said when running twins to size one slightly bigger or smaller to change the power delivery Would love to see a bigg compound turbo test and A remote turbo test comparison I've been dreaming up a remote compound system inbetween being the fattest fly in your dyno room I just love that this is job I do believe BMW brought out a triple sequential on an m series Diesel with great success Bring back the keglageon for a boost test please
. . . BMW actually "went to plaid" and made a four turbo B57 inline 6 Diesel [ 394hp@4400 rpm/561torque@2k-3k rpm ] and installed it in the M550d which I think never made it to USA shores. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BMW_B57
Great data as always - but maybe i'm missing the point. The larger turbo is going to make more power - yes. Wouldn't the more relevant comparison be to target a boost level like 10PSI and compare the transient response and the ability of both turbos to carry that boost level throughout the rev range? And by association, what impact that has on area under the curve(s), which is what makes you get down-track faster?
Great video!! A suggestion.., You have all these different tests, 4.8 (?), 5.3, 416 cid and 454 BBC all using the GT-45. Could you make a brief compilation video of all of these tests just to super clearly show how the torque and HP aren’t a lot different amongst very different combos over a variance range of roughy 55% in displacement. Perhaps that’s spiking the ball.....? My 2 or 3 cents. Cheers 🍻
I'd rather be a little on the small side for street use. Torque, throttle response, burnouts, highway passing. I spend very little time over 5000 rpm. But I'm more of a supercharger guy anyway. It ain't how much I can make, it's how much I can use.
Love seeing facts. I know its been talked about, but what about something like twin 62mm vs say the s475 on the 5.3 and twin 67-8ish vs the 80mm comp on the 6.2L? May be beating a dead horse, but seems like twin smaller vs one large would be better in both for worlds of street and strip.
@@jaydunbar7538 that's an understandable angle, but also if you are talking about a 6.2, alum heads reworked and all the other goodies with it, what's the difference cost percentages and actual dollar amount. Some would say its negligible in difference for end result. That's why I was asking about the comparisons.
@@richardholdener1727 just curiosity had gotten the best of me, for instance the turbo on the 6.2 that couldn't support any more due to back pressure restrictions, would it benefit adding a compound set up or just twins if you had already went that size. I.E. twin 76mm vs single 88mm
Richard, have you ever tested a variable geometry turbine on a gas engine? From everything I have read the hydraulic actuator in Garretts VA series is compatible with pulse width modulated boost controllers.
@@bacardiclark8919 get one of the Ball Bearing gt3582 guys. The cheapest that will push 500 to the tires is a Chinese hx35 but your stuck with it. You can maybe get 700 at the tires with a Chinese gt3582r but running them at 500 they will last a long time.
What would be a good twin turbo setup for a track car. Thinking of going with a 5.3 aluminum block with forged internals. But not sure what turbos to give me good power that isnt rowdy when they kick in. I'd still wanna be up towards the 1000hp range with the turbo opened up. But probably be happy around the 600whp range. At least for a while
Add larger chamber head and below 3k gained and top end lost, i would think less comp affects bottom rpm more than top end rpm? Maybe more going on in the flow and swirl that affected drop with low comp heads?
I would really want to see a wastegate comparison. Like the GT45 with a much bigger wastegate like a turbo smart compgate 40 vs a progate 50. Would a bigger wastegate help with back pressure?
There is a difference between a small turbo and a turbo that is to small. I look at turbocharger inducer Area to engine volume. A nice 2.0 L needs at turbo with someting between 46mm and 54mm inducer, right? A 5.3 L engine is 2.65 times bigger than a 2.0 L engine and therefor needs 2.65 times more inducer area (not diameter). That indicates a turbocharger with inducer between 75 mm and 88 mm is the right choice for a 5.3L engine. This also says a 416 CID engine can use a 100 mm turbocharger.
@@richardholdener1727 I use this as starting point for a true (very) high performance engine. imgur.com/is143SB 84 - 88 mm turbo for a good 6,0L engine to keep the back pressure down with a single turbo kit. Two 76 mm turbos = one 107 mm turbo. ruclips.net/video/1CIaPJ8hQ1k/видео.html
My problem is i cant afford the trans clutch torque converter reared needed to support the big turbo lol. The hp seems to be easy putting it to the ground is the challenge
Do you have a gt45 vs summit for a low rpm cam for a truck with stock heads and intake. BTR has a truck cam called "torque". I think it would put the power at a very low rpm range. I would like to see how it would run with different boost levels on pump gas. You do a great job.
@@richardholdener1727 Thank you. ruclips.net/video/s5Y04npcG0c/видео.html just came up in my suggested videos. Looks like we are back to the trucknorris cam.
