The reason people often say the Porsche flat six doesn't sound like much until you get it up in the revs is due to the exhaust valve control settings. Even in sport or sport + mode with the exhaust valves "open" they will still close between something like 1-4 thousand revs. A $500 valve controller and 20 minutes solves that issue. Then you get that lovely noise even when going around town. The 4.5 seconds to 60 you are looking at is for the manual GTS 4.0. The PDK is .1 seconds quicker to 60 (stated) than the 2.5l model. The sounds difference is something that's completely personal and its frustrating to hear all the reviewers say it sounds like garbage. It certainly doesn't. The pops and crackles give it a character the 4l doesn't have. You have an absolutely lovely car. Im expecting a C GTS 4.0 in the summer so thank you for helping pass the time until then.
Should also be noted that you can't trust any numbers from any of the VW group's brands, it's sort of an open secret they'll make the numbers fit whatever they're trying to achieve, for instance the sporty Golf versions are on paper always quicker than their counterparts from the other brands (Seat & Skoda), but when put to the test those counterparts perform as well or better. It's just that VW politics demands that the Golf must be quicker. So they'll just tweak the numbers. They do the same thing with horsepower numbers. I suspect the GTS 4.0 doesn't produce 400 hp but rather the same 420 as the Spyder. They're using the same engine and I doubt their tuning's actually any different. Instead the numbers on paper are tweaked so that the buyer has more of a justification to go for the Spyder. I can speak from experience, my car is from a VW group brand and supposed to be a few milliseconds slower than the Golf model with the same engine. It isn't. It's actually faster than the Golf is on paper.
i just rented and enjoyed a Porsche Boxster 718 S, Flat 4, 350 HP, 2023 model in PorschePlatz Stuttgart 2 weeks ago and I loved the experience driving about the winding hill roads of the Black Forest region. The engine tune and exhaust sounds rorty and nice. Anyway I enjoyed it.
I bought my 2018 718S Boxster 4 months ago. Always wanted one and saw mine at Porsche center south London and fell in love with it. Its heavily specked and probably paid over the top but it is a beautiful car. I had no idea how many people really dislike the 4 cylinder and like you say most of them have probably never driven one! I think mine has a great sound and with the UK roads as they are now I wouldn't want anything faster! Great review Pete.
There's another aspect to the 6 cylinder engine. Some people are complaining that it's a bit characterless below 4000rpm but I actually think this is a huge virtue. Below 4000, the engine is silky smooth and quiet so you can waft around in peace and harmony touring or watching the world flow by. It slinks around like a Bentley, soothing frayed nerves in a wash of tranquility. But...floor it and rev it and it comes alive howling like a banshee and screaming from apex to apex. So, this is actually two cars in one. A creamy tourer and slot car all in one. My brother has a Honda S2000 which requires thrashing and revving at all times. Rewarding in its own way but you finish a drive like a caffeine junky, sweating and shaking. It's so good to have a choice. The joy of six.
@johnwatt .. +1. Spot on, the nose! ..My brother drives the high-revving RPM Honda S2000. .. Read a "caffeine junky" drive character,,,,,, to the otherwise an uber-sophisticated Honda chassis.. . "Different strokes, for different folks" ... Cheers
You are so right. I thought I wanted an S2000, but it is so much better to have a car you can enjoy at any speed and RPM. With the Porsche 6 you get a nice sound and good torque plus the unhinged wail at the top.
That Honda S2000 sounds fun ;) Sweating and shaking like you had 100 RedBull after a drive sounds perfect lol. But I think I will still prefer a Porsche Cayman as a daily drive.
Where r u gonna rev it,in the middle of nowhere or a track?.Don't we all use our car more in b roads and normal with speed limits.what is the point in having a car which can be only enjoyed in special conditions and situation,when the cheaper car has better driving characteristics in everyday driving situations
Interesting comparison, I can’t say I agree that they both sound good. I had a cayman 2.5GTS, and now have a 718 GT4, the engine in the 2.5 is definitely effective, punchy at low speeds as you say, but very monotone and it never put a smile on my face like the flat 6 does. Also, the PDK 4.0 is said to do 0-60 in 4 seconds, the 4.5 second time is for the manual. It’s fine to defend the car you bought though and the cabin size comparison, that’s really interesting, not something you’d expect!
@@simonm9923 must be something like that. Or perhaps the back is less upright? Always the top bit that hits the bulkhead when I go all the way back in mine
@@simonm9923 yep doubt they would have reengineered the structural bulkhead. The platform would have been designed for the 6. Not sure but might have needed crash testing certification.
6’5”, really appreciate your reporting this discovery! And I’m actually surprised at how small the sound difference was b/n the two engines, I thought it would be more pronounced.
I have a BMW Z4 and made the mistake of buying without driving it first. I have the exact issue you mentioned with the leg room. I just can't get the seat far back enough so within an hour I end up with cramp and have to get out. I've had the car less than a year and already having to sell because it just takes the enjoyment out of using it. Your point about not buying something without driving is a very good one!
Great comparison 👍🏽 I never saw that last reason coming and it makes a lot of sense! On getting cruise control retrofitted - something to bear in mind is that if you're doing longer motorway runs, then the cruise control doesn't utilise the car's "coasting" function well, which can result in notably worse fuel economy on long runs. I have cruise in my 981 Cayman GTS, but rarely use cruise on the motorway for this reason. (Apart from avg speed zones) I appreciate that these obviously aren't the kinds of cars we buy for fuel economy! But every little helps 😊
The review no one else has done, and very well done too 👏🏻 I did of course know the conclusion and it's still baffling as they have the same seats. Let me know what porsche say. On the weight Harry Metcalf weighed the 4.0 at 1,280 kilos. He was so shocked he did it twice to check and had a full tank of fuel. As others have pointed out 4.5 to 60 is for the manual. Having driven the 4.0 man and PDK, only a few days apart, I can honestly say the manual felt quicker, by quite some margin. Very odd I know! Probably my brain playing tricks and my in-built manual preference. When driving the PDK I also think using the stick is much nicer than the paddles, the stick feels more mechanical and again, probably my brain playing tricks, but it felt like the shifts were more punchy. Try it and see? I also much preferred the 4.0 to my 981 spyder, better riding, quicker and not as obnoxious on the exhaust. I was so impressed I ordered one, as you know. I would also have no problem with a 2.5. The Boxster is an amazing car in any guise, I've had 3 and they are just about the best sportscar at any price.
@@georgepotcovaru2595 I actually haven't driven a 2.5. I was comparing manual & PDK 4.0 and 718 and 981 manual Spyder. There is no wrong answer with a Boxster, they are all amazing cars, I have just bought my 4th .
Fantastic, informative video. Im just about to take delivery of my 718 GTS 4.0 manual. I was very tempted with a 2.5 due to its flexibility , especially on UK roads. A track day at Porsche Silverstone won me over with the 4.0 and as we are about to wave goodbye to naturally aspirated engines, especially when coupled to a manual box that made my decision. Porsche kindly lent me a Boxster 2.0 with a PDK for the weekend, and to be honest that was still a brilliant, balanced and entertaining car to drive. In all their guises , modern Porsches are pretty hard to beat 😊
Great review, for enjoying B roads I think the 981 GTS might be the one to have. Better gearing and sound. Would be great to compare the 4.0 to the 3.4 👍
I really preferred the 2.5L in autocross to the flat 6. The 6 felt heavier and less agile. The variable vane and high compression make the engine plenty powerful and remarkably responsive. I'd pick the 4 for daily and autocross and be happy as a clam it's a great total package.
I’m the original owner of a 986 Boxster S. The best upgrade I ever made to the car was switching to GT3 bucket seats - they gave me a lot more headroom and legroom and made the car truly a great fit for me. (I also installed GT3 console delete and that helped with lateral legroom.) I’d be curious to see if bucket seats would improve the GTS 4.0 similarly.
Sir, for some odd reason, I’ve never bumped into your channel until today. Absolutely love the content and delivery. And that FACE you make when you listen to the exhaust noises. Only a true petrol head would get it! 😅
Funny you should mention gear ratios. When new MINI came out, my Dad was a delivery driver for the local dealer. When asked which one someone should buy, he said the normal Cooper but not the 'S'. The gears had been changed for the S to make the numbers look good on paper but had ruined it's drivability.
I have a Boxster GTS 4.0. My previous car was a 2006 Boxster S. I am 6'2". Took me a day to get adjusted and comfortable. Great cars! Love the one you're with.....
This just reinforces how I feel about my 718 Cayman S. I almost bought a 981 GTS w the old 3.8 F6 and hated the lack of torque and the lack of character at lower rpms. I’ve got most of the same kit on mine as a GTS except the 18-way seats and Sport Chrono so the only thing I’d like to do now is get a Softech tune, a downpipe and go ham 😁
I’ve been trying to look for a comparison between the two for a while and couldn’t find any that provided such good information. Direct comparison of engine sounds, 0-60 mph *without* launch control (since we rarely actually use it), and the seating position difference! What an unexpected surprise! I completely agree with you the 2.5 is portably better for daily drives, and one thing I do enjoy more of the smaller engine is exactly what you mentioned 6:29, the popping turbo exhaust noises. I am blessed with shorter height (much less than 6 ft) so I’m happily enjoying the flat 6. Thank you, Ped, for doing such an amazing comparison review! I definitely think you made the right choice for yourself.
Interesting vid, in my 4.0 litre I’ve fitted seat lift brackets which have made it comfortable for my long legs also the zero to sixty time of 4.5s I believe is based on the manual box
Another very good and very honest review. Being the owner of a 718 flat four, I am obviously partial. I have commented previously about the sound haters that say it sounds like a Subaru. Obviously, nobody buys a Porsche to get good gas mileage but I get over 30 miles per gallon on the highway with my turbo charged flat four. Just another bonus. And, I love the way it sounds. It’s rough and raspy and I like it.
Fantastic video, you’ve absolutely nailed it.I’ve had a base 718 and now GT4 and they are obviously very different cars but the base was way more comfortable than the GT4. The 2.0 and 2.5 are fantastic engines and allow you to really engage with the car because as per the test they make lots more low down torque. 4.0 def sound so much better but again the 2.0 and 2.5 sound great. I thought I needed the pinnacle GT4 but in reality now I’ve had both I’d say the 2.0 or 2.5 is the better car to live with anyday.👍
Great video and objective comparison. Owning a cayman 718 S, i was considering upgrading to a 991.2 S, tried recently a 992 GTS also...and honestly... yeah they sound great and look nice, but the overall perfs/driving feeling, not mentioning the ridiculous budget difference, make me love my 718 even more. Of course that's a very personal feeling, but i agree when you say that price/pef/looks considered, the 718 is maybe the best sport car out there right now (seems the A110 is amazing too but i haven't tested it so can't really say ^^).
