Deep Rock Galactic | The Problem With Engineer Primary Weapons
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- Опубликовано: 10 сен 2024
- In this video we are going to be discussing all of the primary weapons for the Engineer class in Deep Rock Galactic. I have heard a lot of complaints about Engi's weapons, at least the primary weapons. I think is for one major reason though.
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#drg #deeprockgalactic #discussion
Engi's primaries are really Personal Defence Weapons, as their main role is to allow him to defend himself at close range, not to contribute to the team's DPS output. His secondaries, turrets, and grenades do the jobs that the team really needs him for, which is area denial and quickly deleting high HP targets or clumped up groups of trash mobs.
Agreed. His primaries are built so that you don't die to swarmers and grunts because your turret is targeting different enemies. They aren't intended as a competitor to a minigun/flamethrower/etc.
This sounds good, but the Warthog is awful. I can't come up with any reason, beyond personal preference, for using it in Haz 5.
@@thenightingale7405 I can't think of any reason anyone would choose any weapon aside from personal preference, its not like there's anything stopping you from choosing anything, aside from certain toxic people perhaps?
@@battleoid2411 It's a close range weapon with low ad clear potential which means you're probably going to get swarmed if you use it. At least, that is my opinion.
@@thenightingale7405 Dunno, I use mini shells and had no problems with it on deep dives.
It's a bit underwhelming otherwise though, the reload is too long.
As a player whose only maximum ranked dwarf and whose main dwarf by extension is Engineer, his primaries (I think) are “supposed” to have synchrony with the turrets, if that makes sense. I presume the devs have an assumption that, when playing Engineer, your turret or turrets (depending on how you build your turrets) are “supposed” to compensate/offset what firepower the primary weapons bring to the table.
When you consider Engineer has access to overclocks such as mini shells, turret em discharge or turret arc, explosive chemical rounds or executioner, and mods such as turret whip, the electric mods on stubby, and the range buffing lenses on the lok-1, there is an impression that your primary weapons are aimed to put in work that the turrets do not. The same reasoning can be applied with the secondary weapons, but while the secondary weapons are known for their overkill power in numerous regards, the primary weapons complete the jobs the turrets do not necessarily specialize in.
I’ve found the turrets being best at residual damage, swarm slow down, and area control, and this goes for either a one turret or two turret build. Whatever the mission, I am prepared to have all my weapons and tools do work, and I don’t feel like my primary weapons are going to do an undermined job.
If I got the warthog, I’ll be reliably taking down the health of larger enemies, which is something the turrets can do, but not always efficiently, especially when the turrets can handle swarms and smaller enemies with more idea efficiency.
If I got the stubby, the electricity offsets the raw bullet damage of the stubby, so the ammo efficiency is top notch, and my turrets aren’t wasting ammo inadvertently, and this makes swarms less costly toward ammo.
If I have the lok-1, my range is far superior than the range of my turrets, therefore my turret’s longevity is increased, and depending on what overclock I have on, the health of various enemy types are drained quickly with minimal danger.
I’ve played and main many engineer type characters in multiple shooters, and from that I’ve learned how much the turret-part of the character is not the main course; rather, the turrets are side dishes and the main course is how well you, the actual engineer, utilize and bring the entire meal together, if that makes sense. If you think a part of your meal is underwhelming or a different part of it is too overwhelming, it’s not necessarily the part of dish at fault, but the synchrony and offset BETWEEN them all that is the reason why for these senses of being underwhelmed or overwhelmed.
Do I see why people say Engineer’s primaries are underwhelming? Yes, sure.
Do I agree? No, not really, I’m used to the holistic aspect of finding full use in each function of Engineer’s kit.
I hope this helps, as long as this comment was! Rock & Stone!
Edit 6-1-23: It’s really cool to see all the positive feedback and I’ve since then got every class to Legendary tier as of yesterday!
Nice analysis. Playing Engineer is a juggling act and understandably it isn't for everyone. Would still love to see the Warthog get the GK's recent treatment 😅
synergy might be a better fit for the word than synchrony
Good analysis also i feel that the meal comparison but the turrets are more of a cherry on top then a side dish but it works
@@jakiru8783 better not take my minor adjustments
I'm not an engineer, I'm a chef. And you're just a part of my 5 course haz 5 BANQUET.
Engie’s playstyle is less of being the “wall” that bugs have to get through, that’s Gunner’s job, but rather being the guy who thins down the hoard, giving his teammates some extra leeway. His secondaries and turrets excel at that, but his primaries are more focused on supportive roles. The Warthog is good at clearing smaller groups of grunts, Stubby debuffs the bugs, slowing them down, and the Lok-1 clears flying enemies quite nicely.
the Lok can also be a very very effective weapon for both single targets and groups when using the Explosive Chemical Rounds overclock
As someone who has just started gunner. I can say I feel like anything but the wall. I feel more like the liability. Mini gun is not good for groups, and I think I miss almost everything. I miss my flamethrower.
@@jakeryan2805 May I introduce you to: Area Damage Autocannon
@@andreacarnevale3152 I haven't unlocked it yet. Will that help me more if im used to driller weapons? I cant aim for the bloody life of me with the tiny line of minigun. Only hit big boys or dread rumps. Lmao
Look at neuro lasso.
It's a debuff which works best when you're not actually firing your rounds.
Engi is built around his ability to control the flow of the bugs, with his Turret at the heart of it all.
That's something i think new players might have to learn, as it's not immediately apparent when first starting.
Engi has a "loop" to his play, in that you're meant to be traversing the cave while always looking for places for your Turret(s). If you're not proactive with your turret you're going to feel underpowered.
The primary is meant to be your "mop up" weapon while you get from one vantage to the next, and to clean up heavier targets your turret is focusing.
Engi is very much a class you have to use every tool to make the most of the class, and the primary is just one part of that ensemble. In a vacuum the primaries will look bad in comparison to the other class primaries also in a vacuum.
But together with the Turret, grenades and even the platform gun with the bug repellent, that's how you make Engi be the most OP in the game
Based take here
*edit:* autocorrect...
Scout picks off priority targets, Driller and Engie thin down the hoard with DoT and numerous guns respectively, and Gunner is the literal wall that the bugs have to get through.
Every class has its role and you described Engie’s role better than I could have.
As an engi main, you do not need to completely play around your turret. Most of my builds, the sentry is just a support and area denial tool.
its too complicated when you realize you can just shoot as gunner and achieve identical results.
@@swolzer True, but some players enjoy the complexity of engineer. I know, I do.
I think Engi's primaries are perfect, because if you try to defend yourself with JUST your primaries, you will run out of ammo very quickly. Your primary is not for horde clearing, it's for mopping up after your team and your turrets. Whenever I go back to engi after playing other classes for a while I always die a ton, because I forget that turrets are this classes bread and butter. They can be unassuming and you may not notice them when they're there, but you DEFINITELY notice when they're not.
With OCs and experience of course this can change a lot, but at baseline this is how the game wants you to think. You are a master of area denial, so while other characters like to hop all over the place during hordes, you are at your strongest when you dig your boots in at one spot and fight like hell.
100% agree with you. Adding on, I love Engi because their role really brings results when you for utilize their whole kit. The idea of them is that they have a right tool for any wide variety of problems. I mean sure I can play Haz 4 or 5 on gunner or even driller without touching my secondary, grenades, and utilities if I have the right set up for the primary. (Interesting enough challenge btw.) But it’s satisfying to use the whole tool belt efficiently and effectively vs 1 tool that can do it all. They say engi can perform all roles the same if not better than the other classes. While I don’t completely agree with that statement, I do agree that they are versatile and have an answer for most situations. Can’t tell you how many times my turrets saved me when I got grabbed. I’m not an engi main but I do love them and the results they bring.