Nice to see the right size single comparison. I would like to see right sized twins vs the right sized single. Two smaller twins should be the compromise of response and power to a big single. I'm building a twin s366 6.0l to package into a gbody, no room for a single s475
Still hoping to see a couple of the ebay cumins turbos on a 4.8. I'm wondering if the internal wastegates will keep boost under 14 psi with some 7lb cans on them
To echo others, I would like to see you play more with VGT turbos ON EVERYTHING. You know, just to open another can of worms. 👌🏻😁 Thanks for the hard work, our Saint and Patron of The Holy Boost & Other Guys Church ! 🤣👍🏻
I am in the process of building a twin turbo built 376 cu.in. LSA block, BTR stage 2 twin turbo cam, triple 450 return style fuel pumps , 1300cc injectors, meth, e85 and all the other supporting mod's.....I was wondering if my two Precision Turbo 6266 Billet Gen2 CEA BB Turbos with an AR of .82 big enough to make over 1k rwhp??
Yes it can be detected from the dyno graph easily. You'll see the power drop drastically at a RPM where the back pressure becomes too high. If you're running 15 lb of boost then you turn it up to 25 lbs of boost, it'll still make the same power just higher torque earlier which could Bend rods. We picked up from 743 rear-wheel horsepower at 24 pounds of boost to 1030 rear-wheel horsepower by changing from a .91 AR to a .96 AR twin s369 Warner's
I have watched your videos to the point that nobody should watch that much. I am just trying to educate myself on turbo selection. I like the big end of the s475 but I want the low initial boost. I am finding it hard to find a compound set up on ls engines I have chosen my cam combo from your videos but still struggle to find a compound setup that will deliver 900ish hp on top and the benefit of the small turbo to get bottom end power up. I have a 408 stroker 9.3 compression with .624 lift 232/242 duration and 108 lsa cam trick flow 255 heads. I know I could go with a supercharger, blower combo to get that instant power but would just really like to use turbo/turbos instead. what hp can be made with this engine on pump fuel below 5500 rpm. I don't care about a particular number i just want to make as much as possible under 5500 with turbo/turbos or am I wasting my time and go with blower/supercharger setup I just really don't want to go that way, Can you help me?
use an S475 turbo on your 408, put a smaller cam in it and use the truck intake since you won't be making big power on pump gas -it will be responsive and fun
I'd like to see the 5.3l with a pair of the ebay GT45 turbos. Though the GT45 may be too large for twins on the 5.3l. If so maybe the 6.0l. But since you can buy a pair of the GT45 for the cost of a single S475, why not try it?
@@richardholdener1727 I haven't seen the twins on the 4.8l. Based n the video here I took it that the GT45 wasn't quite big enough for a single on the 5.3l and the S475 was closer to the right size but also twice the cost. If the GT45 is too small for the 5.3l, a single on the 454 would definitely be too small. I'd definitely like to see you run the 5.3l with twin GT45s.
I want to see some flathead stuff you shown a lot and even my favorite motor but I want to know what different combos with the flathead work and what dont
i think with that caddy 500 you'll change your tune a touch on the "rather have lag down low for big power up top" when that big power up top is at 4800rpm. but that may be an extreme example. cant wait to see though
I actually prefer a bit smaller turbo for that quick response. I mean how many can actually get those 1000 horsepowers to the ground. ( I'm talking about street cars)
Richard could you compare supercharger vs turbocharger on the same engine to settle the question which one produces more power at the same boost level and using the same intercooler.
@@richardholdener1727 I was looking at that exact one. Would a performance place put that on for me? Or try to get me to buy more expensive crap I don't need ?
So...if i had a super charger and i had a small 2 stroke engine with a horizontal shaft, how hard would it be to make a water pump? It LOOKs like it just needs to be sealed on the back...where the blades are exposed.
Any chance for a test showing a LS engine getting into boost at lower RPMS? Pretty much trying to get a gasser to act somewhat like a diesel with a power curve (as close as possible).
@@richardholdener1727 How would that do with towing though? Would it generate too much heat? I don't need a lot of boost. Just something for my 6.0. Thanks for the videos and responses.
I'm setting out to disprove the traditional theory that you need a small turbo to get a responsive engine. I'm running a EFR6758 on a 2.0L mazda motor, and I'm "only" running 10 psi (side note: that is going to change this year). That's a big turbo for a 2.0L. In 3rd gear starting at ~1700 rpm, I can achieve 10 psi at ~ 3200 rpm. It's even better in higher gears. It was worse before I got a boost controller, turbo blanket, and wrapped exhaust. However, that's on a fairly short, unequal-length runner exhaust with a single scroll housing. I've already drafted up a slightly longer, equal length runner exhaust design with a twin scroll housing. I'll let you know what I achieve after I've finished up the new design. It'll probably later this year.