Great video! I have the same car as you. The silver 19 GTS. I think it sounds insane. I love the pops when you lift off the throttle. The same pops sound a bit muted in the flat 6. The torque character is what makes me not want to get a 4.0 GTS. 2.5 makes peak torque at 1900 RPM 4.0 makes peak torque at 5500 RPM That’s a lot of fun skipped driving on an ordinary trip to the tennis court. Had no idea about the cabin being smaller. That’s made me certain I am in the right car! I frequently drive long distances. Cheers to our cars!
Makes me miss my old 981 Cayman - even the engine in that sounded fabulous and because it was just the 2.7 you could really rev it out. Manual too with sports plus...fab car. The 2.5 flat four sounds just like a flat four - monotonal and dull but certainly effective!
@@drbobs8267 I think its a compliment to compare it to the gorgeous Subaru sound. First thing I thought when I heard it w/o seeing it was that someone fires up his aircooled beetle with sports exhaust. I was surprised seeing a Boxster instead in front of my house. Love that sound of the past🥰
Thanks for a well balanced review. Whilst logical I just never knew about the firewall being closer with the 4.0. I agonised between a 4 & 6 cylinder and purchased a 718 Cayman, stock standard non ‘S’ with PDK and Sport Chrono. Coming out of an M2 Competition, I would have to say I have more fun more often in the Cayman. The 2 litre motor still delivers huge punch at legal speeds and all the lovely poise & balance of the chassis is still there in spades. I cannot recommend highly enough. As you say, the Cayman in any guise is one of the best sports cars out there. You can’t beat a pure bred Porsche in my opinion. Thanks again for a great comparison.
Just a quick FYI, there's a few inaccuracies in this. The engines are the same between GTS 4.0, GT4 and Spyder, the weight stats you quoted aren't correct - you quoted the minimum AND manual weight figures for the GTS 2.5 PDK (i.e. weight saving options, carbon buckets, etc.), and the GTS 4.0 PDK figure was way, way out - the difference between the two PDK cars would have been closer to 30kg, not 121kg. The rear diffuser of the GTS 4.0 isn't the same as the Spyder, the Spyder shares it's rear diffuser with the GT4 though. And as others have mentioned, Porsche quotes the GTS 4.0 PDK 0-60 at 4 seconds, but it has been tested at well below 4 by other journalists. Otherwise, great vid - the leg length issue was a big surprise!
2:40 The weight difference it wrong. Porsche quotes the PDK GTS 4.0 at 1435 Kg and GTS 2.5 PDK at 1405Kg which make it about 30kg heavier. A couple of cylinders and less a turbo can't weigh over 121kg more, that doesn't make sense. Interesting comment about the leg room though. I wonder if the carbon bucket seats creates more legroom. Between the sport plus seat and the bucket seats the bucket seats always look like it has more room behind the seats, not sure if that'll translate to leg room.
Brilliant appraisal, and who knew it would be a design change that meant you could not have a 4.0........ but you made the right choice with your car, accidentally or not.
Thanks for the hint. I'm 6'3 so when I win the lottery, I'll be going for the 2.5L but in Cayman format. (Not a soft top fan). And yes - The 6 cylinder engine sounded GREAT
Excellent GTS v GTS comparison! As a Porsche addict for most of my adult life (more than a dozen, starting in 1996 with a 968 CS and including front, rear and mid-engined models with 4,6 and 8 pot motors - so I'm no flat-six snob!) I have sampled almost every derivative, but I've never had the chance drive 4 and 6 cylinder 718s back-to-back. The unexplained cabin space discrepancy should not be a deal-breaker as it's probably just down to seat adjustment - the seats are the same in both cars and the cabin architecture in both is carried over from the exclusively six-cylinder 981. Other factors (looks, ambience, performance, weight, chassis dynamics) appear to be very similar or a matter of taste. For me, in these final days of ICE power, the 4.0 is much more desirable. The six-cylinder engine sounds a lot better, delivers it's power in classic NA style and revving it out would never be a chore. But it'll cost you at least £12k more than the 2.5, which is without doubt the best value car here. If this was a GTS v GTS v GTS comparison, you might be wishing you'd saved another £10k and bagged a six-cylinder 981 3.4 GTS - best of both worlds?
As a ‘2018 718 box GTS owner - I love this video :) never drove a GTS 4.0 or a simple flat 6.. so can’t compare.. however yeah it’s a definite smile inducing driver pleaser. Having taken it around the Silverstone Porsche tracks learnt a lot more about its capabilities. Love it even more :)
Interesting comparison! First thing to get out of the way is that there isn't 140kg between the two, but to be fair I can't find a definitive figure either. The lowest I have seen is 8Kg. Autocar said there was 60Kg between then. Remember the 4cyl has turbos, cross pipes, intercoolers etc. to offset that smaller block. On the most important points, I am aligned with your assessment. I have 4.0 Manual and compared it with 2.5S PDK. I thought the 2.5 was faster than mine, certainly felt it. There's a linearity to the 4.0l that belies it's pace. The 2.5 is pizzaz and zip. It had a bit of lag, then real midrange punch that feels 'wow', then it gets a bit 'rung out' above 6500rpm compared with 4.0l. The 4.0l has no pops and bangs on the over-run however. So it's however you like your poison! For me it's the velvet sound of the 4.0l that I love, but if I didn't fit (I had no idea the cabin was shorter), I'd have no issue with the 4 pot. Keep up the good videos Mate!
I’m 5’11”. I own a 99 Boxster and just got a 2023 Spyder. The Spyder is unreal. The best. And I have zero problems fitting in the Spyder. Plus, the Spyder will hold its value more than the other Boxsters these days
I came out of a 99 Boxster into a new Spyder. I can’t put it into words. I find excuses to try and drive the Spyder. It’s best vehicle I’ve ever owned.
I had a 981 S, now have the 2.5 GTS and I can tell you the 2.5 is ridiculously more fun. I loved my 981, never thought I’d want to let it go until I drove the 718
Pete. Great video as always but regarding the cabin size I really can't see Porsche introducing new tooling just for the BGTS4.0. Did the 4.0 have 18 way seats? This is the only thing I can think of. The extra electrics and motors do reduce how low you can put the seat in the 18 way, just wondering if it also limits the travel fore and aft? Re the steering wheel, you have the standard wheel whereas the 4.0 has the multifunction wheel which is also heated. As a side note, the engine and gearbox in the 4.0 GTS is the same as the Spyder and GT4 but with different engine mapping which reduces the red line to 7800 rather than the 8 of the GT4.
Good review. I started with a 987 cayman base manual and loved it. Moved to a 911 camera 2 997, awesome car, but couldn’t drive fast enough to enjoy the engine note. I traded it for a 981 base with pdk, 275 hp, so perfect held in 3rd on the b roads, always hearing that engine note. I tried the 718, amazing drive , but for me, the non s 981 is the most fun I ever had in a Porsche.
I bought a boxster without knowing anything about cars. I didnt know what a turbo was, what hp or nm meant. I had owned a Peugeot 206 and a Kia, walked into Porsche just to try one for fun and it was amazing, walked out with a Boxster and now Im in love with Porsche. Any model is just mind blowing over the competition, recently had 2 different BMWs and they just feel dull afterwards. And I like PDK cant be hassled with manual lol
There is no reduced space, all 718 Boxster interior dimensions are identical. Different seat specifications and adjustments (eg backrest angle) can lead to perception of reduced legroom. It is not a 4cyl vs. 6 cyl issue.
Very detailed explanation of the difference and who’d have thought the leg room would be different. I have a 987.1 Boxster 3.4s and one of the reasons I bought it is the flat 6 soundtrack. I have a flat 4 boxer engined Subaru 2.0 turbo and the sound track is oh so plain in comparison. I’m not against a 4 cylinder in general but think the flat 6 is one of the best sounds a car can make. Thanks for posting 👍🏻
Our AA group leader just sat us down to watch this, so we can recognise the symptoms of Denial…. 😜. Only joking, thanks for the comparison, def not 20k’s worth of difference between them. I wonder how the 981 GTS would fare in this comparison?
I've got the 981 GTS & I chose it instead of the 718 purely on noise alone it's epic in comparison, Nobody buys a boxster as a daily it's for the weekends 😂
Great little video, I actually watched the followup video first which helped. I'm in a 987.2 3.4 PDK at the moment and my mindset is that moving to a 981 sharing the same engine and gearbox might not be a huge change. So leaning towards a 2.5 718 S with the mindset of its always easier to drop back into a 981 later in life so videos of happy owners is a bonus to find. Seats have always been a strange one in Porsche I'm 6'3 and in my 986 I had to install 987 seats for legroom benefits & I'm told the newer models tall person advise is the more basic the seat the more legroom you get. So the standard 2-way (wingback or not) seems to be the best option while jumping in the 14/18 way seats you get less. I do agree for road use the 4.0 has gone too far. Similarly why I don't get the 911 itch on newer cars.
I also agree with your point about a lot of internet trolls likely don't own or have owned a Boxster/Cayman previously so who are they to comment. I trust in the brand and the itch to try one out is there.
Love your videos but can’t help feeling you’re trying to retrospectively justify the 4 pot. It’s fab don’t get me wrong, love mine, but the 6 pot is a class above, special in a way that even surpasses the 4
@@PetrolPed Just finished a wash after 4 weeks of salt and grime and wow what a wonderful looking car whatever engine you have the privilege to pedal 👍
Outstanding video and comparison. I'm sure this will help alot of us with this admittedly 'first world problem', but thank you making this comparison. Cheers from Canada !
The sound of the 4.0 is a totally different level! And it revs so nicely, It is the only option here! But I think since it’s been available and for the foreseeable the 2.5 is a relative bargain. Also I don’t agree that you have to thrash the 4 to make it sound good. Anything above 3k rpm sounds epic. Really enjoyed the video
Btw, I have the 4.0 cayman and I’m 6’3. Don’t have any issues which space, my seat still has plenty more room to go back actually, so maybe just an issue with the space in the boxster?