I don't think this is the way intended to play as eng, if you remove shield from Gunner he is still gunner, same as flares and C4s... but with eng without the Turrs u've only your secondaries to rely on. Maybe some changes in the class overhaul
@@wellingtondacruz4082 I disagree with your point about the support tools. Gunner without shield is no longer a revival ace, scout without flares can no longer efficiently comb every inch of a cave, and driller without c4 couldn't teamkill nearly as efficiently (joke, but also not really a joke lmfao)! At the risk of sounding like I'm sucking GSGs dick, I really do think they've balanced each classes entire kit insanely well so that everything TOGETHER gives the class its identity. In my 12 days and 20 hours of in-mission time as JUST engi, I've personally very rarely run into serious ammo issues, so long as I play smart. Though I could be in the minority.
Fatboy says hi.
Stubby clears hoards and never runs out of ammo
Engi’s primary’s are his *second* line of defence. He was designed to work around his guns, so his primary (which isn’t meant to be his main damage source) takes a backseat to the aimbot guns.
No, it takes a back seat to the SECONDARY, which is the actual primary, and the "primary" *synergizes* with the turrets, making them both stronger.
I feel that the raw power you can get out of Engie's secondaries make the primaries have to be a little underpowered to balance them, but the small pool of ammo for their secondaries makes them run out quickly, while the primaries sometimes feel like they're not doing much. So green beard engie's may be struggling to play the class well from underusing their turrets.
And then there is the turret(s). They are almost a 3rd gun by itself.
My PGL (11121) with RJ250 Compound overclock disagrees haha. Shoot one in the middle of a hoard and all the grunts burn until they vaporize in a few seconds (when not they are severely weakened). The fact it has 22 rounds makes sure you're never out of ammo on tricky situations.
@@shimadabr green beards. My comment was discussing green beards playing engie.
I think if you're overusing Engi's primaries it can really feel like you have a bad ammo economy, but if you're taking full advantage of your turrets, secondary, and throwables it's not bad at all.
I've been playing Engi for a long time and I had forgotten how rough it feels to play him without upgrades and overclocks. As a fully kitted out engi I don't find I have these problems. My warthog damage and ammo management is pretty good. Better than scouts. With experience you will end up fighting along with your turret when the horde arrives and you're only using your primary on its own when moving between caverns.
Yeah I noticed that when I played a game where I brought nothing, and it was a bit of a rough mission.
Engineer's damage and contribution to his team is spread out across his entire kit, rather than (mostly) condensed into their weapons like gunner/driller, you gotta use your whole kit to make the most of it.
As an Engineer player- primaries are terrific. Even the stubby which I consider the weakest is still extremely good.
His primary can be built anyway the player wants. Engineer is a jack of all trades type dwarf.
Single target dmg? Executioner/CycleOverload
Swarm clearing? EM Refire/Turret whip.
Want infinite ammo? Light-weight rounds.
Want a better Warthog? Magnetic Pellet Alignment.
Don't even want to aim? ExplosiveChemRounds.
This is without accounting for his secondary (which is even stronger in most cases) and his nades (plasma and mine, VERY GOOD STUFF)
Whoever complains about ammo issues are forgetting to put down their sentries, lol.
I hate it when I run out of ammo for my sentries
Explosive chem rounds + plastacrete catalyst = being able to clear dreadnoughts and big hordes of literally any kind of enemy in 10 seconds max
@@creeperizak8971 Same. If I choose the fast build mod for the sentries, then I run out of ammo quickly. If I choose the ammo mod, then setting up the turrets becomes a chore because both turrets take 4 seconds to build.
@@creeperizak8971 I had this problem because I used the sentries as a independent damage source (as in I let them cover angles I wasn't looking at), which led to them facing multiple bugs alone which eats through their ammo fast. My playstyle now is to run defender system and play in the cone they cover, getting stuck in the fight while they support me. That way, I found myself running out of ammo around the same time my sentries were.
tbh light-weight rounds is kina weak. idk which one is better LWR or minishells but imo if u want a primary with lots of ammo i would go with stubby and if u want to be able to spam it all day then put the ammo mods or the ammo oc on it.
I believe Engineer's primaries exist to eliminate the survivors of those targeted by his secondary weapons and turrets, his primaries are the sidearm to the power weapons of his secondary slot.
That's how I use them anyway, and as general personal defence between large waves of enemies, but whenever there's more than a handful of grunts, the secondary comes out to obliterate them, the sentries deal with swarmers, and the primary extinguishes the survivors that slip past it all.
Now you can also use the swarm grenade to eliminate the swarmers!
Yes. 100%
Gotta love the question of "What's the problem with the Engineer Primaries?" being answered with "There is no problem."
Engi's primaries are very good as an all around tool, his secondaries are where his big burst damage lies, the others are more support tools than anything.
I honestly haven’t been paying attention to this video but I want to say thank you for the background noise, your tone and delivery is really well done for someone I don’t think is using a script.
Thank you very much!
I have only played like 30 games with random at most so my sample size is small, but I noticed a lot of engineers usually forget about their turrets, platforms and relied on their primaries and or the damn grenade launcher (usually of the nuke variation) It's a bit frustrating since their primary doesnt help a lot and the nuking get old fast when they are used mindlessly and end up hindering everyone. I understand that setting up turrets is a hassle and requires some planning which many seems to lack (or dont take the fast build upgrade)
1. teams run around.
2. You have to build the turrets
3. If they’re built, they have to physically move from their last location to the new location.
4. They have low ammo capacity.
Their turrets are also very low damage.
Part of the reason why turrets are underused is because, on the surface, they lack damage. Turret whip shows you absolutely no stats, so you can't tell how much damage it does or if it even has AoE. The same applies to Stubby's turret overclocks.
I feel like Engineer's primaries are fine, same with the other classes. I agree with having trouble balancing Engi cuz he also has the turrets. The turrets I feel like kinda take away from the ammo Engi would otherwise have had on his weapons. Rock and Stone!
Maybe the solution could be to make a couple new slot options in that category for Engineer, one of which could be some sort of ammo pack?
@@jakiru8783 Perhaps yeah, that might work
Rock and Stone!
One thing I noticed about Engi over my time playing it is that he's not ammo inefficient, at least not to the point most players tend to believe.
He is simply very fast to kill stuff, which obviously burns a lot of ammo. After all, your turrets passively engage everything at the range, providing constant firepower.
Sometimes it's better to stop pulling the trigger at every enemy that enters your line of sight and let turrets and other players take care of it. You let the guns rip during swarms and dangerous waves, and at High-Value targets.
Exactly my thoughts as well. On Engie the TTK is insanely low for most bugs, making it REALLY easy (and satisfying) to just ammo dump and kill everything in sight. I too thought ammo economy was trash on Engie in the beginning, but the problem was just me blowing my load in every fight. Took me running flat out empty on several missions before I learned that I don't HAVE to kill every bug in the cave, and to remember there are three other dwarves with big guns too.
I'm a rj250 user. I'm a strong independant engie, i don't need no scout to reach high up minerals!
That is a really fun overclock.
More ammo than a pack rat could dream of and still killing groups
I think my favorite combo for engie is shock stubby and diffractor with bonus vs shocked.
