Honestly, Trank's idea of a body horror Cronenberg-style superhero film would be really interesting, but Slater was the right guy to draft a Fantastic Four screenplay
I agreed sounds interesting but I think if he wanted to make a movie like that. He should have make it but with a original story instead of using the Fantastic Four IP. Regardless of
he didnt want a body-horror. he wanted cronicles but with fantastic four. *sighs*. also the idea that jeremy slater and directors wasnt on page is wrong. tallk about trying to throw shades on someone you already thrown shade at. he didnt wanted a "black-all-crew" , he had the same casts as young teens. same cast after they got powers, probably ?? ALSO.. FOR the love of. Hasn't trank suffered enough ? He made one-of-the-best superhero / realistic movies. He was pulled of Fantastic Four cause they wanted to do re-shoot for no reason at all. this was almost 2015. almost 10 years ago. talk about his new movies instead.
@@UnifiedaxxS Except that's not what the fantastic 4 are, which makes Trank the problem for trying to fit a square block through a round hole. If a director can't look at the source material and get any inspiration at all, then they're the wrong director for that project. It doesn't matter if it's "capeshit" or not, if the director is going out of their way to ignore the source material it won't be a good adaptation. Besides it's not as if Trank's vision was particularly inspired, he just wanted to make chronicle again but with established characters.
yeah I went into this video thinking, "I want the Track cut" but the longer I watched I was like "this version sounds terrible...I want the Slater cut!"
@@palmickey420 Ikr I think that this is the one time I am totally fine with the studio not releasing the directors cut for the film & them attempting to fix it themselves for a CBM. Unlike Richard Donners Superman 2, Ayer's Suicide Squad or Snyder's Justice League which would have been good or great but because the studio thought they knew better they just ruined them & pissed off the fans & teams who worked on it.
How is it interesting? They gave full control for a comic book movie to someone who hates comics? Also makes sense that he hated the avengers. He's synder 2.0
@@derekseven1647you cannot convert jack kirby's amazing concepts and art into live action, the fantastic four work so much better in animation (either it be 2d or 3d or both)
@@DeepEye1994 there was a cut scene in across the spider-verse where miles and gwen teleport to a kirby art like room and it looked amazing, can't forget how the first spider-verse film used the kirby crackle (the ball particles you see in the portal, that's how kirby drew energy) i think a fantastic 4 movie with the spider-verse art style would be incredible.
I feel like one thing people forget is while yes the Dark Knight Trilogy has darker themes, those movies have a good amount of humor and personality- I feel like a lot of directors just say the darker themes and did not see the humor and personality in those films
@@OptimusMonk01what makes you think he was specifically replying to you? And if you spoke English fluently you would understand his comment has a lot to do with the discussion being had.
I can understand keeping a real world feel to it, but that doesn’t mean it has to be gloomy or dark. You can still make a bright movie and make it relatable
We get that but let’s be honest marvel haves a full catalog full of bright movies some successful a lot was not so they can do the dark and gloomy just needs the right writer and director to flush the characters out
the F4 is supposed to be a tight family giving you that friendly vibe. i don’t get the whole dark n gloomy vibe. save that for characters like doom . they’re literally the ninja turtles , doesn’t need to be as goofy but we love teams like this because of that true family atmosphere.
"While the Snyder Cut movement was an incredible thing, it's also something that doesn't need to happen for every movie that suffers from studio interference, as sometimes movie studios have no choice but to step in" - Wiser words have never been spoken.
@@Bowiiihowdy Whedon's version was just Producer pleasing botched Surgery. It's unfair to only blame him. I will blame WB for it more cuz Snyder's Previous movie was not that good either nor his later Rebel Moon.
Everything about this film's conception was doomed from the get-go. Making it dark and gritty, taking inspiration from Cronenberg, only kickstarting it just to maintain film rights. Nothing about it said anyone's hearts were in the right place. In regards to Jeremy Slater's original treatment, it might not have been that good, but at least it sounded more interesting and entertaining than what we got.
I have to quote redlettermedia and say you cant make a good fantastic 4 movie. Trank at least has an idea that was different and Slater just wanted to do ANOTHER attempt at a superhero film with the F4 when they aren't superheroes theyre a bunch of wacky scientists who try and make their lives as normal as possible but are always called to action.
Trank's movie would have been interesting. Not good, better than what we got. There was nothng wrong with the body horror, its already in the original concept. The things main personality is horror with his own body
Awesome video! This really opened my eyes to Josh Trank. I was aware about how the fox studio had heavy involvement in the film, but I had no idea about his behavior on the project. Guess this explains why he hasn’t done any big movies in while.
@@Zegeebwah he wrote and directed a $20 million movie a couple years ago. it didn't do amazing theatrically cause it ended up going digital due to covid (literally came out may 2020 lol). it seems like he's still able to get jobs
I'm honestly amazed Hollywood could never understand that Batman was appropriate for a dark and gritty film but other superhero franchises were not. You can have variety and do some dark and some light depending on the source material.
That's where DC has struggled. Especially Zack Snyder. I liked his films, I enjoyed Man of Steel and BvS, but making everyone fit the dark tone didn't work. That's where Marvel did better (usually). The adapted the story around the characters.
You say this, but when those execs were growing up, Batman was the byword for comedy. Imagine if someone tells you that Looney Tunes are appropriate for a dark and gritty adaptation (but not other cartoons).
Hollywood doesn't do Subtlety, comic books are comic books , whether horror or action heroes , romance , slice of life , philosophical. If some one drew them then they are a cartoon and that either means a cartoony comedy super movie or a dark and gritty reimagining. 😐
Trank sounds like a nightmare. Why do the studios hire people who have contempt for the source material? It seems to happen often and usually results in a poor adaptation.
Studios like to take promising directors that have made one or two features, and then bring them onto huge franchises. They do this because it gives them hope that something fresh and good will be made, but they'll be new enough to be controlled by the studio.
@@CollegeDroputPowerpointsYou say that like it was Tranks plan all along to screw over a studio that gave him his first big break, Chronicle. Personally, it looks to me like Trank had a very specific, alternative take on the superhero genre. Him and Max Landis crafted an incredibly unique "superhero" style film with Chronicle that avoided most cliches (like the whole great power comes with great responsibility yada yada type hero cliches) and instead went with the idea of "what would 3 teens ACTUALLY do if they gained super powers?" I'm not trying to say Trank would've made a groundbreaking new film if he had been allowed to write and film what he wanted with Fantastic Four, but I agree with most other commenters saying his version would've at least been interesting and not a Simon Kinberg, Dark Phoenix snooze fest.
I know people don't like the portal thing from this film, but it's not completely out of nowhere. It's more based on the Ultimate universe's Fantastic Four, where they got their powers via dimensional travel instead of space travel.
@@Bulletsandblockbustersaloso colecthio. The x men fntastic four move was planed in 2010 but the did frent x men fntastic foyr crossover planned to be wrteen by warren ellus
@@thrashpuppy2010agreed. It feels more modern. When the FF were originally created in 1961, dreams of exploring the stars and going the moon was the idea. But now we’ve already been to space a lot…so inter dimensional travel would be the next big thing. I like it.
I actually prefer parts of that origin. Space is fun and cool, but that doesn't seem to be a priority for humanity. We haven't made any concrete steps to go back to the Moon or even land on Mars. So the N-Zone is an interesting concept that opens up so many other doors for the story. I think Annihilus should have been the villain if you take the N-Zone route for a story.
man, what a nightmare. I can just imagine having to deal with all those problems, both as trank, and the other people trying to cope with all that craziness.
When whe movie began by presenting the mindset of a young Reed Richards, I thought I was in for a great movie. And that impression was enforced with the prototype scene in the basement. Then everything went south pretty quickly. The team didn't felt like a family, the movie was esthetically so dark, a lot of the story took place inside the same facility or whatever, there was a whole 5 year time jump in between that wasn't as impactful as it should have and Victor turned into a villain simply because he has to. This movie is like a nice mug that they broke and repaired using glue, with some pieces either missing or replaced, and no idea of what made it great initially.
I remember seeing the trailers for this and thinking it looked awful. Seems like the studio and director share the blame on this one. Being caught off guard by the tone of the film is entirely on the studio for not monitoring more closely though
He did what they hired him to do, they were being silly. They should have interfered more during filming, but also supported Trank. He clearly went a bit mad.
@@ThePie_only it’s not a mean thing. I just don’t exactly think that what he said is true. I mean, with all the misinformations spreading around the internet about everything, can you really blame me??
I think it was Honest Trailers that at one point said that a movie about the making of this movie would be more interesting than this version of Fantastic Four turned out to be.
