NES with GREY Screen and Flashing RED LIGHT | Revisit
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- Опубликовано: 29 сен 2024
- This is the Nintendo Entertainment System I couldn't get working from this previous video: • A Subscriber sent me a...
It had a flashing red light at times, and also a blank grey screen. Is it the PPU at fault?, the lockout chip?, or is it just a dirty connector?
Let's see if we can get it working!
Hope you enjoy!
Steve
PS. I'm not an expert in repairs at all. I do this for fun, and it may not be the best or safest way to go about repairing broken stuff. I'm pretty good at melting plastic though. Please don't copy me - I'm an idiot.
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That is NOT dirt, its a reaction between the metal and the polish, it will keep coming up black till you polish away all the metal!
Glad I didn't keep scrubbing! 🙂
@@StezStixFix you might have no metal left! 🤪
Im glad someone said this before he keeps going in the future haha.
@@StezStixFix what flux do you use please?
I only use IPA and a pink eraser and 99% of the time all contacts end up looking new
Love your videos, Steve! Avoid metal polish on contacts, use contact cleaner instead.
Just wanna say ,I love your comedic timing, it's brilliant
Glad you got it working! At least your entire day of staring at a board got you somewhere. I hate when I sit there all afternoon and it's just as broken as when I started.
well done!
What kind of flux are u using in your videos?
you never mentioned if it's a pal system or ntsc?!
Flashing light is when it can't read the game. Thats normal with every NES.
If you can identify the pins that were shorted together by their number it's possible to know what signals specifically are causing the problem on the bad PPU. My guess is that they were pins 39 - 36. From the Castlevania screen that was messed up it looks like pin 37 (PPU AD1) might be having a problem. If you examine the incorrect letters on the screen you can see that bit1 is behaving as always 0 in the tile numbers.
I don't know if this can be overcome. You could try a 1K ohms or higher resistor connected to pin 37 and the other end to pin 40 which is +5v to give it a pull up. It could be that when they were shorted together it ended up burning out an internal pull-up resistor that existed inside pin 37. I've seen MaskROMs fixed by using external resistors so it may be worth a shot here. Better than throwing the PPU in the trash.
*Great info* 👍💪
He should definitly try this! Fixing a chip would be a new level of repair
I have 0 technical knowledge but reading comments like these is awesome.
Sounds like you have more knowledge of the PPU than I do, but for sure I wouldn't blindly try repair attempts without some degree of confidence at the very least that the repair attempt won't damage anything further.
I know we have logical implementations of the PPU in terms of FPGA cores. I wonder if the knowledge is out there... basically the schematic (there's another word for it... it escapes me... delidding the chip to trace it's die) for it to be possible to make an educated guess at what a repair attempt might look like?
I fully agree though. There is only a finite number of PPU's left in the world. I hate to see any die off as a result of a botched mod attempt.
@@brandonkick Testing it with a 10k ohms pull-up resistor for a short period of time to see if it makes a difference is unlikely to damage anything. It's not really a blind attempt. And yes it is possible to replace the PPU with a FPGA. I don't believe anyone has actually put in the work to make a drop in replacement yet, but it's possible. If the problem isn't a bad internal pull-up it could be a broken bonding wire which would be an even worse problem to have.
With the PPU already malfunctioning I think it's worth a try doing a quick test with an external pull-up resistor. I would start with a 10k ohms and then if nothing changes try a lower value, but without going lower than 1K ohms. He could get lucky and it might result in a fully working PPU again and it would make for a nice video outcome.
Never recommend using metal polish for cleaning any plated metals, as it will strip the plating right off the contact and usually results in the pins corroding down the lines, as they have no seal from oxidizing anymore. While the pins did seem really dirty, you would have been better off continuing to use the Eraser and IPA. It might never come out completely clean.
What the old buffoon did was corroding oxidizing) the pins with his polish. Beginner's mistake. :D
if you want to get crazy with it just use a magic eraser
The original modder probably put in too much solder on the socket's pins and it bridged on the other side. NES boards are an absolute nightmare to work on for beginner modders, especially if they're using cheapo tools.
Yeah thought the same thing.
Just an FYI, they do some Russian 'clone' PPU chips Called the UMC UA6538. And CPU clones called UMC UA6527P. I bought some on ebay years ago and i'm in NZ using a Pal system as well.
