Not to mention being highly respected around the league as well - just look at some of the players who were pallbearers at his funeral [Tony Amonte and Doug Gilmour to name two].
I feel that sweater kept the Canucks away from a cup as much as anything else. Imagine being demoralized by a mirror before you even get to the ice. Add the 80's era pants and you have the ugliest uniform ever
No, it's good. It's their true uniform. Same with the L.A. Kings' home unis of the era. Always looked forward to the psychedelic matchups between those two teams back in the day.
My favorite bench clearing brawl was the first time Nashville played Winnipeg at home after Winnipeg beat Nashville in round 2 of the 17-18 season. I was at both games and to see Nashville come back pissed was awesome!
You have to check out the NRL and Superleague ( Rugby League) back in the day. All in brawls were nearly every game from 70s till 2010s. Now it is so rare when it happens now players are looking at multi game suspension. It is only other pro sport other than Lacrosse which I can think of where it has historically been accepted as part of the game.
It was. Keith Allen and Ed Snider got tired of the Flyers being bullied by the Blues so they changed tactics. And the funny thing is Schultz was actually a scorer in juniors before becoming an enforcer.
The Broadstreet Bullies weren't a reaction to Montreal, it was the St Louis Blues, who dominated the first three years of the expansion era and Philly got bigger and meaner as a reaction to try to get past the Bully Blues.
Of interest. John Ferguson and Bobby Hull had a real blood feud. I don't know how many times they fought in the 60s-70s, but they certainly didn't like each other.
some of my favorite moments from AHL games are guys like Brett Murray and Tyson Kozak absolutely dumpstering a guy who tried for a dirty hit and was made to answer the bell for it, Amerks signed one of the biggest fighters in the WHL this summer and I cannot wait to see him drop em with those syracuse and utica pundits
I totally agree with you about baseball bench clearing brawls. Totally stupid. So simple to eliminate it by suspending players for leaving the bench or bullpen. Plus, players in the outfield may not enter the infield. I've always thought so too. Great minds think alike. :)
With how popular MMA is I don't see how fighting in Hockey would keep people away. I mean they used to showcase NHL enforcers on the front page of newpapers like it was an event. Never has NHL fans booed when a fight starts, or a line brawl. Everyone is standing and cheering, everyone talks about it for days afterwords. Some enforcers were the most popular players on the team. They were loved and played larger rolls than just a 3rd liner, some played alongside the greats. Rivalries suck now, there are none even compared to a decade ago. I'm not saying I want bench clearing brawls again, but I miss the rivalries of the 90's and the 2000's to early 2010's, I was born in 1982 so I never got into Hockey until the late 80's. I'm not a fan of staged fights, I love the ones that happen organically during a game, IMO, that's where the hatred builds over-time during a season as you get fed up with certain players or teams and all hell breaks loose, especially during the playoffs. We don't have that anymore and it stinks. If we had more heated rivalries between teams with the higher scoring games I'd enjoy the game more. I still love the current game, but I miss the rivalries. I watched most playoff games this past year and really the only one that had some bite to it was the Oilers and Canucks series, but it was tame compared to 10 years ago even.
I think a fight should be a requirement in every game. 5 minutes left in the 3rd, if there hasn't been one, the ref blows the whistle and 2 guys gotta come out to center ice and go at it. Then they can go home, because even if there were overtime or a shootout in that game, those dudes aren't gonna be out there for it lol
John Ferguson was a good player too, so was Eddie Shack, they were enforcers, but they had talent. Shack wasn't as proficient defensively, but he could score, John Ferguson was an excellent checker and an honest hockey player. They both could fight, and it was fun to watch, but they were talented players.
Ferguson was near 30 goals one year and at 20ish for several other seasons. This was when 20 goals was an accomplishment. He could score but his role was to terrify the other team.
@@oldhab7890 Exactly. I think in this era, you just need to return to having guys who are good at more then punching, but are more than willing to do so should it be necessary.
This is such I weird thing as I feel the emotional bump when I’m watching a hockey game a fight happens more conversely if I’m watching a football game and they start fighting I think it’s childish and unsportsmanlike. Now I will say I might watch other sports but I’m a hockey fan. My fanship started in 93 with the La kings run to the cup and Marty McSorley and Wendell Clarke working things out. I don’t like where Marty’s career ended but I was a fan of his for a long time and I was a little surprised he didn’t make it on your list as I believe he played a big part of the great one’s career. Just some thoughts… thanks for the content.
You don't need an enforcer to attack the enemy team, but if you have a superstar, especially a rookie, then employing an enforcer to protect them may be the right choice.
