KTM's Demo Mode Is A SCAM! | 2023 KTM 890 Adventure R
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- Опубликовано: 30 июл 2024
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Yeah, I said it, this new Demo Mode from KTM is a giant scam, and it needs to stop!
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00:00 - Intro
00:22 - The Facts
05:48 - KTM Isn't Alone...
08:42 - One Bad Excuse For It
11:50 - What Can You Do? 
Авто/Мото
Before anyone gets mad, please watch the whole video... I stand by what I said in the title.
But… but… tHe tItLe oF tHe ViDeO…
It is a scam. Those electronic doodads are cheaper to enable than actually making a physically better bike.
"Rally mode" should just be where the bike lives in this case. Probably just turns off abs lol.
Totally agree, it begs to question if you really do own the bike once you pay for it.
Saying a word "Scam" in a title is a massive clickbait.
Since you know it what you are buying and you can purchase for extra money.
It is a pure greed from Spite using clickbait to get more clicks from adverts...
@@davidlesniak3790 any pay-wall on a vehicle you own IS a scam
The more manufacturers that do this, the more valuable my older bikes become.
KTM - Keeps Taking Money
@@timh6845 funny.
it can be worse, try a new Kawasaki, especially in EU.
I recommend spinning the tires in reverse after every ride to reset the odometer
Galaxy brain
Corgi, you made it!
Okay Ferris…lol
@@speedtriprr537 I've been here all along
@@fullmetalcorgi1350 🍻
I've tested the 890KTM, the AfricaTwin and the Ténéré.
Bought the Yamaha because of its simplicity. Now, after one year and 10k miles I am still happy. What a great motorcycle that is!
great choice!
I bought a tenere at the beginning of this year aswell!
Was looking into the KTM aswell. Same as you the simplicity of the tenere convinced me!
These companies have actually 'decided' that we are all a bunch of suckers. Are we?
Harley seems to have decided that two decades ago.
If you don't buy their products, who's the sucker for implementing these electronic policies?
Only if we buy from them. 🤷👍
This is insane. How have we moved to a paid subscription model for physically tangible goods that we own!?
If so, you don't own it.
Buy a T7 instead.
Those modes are dumb. Only new thing I'd want is cruise control.
You will own nothing, and you will be happy.
@@realbigtuna667 no need to be a vehicle for that kind of programming. We simply won't buy it. All we can do...
If you vote with your wallet and walk away, you HAVE to make it known to the dealer why you’re buying a different make!
Even better, show the receipts to their regional rep. In other words, show them proof that they lost money on their policy.
So you don’t pay for the options on other motorcycles? I mean it keeps cost down to just have the “factory” install the components and unlock as you pay for the Options just like Ducati BMW or Triumph.
Tbh there are sales statistics. For example If KTM in 2022 was the 6th sold in the world and at end of the 2023 they are 11th sold make in world, they can draw conclusions themselves aswell. If not they dumber than they seem right now.
@@superhonky7682 problem with KTM the options can be turned off. You can’t turn off a slip on exhaust.
@@mattus1gig well said
I used to work in Operations at my old career and I oversaw sourcing, pricing, and assembly of components for our equipment. Eventually, we ran the math and the cost of sourcing and assembling a "low" spec *and* a "high" spec for our equipment drove the COGS up on both, hurting margins and making both specs cost more to assemble than if we built the high-spec only. So, we did what any business would. We stopped sourcing the low-spec parts and built everything from the high-cost components, and the low-cost option went away. Was that the right decision for the consumer? Almost 90% of our sales were the high-spec, and this gave us wiggle room on the margin for the high-spec. For the other 10% that wanted the low-spec? It was worse, yeah. But for 90% it was often better. If the prices are right, and this allows a low-cost option for consumers who want it by reducing the overall COGS, I'm in favor of this. If the prices are not competitive for the base bike, walk away. Otherwise, this feels like complaining "things cost more than they used to".
Great job providing invaluable consumer advice. As a consumer that is currently looking at mid size adventure bikes and looking to purchase in the next 9 to 10 months, my purchasing dollars won't be handed to KTM. I will search long and hard and purchase a T7 Yamaha. Keep up the great work on our behalf Spite.
Cool and you'll be wishing you had an 890.
Seems like you would have done some of your own research given how dialed in with your dollars you seem to be. If you had, you would know he's wrong. So yeah..
It's rent seeking behavior. Vote with your wallet!