Congratulations Steve! You've done a tremendous job. Is so satisfying achieving success after so much hassle, isn't it?
Since NES has so many great mods, like the RGB, audio expansion to name a few, I'm most definitely looking forward for another revisit soon!
Hi Steve. I miss the cow/moo animation when you use the desoldering vacuum gun!! :D I respectfully request its return lol. Love your channel by the way. :)
Request accepted! 😁
To elaborate on the flashing screen. It's the lock out chip checking the cartridge chip for authenticity, and why it flashes is because when it does the check and doesn't recognise the cartridge/cartridge fails to communicate, the console forces a reboot and the cycle keeps repeating. So technically valid games might run, but they run only for that very short time when the console is communicating with the cartridge for the authenticity check. The lock out chips are notorious for being extremely unreliable.
Autosol is abrasive so the rag is black because of metal particles not dirt necisarily.
Question....Why did you not try the antenna connection as the first Thing. Why only use the coax... I think the fault chip would have worked if you used the antenna connection...
omg Steve , you have the patience of a saint ! nice work
Thanks Mart! 👍
That's what's left of the metal you're taking off the contacts mixed with the paste . It isn't dirt .
When I was an apprentice long time ago, my former boss said always "use sockets, it`s easier to replace the chips afterwards". My experienced colleague refused/ignored this and told me "I had too often problems in connectivity with those sockets". Amazing to see this issue being proofed decades later on youtube. Well done.
As someone who has been working on NES systems since he was 10, if your NES is flashing, disable the lockout chip. Hell, just disable it anyways if you can.
The game tries to handshake with the console at boot to authenticate the game, but if it fails that check it'll flag the game as a pirate game and cause the game to reset. If ANYTHING disrupts that handshake, it'll be flagged, even if the game is a legitimate game in good working order.
Hey I just wanted to give you props. I just fixed a radio for a car, and it was all thanks to the videos you make. They ordered a new one for 800$ so I decided to take it apart as it was getting replace anyway and i was able to look at it the way you do. I found an obvious problem and it was a super simple fix but I couldn’t have done it without you. Thanks so much from South Carolina USA
Awesome! Great job on the fix, and I'm glad my videos came in useful! 👍
As a North American, watching PAL games run at 50 fps throws me off every time.
I'm so glad you put the original PPU back in after changing the socket. I would have had an itchy brain if you hadn't have tried, even though I was expecting the PPU to behave bad, like it did in the donor system. Great vid!
Hey Steve, if you ever do another Nes fix or mod and you need to disable the lockout chip, there is a way to do it without damaging the lockout chip pin 4. You just have to ground pin 4 using two wires and Consoleunleashed has a guide to show you how to do it.
Whaaat???
STUPID GAME??? THATS THE BEST ONE EVER!!!
UNSUBSCRIBE!!! 🤣
No of course not 😃
Snake Rattle n Roll is totally my favourite nes game.
But damn, it is hard, very very hard.
You should give it a chance. It's one of those old non forgiving game. When u are out of continuous, then the only option is to start again.
I must say! Another great video from you Steve. But.... Do please forgive me 🙏 I kind enjoy seeing you suffer ehehe 😁. PS. Nice haircut mate 😉
Hey Steve, can you tell me how you're connecting the NES to the 10"-12" flat panel in your vid? Does that monitor have native connectors or are you using something like a retrotink?
Loved the video, you know if this fixing lark doesn't work out for you, you could always go back to song writing I loved Elbow back in the day and you guys should get back together
Fun fact about the nes when you push the cartridge in you dont have to push it down it makes contact and plays just fine if you push the game cartridge in and just turn it on
What's the bet that faulty socket had some microscopic whiskers in it's innards "Perhaps trimmed multicore wire?🤔" May have fried a perfectly good Chip, Anyway Nice diagnosis N Repair..
APU I dropped a 👉👍👈
Why don’t you look into making a new nes? There are lots of kits out there. You would get a new main board, with all the electronics. You do need to use some of the old chips from the board but I think you can also fit a hdmi port on it!
Bizarre that the socket itself was shorted, would've been cool if you had a look at it under the microscope to see how that was even happening in the first place
Yeah, I should have put that in, there was nothing obvious though. I'm guessing the desoldering gun sucked away some solder hidden under the socket. Can't see how else it was shorted (although I did break it trying to get it out too 🤦)
Probably too much solder applied by the modder and you removed it with the solder sucker
I really enjoy the raps, but It sounds like you are unsure. Or maybe it comes across that way for me.