After listening to certain retired players being interviewed on various podcasts, I realize that Slapshot was... shall we say, 'toned down' to get past the censors?
I still say I'd rather fight any other player in the history of the NHL than Joey Kocur .. he was just frightening. Probert , grimson , you name them they were nasty but joey could really hurt you in the blink of an eye
According to Tiger Williams, the evilest player in the NHL [in terms of wanting to hurt someone in a fight] was Dave Semenko. However, he said the scariest player to fight was Clark Gilles and most players in the NHL at the time knew it - hence the reason very few would actively challenge him.
@@blackenedmagic888 lol oh Clark was fucking scary too and he's way up my list . Joey still scares me more but then Im a bit young to have seen Clark in his glory days I was just born when he was winning his cups on the island . So what I know of him is from old footage and mostly stories about him. After seeing pictures of Gordie Howe and Tim Hortons builds though idk lol those men were crazy built for hockey . Bobby Hull as well .
That big fight night between the Islanders and Penguins was the last really good one I can recall, and man, it was fantastic lol. Flames and Oilers had a decent one the game after that Tkachuk hit on Kassian, but otherwise, there haven't been any big brawls.
That definitely was a good one, and it included Mario Lemieux's hypocrisy about complaining about the brawl when the Penguins was one of the leading teams in PIMs and fights. They had some dirty players in that Penguins lineup, though to be fair the same could be the said of the Isles...
Hi Shannon, I watched a Bruins- Habs game on Saturday afternoon, around 1985. Somebody had three fights. I think it might have been Chris Nilan...ALso, just saw that Evander Kane and Alex Petrovic actually fought three times in the same game.
Two players in a league of 600+. In the 90s, most players coming up knew how to fight far more commonly than now. No one fights like they did back then. 33 fights in a season will never be reached by a single player again.
Hockey isn’t niche. It’s a multi billion dollar business that constantly gets high attendance figures on par with the NBA. and not to mention the tv ratings went up this year and game 7 of the SCF was the highest rated non-NFL playoff game in over 5 years. If anything stunts his ability to get bigger, it’s not fighting but the NHLs inability to market its starts. But no hockeys popularity is fine, Shannon. Don’t be daft. Fighting in hockey is a far cry from what it was say…40 years ago where games can break out into total carnage. I don’t think it was just the fighting that cause a negative connotation to creep into the game, but those awful bench clearing brawls that took over 20 minutes to sort out (like the Good Friday Massacre) and those few instances where players would climb over the glass and fight in the stands. Idiots like Mike Milbury beating up a fan with his own show did more to create a negative stereotype than the Bob Proberts and Jimmy Manns of the world in my opinion.
The enforcer could only score two goals all season and be a lot of fans favorite player. Glad I got to witness that era with my own eyes even though I get why it changed.
I suspect that fighting will continue to decline through natural attrition rather than through rule changes. The junior leagues that have automatic ejections will contribute to fewer players regularly dropping the gloves when they reach the NHL. Plus, their helmet style, cage or fish bowl, makes it that much harder to throw a punch to the head. Even now, it seems that players are concerned about doing damage to their hands by hitting the helmet. And hockey doesn't need fighting to be entertaining.
Bob property had a lot of fights protecting Slava Koslov when Koslov was young. He didn't fight and got bullied until Probert became his protector. European players weren't used to how physical the NHL was back then.
I think you maybe should have made a shout out to the last of a certain type of player and that is the true team enforcer and the last great one was Chris Neil. I don't believe there will never ever be another enforcer that will 1. Be regarded as an enforcer/fighter/tough guy 2. Play more than 1000 games for one team and one team only. Enforcers just will not have that ability to stay in the lineup that long ever again because the value for that position has diminished so much that it is simply too hard to remain in the lineup if that is your main purpose. Chris was a pretty good hockey player for an enforcer, but I don't think even he could manage to be a viable team option for 1000 games plus anymore and certainly not for the same team. I don't think he gets enough credit league wide for that accomplishment. Love the channel, cheers!
If players fought as much today as they did in the 70’s and 80’s, as athletic and strong as they are today, they’d really be causing some serious damage to each other. The stories of enforcers playing hungover are legendary, but imagine an overweight hungover guy who can barely skate going up against a top NHL “tough guy” today and think about how that would go.
can i shine the puck for you sir ?? if i saw the hansen twins or shoresy coming at me, i'd do exactly that. "here you go sir, please take this shiny puck !!"