Incredibly simple, but versatile and effective.
That is pretty nice.
For the engineer Lok-1, I’d love to see a toggle mode between manual fire and lock on, something like that would be interesting.
Another concept would be an overclock that removes the lock on entirely, and automatically hits enemies at a certain range or something like that.
For shotgun, would absolutely adore slug rounds as an option or something like that.
For stubby, always didn’t like it too much. Would be interesting to see it fire something like little nails instead, plenty of fun ideas to mess around with there
In the DRG board game, any class can equip any secondary. But Engineer's primaries have become his secondaries and vice versa.
So you could be Gunner with his Lead Storm minigun primary and Warthog shotgun secondary. Or you could be Engineer with a Breach Cutter and a Bulldog.
I feel as though this strength in secondaries is reflected in the actual game. His primaries are fine.
That sounds interesting.
His primary weapons shouldn’t be strong. His secondaries are huge wave clears, and his sentries are good sustained support. His primaries are pretty much for taking out a few stragglers too keep yourself alive
Engineers weapons are pretty strong. He is by far the most powerful dwarf in the game. His killing potential and capability is insane. He needs a nerf or everyone else a buff
but the gunner has shield
@@RAiNfORAiNbOW If you are good, you won't need one
@@arturmagomedov02 bros solution is literally git gud lol
Balanced by short range
By any chance are you an engineer main?
Maybe some tweaks for the stubby and definitely some more interesting warthog overclocks, (Dragon's Breath shells or single Slugs would be really cool) but other than that they do their job. Love your videos, ron!
ong i would love different ammo types, and birdshot would also be cool lmao.
@@aquapotato.. I'd love birdshot for taking down Macteras, and those stupid jellyfish.
Like TF2 engineer’s primaries are secondaries.
Especially the way the classes are designed is three of them have powerful primaries with a lot of ammo with a secondary to back them up when you need either a different function or when you just need a back up. Engineer has the reverse for functionality, but the same order for ammo.
Lok1 (ECR & 21111) & Shard (VIE & 31111) is my all around engi build. Can handle swarms well (ecr) and melts things at range (hit w lok1 to add electric effect then hit w shard to melt). Absolute snipes things at range.
I like to build the stubby to increase accuracy and damage, basically turning it into a shittier version of the GK2. Very consistent damage even from medium range (20-30m), and tears through grunts with headshots.
Cool!
I mean, they could make an OC for the Lok that turns it into a slow automatic with increased reserve ammo. Not sure that it'd be an amazing OC but at least it could be a different new way to play the gun.
The Lok-1 needs an Unstable OC that turns it into the Smart Gun from Aliens.
Thats almost like high accuracy minishells shotgun
Make it a tier 2 mod (replacing the zoom lens that I don't think anyone uses) and have it fire in bursts of 3, triggering ECR and... ECR.
Engie's primaries are fantastic, I don't know what anyone is going on about. And except when I was brand new, I rarely ever have ammo difficulties with Engie. What with turrets, nades, and teammates, I rarely feel much strain on my primary or secondary ammo, unless I'm running an anti-Dreadnought build or Fat Boy.
Engineer is, without a doubt, not a single target class. It has single target weapons (shard diffractor, arguably breach cutter) but mostly shines vs masses of little stuff especially in entrenched positions. For example Stubby EM Discharge + Gemini + Plastcrete Catalyst Shard Diffractor or FatBoy PGL absolutely destroys salvage/escort missions because you can kill obscene numbers of bugs with your many sources of area damage even after the turrets are dry. I use this build substantially when playing with basically anyone that deals single target damage (i.e. a minigun/rocket gunner or hyper propellant/breachcutter engineer). I do switch to Seeker Rounds Lok1 for all other mission types though, much easier to avoid the long setup times and better ammo efficiency vs dreadnought and caretaker.
That said, I don't think engy is ammo inefficient, I would actually argue the opposite, since normally the reason I'm taking resupplies more than my teammates is because *I'm killing almost everything* and even then I rarely need a second reload from a given supply pod. Of course the instant we get like a bulk detonator or something similarly bullet spongey I struggle but that is what team is for.
Engineers get twice the kill count of any other class in pretty much every game I ever played.
I run Executioner LOK, Breach Cutter with returning rays for hordes and Shredder Swarm Grenades for personal protection. Yes, I may tend to spend ammo a little bit faster than everybody, but I feel that I'm using it way more efficiently than any other class.
Exactly, this video is for the 8 year olds that just want to point and shoot. Engi is the most efficient killing class in the game. The notion that anything about the class needs to be “buffed” is ridiculous.
Heya, Serket the Baby Engie from last year here. I’ve played a lot more and have obtained a bunch of overclocks for all of Engie’s weapons now. Here’s how I feel about the primaries.
Warthog: The middle of the road. It’s reliable, but it’s reliably middling. The best I’ve ever done with it was full-auto at point blank in a Praetorian’s rear. In that specific scenario, it will kill in a regular sized clip. The best thing to really be said about this weapon is that it can sometimes oneshot grunts at point blank, using 1/6th of a magazine.
Stubby: The weakest of the three (I have the fewest overclocks for it as well). It doesn’t excel in any category I’ve tried it in. Electric DoT just isn’t that damaging, and is best used for slowing down targets. The best I’ve ever done with it was in a Critical Weakpoint mission, with the +30% Weakpoint Damage upgrade. It was good, I felt. Since then I’ve learned that anything is good on Critical Weakpoint missions. This is Engineer’s worst gun in any slot in my opinion.
Lok1: The best of the bunch. To what the Shotgun flaunted earlier, being able to one tap a grunt at point blank, the Lok1 says it can do the same with 3 shots and Electric DoT, or 5 shots and no DoT, through armor. That’s still under 1/6th of a standard 36 round magazine. With overclocks, this thing becomes more useful than you can imagine. Neuro Lasso slows down even Dreadnaught level enemies at effectively no cost. The Clean OC for Magazine size and Target Amount makes the gun a general use beast, capable of blitzing down anything up to a Praetorian. Then, we get up to the big names, and some of my least liked OCs; Executioner will just rip through an enemy’s Weakpoint, while Explosive Chemical Rounds is a straight damage upgrade in the form of an AOE if you play it right. With that said, both of these OCs chug ammo like no other, and are the reason I think the gun runs dry so fast. I don’t use them. The Lok1 is capable of burst damage to high value targets, taking out entire swarms of Swarmers, Exploders, or Shredders, and better yet you can finagle the bullet path to hit behind walls and armor alike. Of course, that’s if you’re not using my new favorite OC. I don’t remember what it’s called, but it allows you to shoot through walls. This ignores terrain and armor alike, the two areas this weapon can suffer. Because it ignores armor, the damage per shot gets better, meaning it can save you ammo as well. This gun is definitively Engineer’s most powerful weapon in any slot, at least in my opinion.
Stubby is so underrated. It has the kind of cool utility with em discharge and turret arc just like how the lok 1 has the lock feature. The warthog is just kinda underwhelming besides turret whip, and I still barely use that
I use the Stubby with the EM Refire Booster Overclock and the Shard Diffractor with the Efficiency Tweaks Overclock
paired with the Shredder Swarm Grenade,
Deep Pockets, Veteran Depositer and Resupplier Passive Perks,
and Beast Master & Dash Active Perks.