And normally the disassembly and the error search are the most interesting part. Therefore I don't skip the rap :)
For the next time, how about singing more confident and clearer? ^^
Great job overall!
Remove the connection pin for the lockout chip. it's probably dusted. Some say clip and bend it, but just clip it twice and remove the leg entirely.
Who is "Bob" ;)? I can clearly hear that name on repeat while you are desoldering ?
Great repair! Thanks for taking the time to go through it and explain it. Plus, I always look forward to your Patreon rap. 😃
You can fix the faulty PPU you just need a 1K resistor between pin 37 and pin 40, sorry if i'm late
Really enjoy these videos BUT... I have to skip ahead whenever that annoying multimeter comes out.
the tip on your desoldering iron seems to big for these pins, also you should press the tip against the pin and let it sit there for about 5 or so seconds to give the heat enough time to melt the solder through to the other side and then suck it up
Also if you don’t get it all out the first time, fill the barrel with solder and try again!
Autosol is lovely stuff. The black stuff you rubbed of isn't dirt, it is metal residue.
8:55 I hope am not the only one that miss the cartoon cow.
Damn lip smacking ASMR
Before you even started fixing it I know what was wrong with it. It ain't got no gas.
Get in there Dave. Start pulling your weight in the videos.
You can disable the lockout chip without clipping/desoldering pin 4 on the CIC. You can do a 2-wire method as found here m.ruclips.net/video/b2RVY55sw0E/видео.html
Dang man faulty socket could have had you running around in circles for days. Nice catch 🍻
Best rule is boil your cartridge connector it’s almost always warped pins and dirt in it. The boiling cleans and somewhat reshapes the pins in the connector
Sorry Stez first 👎from me, can't agree with anyone who thinks snake, rattle n roll is a stupid game 😂 I spent many hours playing NES games and I loved it.
You know me, anything is stupid if I can't play it properly! Should just call it stupid Steve From now on I guess. 😁
Hello my breakfast, cause i'm a hungry man
Googled who the hell Jocky Willson is, google showd me picture of clearly drunk dude in bath holding darts with beer mug propped on his belly... that's enough internet for today :D
🤣🤣 legendary darts player!
Congratulations on your persistence. I did tech support for about 15 years so I can understand the frustration and the joy when you finally nail a particularly difficult problem ;D
Before using the desoldering station, add some more tin in the solderweld, then desolder it, works every time!
Maybe worthwhile checking the legs on the Faulty ppu maybe some Corrosion or a solder blob causeing bad contact.
Great video.
3:33 you are removing metal with that polisher... it only ends when you have no more metal
If you use a regular eraser, you make your work faster.
I have one regular white rubber (They don't leave stains) and one of those "blue pen eraser rubber" when i want to be more abrasive. You can also use "Automotive break cleaner instead of contact cleaner" but you have to clean it afterwards because it is corrosive.
Great vid Steve - well done for persevering - seek and yee shall find said the lord... Also, you have a bogey....
Yeah, it's gone now. 🤣
Helpful tip, if you are going to open up an NES, you might as well replace the 72pin connector. They are about $12 to $15 dollars on Amazon.
Yeah and get a deathgrip 72-pin. N-e-v-e-r replace the original 72-pin, if you can clean it.
@@danielsundqvist8413 I did not have that problem after I replaced my 72pin.
Mooing turned into a small man yelling Bob! Nice 👍
🤣🤣🤣
Pop on the mod board for the funzy, because you don't know how the chip fried, was it the mod ?
Yeah, could be the mod board. I think when I get back round to it, I'll use the dodgy PPU in it first and see what kind of screen I get before commiting the working one in it... 👍
Well done on fixing it, but your Bogie on your left nostril was really distracting!!!
🤣
Great Job Steve! weird goings on with that socket tho..
Snake Rattle & Roll is a weird but great game!
What "pee pee" module is for in NES? Pee pee? Literally? Pee pee you, and its faulty??? Some gimmicky add-on for early augmented reality? And why NES need good pee pee for working? This is all very complicated...