Should I use a turbo or supercharger ? I thought about a hundred shot of nitrous, but I would use that up on the way home for dinner. What is the cheapest and most reliable? It’s for my Silverado w/ 5.3 I just want a lil sleeper just to raise little bit of hell in but yet it is my daily driver. Love your videos!
They used to tell us that variable geometry turbos would give you the best of both worlds. Is it too hard for aftermarket kits to control them? Or is there a reliability issue?
VG turbos are common on modern diesels, but are very rare in gasoline engines. As far as I know, Porsche is the only manufacturer that has them. The main reason is exhaust gas temperature is about 400F lower on diesels than on gasoline engines. It takes much more exotic (expensive) materials to make a reliable VG turbo for gasoline. But it would be interesting to pull a VG turbo off a Cummins 6.7 and see how well it works on a 5.3.....
Richard Holdener I would like to see a test like that. Max out the small turbo then add another and see what power at the same boost levels but essentially double the CFM.
Any experience with this combo? I'm putting together a 4.8, Sloppy stage 2 cam, NNBS Intake manifold, S475 (75/96) 1.32 T6, 4L80, Holley Terminator X Max SN95. I'm having trouble sizing a converter for a street car. I'd love to see what the stock converter would do! Gonna try and shoot for 3.27 gears on a 275/60/15.
Love these videos of yours man. Have a question if I may. Can you do a video of a turbo with an open housing vs divided vs divided and a QSV for turbo response?
![Seungmin "그렇게, 천천히, 우리(As we are)" | [Stray Kids : SKZ-PLAYER]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/kAzmhLHePqU/mqdefault.jpg)
This is one of those important conversations to have with one's son.
"Don't worry about the size of your snail, son"
Its not the size of the dog in the fight.
Its the size of the fight in the dog.
Dad: birds and the bees son
Son: dad is the bird the summit turbo and the bee is the eBay turbo?
Dad: I love boy.
Top tier comment 🤟🏻
That, and the advice to always buy a modern 4V DOHC VVT engine.
I love how the little turbo makes 765 hp/ 815 ft lbs, and Richard is saying, "listen thats cool, but just go with the 1100 hp, unit, it's what you really want"
I'm not even trying to aim pass 550😂
Depends what you like. I would give up top end for instant gratification on the bottom. I don’t want to have to rev 6 or 7 k to get that hard pulling feeling.
You do see that you don't have to pick, right? Cover the right half of your screen and watch again.
One of my favorite channels out there. Keep up the good work.
The bigger turbo even made more power down around 3000-3500rpm. I think a lot of us are reluctant to turn up the hp screw since we're limited by the strength of the block, trans, rear end etc.
Revs give power without more torque, but it costs money to have a free-revving engine.
I love seeing this kind of information. Not every build is for a racecar, and this is the kind of info I am after for more of my streetcar build stuff.
That is a very healthy naturally aspirated motor! Good test.
You did twin eBay GT-45s on a BBC, love to see that on the 416! How ‘bout no intercooler and blow through an 8-injector Sniper on a tall single plane with E-85? OTOH, a simple 4.8 or 5.3 with bolt on Holley or Hooker crossover turbo manifold and a single GT-45 or S475 with a similar blow through setup would be more in line with our budgets.
Buy a GT45. Get bored.
Get a second one and go twins ;)
If you max out a thousand hp turbo,what happens when you add a second?🤔How much more power could you gain ?
good plan
@@sixx6sixx107 Doesn't matter how much more... its not enough. Its never enough.
@@SweatyFatGuy that's understandable...but will it make more than the one thousand hp turbo did alone 🤷🏾♂️
@@sixx6sixx107 To explain, compressors have a air flow curve and move x amount of air efficiently, so the general rule is 2cfm per horsepower, so 2000 cfm = 1000 hp roughly.. x 2 = 2000 hp, you run into a few limitations along the way mainly head flow and exhaust back pressure, not counting the engines ability to make.. 2000 hp. Boost in means exhaust out, so having to small of a exhaust turbine *which is what an exhaust side of a turbo is called btw* makes the turbo spool really fast but limits top end power. Having to big of an exhaust turbine means the turbo rpm doesn't get efficient till higher exhaust flow/rpm. You can put to big of an exhaust side on and make no boost. So it's a balancing act depending on how you use the engine combination. I know you used to be able to look up flow charts for turbos on various websites, you can look up a compressor side for an airflow you need for the power you want, say you want to make 1500 hp on a single turbo you know you will need 3000+ cfm to reach that number and you want to run the turbo about 75-80% flow for it to be efficient and have a bit left over for fine tuning, once you determine how big and which compressor side you need you start sizing the exhaust side. Exhaust size and flow can be used to tune where the compressor makes the boost you need in a rpm range that fits your needs. so a single 1500hp turbo need 1500hp worth of exhaust flow, on a twin turbo 1500hp setup the turbines are sized for 750hp each and are much smaller. The engine size determines how much exhaust can be made, more air in = more air out the bigger the engine the more power it can make given enough cylinder head to move that air. So... how do fast yah wanna go?