Before i bought my first Caymam, a 2007 987 base model, i got my performance thrills on motorcycles, not all out sport bikes but sport standards like the Honda Nighthawk S and the Kawasaki ZRX1200, two very similar styled bikes with very different power delivery. The Honda had a ton of cam overlap so it made little power down low. But the jump between 7 and 8,000 RPM was 20 HP. And that jump was very noticable in the seat of the pants as the revs climbed. The ZRX on the other hand had a Ninja motor with smaller intake tracts and milder cams than the Honda. It had loads of gruntt down low and pulled hard pretty much throughout its rev range. I am able to appreciate both methods of power delivery. Its a lot of fun rowing through the gears, keeping the RPM's in that sweet spot. On the other hand, the low end grunt of the ZRX was easier to ride fast on curvy roads with strong power delivery in almost any gear chosen. I found that very satisfying also. My old 2.7L base model Cayman and my 2018 718 S compare very similarly to the bikes I described. Both are a ton of fun to drive. And i have to admit i love the sound of the NA 6 better. The turbocharged 4 doesn't sound bad but it doesn't sing like the 6.
In 2019 I went to Porsche to test the Boxster, couldn’t get comfortable in it (I’m 6-4). Bought a BMW Z4 Sdrive35is and LOVE it. Now the 4 cylinder 917 Boxster has ample room in it AND I WANT AN S ! You have explained why, thought I really missed something. Oh well, love and learn.
Do you really think they produced a different bodyshell for the GTS 4.0? Whatever you are feeling has another explanation because the cabin of any 718 Cayman or Boxster has the same dimensions. You had no concerns with the GT4 so there must be another explanation….
I would suggest that the seat was either a different spec or the backrest was more reclined and hitting the bulkhead earlier. I’ve had both cars and there’s no difference. I’m only 6’1” but don’t have my seat anywhere near fully back
I borrowed a 4.0 GTS 718 and thought it felt flat and deliberately de tuned. The same lump in a 911 feels a lot more entertaining. Pre-OPF 981 Spyder for me - based on noise alone 😀 Flat 4 sound is not what we’re used to from Porsche today, although most people forget that Porsches had 4s long before they had 6s.
There is no 'same lump' in the 911. The GTS4.0l takes the 3l 911 engine, turbo's removed, then bored and stroked to 4l along with many other changes. No 911 has anything similar.
Great video and very well considered comparison. I have a 2022 GTS 4.0 Manual Cayman. Manual was a no-brainer for me as I didn’t want to chase faster 0-60 times or worry about driveability in traffic. I wanted to change gear myself rather than worry about 10ths. I also wanted a NA engine - probably the last time I’d be able to buy a new one. I also have a base Carrerra 992 with a turbo engine - no question, the Cayman’s donkey is a much greater sense of occasion, albeit with less torque and drive ability. But that’s fine - it so much more of an event to drive. Interestingly, my Carrerra’s PDK and turbo engine seem to match each other really well. And the Cayman’s NA 6 and manual seem to be a match made in heaven. I’m 6ft 2ins and don’t feel the seat issue - maybe the Cayman and Boxster have different dimensions as the former doesn’t need to fit a folding roof space inside? I’ve driven over 10k miles in Europe over several trips with no issues. I’ve never tried any sort of Boxster. I specced the alcantara shell and gear shift. I also have the radar cruise - essential for the long journeys to the mountains!! I wouldn’t get any car without it nowadays. I made one change that you touch upon - I had a lower final drive gear ratio fitted. I knew the long gearing would be an issue so I planned to change it before I ordered. It has transformed the car, albeit it drinks slightly more fuel and is a little noisier on a cruise. Basically, I bought the Cayman for the engine and gearbox. And fixed the main issue of gear ratios.
Just beginning to contemplate a used Boxter and absolutely loved this video. I’m only 5’8” so the size thing doesn’t bother me but I was very interested in your assessment of the driving characteristics of the two cars. I think my preference is the 2.5 litre for usability on UK roads.
I had the 3.2L Boxster "S." It was a great car. Balance, poise & road manners really made excel. Being mid engined & with PDK gear box. To my mind far superior to the 70 year Old continual development of the VW Beetle! The Boxster is the model that single handedly saved Porsche from certain bankruptcy! The Caymab came along when the job was done. I would guess Porsche have now sold more Boxster/ Caymans now than 911's since their very first. If any Porsche is sorted it's the Boxster Cayman! They were reluctant to put a 4.0L performance engine in it! As they know it will damage to 911 sales. Put a 911 owner in a Boxster & they would be amazed!
I had poo pooed the 2.5 flat four until I heard one in a car park the other day. It sounded great. Those 4.0s make are so expensive. Not that anything is cheap nowadays. Great vid as usual. Thanks. 👍
Great video, thanks! I’m 6’6 and I’ve got a 4.0 arriving in April. Were they the 18 way adjustable seats? I fit comfortably with the standard seats, but not the 18 way.
Excellent video. Despite the fact that you paid with your own money for the 2.5l, you are honest. As you say, the engines simply sound different - I describe it as the 6-cylinder as 'singing' and the 4-cylinder as 'growling'. I have a 2017 Boxster S (3 weeks now) and I read/hear the same as you - people (many journalists and Porsche aficionados) who have never owned the 2.5l jump to the same conclusions. But I can tell you this, I came from a BMW 2-litre diesel and now own a Porsche - and it sounds incredible. Kids take their phones out and film my car as I drive by when they hear it in sports mode. And that weight thing is significant. 120kg might not sound much in a passing comment or on paper - but then people should imaging filling their car with 5 fully loaded holiday suitcases - you will feel the difference...
Sorry, late to this. Ref steering wheel controls. I have both setups, switches and knobs on steering wheel I find fiddly but radio vol is useful. The little stick is sooo much better IMO as you can just bang through the settings, up down, forward, back. So much easier on the move. Big surprise about the legroom.
There is no reduced space, all 718 Boxster interior dimensions are identical. Different seat specifications and adjustments (eg backrest angle) can lead to perception of reduced legroom. It is not a 4cyl vs. 6 cyl issue.
I loved the dual rear tip exit, was GT3 like...so I got a soul performance cat back with sport muffler and life is better now. Torque and sound in a 2.5. and amazing mpg on the highway🎉
You make an interesting point about the legroom differences. I noticed a difference as well. Sometimes my left foot was off center on the clutch pedal in the GTS 4.0. I rarely, if ever experienced that with the Cayman S. It was not a comfortable feeling. I thought it was me. What you described could explain what I experienced also.
Have to disagree with you. I think the rear view of your car looks far better than the 4.0 With having the central twin exhaust it just looks more balanced.
Great Vid thank you, for me the GTS 4.0 sounds night and day better, also regarding 0-62s I believe you have taken the GTS4.0s as a manual, the auto is stated by Porsche to be 4 seconds dead...on the flip side the top speed of the PDK is 179 so its now slower :D. I haven't driven the 4.0, but did note I couldn't get low enough in the 2.5, my vision would be partially inhibited by the bar above the windscreen, good to know I need to try this out in the 4.0, thank you!
I am probably one of your older subscribers at 72 and have been a Porsche fan since I was 12 and my older sister came home with a new boyfriend in a 356. After graduating from university with an engineering degree I traded my MGB for a new 1973 914 2.0l with its flat 4. Now I should say that my first two cars were VW beetles so theI was very much a flat 4 fan and remembering that Porsches first 15 years of production were all rooted in VW flat 4 technology. As years went by an my income grew so did my interest in all things Porsche and so have been blessed with having owned several 911’s over the years with my last one being a 991 GTS but that’s not my story. My wife who loves her cars as well had traded her Bentley GTC for a 2.5 718 GTS GT silver tan leather interior and turbo wheels. While I thought this was “nice” and not a 911 I have fallen in love with it! First it pays homage to the 718 of the 50’s and reminds me of my 914 both with mid engine flat 4’s and the wonderful sound of the flat 4. Don’t get me wrong the flat 6 is the the metric all other cars try to compare themselves to but the flat 4 is Porsche roots. So getting back to the 2.5 GTS as this report says it is a wonderfully balanced car as so agile and quick and while I am on pilots sports I am sure we are sub 4s 0-60. For me this is the best all round sports car out there and easily a daily driver. With two trunks or boots I have to smile when I come out of a supermarket with a trolley full of bags and they all get swallowed up in the front trunk as onlookers are amazed that a sports car even has a proper trunk yet alone one an small SUV would be envious of. Now back to the 2.5 do your research and you will find this 4 is based on the 992 6 in the design and even carryover of many components, so very robust. Just remember Porsche roots are all in flat 4’s and the tragedy is that someone at Porsche got it right launching the 2.5 4 but lost their bottle to pressure and replacing it again with a flat 6. If you love your Porsches and their history go out a get a 2.5 before it is too late…
Love your videos Pete but I'm afraid you've got a few facts wrong here re weights and 0-60s. I'm a big fan of both and unlike most have owned both the 2.5 and 4.0. Totally agree the 2.5 engine gets a bad rep and I loved mine - best progressive, accelerating car ever. Get them on track though and there is a big driver experience difference. Nevertheless, great fun in both.
Thanks for the video Pete! I'm searching for my next Porsche and have narrowed in on the Cayman GTS. But I wasn't sure which one until your video. The interior space is the winner for me. After churning through countless other reviews yours was the only one to even bring that up, let alone actually measure it. Thanks!
Having done more research I found out the cabins are exactly the same size. It must have been the position of the seat. I did a second video on the subject 👍
Interesting comment about the leg room between the two cars something that I would not have thought of- I like the Mazda MX5 but doubt I could live with it as at 6.2 it feels cramped. I agree with you that both cars are brilliant and I would very much like another Boxster if only I could afford it
Interesting and great comparison, I’m 6’1 with 34” inside leg and have no issues driving my gts4. I haven’t driven the 4 cylinder so can’t compare. 0-60 times in the 4 litre differ between pdk (4 secs) and manual (4.5 sec). One thing I know for sure is that If you want to track your car then get the 4 litre. At the end of the day, they are both Porsches, who build great cars! You won’t be disappointed either way!
Went from a 3.4 987.2 Boxster S to 2.5 Cayman S both wonderful cars but got to love the low down power delivery of the 2.5 was more useable on a day to day basis. Had to sadly sell during Covid.
My brother-in-law has a Cayman S and I have taken it out for a thrash many times, it's a lovely thing, but as you say the gearing is too tall, run it out it is doing 90+ in second. Corvette owners think of their cars like the beginning of a project, my C4 ZR1 has several minor upgrades but the 4.10:1 rear end ratio is the one you notice, 90 in 3rd and 125 in 4th, but Porsche owners seem to resist upgrades like ATB / limited slip, low ratio axles.
