This video is pure gold. It may not have thousand of likes or million of view but video like is actually a real value of youtube. Not those cheap few second videos. They have all of my respect.
Brilliant. Thank you. I'm 63 and just bought my first bow. I'm trying to learn the correct draw before I even shoot my first arrow so I can avoid aggravating an existing minor shoulder injury. I had no idea about using the back muscles before watching videos like this.
I wish my local archery shop would watch this video and at least attempt to explain some of this to new shooters, I’ve been shooting a little over a year so I’m still learning but this video helped allot, thanks guys
I'm 54 years old have had my left shoulder reconstructed twice. I don't have any cartilage left in my right shoulder. I'm right handed. These injuries are not from pulling a bow back. They are from playing softball. However, I have been pulling a bow for years and was taught the correct way. I am still able to pull my 70 lb Mathews bow back with no pain with those injuries. I'm going to shoot 300 tomorrow. This guy knows exactly what he is doing and his draw cycle is perfect.
PRICELESS ..... Thank you am 77 years old and needed to correct properly. Not knowing what was doing the soreness results in injury. This advise is great. Own Kawartha Traditional Archery Center in Ontario Canada and want to shoot my 3D ranges daily. Keeps me young. Beautful. Fred H Walker
Absolutely amazing video and probably stopped me from causing/worsing a potential life long injury! First bow season and I shot well over 100 arrows last practice session without much guidance and my shoulder wasnt a fan, now I know why!
Thank you so much sir. I’ve been an archery hunter for 30 years and now developed Shoulder tendinitis after shooting my bow at the beginning of the summer. After watching your video it all makes sense thank you again.
Great instruction. Was having bow arm shoulder pain most likely from holding the bow with a high shoulder. I didn't know I was also drawing incorrectly, as this was bonus knowledge you provided. I will refer to this guide as I continue to renew my love of archery. Thank you for making this video available. Cheers
This is awesome! I've been shooting for over 20+ years and I always had some soreness; lately even more soreness. Now, with this simple instruction, I no longer felt any soreness and I can pull more weight. And, my groups are tighter --- fantastic!
i've watched this before. Thought i got it but i did not. Messed up my shoulder and couldnt shoot for couple of years. Watched this again andI am now able to draw my bow. Many thanks!!
At 66 yrs old, and more education than I care to remember, I had not anticipated that I'd be adding one more teacher to my short list of the "great ones." When you brought out the model of the glenohumeral joint and explained the causes of, and solution to impingement syndrome... you had me. I'm about two days into archery (again) and immediately drew the bow the way you explained that 100% of us will do without proper instruction. We both know that you saved me from becoming one more on my long list of patients that ruined their shoulders through poor bio-mechanics. Thanks and keep up the great work.
i know why i've had both shoulders rebuilt. Shooting an 80lb draw bow incorrectly for yeeeaaarrrrs. i'm 60 now and have been trying to get back into my bows. An old 1969 Ben Pearson 45lb draw and my old Bear Polar LTD. i just inherited my dads (another old) Bear WT 2. i might be able to hunt this year, thanks guys. Video saved...
I am intrigued by the biomechanics of movement as an exercise specialist. Been trad shooting for 4 years now and made these changes in my shot sequence and my shoulder pain recovered. Yes we need people recovering and continue shooting! Thanks Tom
Also great insight on actually achieving/feeling back tension and developing a true release follow through not just for looks but as a result of good form. Again cheers and thank you. Looking forward to putting it into practice.
Best and most informative video on the subject available, was a game changer for me when I first watched it. So glad I did before I ruined my draw shoulder and my shooting improved drastically. Watching again now as a refresher. Thanks so much Tom Clum.
Oh wow thank you. I have managed to draw the bow using the starting the lawn mower method and also managed to keep the bow shoulder low. BUT I never got the twisting around the shoulder using back tension. Thank you so much hopefully I can manage to implement this going forward and get better. As others have said everybody talks about back tension but no one explains it like this.
just started shooting less than a week ago. Getting pain in my front shoulder and thought it was because I was out of shape. Had no clue it was because of high shoulders. Thank you soooo much
Best and most easy to follow video on a subject that does not get nearly enough attention. Seriously injure yourself and say goodbye to archery at least for a while, possibly forever. I know this from painful experience.