Thank you Richard-love the tech videos!!!!
Hey Richard how about an other guy turbo comparison, old 7.3 turbos, maybe a turbo from a 466 international engine, grab one from a front end loader stuff like that
I would love to see old flat heads and or a hurricane 4cyl turbo buildup Willy’s Jeep etc
Me too.
That's a CRAZY N/A combination. Again, great information, keep up the hard work.
What you are saying makes perfect sense for a street engine. I did a Jeep 4.0 with a small turbo specifically for the response. It has a mild comp cam, an Edelbrock head and headers. I have a rpm ceiling of 5k. The turbo itself is a cheap T3/T4 hybrid off Ebay. It holds 10 psi from 2200 to 5000. Seems to work great for my application. Intended usage plays a big part in turbo selection also. The small one like you did would be great for a work truck. I use mine for offroad and the boost response is very beneficial.
I've got a hx40w on my 4.0. full boost doesn't happen till 3500 and I think it's perfect. Out of the picture till you dip into it, but the boost response is still excellent. It's downright fast.
I'd like to see how this applies with big displacement/low rpm engines. Like in your other guy's series. Cad 500 and the Buick 455, also curious about how the 500ci Mopar stroker would fair also.
Their NA power spread tells you exactly how they will respond.
Alpha Wërks but they move big volume of exhaust gas compared to let’s say a 5.3
@@hondaservicecenter Agreed. The rpm point would make more sense on a centrifugal supercharger, but it's the exhaust flow that determines the spool on the turbo...just look at the diesels.
Could you explain the AR on the exhaust side? I noticed you mentioned it before. But to better understand the concept of it would be nice especially a comparison. Thanks Richard the content is awesome!!!
Yes I can-bigger AR equals more flow and less response for a given size
What would you recommend on a boosted engine timing vs boost. More timing less boost, more boost less timing would be pretty cool to see a video and explanation as to why for which.
As always I enjoy the videos Richard. How about a video for us newbies to boost on boost curves and electronic controllers versus regular.
Nice, I have an s475 for my 6.0, glad I picked the right one!
Good choice!
Can you do a video on turbo placement,turbo clocking,WG placement,WG welded straight to the backhousing and differences that makes,blow off valve placement,pretty much everything having to do with different placements of components of a turbo kit and the advantages and disadvantages...............and maybe one day build a Mule 434cid SBC or a 440cid SBC with a huge single or big twin turbos and EFI not blow-thru carburetor or build a 454cid LSX with a huge single or big twins I've only really seen 427cid or smaller with turbos when it comes to an LS engine and 430cid and bigger or either N/A or Nitrous but hardly ever any boosted applications except maybe one with a twin screw blower here and there or a small Procharger but nothing that big with turbos even when it comes down to other engines like a BBC I've only really seen 572cid and smaller with a turbo 632cid and bigger either have Nitrous,Procharger,Twin Screw,or N/A maybe you can get a speciality engine builder who builds big cubic inch engines to come on the channel and explain why or maybe even be willing to bring a big cubic inch BBC on the channel and test it out and see what happens maybe even bring a "Semi-Hemi" a BBC with Hemi heads on it 632cid or bigger with a huge single or big twins on EFI with billet intake, CNC ported,polished and milled billet heads,and block, and billet aluminum or titanium rods,and a billet steel crankshaft with a special grind solid roller turbo cam,incanell and titanium valves,and of course shaft rockers and roller everything
I agree with your idea of a little bigger turbo, as long as people realize when boost goes up, air temps go up, now you need an intercooler, and maybe race gas. Your original Ebay turbo, budget build, just got expensive and it’s no longer a daily driver!
Run ethanol instead of race gas and go pick up the groceries.
Jay Dunbar I found out the hard way, that even on E85 you may still need an intercooler. I have a bunch of ashtrays because of that. Air temps can mess with E85 too!
