NEVER Miss Power Bounce AGAIN!!
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- Опубликовано: 10 июл 2024
- The 4th bounce of Power Bounce (and Multibonk) in the Thousand Year Door Remake is frame perfect, nerfing the badge since it's so difficult to pull off that bounce...or is it? I'll show you how to be way, WAY more consistent with Power Bounce and Multibonk in the TTYD Remake and become a master!
0:00 Intro
0:30 Timing Changes
1:22 Visual Cue
MUSIC USED
Slippery Steps -- Kirby's Return to Dreamland Deluxe
Four Adventurers - Cookie Country -- Kirby's Return to Dreamland Deluxe
Time for a Challenge! -- Kirby's Return to Dreamland Deluxe
Special thanks to Arten for the Multibonk art!
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Игры
The frame perfect is evil.
Deserved really, power bounce is definitely broken and always has been
This way you still are likely to at least get twice as many jumps as normal with the possibility of more. Still really good, but not nearly as broken
@@peco595 such a terrible and unintuitive way of nerfing the move tho.
1 frame in 30 fps is 2 in 60 which is technicalllyyyyy consistent
Not saying it's a good change though
@@reason9262skill issue
Me: misses the first action command
We are together
Saaaammmeee, I'm so bad I just gave up power bounce and multibonk entirely
@@da_real_bup I can do multi bounce but not power bounce for some reason
3 fp spent for what😔
@@derginadaydream3 FP gone to waste. 🥲
no wonder i can never get the 4th bounce.
My highest bounce number were 7 bounces
Truthfully, I had a feeling the timing was somehow inconsistent. I would be trying to practice Power Bounce against the Battle Master, and he would keep saying "Too slow" on the fourth bounce even though as far as I could tell, my timing was exactly the same. Then, on the fifth bounce, he would sometimes be saying "Too fast" because I was still using the timing from the fourth bounce.
It's a good thing he exists, otherwise we might've been confused about the timing for weeks to come.
The master saying "too early" or "too late" really helped me because I heard of the frame perfect but I often got the 4th bounce but I could never get the 5th so I thought the frame perfect was on the 5th bounce but I just wasn't changing my timing after the 4th bounce and the master showed me that
Praise be to the Battle Master 🙏
I’m glad I’m not the only one that is using the “peachy badge” to spread joy to all of my enemies.
How do you get that?
@@Yoshi76257 the merchant in Rougeport square sells it
@@Yoshi76257Buy it from the Merchant at Rogueport Square.
I understand wanting to nerf Power Bounce by making it effectively cap out at 4 hits for casual players, but it still feels WRONG to throw out that entire sense of tightening up your timing with each hit, like you described. It was so satisfying before.
A more logical nerf would be decreasing damage by 2 to a maximum of 1
Thank you RUclips for recommending me this video when I'm on chapter 7
I'm on The post Game and only remains for me The last 2 secret bosses and RUclips recomends me this video NOW 😂
Meanwhile me not even having the game:
At what cost! But, I won?
i added more consistency by watching that A button on screen. if you noticed, the A button on screens presses when you reach the frames where it should be pressed, on the 4th jump just time the first frame by instinc and you should be able to time it almost every single time.
it's another visual cue ^^ and you should feel the rythm
The A button is also for cool inputs tho, so this might be very confusing
Thank you kyapper
8 consectuive frame perfect inputs is crazy
I'm wondering if they wanted to tighten up the timing on later bounces, tried to just delete the entries around 4 bounces, and somehow ended up with them using a default value instead
Edit: actually it looks like there's a lot of nonsense going on, the 9th bounce with 1 simplifier is less strict than the 8th?? Some of the bounces with 1 unsimplifier are less strict than with no (un)simplifier??
Developers: We’re vertically blocking loading zones so nobody does frame perfect jumps to break the game.
Also Developers: We’re changing Power Bounce to make a frame perfect jump mandatory on the fourth bounce every time.
I guarantee this also somehow crashed Paper Mario.
I straight up avoid using powerbounce in the remake, just a bunch of damage up/jumpman/pupddown stuff and ground pound gets the job done
I was wondering how I missed bounce 4 when I first used it against Hooktail before I heard about this a few weeks back. I really did think I had gotten really bad at PB after not having played TTYD GCN in a bit. Glad to know there's a visual cue that may help. I'll be sure to try it whenever I get 'round to doing a challenge run in the remake. Whenever that may be.
Simple explanation, and straight to the point! Thanks!
I wish I had this guide before I beat the game
doesnt matter much since the game is still super easy
only time i ever wouldve used this is for the one superboss that you need to superguard
"I made an evil and fucked up version of Power Bounce/Multibonk" -Some dev who decided to make this change, probably.