I definitely would like to see 0-60,100,200 comparison of the 2 cars. Can't believe no one has done that in the past 2 years. There are too many speculation the 2.5 would just dust the 4.0 and hence no one is doing such comparison or they won't get Porsche's sponsorship.
Great video and great to see the comparison between the two cars - I'm very much surprised though that the interior space is different in the 4.0 - I have one, although I'm just under 6 ft did a 4000 mile european tour last year in it and had no issues with comfort. I do also wish the gearing was shorter for the sake of fun, and GPF equipped cars don't do the pops/bangs, but as a road car it's spectacular. Surprisingly economical too!
I own a 2.7 981, no mod exhaust, manual. It kills the 2.5t stone dead on sound and involved drive (f you drive the 981 in sports mode, the difference more massive). I tested a 987 4.0 GTS 4 months back, and whilst totally wowed - was no way worth the extra 40-45k for a similar used model.
The Flat 6 4.0 is a special platform, especially in Manual. The last of its kind. Snatch em up while you can, because the 718 GTS 4.0 at under or around 100k is all that most people will ever need in a 400 HP sportscar. A perfect package that will increase in value every year.
I had 2.5 GTS with stage 1, it's faster over my new GTS 4.0 but I just fall in love with the responsiveness of the NA engine or should I say fall in love again since it's been a while since I had my last NA engine.
Some of the best porsches were 4 cyl...944,968CS....no one was complaining at them.6 cylinder sounds nicer but not by that much cash.One is great is very good....I still want either one..😊
For what it’s worth, I’m 6’3” and fit in my 2013 Boxster S just fine. I believe the leg room is the same as the 1972 914 four cylinder my wife had before we were married. The standard seats in the Boxsters looks and feel like the 914’s.
Great comparison. Seating is a problem in the Boxster, I’ve had two and they both give me a numb bum compared to my 911. I like the 2.5 sound but I had a 2.5 turbo Subaru too and loved the deep throb with that. I’d have either car in a heart beat, they are both Porsches. Any Porsche is a good car because they are all made with the same ethos, driver first. Just enjoy it!
I miss the 3.4ltr 981 GTS I had. It was an amazing car. Sounded fenomenal. Had the x73 sports suspension option, manual gears and standard seats ie not electric. At 5' 10" I found it very comfy and did the San Fran to LA PCH trip about 7 times round trip in the year I had it with no comfort issues. Didn't have much issue with keeping the revs up ;) .. for such a good drivers car I'd rather have an NA engine. I found the throttle response very predictable. Actually can't think of anything I didn't like. Well perhaps the variable rate steering and prefer hydrolic steering. The steering in the 987 I had was more communicative but the difference is marginal so probably nit picking and all cars have gone this way now. Unfortunately such cars are a rip off here in Australia. I have an FK8 now, which is amazing value, fits my water sports kit and was the closest driving experience to the 981 in hatchback form I've tried albeit fwd. Can't believe ownership from new over the two year has netted a 10% profit :)
So, just watched the video. Just going to identify some factual inaccuracies. The engine is the GTS4.0 was derived from the latest 911. As mentioned in my previous message, they took the 3l twin turbo from the 911, removed the turbos, bored and stroked to 4l and stuck behind the Boxster / Cayman seats. Where the review is wrong is the suggestion that the GTS4.0 and GT4 is a different engine. It is not. It is exactly the same engine and exactly the same gearbox. The only difference is that the GTS4 has redline reduced from 8000rpm to 7,800rpm. That took circa 15-20BHP away which everyone has said is not really detectable by normal people. The only clearly different thing in the GT4 over the GTS4 is the suspension. Looking at Porsche UK tech spec for GTS4 Manual - 1405kg and the PDK is 1435kg. The 2.5T PDK is 1443 (from Porsche China site where the 2.5 is still available). Please note that when checking weights always check from the manufacturer's own tech sheets - which I have here). So, rather than being heavier, the GTS4 is lighter that the 2.5T. Should you be surprised - no, the Turbo assembly components were always going make it similar to the 6cyl block. If you are feeling it is heavier, it is either the very mild lag and lower rpm torque delivery of the turbo or auto suggestion having read the incorrect figures. Speed and accel - the marketed figures state the GTS4 PDK is 3.9-4 for 0-62. The manual is 4.4-4.5 0-62. This is faster than the 2.5T but frankly, if we are talking these differences we are focusing on something that isn't really discernible. What's more, Porsche are well known for under rating BHP / Torque and acceleration of their cars. Looking at delivery - again, the gear thing again - so much talked about it by most people that haven't really spent time with both. The PDK gear ratios are identical between the 2.5T and GTS4.0. Check PDK specialist sites and Porsche's own PDK ratio PDFs for both cars. Re acceleration and gear ratios you are sensing the normal difference in delivery between NA and Turbo. The Turbo as a very tiny lag and then a kick, getting to max torque very quickly and then dropping off at the top end. This means that it feels and sounds more torquey and faster but the figures show it's wrong. The NA is really linear / progressive and doesn't have that initial kick but unlike the 3.4s, the GTS4 has 80% of max torque from 2,500-3,000 rpm and it increases to max by just over 7,000 rpm. It is smooth and linear which is very easy control / balance and that is why most sports car drivers prefer it. The 3.4s torque took far longer to ramp up. This is why the manual feels so special with the GTS4 because there is no lag at all (I know the 2.5T has very little lag for a Turbo as most modern Turbo cars do) and there is no kick down delay that you get with the PDK. Because there is so much torque from 2,500 you do get loads of fun, event before 4-5000rpm and as the valves open up to 2000rpm and then from 4000rpm, you get a lot with that angry exhaust note. I'm guessing the after market 2.5T one Ped has has different valve setup - but again, all Turbo 4s have loud exhaust - some like it. I used to love the Scooby exhaust / engine sound unlike many and don't dislike the 2.5T, but it isn't the supercar NA sound of the GTS4. As I said previously, it is also nothing like the 3.4s which was like a banshee). What else? Well - the seat space. I'm fairly certain this is a misconception that is probably down to seat types. I might be wrong, but I don't believe Porsche changed the engine bay / bulkhead is different between the 2.5T to GTS4. If the Porsche UK GTS4 was the same as they usually are, it would have had the 18way seats (mine does). These are bigger than several of the other seat options and certainly doesn't go quite as low - perhaps it also has less max space in front of it. Measure that actual firewall to bulkhead to see if there is actually a difference. Hopefully you can see I've not given any subjective thoughts here - just clarified points and correct some incorrect 'facts'. I do have my own thoughts and they should not be taken as points of fact - just my perceptions. The GTS4 manual feels more like a composed, pure, large engined supercar. It isn't really measurably faster but as a controllable (progressing and predictable on the edge) car it feels very close to perfect to me. The 2.5T may feel more exciting if that is what you've mostly driven and if you are focused on very short stretches of straight road between corners but if you get used to the GTS4.0, I think you may start to feel more part of the machine and that then becomes very exciting. Time spent driven in many different situations is required to really decide what you prefer. As mentioned, the gearing thing isn't an issue for most with the GTS4 and is no different from the 2.5T when looking at PDK - it just feels different. With so much Torque delivered so linearly from 2-2.500rpm, the manual feels and sounds great well below licence losing speeds. I ran it in for 2000 miles keeping it below 4000rpm and had loads of fun. What would I have if I had the choice again today - the GTS4 everyday of the week. Again, that's me, not anyone else. I would also so, my thoughts are far from unique. Most reviews from well regarded reviewers place it well ahead from the 2.5T GTS as a driving and sensory experience. That still doesn't mean it's better or worse, but it should suggest to people that they need to spend weeks driving each (very hard to do unless you've had both) driving in all different conditions to make a decision - and also, please, check facts and ignore subjective stuff until you've checked properly for yourselves.
I think you’re spot on about the weight as it increased significantly when 2.5T replaced 3.4 NA due to the weight of the turbo and ancillaries. If there isn’t a cabin space difference, most people would prefer the 4.0. However, when faced with the £20,000 price difference I’m certain most people would be content with the 2.5t, which is easily tuned with a map to match or exceed the power of the 4.0.
@@adrianbennett3761 Hi Adrian. Yes agree, price difference is huge and will have a big impact. I also think there will be many that just love turbo torque delivery. Whilst the GTS4 has the same max torque (stock) and delivers 75% of it from about 3000rpm (mitigating any real concerns about the 'long gearing' that is only raised by all those that haven't drive one for a long period), it isn't as abrupt. A bit like electric car torque delivery, everyone smiles when they get a big kick in the back - for me, that wears off after a while. For many it doesn't and that's fine. If you prefer that, the 2.5 is better for you. I, like many others, love the linear delivery the NA offers with no turbo lag and in my case, no kick down lag you get with a PDK. Re tuning, you do surprisingly get a fair bit from a GTS4 if you are brave enough, but nothing like what is possible with the 2.5 (in a similar way to most other performance Turbo cars (eg BMW). That isn't my thing, but for many, it is.
Just put an aftermarket exhaust on the 4.0 and and it’s no contest.. even a Cargraphic valve controller on the standard exhaust would make a considerable difference.. it sounds like you’re trying to convince yourself that the 4cyld GTS better than the 4.0.. ps I owned a 718 spyder until a year ago. Apologies if this hurts, I’m a subscriber and enjoy your productions
I have always loved a WRX. I have a 718-2.5L tuned with an inconel exhaust. I love it. Mind you I also have a diesel Panamera so there might be something wrong with me. There are a lot of cars getting around now sounding like 718Ss. Smaller Mercs, BMWs etc, fast sub 3 and 4 second cars. If you drive a 4.0GTS, or a 911, I take the criticism. It you drive a Camry...
I’ve had both flat 4 and flat 6 Boxsters so no axe to grind, but… There is a lot of self justification bias here: The 0-60 times quoted are PDK (2.5) vs. Manual (4.0). In reality there is effectively nothing between them with equivalent transmissions. Misleading The weight difference is incorrect. It’s hard to get apples to apples because of different measurement criteria but 4.0 probably 15-30 kg more. Misleading The comment about the bulkhead position is ridiculous. The cockpit dimensions are identical. Were the seats the same spec.? Misleading I don’t normally comment but this level of inaccuracy is unacceptable.