Had the bow set up at a pro shop. It performed just fine ruclips.net/user/postUgkxQEKUoxLWwayEDZR0NKB-5limn4MBU-2L . And I would say this is a good starting now that I could pass down to my son when he is older.But the package was missing the release and a nock was missing from one arrow.Dealing with customer support was terrible. They suggested I buy a new release rather than correct their own quality control issue because it’s to expensive for the. to ship it out from China.Update: manufacturer got back to me and resolved the issue. I retract the above statement.
Awesome video! Very new archer here, only a couple of months in, could feel an injury coming on in my draw shoulder, using the exact same wrong technique as demonstrated in the vid! The whole back tension thing clicked after watching this and practicing for 20 mins with a band. 👍 Great stuff.
Thank you! I’ve only been shooting for two weeks and my bow arm has a lot of discomfort and pain when reaching overhead. . I can see how I might have high shoulders. I’ll be working on that.
An Absolutely great video. I'm new to recurve archery and have begun feeling impingement pain in my bow shoulder and now understand why through this video. Thank you for taking the time to go through form and body mechanics. Wish you guys were in UK so we could attend one of your workshops!!
Thank you! I’m 72. I still feel like a rookie. Its a lifetime sport but you either have to be tuff, lucky or stupid to keep doing it wrong. Valuable pointers AND I loved your anatomical explanations
Thanks guys - great vid and helped a lot. Would really like to see similar example video of correct/incorrect bow shoulder as I imagine this is a big problem area for many newcomers.
Great video thank you. I'm shooting a compound bow. I'm not sure if I missed it but my bow shoulder is hurting when I pick up the bow. It's like the rotator cup for me. I have tried different styles with my bow shoulder, aiming down pulling back Pushing and pulling. It's going to take some practice to re learn how to pull back and use my back muscles more. My draw shoulder has never hurt, its been my bow shoulder. Again thank you for the great video guys.
I finally am able to shoot without draw shoulder pain (back muscles sore next day) but starting to feel bow shoulder discomfort, this may be the ticket! Thank you!
I am new to archery and absolutely love it. After watching this video - I am wondering if I am drawing the bow in a dangerous way for my shoulder. However, I am a woman with a large chest and I find it difficult to move the tension into my back because my chest is in the way. Do you have any experience advising women like me how to draw safely without being impeded by my body? Or should this not be a problem at all?
Wow very informative. I've been doing it all wrong . Also so mush easier to draw, Thank god I'm in the building stage not even had time to really shoot a whole lot.. bought a used bow had it restrung. had them dial it all the way up. been just practicing just pulling it back. I've always learned practice the hard the rest will come easy. Will this be a bad way about doing this.
I wish I knew this 30 years ago, I shot in the IBO long bow class, I just had shoulder surgery, two bone spurs removed, one calcium deposit in the supraspinatus and a slap tear repaired
Thanks for this really good explanation of the difference between drawing straight back compared to rotating the shoulders and using back muscles to rotate the drawing shoulder back to get through the shot. I think I'll be referring back to this video from time to time so I can compare it my progressing draw technique (I'm still working on it after years of shooting).
Tom, thanks for the video. Any feedback on somebody with a compromised long thoracic nerve and resulting inability to raise the elbow up to arrow height?
I do anchor using my ear with top finger on the lowest part of the cartilage stopper before the ear canal, mainly due to otherwise I would get a 21--22 inch draw rather then a 24 inch draw to help hit 35 pounds with the 45 pound 54 inch long Recurve bow I have. So the Recurve I use that is 45 pounds for 54 inch bow would have a just under 30 pound draw otherwise if going to the mouth and I would need a 50 pound bow just to hit 30 pounds or the minimum for South Dakota Deer/Turkey sized big game not Elk or Mountain Lion and really would need a 55 pound bow just to hit 35 pounds or what I feel is the minimum needed for Deer/Turkey.
I got bad rotater cup in shoulder so I have to tuck my elbow down I'm really accurate just a little shorter draw length I tried the right way shoulder dislocates so there's more than one way to draw your bow
At least in the Lower info before the comments you mention this is for Bowhunters. Not modern target bows or for certain hunting ILF designs used as a target barebow. I use the Push Pull, but with more pull on the string as correctly done otherwise you injure your bow handle gripping hand.