Just a glimpse into the asylum of their mind.
Thank you SO much for this Kappy. All of a sudden I am a lot more consistent with it than I was before. The only addition I would make is that the 8th and 11th bounces are ALSO 1-frame. I suspect the 12th is also 1-frame but I'm not fully sure. You should be fine with the visual cue you gave with those
Power made Bounce Easy
Thanks this tip help me will help out when I get the game
Thanks!! Awesome video!
Very helpful, thanks !
This entirely explains how I usually only get 4 bounces before I fail lmao. This’s about as narrow a frame window as a superguard.
It's actually a tighter frame window than a superguard, which is 2 frames LOL
...one frame at the 4th hit.
WOW.
Nice, thanks for the advice, Kappy. Gotta put in some serious practice with Kapp T. now.
oh that's weird, i can consistently get the 4th one, but i can never get past 7
That is because the 8th bounce is ALSO a 1-frame, coming earlier like the 4th as well. Just use the visual cue Kappy provided and you'll be fine
AMAZING VIDEO
I can’t believe I didn’t know about the practice arena until I saw Bringle use it AFTER I beat the game 😔
Thank you so much! This seems to help me a lot.
Also, it seems like EVERY fourth bounce is slightly earlier, not just the fourth bounce. So 4, 8, 12, etc.
Kappy still the goat even with the remake😌
ngl, i just looked at the A button and pressed it when it was pressed down as a cue and practice through that
I thought it felt unusually difficult. My go-to has been Power Stomp this go around.
It should 2 frames from the 3rd jump onwards
KIRBY RETURN TO DREAMLAND MUSIC
I've really got to wonder if this is intentional or a bug. Adding a random 1 frame bounce would be a wild decision if it's intended.
Why didn’t you say Power Bounce that Subscribe Button?
Damn, didn't even cross my mind; not content-brained enough yet LMAO
that would toggle it back and forth, which might end up in the unsubscribed state
You’d toggle it back and fourth between “subscribed” and “not subscribed”, which may not finish with it being on “subscribed”
@@yoshiwoollyworld Of course if you miss the 4th time, you stay subscribed
RUclips out here recommending me this after I 100% the game
Oh well, one day I’ll replay the game and then I’ll make use of this
At least this isn’t like doing 100 super jumps in SMRPG
Neat analysis video! Thanks for uploading!
TBH, I'm wondering if they're planning to patch this, or if the coders were just spiteful. Perhaps they're hoping runners would go for non-Power Bounce strategies?
The 4th power bounce being 1 frame HAS to be an oversight.
My brain read the thumbnail as "Power made bounce easy" 😂
I was wondering why Multibonk was so hard to use!
i looked up power bounce ttyd videos to see what the world record was after being able to semi-consistently get to one or two Excellents, having no idea Wonderful was a *frame perfect input*
IT'S 1 AM
I'VE GOTTEN LIKE 10 FRAME PERFECT INPUTS
AT 1 AM
power bounce made easy ❌
power made bounce easy ✔
Honestly the only question I have here is "why?" Was this intentionally done to curb OP strats? Was this a glitch? A framerate change gone wrong? What happened to completely screw these up?
I think the actual target of the nerf was Danger Mario, since Power Bounce + Danger Mario could rip through even the strongest enemies like a chainsaw.
I say the GameCube is easier in order to time that but thanks for the help.
I think I'm in the minority but I actually like that it's harder. I'm a bit bored of all paper mario high level gameplay boiling down to power bounce since it's so massively OP, and it's forced me to work around and explore other more interesting options
I knew something was off about the fourth bounce, but I thought was arbitrarily "earlier" than every other jump, not arbitrarily 1 frame. That explains a lot.
Now do it with "Cool" A-inputs in-between.
My g🎉🎉🎉
meanwhile me who can't even get past the third one
Yeah I got used to it but definitly I though I was getting too old for this the first time I tried my Power Bounces... Glad it is really just messed up timing decision by the devs.
At least danger Mario is still valid.
I would be playing it if i didnt beat it in one week.
When are they gonna patch this?
Nice xD
We kept failing the first jump of Multibonk. 🙃
Wait I’ve equipped both simplifier badges and actual started getting them more consistent yet now I’m hearing those badges weren’t doing anything for my timing?
There’s always simplifier. It can give you a few more frames for the 4th timing on Power Bounce/Multibonk, though this means you’ll get less star power.
I specifically address how Simplifier doesn't actually do anything for Power Bounce in the remake; did you watch the video? LOL
It’s worth noting that hits 8 and 11 have the same timing as 4, and 12 is even earlier.