No bias I can assure you. Getting comparison stats is tricky, especially for cars that aren’t made any more. I took them from a source I thought was accurate but clearly it wasn’t. Don’t worry though the internet is correcting me. I may be wrong about the reason for cabin space but honestly could explain it any other way. The seats were identical and set up the same way yet there was still less legroom in the 4.0. Not misleading…fact 🤷♂️
But now loads of people down the pub will be saying the 6 cylinder Boxster has a smaller cabin which is simply untrue. It would be good if you could establish why you had the issue and give an explainer in a subsequent midweek 180 or something?
The reason people often say the Porsche flat six doesn't sound like much until you get it up in the revs is due to the exhaust valve control settings. Even in sport or sport + mode with the exhaust valves "open" they will still close between something like 1-4 thousand revs. A $500 valve controller and 20 minutes solves that issue. Then you get that lovely noise even when going around town. The 4.5 seconds to 60 you are looking at is for the manual GTS 4.0. The PDK is .1 seconds quicker to 60 (stated) than the 2.5l model. The sounds difference is something that's completely personal and its frustrating to hear all the reviewers say it sounds like garbage. It certainly doesn't. The pops and crackles give it a character the 4l doesn't have. You have an absolutely lovely car. Im expecting a C GTS 4.0 in the summer so thank you for helping pass the time until then.
Should also be noted that you can't trust any numbers from any of the VW group's brands,
it's sort of an open secret they'll make the numbers fit whatever they're trying to achieve,
for instance the sporty Golf versions are on paper always quicker than their counterparts from the other brands (Seat & Skoda),
but when put to the test those counterparts perform as well or better. It's just that VW politics demands that the Golf must be quicker.
So they'll just tweak the numbers.
They do the same thing with horsepower numbers. I suspect the GTS 4.0 doesn't produce 400 hp but rather the same 420 as the Spyder.
They're using the same engine and I doubt their tuning's actually any different.
Instead the numbers on paper are tweaked so that the buyer has more of a justification to go for the Spyder.
I can speak from experience, my car is from a VW group brand and supposed to be a few milliseconds slower than the Golf model with the same engine. It isn't. It's actually faster than the Golf is on paper.
i just rented and enjoyed a Porsche Boxster 718 S, Flat 4, 350 HP, 2023 model in PorschePlatz Stuttgart 2 weeks ago and I loved the experience driving about the winding hill roads of the Black Forest region. The engine tune and exhaust sounds rorty and nice. Anyway I enjoyed it.
I bought my 2018 718S Boxster 4 months ago. Always wanted one and saw mine at Porsche center south London and fell in love with it. Its heavily specked and probably paid over the top but it is a beautiful car. I had no idea how many people really dislike the 4 cylinder and like you say most of them have probably never driven one! I think mine has a great sound and with the UK roads as they are now I wouldn't want anything faster! Great review Pete.
There's another aspect to the 6 cylinder engine. Some people are complaining that it's a bit characterless below 4000rpm but I actually think this is a huge virtue. Below 4000, the engine is silky smooth and quiet so you can waft around in peace and harmony touring or watching the world flow by. It slinks around like a Bentley, soothing frayed nerves in a wash of tranquility. But...floor it and rev it and it comes alive howling like a banshee and screaming from apex to apex. So, this is actually two cars in one. A creamy tourer and slot car all in one. My brother has a Honda S2000 which requires thrashing and revving at all times. Rewarding in its own way but you finish a drive like a caffeine junky, sweating and shaking. It's so good to have a choice. The joy of six.
@johnwatt .. +1. Spot on, the nose! ..My brother drives the high-revving RPM Honda S2000. .. Read a "caffeine junky" drive character,,,,,, to the otherwise an uber-sophisticated Honda chassis.. . "Different strokes, for different folks" ... Cheers
You are so right. I thought I wanted an S2000, but it is so much better to have a car you can enjoy at any speed and RPM. With the Porsche 6 you get a nice sound and good torque plus the unhinged wail at the top.
That Honda S2000 sounds fun ;) Sweating and shaking like you had 100 RedBull after a drive sounds perfect lol. But I think I will still prefer a Porsche Cayman as a daily drive.
Where r u gonna rev it,in the middle of nowhere or a track?.Don't we all use our car more in b roads and normal with speed limits.what is the point in having a car which can be only enjoyed in special conditions and situation,when the cheaper car has better driving characteristics in everyday driving situations
Interesting comparison, I can’t say I agree that they both sound good. I had a cayman 2.5GTS, and now have a 718 GT4, the engine in the 2.5 is definitely effective, punchy at low speeds as you say, but very monotone and it never put a smile on my face like the flat 6 does. Also, the PDK 4.0 is said to do 0-60 in 4 seconds, the 4.5 second time is for the manual. It’s fine to defend the car you bought though and the cabin size comparison, that’s really interesting, not something you’d expect!
You beat me to it re: 0-60times.
The cabins are dimensionally the same, maybe seat spec.? 18 ways vs. 2 way sport seats plus?
@@simonm9923 must be something like that. Or perhaps the back is less upright? Always the top bit that hits the bulkhead when I go all the way back in mine
@@simonm9923 yep doubt they would have reengineered the structural bulkhead. The platform would have been designed for the 6. Not sure but might have needed crash testing certification.
I like my 718 cayman s but like you said, the sound just doesn’t put a smile on my face.
6’5”, really appreciate your reporting this discovery! And I’m actually surprised at how small the sound difference was b/n the two engines, I thought it would be more pronounced.
On further investigation it’s not the case. Cabin is the same. Still trying to find a reason for the difference 🤷♂️
I have a BMW Z4 and made the mistake of buying without driving it first. I have the exact issue you mentioned with the leg room. I just can't get the seat far back enough so within an hour I end up with cramp and have to get out. I've had the car less than a year and already having to sell because it just takes the enjoyment out of using it. Your point about not buying something without driving is a very good one!
Great comparison 👍🏽 I never saw that last reason coming and it makes a lot of sense!
On getting cruise control retrofitted - something to bear in mind is that if you're doing longer motorway runs, then the cruise control doesn't utilise the car's "coasting" function well, which can result in notably worse fuel economy on long runs. I have cruise in my 981 Cayman GTS, but rarely use cruise on the motorway for this reason. (Apart from avg speed zones)
I appreciate that these obviously aren't the kinds of cars we buy for fuel economy! But every little helps 😊
The review no one else has done, and very well done too 👏🏻 I did of course know the conclusion and it's still baffling as they have the same seats. Let me know what porsche say. On the weight Harry Metcalf weighed the 4.0 at 1,280 kilos. He was so shocked he did it twice to check and had a full tank of fuel. As others have pointed out 4.5 to 60 is for the manual. Having driven the 4.0 man and PDK, only a few days apart, I can honestly say the manual felt quicker, by quite some margin. Very odd I know! Probably my brain playing tricks and my in-built manual preference. When driving the PDK I also think using the stick is much nicer than the paddles, the stick feels more mechanical and again, probably my brain playing tricks, but it felt like the shifts were more punchy. Try it and see? I also much preferred the 4.0 to my 981 spyder, better riding, quicker and not as obnoxious on the exhaust. I was so impressed I ordered one, as you know. I would also have no problem with a 2.5. The Boxster is an amazing car in any guise, I've had 3 and they are just about the best sportscar at any price.
Hi ! Guess the 4.0 718 was to you a better overall then the 2.5 . Like more alive ..
@@georgepotcovaru2595 I actually haven't driven a 2.5. I was comparing manual & PDK 4.0 and 718 and 981 manual Spyder. There is no wrong answer with a Boxster, they are all amazing cars, I have just bought my 4th .
Fantastic, informative video. Im just about to take delivery of my 718 GTS 4.0 manual. I was very tempted with a 2.5 due to its flexibility , especially on UK roads. A track day at Porsche Silverstone won me over with the 4.0 and as we are about to wave goodbye to naturally aspirated engines, especially when coupled to a manual box that made my decision. Porsche kindly lent me a Boxster 2.0 with a PDK for the weekend, and to be honest that was still a brilliant, balanced and entertaining car to drive. In all their guises , modern Porsches are pretty hard to beat 😊
Enjoy the new wheels 👌👍
Very insightful video PP, especially on the weight and the legroom (which I don’t think I’ve heard from anyone before!).
Great review, for enjoying B roads I think the 981 GTS might be the one to have. Better gearing and sound. Would be great to compare the 4.0 to the 3.4 👍
I really preferred the 2.5L in autocross to the flat 6. The 6 felt heavier and less agile. The variable vane and high compression make the engine plenty powerful and remarkably responsive. I'd pick the 4 for daily and autocross and be happy as a clam it's a great total package.
I’m the original owner of a 986 Boxster S. The best upgrade I ever made to the car was switching to GT3 bucket seats - they gave me a lot more headroom and legroom and made the car truly a great fit for me. (I also installed GT3 console delete and that helped with lateral legroom.) I’d be curious to see if bucket seats would improve the GTS 4.0 similarly.
I’m sure they would 👍
What a great and informative review. I have driven both cars and could not agree more. Enjoy your car. Its beautiful.
Thank you! 👍
Sir, for some odd reason, I’ve never bumped into your channel until today. Absolutely love the content and delivery. And that FACE you make when you listen to the exhaust noises. Only a true petrol head would get it! 😅
Welcome aboard!
Funny you should mention gear ratios. When new MINI came out, my Dad was a delivery driver for the local dealer. When asked which one someone should buy, he said the normal Cooper but not the 'S'. The gears had been changed for the S to make the numbers look good on paper but had ruined it's drivability.
I have a Boxster GTS 4.0. My previous car was a 2006 Boxster S. I am 6'2". Took me a day to get adjusted and comfortable. Great cars! Love the one you're with.....
Very nice!
This just reinforces how I feel about my 718 Cayman S. I almost bought a 981 GTS w the old 3.8 F6 and hated the lack of torque and the lack of character at lower rpms. I’ve got most of the same kit on mine as a GTS except the 18-way seats and Sport Chrono so the only thing I’d like to do now is get a Softech tune, a downpipe and go ham 😁
I’ve been trying to look for a comparison between the two for a while and couldn’t find any that provided such good information. Direct comparison of engine sounds, 0-60 mph *without* launch control (since we rarely actually use it), and the seating position difference! What an unexpected surprise! I completely agree with you the 2.5 is portably better for daily drives, and one thing I do enjoy more of the smaller engine is exactly what you mentioned 6:29, the popping turbo exhaust noises.