Very informative video. I've been shooting traditional for a little over a year and no shoulder issues at this time but will certainly work more on proper back tension. However, I am having some tendonitis in my bow arm on the inside (medial) part of my elbow. I usually shoot 4 times/200 arrows per week. I was thinking my bow grip was too tight so been working on a more relaxed grip, but elbow soreness still exists. Any thoughts? Thanks!!
Great video, thank you. I discovered that if I draw low (recurve) with my hands at chest height then, at almost full draw, slowly raise up to position, I no longer experienced the pain I was getting. However, the pain I get now is the tendon halfway between my wrist and elbow (draw arm). It's stopped me shooting for several months. Any idea what could be causing that?
That is probably a need to keep wrist basically even to hand and not flex/push the wrist outward. Try if having issues with string slap or vibration get the elbow bent very minorly so you have a roughly a 170 degree arm. You need to keep the wrist basically even to the hand. I find this bend to help with both string slap and vibration of the bow which helps due to my small size of 5 foot 2 inches or 157.5 cm height with draw 1--2 inches or 2.5--5 cm shorter then most people of this size with small hands for an adult of kids XL to adult XS/women's small depending on brand/model.
When related to archery, elbow pain in the bow arm side is typically from how you grip. Untrained, we all grip the bow like shaking a hand (with the knuckles parallel with the handlep). Instead, the knuckles should be angled 45 degrees away from the riser so that just the thumb pad can be placed on the bow. Then let the wrist relax and pressure will translate only through the skeletal structure. With this grip, torque is removed which increases accuracy. When pressure is applied to the heal side of the hand, a tendon that goes through the elbow is stressed. This injury is very slow to heal.
I have aBroken clavicle now hoping to have strength back for October has anyone else done this? worried I won't be able to shoot my recurve or my compound
I urge everyone to listen to these gentlemen. I just bought a recurve and after one day of shooting I’ve had to see an orthopedic surgeon and waiting to get an MRI on my shoulder. So don’t take their advice lightly.
There comes a time, like around 70, that pulling the bow requires more daily training. This occurs at about the same time that you lose interest in some other important things, which shall remain un-named, lest the grandchildren read this.
This was great. My 11 year old son and his older sister decided they wanted to learn to shoot so I got my bows out of mouth balls and we got them a light weight bow to start with. I keep telling them to pull with their back but haven't been getting through because I didn't know how to explain what "pull with your back" means. This will help a lot.
The Biggest injury I see is people not using an arm guard who are prone to hitting arm then go up to a 60 pound plus bow and hit arm. I have seen this in real life with at least one person.
Why only discuss release?? That is not when people injure their shoulders. It is when they draw. Modern archery form is wrong. Old English longbow men twisted their upper body to the left.
This is the best shoulder video on archery I've seen.
This video is pure gold. It may not have thousand of likes or million of view but video like is actually a real value of youtube. Not those cheap few second videos.
They have all of my respect.
We're glad you enjoyed it! Thanks for watching!
Brilliant. Thank you.
I'm 63 and just bought my first bow.
I'm trying to learn the correct draw before I even shoot my first arrow so I can avoid aggravating an existing minor shoulder injury. I had no idea about using the back muscles before watching videos like this.
We're glad to hear it helped! Good luck with your new bow!
I wish my local archery shop would watch this video and at least attempt to explain some of this to new shooters, I’ve been shooting a little over a year so I’m still learning but this video helped allot, thanks guys
Seen dozens of vids in last month. Looks as if all instructors are just wrong. Hope this spreads. Thx for doing.
Me too, my place has zero lesson like this. Wish they care more for players' healthy.
I'm 54 years old have had my left shoulder reconstructed twice. I don't have any cartilage left in my right shoulder. I'm right handed. These injuries are not from pulling a bow back. They are from playing softball. However, I have been pulling a bow for years and was taught the correct way. I am still able to pull my 70 lb Mathews bow back with no pain with those injuries. I'm going to shoot 300 tomorrow. This guy knows exactly what he is doing and his draw cycle is perfect.