@MenaceInc 72.91% of viewers here just for the gorgeous thanksgiving odes to patrons, 22.09% here for the odes and funny stuff, 1% - for the odes, funny stuff and English ideal pronunciation learning , and only 4% for soldering and job lots off of eBay ... So ur explanation is helpful)
@MenaceInc still does handle them if it's still being used :P
I've become addicted to this channel, without really understanding many of the things you're doing and using. What is it you apply to the solder points before you solder? What do you use to clean the boards after working on them?
Flux helps melt the solder and probably rubbing (isopropyl) alcohol to clean.
Flux helps solder to flow more easily and redirects it where it is suposed to go, melting is done by the soldering iron/tip and has nothing to do with flux.
IPA is most commonly used as a cleaner for electronics.If you are interested in this stuff try it you dont have to spend much to get started and it is a great hobby.
Yep, flux to help the solder flow and Isopropyl Alcohol to clean up. 2 of the most important items you'll need (aside from a soldering iron 😁)
When warm enough to flow the solder really wants to stick to itself and other metals but oxides get in the way. Flux removes these oxides and prevents more from forming and clogging up the mix.
Now, now brother Steve! be careful what you put in the Socket the results may shock you, remember kids don't finger the Socket, It really Hertz 🤦♂
Seriously that was a very informative lesson, just because 'something looks good, it doesn't mean it is' Will be nice to see if the MOD still works 🖖
🤣🤣 thanks brother Steve! Yeah, can't wait to have another go at that mod! 👍
Wish I had your patience 👍
I can look at your face all day. Great work
Finally !! Now re instal the mod XD
Probably bad video ram chip
It will be the VRAM (Video RAM).
Change the 72 pin connector!
stupid ppu and the songs at the end are great lol
Did you try giving it the good old 80s slap to the side of the nintendo that worked back in the day. Wiggling the cartridge from side to side very fast would work aswell I've still got my old nes
Yeah, I even tried shouting at it! 🤣
@@StezStixFix a few years back I had to bend the pins in my nes the big comb looking thing the cartridge goes into. Reason was I had a game genie in my nes that made the cartridge stick out the console about an inch and over time it bent the pins out of shape. You cant push the game down like normal to play with the game genie
I can't tell from the accent, are you from the UK? If yes, be extra careful with NES cartridges. PAL region has 2 sub-region, PAL A and PAL B and they are not compatible. PAL A is UK and PAL B is basically rest of Europe. I see a big letter A on the Castlevania cartridge and if your console is the same then it shouldn't be a problem.
Usually the dirty part is the receiving side of the big black connector, not the edge connector on the main board side. You don't need to replace it, just clean it. Usually boiling in hot water, maybe adding a little dishwasher liquid can help but make sure you rinse it off, preferrably with some distilled water. Or apply vinegar, then rinse it off with alcohol. The point is you have to make it squiky clean and don't want any limescale to form on it either.
Never ending dirt story :)
Awesome mate 👏 👌 👍 🙌 😎
I'd recommend that you leave the mooing desoldering gun on the pins for a bit longer in the future.
You're not giving the gun enough time to soak heat into the board so it's not able remove the solder from the pins.
I'd also recommend adding fresh solder to the pins as well before desoldering.
I agree with Robin, and the same goes for your soldering iron Steve! Just give it a split second more dwell time, to let the new solder wick down into the vias - the ideal solder fillet should have a concave surface...
@@grmmmmhpph " the ideal solder fillet should have a concave surface..." I agree.
Yes, we want more mooooo!
"because quite frankly, I can't be ar..."
Honesty is always the best policy 😄 Great fix Steve, glad you got to the bottom of it.
Hey Steve this is Marcus from America. I think you have. Some faulty video RAM on the bad board. Sorry I'm a year late. But that might be your problem dude. Have you tried to switch the ram? As always. Great video😊. Especially on a rainy day like today. Keep on the good work. And I look forward on more of your repair videos.
When sped up and higher pitched, the mooing solder sucker sounds like it's saying "Bob... bob... bob... bob..." ^_^
Those RGB kits are fairly valuable, and not too easily aquired. I think it's one Australian bloke who makes them.
Yeah, Tim Worthington in Oz. 👍
Jockey on the Oche was My fave
Got a set of his 97% Tungsten Nails
That still give me results
Im still crap but 30+ 180
Cheers Jockey ya ol bastad ;-)
Need to boil the 72p connector.