@@Bulletsandblockbustersyeh msyb Josh trank shou j been balowed yo mskmr th move he wanted to make lith guy wanted to mor if a sci fi horror movie and msyb fix cou hsv just let him do it imgin if the got mdkevth mo he wanted it cou hsv been on mor intresting suphero moves out there imagine unvrksble meets th fly
I wish more directors and studios would take inspiration from Raimi's Spiderman trilogy. It was able to be serious and campy. Had dark moments, but also light ones. Not everything needs to be dark and gritty all the time.
@Alf-gm7tf I think Raimi would be an awesome director for a Batman movie. Especially with his ability to balance serious and campy, but also sprinkle in some horror elements. I think it could work really well, especially using elements from Batman: the animated series like he used elements from Spiderman: the animated series for his Spiderman trilogy.
I think nobody can direct like Raimi other than Raimi himself. Even with the evil dead TV show, you notice the difference between the episodes he directed and the ones he only wrote... he's a God among humans
I think nobody can direct like Raimi other than Raimi himself. Even with the evil dead TV show, you notice the difference between the episodes he directed and the ones he only wrote... he's a God among humans
@@lucacriscuolo2989 I agree, and I think it's why Dr. Strange 2 was such a mess. It was his vision conflicting with the MCU vision. It almost felt like it held him back.
Absolutely love this series! Another awesome video dude! However it does suck to hear that this is one film that sounds like it would not have had any sort of good cut with who was at the helm of the project.
At most it would be a cult classic. Chronicle had some bad reviews for how dark it became and I think thats because the mass audience dont like things that are "negative."
Thank you for making this, I've been recently telling everyone how compelling the pre-production and concept art for Fant4stic was. I really like the idea of a superhero body horror so it's a shame Fox fumbled that.
@@drumnbassdan Rise of the Silver Surfer is one of the most terrible superhero movies ever made. It killed the franchise. The most boring parts of Incredibles 1 and 2 are better than all Fantastic Four movies combined.
That does not count but yeah also I'm just gonna you know despite the recent years with the MCU but I would like to see the interpretation of Fantastic Four in that universe
No way, they did it really dirty on Jeremy Slater 💀, with his script and his concepts and ideas it could have been the best Fantastic Four movie. Too bad it wasn't, but the good thing is that Jeremy Slater was able to continue with Marvel with Moon Knight and is now working on James Gunn's new DCU, equally a shame he's not the writer of the new Fantastic Four MCU movie.
I remember watching this in theatres and sharply noticing how much I actually like the Trank First half, and then boom, when the studio recuts happen for the second half of the movie, I and all my friends stopped liking it. We didn't know it at the time and we just thought "Why was the second half of the movie so much worse than the first half???" and then I eventually learned about the reshoots and recuts and such. I wish they would have just let Trank cook. I was REALLY digging the horror inspired elements and I think experimentation is good. You wanna bright kid friendly F4? We got two of those in the 2000's. Go watch those. Ya know?
No, the first half was garbage, too. It was as boring, tedious and poorly-acted with a whole bunch of nothing happening as the second half. All it confirmed was the movie might’ve been mostly garbage instead of complete garbage had they let him cook.
@@edwardhewitt9229 what character or plot development? The first half was as boring to sit through with a whole bunch of NOTHING happening as the second half was. 🤦♂
Oh, right. Of course I want a bright FF movie. Wait, nevermind. I *totally* want Marvel's First Family to be dark, gritty, and realistic. God forbid, there isn't a FF inspired film with darker themes/tone but still able keep it light. Oh...
Honestly, i would have loved to see tranks version, it seems like a great and refreshing take, but i also would have loved to see slaters. Both could have done really well and been great movies if they could have been done in their own
I heard there was different ideas for X-Men Dark Phoenix before that film was made. Presumably there was an alternate ending of the film that was made where the X-Men fought the Dark Phoenix outside the United Nations building. Maybe you could do a video on that in the future.
I like Chronicle a lot and I really like the idea of the Scanners/Fly mix, but there was no way this film was going to end well. The studio wanted one thing and Trank another. I imagine if there actually is a Director cut out there, it's maybe fine. If he'd been able to execute his vision it might have been good, but just so different from what they wanted
After seeing this vid i think Trank should've just done his own thing. He wouldn't have been restricted by source material and such. He would have had no problem pitching and greenlighting an original film based on the ideas ideas that were mentioned i.e. A Scanner and The Fly mix with inspiration from The Fantastic Four, after his success with chronicle.
I do like this movie, or at least what it set out to do. The minimalist beginning leading into 90s Sci-fi wonder into pure body horror is legitimately great and reminded me a lot of Ang Lee's Hulk, which I also really liked. It's when it has to be a superhero movie is when it goes wrong and it goes wrong hard and fast
It may still have worked. Fox didnt know what they had asked for, so were surprised when Trank delivered what they asked for, rather than a slightly more serious take on the fantastic four
Nah. The only thing I wanted out of this movie when it came out was a good action figure of the thing...with pants. This movie was so trash that we didn't get any good action figures if any at all
That first script would have been amazing. Adding Annihulus would have been such an awesome movie. Especially with his control rod being the thing to create victors armor. Such a shame man.
Thanks for this, it really wraps everything up. I was very hopeful for this film when it was announced. I loved the idea of the negative zone (planet zero) instead of cosmic rays in space. Novel in the early 60's, but another dimension is the new frontier. I loved the slightly more serious, gritty tone, something I liked in general about Fox's superhero films versus the more comedy-driven MCU films. But there's no denying the movie falls apart after little more than half an hour. With 20/20 hindsight, it would have been better if Trank had trusted the writer he hired and gone with the story he developed, and done his rewrites off of it, as opposed to being in such opposition to every element of the story. I mean, Annihilus, Doom, Galactus and Mole Man in one film!!! Fox double-downed on the problems by slashing the budget and thinking they could somehow cobble together a film post principal photography. Fox's superhero films are characterized by good characters and strong action - you can't beat the opening to X2, or Quicksilver in DOFP. But this film had a dizzying lack of action, coherence, and ultimately shows what you get when no one in the production trusts anyone else in the production.
I agree. If Trank just tried to add some extra spice to a story about Annilhilus and Doom with one of the others as an end credits scene it would have been a decent movie at the very least. At least if we're going with the summary we heard in the video.
It’s not just this film, there are other good Fantastic 4 scripts like the mid-to-late 90s Michael France version and the early 2000s Doug Petrie one, but for some reason the movies don’t work. They could make good What Could Have Been videos, as they’re both online to read
It’s absolutely wild to me that people are saying MCU is in a bad state when we had movies like this in the superhero genre just popping up right and left. Sure, we have She Hulks and Secret Invasions but then we got BANGERS like Loki, Wandavision, Shang Chi, and Moon Knight.
Trank had no right not to take his anger on Kate because he was forced to cast her she didn't do anything wrong she even went to do research on her character Sue Storm but was told not to do that.
Trank just wanted to be different for the sake of being different because he had no attachment to the source material. He wanted a Fantastic Four in name only, a complete deconstruction; and then just acted out somewhat unnecessarily when the things he wanted just flat out weren't working for everyone, between the higher up's concerns and even the way he clashed with his own cast in ways that sound so childish and unprofessional, he just wasn't acknowledging this and ultimately seems like he just shut down and then when all was said and done he blamed everybody else a lot but himself a little too little. He should've just left the project or got fired. He just simply wasn't right for it at all.
I would have love to see Trank's vision on full display. I think the idea of making a more grounded story with a little inspiration from Chronicle is why he was hired in the first place. If there was issues on set with actors then that's a different story.
I remember being so hyped for this... As Trank had made one of my favorite movies of all time: Chronicle. Not to mention Michael B. Jordan and Miles Teller being totally awesome actors. The first trailer looked so good. Whatever happened to Miles Teller? Feels like he disappeared after J.K. Simmons shouted at him in Whiplash.
In the comics, it took the Fantastic Four a little time to become a full-blown super hero adventure comic. Back then Marvel was pumping out monster stories and others like the Twilight Zone, and when the FF started, they retained a lot of the flavor of the other stories. In their first issue they fought a monster. They didn't get their costumes until the third issue I think.
A Cronenberg-esque Body-Horror-Version of this Movie actually sounds interesting and there *are* some bits of that left in the movie, like Reed coming across half reformed and panicking Ben trapped in his cell or the shot of Reed being experimented on and his limbs streched in all directions. I'd be honestly curious to watch this version of Fant4stic. Alas, if will probably never happen. Shame, since the general Idea is interesting in concept and I actually like the Cast.
I feel like Fox should have given support early on, to mould it an push for some fun, instead of giving him free reign then destroying what they specifically hired him to do.
