It's a shame there are not more people out there who will understand what's going on here. The FliteControl shell is amazing. Thanks very much for this great video, I appreciate how much work went into this video. Kudos sir.
@@Brobee223 You won't believe this, you are responding to a comment I left two months ago, but on Saturday I took a new shotgun out and compared/contrasted Flite Control v. regular 00 Buckshot. :) It's really impressive watching how well FliteControl keeps the groups tight. I was only to get out to 33 yards, but even at that distance, the group was impressive.
Thanks for doing this test. I use the law enforcement version of this load (LE12700) for home defense. Looks like it might be a bit overkill when it comes to penetration :). Your video and narration skills are excellent, I look forward to more of your video.
just bought some of these shells the other day decided to do some research on them after the fact lol, found this video and now I'm a subscriber I like your straightforward no BS approach. I'm not here to be entertained I want information and I got it thanks for the upload keep up the good work!
Federal .410 #4 and '000' buck through both a full choke barrel and a cylinder choke barrel at different distances. Loved the test and it does give shotgunners a good idea of what to expect. Keep up the good work,I'll keep watching and thumbing the vids up.
Something that would be interesting is to see how a cheap #00 loaf compares to the premium loadings, something like Rio. I know the ammo is a very small part of the expense of running one of these tests, but I'd be happy to send up some Rio #00 to see it tested.
Well done and well presented... That worked about as well as one might expect... Hornady now makes similar buckshot loads with similar wads in a Fast 1600 FPS 8 pellet 2-3/4 and a slower 1+1/2 ounce payload 3" version...
Putting an additional gel block behind the original after the original had already been shot, and therefore compromised, was a flaw in the test. The likely effect would be to channelize the shot through the path/s already made in the gel by the 1st shot, decreasing drag and extending the penetration observed in the 2nd block. RX: "sneaking up on" your tests by starting with the longest range, and checking the results before proceeding to the more energetic short-range tests.
This is the version of 1145 fps or 1325 fps? And this penetration results of federal flitecontrol, you believe is very good for 00BK, compared to other brands 00BK? Thanks for the nice video.
Wonderful video! Your testing mistakes were perfect; you know what to change for the future, and the video was STILL very informative because you explained everything well. A++!
Some local Law Enforcement Officers told me that they had problems with LE 127 penetrating winter clothing (namely leather jackets) at 40 yards and beyond. I've yet to see a test of anything but Denim clothing against buckshot and would greatly appreciate a barrier penetration video.
Beg to differ...:) I've tested both your statements and unfortunately they are untrue. Re velocity and barrel length - my measurements indicate that there is no appreciable difference in muzzle velocity with barrels any longer than 14 inches. Re Pattern - go check out what Dr. A.C. Jones's tests reveal in his book Sporting Shotgun Performance. My results on the subject of patterning mirror his.
If possible could you test hevi-shot hevi metal for waterfowl hunting I would really like to see the results of the shots at different yardage and how well it penetrates. Also great videos love them!
Do they make a 3" Federal FliteControl Premium 000 Buckshot? If so I would love to see how such a tight grouping ammo would perform at longer ranges with the added weight of the 000 buckshot.
MrWhiltetail Yes, Federal does make a 3" version with the flight control wad. However, you only get 12 pellets instead of the 15 pellets you get in a Winchester Super X. I found the 3" at MidwayUSA
My defense buckshot Winchester 3 inch 00buck 12 pellets at 1,450 FPS and side saddle with Brenneke Black Magic 602 gr slug at 1,500 FPS with 3,042 ft lbs energy
Very good Brobee223. I like this review. I own a 1999 production Mossberg 590 with a 20" barrel. 8+1 round capacity. I've not had the opportunity to test the Federal 00 Flight Control rounds as yet. I do have some of the Hornady Critical Defense high velocity rounds and they seem to maintain a tight shot pattern as well although I cannot definitively say that they are as good as the Federal rounds in your review. I am a proponent of the 12 twelve gauge shotgun pump or semi auto simply for their versatility and lethality when that becomes necessary. A fight stopper at close range I would trust this Mossberg in a bad situation. Is the shotgun the be all end all in every scenario? Nope! A man once said that you need the right tool for the job. That said though a shotgun will provide your dinner or stop a very determined bad guy where a pistol may not. By the way. Another weapon at the Castle is an AR15. All the best to you Brobee223
Dude you have to consider that your guns have like 18" barels and that spreads your pattern quicker. It also slows down the shot and increases muzzle jump.