I use the Stubby as my primary because a Crowd Control weapon as it generates electric fields that applies the slow down electric effect on multiple grunts, paired with the EM Refire Booster Overclock that increases the Fire Rate, Electric Damage, and Spread which overall makes it better at Croud Contol, while the Fire Rate makes applying the Electricuted status effect a lot faster.
as for Mods, I got Expended Mags and Increased Ammo while all the other mods benefit Electrical Damage.
I prefer to use the Stubby as my form Croud Control over the Grenade Launcher or Breach Cutter because it removes AOE Friendly Fire towards my Squad and most importantly my Steeve.
I use the Shard Diffractor as my secondary because It covers all the weaknesses my Stubby as, being poor Range and Single Armored Target Damage.
I have the Nitrogen Vaporizer (Armor Break), Soft Tissue Disruption (Weakpoint Damage), and Hydrogen Rupturing Mods equipped,
the Hydrogen Rupturing Mod makes it so the Shard Diffractor does 33% more damage to Electrified Enemies which all makes the Diffractor pair so well with the Stubby.
As for my perks and choice in throwable,
I like having multiple sources of "AFK Damage" so I can focus a bit more on gathering resources, doing the objective, building, repairing, or hacking while in combat scenarios.
such sources of "AFK Damage" are my 1 or 2 Sentry Guns, Steeve Grunt Guard, and Shredder Drones.
I have Veteran Depositer and Deep Pockets equipped because it increases my efficiency at gathering and depositing resources, which helps fortify my support role and Resupplier because I believe it's just the best Passive Perk in the game.
The faster rate of Resupplying paired with the Increased Health and Magazines filled makes it so much more reliable to resupply during stressful situations,
like fighting the Caretaker or clutching a Swarm.
My whole Engineer Loadout focuses a lot on Support as I can deal damage and gather resources at the same time which benefits my team strongly.
Awesome, that is a fun build to run!
DRG is all about play style and taste. I started playing with the engineer, but as of now I believe it's the most challenging kit overall.
Driller: area dps, lots of ammo, can drill tunnels to avoid ambushes and flanking.
Gunner: lot of firepower, different weapons, shield is an unbreakable barrier, mountains of ammunition.
Scout: great firepower for both short and long range, cool grenades, lots of mobility lots of versatility.
Engineer: main weapons have limited range. Very limited range. Secondary weapons are cool, but have few, very few ammunitions. Can't traverse terrain quickly, can't burrow or fly or hover midair. Turrets take time to build and target one enemy at a time. Flares are somewhat dark, too.
I would totally agree with that.
I think people expect engie to just clean hordes on it's own but like other classes in DRG, they all fill in the gaps of each other. Giving engie the same fire power of another class would make it unbalanced
But engie is perfectly capable of taking a swarm on alone. All of the classes support each other really well but they can all still hold their own solo
@@Omegaset yes, but for example, gunner and driller clean it with much more ease that's what I meant
Stubby all electricy upgrades+shard diffraction with the bonus damage at electricy=a pretty insane combo in my opinion
I've been testing stub builds and it is by far my fav of the 3 primary guns. Running with either the bonus damage for shard and electricity or a nuke build grenade launcher to better hit vital spots after stun. ALL the ammo is needed to make up for lack of damage. Short bursts to mitigate spread and I end with top kills most missions.
I think the main complaint with engi should be that the weapons have a learning curve steeper than most other weapons in the game, learning to let your turrets take care of the hoard, learning to use your grenades to mop up bugs and keep them in LOS if your turrets, knowing the right time to switch to your secondaries to tear through a pack of bugs, also, the weapons themselves have a learning curve, Warthog you realllly want to aim for crits, where with most other shotguns you just want to hit meat shots, Stubby has less of a learning curve (and that’s why it’s kinda underpowered) when not considering overclocks but turret placement becomes really important when you do consider the two overclocks there, and LOKI has one of the steepest learning curves in the game, learning to pick out high value targets and get the most of your bullets can be really powerful, but it’s hard to do. Who would expect the Engineer to make you think?
I play 3 engie builds, and they use all weapons available. Main build uses Lok-1 + Breach Cutter and can be used for every mission, but it was designed for Eggs, Salvage, Mining Expedition and other kinds of "common" missions. Lok-1 provides AoE and long-range, while Breach Cutter shreds through stronger enemies and large waves. Dreadhunter build uses Shard Diffractor to kill bosses and enemies at long range, while Warthog quickly fends off everything when I'm swarmed. And finally, the nuclear build - Grenade Launcher [obviously with Fat Man] and Stubby with all the ammo mods it can take to offset deficit of ammo caused by Fat Man. This build exists because Industrial Sabotage is such annoying mission that Fat Man makes much easier to complete faster.
Each one of primary and each one of secondary weapons of engie offers a solution for different problems, and all find their usage. I think Engie has the greatest variety of available builds, so also extremely high flexibility and adaptability. It's okay that his primaries are somewhat boring, because their task is to provide reliable source of damage, while his secondaries are meant to truly shine.
People are dumb. Full auto shotty is absolutely metal in addition to being an incredibly useful and versatile weapon.
I love the Lok-1 smart rifle and it's my go-to for any mission thats not about killing bosses, since it's weakness is being unable to blast weakpoints that the smart lock cant lock onto (and the turret doesnt really help against either). You can usually make up for this weakness with your secondaries, but I cant bring myself to ever leave the breach cutter behind, so I guess that's on me.
Feel the last part, I have my pgl set up as a grunt cleaner with rj250, its sooo convenient but kinda useless against everything but large groups
My only problem with them is that ECR Lok-1 outclasses all of his other primaries in crowd control by such a significant margin that I always end up using the Lok-1 and never his other primaries because all of his secondaries are so much more flexible
yeah the lok is pretty much straight up better than all the other primaries but the lok is much harder for new players and it generally needs some skill which is why fewer people use it. i mean than again after like 350h of the game i pretty much cycle though out every gun in the game even if they are worse because unless im playing haz 6x2 the game is easy enough that u can use what ever u want and do fine. and tbh i like cycle overload for elimination more then lok anyway.
I agree, engie has so many other crowd options, it almost feels redundant to spec his primary for crowd stuff too
My struggle with engineer is always ammo management. I often wind up sticking with my primary for too long and placing turrets at every opportunity, so typically I’m left with the secondary and the nades I always forget to throw.
To solve this I’ve started switching more often or looking for opportunities for the secondary to take out a large group with one shot, remembering that I have grenades, and deciding whether to use 2, 1, or no sentries for a given encounter.
For some reason, the LOK is the easiest for me to ammo manage. I go for max ammo grenade launcher so I can use it more freely and mostly engage priority targets and that seems to disappear my issues with ammo.
In addition to the flexibility you mentioned, I would add as an engineer main that he has the greatest number of combos with weapons. Almost all of his weapons interact with his other weapons/turrets, or have increased damage when stacked on effects from other weapons. Things like using the stubby to proc shock damage on a bug then finishing it with the diffractor, or using turret whip to get better ammo efficiency from his turrets, or using the BC to set a target on fire so the LOK can do better damage, or exploding platforms with the SD for massive CC...
Even without playing smart, engineer gets top kills almost every mission, so it's hard to argue that he needs a buff. A good engineer can double the gunner's kills by playing to the strengths of all engineer's tools.
The main problem with Engineer is that his turrets have no fucking ammo reserves. You get 1-2 engagements, and then you have to hit up the resupply (and a double dip, at that). They need to at least double the ammo reserve for his turrets, so that you can go 3+ swarms without resupplying (and comfortably so) like the other three classes. Alternatively, improve the turret AI so that they only fire at enemy weak points (and just simply do not fire if they can't hit a weak point), which would accomplish the same thing for their ammo economy.