How do you go smaller then 1 frame
@@Bowser6495 You don’t. I’m not talking about how precise it is, but rather their timings. You should press A when you hit the enemy for most hits, but you should press A before you hit the enemy for hits 4, 8, 11, and 12, with 12 being even earlier than the rest.
I got fifteen hits and will never do something like that again
(does charge for 15 turns)
(messes up on the first bounce)
dude i thought it was just me 😭
You know even now give me the iPhone who played bug fables the everlasting sapling I'm used to tricky timing this this is just absurd. Sorry thank you for this. Still annoying as hell especially doing stylish
This showed up after I beat Bonetail...
Wonderf Power Made
Wonderf Bounce Easy
You know this is crazy. I noticed the difficulty increase, but I always lose it on the 5th bounce not the 4th, haha. Am I good or bad?
This is a weird thing for them to make the timing hardest at the 4th hit but actually I think I understand what Nintendo was going for, or wt least I assume. Multibonk/Power Bounce is super overpowered originally and technically it still is. If it was only 3 hits, it'd still be fine, especially if you have other badges that work with Power Bounce it can still be op. But to someone who got through the 1-frame 4th hit, a reward of easier timed hits to continue the chain is a total TTYD thing to do of you think about it. The game is all about those random good feel RPG moments
The real takeaway is that simplifier is broken lol
I’m actually glad they nerfed this move. Making the 4th bounce a 1 frame input makes it fair for the massive damage you can do with it, I mean, if you’re the kind of player doing 13 damage per hit you are also a player who can do a 1 frame input. But everyone else is encouraged to use other moves too
This is a bug, not a nerf. If it was intentional, they would've kept every jump at 1 frame afterwards or just cancelled it
BS like this is why I don't feel that bad about exploiting glitches.
DINKY AHH SONG FROM KIRBY. :>
I know power bounce is extremely powerful so maybe that's why nintendo changed it so it couldn't be abused.
but still...what a weird way to go about it. why not make the "excellent" bounces more strict?
anyway, thanks for the pointer! this will help out a lot.
0:35 i think it is me, i got 6 hits with power bounce once and have never been able to get past like 2 ever again, i was so bad at it i just gave up power bounce by the end of my playthrough lol 😅
(Thats just a side tangent)
Power Made Bounce Easy
For some reason i have little trouble with the frame perfect hits. I rarely miss.
What's your Power Bounce record so far? Think I saw 4x or 5x "Excellent" ranks with Goombella in OG TTYD one time. _Emulating the game on a phone._
Jokes on you I can't hit the first input on Multibonk (seriously why is the timing so wierd)
now do it with the stylish
Jokes on all of you OG players, you have to deal with muscle memory while I learned the timing and got 12 during the secret boss that kills you if you hit it multiple times, jokes on you for being lucky enough to be able to play the game without spending hundreds on ether the disc or the computer to emulate it, plus you had this game for longer….
Y-yea JOKES ON YOU GUYS!
i never was able to get very manh bounces even in tbe original.
what's the point of removing skill-based OP-ness if they left intact the grinding-based danger mario?
after a certain amount of power rush badges I could one-turn whacka/bonetail/mush while deliberately missing every action command.
*Prince Mush's battle stance has changed! A fiery spirit is now burning within Prince Mush!*
Can I have a link to that spreadsheet that shows all the frame data
Sorry, I grabbed it from images online; no spreadsheet :(
@@Kappy0 Oh no worry, I was just curious what the data was for unsimplifier
Huh, I thought simplifier helped. Must've been placebo then.
0:47 Look at how weirdly inconsistent it is on 1 unsimplifier, adding an extra frame perfect, then removes it on 2 unsimplifiers. No way this was intentional? Is there some weird math I'm not getting?
Was this frame perfect bounce intentional? That seems so weird, especially since it goes back to normal on the 5th bounce. Why would they program it like that?
I wonder the same, but with the simplifier the frame perfect requirement just shifts, it doesn't get easier. That leads me to believe it's intentional, but why make it non frame perfect after the fourth bonk? It makes no sense. Nintendo is and always had been harebrained.
Does this affect Multibounce?
Nope, just Power Bounce & Multibonk!
This 1 frame fourth bounce is bullshit, but at least now whenever you see excellent on a Power Bounce it is SUPER hype because you know you hit it.
Power bounce is so not worth it if you aren't frame perfect
Why did they even do that it doesn't even make sense...
(Btw I didn't even know it got smaller in the original, does that happen in 64 aswell?)
Can you do them all on that visual cue?
Not sure what you mean by that?