Man , i just love the sound of the small turbo spooling lol... thanks good video..
There are workarounds for the lag issue. Twin scrolls, compounds, etcetera.
Would be interesting to see you test a VGT turbo "Turbonator" from Diesel Power Source.
Whatever happened to Bryce at Dr J’s , he did an excellent job for me on a BBC intake ten years ago ? Excellent work again Richard .
I have a set of Airwolf heads he did for me ..He got a divorce and shut down shop, he works at carrllio now.Chad Speier is the man at SRH inductions..
Your closing statement is what gets me. I bought a truck to ls swap and right now I’m thinking 500whp quick spooling street truck. Kind of a cross between auto cross and drag build. I like the idea of a s366, or a 72/68. Both will make low 600hp if needed. But should I go bigger to shift the power up? This is where research fails and real world experience is needed.
what size LS
Richard Holdener 5.3 with small cam. Should be purchasing drive train in a week or so.
Well I’m planning on running a sequential turbo setup, with the small for the low end quick response and the big one for the high end
Hey Richard please remember to sleep
when measuring back pressure are U taking the reading pre or post turbo
Do you think there is anything to be said when running twins to size one slightly bigger or smaller to change the power delivery
Would love to see a bigg compound turbo test
and
A remote turbo test comparison
I've been dreaming up a remote compound system inbetween being the fattest fly in your dyno room
I just love that this is job
I do believe BMW brought out a triple sequential on an m series Diesel with great success
Bring back the keglageon for a boost test please
back pressure readings taken before turbo and we size them the same unless sequential
. . . BMW actually "went to plaid" and made a four turbo B57 inline 6 Diesel [ 394hp@4400 rpm/561torque@2k-3k rpm ] and installed it in the M550d which I think never made it to USA shores.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BMW_B57
Dayum Richard I wish u would have ran that vs 7875 I'm about to
Id love to see a shootout between holley sniper efi and comparable cfm carb on the same motor sbc preferibly
Engine masters did it twice
@@jarrusjenkins Which is unfortunately behind a pay wall now.
@@nowayjose596 its 12$ a year....
@@gava7691 Pretty sad huh? All the "fans" that still complain over the price of Starbucks.
@@jarrusjenkins my exact response also. Been done and easy to access the info.
Great data as always - but maybe i'm missing the point. The larger turbo is going to make more power - yes. Wouldn't the more relevant comparison be to target a boost level like 10PSI and compare the transient response and the ability of both turbos to carry that boost level throughout the rev range? And by association, what impact that has on area under the curve(s), which is what makes you get down-track faster?
this wasn't that test
Great video!!
A suggestion..,
You have all these different tests, 4.8 (?), 5.3, 416 cid and 454 BBC all using the GT-45.
Could you make a brief compilation video of all of these tests just to super clearly show how the torque and HP aren’t a lot different amongst very different combos over a variance range of roughy 55% in displacement.
Perhaps that’s spiking the ball.....?
My 2 or 3 cents.
Cheers 🍻
Any update on bbc Big Bang?! I’m in a mood where I want to watch some destruction!
I'd rather be a little on the small side for street use. Torque, throttle response, burnouts, highway passing. I spend very little time over 5000 rpm. But I'm more of a supercharger guy anyway. It ain't how much I can make, it's how much I can use.
Compound turbos!!!
Great video! Thank you for what you do!
My trans ams 4l60e recommends i go small turbo
Love seeing facts. I know its been talked about, but what about something like twin 62mm vs say the s475 on the 5.3 and twin 67-8ish vs the 80mm comp on the 6.2L? May be beating a dead horse, but seems like twin smaller vs one large would be better in both for worlds of street and strip.
Twin costs more is much more difficult to fit in the bay.
@@jaydunbar7538 that's an understandable angle, but also if you are talking about a 6.2, alum heads reworked and all the other goodies with it, what's the difference cost percentages and actual dollar amount. Some would say its negligible in difference for end result. That's why I was asking about the comparisons.
The twin vs single is usually packaging if they are both sized correctly-might be a slight back pressure advantage with twins
@@richardholdener1727 just curiosity had gotten the best of me, for instance the turbo on the 6.2 that couldn't support any more due to back pressure restrictions, would it benefit adding a compound set up or just twins if you had already went that size. I.E. twin 76mm vs single 88mm
Or say a 68-72mm compound with a 102 lol
Coffe and morning class always makes a good day
Richard, have you ever tested a variable geometry turbine on a gas engine? From everything I have read the hydraulic actuator in Garretts VA series is compatible with pulse width modulated boost controllers.