Exactly. Any company taking a stance against this gets my business, regardless of performance. It's 2022, everything that comes out is awesome.
It's as though they are working towards the...."You will own NOTHING"..... Being pushed the evil WEF
Other companies: Kawasaki doesn't offer warranty on their products!
If you really want it, then you must take them to court, which will cost more than it's worth.
Could this at all holdup in court? Unlocking heated grips/cruise control etc? Myself and everyone else will simply go to pirates. I cannot see unlocking equipment already equipped on your property as being illegal etc.
Right on!....if we don't drink the kool-aid then the manufacturers will need to retreat from this tactic.
All I can imagine is this snowballing into ludicrous proportions, like you have to have a subscription to start the bike so many times a month, or open the fuel cap, or extra charges for extended time on the brakes... Like that episode of Black Mirror where everyone has a "social score"... "sorry your score has dipped this month. you can only have 5 hours on your bike per week till you are back up to 750"
Several car manufacturers are already doing similar things in their cars, ie; charging subscriptions for access to hardware features when you already own the hardware that performs the task. China has already implemented a social score system and many of the most powerful and wealthy people in the world actively advocate for implementation of a similar system in the EU and US. That episode was prophetic, a point will come when it is considered nonfiction. Kind of a bummer.
agreed. btw, you already have a "social score", you just can't see what it is.
TFW when all the memes you've been shitposting on social media get you locked out of your electric car.
And going over 60mph only with premium subscription!
I'll bet you can do it with a laptop and a $10 cable...just like all of the car software that is sold the same way. You just have to do it again when they clear the software during the service ;)
It’s kind of weird to think that we are reaching the point where people will be jail breaking their motorcycles.
In sales they used to call this the ‘puppy-dog’ close; if you ask someone if they want to buy a dog they will probably say no, but if you give them a puppy to look after for a week they are unlikely to want to give it back.
I'm reminded of the time when I considered the Super Duke 1290... "Oh you must pay to unlock electronic features? Well, KTM can shove that right up their ass." Applies here, also.
Yeap! If we don't stop it now, they will all follow suit................ And then there's your "Social credit" rating, coming to a "Democracy" near you! Behave as they say or else your bike will be locked until your score crosses the "acceptable" threshold.........🤑
yes covered in glass, and sideways.
You are absolutely right. Charging to use a part or feature that is already on the bike/car from the factory is unethical at best, but more akin to outright extortion.
I think that's a great idea. I bought quickshifter and track mode on my Superduke Gt. Never used either and had I known what they were like I wouldn't have bought them. Cruise control and Rally mode on an adventure should be stock. They are basic these days.
KTM, software by EA studios
So true … don’t let KTM get that idea. Do you imagine getting your electronics unlock through loot boxes? Hahaha
Just buy this lootbox with a 10% to unlock heated grips!
@@Hipopelusas surprise mechanics 😂
@The Old Husky that’s part of the hospital dlc. $2000, but it includes the ambulance
I know right.
Thanks Spite, I appreciate you letting me know to not bother looking at the KTM offerings for my next bike. I love to simplify the search and eliminate shit products out the gate.
I love my old KTM but this is BS. I consider to get a japanese brand
I have the 890r and wow with the teck pack.....
What an amazing motorcycle don't pass it up regardless of this rant
@@timothybroga1704 fuck that. It's not passing up the product necessarily, but passing up a company for treating customers like garbage. The capital it took to install the features on the bike is considered sunk costs and it's built into the original pricetag. They make profit selling the bike to you when you buy the base bike. They they try to sucker you out of more money by activating things on your vehicle that they've already sold you. The person who wants the features has to pay more money than they should, and because the costs of the features have to be baked into the base price of the bike, the customer who doesn't care to buy the extra features would be paying for it regardless. None of the consumers win. If people care enough, KTM's sales will suffer horribly from this decision, so much so that they'll stop quickly and preferably fire the moron who pushed this idea.
@@peanutpirate4622 I AGREE.... It is a shitty business practice.
@@peanutpirate4622 the only thing that will make them stop is to not buy their scams. 🎉
Great take on the pay to play mentality. I totally agree that you shouldn't have to pay twice for features that are already on the bikes. Also, awesome to see that you have over 72k subscribers now! Keep it up man! Loving the channel!