I am blessed with shorter height (much less than 6 ft) so I’m happily enjoying the flat 6.
Thank you, Ped, for doing such an amazing comparison review! I definitely think you made the right choice for yourself.
My pleasure. I’ve looked into the cabin size and I was wrong. There isn’t a difference. Still not sure why they felt so different 🤷♂️
Interesting vid, in my 4.0 litre I’ve fitted seat lift brackets which have made it comfortable for my long legs also the zero to sixty time of 4.5s I believe is based on the manual box
I thought the manual was 4.3s and the PDK was like 3.7s with launch control.
Is that on sports seats Roger (eg not buckets) ?
@@th3b0untyhunter yes sports seats, also available for buckets
@@RogerBaileyOnCars Hi - which brackets are you using?
Another very good and very honest review. Being the owner of a 718 flat four, I am obviously partial. I have commented previously about the sound haters that say it sounds like a Subaru. Obviously, nobody buys a Porsche to get good gas mileage but I get over 30 miles per gallon on the highway with my turbo charged flat four. Just another bonus. And, I love the way it sounds. It’s rough and raspy and I like it.
👍
Fantastic video, you’ve absolutely nailed it.I’ve had a base 718 and now GT4 and they are obviously very different cars but the base was way more comfortable than the GT4.
The 2.0 and 2.5 are fantastic engines and allow you to really engage with the car because as per the test they make lots more low down torque.
4.0 def sound so much better but again the 2.0 and 2.5 sound great.
I thought I needed the pinnacle GT4 but in reality now I’ve had both I’d say the 2.0 or 2.5 is the better car to live with anyday.👍
I own a Spyder. The ride is just fine and then handling is other worldly. Plus it’s automotive art
I’m looking to buy a boxster and I’m 6’3. I was flat 6 on the brain but this review has made me think ther’es more than just that engine note. Thanks
Great video and objective comparison. Owning a cayman 718 S, i was considering upgrading to a 991.2 S, tried recently a 992 GTS also...and honestly... yeah they sound great and look nice, but the overall perfs/driving feeling, not mentioning the ridiculous budget difference, make me love my 718 even more.
Of course that's a very personal feeling, but i agree when you say that price/pef/looks considered, the 718 is maybe the best sport car out there right now (seems the A110 is amazing too but i haven't tested it so can't really say ^^).
Great video! I have the same car as you. The silver 19 GTS. I think it sounds insane. I love the pops when you lift off the throttle. The same pops sound a bit muted in the flat 6.
The torque character is what makes me not want to get a 4.0 GTS.
2.5 makes peak torque at 1900 RPM
4.0 makes peak torque at 5500 RPM
That’s a lot of fun skipped driving on an ordinary trip to the tennis court.
Had no idea about the cabin being smaller. That’s made me certain I am in the right car! I frequently drive long distances. Cheers to our cars!
Makes me miss my old 981 Cayman - even the engine in that sounded fabulous and because it was just the 2.7 you could really rev it out. Manual too with sports plus...fab car. The 2.5 flat four sounds just like a flat four - monotonal and dull but certainly effective!
At least you didn’t say it sounded like a Subaru…
@@drbobs8267
I think its a compliment to compare it to the gorgeous Subaru sound. First thing I thought when I heard it w/o seeing it was that someone fires up his aircooled beetle with sports exhaust. I was surprised seeing a Boxster instead in front of my house. Love that sound of the past🥰
Thanks for a well balanced review. Whilst logical I just never knew about the firewall being closer with the 4.0. I agonised between a 4 & 6 cylinder and purchased a 718 Cayman, stock standard non ‘S’ with PDK and Sport Chrono. Coming out of an M2 Competition, I would have to say I have more fun more often in the Cayman. The 2 litre motor still delivers huge punch at legal speeds and all the lovely poise & balance of the chassis is still there in spades. I cannot recommend highly enough. As you say, the Cayman in any guise is one of the best sports cars out there. You can’t beat a pure bred Porsche in my opinion. Thanks again for a great comparison.
After further investigation I have discovered the cabin sizes are not different. Still not sure why I couldn’t fit in the 4 litre 🤔
Just a quick FYI, there's a few inaccuracies in this. The engines are the same between GTS 4.0, GT4 and Spyder, the weight stats you quoted aren't correct - you quoted the minimum AND manual weight figures for the GTS 2.5 PDK (i.e. weight saving options, carbon buckets, etc.), and the GTS 4.0 PDK figure was way, way out - the difference between the two PDK cars would have been closer to 30kg, not 121kg. The rear diffuser of the GTS 4.0 isn't the same as the Spyder, the Spyder shares it's rear diffuser with the GT4 though. And as others have mentioned, Porsche quotes the GTS 4.0 PDK 0-60 at 4 seconds, but it has been tested at well below 4 by other journalists. Otherwise, great vid - the leg length issue was a big surprise!
I read several articles about the engine that state something different 🤷♂️
2:40 The weight difference it wrong. Porsche quotes the PDK GTS 4.0 at 1435 Kg and GTS 2.5 PDK at 1405Kg which make it about 30kg heavier. A couple of cylinders and less a turbo can't weigh over 121kg more, that doesn't make sense. Interesting comment about the leg room though. I wonder if the carbon bucket seats creates more legroom. Between the sport plus seat and the bucket seats the bucket seats always look like it has more room behind the seats, not sure if that'll translate to leg room.
Brilliant appraisal, and who knew it would be a design change that meant you could not have a 4.0........ but you made the right choice with your car, accidentally or not.
Thanks for the hint. I'm 6'3 so when I win the lottery, I'll be going for the 2.5L but in Cayman format. (Not a soft top fan).
And yes - The 6 cylinder engine sounded GREAT
indeed, same here, buy soft top.
@@1MrErling If you live in Spain or California then yes. For the UK.........no! 🤣
That was an awesome comparison! Thank you! I just picked up a 2.5 GTS and I fit! If I went with the 4.0 I would not!
I was actually mistaken. There is no difference in cabin size. It must have been a seat position issue but never got to the bottom of it 😬
@@PetrolPed hey, did you have same seats 2way vs 18way?
Excellent GTS v GTS comparison! As a Porsche addict for most of my adult life (more than a dozen, starting in 1996 with a 968 CS and including front, rear and mid-engined models with 4,6 and 8 pot motors - so I'm no flat-six snob!) I have sampled almost every derivative, but I've never had the chance drive 4 and 6 cylinder 718s back-to-back. The unexplained cabin space discrepancy should not be a deal-breaker as it's probably just down to seat adjustment - the seats are the same in both cars and the cabin architecture in both is carried over from the exclusively six-cylinder 981. Other factors (looks, ambience, performance, weight, chassis dynamics) appear to be very similar or a matter of taste. For me, in these final days of ICE power, the 4.0 is much more desirable. The six-cylinder engine sounds a lot better, delivers it's power in classic NA style and revving it out would never be a chore. But it'll cost you at least £12k more than the 2.5, which is without doubt the best value car here. If this was a GTS v GTS v GTS comparison, you might be wishing you'd saved another £10k and bagged a six-cylinder 981 3.4 GTS - best of both worlds?
no contest. flat 6 with a manual gearbox - heaven on earth!
unless you are too tall to fit in the car right ... solution 911
that's the best combo....and I bought it😂
As a ‘2018 718 box GTS owner - I love this video :) never drove a GTS 4.0 or a simple flat 6.. so can’t compare.. however yeah it’s a definite smile inducing driver pleaser. Having taken it around the Silverstone Porsche tracks learnt a lot more about its capabilities. Love it even more :)
Nice 👌
I'm over 6ft and own a 718 Boxster GTS 4.0. I have no issues with the cabin space and seating position.
That’s great. My height is in my legs and I just could get comfy 🤷♂️
@@PetrolPed Were the seats the same Ped, as in 2 way or 18 way? Someone commented on another forum that that may have had something to do with it.
I also have the 2.5 718 gts, it’s a FANTASTIC car and I wouldn’t swap it, personally.
👍
Interesting comparison! First thing to get out of the way is that there isn't 140kg between the two, but to be fair I can't find a definitive figure either. The lowest I have seen is 8Kg. Autocar said there was 60Kg between then. Remember the 4cyl has turbos, cross pipes, intercoolers etc. to offset that smaller block.
On the most important points, I am aligned with your assessment. I have 4.0 Manual and compared it with 2.5S PDK. I thought the 2.5 was faster than mine, certainly felt it. There's a linearity to the 4.0l that belies it's pace. The 2.5 is pizzaz and zip. It had a bit of lag, then real midrange punch that feels 'wow', then it gets a bit 'rung out' above 6500rpm compared with 4.0l. The 4.0l has no pops and bangs on the over-run however. So it's however you like your poison!
For me it's the velvet sound of the 4.0l that I love, but if I didn't fit (I had no idea the cabin was shorter), I'd have no issue with the 4 pot. Keep up the good videos Mate!
I struggle to get the weights from the same source and turns out it was wrong 😬😂
I’m 5’11”. I own a 99 Boxster and just got a 2023 Spyder. The Spyder is unreal. The best. And I have zero problems fitting in the Spyder. Plus, the Spyder will hold its value more than the other Boxsters these days
You'll be surprised Mat Watson from car wow did the 0-60 in 3.7 seconds, the gts is surprisingly fast.
Excellent video. Love it. As a 981 owner, I must admit I am warming up to the 718 range. They sound ok but have so much torque low down.
I came out of a 99 Boxster into a new Spyder. I can’t put it into words. I find excuses to try and drive the Spyder. It’s best vehicle I’ve ever owned.
I had a 981 S, now have the 2.5 GTS and I can tell you the 2.5 is ridiculously more fun. I loved my 981, never thought I’d want to let it go until I drove the 718
Pete. Great video as always but regarding the cabin size I really can't see Porsche introducing new tooling just for the BGTS4.0. Did the 4.0 have 18 way seats? This is the only thing I can think of. The extra electrics and motors do reduce how low you can put the seat in the 18 way, just wondering if it also limits the travel fore and aft? Re the steering wheel, you have the standard wheel whereas the 4.0 has the multifunction wheel which is also heated. As a side note, the engine and gearbox in the 4.0 GTS is the same as the Spyder and GT4 but with different engine mapping which reduces the red line to 7800 rather than the 8 of the GT4.
They both had the same seats. Just couldn’t figure it out. That was the only conclusion I could come to 🤷♂️
As you say surprising reason. Would not have expected that but makes sense. Always enjoy your reviews. Thanks Petrol Ped.
