Goku gets destroyed by any version of Super Buu, he straight up says he doesn't stand a chance against Buu like that... Even when confronted by piccolo buu, Goku says that GOHAN can handle Buu now....
If we're going by the anime Kid buu is the strongest buu and goku is somewhat able to fight kid buu meaning rip super buu. if its the manga buuhan is the strongest buu and i'm not too familiar with the manga scaling.
@@cryingmetal9349 it really doesn't matter if its the anime or manga, Buuhan is still the strongest Buu in both versions... In the anime, SS3 Gotenks is still stronger than SS3 Goku and then Ultimate Gohan is stronger than SS3 Gotenks and nothing changes that... It doesn't matter that the anime makes an incorrect statement, the scaling still exists and there's a bunch of other statements that contradict the incorrect anime statement. All you can really argue is which version of Gotenks is stronger than Goku, most would say Base Gotenks, but either way SS3 Gotenks is definitely stronger than SS3 Goku and Ultimate Gohan is even stronger...
@@reptilian_geneticist In the anime Goku an off guard goku tanks an hit from illusion ultimate gohan who has the same power as gohan (stated in the guides and by goku himself). He goes ssj then 1 taps that gohan. Kid buu is stated by everyone and everything to be the strongest buu. Not only that Gohan is scared of kid buu coming to earth (If he was stronger he wouldn't be that scared) and theres much much more. The anime is completely different to the manga when it comes to scaling.
@@cryingmetal9349 Nope... Goku is fighting an ILLUSION of Gohan inside of Buu's mind 🤣 None of it is real, its all just a figment of Buus imagination... and in that very same episode Goku says that he and Vegeta stand no chance against Super Buu... SS3 Gotenks is stronger than SS3 Goku and Ultimate Gohan is stronger than SS3 Gotenks and nothing changes that... Goku is never stated or inferred to have gotten any stronger. To say that he did is pure headcannon nonsense... and Goku would need to have gotten dozens of times stronger in order to fight kid buu (if kid buu was actually stronger than Buuhan lol)
The narrator literally says shenron will grant any wish is requested just before calling goku the strongest warrior . Narrator lies to hype up the universe of dragon ball for the new viewers , thats what it is.
Thats how it works. Goku is often gonna be referred to as the strongest no matter what. Same way Beerus will get called unbeatable even though The Angels exist
@@ItsB1998 read the manga or watch db kai, hes never actually stated to be the strongest boo, hes just the most dangerous one cuz he gives no shits unlike the others. thats an anime only thing that makes 0 sense
@@onlygens1502seems like YOU didn't watch DB Kai, I literally have the statements uploaded from DB Kai 😂 they did NOT just say the most dangerous, they said he's the most powerful and they said this MULTIPLE TIMES, they said he was the most powerful more times than they said he was the most dangerous 💀 DB fans making up lies because they can't stand their precious Gohan getting one shotted by Kid Buu.
Piccolo said he had never felt power like Gohan's at that time. And that was after seeing Goku and even SS3 Gotenks in action. That and taking into account the stamina drain of SS3, I would bet on Gohan in any case. Especially if he's in top form.
SS3 Goku might be stronger now; but I can’t wrap my head around Gotenks SS3 being weaker than Goku, so I can’t fathom SS3 Goku being stronger than Ultimate Gohan during the Boo arc for sure
@@JACQUEZ23 During Boo? No; not with the fusion multiplier & the SS3 multiplier. Now? Yes. However, Goku was far more an experienced fighter than Gotenks - but Gotenks would definitely have been stronger
Take it like this. At SSJ3 gotenks was struggling against super buu. Meanwhile vegito barely needed SSj to defeat Buuhan. Goku and vegeta were natural stronger than goten and trunks. Even fused gotenks power would not eclipse SSJ3 Goku. Now this is daima. Goku has been training since the last episode of the buu sega. Gotten and trunks not so much. They are kids, they are more focused on kid stuff. At this point in Daima we can assume the boys probably hadn’t fused since the buu sega, so Goku right now in Daima should be far stronger than SSJ3 gotenks. And if gohan has done nothing but study since then, Goku should be far stronger than him too.
The core issue with this debate lies in the use of sources released after the original manga or anime. If we’re going to compare two characters fairly, it should be based solely on the information available at the time of the original story’s release. Even if the original creator is involved in these newer sources, it doesn’t change the fact that writers often contradict their previous work without much concern. Does anyone really believe Akira Toriyama or the writing team is preoccupied with maintaining perfect consistency across decades of content? This debate reminds me of the Potara vs. Fusion Dance argument. When the original series was airing, it was made explicitly clear that the Potara fusion was far superior. It wasn’t until Dragon Ball Super came along with its questionable retcons that this once-settled matter was reopened. If not for these changes, the debate wouldn’t even exist today, except among a small group of fans. Now, regarding Goku vs. Gohan during the Buu arc-there is overwhelming evidence that Goku isn’t even on the same level as Gotenks, let alone Gohan. Despite the overwhelming evidence evidence in favor of Gohan. You had individuals arguing in favor of Goku nearly 3 decades ago now , At this point, I’m convinced that some people are simply biased toward their favorite character. No matter how much evidence exists to the contrary, they will always find a way to argue in favor of their preferred character.
As long as Goku's the monkey demon to beat then hes by default the strongest. Its the same narrative logic that allows Beerus/ gods of destruction to being the moving goal post regardless of being surpassed in power by fusion and UI.
OMG this is just PURE copium 😂😂😂 Toriyama wrote this, Kid Buu is the strongest and he's been telling you this for decades, Daima was the final nail in the coffin for people who refuse to accept the truth 🤣🤣
@@MajinUltraEgo-pv akira never explicitly states kid buu is stronger during the time it 1st originally aired , As I said I can tell right away when someone is Clearly biased t
@@MajinUltraEgo-pv On top of that, buu gohan was able to fight (though clearly on the back foot) vegito were as kid buu fought more or less on par with a slight edge with super saiyan 3 Goku
He did, but we also got a gt writer interview about him not being a super warrior anymore like he allegedly was back then, mentally So for SS2 Z Gohan to go from Fat Buu-ish level to Base GT Gohan being relative to Base General Rilldo who is stronger than Kid Buu should say a lot
@@johnzahm193 tbh if he was stacking ss on ultimate (as his base) it'd be worse, because buuhan wasn't even worth a total of 3 gotenks, and rilldo was being compared to buu XD at least we can say regular gohan got over 400x stronger with ss still in his back pocket instead of 3 - 6x stronger bare minimum
The only way Ssj3 Goku is stronger Ultimate Gohan if you believe Kid Buu is stronger than Super Buu. Which wouldn't make sense because Goku after Buuhan went back to Super Buu Goku said him AND Vegeta would still not have a chance. Meanwhile he was confident that he could solo Kid Buu, and Ultimate Gohan was boxing up Super Buu and made him run.While also feeling the need to absorb Gotenks and Piccolo to even have a chance at beating Gohan.
Super Buu is NOT pushing back a Spirit Bomb that has Ultimate Gohan's energy inside of it 😂 it makes perfect sense, you just deluded yourself into believing the opposite for so long that you can't accept it
No they straight up say when Super Buu transforms into buff Buu then into Kid Boo that he’s getting stronger. Also Goku and even Vegeta were confident they could take Kid Boo, but they were clearly wrong. They underestimated him.
@@Zeff0 I love how you replied to him and ignored my comment because you can't counter it 😂 also, Goku was hiding the extent of his power, Vegeta did not even believe Goku when he said that, Vegeta was able to see Goku's true power when they were Vegito 🤣👉🍭
Saying tht Buuhan is weaker than Kid Buu doesn't make any sense at all. It discredits your entire video. Supreme Kai said that Kid Buu was "the most dangerous" version of Buu, not the strongest. That statement has always been misinterpreted by fans. Why did Goku and Vegeta fuse then if they had been able to fight Buuhan by themselves? Nonesensical.
All that matters is who was stronger during the Buu fights, not who was stronger the next day or a year later.... Gotenks was already stronger than Goku and then Ultimate Gohan was stronger than Gotenks... There's really nothing to debate, that is the narrative of the story.
@@charzanboo9940 They take place during the 10 year time skip after the Buu saga but before the Tournament where Goku fights Uub. Nobody cares how strong Gohan is at the end of Z... The "argument" is how strong ultimate Gohan and SS3 Goku were during the buu saga (which took place over the span of 1 day). So like I said, it doesn't matter.
@@reptilian_geneticist This dude has been making stupid comments all day lol he's looking for anyone to argue with and you're right. Daima literally doesn't matter one way or the other to the overall debate.
Even in the anime Goku tells Vegeta they don’t stand a chance against BASE Super Buu if they leave his body and decide to fight him. That statement alone should tell you Ultimate Gohan > SSJ3 Goku. Even SSJ3 Gotenks is stronger than that version of Goku. If we’re going by the original manga then Gohan, Super Buu and Gotenks is astronomically stronger than SSJ3 Goku 😂
Goku and Vegeta are at 1/100 percent of their power when they say that When Buutenks defuses into Buu piccolo Goku verbatim reverts to his base in front of him and mocks him about how he can’t beat him now.