PRICELESS ..... Thank you am 77 years old and needed to correct properly. Not knowing what was doing the soreness results in injury. This advise is great. Own Kawartha Traditional Archery Center in Ontario Canada and want to shoot my 3D ranges daily. Keeps me young. Beautful. Fred H Walker
Absolutely amazing video and probably stopped me from causing/worsing a potential life long injury! First bow season and I shot well over 100 arrows last practice session without much guidance and my shoulder wasnt a fan, now I know why!
We're glad to hear it helped you! Thanks for watching!
Thank you so much sir. I’ve been an archery hunter for 30 years and now developed Shoulder tendinitis after shooting my bow at the beginning of the summer. After watching your video it all makes sense thank you again.
Great instruction. Was having bow arm shoulder pain most likely from holding the bow with a high shoulder. I didn't know I was also drawing incorrectly, as this was bonus knowledge you provided. I will refer to this guide as I continue to renew my love of archery. Thank you for making this video available. Cheers
Thank you!!! Excellent video!! So glad I watched this! just getting back into bow after a 20 yr break :).
This is awesome! I've been shooting for over 20+ years and I always had some soreness; lately even more soreness. Now, with this simple instruction, I no longer felt any soreness and I can pull more weight. And, my groups are tighter --- fantastic!
i've watched this before. Thought i got it but i did not. Messed up my shoulder and couldnt shoot for couple of years. Watched this again andI am now able to draw my bow. Many thanks!!
At 66 yrs old, and more education than I care to remember, I had not anticipated that I'd be adding one more teacher to my short list of the "great ones." When you brought out the model of the glenohumeral joint and explained the causes of, and solution to impingement syndrome... you had me. I'm about two days into archery (again) and immediately drew the bow the way you explained that 100% of us will do without proper instruction. We both know that you saved me from becoming one more on my long list of patients that ruined their shoulders through poor bio-mechanics. Thanks and keep up the great work.
I gained so much skill from taking Tom’s class. Highly recommend it. Thanks Tom for being a great coach.
i know why i've had both shoulders rebuilt. Shooting an 80lb draw bow incorrectly for yeeeaaarrrrs. i'm 60 now and have been trying to get back into my bows. An old 1969 Ben Pearson 45lb draw and my old Bear Polar LTD. i just inherited my dads (another old) Bear WT 2. i might be able to hunt this year, thanks guys. Video saved...
Wow, this is awesome. Every archer needs to see this!! Thank you
I am intrigued by the biomechanics of movement as an exercise specialist. Been trad shooting for 4 years now and made these changes in my shot sequence and my shoulder pain recovered. Yes we need people recovering and continue shooting! Thanks Tom
Also great insight on actually achieving/feeling back tension and developing a true release follow through not just for looks but as a result of good form. Again cheers and thank you. Looking forward to putting it into practice.
Best and most informative video on the subject available, was a game changer for me when I first watched it. So glad I did before I ruined my draw shoulder and my shooting improved drastically. Watching again now as a refresher. Thanks so much Tom Clum.
Wow! Such a helpful video! Once again Tom knocks it out of the park. The man has such a gift to teach. Thx so much!
Oh wow thank you. I have managed to draw the bow using the starting the lawn mower method and also managed to keep the bow shoulder low. BUT I never got the twisting around the shoulder using back tension. Thank you so much hopefully I can manage to implement this going forward and get better. As others have said everybody talks about back tension but no one explains it like this.
just started shooting less than a week ago. Getting pain in my front shoulder and thought it was because I was out of shape. Had no clue it was because of high shoulders. Thank you soooo much
Great instruction and great people! 5 stars for Rocky mountain specialist.
Best and most easy to follow video on a subject that does not get nearly enough attention. Seriously injure yourself and say goodbye to archery at least for a while, possibly forever. I know this from painful experience.
Had the bow set up at a pro shop. It performed just fine ruclips.net/user/postUgkxQEKUoxLWwayEDZR0NKB-5limn4MBU-2L . And I would say this is a good starting now that I could pass down to my son when he is older.But the package was missing the release and a nock was missing from one arrow.Dealing with customer support was terrible. They suggested I buy a new release rather than correct their own quality control issue because it’s to expensive for the. to ship it out from China.Update: manufacturer got back to me and resolved the issue. I retract the above statement.