Weird that 1987 was the last bench clearing brawl in the NHL, but, the AHL had the "Pink in the Rink Brawl" in 2013! 😮 Between Grand Rapids and Rockford. I know Shanon has talked about doing AHL subjects, that would be a good start and be a good excuse to wear that Griffins jersey.
Right now players who can fight are players who are good elsewhere and can play but can drop the gloves, a guy like Xhekaj whos a decent big guy on D and has an ok shot... But I also remember with Laraque in Montreal, couldn't play and couldn't fight either cause no one would fight him.
I was hoping that you would mention Dave 'Tiger' Williams. Although I don't recall seeing him getting a bunch of penalty minutes, I was around to see him play junior hockey, in what was then the Western Canada Hockey League. He played for the Swift Current Broncos ( later Lethbridge Broncos, then back to Swift Current).
While Williams wasn't in the upper echelon of offensive point scorers, he did contribute offensively. So, he did have more value than just being a tough guy.
@@ronfehr7899 Same with Ferguson and Shack. Fergie was a great two-way forward, could kill penalties and pot 20 goals, as well as hit. Shack could put in 20 goals, and could skate, he also was an excellent hitter. Reg Fleming was a good checker also, he was a good penalty killer, and he was a good fighter. In the 80s and 90s yes, there were a lot of pure cementheads, but in the 60s like now, you had to be able to play hockey also to be of any use to an NHL club in an enforcing role.
He's also the reason why I lost some respect for Mike Bossy. As fantastic as a player he was, in his biography he constantly complained about the dirtiness of a lot of players in the NHL during his career - with a major focus on Williams. Meanwhile, he was a teammate and supporter of arguably the most evil goalie in NHL history - Billy Smith. If that's not hypocrisy, I don't know what is... and I despise hypocrites!
For those of you who weren't around to watch Junior hockey in Canada during the 1970's I can tell you there was very little actual hockey being played.
I grew up with Dave Schultz and the Broad Street Bullies. Schultz wasn't the only enforcer on that team although he was the chief one. Don Saleski, Andre Dupont, Bob Kelly could fight with the best of them. They didn't just fight. They intimidated opponents especially at the Spectrum. Even Bobby Clarke threw hands once in a while and he wasn't a terrible fighter either. Sadly the franchise hasn't been able to move on from that era hence zero cups since then.
As a Canucks fan (started watching in the late 2000s and early 2010s), when it comes to pure goons with very little puck skill, the first guy that comes up on my mind is Tom Sestito. His existence was to create a scrum and because he brings nothing else to the table, it was so frustrating to watch. When you see him out there starting scrums, I know we are already down atleast 3 goals with no hopes of coming back. Those mid to late 2010s was not fun to watch.
I feel like penalty minutes have dropped in part because so many power play units are just plain lethal (eg Edmonton). Could also be officiating tendencies or better discipline, but I like to think it’s an adjustment. I’m also partial to a good scrap, to address the video’s actual topic.
Just yesterday I posted a couple of pics of Tiger Williams and Tie Domi asking why between the two of them they never got nominated even once for the Lady Byng Trophy. I mean those guys were never known for spending time in the penalty box or getting into fights.
I was not a Leafs fan. But, Dave "Tiger" Williams was the most fearless hockey player I've ever seen play the game. Only about 5'10" & about 185 lbs., the guy took on everybody. Mighty tough dude!
I was wondering to whom THG was referring to when he said one of the best ever wore that jersey. I instantly came to the Chief Ron Delorme. The other guy who people disrespect, but was a crazy good fighter was Craig Coxe (wrong jersey though). In a game in1987 in Detroit he fought Probert, then Kocur, then Probert again.
@@tonyjofenig6833 The Coxe/Probert bouts were amazing, esp the first one. Stan Johnathan/Pierre Bouchard is legendary, in my mind. Anyone who was an enforcer is courageous. Tough way to make a living.
Shannon I think you are thinking of Reeves several years ago. I don't think he scares too many people now. Being rag dolled by a kid at the start of the last season pretty well ended his mystic.
In 1976 my Atl. Flames rookie, Willi Plett, scored 33 goals. I believe that this is also the year that Dave Schultz thought that he'd show the Flames rookie how tough he was. He probably didn't realize that Plett had come up from the minors playing for Orland Kurtenbach. he kcked Schultz's ass that night at the Omni in Atlanta. And remained the Flames enforcer until they left for Calgary in 1980.