I don't take Daima seriously personally It might mean Goku is stronger now but thats about it Toriyamas recent word doesnt outrank his original manga,which clearly portrayed Super Buu,Gotenks and Gohan as far above Goku That is not even a debate. You cant read the manga and think otherwise That was PRIME Toriyama. Daima is by an old and confused Toriyama who just wrote whatever. And i doubt he even remembered the scaling in the Buu saga after all these decades,a lot of fans dont remember,you expect TORIYAMA to remember? Ofcourse he is gonna say the main character is the strongest after decades Nothing has been changed because it cannot be changed. "retcons" are an excuse by people that dont like the past But what happened has happened. Buu Saga Ultimate Gohan>>>Buu Saga SSJ3 Gohan The original manga is above everything else. Frankly i am disappointed Rev even considered it instead of casually laughing at the idea and moving on If we are talking about things from the original manga vs what old senile toriyama later wrote its not even close. Its basically word of god vs washed out word of god Also there is no evidence Toriyama wrote this specific line. The producers of movies&animes etc throw a lot of stuff in to fill out time and all that. Toriyama writes the script as in what is happening in the story etc. Whats more valid? The manga as it was being written by Toriyama literally at that moment? Or Some offhand comment decades later?
@charzanboo9940 If it's after the buu saga, then it doesn't matter lol but during the buu saga, no Goku was not stronger. And the debate was only during that time when there was no Daima. Gohan is studying again in Daima. So if Goku is stronger, so what
@@derekosgood3230 Daima supposedly takes place 9-10 months after the end of Z, which isn't a very long time for Ultimate Gohan to be substantial weaker or unskilled. In comparison, 7 years was required, between the end of the Cell saga and the beginning of the Buu saga, for SSJ2 Gohan to become a bit weaker 🤦🏽♂️
@@charzanboo9940 If Gohan stopped training for 10 months, assuming your time frame is accurate, and Goku continues to train for those 10 months, it's long enough.
@@derekosgood3230 First, Revolushane in the video quoted 9-10 months. Second, if 9-10 months of training was all it took for SSJ3 Goku to surpass Ultimate Gohan, then the *supposed* gap was inconsequential at best to begin with, lmao.
Um, No Ultimate gohan is much stronger than SSJ3, First there's no stamina issue, and in terms of raw power, Ultimate gohan wins, because he is the strongest character besides Vegito at the end of DBZ.
I've always put ultimate gohan above ssj3 goku in terms if strength but i do think when goku goes into ssj3 he knows he can't toy around like he usually does so if he had to fight gohan, goku would be trying to end the fight quickly and so his fighting tactics will be able to overwhelm gohan's raw power and manage to beat gohan but it would be a difficult fight.
Anime can't change the story of the manga so if the anime said kid buu was the strongest and the manga never flat out said buuhan was it won't be illogical to say that kid buu is stronger
Well said. Fans who state the Manga DBZ & The Anime DBZ KAI go in two different directions, are lying. Bcuz they tell the same story. When it states that Goku is the strongest in the universe. The Statement is directly connected to The Buu Arc. Go Han fan boys are gonna find a way to try to twist this narrative into a direction that they want to go. Because they just keep on denying the truth. And what’s most hilarious is each new dragon ball contest that comes out that is genuinely canon states the same thing over and over again. Goku is The Strongest In The Universe in The Buu Arc. We notice to be pinpoint perfect. Because the cell arc states that Gohan is the strongest in the universe. What also shut down the Gohan fanboys. They keep on exclaiming with their life, the lie that Gohan was in a transformed state in the Buu Arc. That’s not true, Gohan is simply in his base form when all of his inner potential was unlocked in his base form, that is why he is unable to transform into any traditional SSJ state that he achieved previously throughout his life. The only way this works out is because he has no more enter potential to unlock he would have to wait for a long period of time in order for that inner potential to fill up again in order for him to be able to transform back into an SSJ & SSJ2. I stated this back in 2006. All the Dragon Ball Canon Content supports everything that I stated and say 100%. And second they have to go into guide books that have no relevancy, especially when they contradict the manga & anime. Because there is nothing in both the manga and the anime that backs of the claim that go on the stronger than Goku in the Buu Arc.
Even still, if people would actually put more thought into what they were watching instead of just blindly believing in every statements they should've realized that Goku and Kid Buu are weaker than Base Super Buu even in the anime. I knew this as an 8 year old anime only watcher. Y'all have no excuse. And yes, Buutenks directly stated that he was the strongest Buu up to that point in both the manga and the anime, which includes Kid Buu. Buuhan is clearly stronger than Buutenks. Therefore by default is the strongest Buu. Its not that hard to figure out.
@@darryltorres7302Super Buu is NOT pushing back a Spirit Bomb that has Ultimate Gohan's energy inside of it 😂 it makes perfect sense, you just deluded yourself into believing the opposite for so long that you can't accept it, so now you people are mad at Dragon Ball Daima 🤣
@@MajinUltraEgo-pv that argument has always been ridiculous. Just because Kid Buu physically push back the spirit bomb does not mean he scales to it. Or have you forgotten that same spirit bomb completely bodied Kid Buu the moment Goku had the energy to properly use it soon after? Come now its not that hard to see Kid Buu was able to push back the spirit bomb only because Goku was dead tired. I barely used my brain to figure out something so obvious.😒
Buu literally revealed an entirely new ability to beat Gohan that he never used up til that time, mf needed fusion to beat Gohan, needed the biggest plot in the show to beat Gohan, Gohan is the strongest non fused character no matter what retcons
Buu never interacts with SSJ3 Goku beyond fat Buu who Goku was letting live, and Kid Buu who beat up Goku and was pushing back against the energy of base Goku+all the z fighters spirit bomb.
With the way Ultimate Gohan manhandled Super Buu , i'd say he's far above SSJ3 goku . Super buu is literally Black Buu (who is far stronger than fat Buu) + fat Buu himself
I feel like this debate would be kinda similar to when MUI vs Beast. I feel like ultimate Gohan is stronger in terms of strength and speed, but due to Goku’s experienced and techniques which may give Goku more edge in winning this fight. Cuz in the end, I believe that even if Gohan is stronger, the gap between their strength would be very comparable. Also I believe that buuhan is stronger than kid buu. But kid buu is way more dangerous due to his evil childish nature. Interesting and good analysis vid as always brother. Keep up the good work man🎉
Kid Buu is stronger than all of the versions of Super Buu. Toriyama switches logic upside down like most anime where kids are stronger than adults. As a result Kid Buu is stronger than all of the adult versions of himself.
Regardless of which Buu is strongest, Goku needs the spirit bomb, *not* SSJ3, to defeat Kid Buu, so using the Buus to scale Goku & Gohan does not work. The story of Z is about Gohan coming into his own & becoming his own man. Even the manga put more focus on him than Goku after his introduction. It makes more narrative sense for him to be stronger. *Paradoxically* I always thought that Buuhan was weaker than Ultimate Gohan, like he only got a percentage of those that he absorbed. Thus, Ultimate Gohan is the strongest of the 4 followed by Kid buu, then Buuhan and finally Goku.
@@MajinUltraEgo-pvFrontiers base Sonic is 15d hyperversal immeasurable speed via string theory, beating Infinite who is thousand times stronger than Solaris(Solaris is 13d via string theory), restored time with his speed, gets stronger every second, escaped cyberspace which isn't even The End can't escape who is inevitable, infinite and etc, Super Sonic is 24d (25d mental attack) high hyperversal, Starfall Super Sonic is low outerversal, Cyber Super Sonic high outerversal bc he one shot not only vessel of The End but The End himself
Daima is happened at least a year after Buu saga. We all know if Gohan not really training after Buu saga. Meanwhile Goku always training everyday and experience multiple zenkai boost. So Gohan was stronger than ssj3 Goku in Buu saga, but no longer in Daima. Why? Because super Saiyan 3 is base power multiplied by 400 (8x stronger than ssj1). base Goku keep stronger and stronger after Buu saga, so ssj3 Goku will also stronger than "stuck" ultimate Gohan.
Here’s how you shut down this argument going into Daima. Goku said gohan has been studying since the buu sega. That’s clear going into DB super. Goku on the other hand, DOES NOT STOP TRAINING. It shouldn’t matter how strong gohan is if he doesn’t maintain that strength, you could naturally be good with a guitar but if you don’t practice it, you will start losing your skills. Goku at this point should if not be close to mastering SSJ3. if those two fought right now in Daima it would not make sense for ultimate gohan to come out on top. Why? Because dude has not been training.
@@ohhellwhereami2574 and Gohan literally says that he only trained special beam canon or maybe if you only train special beam canon, you can abtain new form, if so then why didn't Piccolo get any form when he mastered it
In the original japanese dub, no one said if kid buu is the strongest buu. And they also clearly said if ultimate gohan is the strongest mortal in the end of buu saga. idc about other dub. But difference in dubbing can cause story deviation. Thats happened a lot in original Dragonball. There are so many dubbing that way too different with original japanese.