Everyone sets expectations for gameplay functions, but in reality every tool has upsides and downsides it's just up to us as players to find the uses.
That is a very good way to put it.
Guys, one thing that I love about both TF2 and Deep Rock Galactic engi class (and that's something you have to understand to play well with it) is that engineer is a SUPPORT class!! You guys will get a MUCH clearer view of the purpose of each weapon with you think "how does this help my team?":
-The shotgun gives the engineer independency for doing quite a reliable damage when properly upgraded, that's why it comes first, so you won't have a hard time on solo.
-Stubby is the most supportive one: hindering enemies actions so the team "fighters" can put them down easily.
-LOK1 is really good for taking down airborne enemies, thinning down hordes of weak enemies, hitting weak points and preserving ammo.
I agree, Engi can be super fun to play in both games!
Cycle overload for the Warthog and Volatile Impact Reactor for the shard diffractor. You got yourself the bread and butter. One only for single target and the Shard diffractor for herd,long range target, heat trap etc :)
Being a veteran of drg, i have to admit that the problem with engi primary slot is strictly related to the capacity of pushing out dmg quickly on every single slot he has, i rarely see drillers and gunners being upfront in total kills when the engi is decent on haz5 lobbyes, and if we talk about purely ammo economy builds (no, not nukes...) like stubby em discharge+twin turrets+diffractor overdrive there's nothing an engi cannot face by himself while retaining a better ammo economy then most drillers (unless all the team agreed to play in tunnels and he runs sticky flames) and a good chunk of gunners too (since not everyone runs neurotoxin), endless hordes? discharge using 3/4 bullets into ur turret and run circles, praets? lazor deathbeam is here if you feel like frying, else treat them as horde parts and mix them in while horde clearing! And ammos into turrets are just optional ofc since the explosion costs only primary ammos!
That's just one portion of the problem wich brings up the next one: engies especially when noob tend to burn ammos faster then a scout on gk2 trying to horde clear, with the difference that engies will always perform decently due to having really good baseline weapons with upgrades that can exagerate the burst damage sacrificing ammos and total damage, but that's strictly related to learning when to do what and why, many times players forget that repositioning is better then obliterating everything in sight especially if there are ways to deal with the problem in a more efficient way that won't chew 15% of your ammo pool (talking about shotgun) istead of 7/8% of a flamer user for example, or even less than 4/5% of a neurotoxic gunner (that's actually a pack of 25/30 grunts in an average haz5 4p cluster), while a detonator during escort needs to be burnt down when far from dotty so it's worth being inefficient but faster and to do it, people tends to look at engie and scout while helping with gunner to shield and let the dps flow freely and leaving the horde management to driller istead (it's proofed that any driller of any skill level can roast 5 grunts and toss an axe into that detonator, or in the scout's back).
Another thing that many forget is building for efficiency and specialyze each slot into something, like mpa warthog is good to clear and self defence cos of turret whip and a really long distance one shot headshot on grunts and other stuff, secondary should be good for larger hp targets then, like shard diffractor (it's probably the most versatile secondary the engi has) or hyperprop (pgl goes yeet) or a breach cutter (just spawm left click till it stops moving).
Coming back the the vid title, i don't see any problem in engies primary weapons, unless having to learn when it's worth using what is a problem ofc.
I don't think the engineer is underwhelming at all as I love the Shotgun for absolutely deleting hp high enemies if you get right in their weak points. In general I can consistently get the same number of kills as 2 or 3 dwarves combined on hazard 4/5 missions as I spend my time mopping up the small enemies and picking off high hp enemies with the Gunner or Scout.
Driller can Synergize well with turrets as they both can soften up the targets they focus on and finish off waves of enemies.
New to DRG, and my most advanced class by a mile is Engineer. I find I really enjoy the shotgun, and rather than going in with lots of ammo, I focused on increasing its armor penetration and tightening its spread. In fights, I let my turrets work on small targets (Gemini with increased range) while I break the armor off larger targets (praetorians chiefly) and distant enemies. I feel this reduces ammo use across the team. For up close, I prefer to toss lures where I see groups of enemies concentrating, and to give it time to cook before blasting the area with my secondary (increased damage and spread).
I've accounted for all ranges, and true to my username, I picked up mobility and support perks to get to allies faster, get them up, and give them a shield boost pat on the back for their trouble.
Awesome!
Thanks. The Magical Medic if folks are keen to take on an eager greenbeard. For Rock and Stone! ⛏️🪨💎
Only problem I have with Engineer's primaries in particular is the ammo economy. He's up there with Scout for running out of ammo before the other two dwarves.
That being said, I exclusively run the stubby with the EM refire booster overclock to mitigate low ammo reserves. The stubby turns into a tap fire stun gun; never holding the trigger down. This way you're primary is more of a 80% slowdown gun, and less of a "I need to delete this bug with my low ammo pool shotgun/lok". Letting bugs die to electric DoT gives good sustain. Slap on whatever perks/OCs that are boosted by electricified enemies (looking at you, shard diffractor) and you'll be a bug stomping machine.
Engineer's primaries are really ment to complement his kit through synergies, and for self defence pinches. Most of the time your turrets and secondaries will be used for general clearing or total damage. The primaries are their to get those tools setup.
Besides reworking the shotgun to single shot grunts in the head without perks/OCs and giving lok way more base ammo I don't see too many problems with the primaries. They do their job, that job just isn't as straightforward as say, a Gunner's primary.
The Stubby is my engi workhorse if I'm single playing. With a crew, I use the smart gun and focus on Mactera and position control. Also in missions that involve a lot of position defense (Salvage, Sabotage) I may used the EMP whip which allows me to focus on high value targets.
Stubby is nice for that.
I think the Warhog and the Loki are perfectly balanced as they are, if you want to have a longer encounter you grab more ammo or you grab damage.
the SMG though... just feels too weak without overclocks. It needs an overclock to just be on the same level as the Drak WITH LESS AMMO.
Of course I use all three, but mainly the shotgun, full damage.
For the Lok-1 There is a overclock i got that make up with the ammo consumption it have. And that's the OC that make target explode at the last bullets locked to them (min 3 stacked locks). The thing is if the bug die before the last bullet is shot, the bug explode anyway allowing you to chain effect or to eco some ammo.
That is really true, ECR is a crazy strong overclock for the Loki.
As an Engie main, I can tell you straight up that the engineer is the single strongest sustained damage class and not even by a little. Two turrets are effectively 2 more teammates that can't take damage and just need a little ammo now and then. The Shotgun is a fantastic weapon to pair with turrets, the smg is good as a combo weapon, and the Lok-1 (my favourite) is basically good at everything. Once you get the "Ignores terrain and armour" overclock you are limited by your ability to target enemies alone. Besides that it can boost its own damage a LOT by fire/electro damage + Electro/fire damage boost (50 damage per bullet that ignores all armour). Mix that with either the Grenade launcher + fire or Shard Defractor and the instantly on fire upgrade and you will kill Praetorians on has 4 with your eyes closed. I always have kills in the triple digits, even got 550 kills on a single mission. I hope I'm wrong about Gunner but every time I play gunner I feel massively under powered. I'll keep leveling him up and unlocking stuff so I can hopefully change my mind.