So glad you made this video. This is exactly what frustrated me about KTM. This video represents 100% of the reason I didn't spend $19K on a new KTM bike. I couldn't bring myself to support their sales strategy. Another brand got my business.
i swear its like they DON'T want me to buy one of their bikes
I know right. I hesitated because of electrical problems of some of there bikes. Now I’m like f-that lol
Hey man, just looked today and saw Yam removed the vid of firing you and his "apology" post. That was the last straw for me and I unsubbed, now youre my regular moto news. Youre killing it man keep up the good work
Unsubscribed the other day from
Him…. Spite was by far the best part, and Here he is without YN! Golden!
Just look at spites subcount explode.and enjoy the show how hard this backfires for the sphinx cat.
Yeah he deleted it with the quickness. He knows he fucked up. Now he’s spamming his channel with stupid ass “ToP 5 CoOlEsT SuPeRmOtO’s”
@@Cj-xl3jv bro right? Like an absolute torrent of content, at first i thought he was just burying the video but idk what the hell he's thinking
I saw the firing video but not the apology post, what was the apology post about?
I actually would be more worried if you could do it from a app as that means through satellite they could control how the bike works.
Most consumer industries are on this trajectory. Look at our music, film, tv, gaming etc. As you mentioned, this disgusting tactic has been adopted by some car companies already. It is absolutely up to us as consumers to stand firm and not purchase items that are linked to recurring payments or even a single extra payment. Great video Spite! I always look forward to what you put out next.
If you can't use the features that are in your car/bike, you don't own it.
"You will own nothing and will be happy."
I paid for the whole tachometer, I'm using the whole tachometer! (Me hitting 9,500 rpm every day I drive my car), also I agree, I'm pretty sure my car has a limited at 123mph for no reason (which makes gears 5 and 6 pountless for tracks), and that's super annoying...
If I don't get the feature, I don't want the added weight and complexity of the feature being there.
Soft ware weighs nothing..
@@pgkr67 well, quickshifter and heated grips do have weight. Why drive them around if you cant use them?
ABS harnesses sometimes weigh up to 20 lbs. The fact that KTM is shipping every single bike decked out is just asinine.
Never mind that whether or not you pay to unlock these features, the tech itself that exists costs money.
Take heated grips for example. Not everyone wants those. A standard, non-heated grip costs less than a heated one, so if you equip all the bikes with non-heated grips, they cost less to make. You can still sell heated grips to those that want them. Otherwise, if you make them all have heated grips (locked behind a paywall), you just increased manufacturing cost of all of them with a feature only some people want (or are willing to pay for), which increases consumer costs by making them pay for something they don't want and then don't even get unless they pay again.
Never mind that electronics can fail, software updates fail all the time. When is the last time you bought software or bought any piece of tech and there wasn't 200 million bug fixes to be downloaded over the next 6 months?
And the other issue with complexity is the more complex the system is, the more failure points it has. Imagine the heated grips on there that you didn't want and don't function because you didn't pay for them end up getting a wire pinched and it shorts or starts drawing abnormally.
Or imagine wanting to customize it and make it your own. Don't like the look or feel of the grips? Too bad, you're stuck with them unless the manufacturer offers a different option that they can install (because imagine clipping the heated grip wires causing failures and fault codes). Hope you like the ones they offer, because it won't be long before there's proprietary connections where you can't just swap an aftermarket heated grip on.
Keep it up, Spite. Laid-back attitude combined with informative content. Good stuff. Hope you breach 100K soon. Like many said before, it's up to the customer to keep their wallet closed for these despicable tactics... Like you mentioned. KTM isn't the first and won't be the last brand to (try to) implement this.
This has always disappointed us. It’s the ‘resort fee’ a la KTM. It enables them to advertise one price, and charge for reality when you are standing there in the dealership and drooling.
Thats why i love my Himalayan, no tech, no mods, just enjoy the nature.
Another good one from Mr Spite.
Greetings from Portugal 🇵🇹 ✌️😉
sounds like after 1500 km this will have no tech either lol.
I am 67 with 50 years on motorcycles.
I have an Indian-market Yamaha FZ25.
Squeeze clutch, turn key, press starter, step on gear pedal, twist throttle, release clutch.................go !!!
.......just don't like the digital display !!
Trinidad & Tobago.
West Indies.
@@ramishrambarran3998 that's crazy that you just put it in gear and go you don't even have to let the clutch out or manipulate the throttle by twisting it back
@@californiapoontappa It is possible that you did not get my drift.