Here are my brief thoughts: -Goku is reasonably strong by the end of the Boo Saga. His amped power is compared to a weaker Gohan and Gotenks, and he's noted by Vegeta to be stronger than before. -Goku may have said that Gohan's ki wasn't enough for Kid Boo, but remember, that was a tiny fraction of Gohan's ki. Significant, but not all of it. Plus, keep in mind that Kid Boo is unnaturally resilient. -There have been statements saying stuff like "After beating Majin Boo, Goku became the strongest" but no specification is made to when this was true. Remember, Gohan slacks. Goku does not. -V Jump made a statement saying that SSJ3 Goku = Gohan. They also made a statement that SSJ3 Goku = Gohan Boo. No specification was given for either version of Goku, and this is contradicted by something I'll say later. -The question where Kid Boo was claimed to be the strongest is a little misinterpreted. The person asking the questions made the insinuation that Kid Boo was the strongest, not Toriyama. Even then, Toriyama was a little forgetful, seeing as he believed that BoG should happen in the Boo Saga despite Gohan having Pan. Goku is powerful enough to be around the ballpark of people like Gotenks and Super Boo, but likely below Gohan. As I said, a Goku that had to put all of his ki into one attack would be equal to a Gohan and Gotenks that would likely not be in the realm of their normal selves. However, it seems that the gap between Goku and Gohan is small enough that Goku can surpass a weakening Gohan in only a few months. Gohan obviously wins due to his stamina, though. Even if Goku was the stronger one, he still wouldn't get past Gotenks Boo. The latter claimed to be the mightiest Majin; his previous form, Super Boo, showed awareness of Kid Boo and firmly separated the latter from himself, meaning he remembered being Kid Boo, and certainly surpassed Kid Boo's level by absorbing Gotenks. Goku was relative to Kid Boo, meaning that no matter what, Goku gets destroyed by Gotenks Boo.
No, it's not a real question. Gohan in his ultimate state is stronger than SSJ3 Goku by far. I seriously can't believe some people still can't let it go. SSJ3 Goku was a bit stronger than fat buu. He was holding back, but given his performance, not by that much. Ultimate Gohan absolutely humiliated Buu after TWO more transformations. It's mind blowing how some people are still trying to make the case that Goku was anywhere near Gohan's level at the end of the Buu Saga.
OMG this is just PURE copium 😂😂😂 Toriyama wrote this, Kid Buu is the strongest and he's been telling you this for decades, Daima was the final nail in the coffin for people who refuse to accept the truth 🤣🤣🤣
@@ohhellwhereami2574 Toriyama has even said in interviews, when the interviewer asked how "so what's up with you making the little form the strongest" and he doesn't correct him, he straight up says "well I did that to subvert people's expectations" and even then people STILL were in denial.
@@MajinUltraEgo-pv interviewer referenced kid goku as basis who isn't strongest at any point It was just a quote to highlight how despite the size they can be as fearsome
(in manga and anime) Kaiô Shin (explains that absorptions don't make boo stronger it depends if the person is good or evil) this boo is a pure incranation of the idea of evil... yes. he gained a herat bue to the absorbtions, which reduced his power... (boo pure > all boo) (Ultimate Gohan lost against super boo) (boo pure > super boo) (SSJ3 Goku win against boo pure) (SSJ3 Goku > Ultimate Gohan) + (GOKU IS #1 it's stated in the "El manga legendario" guidebook for DB that end of z goku is the strongest fighter. (goku end of z > Vegetto)
there's something wrong you stated in your video, ultimate gohan (this name is now official so i'd use it) was originally called "awakened potential gohan, this form doesn't draw all the strength of hi base form at once, it draws all of his current potential every form included and turns it into his base form
Unfortunately, we know Goku’s training post Buu Saga compared to boys that rarely train makes him superior Be in DBS, DBD, or the Tarble Special and so on
Why is this still a debate 😭 The daizenshuu calls Goku the strongest Toriyama calls Goku the strongest Goku is shown to one shot mystic gohan clone that is equal to the original, and this is while Goku is nerfed to 1/100th of his strength btw. Vegeta saying they can’t defeat super buu would just mean they are unable to defeat him in THAT current state. Also, they are LITERALLY trapped in his body. Also vegeta believes they wouldn’t be able to defeat super buu because they could still be as small as a plea even if they rescued the others.
Clone was clone not ultimate Strongest could refer to his spirit bomb included The short part is headcanon they know they would get back to original size actually buu fights them inside so they can gauge already and aren't confident
@@ohhellwhereami2574 They didn’t know they would grow back to their original sizes They believed they would have to fight super buu while still nerfed. The super buu they did fight wasn’t even just normal super buu but he was still buuhan. Gohan was still absorbed within him. Then we have the daizenshuu calling goku 3 times THE STRONGEST
@@Zeno1781 3 times strongest? While he's using spirit bomb ok bud Also they never said about thinking they would be still same size it was buus effect as far as they can tell , they didn't think about fighting super buu but more so running away Them assuming the lower size is permanent is headcanon at peak
@@ohhellwhereami2574 Goku vs kid : the strongest vs the strongest (before spirit bomb) Goku’s feelings are only understood by his fellow STRONGEST Nvm the 3rd time is eoz Goku But yea. 1 instant where Goku was called the strongest and the other was post spirit bomb
@@ohhellwhereami2574 Now for the super buu agenda 💀 This is what the daizenshuu has to say about that Goku, vegeta, and the original buu head into the final battle with the pure majin buu. If they were to lose here, then the universe would have NO FUTURE. Basically they are essentially saying Goku is essentially their last hope. They didn’t say gohan, gotenks, piccolo but mainly Goku. B But, but, it also says vegeta and fat majin buu. Vegeta and fat majin buu were far weaker than goku for them to help him.
@@ACertainMan Future Trunks says androids will invade on May 12, 3 years from age 764. He said he was 17 and came from 20 years in the Future. Chozenshu says an unspecified day in August is when Future Trunks and Goku meet. He says he will be born 2.5 years from when he warns them. This should be roughly February 767.. But this doesn't work for present Trunks. Or even Future Trunks as I'll show below. Chozenshu says Trunks was born in age766. He is 8 years old in Boo arc. Chozenshu also says that on May 7, 774 Budokai takes place. March 28 is the earliest listed date in 774 from Chozenshu. It says Gohan enrolled in Orange County High. Since Trunks is 8 in Boo arc, he was born before March 28, 766 but after January 1, 766. Yamucha wished for all the people who died that day (except bad ones) be revived. Dende then says save the other 2 wishes and the balls will only be stone for 4 months. Chozenshu says September 7, 774 is when Shenlong erases memories of Boo. The second wish is to make Boo good as there would be 2 wishes left since Yamucha only used 1. Dragon Balls would be stone at least 8 months. Meaning they would be stone until May 7 of 775. So Daima episode 1 takes place after January 1, 775 but before March 28 775. Since Future Trunks meets Goku in August of 764, Trunks saying he is born 2.5 years from then actually puts him born in February of Age 767. This means he was either mistaken and meant under 2.5 years (no more than 2 years 4 months) or Future Trunks was born later than Present Trunks. Since I think they're both supposed to be the same and February seems to sync up well, I'm placing Daima Episode 1 in February of Age 775.
Guides confirm Ultimate Gohan was stronger than Goku, at least at the time that Gohan attained Ultimate form. If Goku became stronger than Gohan later is a different matter. Goku could have become stronger by the end of the Buu Saga.
Daizenshuu 2 saying Gojan is the strongest warrior has his picture from when Kibito changes his clothes right before his battle with Super Boo. The only warriors left (goku was dead) were Goten, Trunks, and Piccolo. This doesn't have to be read the the Fandom seems to take it. Gohan is also called the Strongest under the Heavens, and Goku is legit dead up above Heaven. Along with Vegeta legit calling Goku number 1. SEG says Goku thinks Gohan surpassed him. This is prior to Goku being Revived which gave him a boost.
@@ACertainMan me when i believe goku got zenkai after a few punches from buuhan to give him more than fusion level with rival boost of power boost as valid
Gohan being stronger than Goku is the biggest myth. It’s been stated at the end that Goku is the strongest. Plus vegeta in the end says that Goku is the strongest warrior
No, vegeta says that in relation to himself "you're number 1 " Cuz he's not Meanwhile same vegeta was annoyed when goku let Gohan die in the explosion of earth
I think gohan came out of the buu saga as the strongest but he did get surpassed throughout it Ultimate gohan did get surpassed by goku and vegeta but I think the zenkai he got after the whole buutenks and absorption thing made him the strongest that's why he is referred to as the strongest unfused character But in daima .that goku and vegeta surpassed gohan .it makes sense since gohan stops training and goku didnt Also I don't believe gohan ever reached sajb level bcz he lost to toppo and saganbo or whatever he was called both so much weaker than ssjb
Goku didnt even come close to going all out against fat buu, he later told piccolo he coulda killed fat buu if he tried but didnt want too. Because its not his place. But its still really hard to say whos more powerful at their maximum.
"Majin Buu the Most Powerful Enemy in History." Yes. But its not called "kid buu" i called Majin buu .. because its includes all buus. In Japanese the general name for buu is Majin Buu. Fatbuu = Zen no Buu. Evil buu = Aku no Buu Super Buu = Cho Buu Kid buu = Jinsui Buu. All buu = Majin Buu The anime and manga in Japanese are pricise with that names.