I have not but would be cool
Sounds very Science ! . . . I would like to see that too ! 👌🏻😎👍🏻
@@richardholdener1727 what is the cheapest turbo for only 500 hp to the wheels
@@bacardiclark8919 get one of the Ball Bearing gt3582 guys. The cheapest that will push 500 to the tires is a Chinese hx35 but your stuck with it. You can maybe get 700 at the tires with a Chinese gt3582r but running them at 500 they will last a long time.
I can see a case for a fast-spooling turbo on a smaller engine, but on a healthy V8? Tires only have so much traction.
Richard, you should do a comparison of the same turbos with different sized turbine housings.. show back pressure also.
But where can you look up info on sizes for turbos other than name brand sites. eBay doesn’t seem to help in that department.
Hey Richard, how about letting us know what the turbine housing A/R ratios on these tests? This is a very useful piece of info
Now that's something that I can believe in. "SIZE MATTERS" lol 😂
What would be a good twin turbo setup for a track car. Thinking of going with a 5.3 aluminum block with forged internals. But not sure what turbos to give me good power that isnt rowdy when they kick in. I'd still wanna be up towards the 1000hp range with the turbo opened up. But probably be happy around the 600whp range. At least for a while
Gt3582s
I’m very curious about the compression ratio static cp and dcp for this stroker.. ? Thanks in advance..
Add larger chamber head and below 3k gained and top end lost, i would think less comp affects bottom rpm more than top end rpm? Maybe more going on in the flow and swirl that affected drop with low comp heads?
I would really want to see a wastegate comparison. Like the GT45 with a much bigger wastegate like a turbo smart compgate 40 vs a progate 50. Would a bigger wastegate help with back pressure?
Look at all that bottom end torque!! I’d low to have all that on my daily 4x4.
Turbine size and exhaust housing A/R is where its at
Wish you could do more compression with t4 vs t6 and ar of both
There is a difference between a small turbo and a turbo that is to small. I look at turbocharger inducer Area to engine volume. A nice 2.0 L needs at turbo with someting between 46mm and 54mm inducer, right? A 5.3 L engine is 2.65 times bigger than a 2.0 L engine and therefor needs 2.65 times more inducer area (not diameter). That indicates a turbocharger with inducer between 75 mm and 88 mm is the right choice for a 5.3L engine. This also says a 416 CID engine can use a 100 mm turbocharger.
turbo sizing isn't that easy-a 100-mm turbo is very big and can support 1500 hp or more
@@richardholdener1727 I use this as starting point for a true (very) high performance engine.
imgur.com/is143SB
84 - 88 mm turbo for a good 6,0L engine to keep the back pressure down with a single turbo kit.
Two 76 mm turbos = one 107 mm turbo. ruclips.net/video/1CIaPJ8hQ1k/видео.html
My problem is i cant afford the trans clutch torque converter reared needed to support the big turbo lol. The hp seems to be easy putting it to the ground is the challenge
yep
Do you have a gt45 vs summit for a low rpm cam for a truck with stock heads and intake. BTR has a truck cam called "torque". I think it would put the power at a very low rpm range. I would like to see how it would run with different boost levels on pump gas. You do a great job.
THE TWO TURBOS WOULD DO THE SAME THING (THERE IS A VIDEO UP) WITH ANY CAM-BIGGER ONE WILL BE LESS RESPONSIVE, BUT MORE POWER POTENTIAL
@@richardholdener1727 Thank you. ruclips.net/video/s5Y04npcG0c/видео.html just came up in my suggested videos. Looks like we are back to the trucknorris cam.
I bet he has a lawnmower will that little turbo on it
Next episode: Hey guys, grass too tall? Lets make some noise
James Holbrook nah Subaru 😂
Nice to see the right size single comparison. I would like to see right sized twins vs the right sized single. Two smaller twins should be the compromise of response and power to a big single. I'm building a twin s366 6.0l to package into a gbody, no room for a single s475
Still hoping to see a couple of the ebay cumins turbos on a 4.8. I'm wondering if the internal wastegates will keep boost under 14 psi with some 7lb cans on them
I had that cam on my ly6 and boy it made some real power on top 😎
To echo others, I would like to see you play more with VGT turbos ON EVERYTHING. You know, just to open another can of worms. 👌🏻😁
Thanks for the hard work, our Saint and Patron of The Holy Boost & Other Guys Church ! 🤣👍🏻
Amen.
We need that diesel VGT technology in gas aftermarket for low rpm boost.
I think modern gasser cars have a turbo similar to vgts but I'm not sure on that
@@chrishansen7004 They do but they're small. We need the 78/76 sized ones with reliability. Throw that 2 step shit in the trash.