As a person who considers himself a purist and I believe fighting makes the game safer, some fights are careless and dumb but it protects against dirty hits and in European leagues where it’s illegal there is a higher injury rate then the leagues with fighting, that being said I like the level we have and I don’t want it to become huge again I don’t like performative fights
In terms of your question about where fighting will ve in 20 years, i think it will atill be around bur continue to slowly decline. You mention that the average is about 0.25 to 0.3 flights per game at the moment and i think in 20 years rhwr number will be in the 0.1 to 0.15 range
Have you ever seen Michael J Fox's short film, "The Ice Man Hummeth"? It's from way back in the day when Letterman had short film festivals. I'd post a link but I don't want to break protocol and hijack anyones threads.
I know you have commented how big hit are momentum changers. I feel fights are the same if you are down, you go out there and stir the pot you said that about Rempe's play in the playoffs vs. CAR at MSG don't think he played on the road but at home to get the crowd into it. it was an energizer
Excellent point. Fights seem kind of dumb on the TV, but when I am in the arena, I found a good fight will electrify the building more than a goal can. I guess it is because the crowd has time to build into it as the fight progresses, and especially if it comes immediately after a perceived wrong to another player on your team which sets the crowd off in the first place.
I miss that old times ... Although he's not an enforcer "don't mess with Rick Tocchet" on YT there you can see where the Coach got is testosterone over shooting 😂
I still get nostalgic & watch Probie fights on YT. For all his off ice troubles, still one of the most beloved athletes Motown ever had.
Not to mention being highly respected around the league as well - just look at some of the players who were pallbearers at his funeral [Tony Amonte and Doug Gilmour to name two].
As young Avs fan in the late nineties I certainly remember some great brawls with Detroit
Fighting is an integral part of hockey, no question. If fighting leaves hockey, hockey is no more.
My most memorable was Link Gatez vs Bob Probert. Saw it live. The crowd went nuts.
Saw it live too. Oh those Cow Palace days!
Its hard to set everything else aside, but man, as a Wild fan, seeing Boogart go out on the ice was always incredible.
Boogaard perhaps?
I feel that sweater kept the Canucks away from a cup as much as anything else. Imagine being demoralized by a mirror before you even get to the ice. Add the 80's era pants and you have the ugliest uniform ever
No, it's good. It's their true uniform. Same with the L.A. Kings' home unis of the era. Always looked forward to the psychedelic matchups between those two teams back in the day.
@James
Agreed...those look like Road Worker unis
I was born in Vancouver the early 1970s, so even during its time we knew those uniforms were ugly.
The classic hockey stick c is one of the best!
I must be the only person who likes this version of the Canuck's jersey.
My favorite bench clearing brawl was the first time Nashville played Winnipeg at home after Winnipeg beat Nashville in round 2 of the 17-18 season. I was at both games and to see Nashville come back pissed was awesome!
There was a CD of Rick Jeanerette calling hockey fights. Pure gold.
Met Tiger twice. What a guy! Put me in a painful headlock the second time! 😂
"I went to a fight the other night and a hockey game broke out" is a quote for a reason.
You have to check out the NRL and Superleague ( Rugby League) back in the day. All in brawls were nearly every game from 70s till 2010s. Now it is so rare when it happens now players are looking at multi game suspension. It is only other pro sport other than Lacrosse which I can think of where it has historically been accepted as part of the game.
From what I've heard, the Broadstreet Bullies were a response to the Plager Brothers.
It was. Keith Allen and Ed Snider got tired of the Flyers being bullied by the Blues so they changed tactics. And the funny thing is Schultz was actually a scorer in juniors before becoming an enforcer.
@@Rockhound6165 in '73 Shultz had 20 goals, thats more than the current Flyers Captain....how 'bout 'dat
@@blackrocks8413 amazing isn't it?
The Broadstreet Bullies weren't a reaction to Montreal, it was the St Louis Blues, who dominated the first three years of the expansion era and Philly got bigger and meaner as a reaction to try to get past the Bully Blues.
Of interest. John Ferguson and Bobby Hull had a real blood feud. I don't know how many times they fought in the 60s-70s, but they certainly didn't like each other.
Thanks Shannon for this!! Great background to an instilled and necessary part of the game.
some of my favorite moments from AHL games are guys like Brett Murray and Tyson Kozak absolutely dumpstering a guy who tried for a dirty hit and was made to answer the bell for it, Amerks signed one of the biggest fighters in the WHL this summer and I cannot wait to see him drop em with those syracuse and utica pundits
With modern hockey headgear it's almost impossible to fight someone without hurting yourself in the process.
Yeah - your knuckles, fingers, hands will take a beating...