That's right Goku was so strong at Supersaiyan 3 he had to fuse to fight Buuhan but fights KidBuu at Supersaiyan 3 Ss3 Goku >Ultimate Gohan is completely bullshit
Akira after hearing these nonsense arguments for so long gave us SUPER which confirms goku>everyone and kidbuu>every other buu now you’ve gave us daima and showed us in deeper detail that Goku>everyone kidbuu>all buus
you say "finally confirmed" like he wasnt always above ultimate gohan I think Gohan was stronger than Goku at the start of the buu saga, but Goku likely didnt stay stagnant. Elder kai did give him 75,000 years worth of life energy, and a guide straight up says he became on par with him (Which is supported by him reacting to buutenks in the manga) along with him fighting kid buu who is stated stronger than super buu by dragon ball forever, goku himself, with kid buu also being implied capable of killing everyone on earth had he won. And before I hear "goku ducked base super buu he said he needed to fuse) Goku was not at full power inside buu, as its stated by both daizenshuu and super buu himself that their size lowered their power, and goku would have no reason to believe going outside would revert him back to normal (he even seemed shocked gohan and co reverted to normal size so he clearly didnt know)
This debate is so dumb and over with. SS3 Goku literally fought a smaller AND weaker version of Super Buu. The ONLY reason he was considered more dangerous was because Kid Buu lacked any sort of reason or logic. Use your brains, people. SS3 could only surpass Fat Buu and Super Buu needed a SS3 fusion to beat Gohan. A SS3 fusion that was Stronger than Goku's SS3. Gohan slaps SS3 Goku, fuck the retcons. Its literally shown to us that Gohan is stronger.
Either dragon ball daima takes place in a alternate timeline or dragon Ball is just full of inconsistencies and retcons because in dragon ball daima supreme kia and kibito Kai say the reason that they were able to defuse was because they got buu to absorb them and that the gas inside buu effects potara fusion causing them to defuse and use as DBZ fans always thought this to be the case because it happened to vegito in Z but this gets retcon in dragon ball super and they tell use the reason why the potara fusion wore off with Goku and Vegeta is because potara fusion is only permanent for kais and for mortals it only last a hour and in dragon ball super supreme Kai and Kabuto Kai state they made a wish with dragon balls to defuse them so either dima is a alternate timeline and don't tie in to super or dragon ball is just inconsistent
Goku's mssj × kaoken makes ssj3, Mystic, Ssj3 Gotenks irrelevant and obsolete. A fpssj3 ×kaoken would make Goku 200× fpssj. Hed obliterate everone in the Buu Arc
In Anime Goku ez is stronger but Manga is complicated but in my opinion Goku SS3>Ultimate Gohan and in Anime Kid buu is stronger then Buuhan and for manga i think that Akira said that smallest buu is strongest and in manga there is no big feat for Buuhan only that buuhan is stronger then goku
Vegeta if he was literal: So kakrot you surpass once for all you're number wait? We aren't even strongest? Kid buu? He's just a mindless scum, Gohan? Yes he is superior both previously, present and most likely in future, gotenks? Fuse being count well judging by how much they enjoy fusing i might not even get close to their power ? Mr satan has God ki wtf***!???!
I've said this before and I'm gonna say it again IN ANIME kid Buu > Buuhan SSJ3 Goku > Ultimate Gohan IN MANGA Buuhan > Kid Buu Ultimate Gohan > SSJ3 Goku This will ALWAYS REMAIN A FACT
No it dont.. Its never stated that Kid buu is the strongest of them. Buuhan is far stronger than any form of Buu. Kid buu is the most evil and unpredicable. the most dangerous.
OMG this is just PURE copium 😂😂😂 Toriyama wrote this, Kid Buu & Goku were the strongest and he's been telling you this for decades, Daima was the final nail in the coffin for people like you who refuse to accept the truth 🤣🤣🤣
OMG this is just PURE copium 😂😂😂 Toriyama wrote this, Kid Buu & Goku were the strongest and he's been telling you this for decades, Daima was the final nail in the coffin for people like you who refuse to accept the truth 🤣🤣
@@MajinUltraEgo-pv Goku was the strongest in Z because of the spirit bomb not because of any transformation he held plus in Super Toriyama stated Gohan to be stronger and even I can give multiple proofs to extremely toxic Goku fans like you 🤣🤣🤣🤣 and for your information the raw power and battle ability of Ultimate Mystic is higher than Super Saiyan 3 and it's totally dependent upon Goku's base form that if it's higher than Gohan's base currently to a great extent them SS3 Goku can win
@@SonZackSSJ9k Its Stated in the Manga. Buutenks against Gohan. Gohan got healed by dende and gohan dont get stronger from his injuries. Its stated in Super Manga that Goku and Vegeta reached their peak in Zenkai boost, because Zenkais are based on physical growth and their bodys are already on their peak. Their is Physical strengh and ki based strengh in dragonball. After Namek no saiyan get a really noticeable Zenkai boost. Ironic Cell gets it because he is not on his Physical peak. Same with Black, who dont know how gokus body works. thing about it.. Vegeta vs C18 = No Zenkai Vegeta vs Cell = No Zenkai Gokus vs C19 = No Zenkai Gokus vs Heart Virus = No Zenkai
Super Saiyan 3 Goku Vs Super Buu
Your thoughts?
Smash a like on the video!
Goku gets destroyed by any version of Super Buu, he straight up says he doesn't stand a chance against Buu like that... Even when confronted by piccolo buu, Goku says that GOHAN can handle Buu now....
If we're going by the anime Kid buu is the strongest buu and goku is somewhat able to fight kid buu meaning rip super buu. if its the manga buuhan is the strongest buu and i'm not too familiar with the manga scaling.
@@cryingmetal9349 it really doesn't matter if its the anime or manga, Buuhan is still the strongest Buu in both versions...
In the anime, SS3 Gotenks is still stronger than SS3 Goku and then Ultimate Gohan is stronger than SS3 Gotenks and nothing changes that... It doesn't matter that the anime makes an incorrect statement, the scaling still exists and there's a bunch of other statements that contradict the incorrect anime statement.
All you can really argue is which version of Gotenks is stronger than Goku, most would say Base Gotenks, but either way SS3 Gotenks is definitely stronger than SS3 Goku and Ultimate Gohan is even stronger...
@@reptilian_geneticist In the anime Goku an off guard goku tanks an hit from illusion ultimate gohan who has the same power as gohan (stated in the guides and by goku himself). He goes ssj then 1 taps that gohan. Kid buu is stated by everyone and everything to be the strongest buu. Not only that Gohan is scared of kid buu coming to earth (If he was stronger he wouldn't be that scared) and theres much much more. The anime is completely different to the manga when it comes to scaling.
@@cryingmetal9349 Nope... Goku is fighting an ILLUSION of Gohan inside of Buu's mind 🤣 None of it is real, its all just a figment of Buus imagination... and in that very same episode Goku says that he and Vegeta stand no chance against Super Buu...
SS3 Gotenks is stronger than SS3 Goku and Ultimate Gohan is stronger than SS3 Gotenks and nothing changes that...
Goku is never stated or inferred to have gotten any stronger. To say that he did is pure headcannon nonsense... and Goku would need to have gotten dozens of times stronger in order to fight kid buu (if kid buu was actually stronger than Buuhan lol)
The narrator literally says shenron will grant any wish is requested just before calling goku the strongest warrior . Narrator lies to hype up the universe of dragon ball for the new viewers , thats what it is.
Thats how it works.
Goku is often gonna be referred to as the strongest no matter what.
Same way Beerus will get called unbeatable even though The Angels exist
Or, Goku is just stronger than Gohan..since he compared to Kid Buu who was stated to be the strongest buu numerous times
@@newhybrid101yeah fax
@@ItsB1998 read the manga or watch db kai, hes never actually stated to be the strongest boo, hes just the most dangerous one cuz he gives no shits unlike the others. thats an anime only thing that makes 0 sense
@@onlygens1502seems like YOU didn't watch DB Kai, I literally have the statements uploaded from DB Kai 😂 they did NOT just say the most dangerous, they said he's the most powerful and they said this MULTIPLE TIMES, they said he was the most powerful more times than they said he was the most dangerous 💀 DB fans making up lies because they can't stand their precious Gohan getting one shotted by Kid Buu.
Piccolo said he had never felt power like Gohan's at that time. And that was after seeing Goku and even SS3 Gotenks in action. That and taking into account the stamina drain of SS3, I would bet on Gohan in any case. Especially if he's in top form.
Yeah but what he felt was a suppressed super Saiyan 3.
@@atari_hmb I'm not sure if that matters
@@derekosgood3230 It does absolutely.
@@charzanboo9940 No not really
@@derekosgood3230 An empty, three-word reply isn't a counterargument but a concession 😂
SS3 Goku might be stronger now; but I can’t wrap my head around Gotenks SS3 being weaker than Goku, so I can’t fathom SS3 Goku being stronger than Ultimate Gohan during the Boo arc for sure
Well right now SS3 Goku definitely isn't stronger than Gohan lol he's gonna need more than that to beat current Gohan for sure.
@@derekosgood3230 oh you mean like NOW in Super? If so, then Yeah you’re probably right
Goku stronger than gotenks
@@JACQUEZ23 During Boo? No; not with the fusion multiplier & the SS3 multiplier. Now? Yes.