I do not like the deformation from the buffering. If you use high antimony shot it does not deform even without the copper plate. Federal is notorious for not adding enough antimony to prevent shot deformation. Then again to much antimony makes shot brittle, it will not dent but it will break. I have never tested buckshot but we have tested #9 birdshot used for skeet shooting. 6% antimony works perfectly for skeet shooting. Shoot a round of skeet with bulk ammo of your favorite flavor. Then shoot a round with Winchester AA ammo. Your score will improve with the AA. Most bulk shotgun pellets are flat when they come out of the barrel. I reload shells for skeet and sporting clays I spend the extra money for AA or Fiocchi shot.
My opinion is that in the variety of shotguns I own, past about 50 yards the pattern is too open to be useful. I did take a deer this year at 55 yards with this load though; brought the camera too and made an episode covering the hunt, so check it out if you get a chance.
To be honest it is not uncommon for some hot high brass loads of #00 and #000 pellets to still penetrate 18 to 24+ inches of ballistics gel or living mammalian tissue as far out as 60 or 70 yards.
Remington's Quality control has gone to shit!!! And it sucks because I am a Remington man. But I also got a IAC HAWK 981 combo barrel on it 18.5" and 26" barrel with choke and it's feels and shoots better then mine and my dads 870 😲😲😫😫 Good video and thanks for it and if you can can you do a long range gel test with .308 or 5.56 if you got it??? Something like 800+ yards that would be very much appreciated 🤓🤓🤓🤓🤓
Thanks! I was disappointed in Remington too, enough that I migrated over to the mossberg for a couple years. But now I'm back to shooting the 870 and don't seem to have any issues with my current police and wingmaster specimens. While I appreciate your suggestion on the long range rifle gelatin tests (and they would be very interesting!), I'm going to be focusing my limited hunting/camera time on a couple more shotgun hunting ideas. Perhaps in a couple years once the kids have moved out...hmmmm.......
Impressive shells but isn't that penetration a bit much for home defense/police distances? I find it strange that if this was a pistol video people would be losing their minds about "over penetration danger," yet I didn't see a single comment about it on this video. I'll stick with my 27 pellet #4 buckshot that you stoned a deer with at 20 yards. If that doesn't stop a home invader at 20 feet I have bigger problems.
I killed a deer with buckshot last year. killed one with #4 and shot one with #4 and I couldn't recover the deer. VERDICT: don't shoot them outside of 20-25 with #4. and 30-55 with 00 or 000,
Sorry to read you lost your deer! I consider myself lucky that I have not had to wrestle with that yet in the buckshot department, but suspect that might change if I hunt long enough with it.
With loads using conventional wads I'd tend to agree, but not with loads using Federal's Flight Control Wad. I've done extensive pattern testing with this load through about a half dozen different shotguns and the full gambit of chokes....my experience is that the load patterns the tightest in guns with little to no choke.
I haven't used federal flight control wade I mostly use royal. That is true but you should try using different types of ammo to figure out their spread as well from the same range you used with the federal.
Andres Piedrahita I spent the summer/fall of 2013 doing exactly that with about 50 different shotgun loads. The results of many of those tests (not the buckshot though as I still have to edit and post those episodes) are up on my channel where you can see my typical setup for pattern testing. I have tested some of the Royal Buckshot loads, and from a patterning perspective my experience is that the Federal and Hornady loads using their rearward braking wads pattern much tighter. This test was more about penetration.