Absolute fire hat and sweater combo dude 🔥🔥🔥
I totally agree with you about baseball bench clearing brawls. Totally stupid. So simple to eliminate it by suspending players for leaving the bench or bullpen. Plus, players in the outfield may not enter the infield. I've always thought so too. Great minds think alike. :)
Such a majestic video about fighting.
With how popular MMA is I don't see how fighting in Hockey would keep people away. I mean they used to showcase NHL enforcers on the front page of newpapers like it was an event. Never has NHL fans booed when a fight starts, or a line brawl. Everyone is standing and cheering, everyone talks about it for days afterwords. Some enforcers were the most popular players on the team. They were loved and played larger rolls than just a 3rd liner, some played alongside the greats. Rivalries suck now, there are none even compared to a decade ago. I'm not saying I want bench clearing brawls again, but I miss the rivalries of the 90's and the 2000's to early 2010's, I was born in 1982 so I never got into Hockey until the late 80's.
I'm not a fan of staged fights, I love the ones that happen organically during a game, IMO, that's where the hatred builds over-time during a season as you get fed up with certain players or teams and all hell breaks loose, especially during the playoffs. We don't have that anymore and it stinks. If we had more heated rivalries between teams with the higher scoring games I'd enjoy the game more. I still love the current game, but I miss the rivalries. I watched most playoff games this past year and really the only one that had some bite to it was the Oilers and Canucks series, but it was tame compared to 10 years ago even.
@Julia_Hammels_ Well I must inform you that fighting has always been a part of the NHL. There are hockey leagues that don't allow it, however.
I think a fight should be a requirement in every game. 5 minutes left in the 3rd, if there hasn't been one, the ref blows the whistle and 2 guys gotta come out to center ice and go at it. Then they can go home, because even if there were overtime or a shootout in that game, those dudes aren't gonna be out there for it lol
Young Stian Solberg is a fighter. Will definitely protect the skill players in Anaheim
Yeah right 🙄
Polish legend Krzysztof Oliwa
John Ferguson was a good player too, so was Eddie Shack, they were enforcers, but they had talent. Shack wasn't as proficient defensively, but he could score, John Ferguson was an excellent checker and an honest hockey player. They both could fight, and it was fun to watch, but they were talented players.
Ferguson was near 30 goals one year and at 20ish for several other seasons. This was when 20 goals was an accomplishment. He could score but his role was to terrify the other team.
@@oldhab7890 Exactly. I think in this era, you just need to return to having guys who are good at more then punching, but are more than willing to do so should it be necessary.
This is such I weird thing as I feel the emotional bump when I’m watching a hockey game a fight happens more conversely if I’m watching a football game and they start fighting I think it’s childish and unsportsmanlike. Now I will say I might watch other sports but I’m a hockey fan. My fanship started in 93 with the La kings run to the cup and Marty McSorley and Wendell Clarke working things out. I don’t like where Marty’s career ended but I was a fan of his for a long time and I was a little surprised he didn’t make it on your list as I believe he played a big part of the great one’s career. Just some thoughts… thanks for the content.
You don't need an enforcer to attack the enemy team, but if you have a superstar, especially a rookie, then employing an enforcer to protect them may be the right choice.
After listening to certain retired players being interviewed on various podcasts, I realize that Slapshot was... shall we say, 'toned down' to get past the censors?
I still say I'd rather fight any other player in the history of the NHL than Joey Kocur .. he was just frightening. Probert , grimson , you name them they were nasty but joey could really hurt you in the blink of an eye
According to Tiger Williams, the evilest player in the NHL [in terms of wanting to hurt someone in a fight] was Dave Semenko. However, he said the scariest player to fight was Clark Gilles and most players in the NHL at the time knew it - hence the reason very few would actively challenge him.
@@blackenedmagic888 lol oh Clark was fucking scary too and he's way up my list . Joey still scares me more but then Im a bit young to have seen Clark in his glory days I was just born when he was winning his cups on the island . So what I know of him is from old footage and mostly stories about him. After seeing pictures of Gordie Howe and Tim Hortons builds though idk lol those men were crazy built for hockey . Bobby Hull as well .
Phila was reacting to St Louis. And good for them. IT worked, it worked well
Wow that was very interesting. I really enjoyed the stats and the history behind the game
That big fight night between the Islanders and Penguins was the last really good one I can recall, and man, it was fantastic lol. Flames and Oilers had a decent one the game after that Tkachuk hit on Kassian, but otherwise, there haven't been any big brawls.