However, Goku was far more an experienced fighter than Gotenks - but Gotenks would definitely have been stronger
Take it like this. At SSJ3 gotenks was struggling against super buu. Meanwhile vegito barely needed SSj to defeat Buuhan. Goku and vegeta were natural stronger than goten and trunks. Even fused gotenks power would not eclipse SSJ3 Goku. Now this is daima. Goku has been training since the last episode of the buu sega. Gotten and trunks not so much. They are kids, they are more focused on kid stuff. At this point in Daima we can assume the boys probably hadn’t fused since the buu sega, so Goku right now in Daima should be far stronger than SSJ3 gotenks. And if gohan has done nothing but study since then, Goku should be far stronger than him too.
The core issue with this debate lies in the use of sources released after the original manga or anime. If we’re going to compare two characters fairly, it should be based solely on the information available at the time of the original story’s release.
Even if the original creator is involved in these newer sources, it doesn’t change the fact that writers often contradict their previous work without much concern. Does anyone really believe Akira Toriyama or the writing team is preoccupied with maintaining perfect consistency across decades of content?
This debate reminds me of the Potara vs. Fusion Dance argument. When the original series was airing, it was made explicitly clear that the Potara fusion was far superior. It wasn’t until Dragon Ball Super came along with its questionable retcons that this once-settled matter was reopened. If not for these changes, the debate wouldn’t even exist today, except among a small group of fans.
Now, regarding Goku vs. Gohan during the Buu arc-there is overwhelming evidence that Goku isn’t even on the same level as Gotenks, let alone Gohan. Despite the overwhelming evidence evidence in favor of Gohan. You had individuals arguing in favor of Goku nearly 3 decades ago now ,
At this point, I’m convinced that some people are simply biased toward their favorite character. No matter how much evidence exists to the contrary, they will always find a way to argue in favor of their preferred character.
As long as Goku's the monkey demon to beat then hes by default the strongest. Its the same narrative logic that allows Beerus/ gods of destruction to being the moving goal post regardless of being surpassed in power by fusion and UI.
OMG this is just PURE copium 😂😂😂 Toriyama wrote this, Kid Buu is the strongest and he's been telling you this for decades, Daima was the final nail in the coffin for people who refuse to accept the truth 🤣🤣
@@MajinUltraEgo-pv akira never explicitly states kid buu is stronger during the time it 1st originally aired ,
As I said I can tell right away when someone is
Clearly biased t
@@MajinUltraEgo-pv
On top of that, buu gohan was able to fight (though clearly on the back foot) vegito were as kid buu fought more or less on par with a slight edge with super saiyan 3 Goku
GT Gohan did keep up with his training. He trained for the 15 years after Buu leading into GT.
He did, but we also got a gt writer interview about him not being a super warrior anymore like he allegedly was back then, mentally
So for SS2 Z Gohan to go from Fat Buu-ish level to Base GT Gohan being relative to Base General Rilldo who is stronger than Kid Buu should say a lot
But he still was weaker than base goku and ubb
@@MegaMachiOnlinehe was still underwhelming though he was too far behind Goku
@@johnzahm193 tbh if he was stacking ss on ultimate (as his base) it'd be worse, because buuhan wasn't even worth a total of 3 gotenks, and rilldo was being compared to buu XD
at least we can say regular gohan got over 400x stronger with ss still in his back pocket instead of 3 - 6x stronger bare minimum
Gt is ass and non canon so who cares 😂
The only way Ssj3 Goku is stronger Ultimate Gohan if you believe Kid Buu is stronger than Super Buu. Which wouldn't make sense because Goku after Buuhan went back to Super Buu Goku said him AND Vegeta would still not have a chance.
Meanwhile he was confident that he could solo Kid Buu, and Ultimate Gohan was boxing up Super Buu and made him run.While also feeling the need to absorb Gotenks and Piccolo to even have a chance at beating Gohan.
Super Buu is NOT pushing back a Spirit Bomb that has Ultimate Gohan's energy inside of it 😂 it makes perfect sense, you just deluded yourself into believing the opposite for so long that you can't accept it
No they straight up say when Super Buu transforms into buff Buu then into Kid Boo that he’s getting stronger.
Also Goku and even Vegeta were confident they could take Kid Boo, but they were clearly wrong. They underestimated him.
@sincere0727 I literally read chapter 506-510 nowhere do they say he's getting stronger, they just make note that he's changing again
@@Zeff0 I love how you replied to him and ignored my comment because you can't counter it 😂 also, Goku was hiding the extent of his power, Vegeta did not even believe Goku when he said that, Vegeta was able to see Goku's true power when they were Vegito 🤣👉🍭
@@Zeff0 Go back and look at the end of chapter 507.
Saying tht Buuhan is weaker than Kid Buu doesn't make any sense at all. It discredits your entire video.
Supreme Kai said that Kid Buu was "the most dangerous" version of Buu, not the strongest. That statement has always been misinterpreted by fans. Why did Goku and Vegeta fuse then if they had been able to fight Buuhan by themselves? Nonesensical.
I mean…I have never said Buuhan is weaker than Kid Buu. 🤗
All that matters is who was stronger during the Buu fights, not who was stronger the next day or a year later....
Gotenks was already stronger than Goku and then Ultimate Gohan was stronger than Gotenks... There's really nothing to debate, that is the narrative of the story.
@@reptilian_geneticist Wrong. Daima and DBS both take place within DBZ, so it does matter.
@@charzanboo9940 They take place during the 10 year time skip after the Buu saga but before the Tournament where Goku fights Uub. Nobody cares how strong Gohan is at the end of Z... The "argument" is how strong ultimate Gohan and SS3 Goku were during the buu saga (which took place over the span of 1 day). So like I said, it doesn't matter.
@@reptilian_geneticist This dude has been making stupid comments all day lol he's looking for anyone to argue with and you're right. Daima literally doesn't matter one way or the other to the overall debate.
@@reptilian_geneticist Which is still within DBZ💀. 9-12 months after the Buu saga is very relevant.
@@derekosgood3230 Ad hominen attacks, the goto of the defeated 😂
The eternal debate lol
Only cause most people only watched the anime.
I myself thought SSJ3 Goku was stronger...when i was 9 lol
@@newhybrid101 it's even confirmed in Daima that's not a coincidence 😂 trying to write ✍️ it off as a mistranslation of the anime is pure copium
@@MajinUltraEgo-pvdragon balls can grant *ANY* wish "-daima probably 🤡
Even in the anime Goku tells Vegeta they don’t stand a chance against BASE Super Buu if they leave his body and decide to fight him. That statement alone should tell you Ultimate Gohan > SSJ3 Goku. Even SSJ3 Gotenks is stronger than that version of Goku. If we’re going by the original manga then Gohan, Super Buu and Gotenks is astronomically stronger than SSJ3 Goku 😂
Goku just got stronger bro. It's really simple
Goku and Vegeta are at 1/100 percent of their power when they say that
When Buutenks defuses into Buu piccolo Goku verbatim reverts to his base in front of him and mocks him about how he can’t beat him now.
And Vegeta didn't believe him at all 😂😂😂 he saw the true extent of Goku's power when they were Vegito.
I don't take Daima seriously personally
It might mean Goku is stronger now but thats about it
Toriyamas recent word doesnt outrank his original manga,which clearly portrayed Super Buu,Gotenks and Gohan as far above Goku
That is not even a debate.
You cant read the manga and think otherwise
That was PRIME Toriyama.
Daima is by an old and confused Toriyama who just wrote whatever.
And i doubt he even remembered the scaling in the Buu saga after all these decades,a lot of fans dont remember,you expect TORIYAMA to remember?
Ofcourse he is gonna say the main character is the strongest after decades
Nothing has been changed because it cannot be changed.
"retcons" are an excuse by people that dont like the past
But what happened has happened.
Buu Saga Ultimate Gohan>>>Buu Saga SSJ3 Gohan
The original manga is above everything else.
Frankly i am disappointed Rev even considered it instead of casually laughing at the idea and moving on
If we are talking about things from the original manga vs what old senile toriyama later wrote its not even close.
Its basically word of god vs washed out word of god
Also there is no evidence Toriyama wrote this specific line.
The producers of movies&animes etc throw a lot of stuff in to fill out time and all that.
Toriyama writes the script as in what is happening in the story etc.
Whats more valid?
The manga as it was being written by Toriyama literally at that moment?
Or
Some offhand comment decades later?
Haha, the cope. Toriyama contributed to Daima directly. SSJ3 Goku > Ultimate Gohan. End of story.
@charzanboo9940 If it's after the buu saga, then it doesn't matter lol but during the buu saga, no Goku was not stronger. And the debate was only during that time when there was no Daima. Gohan is studying again in Daima. So if Goku is stronger, so what
@@derekosgood3230 Daima supposedly takes place 9-10 months after the end of Z, which isn't a very long time for Ultimate Gohan to be substantial weaker or unskilled. In comparison, 7 years was required, between the end of the Cell saga and the beginning of the Buu saga, for SSJ2 Gohan to become a bit weaker 🤦🏽♂️
@@charzanboo9940 If Gohan stopped training for 10 months, assuming your time frame is accurate, and Goku continues to train for those 10 months, it's long enough.