I feel like the only engi primary i see there being an issue with is the Stubby. The lok1 and warthog easily blow through most targets even with the "ammo tightness", but the stubby feels like you're shooting blanks even with the electricity. Not so much that its weak, but just that it doesn't feel incredible to use. I feel like if they bumped the base damage just a tiny bit it may feel more impactful.
I think the stubby is fine
the way I use engie's primaries makes them my favorite primaries in the game (aside from stubby, I ain't touchin' that with a ten foot pole, it feels ass to use imo) by just equiping MPA (magnetic pellet alignment) on the warthog to just pop the heads of grunts and unload into weakpoints of larger bugs, it feels great, and the best feeling way to use the Loki is with ECR (explosive chemical rounds), same idea but more for crowds and only firing bursts of 3 at tanky bois. (to clarify I play on haz 5 almost exclusively, solo and with groups, and I consider myself skilled enough that I can just go for what FEELS best/most satisfying, rather than just what's most effective so I don't use the breach cutter, cuz it might technichally be the best secondary (or at least i've seen many who think it is) but it doesn't have the same OOMPH as the GL or the pure GHWEEEEERRR of the lazer)
I basically never run out of ammo with the LOK-1, but I don't mindlessly shoot at everything.
I use it mainly to weaken groups of enemies so my team and my turret have an easier time killing them.
In conjunction with the turret, specially, the LOK-1 is a beast. You can instantly put a group of enemies on low health so your turret finishes them off with 2 or 3 bursts.
Diehard engie main here, I have 300 hours in just engineer gameplay. I agree that ammo is a bit lacking for sure. However,
Like some other people have said in the comments, he’s meant to use all his tools at once. In my own personal experience, when you do this, he can easily excel in all combat, very commonly having the most kills on the scoreboard by a landslide. Build his entire class for hoard killing, and then build one of the weapons you use for big targets. I think turret whip is incredibly underrated on him. And obviously the nuke launcher is a game saver when the hoard is wiping the team out.
I would 100% agree with that.
Eh Engi has the breach cutter, which means the primary has to be underwhelming or the class would be OP. Breach cutter has so much crowd clear and crowd control with quick deploy + stun that also having a spammable ammo efficient primary would simply make other classes redundant.
Basically Engi is a force multiplier. He works well with Scout placing platforms and providing swarm clear, he works well with Driller by constructing terrain where the Driller can take it away, and he works well with Gunner by providing burst damage, either single target or AOE. In all cases, he supports the other dwarf and makes him more efficient comparing to going at it alone.
Engi's weaknesses are a lack of a "get off me" button outside of lures and breach cutter's quick deploy + stun, his ammo efficiency which steers him towards more of a supporting role, and his reliance on being set up with turrets and platforms already down when the swarm comes, and when he's caught with his pants down he's pretty vulnerable.
Play Engi right and you can carry really hard, top the scoreboards (at least when the Driller's sleeping), solo haz 6 2x, do whatever you want to do, but you will rely more on your secondary than your primary, and for most situations you'll need to think of breach cutter as your primary and your actual primary as just single target damage. Of course this assumes you're a filthy breach cutter spammer like me.
Remember, when in doubt, you're not spamming breach cutter hard enough. Spam harder.
For primary, try shotgun with magnetic pellet alignment, or lok with executioner. If you're not running breach cutter for some reason, lok with explosive chemical rounds when you need more AOE. For stubby, its utility is limited outside of turret arc or turret em discharge, but those 2 overclocks make stubby viable.
Last note has to go out to my fellow high ping sufferers: lok, because of its charge-up mechanic, can get very glitchy on ping 100+, sometimes the game will drop inputs and not register and you'll be holding down charge and nothing is happening, and by sometimes I mean a lot of the time. So with high ping, forget it, just play shotgun with pellet alignment, except in industrial sabotage where you really do need the extra range. Lok is more for ping under 50, but maybe if you're blessed with a functional connection and a friend group that doesn't live half the world away you'll have a better time. And of course forget playing Driller with awful ping, trying to animation cancel axes on ping 120+ with severe packet loss is like trying to scale a skyscraper made out of wet soap when you have no hands. It ain't gonna happen. Maybe with a macro, but that's kinda cheating.
Engi was the class I started playing this game with, and I recently got back into playing it about a couple weeks ago. I've promoted him and unlocked every weapon with at least a full suite of upgrades for each, and I've gotten a feel for his playstyle through both solo and general multiplayer.
Engi feels to me like the backbone of the team, setting up his autonomous turret(s) to hold down areas and using the platform gun for reliable traversal and setup for other dwarves' skillets like Gunner and Scoot. As a general rule, the load of his damage kit is focused on one thing: dealing with swarms of grunts and medium glyphid units. Engis weapons, while absolutely capable of damaging and killing larger enemies, are not suited for such kills, as they often take more ammo than is worth it outside of solo play. The class grenade is the only reliable means of putting larger glyphids off course, which allows heavy hitters to deal with them more reliably.
The primary weapons are strong enough to allow the Engi to fend for themselves, but not be so strong as to make the choice of them mandatory for success. Power is spread evenly between the turret(s), primary, heavy, and utility of the Engi, making them very well rounded, which can be said for basically all the dwarves.
And the choice of what you prefer in a weapon is absolutely available for thought in any player. The Warthog is a workhorse shotgun, and always reliable. The Stubby provides ammo capacity and utility in an easy to use package, with a lot of flexibility between damage and sheer volume of bullets. The Lok-1 is a great weapon for sheer damage output, allowing some of the best DPS in class at a severe cost in ammo capacity.
Secondaries are a bit harder to justify. Each unlock exceeds the last in terms of usefulness based entirely on design and ammo capacity for damage.
GL is a great weapon because it's a massive blast radius with high damage. But it's outclassed by the line gun because the line gun does as much damage to multiple targets with more ammo at less risk to your allies. Which then the line gun gets out classed by the Shard Diffractor because the laser has even more ammo, never needs to be manually reloaded, has perfect accuracy and instant damage output with a lot of damage involved because of the reliable burn and a constant ticking of damage. And because it does a small amount of damage over many ticks, it does less overall damage to allies if you accidentally tag them with it, and you can adjust your aim to miss them entirely thanks to the small laser pointer of death.
Might I also say it can be modded to absolutely delete armor off enemies? It has some of the most reliable armor shredding I've ever seen.
Shard Diffractor cannot be topped by just about any weapon in this game, only matched by the freaking Cryo cannon in terms of power and usefulness.
I play engi for a bit now. When fighting big guys with my friends like boss fights, I tend to try and focus the little guys so my teammates can focus strictly on the boss, I throw down a lure (dreadnought don't get lured) and than crowed control them with whatever the grenade launcher gun is called. Seems pretty effective and platforming areas and having that fall protection is amazing. Though I have messed up sometimes thinking the fall protection is endless (it's not, you'll still die if it's to far)
I thought the same yesterday and I looked for a video about it, I think it makes sense forcing you to learn to use the turrets, and I ended up finding myself with the Stubby ^^
Stubby is a nice choice!