That definitely was a good one, and it included Mario Lemieux's hypocrisy about complaining about the brawl when the Penguins was one of the leading teams in PIMs and fights. They had some dirty players in that Penguins lineup, though to be fair the same could be the said of the Isles...
Hi Shannon, I watched a Bruins- Habs game on Saturday afternoon, around 1985. Somebody had three fights. I think it might have been Chris Nilan...ALso, just saw that Evander Kane and Alex Petrovic actually fought three times in the same game.
Tie Domi Rob Ray era
I like the choir outfit jersey that Vancouver had
"We don't really have anyone coming up from juniors that fights like that." May I introduce you to one Matthew Rempe? Arber Xhakaj?
Two players in a league of 600+. In the 90s, most players coming up knew how to fight far more commonly than now. No one fights like they did back then. 33 fights in a season will never be reached by a single player again.
@@TheHockeyGuy fair point
U nailed it
Kurtis MacDermid is criminally underrated! Best fighter in NHL
bobby holik was pretty tough himself
Fighting thankfully in decline.
Hockey isn’t niche. It’s a multi billion dollar business that constantly gets high attendance figures on par with the NBA. and not to mention the tv ratings went up this year and game 7 of the SCF was the highest rated non-NFL playoff game in over 5 years. If anything stunts his ability to get bigger, it’s not fighting but the NHLs inability to market its starts. But no hockeys popularity is fine, Shannon. Don’t be daft.
Fighting in hockey is a far cry from what it was say…40 years ago where games can break out into total carnage. I don’t think it was just the fighting that cause a negative connotation to creep into the game, but those awful bench clearing brawls that took over 20 minutes to sort out (like the Good Friday Massacre) and those few instances where players would climb over the glass and fight in the stands. Idiots like Mike Milbury beating up a fan with his own show did more to create a negative stereotype than the Bob Proberts and Jimmy Manns of the world in my opinion.
3 fights in one game was Evander Kane when he played with Buffalo
The enforcer could only score two goals all season and be a lot of fans favorite player. Glad I got to witness that era with my own eyes even though I get why it changed.
Goalie fights are my fav
As fighting goes down stick work goes up. I’d bet money we see an honest to goodness stick fight within the next five years.
I suspect that fighting will continue to decline through natural attrition rather than through rule changes. The junior leagues that have automatic ejections will contribute to fewer players regularly dropping the gloves when they reach the NHL. Plus, their helmet style, cage or fish bowl, makes it that much harder to throw a punch to the head. Even now, it seems that players are concerned about doing damage to their hands by hitting the helmet. And hockey doesn't need fighting to be entertaining.
Bob property had a lot of fights protecting Slava Koslov when Koslov was young. He didn't fight and got bullied until Probert became his protector. European players weren't used to how physical the NHL was back then.
I think you maybe should have made a shout out to the last of a certain type of player and that is the true team enforcer and the last great one was Chris Neil.
I don't believe there will never ever be another enforcer that will
1. Be regarded as an enforcer/fighter/tough guy
2. Play more than 1000 games for one team and one team only.
Enforcers just will not have that ability to stay in the lineup that long ever again because the value for that position has diminished so much that it is simply too hard to remain in the lineup if that is your main purpose.
Chris was a pretty good hockey player for an enforcer, but I don't think even he could manage to be a viable team option for 1000 games plus anymore and certainly not for the same team.
I don't think he gets enough credit league wide for that accomplishment.
Love the channel, cheers!
Well said, and yes I agree with everything you said about Chris Neil. He was absolutely one of a kind
I'd rather see a big hit than a fight.
If players fought as much today as they did in the 70’s and 80’s, as athletic and strong as they are today, they’d really be causing some serious damage to each other. The stories of enforcers playing hungover are legendary, but imagine an overweight hungover guy who can barely skate going up against a top NHL “tough guy” today and think about how that would go.
can i shine the puck for you sir ?? if i saw the hansen twins or shoresy coming at me, i'd do exactly that. "here you go sir, please take this shiny puck !!"
Bob Probert for NHL Hall of Fame! 💪
It seems like there's a scuffle on HNIC Saturday night!
Weird that 1987 was the last bench clearing brawl in the NHL, but, the AHL had the "Pink in the Rink Brawl" in 2013! 😮 Between Grand Rapids and Rockford. I know Shanon has talked about doing AHL subjects, that would be a good start and be a good excuse to wear that Griffins jersey.
ruclips.net/video/NcMu4l-QoQk/видео.htmlsi=1tpFq7apuoifd1CV
Right now players who can fight are players who are good elsewhere and can play but can drop the gloves, a guy like Xhekaj whos a decent big guy on D and has an ok shot...
