Matt is totally right. I tell my story: there was a momenti in which i had a strict weighted pull up with 40 kg,neutral grip plus 50 kg,i was able to do like 20 pull ups in a row. Still i couldn't do a muscle up. Then,one day,with the same level of strength and without proper training,i got 1 ,and then 2 in a row. Then,again nothing. Long story short,there were days in which i was able to do this stuff and days i wasn't,and my level of strength was the same. At the end i quit it,cos i lift/do calisthenics for strength and build muscle,as matt say( i do bjj so thats my goal) and the muscle up is kind of a party trick that require strenght and skill in a rom that doesnt add anything: cool, but useful only if u have to do calisthenics as a performance sport. ( sorry for the long comment,just my 2 cents
100% agree with you, Matt. I stopped doing them long time ago. That was one of my goals but after doing them for a few months I didn't see any benefits from doing them.
I once thought it would be cool to learn the muscle-up. But my shoulders disagreed. I decided not to pursue it any further, because having functional shoulder joints is more important than trying to impress people.
Dude you have to warm up your shoulders. You actually improve by not training them often. It takes alot of time to strengthen the connective tissue. Im able to do slow muscleups but not explosive
Agree with you completely. It's a cool party trick and one that I trained for a long time for, then somehow lost the ability to do, and now I can just about do one. So as a training exercise it doesn't have much merit, as you said, but the working towards a muscle up is useful, as it forces you to get stronger as you progress. Working such things as explosive pull-ups is great and having that end goal can be helpful for some.
Another reason not to do muscle ups is the injury risk. I had to give up muscle ups soon after getting my first one because they were killing my wrists, and that is saying something because I don't normally get joint pain.
So, I feel I can give a really good insight into this as I have just been on this journey. I have been doing Calisthenics since 2018. I never chased the muscle up or any other fancy trick, as I was far too focused on building muscle. But then I thought well can I really call myself a proper Calisthenics guy if I am not capable of the muscle up? I started to practice it once or twice a week since the turn of this year. I managed to nail it in the second week of May. It's massively about technique! I used resistance bands and gradually removed a band or went down a band as the weeks progressed. I now can do two unassisted clean, muscle ups and that was after a huge warm-up with them using bands. So I think I could probably do 4 if I was fresh! One thing I would advise is to make sure you have a solid foundation. I would never even attempt it if I couldn't do 10 clean pull-ups. There's no point, don't run before you can walk and fall into injury like I have and many others before have. If you really want it go for it! If you don't, then don't force yourself because you'll probably regret it. I can't tell you how good it felt to nail one though. I personally think that they have a weird reverse carry-over to normal pull-ups as you have to be explosive out of the pocket to achieve one. So if you are one of these people who labors when doing pull-ups putting a lot of stress on your tendons like I used to. Then these could well help with that. Let's face it, who doesn't want to be more explosive haha! Hope this rant helps someone and if you're reading this and struggling let me know and I'll try and help If Matt can't get back to you. Happy training!
But what if I do one or two sets of muscle ups as many as I can at the start and then later finish the pull and push muscles seperately with pull ups and dips?
Matt's argument against muscle ups would apply to most other compound moves. You could say that bench press and basic pushups are bad exercises because the triceps is the limiting factor, so the chest is not really worked to full capacity as it would in an isolation exercise. I could think of similar arguments for deadlifts, shoulder presses and pistol squats. But nobody says we should ditch such compound exercises.
Incredible timing. Just went down the muscle up rabbit hole the other day. I feel like it’s very similar to the clean and press. I think it’s a cool movement but, it’s more of a skill and cardio movement. I switched from clean and press to supersetting presses and cleans. I do the same thing with pull-ups and dips. Actually I dropped cleans for high-pulls. You don’t need to train catching the weight if you’re not a Olympic lifter. Do you prefer strait bar dips or parallel?
Depends on the goal, if you care about strength and versatility, muscle up is an excellent additional skill to learn. If you are muscle focused, you shouldnt be doing only calisthenics to begin with. Calisthenics builds strong tendons and connective tissue compared to weights, but weights are better for building certain muscles (but neglect tendons). Muscle ups shouldnt be a problem unless you are immobile and stiff, then your goal should be to become less stiff shouldnt it. I dont see a reason to skip muscle ups unless you are a bodybuilder, its not hard to do a few reps once a week
I superset muscleups with pullups and straight bar dips. I've seen significant changes to my physique since doing them that way rather than pullups (100reps) and dips(100reps) separately. To each their own.
@RJ-is9ko Not saying they aren't a good exercise. At my age you have to be a little more careful of faster more dynamic movements. At 59 years old I am in great shape but, get a few more joint and tendon injuries. Slow and controlled is my path.