![More Stuff You Should Know About Buckshot [Part 2]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/Jf4i8gRTsJs/mqdefault.jpg)
Just found this video after ordering some of this ammo. I'm now a subscriber. Your narration is eloquent and informative. Thank you Sir.
Thanks for your kind comment! Cheers.
It's a shame there are not more people out there who will understand what's going on here. The FliteControl shell is amazing. Thanks very much for this great video, I appreciate how much work went into this video. Kudos sir.
Appreciate your encouraging comment! It was a lot of work, but it was also a lot of fun. Hope life re-aligns so I can make a bunch more soon.
@@Brobee223 You won't believe this, you are responding to a comment I left two months ago, but on Saturday I took a new shotgun out and compared/contrasted Flite Control v. regular 00 Buckshot. :) It's really impressive watching how well FliteControl keeps the groups tight. I was only to get out to 33 yards, but even at that distance, the group was impressive.
this stuff is heaven sent
i got 7 out of 9 pellets on a human torso target at 50 yards out of an open cylinder mossy 500
i've seen none better
Thanks for doing this test. I use the law enforcement version of this load (LE12700) for home defense. Looks like it might be a bit overkill when it comes to penetration :). Your video and narration skills are excellent, I look forward to more of your video.
I agree. You are a pleasure to listen to. Forgot I was watching youtube for a minute. You should do voiceover for national geographic
I like this video style. Hopefully you get more views. This is a great shell!
You are a pleasure to listen to buddy. Great test.
just bought some of these shells the other day decided to do some research on them after the fact lol, found this video and now I'm a subscriber I like your straightforward no BS approach. I'm not here to be entertained I want information and I got it thanks for the upload keep up the good work!
Federal .410 #4 and '000' buck through both a full choke barrel and a cylinder choke barrel at different distances. Loved the test and it does give shotgunners a good idea of what to expect. Keep up the good work,I'll keep watching and thumbing the vids up.
Something that would be interesting is to see how a cheap #00 loaf compares to the premium loadings, something like Rio.
I know the ammo is a very small part of the expense of running one of these tests, but I'd be happy to send up some Rio #00 to see it tested.
This was a phenomenal video. Definitely surprising results.
Thanks!
Very well done video. Informative, helpful footage, and to the point.
Thank you!
Great stuff Brobee, Thanks
Thank you!
Well done and well presented... That worked about as well as one might expect... Hornady now makes similar buckshot loads with similar wads in a Fast 1600 FPS 8 pellet 2-3/4 and a slower 1+1/2 ounce payload 3" version...
Thanks for your encouraging comment! Cheers.
Very humble and informative. Thank you!
Putting an additional gel block behind the original after the original had already been shot, and therefore compromised, was a flaw in the test.
The likely effect would be to channelize the shot through the path/s already made in the gel by the 1st shot, decreasing drag and extending the penetration observed in the 2nd block.
RX: "sneaking up on" your tests by starting with the longest range, and checking the results before proceeding to the more energetic short-range tests.
Impressive work!
Thanks!
I've already filmed a hevi-shot episode....just have to edit it....will be several weeks (maybe months!) still.
This is the version of 1145 fps or 1325 fps?
And this penetration results of federal flitecontrol, you believe is very good for 00BK, compared to other brands 00BK?
Thanks for the nice video.
I'd like to see a test of some canadian challenger slugs please
Love this product for hunting with a cyclinder bore 👍👍
Good luck!
Wonderful video! Your testing mistakes were perfect; you know what to change for the future, and the video was STILL very informative because you explained everything well. A++!
Some local Law Enforcement Officers told me that they had problems with LE 127 penetrating winter clothing (namely leather jackets) at 40 yards and beyond. I've yet to see a test of anything but Denim clothing against buckshot and would greatly appreciate a barrier penetration video.
Great video. I just purchased 25 boxes of this stuff. Were those different sized shot in your recovered pics?