But I also remember with Laraque in Montreal, couldn't play and couldn't fight either cause no one would fight him.
I was hoping that you would mention Dave 'Tiger' Williams. Although I don't recall seeing him getting a bunch of penalty minutes, I was around to see him play junior hockey, in what was then the Western Canada Hockey League. He played for the Swift Current Broncos ( later Lethbridge Broncos, then back to Swift Current).
While Williams wasn't in the upper echelon of offensive point scorers, he did contribute offensively. So, he did have more value than just being a tough guy.
@@ronfehr7899 Same with Ferguson and Shack. Fergie was a great two-way forward, could kill penalties and pot 20 goals, as well as hit. Shack could put in 20 goals, and could skate, he also was an excellent hitter. Reg Fleming was a good checker also, he was a good penalty killer, and he was a good fighter. In the 80s and 90s yes, there were a lot of pure cementheads, but in the 60s like now, you had to be able to play hockey also to be of any use to an NHL club in an enforcing role.
@@ronfehr7899 I remember Tiger Williams scoring 35 goals at least twice in his career.
@@BunnEFartz He also made the All-Star game with the Canucks and, if my memory serves me correctly, he was voted to the first team that year.
He's also the reason why I lost some respect for Mike Bossy. As fantastic as a player he was, in his biography he constantly complained about the dirtiness of a lot of players in the NHL during his career - with a major focus on Williams. Meanwhile, he was a teammate and supporter of arguably the most evil goalie in NHL history - Billy Smith. If that's not hypocrisy, I don't know what is... and I despise hypocrites!
The Flying V😭😭😭😭
For those of you who weren't around to watch Junior hockey in Canada during the 1970's I can tell you there was very little actual hockey being played.
Ron Delorme, Tiger Williams, Curt Fraser ......
I grew up with Dave Schultz and the Broad Street Bullies. Schultz wasn't the only enforcer on that team although he was the chief one. Don Saleski, Andre Dupont, Bob Kelly could fight with the best of them. They didn't just fight. They intimidated opponents especially at the Spectrum. Even Bobby Clarke threw hands once in a while and he wasn't a terrible fighter either. Sadly the franchise hasn't been able to move on from that era hence zero cups since then.
For those curious, Liam O'Brien would have to play just under 26 seasons to break Tiger Williams' record at 153 PIM/season
The Florida Panthers are the bullies now 😂
How many fights for Rob Ray?
Sorry I know this unrelated but will you be reviewing summerslam on the other channel. IT WAS INSANE!
As a Canucks fan (started watching in the late 2000s and early 2010s), when it comes to pure goons with very little puck skill, the first guy that comes up on my mind is Tom Sestito. His existence was to create a scrum and because he brings nothing else to the table, it was so frustrating to watch. When you see him out there starting scrums, I know we are already down atleast 3 goals with no hopes of coming back. Those mid to late 2010s was not fun to watch.
I think the league changed their mind after the Good Friday game between the Habs and Nordiques.
I feel like penalty minutes have dropped in part because so many power play units are just plain lethal (eg Edmonton). Could also be officiating tendencies or better discipline, but I like to think it’s an adjustment. I’m also partial to a good scrap, to address the video’s actual topic.
I have 3 fights a game in nhl 24 be a pro mode at least once a season. Usually against the oilers or vegas for laying out mc david or mark stone.
Evander Kane vs Alex Petrovich fought each other 3 times in the same game in 2015
I want to say Evander Kane had a 3 fight night in Buffalo at one point, not sure though
Just yesterday I posted a couple of pics of Tiger Williams and Tie Domi asking why between the two of them they never got nominated even once for the Lady Byng Trophy. I mean those guys were never known for spending time in the penalty box or getting into fights.
I was not a Leafs fan. But, Dave "Tiger" Williams was the most fearless hockey player I've ever seen play the game. Only about 5'10" & about 185 lbs., the guy took on everybody. Mighty tough dude!
I wonder how much of the salary cap kill fighting as well.
Ron delorme when he played for Vancouver fought Stan Jonathon terry oreilly and John wensik
@@MarkSchliebener Delorme vs Macoun was one the best fights I ever saw.
I was wondering to whom THG was referring to when he said one of the best ever wore that jersey. I instantly came to the Chief Ron Delorme.
The other guy who people disrespect, but was a crazy good fighter was Craig Coxe (wrong jersey though). In a game in1987 in Detroit he fought Probert, then Kocur, then Probert again.