I actually kinda love engi’s primaries as well. They’re not super powerful, but I have a lot of fun using them
596hr miner here and i feel like engies primaries are supposed to be a bit underwhelming. it doesnt feel great at first, but once u look at his kit overall and actually try to understand it, its not that bad. i feel that engie is the one class that can easily utilizes all his kit at once.
i mainly use the stubby as i initially liked the better range i got out of it vs the hog. plus im not usually a big fan of shotguns in hoard type shooters as its not quite the weapon type to be dealing with tons of enemies unless given the ammo. i dont dislike the hog as much as i used to, but still dont prefer it. lok does lack in ammo tho, i think pretty much everyone is in agreeance of that. im not a big fan of it tho, i dont really like ecr. executioner is the only oc i like, but its still plagued by the low ammo.
once the shard diffractor was released, the hydrogen rupturing(33% more damage to electrocuted targets) made the stubby and shard my favorite engie build
As an engie regularly running haz 5 on their own or leading less experienced dwarves, I can't see myself using anything other than the ammo efficient DPS/CC work horse that is the Stubby. Especially since I unlocked EM Refire Boosters. It really feels like the only thing holding it back is the user's ability to aim the dang thing since it can be hard sometimes under pressure. It saves ammo on weaker targets and can shred if you need it to.
I've always felt alone on this for some reason though, even though it's proven its worth time and time again for me. I too often find myself struggling at range or with ammo on the shotgun, or getting annoyed sweeping for targets on the LOK-1.
Again this is with dwarves who aren't as experienced and may not be playing optimally (killing enough bugs to counteract the enemy-per-player multiplier for example), but I seriously value its well roundedness, which also sums up why I play Engie in the first place.
For me, the biggest thing about engineer is that there isn't a primary that's approachable for everyone. Every one of the primaries has something strange going on.
The Warthog is a robust and flexible combat shotgun and within that it excels. That said, not everyone likes robust, flexible combat shotguns. Fair enough.
Stubby is an SMG, and to that extent it's fairly straightforward. That said, it ditches pure damage output in favor for electric procs, which is something that a player might not like. Fair enough.
Loki is... weird, and there's no two ways about it. It's janky, and people who like jank (like me) will like it, but people who just want a solid primary option won't enjoy it. Fair enough.
And, given that I keep saying 'fair enough', maybe it's not too surprising that there's people out there who don't click with any of the three. Other classes all at least have one weapon that's very much inoffensive, and can be picked up and ran with.
Gunner's Minigun has rubbish accuracy at the start of its spool-up, but it isn't that big of deal, not with some mods. It can be gotten used to easily enough.
Scout's GK is a boring assault rifle by default, but it's also reliable and customizable.
And you may think I've written myself into a corner with the Driller, but in reality the Driller's reliable weapon is a secondary: the Subata. No matter what primary you bring, no matter what else you have going on, the Subata will work fine. You can gripe about it being semi-auto or any number of things, but I defy you to tell me it will not work and be perfectly passable at it.
Between the all slightly off primaries and heavy secondaries, Engineer doesn't have something comparable. The Warthog is closest, but it falls off at range in a way that the others don't. With that in mind, if Engineer got a solid semi-auto rifle, or even warthog overclock that changed it to slugs, I think a lot of people would really like it.
as an engi main, i agree with your assesment, the primary is there for when you need it, not for you to use constantly, let your turrets do their job, use your secondary to delete praetorians etc, your primary for when a horde comes usually, the shotgun especially, has came in clutch for me so many times even when others are down and i need to revive
I think that in this game, all classes have a "default" thing they are good at.
To put this into perspective, imagine a bunker and a team of 4 dwarves, now what do you think they might be doing?
-gunner is probably at the entrance holding m1
-scout's probably outside killing bugs that can dig into the bunker
-driller is probably standing next to gunner dealing DoT
Now, what is engi doing?
-engineer has probably placed his turret(s) outside the bunker so they weaken the crowd, and he deals with things when it gets out of hand (basically nukes them when they start leeking) and he uses his primary to do stuff with turrets.
My favorite load out with eng is shotgun and breach cutter but dang it hurts not being able to clear distant targets.
Yeah that can be a bit rough at times, menaces can be rough.
I use the lok1 allot with explosive chemical rounds and the pgl with hyperprop. Using electro chemical rounds and electrifying+igniting something the lock one becomes very strong against single targets as well as crowd control. The only time I really feel myself burning through ammo too quickly with this build is when I am using my turrets poorly
That is really strong.
IMO: engi has the least surviability out of the classes. Gunner has sheild, scout has grappling hook, driller has vampire+drills (though this is a bit iffy), while engi has really nothing. This seems to be balaced out by having a ready made self defense weapon in your primary, as well as an absolute powerhouse of a weapon in your secondary, along with the consistent damage of the turrets. You can potentially tear through a swarm on haz 5 if you play your cards right, and thats the trick: playing your cards right. You dont have just 1 main tool and a secondary, like driller and gunner, you effectively have multple different tools: primary, secondary, plats with repellent, grenades and turrets. This means you have muiple specialized tools that are trickier and riskier to use, but have a better reward. This may be a bad take, feel free to rip me apart in replies.
I would agree with that if you are moving around, but if you have your turrets setup you can fight off quite a lot of stuff.
Just going into this video as someone who only plays engineer and has never tried the other classes. The idea people not liking the primary options baffles me. Everything just feels so good. You have; punchy ammo efficient shotgun, potentially highest dps at the cost of ammo efficiency smg, and finally auto aim smg that balances ammo efficiency with being over all underwhelming in all categories (including ammo efficiency, over all my least favorite primary but still think it’s fun). And that’s only engineers first set of primaries lol. Engineer has no "secondaries", they have 2 primaries you have to balance. One of my favorite bulls for engineer as (I think) the highest dps smg build with trash ammo efficiency, balanced with a grenade launcher that sacrifices damage and even (some) area of effect for 18 ammo. This build really turns your “secondary” into the weapon you’re gonna be using 60-80% of the time, and your "primary” into your situational tool for killing bug baddies in 2 seconds flat but at the cost of a magazine or 2 or 3. Engineers weapons amazing, I’m constantly top scoring(as far as kills go) with engineer solely cause the set of primaries you get in combination have no weaknesses. Honestly engineer’s turrets where what w drew me to the class as a new player, but even if you told me I couldn’t use them anymore, I’d still love the class for having such great diversity of builds you can make viable for hazard 5 just by nature of how the class has 2 sets of primaries.
When it comes to engineer’s primary weapon, I accept no substitute to the Warthog.
The Warthog is pretty awesome!
I don't see why no one ever brings up the Seeker Rounds Overclock for the Lok-1. Everyone always talks about Explosive Chemical Rounds, which I DO have available, but haven't ever unlocked yet. The Seeker Rounds are great in my opinion, really good for Dreadnoughts & Oppressors.
Yeah Seeker Rounds are pretty nice too.
@@ReapeeRon for the life of me, I don't even understand why it's even a "BALANCED" overclock. The downsides are so minute that you can basically call this a clean overclock. It literally JUST improves your damage output by ensuring everything takes damage NO MATTER WHAT.
But no one talks about it?!? Not even on Reddit bro, makes me feel like some weird foreign entity even as an active part of the community.
my interpritation is that you are meant to be using your primary while fighting alongside your turret, keeping it loaded and supplimenting its damage because the combined damage of your primary and a sentry on 1 target is a lot and the croud clearing of your primary on one target and your sentry on another is also a lot
Engi's primaries are single target weapons, which makes sense as his secondaries, turrets, and SSGs can take care of swarms
I agree a lot with what most people have said here in that engis primaries feel more supplementary to his kit as general purpose self defense weapons, where your turrets make up for more DPS and your secondaries are there for the big swarms or hvts, which can sometimes be in contrast to the other classes, mainly driller and gunner (with some build exceptions) whose main weapons very much are the focal point of their damage against swarms/hvts.