Could you do a video about the original script for Prometheus? It was called Alien: Engineers and was was written by Jon Spaihts. It eventually became Prometheus after rewrites by Damon Lindelof, most known as the writer of Lost, Watchmen HBO, the JJ Abrams Star Trek movies, and World War Z among other things
While maybe not the best idea for a Fantastic Four movie, I liked the idea of a “body horror” F superhero film and would of liked to have seen Trank’s original version
I will never forget how bewildered I was when I found out that Thing's iconic catchphrase was borrowed from his abusive bully brother in this iteration.
It sounds as though Trank wasn’t the right fit from the jump. I like the idea of the superhero-transformation -as-body-horror film he wanted to do and it could have been a great piece. However, the studio clearly had something altogether different. This is a story of the city mouse and the country mouse trying to live happily in the suburbs: it doesn’t work for either one
Kind of funny that the best parts of the film are the ones that were rewritten and reshot without Trank. I just hope the new one is great because F4 and X-men are my favorite thing and the only real Marvel comics I read. We deserve it.
If Josh Trank taught us anything, is that you can't go from a low-budget movie to a big-budget movie You need to go from low to medium, and then from medium to big Is all about gaining credibility. You never know when a studio is gonna think they can control you. You need to show them that you know what you're doing better than them.
Yeah. Giving Trank the keys to an F1 car after driving his first beater car probably wasn't the best idea (not to say Chronicle was a beater car, but for a movie that didn't cost much, it was a bit of a miracle it was as good as it was and made as much as it did). I wish Trank had told the studio very clearly his vision BEFOREHAND so that they could've been like "oh, I see" and just let him down slowly that he wasn't getting the job. I think Fox was on a deadline though and wanted to retain the rights to the Fant4stic franchise. They probably trusted him enough to move forward and, well, we got what we got. I definitely don't blame Trank, at least not entirely.
@LeonardoKlotz no? MCU specifically hires up-and-coming filmmakers. Technically, you can say every director in the mcu is a director for hire. They have these planned out years in advance.
@@Siapsidhen the only reason why they do this is so they can control them. The smaller the director, the more they wanted to control them In the beginning, they hired stablished directors to helm their first movies, and that was before Disney took over After that, the bigger they got, the bigger was their control over the movies They not only were getting up-and-coming directors, but also TV directors They didn't wanted their filmmakers to think outside the box when they shouldn't. That's why they got rid of Edgar Wright and put a director for hire like Peyton Reed. There's a reason why they usually don't pick stablished filmmakers like Darren Aronofsky, Matt Reeves, Jordan Peele, Greta Gerwig It doesn't matter how talented they are, if Disney can't control them, they won't even go to the "maybe pile" That's what Hollywood has been doing recently, especially with franchise movies
I still find it hard to believe someone who directed Chronicle, objectively a really well made and creative film, could fail so miserably on another comic book movie. I think I read somewhere Trank had some help directing Chronicle, but I can't find the article anywhere and have no idea if it's true.
Slater’s screenplay was phenomenal. How do you walk away from a 2015 F4 movie, with access to good vfx that include Annihilus, Mole Man, Herbie, the fantasticar, the cosmic control rod and more?
Sounds like the studio was actually the “good guys” this time around. Whereas Trank did not care about the source material, his writer or the cast. It had to be his way through and through at every turn. Even though his way was the wrong way
From what I remember, the film would've been too dark for a decent 3D post conversion, as 3D hates the dark and Trank was obviously going for a dimly lit horror motif.
Oh yay! You finally released it. Ask and I shall receive. Unless you were already making this video when I was asking for it. Hahaha! Great video, looking forward to the next one! 👍🏻
I did enjoy a lot of ideas from this fantastic four but goddamn was it all over the place. I honestly would’ve like to see Transks full vision just to see how unique it would’ve been. I doubt I would’ve enjoyed that version of the film but I would’ve loved to see what a complete unhinged creative freedom looks like
josh trank and david ayer both want director cuts. most people support ayers cut but so few people support tranks. my theory is people can sense that ayer is passionate about wanting to do right by the characters, or fans, where as trank seems more upset his movie got bad reviews.
So Josh Trank is the problem. Imagine hiring a guy that has no interest in comics let alone fantastic 4 itself and creates a toxic environment, no wonder it bombed. His version is even worse
I have to say, Trank's FANTASTIC FOUR felt to me like it would've been a decent sci-fi/horror movie if only it didn't have the Fantastic Four brand on it. As a sci-fi/horror movie of some other name (and with characters having a different powerset), it would've done fine.
Having been a fan of the Fan4 for my whole life, its sad to see what has happened with the live action portrayals, even though I somewhat like them all in their own way. The ‘94 unreleased movie was a perfect adaptation of the origins if you overlook the shotty special effects and animation. The 2000’s was campy and lighthearted, with fun chemistry and good vibes, but terrible galactus portrayal. But Fan4stic just feels unfinished and doesnt bring the love of the team like the comics do. I’m happy you made this video because now I can at least appreciate what Trank tried to do with Slater on the project, but its a shame his vision wasnt produced the way he wanted.
They had the right writer, just not the director. Josh Trank wasn't a Marvel guy or even a DC guy, he just wanted to make his movie without the clamor from the studio and its producers, it's the only reason why Chronicle works perfectly as a one-off story, no sequel or franchise needed it was his story the way he wanted to tell and share, it was just a story about three kids discovering superpowers but set in the realistic world. With Fantastic 4, it just didn't garner off his interest in the way Chris Nolan wanted to make Batman set in a realistic world, he just didn't have the heart to make it or make it in a way to satisfy the studio. Overall, I feel that Josh was in a no-win situation to make his movie or a movie that everyone would love.
Another great video! This whole thing is such a shame because maybe instead we could have got another original Josh Trank film and a more accurate Fantastic Four. One good thing that came out of was Jamie Bell meeting Kate Mara, and now they're married and have kids!
The original origin of Dr Doom in the comics is probably the greatest villain origin story of all time (I read it in Bring On The Bad Guys at least 100 times as a kid)… why do people insist on f@cking with it? It’s perfect.
Because nowadays no villain is allowed to be villainous, they always have to be misunderstood or treated badly to justify why they're evil; all the companies now want to have sympathetic villains that act and look cool. That's why I'm glad that Jack Horner from the last Puss n Boots movie was just straight up evil because he wanted to and had none of the nowadays common villain traits.
Went to go see this with my mom when it came out. A guy in the row in front of us, a few seats across, literally fell asleep and snored loudly through the latter half of the film.
The most interesting thing about this film will always be the production nightmare. I think Trank wasn’t a good pick imo. No clue how the F4 is so hard to adapt but man the MCU can only do better.