What I meant is that it is a conventional motorcycle, that has been around for years.
No electronic mode controls.....................just a simple motorcycle !
But for your sake, I have added it !
The English Language is difficult !!
@@ramishrambarran3998 no I understood I was just messing around... It was a joke. You did great writing in English I completely understood what you mean again I was messing around light heartedly
I had no idea KTM did this crap. I'll Look elsewhere when It comes time to buy my next Motorcycle. Thanks for sharing.
do your own research
That is an absolute fact ! Never.... Ever will I support a company that makes you subscribe for support.
@@papimiami1938 this is not a subscription , it is a 1 time thing , cheesy maybe but not at all comparable
do your own research
They do all the time. I own a 1290SDR and 300. Not happy about this crap at all!
💯 % agree Spite! Consumers can and must break this system, before it becomes the norm...it's unacceptable! It reminds me of the quote "you will own nothing and be happy" BS. If not, pirates will fill the gap for sure.
Thanks for the great scoop. Hopefully KTM is watching this video also. Needless to say I will not buy a bike that requires a subscription from any company. I’ll just stick with old school bikes as I’ve always done. PS great video, keep up the great content, and be safe and all that you do.
Once folks get good at jail breaking these systems, I suspect this will largely stop.
Having to take the bike to the dealer first - and then periodically - will combat that.
It will be consumer vs. producer warfare
At the moment but unfortunately when legislation change's that everything on vehicles can only be implemented by the manufacturer. And yes it will happen also on all products.
That's what I am thinking. Just need a Linux computer system hooked up to the ECU or whatever is on the bike to get into the script. Gotta be a startup file or some kind of config file where you can uncomment or add lines to turn off the 1000 mile switch that deactivates everything.
@@HandyL or unplug the speedometer cable so it never racks up the 1000 miles... Simple problems require simple solutions.
Au contraire.
These bikes will be VERY easy to jailbreak at first, so every halfwit can do it. So everyone does it, and the buyers accept this business model.
And then at some point, the next model or at a manufacturer's recall, the next firmware will be impossible to crack, everything encrypted, signed and certified, and potted in epoxy resin.
That's how this works. Get a foot in the door, and then tighten the ratchet.
Absolutely agree with you there Spite, such a sad thing that companies do to squeeze that much more money out of their consumers
It is what companies is about. Its called capitalism. I dont like either but its no surprise. Hs always been that way..
The big problem, similar to what Telsa has done, is that they can turn OFF features. Telsa does this OTA, as soon as this happens to other MFGRs (OTA updates), when you buy a used bike/car/whatever, they'll have to option to shut off features and make a 2nd buyer re-pay for something that was already paid for.
Nice video Spite. They are already pricing themselves out of the market anyway in my opinion.
The other comment I would add is that promotional videos I have seen the bikes are obviously being ridden by professional riders very fast on what I consider to be enduro tracks in most cases.
KTM seem to be trying to suck people into believing that everyone could throw an adventure bike around like a 350 enduro machine which is simply not the case
I got into motorcycles recently. Before that I thought KTMs is some sort of Chinese motorcycle brand. It's gonna be easy for me to keep ignoring it. :)
Their engines tend to die pretty fast anyways, I would never bother with a KTM
@The Old Husky wasn't Husqvarna Motorcycles bought by KTM too?
KTM have been around for 70+ years...and they're Austrian.
They've been a huge chunk of the off-road market for the last 30 years, and have won hundreds of titles in MX and enduro.
Didn't they have Chinese CFMoto engines on some of their bikes ?
If they had recognised Ewan McGregor literally 95% of people who ride 1250GSs today would be riding 1290 Advs.
"you wouldn't download a car"
Good to see you in full force Spite.
Good show keep going at doing what you do best. 💪🏽
The new updates are nice.
On the 2019 1290 to the 2022 new tft and modes were a nice upgrade. It will be the same on the 890 r.
The upgraded package is pretty nice . Most people can negotiate that in with the cost of the bike. Everyone I know who bought the new 1290 with the Tech pack all paid a different amount.
I'm glad you're informing consumers out there. I will not be buying the 890 Duke R then. I think I'm going to go with the MT09SP instead.
make it known to them that you didn't buy that bike for that reason.
@@abracing199 I hate it when just as you thought that you've found the perfect bike, the manufacturer does something completely idiotic.
You'll be happy with the fiesty Yamaha triple. A fine choice it is.