Also, lifting pin 4 of the CIC isn't the most preferred method of disabling the lockout. Certain games won't work correctly. Granted, they are few and far between, but there are better ways of disabling it. There's a very advanced method, that should work with every game, but then there's a more simple way, by running two jumper wires. I'm not sure if there are any downsides of the two-wire method, but it's fairly easy and seems to work well as far as I know.
Also, the tension on the slot, i.e., how tight you screw the front screw, is critical. The front-loader is very finicky.
Nice job finding the shorts!
why do i hear at 9:09 bob
I'm going to put this out here as he's minutes into this. The fixes for this are a mix when it's not a true hardware fail, read on.
- 10NES chip, detach PIN#4, that is what causes it, also it doubles a a region lockout disabling that too.
- Boil the 72pin connector after using a pin to pull the cart touching part lower row up toward center. Boil 5min, remove, use cleaning kit on pin row, you'll see the invisible funk. Repeat until clean.
Doing that stuff I've taken a number of dead ones back to life.
Super Mario Browssss
Typically, the NES keeps resetting if the CIC chip can't communicate with the one on the cartridge. The graphics garbled is almost always caused by failure to communicate with the char ROM on the cartridge. When it runs bad code, that's typically failure to communicate with the program ROM on the cartridge. So 90% of the time, any of those failures indicate that the U-shaped contact pins on the cartridge side aren't working. One likely cause for that is the Game Shark, which aggressively contacted the pins back there and potentially deformed them.
I guess in this case it was a mod that caused most of the damage, but NES's decision to use that weird push-down toggle caused most of the problems with the system. The newer system that plugs the cartridges in vertically like should have been done in the first place is much more reliable.
NEVR use polish on contact connections. They are very bad for the boards and contacts. the best away to clean them is a pink rubber eraser. 99%IPA works as well. Also to clean the plastic cartridge holder just put it in boiling water for a little bit. Not too long though because you could warp the plastic. If you don't want to risk it then 99%IPA works great.
I got a "broken" NES that had the same symptoms as yours. All I had to do is boil the 72 pin connector and bend the cartridge side pins a little back up. Now every (good shape) game boots up every time even without me pushing down the cartridge with the lockout chip intact as well. I also wouldnt recommend disabling the lockout chip because it's a good indicator of how good your game is. If it needs cleaning, it will show up.
9:01 the sped up solder sucker sounds like a person calling for "Bob!"
Bob!
Bob!
Bob!
Bob!
Bob!
Metal polish will produce a black residue forever. It's some chemical reaction of the polish with the metal.
I had a garbled image because of the 72-pin connector. I pulled it out, poured rubbing alcohol into it, then inserted the cartridge into it a bunch of times to clean the contacts. Then I also did the same thing where it connects to the main board.
StezStix we have the same Binoculars, "Nature Product" on the inner right bar is written.On the left inside is written 52 [ ]17
Contact pins are either gold or silver plated. The black you see is rubbing away the Silver coating. You would have been better to clean with DeOxit which is safer.....
Removing the lockout chip is dumb. 90% of the problems are your 72pin. Boil it!
I know this is an older video and maybe other people pointed that out already, but I am a bit concerned of the way you are desoldering the sockets and the big ICs. It looks like the desoldering iron with the pump can't suck out the solder from the other side of the board and it looks like it is very easy for the trace to come out with the pin it is connected to. It certainly happened to me before with SMT pads. I guess THT pads are more robust thanks to the plating inside the hole.
What I had great results with, was a desoldering alloy. Add a little bit of it to the solder joint with the iron and it starts melting at 80°C. Then you can very easily extract the part with a hot air solder station (There are very cheap and suprisingly well working ones on Aliexpress) set to a low temperature, so it can not melt any plastic parts close by. The heat capacity of the solder also keeps it molten for a surprisingly long time. Removing it with copper braid is also very easy but also necessary if you are going to install the part somewhere else. You can buy the alloy on Amazon. It is a little bit expensive, but you also don't need that much of it.
Do you have a branded sticker somewhere I could buy? Preferably one with your face and the words "stupid game" on it?
Edit: I found the captain bodge one on your merch store but I'm not a fan of that.
first:
the desolderer in fast forward, sounds like a little german.. (work, work, work)
second:
I think I have the same tripod.
I would have just hit it with some brake parts cleaner, or electronics cleaner stuff is pretty aggressive but in my limited experience with it hasnt harmed anything.
Tye sped up mooing solder suckered needed to say EXTERMINATE!!!! at the end. Great vid mate