Everything about this film's conception was doomed from the get-go. Making it dark and gritty, taking inspiration from Cronenberg, only kickstarting it just to maintain film rights. Nothing about it said anyone's hearts were in the right place. In regards to Jeremy Slater's original treatment, it might not have been that good, but at least it sounded more interesting and entertaining than what we got. Awesome video! This really opened my eyes to Josh Trank. I was aware of how the Fox studio had heavy involvement in the film, but I had no idea about his behavior on the project. Guess this explains why he hasn’t done any big movies in a while. I feel like one thing people forget is while yes the Dark Knight Trilogy has darker themes, those movies have a good amount of humor and personality- I feel like a lot of directors just say the darker themes and did not see the humor and personality in those films Absolutely love this series! Another awesome video dude! However, it does suck to hear that this is one film that sounds like it would not have had any sort of good cut with who was at the helm of the project. As a big Fantastic Four fan, I remember being so hyped watching this not caring how actually bad the film was. I just wanted a sequel so bad 😂 I like Chronicle a lot and I really like the idea of the Scanners/Fly mix, but there was no way this film was going to end well. The studio wanted one thing and Trank another. I imagine if there actually is a Director cut out there, it's maybe fine. If he'd been able to execute his vision it might have been good, but just so different from what they wanted Nice. Another great video. Your videos are one of the highlights of my week man. Thanks as always! Man, what a nightmare. I can just imagine having to deal with all those problems, both as a trank and the other people trying to cope with all that craziness. Great video :) Just a small correction ... Chronicle was not made based on Trank's own script. Max Landis was a screenwriter on that one. I do like this movie, or at least what it set out to do. The minimalist beginning leading into 90s Sci-fi wonder into pure body horror is legitimately great and reminded me a lot of Ang Lee's Hulk, which I also really liked. It's when it has to be a superhero movie when it goes wrong and it goes wrong hard and fast While maybe not the best idea for a Fantastic Four movie, I liked the idea of a “body horror” F superhero film and would have liked to have seen Trank’s original version I did enjoy a lot of ideas from this fantastic four but goddamn was it all over the place. I honestly would’ve liked to see Mark's full vision just to see how unique it would’ve been. I doubt I would’ve enjoyed that version of the film but I would’ve loved to see what complete unhinged creative freedom looks like I'm honestly amazed Hollywood could never understand that Batman was appropriate for a dark and gritty film but other superhero franchises were not. You can have variety and do some dark and some light depending on the source material. Thanks for this, it really wraps everything up. I was very hopeful for this film when it was announced. I loved the idea of the negative zone (planet zero) instead of cosmic rays in space. Novel in the early 60's, but another dimension is the new frontier. I loved the slightly more serious, gritty tone, something I liked in general about Fox's superhero films versus the more comedy-driven MCU films. But there's no denying the movie falls apart after little more than half an hour. With 20/20 hindsight, it would have been better if Trank had trusted the writer he hired to go with the story he developed, and done his rewrites off of it, as opposed to being in such opposition to every element of the story. I mean, Annihilus, Doom, Galactus, and Mole Man in one film!!! Fox double-downed on the problems by slashing the budget and thinking they could somehow cobble together a film post-principal photography. Fox's superhero films are characterized by good characters and strong action - you can't beat the opening to X2, or Quicksilver in DOFP. But this film had a dizzying lack of action, and coherence, and ultimately shows what you get when no one in the production trusts anyone else in the production. The concepts for the movie all sound very interesting and have a lot of potential. If there was a better director and writer on the project the movie would've been much better. I remember seeing the trailers for this and thinking it looked awful. Seems like the studio and director share the blame on this one. Being caught off guard by the tone of the film is entirely on the studio for not monitoring more closely though understanding yes I actually really like the first half of this film and really wish the studio had let Trank do his thing. If they wanted a fun one they should have said that to begin with lol A Cronenberg-esque Body-Horror-Version of this Movie actually sounds interesting and there are some bits of that left in the movie like Reed coming across half-reformed and panicking Ben trapped in his cell or the shot of Reed being experimented on and his limbs stretched in all directions. I'd be honestly curious to watch this version of Fantastic. Alas, it will probably never happen. Shame, since the general Idea is interesting in concept and I actually like the Cast. If Josh Trank taught us anything, is that you can't go from a low-budget movie to a big-budget movie You need to go from low to medium, and then from medium to big Is all about gaining credibility. You never know when a studio is gonna think they can control you. You need to show them that you know what you're doing better than them. It’s not just this film, there are other good Fantastic 4 scripts like the mid-to-late 90s Michael France version and the early 2000s Doug Petrie one, but for some reason, the movies don’t work. They could make good What Could Have Been videos, as they’re both online to read I heard there were different ideas for X-Men Dark Phoenix before that film was made. Presumably, there was an alternate ending of the film that was made where the X-Men fought the Dark Phoenix outside the United Nations building. Maybe you could do a video on that in the future. Trank’s ideas sound interesting if you’re not doing an F4 movie and I wouldn’t be surprised if this is a big reason indie directors hired for MCU movies are generally muzzled creatively Amazing breakdown 👏🏾can’t wait until the next video!
As soon as Josh Trank decided to be a numb skull and not listen to/disregard Jeremy Slater who cooked up an absolute masterpiece of a script, this movie was doomed. Sad to see but can't say that it wasn't deserved.
Nope, trunk's idea was pitch perfect. If you think about the characters it is actually genius. We already had avengers we did not need another carbon copy. The studio should have not intervened , they did the movie just to make it, so why care anyways. Even the coat would have been lower with the trunk's version. You brought the guy that made you a blockbuster already, let him fking cook. Slater's idea sounds like a second hand fart.
slater ideas for the film were perfect. if they had handed him another writer to write more character work, and _obviously_ another director like brad bird it would have been an amazing movie. let's see what the MCU does!
Honestly, Trank's idea of a body horror Cronenberg-style superhero film would be really interesting, but Slater was the right guy to draft a Fantastic Four screenplay
Check out Planetary if you want body horror w/ the FF
Both can work together , especially if you go back and read the original run by Stan and ditko especially with the thing's appearance
I prefer Slatter's version for that regard of getting the movie fruitful based on the comics.
I agreed sounds interesting but I think if he wanted to make a movie like that. He should have make it but with a original story instead of using the Fantastic Four IP. Regardless of
@@alejandroalvarado4178 that's Trank's idea for this movie about the F4. I am rooting for Slatter on this movie.
So basically Slater was the right guy to write it, but Trank was the exact wrong person to direct and hand over creative control to.
he didnt want a body-horror. he wanted cronicles but with fantastic four. *sighs*. also the idea that jeremy slater and directors wasnt on page is wrong. tallk about trying to throw shades on someone you already thrown shade at. he didnt wanted a "black-all-crew" , he had the same casts as young teens. same cast after they got powers, probably ??
ALSO.. FOR the love of. Hasn't trank suffered enough ? He made one-of-the-best superhero / realistic movies. He was pulled of Fantastic Four cause they wanted to do re-shoot for no reason at all. this was almost 2015. almost 10 years ago. talk about his new movies instead.
Slater was a comic book nerd. Trank could make a serious grounded movie that isn't capeshit. Trank wasn't the problem
He had no creative control though. He and Fox agreed to shoot the movie in 3D. Then Fox nixed that.
@@UnifiedaxxS Except that's not what the fantastic 4 are, which makes Trank the problem for trying to fit a square block through a round hole. If a director can't look at the source material and get any inspiration at all, then they're the wrong director for that project. It doesn't matter if it's "capeshit" or not, if the director is going out of their way to ignore the source material it won't be a good adaptation. Besides it's not as if Trank's vision was particularly inspired, he just wanted to make chronicle again but with established characters.
It's really funny that Trank correctly identified the correct writer in Slater, but couldn't identify that he wasn't the right director.
yeah I went into this video thinking, "I want the Track cut" but the longer I watched I was like "this version sounds terrible...I want the Slater cut!"
@@palmickey420 Ikr I think that this is the one time I am totally fine with the studio not releasing the directors cut for the film & them attempting to fix it themselves for a CBM. Unlike Richard Donners Superman 2, Ayer's Suicide Squad or Snyder's Justice League which would have been good or great but because the studio thought they knew better they just ruined them & pissed off the fans & teams who worked on it.
@@ricniks4619snyders justice league was straight trash
@@ricniks4619both versions of justice league were ass
Jew
Fantastic Four (2015) is one of those movies in which its behind the scenes story is more interesting than the movie itself.
Like the island if Dr. Moro
Or even The Phantom Menace
@@mjl11Correction: The Sequels
How is it interesting? They gave full control for a comic book movie to someone who hates comics? Also makes sense that he hated the avengers. He's synder 2.0
The Incredibles will always be the best Fantastic Four movie (for now).
For now yeah right your gonna wait another 20 years 😂😂
Yeah and even that one's animated. Live action doesn't seem to work for the F4.
@@derekseven1647you cannot convert jack kirby's amazing concepts and art into live action, the fantastic four work so much better in animation (either it be 2d or 3d or both)
@@yourfatboy5359Spider-Verse style Fantastic 4 would be lit
@@DeepEye1994 there was a cut scene in across the spider-verse where miles and gwen teleport to a kirby art like room and it looked amazing, can't forget how the first spider-verse film used the kirby crackle (the ball particles you see in the portal, that's how kirby drew energy) i think a fantastic 4 movie with the spider-verse art style would be incredible.
Considering the state of the MCU now, if that F4 movie doesn’t deliver, then the IP is officially cursed in the movie format
I honestly think the 2000s f4 movies were great especially the first one the second one definitely had its problems but it was still enjoyable
....that's so fucking stupid.
No. No it doesn't
I hated how they turned Doctor Doom into a copy of Norman Osborn.
I'm happy Marvel is taking their time on it.
@@ericklingenberg5309
I am really unsure about Pedro Pascal as Mr Fantastic.
I feel like one thing people forget is while yes the Dark Knight Trilogy has darker themes, those movies have a good amount of humor and personality- I feel like a lot of directors just say the darker themes and did not see the humor and personality in those films
its not really "directors" though, its studio executives. Trank wasnt trying to make a film like the Dark Knight.
plus, batman is dark. F4 is not.
The Dark Knight wasn't sucessful because it was "dark and gritty", but because it was a damn good movie
@@KingArthur39 what's that got to do with my comment
@@OptimusMonk01what makes you think he was specifically replying to you?
And if you spoke English fluently you would understand his comment has a lot to do with the discussion being had.