Good exercises if your job involves climbing eg tree surgeon, rescue and armed forces or the ability to traverse an obstacle, ifneeded cool if not dont bother
Muscle ups are a difficult compound movement that require explosive strength. Doing sets of muscle ups are akso tough on your cardiovascular system. Obviously, if someone is strong enough to do them, then they dint necessarily need to train them. But someone who lacks sufficient strength initially, and builds ups to doing them (with the aid of bands) is going to gain strength, agility from the extension at the bottom of the lift, technique and coordination.. There's no reason not to sin to be able to perform muscle ups. The guy in this video probably can do them, so it's easy for him to say. But if you presently cannot, then give it a try.
Nope not at all. The risk to reward ratio doesn’t weigh out at all. You’ll eventually need those joints you will keep damaging just to post footage of your muscle up journey. Pull ups, dips, and push ups in a very controlled, strict manner, keeping constant tension on the working muscles and as far away as possible from hammering the joints is the optimal way to increase upper body size and strength when using pure calisthenics. This applies to all aspects of strength training.💯
I think the premise of the transition as a hard part of the movement it's wrong. The goal of the muscle up, if done properly is to have such pulling strength that you are able to get on top of the bar without needing the transition. All you need is to have a solid grip wrap around the bar with a slight bent wrist, not a false grip. From there just pull as high as you can than pull also towards the bar kinda rowing to get on top of the bar, than you have the dip. Now could you train explosive pull strength without a muscle up? 100% yes as long as you train high pull ups which is a requirement for the muscle up. High pull ups not normal pull ups. The thing with the muscle up is that you can keep improving it even bodyweight and bring it to a level where you pull so high that you basically skip the dip. So I would say it's not about what muscle up being effective, but instead it's just being interested on it.
Matt is totally right. I tell my story: there was a momenti in which i had a strict weighted pull up with 40 kg,neutral grip plus 50 kg,i was able to do like 20 pull ups in a row. Still i couldn't do a muscle up. Then,one day,with the same level of strength and without proper training,i got 1 ,and then 2 in a row. Then,again nothing. Long story short,there were days in which i was able to do this stuff and days i wasn't,and my level of strength was the same. At the end i quit it,cos i lift/do calisthenics for strength and build muscle,as matt say( i do bjj so thats my goal) and the muscle up is kind of a party trick that require strenght and skill in a rom that doesnt add anything: cool, but useful only if u have to do calisthenics as a performance sport. ( sorry for the long comment,just my 2 cents
Love these clips, I always miss your lives because of the different time zone
I think the slow muscle up on rings still is worth to learn! I think it's the only safe and most effective variation
I agree my next quest
100% agree with you, Matt. I stopped doing them long time ago. That was one of my goals but after doing them for a few months I didn't see any benefits from doing them.
I once thought it would be cool to learn the muscle-up. But my shoulders disagreed. I decided not to pursue it any further, because having functional shoulder joints is more important than trying to impress people.
Dude you have to warm up your shoulders. You actually improve by not training them often. It takes alot of time to strengthen the connective tissue. Im able to do slow muscleups but not explosive
Agree with you completely. It's a cool party trick and one that I trained for a long time for, then somehow lost the ability to do, and now I can just about do one. So as a training exercise it doesn't have much merit, as you said, but the working towards a muscle up is useful, as it forces you to get stronger as you progress. Working such things as explosive pull-ups is great and having that end goal can be helpful for some.
Another reason not to do muscle ups is the injury risk. I had to give up muscle ups soon after getting my first one because they were killing my wrists, and that is saying something because I don't normally get joint pain.
So, I feel I can give a really good insight into this as I have just been on this journey. I have been doing Calisthenics since 2018. I never chased the muscle up or any other fancy trick, as I was far too focused on building muscle. But then I thought well can I really call myself a proper Calisthenics guy if I am not capable of the muscle up? I started to practice it once or twice a week since the turn of this year. I managed to nail it in the second week of May. It's massively about technique!
I used resistance bands and gradually removed a band or went down a band as the weeks progressed. I now can do two unassisted clean, muscle ups and that was after a huge warm-up with them using bands. So I think I could probably do 4 if I was fresh! One thing I would advise is to make sure you have a solid foundation. I would never even attempt it if I couldn't do 10 clean pull-ups. There's no point, don't run before you can walk and fall into injury like I have and many others before have. If you really want it go for it! If you don't, then don't force yourself because you'll probably regret it. I can't tell you how good it felt to nail one though.