Awesome video! Very new archer here, only a couple of months in, could feel an injury coming on in my draw shoulder, using the exact same wrong technique as demonstrated in the vid! The whole back tension thing clicked after watching this and practicing for 20 mins with a band. 👍 Great stuff.
Makes total sense, thanks for the explanation of body mechanics!
Thank you! I’ve only been shooting for two weeks and my bow arm has a lot of discomfort and pain when reaching overhead. . I can see how I might have high shoulders. I’ll be working on that.
This is great just trying to avoid the injuries.
An Absolutely great video.
I'm new to recurve archery and have begun feeling impingement pain in my bow shoulder and now understand why through this video. Thank you for taking the time to go through form and body mechanics.
Wish you guys were in UK so we could attend one of your workshops!!
Really useful and easy to follow explanations. Thank you.
Thank you! I’m 72. I still feel like a rookie. Its a lifetime sport but you either have to be tuff, lucky or stupid to keep doing it wrong. Valuable pointers AND I loved your anatomical explanations
Thanks guys - great vid and helped a lot. Would really like to see similar example video of correct/incorrect bow shoulder as I imagine this is a big problem area for many newcomers.
Great video thank you. I'm shooting a compound bow. I'm not sure if I missed it but my bow shoulder is hurting when I pick up the bow. It's like the rotator cup for me. I have tried different styles with my bow shoulder, aiming down pulling back Pushing and pulling. It's going to take some practice to re learn how to pull back and use my back muscles more. My draw shoulder has never hurt, its been my bow shoulder.
Again thank you for the great video guys.
@13:45 discusses lifting the bow specifically.
lucky i found this vid before my injury got worse, appreciate.
Thank you! Great explanation. AC has been bothering me and I’ve been playing with this.
I finally am able to shoot without draw shoulder pain (back muscles sore next day) but starting to feel bow shoulder discomfort, this may be the ticket!
Thank you!
great video i shoot compound bow and both shoulders hurt when shooting i will try your style of drawing will let you know results once again thanks
Might be a good idea to drop 10# to start then work your way up
I am new to archery and absolutely love it. After watching this video - I am wondering if I am drawing the bow in a dangerous way for my shoulder. However, I am a woman with a large chest and I find it difficult to move the tension into my back because my chest is in the way. Do you have any experience advising women like me how to draw safely without being impeded by my body? Or should this not be a problem at all?
Wow very informative. I've been doing it all wrong . Also so mush easier to draw, Thank god I'm in the building stage not even had time to really shoot a whole lot.. bought a used bow had it restrung. had them dial it all the way up. been just practicing just pulling it back. I've always learned practice the hard the rest will come easy. Will this be a bad way about doing this.
I wish I knew this 30 years ago, I shot in the IBO long bow class, I just had shoulder surgery, two bone spurs removed, one calcium deposit in the supraspinatus and a slap tear repaired
Thanks for this really good explanation of the difference between drawing straight back compared to rotating the shoulders and using back muscles to rotate the drawing shoulder back to get through the shot. I think I'll be referring back to this video from time to time so I can compare it my progressing draw technique (I'm still working on it after years of shooting).
Good stuff, thanks for sharing!!
Great information!!
Tom, thanks for the video. Any feedback on somebody with a compromised long thoracic nerve and resulting inability to raise the elbow up to arrow height?
I do anchor using my ear with top finger on the lowest part of the cartilage stopper before the ear canal, mainly due to otherwise I would get a 21--22 inch draw rather then a 24 inch draw to help hit 35 pounds with the 45 pound 54 inch long Recurve bow I have. So the Recurve I use that is 45 pounds for 54 inch bow would have a just under 30 pound draw otherwise if going to the mouth and I would need a 50 pound bow just to hit 30 pounds or the minimum for South Dakota Deer/Turkey sized big game not Elk or Mountain Lion and really would need a 55 pound bow just to hit 35 pounds or what I feel is the minimum needed for Deer/Turkey.
Any advice for a guy that had shoulder replacement?
Great Video
I got bad rotater cup in shoulder so I have to tuck my elbow down I'm really accurate just a little shorter draw length I tried the right way shoulder dislocates so there's more than one way to draw your bow
Love this man👍
I’ve not been able to draw 70lbs I wonder if I could if I can adopt getting draw in my back muscles instead of just my draw arm …
At least in the Lower info before the comments you mention this is for Bowhunters. Not modern target bows or for certain hunting ILF designs used as a target barebow. I use the Push Pull, but with more pull on the string as correctly done otherwise you injure your bow handle gripping hand.