I understand for heated grips and cruise control to be additional but just to wheelie the 890 Duke r I have to pay like 200$ lmao freaking ridiculous, I can get a 2020 triumph speed triple for 2 grand more and it’ll have everything already added from the factory…
Rather have the MT09 SP anyway 🏆
KTM CASH GRAB coming to a dealership near you!!!
I’ll stick with all my old bikes and my old car, everything on them I own and it all works ( most of the time) 😂.
And they can't shut off your vehicle whenever they want
Old bikes rule 😁👍🏻
Nice one 👍 what I'm doing as well.
Hey Spite, what mic do you use? Sound quality is really good!
I subbed for yammie a year or 2 ago and I left yammie for spike today. He lost his best aspect to his videos and now I get more. We're here for YOU spite. You are what made his channel as big as it was and I can't wait to see you surpass 1 million subs by this time next year if not farther than 1m.
Thanks Spite, thought provoking video.
This business model - shipping with the hardware (which increases marginal unit cost of the product) and then trying to sell you the software (that doesn’t) is essentially marketing sleight-of-hand, and arguably dishonest. It must me made to fail in my view.
With the monthly subscription thing what happens when someone buys the vehicle second hand. Can they just never use the features?
It’s supposed to be cream for the dealers who usually get screwed by KTM.
I think a lot of defenders of this practice think it's the same old 'Optional Extras' thing, but Spite hit the nail on the head; we're actually being made to buy those extras twice. The other problem I foresee is how this will decimate the third party accessory market. Companies like Oxford, who are the go-to default for adding heated grips to a bike, or Power Commander, or even nuke the ability to add an aftermarket exhaust to a bike.
It's a really slippery slope that could decimate a huge part of motorcycling culture; ie making a bike your own by adding after market accessories.
TFW you have to remove the "unlockable extras" to install aftermarket parts🤡
They often say, if you are struggling to decide what you want, understand first what you Don't want.
Knowledge is king so thanks Spike for highlighting this.
One less brand to have to consider.
Spite's best point here and it shouldn't be overlooked, is if you don't want or can't justify the extra features and you're ok with them being locked away from you, YOU'VE STILL PAID THE PREMIUM for them. You've purchased an insanely expensive item at full price for features you don't want and still can't use.
I've been toying with the idea of building an 890 Duke R as a next (FUN) race bike but when I looked around the KTM site and saw this same deal on it, I immediately went to the Aprilia site. My RSV4 race bike came with every bit of tech I could want, and it was all enabled... my next race bike will be the same way.
And the extra $1000 already built into the price of the bike. Strange logic you use there pal!
the imperial logo at your helmet, Spite! Be the force be with you! so happy to see your channel growning! keep pushing. regards from brazil!
Went to buy a Super Duke. Full price, over priced shipping and setup. Then they wanted over $700 for Tech Pack+ $150 to "install" tech pack. Told them to take off the installation charge for software, they wouldn't budge. Now I own a Ducati
So now you own a Ducati that doesn't have cruise control or fuel gauge even as an option while costing more money? (Assuming it's a streetfighter) 😂
@@volodymyrshoniia2424 Nope, Less money, has a fuel gauge. You missed the point. If KTM wants to charge to “install” something that’s on the bike, they can keep it. They missed a sale that was close to $25k because they wanted every last cent, even made up ones. I guess I should be thankful, they saved me a bunch of money
@@bradhone9168 now I'm trying to figure out what it could be since it's not a hyper and not a streetfighter, not sure why anyone would cross shop anything else from Ducati with a superduke. Maybe a multistrada to go full dad mode, but that's more for super adventure or gt cross shopping.
@@volodymyrshoniia2424 Should be easy, less than super Duke, with fuel gauge. Went different direction than Dad mode😀
@@bradhone9168 I mean it's either pretend sport bike pig that is supersport or stupidly expensive beginner bike that is the monster. But like 890 duke R would destroy either in all aspects.
I will never buy a vehicle with a subscription service for it to function.
The next thing will be that you have to buy a software license to get all your bikes capability that somehow isn't transferable when you sell it or trade it in. They could do this through annual validation methods.
The Quick shifter on the Duke 890R was a $700 download and is dog shit :(
That is outrageously overpriced...
VW been doing this for a while, thankfully it was pretty easy to get into the software settings and turn all the features on (The programmable OBD tool was not cheap however), I am quite sure some bright spark will work out how to do this.