The small copper plated bb's are .177cal bbs shot from an air rifle to calibrate the gelatin.
Beg to differ...:) I've tested both your statements and unfortunately they are untrue. Re velocity and barrel length - my measurements indicate that there is no appreciable difference in muzzle velocity with barrels any longer than 14 inches. Re Pattern - go check out what Dr. A.C. Jones's tests reveal in his book Sporting Shotgun Performance. My results on the subject of patterning mirror his.
Very informing and pleseant to view. One Q though. What choke do you use in your guns?
If I recall correctly, the barrel on this gun had a fixed improved cylinder choke. Cheers!
Really interesting, I appreciate you making this.
Thanks! I appreciate your comment. Cheers!
If possible could you test hevi-shot hevi metal for waterfowl hunting I would really like to see the results of the shots at different yardage and how well it penetrates. Also great videos love them!
I was about to ask if you were from Canada, but then I scrolled down
Yup - we live and play in Alberta.
@@Brobee223 the best province
Do they make a 3" Federal FliteControl Premium 000 Buckshot? If so I would love to see how such a tight grouping ammo would perform at longer ranges with the added weight of the 000 buckshot.
MrWhiltetail Yes, Federal does make a 3" version with the flight control wad. However, you only get 12 pellets instead of the 15 pellets you get in a Winchester Super X. I found the 3" at MidwayUSA
Very nice video.Could you please test buckshot without flitecontrol through a full choke at different distanses?
Have done this, and my results were that IC was the best choke for use with flight-control wads and buckshot.
@@Brobee223 I have seen that video but i wondered what is the best choke for buckshot with no flight control wad!!!
My defense buckshot Winchester 3 inch 00buck 12 pellets at 1,450 FPS and side saddle with Brenneke Black Magic 602 gr slug at 1,500 FPS with 3,042 ft lbs energy
Sounds scary!
I vote for federal tru-ball in 12g. Way to go cgner! Subscribed!
Just uploaded a review of Federal TruBall...:)
Your doing a great job... I'm a big fan. Keep it up fellow CGNer.
SBsasquatch...
I wonder if the texture on the pellets acts like golf ball dimples and reduce drag.
Interesting question!
I like your channel. Keep up the good work
How would you rate the Remington 2 3/4 00 law enforcement against a black bear?
Not that I would feel naked with a mag tube filled with 2&3/4 00 buck, but for black bear I would feel better if they were slugs.
Very good Brobee223. I like this review. I own a 1999 production Mossberg 590 with a 20" barrel. 8+1 round capacity. I've not had the opportunity to test the Federal 00 Flight Control rounds as yet. I do have some of the Hornady Critical Defense high velocity rounds and they seem to maintain a tight shot pattern as well although I cannot definitively say that they are as good as the Federal rounds in your review. I am a proponent of the 12 twelve gauge shotgun pump or semi auto simply for their versatility and lethality when that becomes necessary. A fight stopper at close range I would trust this Mossberg in a bad situation. Is the shotgun the be all end all in every scenario? Nope! A man once said that you need the right tool for the job. That said though a shotgun will provide your dinner or stop a very determined bad guy where a pistol may not. By the way. Another weapon at the Castle is an AR15. All the best to you Brobee223
No AR15s allowed for us up here. All the best to you too!
Dude you have to consider that your guns have like 18" barels and that spreads your pattern quicker. It also slows down the shot and increases muzzle jump.
00 Buck only loses about 2-3" of penetration from the muzzle to 50 yards in properly calibrated gel.
Great video subscribed
Thanks for video again))
Glad you enjoyed it!
even #4 buck will often still penetrate 8 to 12 inches at 50 yards
I do not like the deformation from the buffering. If you use high antimony shot it does not deform even without the copper plate. Federal is notorious for not adding enough antimony to prevent shot deformation. Then again to much antimony makes shot brittle, it will not dent but it will break. I have never tested buckshot but we have tested #9 birdshot used for skeet shooting. 6% antimony works perfectly for skeet shooting. Shoot a round of skeet with bulk ammo of your favorite flavor. Then shoot a round with Winchester AA ammo. Your score will improve with the AA. Most bulk shotgun pellets are flat when they come out of the barrel. I reload shells for skeet and sporting clays I spend the extra money for AA or Fiocchi shot.