I can understand keeping a real world feel to it, but that doesn’t mean it has to be gloomy or dark. You can still make a bright movie and make it relatable
We get that but let’s be honest marvel haves a full catalog full of bright movies some successful a lot was not so they can do the dark and gloomy just needs the right writer and director to flush the characters out
I don't need it to be gloomy or dark, I legit wanna see a Cronenburg style FF film with all the body horror
I like the dark n gloomy. We can have both. It’s a multiverse
the F4 is supposed to be a tight family giving you that friendly vibe. i don’t get the whole dark n gloomy vibe. save that for characters like doom . they’re literally the ninja turtles , doesn’t need to be as goofy but we love teams like this because of that true family atmosphere.
Bright and relatable? You mean constant unfunny jokes and quips that whedon and the rest of mcu does for 10 years and played out nowadays?
"While the Snyder Cut movement was an incredible thing, it's also something that doesn't need to happen for every movie that suffers from studio interference, as sometimes movie studios have no choice but to step in" - Wiser words have never been spoken.
Perfect quote!!
Snyder cut was not that good TBH.
And Directors sud sign movies if studio agrees to release their cut on Digital.
@ChoCoMoCo69 it wasn't a masterpiece but it wasn't a Frankenstein mess the Whedon Schneider mix the original cut was
@@ChoCoMoCo69except it was that good. 🤷🏻♂️
@@Bowiiihowdy Whedon's version was just Producer pleasing botched Surgery. It's unfair to only blame him.
I will blame WB for it more cuz Snyder's Previous movie was not that good either nor his later Rebel Moon.
Everything about this film's conception was doomed from the get-go. Making it dark and gritty, taking inspiration from Cronenberg, only kickstarting it just to maintain film rights. Nothing about it said anyone's hearts were in the right place.
In regards to Jeremy Slater's original treatment, it might not have been that good, but at least it sounded more interesting and entertaining than what we got.
Agreed
I have to quote redlettermedia and say you cant make a good fantastic 4 movie. Trank at least has an idea that was different and Slater just wanted to do ANOTHER attempt at a superhero film with the F4 when they aren't superheroes theyre a bunch of wacky scientists who try and make their lives as normal as possible but are always called to action.
@@CollegeDroputPowerpoints I counter that argument saying you can't make a good Fantastic Four movie with one word: Incredibles.
So glad that Josh drank himself isn't pushing for a Trank cut
Trank's movie would have been interesting. Not good, better than what we got. There was nothng wrong with the body horror, its already in the original concept. The things main personality is horror with his own body
Goddamn, the industry shat out Trank as quickly as it welcomed him.
😂
He kind of had it coming. If he wanted to be an auteur and have 100% control, he shouldn't have agreed to do a summer super hero movie.
@jeffreymilhorn-bx5jrNICHOLAS ROBBED ME BLIND! Don't trust his tricks, it's all a ploy to leave you penniless
@@Bulletsandblockbusters "Yeah, Barney's right, we're almost out of beer!" Can you get rid of all these sockpuppet crypto scam replies?
I love when the bots have conversations in comments 😂
Awesome video! This really opened my eyes to Josh Trank. I was aware about how the fox studio had heavy involvement in the film, but I had no idea about his behavior on the project. Guess this explains why he hasn’t done any big movies in while.
Guy had one good idea and executed it well with chronicle and that’s about all he had. I know his father and step mom were connected to Hollywood
His career is definitely over
@@Zegeebwah he wrote and directed a $20 million movie a couple years ago. it didn't do amazing theatrically cause it ended up going digital due to covid (literally came out may 2020 lol). it seems like he's still able to get jobs
@@EJD339 We didn't really need an American version of Akira set in Seattle. It was OK for what it was, but it wasn't a very original story.
@@scenes3177Chronicle is and will always be his best movie, to be honest I think of it as one of the best superhero films to date!
I'm honestly amazed Hollywood could never understand that Batman was appropriate for a dark and gritty film but other superhero franchises were not. You can have variety and do some dark and some light depending on the source material.
That's where DC has struggled. Especially Zack Snyder. I liked his films, I enjoyed Man of Steel and BvS, but making everyone fit the dark tone didn't work. That's where Marvel did better (usually). The adapted the story around the characters.
You say this, but when those execs were growing up, Batman was the byword for comedy. Imagine if someone tells you that Looney Tunes are appropriate for a dark and gritty adaptation (but not other cartoons).
Hollywood doesn't do Subtlety, comic books are comic books , whether horror or action heroes , romance , slice of life , philosophical. If some one drew them then they are a cartoon and that either means a cartoony comedy super movie or a dark and gritty reimagining. 😐
@@davidshillaker7578Zack Snyder is a hack and you have awful taste
James Bond and Batman Begins started that trend to be fair, and honestly a lot of other films tried to be dark and gritty from then on
Trank sounds like a nightmare. Why do the studios hire people who have contempt for the source material? It seems to happen often and usually results in a poor adaptation.
Studios like to take promising directors that have made one or two features, and then bring them onto huge franchises. They do this because it gives them hope that something fresh and good will be made, but they'll be new enough to be controlled by the studio.
Honestly that script with Annihilus and Mole Man sounds fucking awesome. Just a shame this isn’t the universe that movie was made in.
Yeah although it might have some problems filming on like how spider-man 3 (2007) have shoehorned all the villain in and stuff
It would have been too expensive, and the story would have been a mess.
@@SirBlackReedsWouldve beeen much better than the abomination we got
This movie had a hellish production from start to finish.
That might have made a better movie than what came out
I recently watched some other RUclipsr's version of this, and yours is WAY better. Thank you. Keep it up!!!
Wow, thanks!
Slaters version actually sounds a lot more interesting than the snooze fest we got
It's basically a choice between a director's revenge story, someone's fanfic, or a studio generic product.
@@CollegeDroputPowerpointsYou say that like it was Tranks plan all along to screw over a studio that gave him his first big break, Chronicle. Personally, it looks to me like Trank had a very specific, alternative take on the superhero genre. Him and Max Landis crafted an incredibly unique "superhero" style film with Chronicle that avoided most cliches (like the whole great power comes with great responsibility yada yada type hero cliches) and instead went with the idea of "what would 3 teens ACTUALLY do if they gained super powers?" I'm not trying to say Trank would've made a groundbreaking new film if he had been allowed to write and film what he wanted with Fantastic Four, but I agree with most other commenters saying his version would've at least been interesting and not a Simon Kinberg, Dark Phoenix snooze fest.
@@CollegeDroputPowerpoints😢
Yes!
Idk about galaktus being the main villain in the first movie in the earlier draft script but other than that I think slater script is pretty cool
I know people don't like the portal thing from this film, but it's not completely out of nowhere.
It's more based on the Ultimate universe's Fantastic Four, where they got their powers via dimensional travel instead of space travel.
💯
I liked it more than the let's go to space with my friends origin.
@@Bulletsandblockbustersaloso colecthio. The x men fntastic four move was planed in 2010 but the did frent x men fntastic foyr crossover planned to be wrteen by warren ellus
@@thrashpuppy2010agreed. It feels more modern. When the FF were originally created in 1961, dreams of exploring the stars and going the moon was the idea. But now we’ve already been to space a lot…so inter dimensional travel would be the next big thing. I like it.
I actually prefer parts of that origin. Space is fun and cool, but that doesn't seem to be a priority for humanity. We haven't made any concrete steps to go back to the Moon or even land on Mars. So the N-Zone is an interesting concept that opens up so many other doors for the story. I think Annihilus should have been the villain if you take the N-Zone route for a story.
They should have shot Slater’s version, no matter how expensive it was gonna be. Sounds amazing.
man, what a nightmare. I can just imagine having to deal with all those problems, both as trank, and the other people trying to cope with all that craziness.
When whe movie began by presenting the mindset of a young Reed Richards, I thought I was in for a great movie. And that impression was enforced with the prototype scene in the basement. Then everything went south pretty quickly.
The team didn't felt like a family, the movie was esthetically so dark, a lot of the story took place inside the same facility or whatever, there was a whole 5 year time jump in between that wasn't as impactful as it should have and Victor turned into a villain simply because he has to.
This movie is like a nice mug that they broke and repaired using glue, with some pieces either missing or replaced, and no idea of what made it great initially.
Great video :) Just a small correction ... Chronicle was not made on the basis of Trank's own script. Max Landis was a screenwtiter on that one.
I remember seeing the trailers for this and thinking it looked awful. Seems like the studio and director share the blame on this one. Being caught off guard by the tone of the film is entirely on the studio for not monitoring more closely though
He did what they hired him to do, they were being silly. They should have interfered more during filming, but also supported Trank. He clearly went a bit mad.
all they had to do was read the script. If he didn't want to do what they wanted, they could have hired someone else.