At the end of the day you need to decide whether the price with unlocked features is worth the premium versus next best alternative . So what if all the capabilty is already there? Your phone can download many useful apps you need to pay for. How is that any different?
Hey mate, this is a fair video. I just picked up a 2022 KTM 890 Adv R this year, so I can understand your statements. By the way, what kind of mirror's do you have on your bike? I'm in the market to get something similar for my 890. Cheers,
KTM was on my radar, but this automatically knocks them off any aspirational list. I hope KTM innovates themselves out of existence, if they want to roll with a business model like that.
If they were really on your radar then you would know he's wrong about the Demo mode. Seems like your Radar is jammed.
This all seems like a wonderful opportunity for someone to create a hack to keep the features...seems like a challenge really for someone to offer the jailbreak possibly 1/4-1/3 what KTM charges.
I would pay someone more money for the jailbreak than i would pay KTM just on principle😤
And I'm sure that would invalidate your warranty!!
Pretty cool to see you up and running already. I just wanted to say that: although I have no interest in these type of bike and barely in KTM, your video was about SOMETHING and that's pretty cool. I felt I had to write that because, on a similar date, Yammie release a video bashing the new BMW stating the exact same reasons he always had in the past. Its a dad bike, blablabla. I know its meant for fun but its getting a little long in the tooth. And yes I can laugh at my own bike: I have a NInja 400 and you guys laughed at this bike alot and it WAS FUNNY.
You have to see it from a manufacturers perspective, and thats something you got wrong about Zero as well:
Its cheaper for them to just stuff all the features into every bike, than it is for them to kit the bike out with the individual wishes of each customer. Alternatively they could raise the prizes of the bikes by 1-2k or whatever all the additional stuff costs and make it available from the start.
Actually it benefits the customer because you can buy a bike for a cheaper price upfront and then buy the stuff you actually want later on.
For example KTM, why would I wanna pay for a quickshifter or cruise control when I don't want to use it?
Imagine you could get a KTM Smcr for less than 12k and pay for the quickshifter later on
This is a trend that is becoming more and more common. I think first company that takes a hard stand against it will prevail and become the go to bike for most reasonable people. Maybe this is how Harley Davidson gets back on top.
Suzuki rarely changes lol.
BMW has been selling you electronic packages for years and look at it's marketshare. We are doomed.
Bro, one thing I've learned over my life is that people are fucking stupid. They're lazy and make good tools for people. They don't want to fight, they just want to move on with their life. This shit's inevitable because people will just bitch as they're buying it until it's totally normalized, then they'll just buy it.
But BMW people are not like rest of us. 😂
They have kind of flown under the radar with it. Now that it's becoming a trend more people will hopefully speak up and also vote with thier wallet. Wishful thinking perhaps.
@@ridenm7748 you say that, but I hear Suzuki have been experimenting with a revolutionary new concept for their twin configuration...
I know I personally have had up and down experiences with KTM. I bought a brand new 2020 790 Adventure S last spring. It was already discounted $1K from the original MSRP since the 890 had already been out. I spent about $900 to add the Quickshifter+, cruise control, and rally mode. To be fair, cruise control wasn’t built into my bike and new switch gear was installed as part of it. The Quickshifter+ and rally mode were just software upgrades though. My bike started leaking oil from the valve cover within the first 500 miles. I took it to the dealer for a warranty claim and it took 5 months for a valve cover gasket to come in. Since they had to take quite a bit of the bike apart to diagnose the issue, it had to sit there the whole time if I didn’t want to pay for labor to reassemble it. 5 months for a gasket directly from the manufacturer is absolutely unacceptable. I later had to order a new oil pan and gasket for the bike (because of my doing, not the bike’s fault). I got those parts within a week from a third party supplier. Overall, the bike is just amazing. I still feel mine has been a good value for what it offers and everything it can do, even with the supply chain issues and having to pay for features. I don’t think I’ll buy another KTM though, even though they make some of the best performing motorcycles you can buy.
@OTWO POV luckily I live in Hawaii, so year-round riding is wonderful. Also I rented 5 different motorcycles on Rider Share haha
I'm surprised they don't have a subscription to use the headlights and turn signals.