@@derekosgood3230 First, Revolushane in the video quoted 9-10 months. Second, if 9-10 months of training was all it took for SSJ3 Goku to surpass Ultimate Gohan, then the *supposed* gap was inconsequential at best to begin with, lmao.
Um, No
Ultimate gohan is much stronger than SSJ3, First there's no stamina issue, and in terms of raw power, Ultimate gohan wins, because he is the strongest character besides Vegito at the end of DBZ.
I've always put ultimate gohan above ssj3 goku in terms if strength but i do think when goku goes into ssj3 he knows he can't toy around like he usually does so if he had to fight gohan, goku would be trying to end the fight quickly and so his fighting tactics will be able to overwhelm gohan's raw power and manage to beat gohan but it would be a difficult fight.
Anime can't change the story of the manga so if the anime said kid buu was the strongest and the manga never flat out said buuhan was it won't be illogical to say that kid buu is stronger
Well said. Fans who state the Manga DBZ & The Anime DBZ KAI go in two different directions, are lying. Bcuz they tell the same story.
When it states that Goku is the strongest in the universe. The Statement is directly connected to The Buu Arc. Go Han fan boys are gonna find a way to try to twist this narrative into a direction that they want to go. Because they just keep on denying the truth.
And what’s most hilarious is each new dragon ball contest that comes out that is genuinely canon states the same thing over and over again. Goku is The Strongest In The Universe in The Buu Arc. We notice to be pinpoint perfect. Because the cell arc states that Gohan is the strongest in the universe.
What also shut down the Gohan fanboys. They keep on exclaiming with their life, the lie that Gohan was in a transformed state in the Buu Arc. That’s not true, Gohan is simply in his base form when all of his inner potential was unlocked in his base form, that is why he is unable to transform into any traditional SSJ state that he achieved previously throughout his life.
The only way this works out is because he has no more enter potential to unlock he would have to wait for a long period of time in order for that inner potential to fill up again in order for him to be able to transform back into an SSJ & SSJ2. I stated this back in 2006. All the Dragon Ball Canon Content supports everything that I stated and say 100%.
And second they have to go into guide books that have no relevancy, especially when they contradict the manga & anime. Because there is nothing in both the manga and the anime that backs of the claim that go on the stronger than Goku in the Buu Arc.
Even still, if people would actually put more thought into what they were watching instead of just blindly believing in every statements they should've realized that Goku and Kid Buu are weaker than Base Super Buu even in the anime. I knew this as an 8 year old anime only watcher. Y'all have no excuse. And yes, Buutenks directly stated that he was the strongest Buu up to that point in both the manga and the anime, which includes Kid Buu. Buuhan is clearly stronger than Buutenks. Therefore by default is the strongest Buu. Its not that hard to figure out.
@@darryltorres7302Super Buu is NOT pushing back a Spirit Bomb that has Ultimate Gohan's energy inside of it 😂 it makes perfect sense, you just deluded yourself into believing the opposite for so long that you can't accept it, so now you people are mad at Dragon Ball Daima 🤣
@@MajinUltraEgo-pv that argument has always been ridiculous. Just because Kid Buu physically push back the spirit bomb does not mean he scales to it. Or have you forgotten that same spirit bomb completely bodied Kid Buu the moment Goku had the energy to properly use it soon after? Come now its not that hard to see Kid Buu was able to push back the spirit bomb only because Goku was dead tired. I barely used my brain to figure out something so obvious.😒
@@jordanglasper1064Gohan is type of guy surpass God ki just with his potential, stop it goku fan
Buu literally revealed an entirely new ability to beat Gohan that he never used up til that time, mf needed fusion to beat Gohan, needed the biggest plot in the show to beat Gohan, Gohan is the strongest non fused character no matter what retcons
Buu never interacts with SSJ3 Goku beyond fat Buu who Goku was letting live, and Kid Buu who beat up Goku and was pushing back against the energy of base Goku+all the z fighters spirit bomb.
With the way Ultimate Gohan manhandled Super Buu , i'd say he's far above SSJ3 goku . Super buu is literally Black Buu (who is far stronger than fat Buu) + fat Buu himself
I feel like this debate would be kinda similar to when MUI vs Beast. I feel like ultimate Gohan is stronger in terms of strength and speed, but due to Goku’s experienced and techniques which may give Goku more edge in winning this fight. Cuz in the end, I believe that even if Gohan is stronger, the gap between their strength would be very comparable. Also I believe that buuhan is stronger than kid buu. But kid buu is way more dangerous due to his evil childish nature. Interesting and good analysis vid as always brother. Keep up the good work man🎉
Kid Buu is stronger than all of the versions of Super Buu. Toriyama switches logic upside down like most anime where kids are stronger than adults. As a result Kid Buu is stronger than all of the adult versions of himself.
Regardless of which Buu is strongest, Goku needs the spirit bomb, *not* SSJ3, to defeat Kid Buu, so using the Buus to scale Goku & Gohan does not work.
The story of Z is about Gohan coming into his own & becoming his own man. Even the manga put more focus on him than Goku after his introduction. It makes more narrative sense for him to be stronger.
*Paradoxically* I always thought that Buuhan was weaker than Ultimate Gohan, like he only got a percentage of those that he absorbed. Thus, Ultimate Gohan is the strongest of the 4 followed by Kid buu, then Buuhan and finally Goku.
Wtf you're saying
@@ohhellwhereami2574 some was the truth but some was like WTF
So dumb ultimate gohan is without a doubt more powerful than ssj3 goku
Nope 🤣 you deluded yourself for so long so Toriyama finally decided to shut down your false agenda 😂👉🍭
@@MajinUltraEgo-pvFrontiers base Sonic is 15d hyperversal immeasurable speed via string theory, beating Infinite who is thousand times stronger than Solaris(Solaris is 13d via string theory), restored time with his speed, gets stronger every second, escaped cyberspace which isn't even The End can't escape who is inevitable, infinite and etc, Super Sonic is 24d (25d mental attack) high hyperversal, Starfall Super Sonic is low outerversal, Cyber Super Sonic high outerversal bc he one shot not only vessel of The End but The End himself
@@MajinUltraEgo-pvbase Sonic > dbs verse
Daima is happened at least a year after Buu saga. We all know if Gohan not really training after Buu saga.
Meanwhile Goku always training everyday and experience multiple zenkai boost.
So Gohan was stronger than ssj3 Goku in Buu saga, but no longer in Daima.
Why? Because super Saiyan 3 is base power multiplied by 400 (8x stronger than ssj1).
base Goku keep stronger and stronger after Buu saga, so ssj3 Goku will also stronger than "stuck" ultimate Gohan.
Here’s how you shut down this argument going into Daima. Goku said gohan has been studying since the buu sega. That’s clear going into DB super. Goku on the other hand, DOES NOT STOP TRAINING. It shouldn’t matter how strong gohan is if he doesn’t maintain that strength, you could naturally be good with a guitar but if you don’t practice it, you will start losing your skills. Goku at this point should if not be close to mastering SSJ3. if those two fought right now in Daima it would not make sense for ultimate gohan to come out on top. Why? Because dude has not been training.
Gohan fans say Gohan doesn't need to train 😂
@@MajinUltraEgo-pv *cough* *cough* Beast asspul *cough*
@@GOAT-ganyuhe literally trained, aspull you
@@ohhellwhereami2574 and Gohan literally says that he only trained special beam canon or maybe if you only train special beam canon, you can abtain new form, if so then why didn't Piccolo get any form when he mastered it
@@ohhellwhereami2574 sorry for later answer, i was just playing db legends
In the original japanese dub, no one said if kid buu is the strongest buu.
And they also clearly said if ultimate gohan is the strongest mortal in the end of buu saga.
idc about other dub. But difference in dubbing can cause story deviation.
Thats happened a lot in original Dragonball. There are so many dubbing that way too different with original japanese.
Here are my brief thoughts:
-Goku is reasonably strong by the end of the Boo Saga. His amped power is compared to a weaker Gohan and Gotenks, and he's noted by Vegeta to be stronger than before.
-Goku may have said that Gohan's ki wasn't enough for Kid Boo, but remember, that was a tiny fraction of Gohan's ki. Significant, but not all of it. Plus, keep in mind that Kid Boo is unnaturally resilient.
-There have been statements saying stuff like "After beating Majin Boo, Goku became the strongest" but no specification is made to when this was true. Remember, Gohan slacks. Goku does not.
-V Jump made a statement saying that SSJ3 Goku = Gohan. They also made a statement that SSJ3 Goku = Gohan Boo. No specification was given for either version of Goku, and this is contradicted by something I'll say later.
-The question where Kid Boo was claimed to be the strongest is a little misinterpreted. The person asking the questions made the insinuation that Kid Boo was the strongest, not Toriyama. Even then, Toriyama was a little forgetful, seeing as he believed that BoG should happen in the Boo Saga despite Gohan having Pan.
Goku is powerful enough to be around the ballpark of people like Gotenks and Super Boo, but likely below Gohan. As I said, a Goku that had to put all of his ki into one attack would be equal to a Gohan and Gotenks that would likely not be in the realm of their normal selves. However, it seems that the gap between Goku and Gohan is small enough that Goku can surpass a weakening Gohan in only a few months. Gohan obviously wins due to his stamina, though.