That said Loki feels horrible to use because yes it doesn't have a whole lot of ammo or feel ammo efficient, which don't get me wrong you can get around with experience and practice with it, but it doesn't help the weapon, but also you have to spend so much time locking on or setting up the right amount of locks on targets which is almost counter intuitive to a fast past Horder shooter like DRG. I think the gun needs a re-work to make the lock on instant, with some sort of mechanic that still comes into play so you still have to actually play the game. Or scrap the lock as a whole, tbh I always felt like that mechanic would've made more sense for the gunners new rocket launcher. But at the very least some changes would be appreciated
Engi was the last one I got promoted and I spent a while with his primaries, so I do have thoughts on them.
Warthog= it was dificult to get used to at first but the more I used it the better I got with it and is my go to of the three. Since I have the amo that gives a powered shot to the single turret, it’s basically an extension of my turret. Also even in long ranges the inner reticle you can do some pretty good damage. It is clunky and I can’t handle hoards as good without a good fat boy, so yea it’s basically a support long to close range shotgun in my eyes.
Stubby= What I consider to be the highest damage weapon in engi’s arsenal, but eats through amo so that’s why I think people consider it underwhelming damage for amount of rounds spent. It is fun but I definitely add electric damage and week point damage in the tree to make it that much more effective. Also the ark electric upgrade is good on hoards of grunts.
Lok-1= fun weapon, versatile for engagements, not enough ammo or not any interaction with the turrets to make it an far more interesting weapon in my opinion. It’s fun to use, not so fun to run out of amo first.
I really hope lok1 gets a tap fire overclock. It could replace your tap shot with a 3 round burst that dose more damage and has a shorter delay between bursts, but you have less locks and it takes longer to lock
For new Engis without overclock as well as for greybeards: the turret whip mod in the shotguns tier 5 is an absolut must have imo. Makes handeling groups and praetorians so much easier
Turret whip is VERY good. Pretty flexible on which secondary you can pick as well. All of them work well.
It's hard to say if anything about engi's kit needs improving since I see countless times engi getting highest kill count even with ammo problems along with all their other versatility. If it wasn't for the shields, I'd say gunner doesn't have anything to offer that engi or driller can do better (and this is coming from a gunner main).
Well. That's a tough one. I would say all primaries without OCs underperform more than you would think or want from them. But at the end of the day you'll still be using your full kit, not just primary. It comes off to how each person builts their engineer. I have loc-1 with exe OC modded fully for damage, min window, min locks; run out of ammo pretty fast but still it's the best gun and oc combo for doing extremely good DPS and have it dedicated mostly for high value targets. 2nd is breach cutter with balanced OC with electricity and modded 1-1-1-1-2(if I remember correctly) main horde killer. It's my main and only build(for now) but I got with it through up to gold promotion and in 95-96% of games I was top by kill count (and yeah, I constantly forget about my turrets).
Still will be figuring out voltaic smg and a shotgun at a latter date when I get my Fat Boy OC for grenade launcher(it's the last OC I don't have for engi :
I'm a 300 hours engi only player and I always like status effect electric build on stubby. Problem is that the electricity damage never gets to do its damage over time because people just lay into the enemies you have slowed and taking electric damage essentially cutting your damage as they don't care to let the status effect finish them off in favor of killing them themselves
Imo the Lok1 is in a fine spot as far as damage output goes, really helped by the fact its remarkably good at hitting mactera in their weak points and wiping out otherwise annoying to hit enemies like swarmers and naedocytes.
The other two do feel like they dont really properly come into their own at least until you get them some OCs.
I rarely use the shotgun myself, but my go-to stubby build is an ammo build focusing on using the turret aoe OC (whose name escapes me) and does do the job well enough.
I'm glad someone knows the feeling, like I've used the shard defractor (also known as the SUPER LASER PISS)
As my primary ngl, because his primary's are just kinda...eh plus with his new grenade and turret are super great for support which o believe is his primary role, although I feel his shotgun is the best primary weapon
Since I discovered the magic of turret whipping I have a hard time picking any other primary...
That can be very fun. It also works on other engi turrets too.
Level 19, no promotion engineer here.
I agree that he has 3 weapons (1 of which works automatically and simultaneously with little input) and thus has to be restrianed in his main guns. If we look at what I would guess is the most famous video game engineer, the Team Fortress 2 engineer.
his default loadout gives him a shotgun that 3 other classes have as secondaries as his primary weapon, he shares a secondary with another class that has a different primary shotgun and he has one of the lowest base healths in the game with no mobility tools, as the upside to offset these he can build a sentry gun that will shred people who enter its range unprepared, teleporters to move teammates quickly from spawn to the objective and the dispenser restoring health and ammo to people standing nearby at rates that overpower any burning or bleed damage and allow for continuous firing of weapons without running out of reserve ammo.
As for this engineer, his biggest problems I find are ammo, the default loadout gives you a shotgun and a grenade launcher in a game with large rooms and some enemies you need to kill at distance, the stock grenade ammo is only 9 rounds and you have no clue when you will get enough nitra for ammo. Until you complete the tutorial assignment chain you can't get a ranged weapon with actual reach to take pressure off the grenade launcher, even then Stubby needs shorter bursts to maintain accurate firing. Running out of grenade launcher when using the shotty leaves you unable to effectivly deal with ranged enemies(for example menace) or safely deal with grabbing enemies before they grab and pin you, leaving you at the mercy of your turret(s) and either bosco or fellow dwarfs.
The stubby overclock that makes turrets burst purple lightning saves me all the time ngl
Idk about other people, but I only play engi since day 1 after the gunner tutorial. You dont realize it at first, but once you start learning how to cycle through all your tools, you'll realize you can do a lot. I use mines and turrers to block off a spot completely and use the mine's audio cue to check whether I need to respond to that spot or not. What non-engi mains dont understand is that there is a delicate balance between cycling through your whole arsenal. Engi is a very active class vs other classes who just whip out their primaries and sometimes use other things when the situation arises only, engi cant afford to do that. The hardest part will always be quickly assessing every situation and knowing which tool to use in those situations, which at this point is second nature to me.
I just really like the feel of stubby, even though im a driller main, stubby just feels good to have on standby, im never kicking myself for not bringing something else.
The engineers smg is rly good if you add weakspot upgrades on it cos you can use your secondary for crowd control and the smg for big targets like oppressors
Shotgun with mini bullets OC is my favourite. It even gets 12 shots in the mag and one shots grunts.
I main engie and I personally really like the primaries. The Stubby has what feels like an endless ammo supply, the Lok-1’s explosive overclock is a ton of fun, and the shotgun is a shotgun.
Engie is a somewhat weird class. Sometimes I feel like I’m not really putting any effort into shooting, but I’ll still do the most damage at the end of the map.
Sorry for little side track here, would you mind consider making a video about the best / efficient load out for each class for Industrial sabotage plz. Since dev really love them especially Driller. Cheers
That sounds like an interesting idea.
The mental change for me is. Your primary should help your secondary while it’s down. Make sure that you conserve your secondary ammo Engineer’s secondary is the actual primary. You should use it to murder hordes and big bugs not pick off enemies.
Yeah that is a good point!
Something overlooked with the Stubby is the electrical damage, with the somewhat recent buff to Electrified the damage over time is quite good paired with the massive 80% slow that it applies.
The problem with it, and other DoTs, is the need for kiting mobs around while they're taking damage and not being sniped by other team mates incurring an ammo wastage.
If you see a grunt is at 50% health and taking electric, fire, or poison damage over time, it's almost certainly safe to ignore them and just walk away from them.