I was already hoping but now I’m REALLY banking on the new Transalp to have some serious off road capability
If you stump up for the "upgrades" will these be accessible by the next owner when you resell it? If you buy a used one that hasn't been "upgraded" in 5-10 of years time will it still be available from the dealer? Will you get a discount rate due to the age of the bike? Just because you can does it mean you should?
it does sound like its a one time payment then its permanent, but after Tesla making Ludacris mode single user, its a valid fear. As well as part of that slippery slope Spite is warning about
If so it won't be for long.
The buying a used one in 10 years is what worries me. If you buy buy a used one in years, that the PO didn't get the upgrades, will KTM even support it still and let you get the upgrades. And if they do, that's gonna suck to spend $600 to unlock stuff on a used bike.
its cheesy but it is an optional 1 time $200 bucks or less , cheesy yes but far from the big deal it is being blown up to here
@@justsomedude445 Well I sort of agree with you here - it's just 1 company doing it. But when the new Triumph comes out and does the same, then 6 months down the line the 'Big 4' japanese companies do it. 'Well I'll just buy that new BMW' - Oh wait - cruise control is a subscription item?... WTF! If KTM get away with it, others will follow. That's what Spite is pointing out. Buyer beware!
I love watching your subscriber count skyrocket!
Can't wait to see your take on the FTR, it's one of the bikes on my short-list for my next rig
Glad I went old school with my Guzzi! I miss driving similar roads in West Texas, even though I don't miss the heat. Great content Spite!
This also means you are forced to pay for the hardware even if you do not opt for the upend tech package...its not just the motorcycle industry but in general.. They want everything to run on a subscription so that they can keep milking the customers till they sell the vehicle or die
Happy with my 2021 SV650. Just the joy of riding a bike 👌😊😊😊
I put 25,000 hard miles on my old 05' SV650s and loved every second of it. Sold it when I was buying my house and needed money but it was a great bike. I have been considering getting a new one.
Simple, reliable and just enough power to be enjoyable 👍
That's why I'm old school with regard to motorcycles...
with all this gizmos and tech, it was just a matter of time for this companies to adopt a subscription business model. At the end, it all comes down to take more money out of the customer's pockets.
My biggest concern is what happens when you sell the motorcycle, do the new owners keep the unlocked features? Or do they then have to pay for them again separately? If so, that'll kill the used value of the bike when you're ready to move to something new.
If it's like the BMW cars, the features do not carry over. They are locked again, and must be purchased again by the new owner.
I suppose you need to weight up the cost of upgrades such as the difference between paying to turn on a function compared to buying a base model and adding these as either post purchase manufacturer installed or aftermarket installed functions. I can see where KTM is coming from in the sense that the cost to produce one model with all the functions verses manufacturing two different bikes of the same model is probably more cost effective, knowing that customers would likely pay for an upgrade down track. However, subscription based upgrades would be a huge turnoff for me. Another issue with all the programable electronics would be if governments decided that available vehicles (new and already on road) had to comply with new emission regulations and the manufacturer electronically adjusts that vehicle to meet that requirement, changing the engine performance in the process. Now that would really suck.
I love my Ktm but I was absolutely pissed I had to spend additional 1k to unlock my 20k bike
you will pay even more.
you spent $1000 USD for the rally or explorer mode ?? wow !!! only costs $200 you got hosed
@@justsomedude445 no it was for the tech pack on a superduke evo because of the suspension plus labor charge and taxes
This is pretty crazy lol. Like in video games you buy but half the content is behind more paid subscriptions and such. Heading towards crazy times. I’m getting my first bike in January by the way ! Maybe you’ll see me riding around the Austin area 🤙
I just bought a Yamaha instead of a KTM for this reason. Locking electronics behind extra payments is greedy bs. Someone needs to release a free hack to unlock the features.
I’d just pay Nik to hack the bike and get me all the features tbh
Spite, you have to make an episode about the just launched Honda hornet. It looks to be much better than the fz07. Look at the tft at that pricepoint.
I think it is less expensive for a manufacturer to make one bike on the assembly line, and then if people want the features they can buy them. They take. a small hit on the hardware, but it is still more straightforward on the manufacturing side. It's not a subscription or a rip off, it is just like if you go to buy heated grips - in this case, the software is enabled, in the usual case they have to disassemble stuff, run wires.. etc and charge you a whole lot for that privilege.. I don't see the big problem, they're not charging you for it, unless you want it.
Love the quality of content! The 2 wheel community needs you!