Even if Goku was the stronger one, he still wouldn't get past Gotenks Boo. The latter claimed to be the mightiest Majin; his previous form, Super Boo, showed awareness of Kid Boo and firmly separated the latter from himself, meaning he remembered being Kid Boo, and certainly surpassed Kid Boo's level by absorbing Gotenks. Goku was relative to Kid Boo, meaning that no matter what, Goku gets destroyed by Gotenks Boo.
A lot of this is super interesting especially with goku and gohan father son being compared to there forms with super sayian 3 and ultimate gohan. 😊
Nice match up
No, it's not a real question. Gohan in his ultimate state is stronger than SSJ3 Goku by far. I seriously can't believe some people still can't let it go. SSJ3 Goku was a bit stronger than fat buu. He was holding back, but given his performance, not by that much. Ultimate Gohan absolutely humiliated Buu after TWO more transformations. It's mind blowing how some people are still trying to make the case that Goku was anywhere near Gohan's level at the end of the Buu Saga.
OMG this is just PURE copium 😂😂😂 Toriyama wrote this, Kid Buu is the strongest and he's been telling you this for decades, Daima was the final nail in the coffin for people who refuse to accept the truth 🤣🤣🤣
@@MajinUltraEgo-pvtoriyama ain't wrote shi regarding this, kid buu has God ki so he has more potential for power not more power currently
@@ohhellwhereami2574 Toriyama has even said in interviews, when the interviewer asked how "so what's up with you making the little form the strongest" and he doesn't correct him, he straight up says "well I did that to subvert people's expectations" and even then people STILL were in denial.
@@MajinUltraEgo-pv interviewer referenced kid goku as basis who isn't strongest at any point
It was just a quote to highlight how despite the size they can be as fearsome
Kid by us never mentioned to be the strongest. He’s the most dangerous
RevoluShane deserves 100k subscriber at least
Fellow Kid Buu = strongest Buu acknowledgers, we've won.
No, you are delusional
Kid buu is strongest potential since God ki
Not strongest literally
Lil bro, put the fries in the bag
@@ohhellwhereami2574 You have to cope I'm afraid
@@ItsB1998 cope about how you're mentally insane ?
@@ItsB1998 cope about how you're mentally insane ?
(in manga and anime) Kaiô Shin (explains that absorptions don't make boo stronger it depends if the person is good or evil)
this boo is a pure incranation of the idea of evil...
yes. he gained a herat bue to the absorbtions, which reduced his power...
(boo pure > all boo) (Ultimate Gohan lost against super boo) (boo pure > super boo) (SSJ3 Goku win against boo pure) (SSJ3 Goku > Ultimate Gohan)
+ (GOKU IS #1 it's stated in the "El manga legendario" guidebook for DB that end of z goku is the strongest fighter. (goku end of z > Vegetto)
They let us know that right off the bat, now bro is nowhere to be found 😆. I do hope we see what he’s up to at some point though.
Goku fans remind me of Jordan fans still living in the past
there's something wrong you stated in your video, ultimate gohan (this name is now official so i'd use it) was originally called "awakened potential gohan, this form doesn't draw all the strength of hi base form at once, it draws all of his current potential every form included and turns it into his base form
Nah ultimate is canonized don't worry
@@AbyssalBlue24 all of this is total headcannon
Unfortunately, we know Goku’s training post Buu Saga compared to boys that rarely train makes him superior
Be in DBS, DBD, or the Tarble Special and so on
Bruh this debate is exhausting af at this point 😂😂
Only because people REFUSE to accept Kid Buu was the strongest 🤣 Toriyama had to shut up the people in denial
@@MajinUltraEgo-pvyou ain't talking like buddy
Why is this still a debate 😭
The daizenshuu calls Goku the strongest
Toriyama calls Goku the strongest
Goku is shown to one shot mystic gohan clone that is equal to the original, and this is while Goku is nerfed to 1/100th of his strength btw.
Vegeta saying they can’t defeat super buu would just mean they are unable to defeat him in THAT current state. Also, they are LITERALLY trapped in his body.
Also vegeta believes they wouldn’t be able to defeat super buu because they could still be as small as a plea even if they rescued the others.
Clone was clone not ultimate
Strongest could refer to his spirit bomb included
The short part is headcanon they know they would get back to original size actually buu fights them inside so they can gauge already and aren't confident
@@ohhellwhereami2574
They didn’t know they would grow back to their original sizes
They believed they would have to fight super buu while still nerfed. The super buu they did fight wasn’t even just normal super buu but he was still buuhan. Gohan was still absorbed within him.
Then we have the daizenshuu calling goku 3 times THE STRONGEST
@@Zeno1781 3 times strongest? While he's using spirit bomb ok bud
Also they never said about thinking they would be still same size it was buus effect as far as they can tell , they didn't think about fighting super buu but more so running away
Them assuming the lower size is permanent is headcanon at peak
@@ohhellwhereami2574
Goku vs kid : the strongest vs the strongest (before spirit bomb)
Goku’s feelings are only understood by his fellow STRONGEST
Nvm the 3rd time is eoz Goku
But yea. 1 instant where Goku was called the strongest and the other was post spirit bomb
@@ohhellwhereami2574
Now for the super buu agenda 💀
This is what the daizenshuu has to say about that
Goku, vegeta, and the original buu head into the final battle with the pure majin buu. If they were to lose here, then the universe would have NO FUTURE.
Basically they are essentially saying Goku is essentially their last hope. They didn’t say gohan, gotenks, piccolo but mainly Goku. B
But, but, it also says vegeta and fat majin buu.
Vegeta and fat majin buu were far weaker than goku for them to help him.
I recommend you watch this video called "SSJ3 Goku vs Ultimate Gohan: the honest truth" from a RUclipsr named "MrPerfectCell"
MrPerfectCell doesn't write Dragon Ball.
@@MajinUltraEgo-pv no but he provides the fact to support his argument and he does it pretty well if you ask me.
Daima episode 1 takes place between January of 775 and March 28 of 775
We have exact dates? Where did you get them from out of curiosity
@@ACertainMan Future Trunks says androids will invade on May 12, 3 years from age 764. He said he was 17 and came from 20 years in the Future.
Chozenshu says an unspecified day in August is when Future Trunks and Goku meet.
He says he will be born 2.5 years from when he warns them. This should be roughly February 767.. But this doesn't work for present Trunks. Or even Future Trunks as I'll show below.
Chozenshu says Trunks was born in age766. He is 8 years old in Boo arc. Chozenshu also says that on May 7, 774 Budokai takes place.
March 28 is the earliest listed date in 774 from Chozenshu. It says Gohan enrolled in Orange County High.
Since Trunks is 8 in Boo arc, he was born before March 28, 766 but after January 1, 766.
Yamucha wished for all the people who died that day (except bad ones) be revived. Dende then says save the other 2 wishes and the balls will only be stone for 4 months.
Chozenshu says September 7, 774 is when Shenlong erases memories of Boo. The second wish is to make Boo good as there would be 2 wishes left since Yamucha only used 1.
Dragon Balls would be stone at least 8 months. Meaning they would be stone until May 7 of 775.
So Daima episode 1 takes place after January 1, 775 but before March 28 775.
Since Future Trunks meets Goku in August of 764, Trunks saying he is born 2.5 years from then actually puts him born in February of Age 767. This means he was either mistaken and meant under 2.5 years (no more than 2 years 4 months) or Future Trunks was born later than Present Trunks. Since I think they're both supposed to be the same and February seems to sync up well, I'm placing Daima Episode 1 in February of Age 775.
@@Dragonballdave363 Perfect.
Guides confirm Ultimate Gohan was stronger than Goku, at least at the time that Gohan attained Ultimate form. If Goku became stronger than Gohan later is a different matter. Goku could have become stronger by the end of the Buu Saga.
In which he did after he was revived.
@@SonZackSSJ9kno
@@SonZackSSJ9kyou're the braindead super /z power scale agenda follower?
@@ohhellwhereami2574 Yes.
@@SonZackSSJ9k agreeing to my "no" By nodding saying "yes" Is truly gentleman craft
Daizenshuu 2 saying Gojan is the strongest warrior has his picture from when Kibito changes his clothes right before his battle with Super Boo. The only warriors left (goku was dead) were Goten, Trunks, and Piccolo. This doesn't have to be read the the Fandom seems to take it. Gohan is also called the Strongest under the Heavens, and Goku is legit dead up above Heaven. Along with Vegeta legit calling Goku number 1.
SEG says Goku thinks Gohan surpassed him. This is prior to Goku being Revived which gave him a boost.