Good test. Looks like 00 buckshot is still lethal at 40 yards.
Have piled up a lot of venison in the freezer using buckshot!
Terrific.
Thx!
Very Nice
Thank you!
Was this the 1145fps or 1325 fps ammo?
I think it was the 1145fps stuff.
Thanks for this.
Had a great time making it, thanks!
Would you test at 50m? How about 75m?
My opinion is that in the variety of shotguns I own, past about 50 yards the pattern is too open to be useful. I did take a deer this year at 55 yards with this load though; brought the camera too and made an episode covering the hunt, so check it out if you get a chance.
r these 2-3-4" or 3"?
2&3/4
THANKS
Great video! Very thorough.
I'm sorry, but I have to ask... Would you be willing to read me a bedtime story?
To be honest it is not uncommon for some hot high brass loads of #00 and #000 pellets to still penetrate 18 to 24+ inches of ballistics gel or living mammalian tissue as far out as 60 or 70 yards.
Remington's Quality control has gone to shit!!! And it sucks because I am a Remington man.
But I also got a IAC HAWK 981 combo barrel on it 18.5" and 26" barrel with choke and it's feels and shoots better then mine and my dads 870 😲😲😫😫
Good video and thanks for it and if you can can you do a long range gel test with .308 or 5.56 if you got it??? Something like 800+ yards that would be very much appreciated 🤓🤓🤓🤓🤓
Thanks! I was disappointed in Remington too, enough that I migrated over to the mossberg for a couple years. But now I'm back to shooting the 870 and don't seem to have any issues with my current police and wingmaster specimens. While I appreciate your suggestion on the long range rifle gelatin tests (and they would be very interesting!), I'm going to be focusing my limited hunting/camera time on a couple more shotgun hunting ideas. Perhaps in a couple years once the kids have moved out...hmmmm.......
Impressive shells but isn't that penetration a bit much for home defense/police distances? I find it strange that if this was a pistol video people would be losing their minds about "over penetration danger," yet I didn't see a single comment about it on this video. I'll stick with my 27 pellet #4 buckshot that you stoned a deer with at 20 yards. If that doesn't stop a home invader at 20 feet I have bigger problems.
I've done a lot of deer hunting with various forms of buckshot...for the purpose you describe above I'd choose 00 over #4.
I killed a deer with buckshot last year. killed one with #4 and shot one with #4 and I couldn't recover the deer. VERDICT: don't shoot them outside of 20-25 with #4. and 30-55 with 00 or 000,
Sorry to read you lost your deer! I consider myself lucky that I have not had to wrestle with that yet in the buckshot department, but suspect that might change if I hunt long enough with it.
USA! USA! USA!
??
You should have used a full choke instead of improved you'll get a way better grouping with a full choke than an improved choke
With loads using conventional wads I'd tend to agree, but not with loads using Federal's Flight Control Wad.
I've done extensive pattern testing with this load through about a half dozen different shotguns and the full gambit of chokes....my experience is that the load patterns the tightest in guns with little to no choke.
I haven't used federal flight control wade I mostly use royal. That is true but you should try using different types of ammo to figure out their spread as well from the same range you used with the federal.
Andres Piedrahita I spent the summer/fall of 2013 doing exactly that with about 50 different shotgun loads. The results of many of those tests (not the buckshot though as I still have to edit and post those episodes) are up on my channel where you can see my typical setup for pattern testing. I have tested some of the Royal Buckshot loads, and from a patterning perspective my experience is that the Federal and Hornady loads using their rearward braking wads pattern much tighter.
This test was more about penetration.
Ahhh I see now