I personally think that they have a weird reverse carry-over to normal pull-ups as you have to be explosive out of the pocket to achieve one. So if you are one of these people who labors when doing pull-ups putting a lot of stress on your tendons like I used to. Then these could well help with that. Let's face it, who doesn't want to be more explosive haha! Hope this rant helps someone and if you're reading this and struggling let me know and I'll try and help If Matt can't get back to you. Happy training!
But what if I do one or two sets of muscle ups as many as I can at the start and then later finish the pull and push muscles seperately with pull ups and dips?
Matt's argument against muscle ups would apply to most other compound moves. You could say that bench press and basic pushups are bad exercises because the triceps is the limiting factor, so the chest is not really worked to full capacity as it would in an isolation exercise. I could think of similar arguments for deadlifts, shoulder presses and pistol squats. But nobody says we should ditch such compound exercises.
Reasons Matt made this video:
To give helpful perspective on muscle ups - 10%
To brag about doing 10 muscle ups in a row - 90%
Incredible timing. Just went down the muscle up rabbit hole the other day. I feel like it’s very similar to the clean and press. I think it’s a cool movement but, it’s more of a skill and cardio movement.
I switched from clean and press to supersetting presses and cleans. I do the same thing with pull-ups and dips. Actually I dropped cleans for high-pulls. You don’t need to train catching the weight if you’re not a Olympic lifter.
Do you prefer strait bar dips or parallel?
I did the same thing when I was trying to do Muscle-ups. Clean and press is the same movement but backwards
Yea all I do for cardio is muscle ups and heavy clean and presses
If you are climbing the transition is the part that could save your life
Depends on the goal, if you care about strength and versatility, muscle up is an excellent additional skill to learn. If you are muscle focused, you shouldnt be doing only calisthenics to begin with. Calisthenics builds strong tendons and connective tissue compared to weights, but weights are better for building certain muscles (but neglect tendons). Muscle ups shouldnt be a problem unless you are immobile and stiff, then your goal should be to become less stiff shouldnt it. I dont see a reason to skip muscle ups unless you are a bodybuilder, its not hard to do a few reps once a week
It's the best move to learn if you're like me and training for the Zombie Apocalypse, and running, obviously.
you could do muscle ups without the dip part of the movement. It gets a bit better when cames to fatige
Yep, I agree for me a Muscle-Up is for showing off. Push-ups/Chin-ups and Push-ups/Dips are for building muscle and strength.
I superset muscleups with pullups and straight bar dips. I've seen significant changes to my physique since doing them that way rather than pullups (100reps) and dips(100reps) separately. To each their own.
@RJ-is9ko Not saying they aren't a good exercise. At my age you have to be a little more careful of faster more dynamic movements. At 59 years old I am in great shape but, get a few more joint and tendon injuries. Slow and controlled is my path.
1:23 You've heard about super sets. Now get ready for... SUPERREPS
Good exercises if your job involves climbing eg tree surgeon, rescue and armed forces or the ability to traverse an obstacle, ifneeded cool if not dont bother
Muscle ups are a difficult compound movement that require explosive strength. Doing sets of muscle ups are akso tough on your cardiovascular system. Obviously, if someone is strong enough to do them, then they dint necessarily need to train them. But someone who lacks sufficient strength initially, and builds ups to doing them (with the aid of bands) is going to gain strength, agility from the extension at the bottom of the lift, technique and coordination.. There's no reason not to sin to be able to perform muscle ups. The guy in this video probably can do them, so it's easy for him to say. But if you presently cannot, then give it a try.
Been training for 3 years now,. Can do 20 pullups in a row, still can't do a muscle-up.
Nope not at all. The risk to reward ratio doesn’t weigh out at all. You’ll eventually need those joints you will keep damaging just to post footage of your muscle up journey. Pull ups, dips, and push ups in a very controlled, strict manner, keeping constant tension on the working muscles and as far away as possible from hammering the joints is the optimal way to increase upper body size and strength when using pure calisthenics. This applies to all aspects of strength training.💯
slow and controlled muscle ups are a thing sir
This guy clearly hasnt seen ring muscle ups lmao
I think the premise of the transition as a hard part of the movement it's wrong. The goal of the muscle up, if done properly is to have such pulling strength that you are able to get on top of the bar without needing the transition. All you need is to have a solid grip wrap around the bar with a slight bent wrist, not a false grip. From there just pull as high as you can than pull also towards the bar kinda rowing to get on top of the bar, than you have the dip. Now could you train explosive pull strength without a muscle up? 100% yes as long as you train high pull ups which is a requirement for the muscle up. High pull ups not normal pull ups. The thing with the muscle up is that you can keep improving it even bodyweight and bring it to a level where you pull so high that you basically skip the dip. So I would say it's not about what muscle up being effective, but instead it's just being interested on it.
nope