This is absolutely applicable to target archery and bows, and that’s where it’s actually sourced, from the NTS method of shooting a bow
I notice a difference in the sound too. Is this correct ? Is the string making incorrect contact causing a louder sound ?
Very informative video. I've been shooting traditional for a little over a year and no shoulder issues at this time but will certainly work more on proper back tension. However, I am having some tendonitis in my bow arm on the inside (medial) part of my elbow. I usually shoot 4 times/200 arrows per week. I was thinking my bow grip was too tight so been working on a more relaxed grip, but elbow soreness still exists. Any thoughts? Thanks!!
More than likely it is going to be overflexion of the elbow.
Great device
Excellent!
Great video, thank you. I discovered that if I draw low (recurve) with my hands at chest height then, at almost full draw, slowly raise up to position, I no longer experienced the pain I was getting. However, the pain I get now is the tendon halfway between my wrist and elbow (draw arm). It's stopped me shooting for several months. Any idea what could be causing that?
That is probably a need to keep wrist basically even to hand and not flex/push the wrist outward. Try if having issues with string slap or vibration get the elbow bent very minorly so you have a roughly a 170 degree arm. You need to keep the wrist basically even to the hand. I find this bend to help with both string slap and vibration of the bow which helps due to my small size of 5 foot 2 inches or 157.5 cm height with draw 1--2 inches or 2.5--5 cm shorter then most people of this size with small hands for an adult of kids XL to adult XS/women's small depending on brand/model.
Skip to 2:30
I get quite a bit of pain in my bow arm elbow during and after shooting, can you tell me what may be causing that?
I had the same thing. Just shoot less until you build up strength..it sucks at first but helped me.
When related to archery, elbow pain in the bow arm side is typically from how you grip. Untrained, we all grip the bow like shaking a hand (with the knuckles parallel with the handlep). Instead, the knuckles should be angled 45 degrees away from the riser so that just the thumb pad can be placed on the bow. Then let the wrist relax and pressure will translate only through the skeletal structure. With this grip, torque is removed which increases accuracy. When pressure is applied to the heal side of the hand, a tendon that goes through the elbow is stressed. This injury is very slow to heal.
Did you say the bow shoulder should be low and back ? Pressing bow shoulder to the rear ?
Not pressing it to the rear. More like you are trying to tuck your shoulder blade in your back pocket.
I have aBroken clavicle now hoping to have strength back for October has anyone else done this? worried I won't be able to shoot my recurve or my compound
I urge everyone to listen to these gentlemen. I just bought a recurve and after one day of shooting I’ve had to see an orthopedic surgeon and waiting to get an MRI on my shoulder. So don’t take their advice lightly.
wonderful video, I wish I would have known this before grabbing a bow and just shooting like a moron.
12:05 front/leading shoulder injuries.
There comes a time, like around 70, that pulling the bow requires more daily training.
This occurs at about the same time that you lose interest in some other important things, which shall remain un-named, lest the grandchildren read this.
This was great. My 11 year old son and his older sister decided they wanted to learn to shoot so I got my bows out of mouth balls and we got them a light weight bow to start with. I keep telling them to pull with their back but haven't been getting through because I didn't know how to explain what "pull with your back" means. This will help a lot.
The Biggest injury I see is people not using an arm guard who are prone to hitting arm then go up to a 60 pound plus bow and hit arm. I have seen this in real life with at least one person.
I wish his 👕 was off.so I can see better.
It would show better on what is happening
Thank you for the instructions
ok, 1s first mistake.. cap hat
Tom has the look on his face like I wish this guy would shut up he doesn't know what he's talkin about and he's making me look bad
I drew my bow on some paper and it came out fine. Used crayons
any youtube vedion less than 3 minutes show correct position avoid injury? too much talk all vedio. lol.
This should be pinned on Archerytalk. Super invaluable information to help prevent injury and utilize good technique
Why only discuss release?? That is not when people injure their shoulders. It is when they draw. Modern archery form is wrong. Old English longbow men twisted their upper body to the left.