Some of these added scenes looked absolutely amazing. Would have liked to have seen that version
My friends brother was the stunt double for Doom. He’s the one who was in all the reshoots.
That's sick, I actually liked this movie, good for him😊
I doubt it.
@@CalvaryProductions1 ok? If you have nothing nice to say then don't say anything at all
@@ThePie_only it’s not a mean thing. I just don’t exactly think that what he said is true. I mean, with all the misinformations spreading around the internet about everything, can you really blame me??
@@CalvaryProductions1 ehh, idk man, people are also mean for no reason, can you blame me?
I think it was Honest Trailers that at one point said that a movie about the making of this movie would be more interesting than this version of Fantastic Four turned out to be.
Nice. Another great video. Your videos are one of the highlights of my week man. Thanks as always!
Wow, that makes me so happy to hear. Thank you and glad you enjoy them so much!
@@Bulletsandblockbusters me and my daughters always watch your videos everytime a new one comes out. We dig it.
That honestly made my day to hear. Thank you!
@@Bulletsandblockbustersyeh msyb Josh trank shou j been balowed yo mskmr th move he wanted to make lith guy wanted to mor if a sci fi horror movie and msyb fix cou hsv just let him do it imgin if the got mdkevth mo he wanted it cou hsv been on mor intresting suphero moves out there imagine unvrksble meets th fly
I wish more directors and studios would take inspiration from Raimi's Spiderman trilogy. It was able to be serious and campy. Had dark moments, but also light ones. Not everything needs to be dark and gritty all the time.
Finally! Somebody said it!
@Alf-gm7tf I think Raimi would be an awesome director for a Batman movie. Especially with his ability to balance serious and campy, but also sprinkle in some horror elements. I think it could work really well, especially using elements from Batman: the animated series like he used elements from Spiderman: the animated series for his Spiderman trilogy.
I think nobody can direct like Raimi other than Raimi himself. Even with the evil dead TV show, you notice the difference between the episodes he directed and the ones he only wrote... he's a God among humans
I think nobody can direct like Raimi other than Raimi himself. Even with the evil dead TV show, you notice the difference between the episodes he directed and the ones he only wrote... he's a God among humans
@@lucacriscuolo2989 I agree, and I think it's why Dr. Strange 2 was such a mess. It was his vision conflicting with the MCU vision. It almost felt like it held him back.
Absolutely love this series! Another awesome video dude! However it does suck to hear that this is one film that sounds like it would not have had any sort of good cut with who was at the helm of the project.
At most it would be a cult classic. Chronicle had some bad reviews for how dark it became and I think thats because the mass audience dont like things that are "negative."
Trank should have just done Chronicle part 2.
Thank you for making this, I've been recently telling everyone how compelling the pre-production and concept art for Fant4stic was. I really like the idea of a superhero body horror so it's a shame Fox fumbled that.
The Incredibles is still the best Fantastic Four film to date. I don’t think any future projects will top it.
The Incredibles is terrible. F4 silver surfer is better.
@@drumnbassdan Rise of the Silver Surfer is one of the most terrible superhero movies ever made. It killed the franchise. The most boring parts of Incredibles 1 and 2 are better than all Fantastic Four movies combined.
i agree. i just said it was better than the Incredibles @@Crimson28
That does not count but yeah also I'm just gonna you know despite the recent years with the MCU but I would like to see the interpretation of Fantastic Four in that universe
@@Crimson28Nah those F4 movies are great
No way, they did it really dirty on Jeremy Slater 💀, with his script and his concepts and ideas it could have been the best Fantastic Four movie.
Too bad it wasn't, but the good thing is that Jeremy Slater was able to continue with Marvel with Moon Knight and is now working on James Gunn's new DCU, equally a shame he's not the writer of the new Fantastic Four MCU movie.
I remember watching this in theatres and sharply noticing how much I actually like the Trank First half, and then boom, when the studio recuts happen for the second half of the movie, I and all my friends stopped liking it. We didn't know it at the time and we just thought "Why was the second half of the movie so much worse than the first half???" and then I eventually learned about the reshoots and recuts and such. I wish they would have just let Trank cook.
I was REALLY digging the horror inspired elements and I think experimentation is good. You wanna bright kid friendly F4? We got two of those in the 2000's. Go watch those. Ya know?
No, the first half was garbage, too. It was as boring, tedious and poorly-acted with a whole bunch of nothing happening as the second half. All it confirmed was the movie might’ve been mostly garbage instead of complete garbage had they let him cook.
1st half was terrible too 😂
@@edwardhewitt9229 what character or plot development? The first half was as boring to sit through with a whole bunch of NOTHING happening as the second half was. 🤦♂
I agree with you man. I don’t know why people didn’t like it. I liked how new and weird it felt m
Oh, right. Of course I want a bright FF movie. Wait, nevermind. I *totally* want Marvel's First Family to be dark, gritty, and realistic. God forbid, there isn't a FF inspired film with darker themes/tone but still able keep it light. Oh...
Another great video from a dude that never misses.
Thank you!
This is what I’ve been waiting for - hell yes!!
Honestly, i would have loved to see tranks version, it seems like a great and refreshing take, but i also would have loved to see slaters. Both could have done really well and been great movies if they could have been done in their own
Your RUclips is probably one of the best for cancelled movies I didn't know a lot of the things about this film
Thanks!
@@Bulletsandblockbustersyou're welcome glad I found your youtube
So they hired Trank to make a Fantastic 4 movie, and he made Chronicle again.
Thanks for the vid! I've still never seen this movie, though I always wanted to know more of the behind the scene story.
I heard there was different ideas for X-Men Dark Phoenix before that film was made. Presumably there was an alternate ending of the film that was made where the X-Men fought the Dark Phoenix outside the United Nations building. Maybe you could do a video on that in the future.
The train sequence in Dark Phoenix was a reshoot. I'm not sure how much of the final act was a reshoot though.
Amazing breakdown 👏🏾can’t wait until the next video!
Thank you!
I like Chronicle a lot and I really like the idea of the Scanners/Fly mix, but there was no way this film was going to end well. The studio wanted one thing and Trank another. I imagine if there actually is a Director cut out there, it's maybe fine. If he'd been able to execute his vision it might have been good, but just so different from what they wanted
After seeing this vid i think Trank should've just done his own thing. He wouldn't have been restricted by source material and such. He would have had no problem pitching and greenlighting an original film based on the ideas ideas that were mentioned i.e. A Scanner and The Fly mix with inspiration from The Fantastic Four, after his success with chronicle.
And none of them were what the audience or fans wanted
There was an article about this ages ago I could never find again so thanks for this
I do like this movie, or at least what it set out to do. The minimalist beginning leading into 90s Sci-fi wonder into pure body horror is legitimately great and reminded me a lot of Ang Lee's Hulk, which I also really liked. It's when it has to be a superhero movie is when it goes wrong and it goes wrong hard and fast
It may still have worked. Fox didnt know what they had asked for, so were surprised when Trank delivered what they asked for, rather than a slightly more serious take on the fantastic four
Nah. The only thing I wanted out of this movie when it came out was a good action figure of the thing...with pants. This movie was so trash that we didn't get any good action figures if any at all
I still want this version of the film.
Awesome video! I watch all your videos when I'm stuck in traffic on the way & back to work! Keep it up! 🙌🏻
Thanks!!!
The gift that keeps on giving.
That first script would have been amazing. Adding Annihulus would have been such an awesome movie. Especially with his control rod being the thing to create victors armor. Such a shame man.
The first half of this movie was amazing. I really wish we could’ve seen Trank’s vision fully realized
Thanks for this, it really wraps everything up. I was very hopeful for this film when it was announced. I loved the idea of the negative zone (planet zero) instead of cosmic rays in space. Novel in the early 60's, but another dimension is the new frontier. I loved the slightly more serious, gritty tone, something I liked in general about Fox's superhero films versus the more comedy-driven MCU films. But there's no denying the movie falls apart after little more than half an hour. With 20/20 hindsight, it would have been better if Trank had trusted the writer he hired and gone with the story he developed, and done his rewrites off of it, as opposed to being in such opposition to every element of the story. I mean, Annihilus, Doom, Galactus and Mole Man in one film!!! Fox double-downed on the problems by slashing the budget and thinking they could somehow cobble together a film post principal photography. Fox's superhero films are characterized by good characters and strong action - you can't beat the opening to X2, or Quicksilver in DOFP. But this film had a dizzying lack of action, coherence, and ultimately shows what you get when no one in the production trusts anyone else in the production.