I am in the process of building a twin turbo built 376 cu.in. LSA block, BTR stage 2 twin turbo cam, triple 450 return style fuel pumps , 1300cc injectors, meth, e85 and all the other supporting mod's.....I was wondering if my two Precision Turbo 6266 Billet Gen2 CEA BB Turbos with an AR of .82 big enough to make over 1k rwhp??
that should do it no problem
I’d love to see a video on exhaust back pressure, any pros or cons to it and how to detect it on dyno graphs
All Con, higher temps with more back pressure. He has addressed the question previously.
Yes it can be detected from the dyno graph easily. You'll see the power drop drastically at a RPM where the back pressure becomes too high. If you're running 15 lb of boost then you turn it up to 25 lbs of boost, it'll still make the same power just higher torque earlier which could Bend rods. We picked up from 743 rear-wheel horsepower at 24 pounds of boost to 1030 rear-wheel horsepower by changing from a .91 AR to a .96 AR twin s369 Warner's
Lots of back pressure info on other tests
@@richardholdener1727 thanks looking forward to it
You ever do any testing with pipe sizing on both intake and exhaust?
So for a truck, go for a big turbo for a softer launch/more traction, but more power in the mid range?
Great video Rich, hiw about twin GT-45s on a 5.3 or 6.0! Measure backpressure and see how much boost will can provide along with hp and tq numbers.
those work
This is probably a stupid question. If a single turbo is maxed at 750hp would that same turbo in a twin setup make the system maxed at 1500hp?
yes-possibly a little more
I love youre Video! Very informativ.
Question... bearing turbos are obviously better, but are they? How are the bushing tubo's holding up... seems like many are bushing style these days.
I have watched your videos to the point that nobody should watch that much. I am just trying to educate myself on turbo selection. I like the big end of the s475 but I want the low initial boost. I am finding it hard to find a compound set up on ls engines I have chosen my cam combo from your videos but still struggle to find a compound setup that will deliver 900ish hp on top and the benefit of the small turbo to get bottom end power up. I have a 408 stroker 9.3 compression with .624 lift 232/242 duration and 108 lsa cam trick flow 255 heads. I know I could go with a supercharger, blower combo to get that instant power but would just really like to use turbo/turbos instead. what hp can be made with this engine on pump fuel below 5500 rpm. I don't care about a particular number i just want to make as much as possible under 5500 with turbo/turbos or am I wasting my time and go with blower/supercharger setup I just really don't want to go that way, Can you help me?
use an S475 turbo on your 408, put a smaller cam in it and use the truck intake since you won't be making big power on pump gas -it will be responsive and fun
And this is exactly why my twin gt45 wu tang warriors should pull a premium one for me this season.. I hope 🙏🏼
I'd like to see the 5.3l with a pair of the ebay GT45 turbos. Though the GT45 may be too large for twins on the 5.3l. If so maybe the 6.0l. But since you can buy a pair of the GT45 for the cost of a single S475, why not try it?
we ran twins on the 454 and maybe the 4.8L
@@richardholdener1727 I haven't seen the twins on the 4.8l. Based n the video here I took it that the GT45 wasn't quite big enough for a single on the 5.3l and the S475 was closer to the right size but also twice the cost. If the GT45 is too small for the 5.3l, a single on the 454 would definitely be too small. I'd definitely like to see you run the 5.3l with twin GT45s.
A 80mm turbo out flowed a 69mm...doesn't surprise me...
Would you be willing to do an independent test on DPS Turbonator VGT turbos? They claim it can bring VGT technology even to gasoline engines.
I want to see some flathead stuff you shown a lot and even my favorite motor but I want to know what different combos with the flathead work and what dont
i think with that caddy 500 you'll change your tune a touch on the "rather have lag down low for big power up top" when that big power up top is at 4800rpm. but that may be an extreme example. cant wait to see though
I actually prefer a bit smaller turbo for that quick response. I mean how many can actually get those 1000 horsepowers to the ground. ( I'm talking about street cars)
that works too
Has anyone engine dyno'd compound, vgt, or quick spool valved turbos on a gas engine?
check out the compound video that is up
I wonder if 2 turbos Of the same size but one journal bearing vs ball bearing would make power differently.
not much difference
Only difference I would think would be spool time.
What psi on the large? A/R housing? Thoughts on a g42-1450 for a 6.2L 530HP GM Crate motor? Thanks Richard
Like to see gr8 45 turbo on 4.3 v6
Boost at 2am? Sounds good.
it's always time for boost
4 a.m. for me but oh well
I got the no turbo blues…. I’m here trying to see what size 😆
How noticeable would the difference in response be going from the smaller turbo to the s475 on a mostly street driven car?
watch the turbo video where I compared them
@@richardholdener1727 I think I did.