My XSR900 MY 2022 came with QS up+down, cruise control, 6-axis imu etc. for 10.899€. Fuck this paying double bs lol
That's crazy. I promise I won't be considering a new (or old) KTM any time soon, and I seriously hope nobody else does either because this is an extremely dangerous precedent. Real shame.
do your own research on this
@@justsomedude445 As far as I’m concerned, this is me doing my research. KTM wants to play stupid games…well you know the rest.
So they give you a free trial of the tech package? That seems pretty awesome if you ask me
Totally agree KTM are off the charts they are probably even thinking about monthly subscriptions to keep bleeding the consumer.
My 990 Adv also got a rally mode, it’s called ABS off.
My 950 doesn't have ABS!
@@richardsimpson3792 so it’s always in rally mode ✊🏻💪🏻
@@DB-me3jt Ain't that the truth?
Sadly the rider isn't always.
Just when I was considering KTM lmao. Thanks Spite. Love the breakdowns. Keep em coming!
So it's $600 for all the features . Then they are switched on for the life of the bike? Or is that per year?
just paid for the quick shifter unlock on my 390, nice upgrade but weird to pay for what's already on the bike
These features are included in every bike regardless if you've unlocked them or not. Meaning their cost has already been factored into their MSRP when you buy the bike, so you really are paying for these features TWICE. Wow..
Indeed - very good point.
Love the videos you're putting out Spite - full of insight and knowledge, delivered your way. Hope the channel keeps growing, much love all the way from Australia!!
I do think its a bad thing and I am from the land of KTM. Put them on the backseat in my endeavor of finding a good new adventure bike for me. Same with BMW. Lets just hope it wont spread more or else I dont have many bike choices anymore ^^
I live in North Austin and need to know where you're riding at in this vid! haha. It looks like such a fun ride!
Great video Spite, loving all these new videos. From the beginning of your video it was giving me BMW subscription vibes, and I agree with you: if it's physically on the vehicle you should pay for it once and be able to use it for life. The options list has always been a way to make money, but this is a massive step too far.
I personally was not in the market for a KTM but now I know I'm staying far away. Love the content Spite.
because of a 1 time optional fee of $200 bucks ?? go buy a t7 with half the hp instead over that ?? big deal out of a non issue
@@justsomedude445 Money's not the issue. It's the fact that they are trying to nickel and dime us in an egregious way. Don't put features on a bike or car or anything and lock them behind a paywall. Just sell me the complete package or not at all. You and people like you are the reason why companies are pulling this shit. Can't wait to buy a new fridge but have to pay 500 bucks to keep anything below freezing.
Edit: Typos my enemy >:(
@@Cosmonaut_Neko do your own research please , that is not at all comparable , yes it is cheesy but it is optional and a 1 time $200 bucks is all not the big deal its being blown up to
@@Cosmonaut_Neko i am the problem now ?? LoL did you even bother reading what i wrote ??
Thanks for clarifying.
A friend of mine had a KTM 790. He bought it used from the dealer, with very little milage on it. The bike had slipper clutch feature, which the dealer claimed other 790 did not have.
He rode it for a bit til he decided to sell it.
At that time he took it to the dealer order to ensure the bike was fully serviced before selling it.
It turned out that, when he picked it up, the slipper clutch no longer functioned.
He went right back to the dealer and complained about this, and they took the bike back into the shop to find out what happened.
Dealer kept saying that according to the computer, everything was OK.
Yet... slipper clutch was no longer available.
My friend insisted that he wanted the bike back in the same condition he had bropught it in.
This went on for over a week or so. Miraculously, the slipper clutch feature came back, and my friend sold the bike. Yet, the dealer never explained what had happened.
Thanks to this video, now we know what happened.
I am certainly staying away from KTM.
This practice of selling you an expensive motorcycle with features that you will only be able to use if you páy more, is simply outrageous.
What happens when your payment method expires, your subscription payment doesn't work and your subscription is unknowingly cancelled. Then you go for a ride not knowing that certain safety features have been disabled which causes you to crash and hurt yourself?
I hate that business model. I'm definitely keeping an eye on this for my next bike.
My opinion is that some of these brands can't compete on the prices other brands are offering. So their bike is being compared to something vastly superior at the same price tag. I think a lower base price allows more riders in and also let's the company deflate the msrp so it looks better. I guess I'm okay with it because that's been the dlc of video games for as long as I can remember. And the guy who never goes off road and doesn't need heated grips saves a little money.