@@tonyjofenig6833 The Coxe/Probert bouts were amazing, esp the first one. Stan Johnathan/Pierre Bouchard is legendary, in my mind. Anyone who was an enforcer is courageous. Tough way to make a living.
@@tonyjofenig6833 I would probably agree even don cherry was quoted as having said toughest player he ever coached ahead of Stan Jonathon
A lot of NCAA players were Enforcers and it was always zero tolerance towards fighting, never mind the facial protection since circa 1981
Danger? The NFL.
Shannon I think you are thinking of Reeves several years ago. I don't think he scares too many people now. Being rag dolled by a kid at the start of the last season pretty well ended his mystic.
Been saying the same thing about baseball for years.
just curious thoughts on Donald Brashear?
No mention of Steve Durbano?
In 1976 my Atl. Flames rookie, Willi Plett, scored 33 goals. I believe that this is also the year that Dave Schultz thought that he'd show the Flames rookie how tough he was. He probably didn't realize that Plett had come up from the minors playing for Orland Kurtenbach. he kcked Schultz's ass that night at the Omni in Atlanta. And remained the Flames enforcer until they left for Calgary in 1980.
@KDial I saw Dave Schultz play and to be honest he was rather mediocre as a fighter. His career was more built on reputation than ability.
Plett played for the North Stars for a while in the 80s. I remember he didn’t wear a helmet either. Old school.
@@BunnEFartz Schultz, I saw him in the day, he was a long ball hitter punishing guys in the late rounds so to speak.
When Dave Shultz was drafted he wasn't a fighter.
@MS-ro9dm Or Nick Kypreos. He was a 50 goal scorer in Junior.
As a person who considers himself a purist and I believe fighting makes the game safer, some fights are careless and dumb but it protects against dirty hits and in European leagues where it’s illegal there is a higher injury rate then the leagues with fighting, that being said I like the level we have and I don’t want it to become huge again I don’t like performative fights
Good.
These guys are on RUclips....Ferguson, Shack, etc....
Broad Street Bullies: Dave Schultz, Bob Kelly, Andre DuPont, Mel Bridgeman, Don Saleski…am I leaving anyone out?
In terms of your question about where fighting will ve in 20 years, i think it will atill be around bur continue to slowly decline. You mention that the average is about 0.25 to 0.3 flights per game at the moment and i think in 20 years rhwr number will be in the 0.1 to 0.15 range
Movie Goon is a great example of how things Used to be
Love your take on most topics. On this front, you should just stay quite because you are really out of your element.
Wow someone has a different opinion about fighting than you and you insult him? Real classy fan, must be a Canadian
Probert was a great scoring rookie, then he decided he would fight better than he scored.
Anyone remember The New Haven nighthawks. Tough team for a tough city
Bob Probert would probably have had a kot more fights if he didn't spend 3 yesrs being unable to play road games against 1/3 of rhr NHL teams.
oh that golden v is so gross brother
Looks like something you'd see in a late eighties early nineties Sci Fi movie.
In the best way possible 😂
@@LiminalMan777 Fifth Element 😂
@@choppergunner8650 exactly
Sick, even.
In 2016, Evander Kane and Alex Petrovic fought 3 times in the same game. Kane won all 3 times.
I was there . Epic
Wendel Clark pound for pound best fighter ever
Once the NHL drafts its first bionic athlete or android athlete, fighting will be banned for the sake of the mere organic mortals.
Have you ever seen Michael J Fox's short film, "The Ice Man Hummeth"? It's from way back in the day when Letterman had short film festivals. I'd post a link but I don't want to break protocol and hijack anyones threads.
I know you have commented how big hit are momentum changers. I feel fights are the same if you are down, you go out there and stir the pot you said that about Rempe's play in the playoffs vs. CAR at MSG don't think he played on the road but at home to get the crowd into it. it was an energizer
Excellent point. Fights seem kind of dumb on the TV, but when I am in the arena, I found a good fight will electrify the building more than a goal can. I guess it is because the crowd has time to build into it as the fight progresses, and especially if it comes immediately after a perceived wrong to another player on your team which sets the crowd off in the first place.
I miss that old times ... Although he's not an enforcer "don't mess with Rick Tocchet" on YT there you can see where the Coach got is testosterone over shooting 😂
He wasn't the biggest guy but he was tough as nails and had balls that clank. Damn good player back in his day also.
How do you have a fighting video and not have rob ray mentioned lol
Bobby Orr could fight..guys learned to leave him alone...