I agree. If Trank just tried to add some extra spice to a story about Annilhilus and Doom with one of the others as an end credits scene it would have been a decent movie at the very least. At least if we're going with the summary we heard in the video.
Trank sounds like the Edgy teenager that writes gritty and "mature" stories based on Sesame Street.
It’s not just this film, there are other good Fantastic 4 scripts like the mid-to-late 90s Michael France version and the early 2000s Doug Petrie one, but for some reason the movies don’t work. They could make good What Could Have Been videos, as they’re both online to read
Trank seems like the type that always feels like he is the smartest person in the room.
It’s absolutely wild to me that people are saying MCU is in a bad state when we had movies like this in the superhero genre just popping up right and left. Sure, we have She Hulks and Secret Invasions but then we got BANGERS like Loki, Wandavision, Shang Chi, and Moon Knight.
Thanks!
Wow thank you!
Trank had no right not to take his anger on Kate because he was forced to cast her she didn't do anything wrong she even went to do research on her character Sue Storm but was told not to do that.
Worst person to direct a FF movie
Trank just wanted to be different for the sake of being different because he had no attachment to the source material. He wanted a Fantastic Four in name only, a complete deconstruction; and then just acted out somewhat unnecessarily when the things he wanted just flat out weren't working for everyone, between the higher up's concerns and even the way he clashed with his own cast in ways that sound so childish and unprofessional, he just wasn't acknowledging this and ultimately seems like he just shut down and then when all was said and done he blamed everybody else a lot but himself a little too little.
He should've just left the project or got fired. He just simply wasn't right for it at all.
I would have love to see Trank's vision on full display. I think the idea of making a more grounded story with a little inspiration from Chronicle is why he was hired in the first place. If there was issues on set with actors then that's a different story.
I remember being so hyped for this... As Trank had made one of my favorite movies of all time: Chronicle.
Not to mention Michael B. Jordan and Miles Teller being totally awesome actors. The first trailer looked so good.
Whatever happened to Miles Teller? Feels like he disappeared after J.K. Simmons shouted at him in Whiplash.
@InevitableOption-ic2vx You're right! I forgot that movie even existed haha.
This movie is so unmemorable, I'd watch it again but in a week I'll probably forget what happened
They didn't even call themselves the Fantastic Four by the End of the Movie.
In the comics, it took the Fantastic Four a little time to become a full-blown super hero adventure comic. Back then Marvel was pumping out monster stories and others like the Twilight Zone, and when the FF started, they retained a lot of the flavor of the other stories. In their first issue they fought a monster. They didn't get their costumes until the third issue I think.
Oddly, i like this unique take on the Fantastic Four. I wish it was fulfilled.
A Cronenberg-esque Body-Horror-Version of this Movie actually sounds interesting and there *are* some bits of that left in the movie, like Reed coming across half reformed and panicking Ben trapped in his cell or the shot of Reed being experimented on and his limbs streched in all directions. I'd be honestly curious to watch this version of Fant4stic.
Alas, if will probably never happen. Shame, since the general Idea is interesting in concept and I actually like the Cast.
I feel like Fox should have given support early on, to mould it an push for some fun, instead of giving him free reign then destroying what they specifically hired him to do.
the scene where doom walks thru the halls blowing brains up, pretty cool tbh
@@myra-yves Yeah, reminded me of _Akira._
Could you do a video about the original script for Prometheus? It was called Alien: Engineers and was was written by Jon Spaihts. It eventually became Prometheus after rewrites by Damon Lindelof, most known as the writer of Lost, Watchmen HBO, the JJ Abrams Star Trek movies, and World War Z among other things
While maybe not the best idea for a Fantastic Four movie, I liked the idea of a “body horror” F
superhero film and would of liked to have seen Trank’s original version
Agreed I think especially with the X-men, body horror is a good way to approach some of their powers.
*would have* not "would of"
I will never forget how bewildered I was when I found out that Thing's iconic catchphrase was borrowed from his abusive bully brother in this iteration.
It sounds as though Trank wasn’t the right fit from the jump. I like the idea of the superhero-transformation -as-body-horror film he wanted to do and it could have been a great piece. However, the studio clearly had something altogether different. This is a story of the city mouse and the country mouse trying to live happily in the suburbs: it doesn’t work for either one
i love how theyre like, “we need our own christopher nolan, GET ME TRANK”
As a big fantastic four fan I remember being so hype watching this not caring how actually bad the film was. I just wanted a sequel so bad 😂
Same
Why would you want a sequel to a film you knew was really bad?
@@rustcohle6149huh
@@R1ch4d8 f4 fans are on the floor trying to eat crumbs for any content other than one title book in the comics.
The Doom head pops were pretty sweet 👍
I always kinda enjoyed the 2015 as a guilty pleasure. Wish we could have seen Trank’s cut.
Kind of funny that the best parts of the film are the ones that were rewritten and reshot without Trank. I just hope the new one is great because F4 and X-men are my favorite thing and the only real Marvel comics I read. We deserve it.
1:46 well that explains why it’s generally faithful to Ultimate Fantastic Four
If Josh Trank taught us anything, is that you can't go from a low-budget movie to a big-budget movie
You need to go from low to medium, and then from medium to big
Is all about gaining credibility. You never know when a studio is gonna think they can control you. You need to show them that you know what you're doing better than them.
Yeah. Giving Trank the keys to an F1 car after driving his first beater car probably wasn't the best idea (not to say Chronicle was a beater car, but for a movie that didn't cost much, it was a bit of a miracle it was as good as it was and made as much as it did). I wish Trank had told the studio very clearly his vision BEFOREHAND so that they could've been like "oh, I see" and just let him down slowly that he wasn't getting the job. I think Fox was on a deadline though and wanted to retain the rights to the Fant4stic franchise. They probably trusted him enough to move forward and, well, we got what we got. I definitely don't blame Trank, at least not entirely.
MCU does this all the time though
@@Siapsidhen that's because most of them are directors for hire
That's why most of them don't have lasting careers afterwards
@LeonardoKlotz no? MCU specifically hires up-and-coming filmmakers. Technically, you can say every director in the mcu is a director for hire. They have these planned out years in advance.
@@Siapsidhen the only reason why they do this is so they can control them. The smaller the director, the more they wanted to control them
In the beginning, they hired stablished directors to helm their first movies, and that was before Disney took over
After that, the bigger they got, the bigger was their control over the movies
They not only were getting up-and-coming directors, but also TV directors
They didn't wanted their filmmakers to think outside the box when they shouldn't. That's why they got rid of Edgar Wright and put a director for hire like Peyton Reed.
There's a reason why they usually don't pick stablished filmmakers like Darren Aronofsky, Matt Reeves, Jordan Peele, Greta Gerwig
It doesn't matter how talented they are, if Disney can't control them, they won't even go to the "maybe pile"
That's what Hollywood has been doing recently, especially with franchise movies
I still find it hard to believe someone who directed Chronicle, objectively a really well made and creative film, could fail so miserably on another comic book movie.
I think I read somewhere Trank had some help directing Chronicle, but I can't find the article anywhere and have no idea if it's true.
Slater’s screenplay was phenomenal. How do you walk away from a 2015 F4 movie, with access to good vfx that include Annihilus, Mole Man, Herbie, the fantasticar, the cosmic control rod and more?
Sounds like the studio was actually the “good guys” this time around. Whereas Trank did not care about the source material, his writer or the cast. It had to be his way through and through at every turn. Even though his way was the wrong way
Another great video!
From what I remember, the film would've been too dark for a decent 3D post conversion, as 3D hates the dark and Trank was obviously going for a dimly lit horror motif.
Oh yay! You finally released it. Ask and I shall receive. Unless you were already making this video when I was asking for it. Hahaha! Great video, looking forward to the next one! 👍🏻
Haha thanks!
I'd love to see Trank get to have his director's cut in the future.
I would've wanted all three...Peyton Reed's 60’s-set film, Slater’s original idea and Trank's full vision but untouched by the studio!
I did enjoy a lot of ideas from this fantastic four but goddamn was it all over the place. I honestly would’ve like to see Transks full vision just to see how unique it would’ve been. I doubt I would’ve enjoyed that version of the film but I would’ve loved to see what a complete unhinged creative freedom looks like
Yes
josh trank and david ayer both want director cuts. most people support ayers cut but so few people support tranks. my theory is people can sense that ayer is passionate about wanting to do right by the characters, or fans, where as trank seems more upset his movie got bad reviews.
So Josh Trank is the problem. Imagine hiring a guy that has no interest in comics let alone fantastic 4 itself and creates a toxic environment, no wonder it bombed. His version is even worse
I have to say, Trank's FANTASTIC FOUR felt to me like it would've been a decent sci-fi/horror movie if only it didn't have the Fantastic Four brand on it. As a sci-fi/horror movie of some other name (and with characters having a different powerset), it would've done fine.