The way I see it is this
Goku ( post revival ) > Gohan > Goku ( start of boo saga )
@@ACertainMan that makes sense to me
@@ACertainMan me when i believe goku got zenkai after a few punches from buuhan to give him more than fusion level with rival boost of power boost as valid
@@ohhellwhereami2574 After namek there is no Zenkai boost for Saiyans .. (After SSJ)
@@rakkieh404 totally false zenkai are like trend
Gohan being stronger than Goku is the biggest myth. It’s been stated at the end that Goku is the strongest. Plus vegeta in the end says that Goku is the strongest warrior
No, vegeta says that in relation to himself "you're number 1 " Cuz he's not
Meanwhile same vegeta was annoyed when goku let Gohan die in the explosion of earth
I think gohan came out of the buu saga as the strongest but he did get surpassed throughout it
Ultimate gohan did get surpassed by goku and vegeta but I think the zenkai he got after the whole buutenks and absorption thing made him the strongest that's why he is referred to as the strongest unfused character
But in daima .that goku and vegeta surpassed gohan .it makes sense since gohan stops training and goku didnt
Also I don't believe gohan ever reached sajb level bcz he lost to toppo and saganbo or whatever he was called both so much weaker than ssjb
The power scaling and rankings can be a bit of a mess. 😂
Goku didnt even come close to going all out against fat buu, he later told piccolo he coulda killed fat buu if he tried but didnt want too. Because its not his place. But its still really hard to say whos more powerful at their maximum.
lol
@@gangstagummybear3432 your entitled to your opinion it's cool.
They do get into argument about this tho
SS Goku/Vegeta>everyone (aside from Kid Buu and SS Vegetto)
Gohan>Goku and Vegeta BEFORE the last battle.
"Majin Buu the Most Powerful Enemy in History." Yes. But its not called "kid buu" i called Majin buu .. because its includes all buus. In Japanese the general name for buu is Majin Buu.
Fatbuu = Zen no Buu.
Evil buu = Aku no Buu
Super Buu = Cho Buu
Kid buu = Jinsui Buu.
All buu = Majin Buu
The anime and manga in Japanese are pricise with that names.
That's right Goku was so strong at Supersaiyan 3 he had to fuse to fight Buuhan but fights KidBuu at Supersaiyan 3 Ss3 Goku >Ultimate Gohan is completely bullshit
Akira after hearing these nonsense arguments for so long gave us SUPER which confirms goku>everyone and kidbuu>every other buu now you’ve gave us daima and showed us in deeper detail that Goku>everyone kidbuu>all buus
The thing is Goku is the strongest warrior because Gohan, well, he isn’t a warrior.
Same pinch i used this argument too, but some dude caught me lacking showing Gohan has been stated as warrior so i don't know man
you say "finally confirmed" like he wasnt always above ultimate gohan
I think Gohan was stronger than Goku at the start of the buu saga, but Goku likely didnt stay stagnant. Elder kai did give him 75,000 years worth of life energy, and a guide straight up says he became on par with him (Which is supported by him reacting to buutenks in the manga) along with him fighting kid buu who is stated stronger than super buu by dragon ball forever, goku himself, with kid buu also being implied capable of killing everyone on earth had he won.
And before I hear "goku ducked base super buu he said he needed to fuse) Goku was not at full power inside buu, as its stated by both daizenshuu and super buu himself that their size lowered their power, and goku would have no reason to believe going outside would revert him back to normal (he even seemed shocked gohan and co reverted to normal size so he clearly didnt know)
W
No dude, go read manga again
@@9iy9y89tI read The Manga 👍 he's right
@@MajinUltraEgo-pv You clearly did not read well
I don't think super buu is stronger than kid buu, that's why ultimate gohan is not stronger than ssj3 goku, but i think they evenly match.
This debate is so dumb and over with. SS3 Goku literally fought a smaller AND weaker version of Super Buu. The ONLY reason he was considered more dangerous was because Kid Buu lacked any sort of reason or logic. Use your brains, people. SS3 could only surpass Fat Buu and Super Buu needed a SS3 fusion to beat Gohan. A SS3 fusion that was Stronger than Goku's SS3. Gohan slaps SS3 Goku, fuck the retcons. Its literally shown to us that Gohan is stronger.
Either dragon ball daima takes place in a alternate timeline or dragon Ball is just full of inconsistencies and retcons because in dragon ball daima supreme kia and kibito Kai say the reason that they were able to defuse was because they got buu to absorb them and that the gas inside buu effects potara fusion causing them to defuse and use as DBZ fans always thought this to be the case because it happened to vegito in Z but this gets retcon in dragon ball super and they tell use the reason why the potara fusion wore off with Goku and Vegeta is because potara fusion is only permanent for kais and for mortals it only last a hour and in dragon ball super supreme Kai and Kabuto Kai state they made a wish with dragon balls to defuse them so either dima is a alternate timeline and don't tie in to super or dragon ball is just inconsistent
how I see the buu sage
-dabura = 3 billion
-fat buu = 11 billion (initial), 12.5 billion (full power)
-good buu = 10 billion
-evil buu = 15 billion
-super buu = 25 billion
-buucolo = 26 billion
-buutenks = 55 billion
-buuhan = 64 billion
-kid buu = 22.5 billion
-buff buu = 28.7 billion
-south supreme kai = 6.2 billion
-grand supreme kai = 3.8 billion
-goku ssj 3 = 23.4 billion, 17.6 billion (75% vs fat buu)
-gotenks ssj 3 = 29 billion
-ultimate gohan = 38 billion
-vegito base form = 66 billion
-super vegito (ssj form) = 3.3 trillion
lol
@@gangstagummybear3432 gummy bear loser haha
Yep kind of confirms Kid Buu strongest Buu and Goku strongest fighter at end of Z (anime)
Nih uh rhe first comment really shut your fodder ahh
Goku's mssj × kaoken makes ssj3, Mystic, Ssj3 Gotenks irrelevant and obsolete. A fpssj3 ×kaoken would make Goku 200× fpssj. Hed obliterate everone in the Buu Arc
In Anime Goku ez is stronger but Manga is complicated but in my opinion Goku SS3>Ultimate Gohan and in Anime Kid buu is stronger then Buuhan and for manga i think that Akira said that smallest buu is strongest and in manga there is no big feat for Buuhan only that buuhan is stronger then goku
This has been known vegeta called goku number 1
Vegeta if he was literal:
So kakrot you surpass once for all you're number wait? We aren't even strongest? Kid buu? He's just a mindless scum, Gohan? Yes he is superior both previously, present and most likely in future, gotenks? Fuse being count well judging by how much they enjoy fusing i might not even get close to their power ? Mr satan has God ki wtf***!???!
I've said this before and I'm gonna say it again
IN ANIME
kid Buu > Buuhan
SSJ3 Goku > Ultimate Gohan
IN MANGA
Buuhan > Kid Buu
Ultimate Gohan > SSJ3 Goku
This will ALWAYS REMAIN A FACT
Drugs addict
No it dont.. Its never stated that Kid buu is the strongest of them. Buuhan is far stronger than any form of Buu.
Kid buu is the most evil and unpredicable. the most dangerous.
Calling the Protagonist of the show the Strongest is really not a definitive proof of anything
hes only one of the protagonists
That why it don't make sense hes not in diama he the strongest
Nope it's after Buu saga so never counts
You should do a power scale video according to the original db manga especially Android to Buu arc
Ultimate Gohan is stronger
It’s not true ultimate gohan is the strongest not fusion Charakter dbz
OMG this is just PURE copium 😂😂😂 Toriyama wrote this, Kid Buu & Goku were the strongest and he's been telling you this for decades, Daima was the final nail in the coffin for people like you who refuse to accept the truth 🤣🤣🤣
Daima is not relevant to the actual story. So why go with anything that’s being said in the series.
Daima was written by Akira Toriyama 😂 it's CANON like it or not, cry about it. SSJ3 > Ultimate Gohan
dafaq are you talking about bro?
it answered nothing! (cope)
Totally wrong plus Gohan was the strongest saiyan in Z and also in Super.
OMG this is just PURE copium 😂😂😂 Toriyama wrote this, Kid Buu & Goku were the strongest and he's been telling you this for decades, Daima was the final nail in the coffin for people like you who refuse to accept the truth 🤣🤣
@@MajinUltraEgo-pv Goku was the strongest in Z because of the spirit bomb not because of any transformation he held plus in Super Toriyama stated Gohan to be stronger and even I can give multiple proofs to extremely toxic Goku fans like you 🤣🤣🤣🤣 and for your information the raw power and battle ability of Ultimate Mystic is higher than Super Saiyan 3 and it's totally dependent upon Goku's base form that if it's higher than Gohan's base currently to a great extent them SS3 Goku can win
Goku after kid buu zankai is slightly stronger
No Zenkai after namek for goku. After Saiyans reach SSJ they dont get a Zenkai.
@@rakkieh404 Thats headcannon
@@SonZackSSJ9k no its not. Its toriyama. After ssj there is no zenkaiboost.
@@rakkieh404 Prove that.
@@SonZackSSJ9k Its Stated in the Manga. Buutenks against Gohan. Gohan got healed by dende and gohan dont get stronger from his injuries.
Its stated in Super Manga that Goku and Vegeta reached their peak in Zenkai boost, because Zenkais are based on physical growth and their bodys are already on their peak.
Their is Physical strengh and ki based strengh in dragonball.
After Namek no saiyan get a really noticeable Zenkai boost. Ironic Cell gets it because he is not on his Physical peak. Same with Black, who dont know how gokus body works.
thing about it..
Vegeta vs C18 = No Zenkai
Vegeta vs Cell = No Zenkai
Gokus vs C19 = No Zenkai
Gokus vs Heart Virus = No Zenkai
Narrator is not relevant
Delusional
Absolutely not. Weaker
Gohan is weaker yes
@@MajinUltraEgo-pv can't be, that form Beats any super sayan
First