@@Kappy0 Does the visual cue of lining up Mario with the A button only work on the 4th bounce? Or can you line him up that way for every bounce?
No, and the video does address that you need to press A later after the 4th bounce to keep it going so you can see when to press it LOL
@@Kappy0 That doesn't make sense. If the 4th bounce is frame perfect, wouldn't that same frame work for the others which aren't frame perfect?
@@djjomon Yeah, that *should* be the case, but it isn't! I've actually got an advanced Power Bounce/Multibonk Guide coming soon that'll help people get to 12+ bounces more consistently. This video is more for general use, where hitting 5-8 bounces is more than enough to get through the game LOL
Was this intentional? Like did they make the 4th bounce 1 frame on purpose?
I assume yes. The move can be powerful enough at just 3 hits if you know what you're doing. After 4, hitting the frame-perfect, it is just a good feeling to keep the chain going. This is how I make sense of it, it's a total Nintendo thing
@@thewiseoldfoxI completely disagree
@@AkameGaKillfan777 you completely have your own opinion
Oh dude if you heart comments in the first and second hour the algorithm senses engagement. Just a tip, and thanks is for the help!
Am I the only one that I've never played on a GameCube version before?
Yes, you are. I saw it on the news.
Nope
@@lpnp9477 Sad news for you I guess 😂😂
Frame 1 what is this? Some Smash Bros tech?
due note that this is in 30 fps, so it isnt as tight as it normally is. not saying that its easy, though.
It is much tighter than the original. It's not about the frame rate, it's about a change in the rhythm due to a design change or bug. But if you use a 60fps patch without another patch or cheat to edit the frame tables then yeah it's mega hard
@@lpnp9477 probably shoulda said it isnt as tight as it would be on 60fps if it was still frame perfect. so yeah i guess are are right
This is helpful, but the mechanic is still stupidly wonky. Sigh…
You were super helpful though!
Honestly, with how much everyone said Power Bounce was OP, something like this was expected, right?
I love how they made a change like this as a sort of troll, instead of just being lame and straight nerfed it.
It's the kind of change that makes me mad, but in a good way.
The devs are just sort of like "Nope, we're not making it super easy to destroy everything with Power Bounce this time."
Truthfully, I don't think it's as big of a nerf as some people think. With enough practice, getting more than four bounces is absolutely doable and even if you only get four bounces, that can still be quite a bit of damage.
Wouldn’t a more logical nerf be capping it after 8 bounces or making the timing more strict instead of the timing being strict on frame 4 and more lenient afterwards?
@@yoshiwoollyworld Yeah, that would be the more logical choice. However, they probably didn't want to straight nerf it and make it inherently a weaker move than in the original, so they went with this sort of middle-ground nerf.
@@yoshiwoollyworld i see it as a sort of skill barrier tbh, you can't abuse danger mario as easily anymore but if you're good enough at the game then you've earned it and can get past that barrier.
thank you so much! Dabn, I literally thought I was becoming worse at Power Bounce. The gamecube version's timings just make so much more sense. Especially at Superguards. Like, wtf are some of these timings in the remake? Personally, I am probably most bothered by the Fuzzy Horde Superguard timings. I mean, you kinda press way before the hit Mario. Or the clefts, where it feels like you have to press when the cleft is right in the middle of Mario.
I really hope they patch that 4th bounce thing out, because there's no way that's meant to be intentional.
No its absolutely intentional, power bounce was broken in the original, and this change just makes it… less accessible but still broken.
@@pokemaniac0075 That is such a band aid on an open wound solution lol
@@MachineMan64 yeah, especially when there are mulitple other options in the game that are also broken, it's ridiculous that only Power Bounce got nerfed
@@pokemaniac0075 Highly doubt it's intentional it's such an arbitrary change to only make the 4th hit 1 frame yet 5th and beyond goes normal again. If they wanted to nerf it they would've made it 8 6 4 2 1 or always cap it at 5 bounces.
@@darc5925 Paper Mario (And all its rereleases) lets you go up to 100 power bounces, sometimes even 101 for some odd reason? Easy too with Dodge Master equipped.
It's busted there too, but it's a thing regardless. I'd stick with the former suggestion and go towards frame perfection more quickly.
Im actually one of those few that like this change. Brainlet Bounce was too overpowered in both 64 and TTYD.
Wouldn’t a more logical nerf be capping it after 8 bounces or making the timing more strict instead of the timing being strict on frame 4 and more lenient afterwards?
@@yoshiwoollyworldimo the best thing to do would be 2 frame window at 4th and frame perfect from 5 onward. The move is undoubtedly powerful enough just being 3-4 hits