Good review. I started with a 987 cayman base manual and loved it. Moved to a 911 camera 2 997, awesome car, but couldn’t drive fast enough to enjoy the engine note. I traded it for a 981 base with pdk, 275 hp, so perfect held in 3rd on the b roads, always hearing that engine note. I tried the 718, amazing drive , but for me, the non s 981 is the most fun I ever had in a Porsche.
I bought a boxster without knowing anything about cars. I didnt know what a turbo was, what hp or nm meant. I had owned a Peugeot 206 and a Kia, walked into Porsche just to try one for fun and it was amazing, walked out with a Boxster and now Im in love with Porsche. Any model is just mind blowing over the competition, recently had 2 different BMWs and they just feel dull afterwards. And I like PDK cant be hassled with manual lol
Great review and the seat issue is not something I would have thought of!
There is no reduced space, all 718 Boxster interior dimensions are identical. Different seat specifications and adjustments (eg backrest angle) can lead to perception of reduced legroom. It is not a 4cyl vs. 6 cyl issue.
Very detailed explanation of the difference and who’d have thought the leg room would be different. I have a 987.1 Boxster 3.4s and one of the reasons I bought it is the flat 6 soundtrack. I have a flat 4 boxer engined Subaru 2.0 turbo and the sound track is oh so plain in comparison. I’m not against a 4 cylinder in general but think the flat 6 is one of the best sounds a car can make. Thanks for posting 👍🏻
I have investigated further and there is no difference in cabin dimensions. Still struggling to explain the lack of comfort in the 4.0 🤷♂️
Our AA group leader just sat us down to watch this, so we can recognise the symptoms of Denial…. 😜. Only joking, thanks for the comparison, def not 20k’s worth of difference between them. I wonder how the 981 GTS would fare in this comparison?
I've got the 981 GTS & I chose it instead of the 718 purely on noise alone it's epic in comparison,
Nobody buys a boxster as a daily it's for the weekends 😂
Great little video, I actually watched the followup video first which helped. I'm in a 987.2 3.4 PDK at the moment and my mindset is that moving to a 981 sharing the same engine and gearbox might not be a huge change. So leaning towards a 2.5 718 S with the mindset of its always easier to drop back into a 981 later in life so videos of happy owners is a bonus to find.
Seats have always been a strange one in Porsche I'm 6'3 and in my 986 I had to install 987 seats for legroom benefits & I'm told the newer models tall person advise is the more basic the seat the more legroom you get. So the standard 2-way (wingback or not) seems to be the best option while jumping in the 14/18 way seats you get less.
I do agree for road use the 4.0 has gone too far. Similarly why I don't get the 911 itch on newer cars.
I also agree with your point about a lot of internet trolls likely don't own or have owned a Boxster/Cayman previously so who are they to comment. I trust in the brand and the itch to try one out is there.
Thanks 🙏🏻
Love your videos but can’t help feeling you’re trying to retrospectively justify the 4 pot. It’s fab don’t get me wrong, love mine, but the 6 pot is a class above, special in a way that even surpasses the 4
I pretty much said that 🤷♂️
Very interesting Pedro. Just goes to show, no matter what the car is the driver has to be comfortable. Couldn't agree more. Cheers
Interesting on the bulkhead. Must be another factor as the bulkhead cannot be in a different position as it’s an integral part of the chassis
I know. Needs more investigation but I just couldn’t figure it out 🤷♂️
@@PetrolPed Just finished a wash after 4 weeks of salt and grime and wow what a wonderful looking car whatever engine you have the privilege to pedal 👍
Outstanding video and comparison. I'm sure this will help alot of us with this admittedly 'first world problem', but thank you making this comparison. Cheers from Canada !
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The sound of the 4.0 is a totally different level! And it revs so nicely, It is the only option here! But I think since it’s been available and for the foreseeable the 2.5 is a relative bargain. Also I don’t agree that you have to thrash the 4 to make it sound good. Anything above 3k rpm sounds epic. Really enjoyed the video
Btw, I have the 4.0 cayman and I’m 6’3. Don’t have any issues which space, my seat still has plenty more room to go back actually, so maybe just an issue with the space in the boxster?
Thanks 👍
Before i bought my first Caymam, a 2007 987 base model, i got my performance thrills on motorcycles, not all out sport bikes but sport standards like the Honda Nighthawk S and the Kawasaki ZRX1200, two very similar styled bikes with very different power delivery. The Honda had a ton of cam overlap so it made little power down low. But the jump between 7 and 8,000 RPM was 20 HP. And that jump was very noticable in the seat of the pants as the revs climbed. The ZRX on the other hand had a Ninja motor with smaller intake tracts and milder cams than the Honda. It had loads of gruntt down low and pulled hard pretty much throughout its rev range. I am able to appreciate both methods of power delivery. Its a lot of fun rowing through the gears, keeping the RPM's in that sweet spot.
On the other hand, the low end grunt of the ZRX was easier to ride fast on curvy roads with strong power delivery in almost any gear chosen. I found that very satisfying also.
My old 2.7L base model Cayman and my 2018 718 S compare very similarly to the bikes I described. Both are a ton of fun to drive. And i have to admit i love the sound of the NA 6 better. The turbocharged 4 doesn't sound bad but it doesn't sing like the 6.
In 2019 I went to Porsche to test the Boxster, couldn’t get comfortable in it (I’m 6-4). Bought a BMW Z4 Sdrive35is and LOVE it. Now the 4 cylinder 917 Boxster has ample room in it AND I WANT AN S ! You have explained why, thought I really missed something.
Oh well, love and learn.
Are both seats from the cars 4-Way, 14-Way or 18-Ways? If different seats in the two cars then this could explain the difference 🤔
The same seats 👍
Do you really think they produced a different bodyshell for the GTS 4.0? Whatever you are feeling has another explanation because the cabin of any 718 Cayman or Boxster has the same dimensions. You had no concerns with the GT4 so there must be another explanation….
I’m sure there is but what 🤷♂️
I would suggest that the seat was either a different spec or the backrest was more reclined and hitting the bulkhead earlier. I’ve had both cars and there’s no difference. I’m only 6’1” but don’t have my seat anywhere near fully back
I borrowed a 4.0 GTS 718 and thought it felt flat and deliberately de tuned. The same lump in a 911 feels a lot more entertaining. Pre-OPF 981 Spyder for me - based on noise alone 😀 Flat 4 sound is not what we’re used to from Porsche today, although most people forget that Porsches had 4s long before they had 6s.
There is no 'same lump' in the 911. The GTS4.0l takes the 3l 911 engine, turbo's removed, then bored and stroked to 4l along with many other changes. No 911 has anything similar.
4.0 PDK official 0-62mph is 4.0 secs… the manual is 4.5 secs 😊
Great video and very well considered comparison.
I have a 2022 GTS 4.0 Manual Cayman. Manual was a no-brainer for me as I didn’t want to chase faster 0-60 times or worry about driveability in traffic. I wanted to change gear myself rather than worry about 10ths. I also wanted a NA engine - probably the last time I’d be able to buy a new one. I also have a base Carrerra 992 with a turbo engine - no question, the Cayman’s donkey is a much greater sense of occasion, albeit with less torque and drive ability. But that’s fine - it so much more of an event to drive.
Interestingly, my Carrerra’s PDK and turbo engine seem to match each other really well. And the Cayman’s NA 6 and manual seem to be a match made in heaven.
I’m 6ft 2ins and don’t feel the seat issue - maybe the Cayman and Boxster have different dimensions as the former doesn’t need to fit a folding roof space inside? I’ve driven over 10k miles in Europe over several trips with no issues. I’ve never tried any sort of Boxster.
I specced the alcantara shell and gear shift. I also have the radar cruise - essential for the long journeys to the mountains!! I wouldn’t get any car without it nowadays.
I made one change that you touch upon - I had a lower final drive gear ratio fitted. I knew the long gearing would be an issue so I planned to change it before I ordered. It has transformed the car, albeit it drinks slightly more fuel and is a little noisier on a cruise.
Basically, I bought the Cayman for the engine and gearbox. And fixed the main issue of gear ratios.
Where did you go to for a ratio change, and doesn't it affect the warranty?
Just beginning to contemplate a used Boxter and absolutely loved this video. I’m only 5’8” so the size thing doesn’t bother me but I was very interested in your assessment of the driving characteristics of the two cars. I think my preference is the 2.5 litre for usability on UK roads.
I had the 3.2L Boxster "S." It was a great car. Balance, poise & road manners really made excel. Being mid engined & with PDK gear box. To my mind far superior to the 70 year Old continual development of the VW Beetle! The Boxster is the model that single handedly saved Porsche from certain bankruptcy! The Caymab came along when the job was done. I would guess Porsche have now sold more Boxster/ Caymans now than 911's since their very first. If any Porsche is sorted it's the Boxster Cayman! They were reluctant to put a 4.0L performance engine in it! As they know it will damage to 911 sales. Put a 911 owner in a Boxster & they would be amazed!
I had poo pooed the 2.5 flat four until I heard one in a car park the other day. It sounded great. Those 4.0s make are so expensive. Not that anything is cheap nowadays. Great vid as usual. Thanks. 👍
👍
Great video, thanks! I’m 6’6 and I’ve got a 4.0 arriving in April. Were they the 18 way adjustable seats? I fit comfortably with the standard seats, but not the 18 way.
No. Both cars had the standard seats 👍
Excellent video. Despite the fact that you paid with your own money for the 2.5l, you are honest. As you say, the engines simply sound different - I describe it as the 6-cylinder as 'singing' and the 4-cylinder as 'growling'. I have a 2017 Boxster S (3 weeks now) and I read/hear the same as you - people (many journalists and Porsche aficionados) who have never owned the 2.5l jump to the same conclusions. But I can tell you this, I came from a BMW 2-litre diesel and now own a Porsche - and it sounds incredible. Kids take their phones out and film my car as I drive by when they hear it in sports mode. And that weight thing is significant. 120kg might not sound much in a passing comment or on paper - but then people should imaging filling their car with 5 fully loaded holiday suitcases - you will feel the difference...
Sorry, late to this. Ref steering wheel controls. I have both setups, switches and knobs on steering wheel I find fiddly but radio vol is useful. The little stick is sooo much better IMO as you can just bang through the settings, up down, forward, back. So much easier on the move. Big surprise about the legroom.