Compressor to match the horsepower, turbine to flow the cubic inches.
You never say what area ratios are these turbos
Richard could you compare supercharger vs turbocharger on the same engine to settle the question which one produces more power at the same boost level and using the same intercooler.
I don't want to race I just want more low end torque what size turbo can I put on my 6.2 gm truck ? I would be happy with 500hp 550 trq
Gt45
@@richardholdener1727 I was looking at that exact one. Would a performance place put that on for me? Or try to get me to buy more expensive crap I don't need ?
Ok but what happens with 2 of the gt45's...
twice as good
So...if i had a super charger and i had a small 2 stroke engine with a horizontal shaft, how hard would it be to make a water pump? It LOOKs like it just needs to be sealed on the back...where the blades are exposed.
Just get a little electric one. Prius has electric water pump.
From what I saw, small turbo or large turbo, the power band is still determined by camshaft and intake manifold
yes-as long as there is flow available from the turbo
I see no reason to lower compression for boost. Just run a fuel to support it.
No, because then I have to rebuild it a couple years sooner because the ethanol wear.
@@redrhino1911 is ethanol the only race fuel that would support high compression w boost
Any chance for a test showing a LS engine getting into boost at lower RPMS? Pretty much trying to get a gasser to act somewhat like a diesel with a power curve (as close as possible).
big motor and small turbo
@@richardholdener1727 How would that do with towing though? Would it generate too much heat? I don't need a lot of boost. Just something for my 6.0.
Thanks for the videos and responses.
I'm setting out to disprove the traditional theory that you need a small turbo to get a responsive engine. I'm running a EFR6758 on a 2.0L mazda motor, and I'm "only" running 10 psi (side note: that is going to change this year). That's a big turbo for a 2.0L. In 3rd gear starting at ~1700 rpm, I can achieve 10 psi at ~ 3200 rpm. It's even better in higher gears. It was worse before I got a boost controller, turbo blanket, and wrapped exhaust. However, that's on a fairly short, unequal-length runner exhaust with a single scroll housing. I've already drafted up a slightly longer, equal length runner exhaust design with a twin scroll housing. I'll let you know what I achieve after I've finished up the new design. It'll probably later this year.
Big and little compounds for the win! 😉
Should I use a turbo or supercharger ? I thought about a hundred shot of nitrous, but I would use that up on the way home for dinner. What is the cheapest and most reliable? It’s for my Silverado w/ 5.3 I just want a lil sleeper just to raise little bit of hell in but yet it is my daily driver. Love your videos!
turbo is cheapest
They used to tell us that variable geometry turbos would give you the best of both worlds. Is it too hard for aftermarket kits to control them? Or is there a reliability issue?
VG turbos are common on modern diesels, but are very rare in gasoline engines. As far as I know, Porsche is the only manufacturer that has them. The main reason is exhaust gas temperature is about 400F lower on diesels than on gasoline engines. It takes much more exotic (expensive) materials to make a reliable VG turbo for gasoline. But it would be interesting to pull a VG turbo off a Cummins 6.7 and see how well it works on a 5.3.....
What about adding another small turbo Richard?
yes
@@richardholdener1727 what
Richard Holdener
I would like to see a test like that. Max out the small turbo then add another and see what power at the same boost levels but essentially double the CFM.
Any experience with this combo? I'm putting together a 4.8, Sloppy stage 2 cam, NNBS Intake manifold, S475 (75/96) 1.32 T6, 4L80, Holley Terminator X Max SN95. I'm having trouble sizing a converter for a street car. I'd love to see what the stock converter would do! Gonna try and shoot for 3.27 gears on a 275/60/15.
Go watch sloppymechanics 8f8 build. It's literally this exact same combo, same car, but a bigger turbo and th400.
yes-go ask MatT at Sloppy for the converter
Another over cammed 4.8
So if you have a back pressure issue, can't you open the waste gate to relieve that pressure, while still maintaining boost?
Love these videos of yours man. Have a question if I may. Can you do a video of a turbo with an open housing vs divided vs divided and a QSV for turbo response?
QSV is usually only necessary on big turbo, race applications
@@richardholdener1727 well the s475 you have is it a divided housing you would be able to check on it is believe. Even if it's only a 1.00 AR no
Where you keep getting these shirts? This one specifically.
My wife makes many of them-so we buy
Richard Holdener I am willing to buy this one!! If she sell them let me know.