Having been a fan of the Fan4 for my whole life, its sad to see what has happened with the live action portrayals, even though I somewhat like them all in their own way. The ‘94 unreleased movie was a perfect adaptation of the origins if you overlook the shotty special effects and animation. The 2000’s was campy and lighthearted, with fun chemistry and good vibes, but terrible galactus portrayal. But Fan4stic just feels unfinished and doesnt bring the love of the team like the comics do. I’m happy you made this video because now I can at least appreciate what Trank tried to do with Slater on the project, but its a shame his vision wasnt produced the way he wanted.
Hello, where did you get the action choreography footage of the deleted Thing action sequence?
They had the right writer, just not the director. Josh Trank wasn't a Marvel guy or even a DC guy, he just wanted to make his movie without the clamor from the studio and its producers, it's the only reason why Chronicle works perfectly as a one-off story, no sequel or franchise needed it was his story the way he wanted to tell and share, it was just a story about three kids discovering superpowers but set in the realistic world. With Fantastic 4, it just didn't garner off his interest in the way Chris Nolan wanted to make Batman set in a realistic world, he just didn't have the heart to make it or make it in a way to satisfy the studio. Overall, I feel that Josh was in a no-win situation to make his movie or a movie that everyone would love.
Another great video!
This whole thing is such a shame because maybe instead we could have got another original Josh Trank film and a more accurate Fantastic Four.
One good thing that came out of was Jamie Bell meeting Kate Mara, and now they're married and have kids!
The original origin of Dr Doom in the comics is probably the greatest villain origin story of all time (I read it in Bring On The Bad Guys at least 100 times as a kid)… why do people insist on f@cking with it? It’s perfect.
Agree
Because nowadays no villain is allowed to be villainous, they always have to be misunderstood or treated badly to justify why they're evil; all the companies now want to have sympathetic villains that act and look cool. That's why I'm glad that Jack Horner from the last Puss n Boots movie was just straight up evil because he wanted to and had none of the nowadays common villain traits.
@@djpegaohe's not just straight up evil. It's played off for laughs. So your point is invalid.
Went to go see this with my mom when it came out. A guy in the row in front of us, a few seats across, literally fell asleep and snored loudly through the latter half of the film.
😂
studio hired a director with less than 1 film achievement under his belt? sheesh.
great video. Thanks!
They should've fired Trank and found a good director to shoot Slater's film.
Thanks for the amazing information
My pleasure
The most interesting thing about this film will always be the production nightmare. I think Trank wasn’t a good pick imo. No clue how the F4 is so hard to adapt but man the MCU can only do better.
With the state of the the current MCU they’ll nuke the fantastic 4 with pandering and race and gender swapping
Everything about this film's conception was doomed from the get-go. Making it dark and gritty, taking inspiration from Cronenberg, only kickstarting it just to maintain film rights. Nothing about it said anyone's hearts were in the right place. In regards to Jeremy Slater's original treatment, it might not have been that good, but at least it sounded more interesting and entertaining than what we got. Awesome video! This really opened my eyes to Josh Trank. I was aware of how the Fox studio had heavy involvement in the film, but I had no idea about his behavior on the project. Guess this explains why he hasn’t done any big movies in a while. I feel like one thing people forget is while yes the Dark Knight Trilogy has darker themes, those movies have a good amount of humor and personality- I feel like a lot of directors just say the darker themes and did not see the humor and personality in those films Absolutely love this series! Another awesome video dude! However, it does suck to hear that this is one film that sounds like it would not have had any sort of good cut with who was at the helm of the project. As a big Fantastic Four fan, I remember being so hyped watching this not caring how actually bad the film was. I just wanted a sequel so bad 😂 I like Chronicle a lot and I really like the idea of the Scanners/Fly mix, but there was no way this film was going to end well. The studio wanted one thing and Trank another. I imagine if there actually is a Director cut out there, it's maybe fine. If he'd been able to execute his vision it might have been good, but just so different from what they wanted Nice. Another great video. Your videos are one of the highlights of my week man. Thanks as always! Man, what a nightmare. I can just imagine having to deal with all those problems, both as a trank and the other people trying to cope with all that craziness. Great video :) Just a small correction ... Chronicle was not made based on Trank's own script. Max Landis was a screenwriter on that one. I do like this movie, or at least what it set out to do. The minimalist beginning leading into 90s Sci-fi wonder into pure body horror is legitimately great and reminded me a lot of Ang Lee's Hulk, which I also really liked. It's when it has to be a superhero movie when it goes wrong and it goes wrong hard and fast While maybe not the best idea for a Fantastic Four movie, I liked the idea of a “body horror” F superhero film and would have liked to have seen Trank’s original version I did enjoy a lot of ideas from this fantastic four but goddamn was it all over the place. I honestly would’ve liked to see Mark's full vision just to see how unique it would’ve been. I doubt I would’ve enjoyed that version of the film but I would’ve loved to see what complete unhinged creative freedom looks like I'm honestly amazed Hollywood could never understand that Batman was appropriate for a dark and gritty film but other superhero franchises were not. You can have variety and do some dark and some light depending on the source material. Thanks for this, it really wraps everything up. I was very hopeful for this film when it was announced. I loved the idea of the negative zone (planet zero) instead of cosmic rays in space. Novel in the early 60's, but another dimension is the new frontier. I loved the slightly more serious, gritty tone, something I liked in general about Fox's superhero films versus the more comedy-driven MCU films. But there's no denying the movie falls apart after little more than half an hour. With 20/20 hindsight, it would have been better if Trank had trusted the writer he hired to go with the story he developed, and done his rewrites off of it, as opposed to being in such opposition to every element of the story. I mean, Annihilus, Doom, Galactus, and Mole Man in one film!!! Fox double-downed on the problems by slashing the budget and thinking they could somehow cobble together a film post-principal photography. Fox's superhero films are characterized by good characters and strong action - you can't beat the opening to X2, or Quicksilver in DOFP. But this film had a dizzying lack of action, and coherence, and ultimately shows what you get when no one in the production trusts anyone else in the production. The concepts for the movie all sound very interesting and have a lot of potential. If there was a better director and writer on the project the movie would've been much better. I remember seeing the trailers for this and thinking it looked awful. Seems like the studio and director share the blame on this one. Being caught off guard by the tone of the film is entirely on the studio for not monitoring more closely though understanding yes I actually really like the first half of this film and really wish the studio had let Trank do his thing. If they wanted a fun one they should have said that to begin with lol A Cronenberg-esque Body-Horror-Version of this Movie actually sounds interesting and there are some bits of that left in the movie like Reed coming across half-reformed and panicking Ben trapped in his cell or the shot of Reed being experimented on and his limbs stretched in all directions. I'd be honestly curious to watch this version of Fantastic. Alas, it will probably never happen. Shame, since the general Idea is interesting in concept and I actually like the Cast. If Josh Trank taught us anything, is that you can't go from a low-budget movie to a big-budget movie You need to go from low to medium, and then from medium to big Is all about gaining credibility. You never know when a studio is gonna think they can control you. You need to show them that you know what you're doing better than them. It’s not just this film, there are other good Fantastic 4 scripts like the mid-to-late 90s Michael France version and the early 2000s Doug Petrie one, but for some reason, the movies don’t work. They could make good What Could Have Been videos, as they’re both online to read I heard there were different ideas for X-Men Dark Phoenix before that film was made. Presumably, there was an alternate ending of the film that was made where the X-Men fought the Dark Phoenix outside the United Nations building. Maybe you could do a video on that in the future. Trank’s ideas sound interesting if you’re not doing an F4 movie and I wouldn’t be surprised if this is a big reason indie directors hired for MCU movies are generally muzzled creatively
Amazing breakdown 👏🏾can’t wait until the next video!
As soon as Josh Trank decided to be a numb skull and not listen to/disregard Jeremy Slater who cooked up an absolute masterpiece of a script, this movie was doomed. Sad to see but can't say that it wasn't deserved.
What a clown also makes sense that he hated the avengers
Nope, trunk's idea was pitch perfect. If you think about the characters it is actually genius. We already had avengers we did not need another carbon copy. The studio should have not intervened , they did the movie just to make it, so why care anyways. Even the coat would have been lower with the trunk's version. You brought the guy that made you a blockbuster already, let him fking cook. Slater's idea sounds like a second hand fart.
slater ideas for the film were perfect. if they had handed him another writer to write more character work, and _obviously_ another director like brad bird it would have been an amazing movie. let's see what the MCU does!