There is no reduced space, all 718 Boxster interior dimensions are identical. Different seat specifications and adjustments (eg backrest angle) can lead to perception of reduced legroom. It is not a 4cyl vs. 6 cyl issue.
I loved the dual rear tip exit, was GT3 like...so I got a soul performance cat back with sport muffler and life is better now. Torque and sound in a 2.5. and amazing mpg on the highway🎉
You make an interesting point about the legroom differences. I noticed a difference as well. Sometimes my left foot was off center on the clutch pedal in the GTS 4.0. I rarely, if ever experienced that with the Cayman S. It was not a comfortable feeling. I thought it was me. What you described could explain what I experienced also.
Have to disagree with you. I think the rear view of your car looks far better than the 4.0 With having the central twin exhaust it just looks more balanced.
Great Vid thank you, for me the GTS 4.0 sounds night and day better, also regarding 0-62s I believe you have taken the GTS4.0s as a manual, the auto is stated by Porsche to be 4 seconds dead...on the flip side the top speed of the PDK is 179 so its now slower :D. I haven't driven the 4.0, but did note I couldn't get low enough in the 2.5, my vision would be partially inhibited by the bar above the windscreen, good to know I
need to try this out in the 4.0, thank you!
You are correct. I messed up 😬
I am probably one of your older subscribers at 72 and have been a Porsche fan since I was 12 and my older sister came home with a new boyfriend in a 356. After graduating from university with an engineering degree I traded my MGB for a new 1973 914 2.0l with its flat 4. Now I should say that my first two cars were VW beetles so theI was very much a flat 4 fan and remembering that Porsches first 15 years of production were all rooted in VW flat 4 technology. As years went by an my income grew so did my interest in all things Porsche and so have been blessed with having owned several 911’s over the years with my last one being a 991 GTS but that’s not my story. My wife who loves her cars as well had traded her Bentley GTC for a 2.5 718 GTS GT silver tan leather interior and turbo wheels. While I thought this was “nice” and not a 911 I have fallen in love with it! First it pays homage to the 718 of the 50’s and reminds me of my 914 both with mid engine flat 4’s and the wonderful sound of the flat 4. Don’t get me wrong the flat 6 is the the metric all other cars try to compare themselves to but the flat 4 is Porsche roots. So getting back to the 2.5 GTS as this report says it is a wonderfully balanced car as so agile and quick and while I am on pilots sports I am sure we are sub 4s 0-60. For me this is the best all round sports car out there and easily a daily driver. With two trunks or boots I have to smile when I come out of a supermarket with a trolley full of bags and they all get swallowed up in the front trunk as onlookers are amazed that a sports car even has a proper trunk yet alone one an small SUV would be envious of. Now back to the 2.5 do your research and you will find this 4 is based on the 992 6 in the design and even carryover of many components, so very robust. Just remember Porsche roots are all in flat 4’s and the tragedy is that someone at Porsche got it right launching the 2.5 4 but lost their bottle to pressure and replacing it again with a flat 6. If you love your Porsches and their history go out a get a 2.5 before it is too late…
Love your videos Pete but I'm afraid you've got a few facts wrong here re weights and 0-60s. I'm a big fan of both and unlike most have owned both the 2.5 and 4.0. Totally agree the 2.5 engine gets a bad rep and I loved mine - best progressive, accelerating car ever. Get them on track though and there is a big driver experience difference. Nevertheless, great fun in both.
as a driver who is only 5' 3" this GTS 4.0 is perfect for me and I simply love the flat 6
A very interesting comparison, thank you. I think, also for me the 2,5 will be the right option. I`m going to see one tomorrow…
Have fun!
Thanks for the video Pete! I'm searching for my next Porsche and have narrowed in on the Cayman GTS. But I wasn't sure which one until your video. The interior space is the winner for me. After churning through countless other reviews yours was the only one to even bring that up, let alone actually measure it. Thanks!
Having done more research I found out the cabins are exactly the same size. It must have been the position of the seat. I did a second video on the subject 👍
Interesting comment about the leg room between the two cars something that I would not have thought of- I like the Mazda MX5 but doubt I could live with it as at 6.2 it feels cramped. I agree with you that both cars are brilliant and I would very much like another Boxster if only I could afford it
So great to see the stomp comparisons. Makes me happy about my choice :) loved my 19. 24 is 2 weeks out :)
Interesting and great comparison, I’m 6’1 with 34” inside leg and have no issues driving my gts4. I haven’t driven the 4 cylinder so can’t compare.
0-60 times in the 4 litre differ between pdk (4 secs) and manual (4.5 sec).
One thing I know for sure is that If you want to track your car then get the 4 litre.
At the end of the day, they are both Porsches, who build great cars! You won’t be disappointed either way!
Right on 👍
Went from a 3.4 987.2 Boxster S to 2.5 Cayman S both wonderful cars but got to love the low down power delivery of the 2.5 was more useable on a day to day basis. Had to sadly sell during Covid.
👍
My brother-in-law has a Cayman S and I have taken it out for a thrash many times, it's a lovely thing, but as you say the gearing is too tall, run it out it is doing 90+ in second. Corvette owners think of their cars like the beginning of a project, my C4 ZR1 has several minor upgrades but the 4.10:1 rear end ratio is the one you notice, 90 in 3rd and 125 in 4th, but Porsche owners seem to resist upgrades like ATB / limited slip, low ratio axles.
Great job on this video. Thank you.
Glad you liked it!
I definitely would like to see 0-60,100,200 comparison of the 2 cars. Can't believe no one has done that in the past 2 years. There are too many speculation the 2.5 would just dust the 4.0 and hence no one is doing such comparison or they won't get Porsche's sponsorship.
Great video and great to see the comparison between the two cars - I'm very much surprised though that the interior space is different in the 4.0 - I have one, although I'm just under 6 ft did a 4000 mile european tour last year in it and had no issues with comfort.
I do also wish the gearing was shorter for the sake of fun, and GPF equipped cars don't do the pops/bangs, but as a road car it's spectacular. Surprisingly economical too!
Thanks for watching!
A very enjoyable video petrol ped thank you 🤝
Glad you enjoyed it
I am currently planning on going with a 2.5 because I live at high altitude and the power loss will be less with the turbo
Love the red roof on the 4.0 GTS featured. Shocking that cruise control is not a standard option on a car of that value.
It is
I own a 2.7 981, no mod exhaust, manual. It kills the 2.5t stone dead on sound and involved drive (f you drive the 981 in sports mode, the difference more massive). I tested a 987 4.0 GTS 4 months back, and whilst totally wowed - was no way worth the extra 40-45k for a similar used model.
Brilliant vid (as always) and fascinating comparison and yes, the flat six is now a no for me too then as I just don’t have the lef room!
The Flat 6 4.0 is a special platform, especially in Manual. The last of its kind. Snatch em up while you can, because the 718 GTS 4.0 at under or around 100k is all that most people will ever need in a 400 HP sportscar. A perfect package that will increase in value every year.
I had 2.5 GTS with stage 1, it's faster over my new GTS 4.0 but I just fall in love with the responsiveness of the NA engine or should I say fall in love again since it's been a while since I had my last NA engine.
You can’t make the cockpit bigger, but you can remap the 2.5 to provide similar performance
Some of the best porsches were 4 cyl...944,968CS....no one was complaining at them.6 cylinder sounds nicer but not by that much cash.One is great is very good....I still want either one..😊
Excellent review. What an Easter Egg.
For what it’s worth, I’m 6’3” and fit in my 2013 Boxster S just fine. I believe the leg room is the same as the 1972 914 four cylinder my wife had before we were married. The standard seats in the Boxsters looks and feel like the 914’s.
Great comparison. Seating is a problem in the Boxster, I’ve had two and they both give me a numb bum compared to my 911. I like the 2.5 sound but I had a 2.5 turbo Subaru too and loved the deep throb with that. I’d have either car in a heart beat, they are both Porsches. Any Porsche is a good car because they are all made with the same ethos, driver first. Just enjoy it!
I miss the 3.4ltr 981 GTS I had. It was an amazing car. Sounded fenomenal. Had the x73 sports suspension option, manual gears and standard seats ie not electric. At 5' 10" I found it very comfy and did the San Fran to LA PCH trip about 7 times round trip in the year I had it with no comfort issues. Didn't have much issue with keeping the revs up ;) .. for such a good drivers car I'd rather have an NA engine. I found the throttle response very predictable. Actually can't think of anything I didn't like. Well perhaps the variable rate steering and prefer hydrolic steering. The steering in the 987 I had was more communicative but the difference is marginal so probably nit picking and all cars have gone this way now.
Unfortunately such cars are a rip off here in Australia. I have an FK8 now, which is amazing value, fits my water sports kit and was the closest driving experience to the 981 in hatchback form I've tried albeit fwd. Can't believe ownership from new over the two year has netted a 10% profit :)
So, just watched the video. Just going to identify some factual inaccuracies. The engine is the GTS4.0 was derived from the latest 911. As mentioned in my previous message, they took the 3l twin turbo from the 911, removed the turbos, bored and stroked to 4l and stuck behind the Boxster / Cayman seats. Where the review is wrong is the suggestion that the GTS4.0 and GT4 is a different engine. It is not. It is exactly the same engine and exactly the same gearbox. The only difference is that the GTS4 has redline reduced from 8000rpm to 7,800rpm. That took circa 15-20BHP away which everyone has said is not really detectable by normal people. The only clearly different thing in the GT4 over the GTS4 is the suspension. Looking at Porsche UK tech spec for GTS4 Manual - 1405kg and the PDK is 1435kg. The 2.5T PDK is 1443 (from Porsche China site where the 2.5 is still available). Please note that when checking weights always check from the manufacturer's own tech sheets - which I have here). So, rather than being heavier, the GTS4 is lighter that the 2.5T. Should you be surprised - no, the Turbo assembly components were always going make it similar to the 6cyl block. If you are feeling it is heavier, it is either the very mild lag and lower rpm torque delivery of the turbo or auto suggestion having read the incorrect figures. Speed and accel - the marketed figures state the GTS4 PDK is 3.9-4 for 0-62. The manual is 4.4-4.5 0-62. This is faster than the 2.5T but frankly, if we are talking these differences we are focusing on something that isn't really discernible. What's more, Porsche are well known for under rating BHP / Torque and acceleration of their cars. Looking at delivery - again, the gear thing again - so much talked about it by most people that haven't really spent time with both. The PDK gear ratios are identical between the 2.5T and GTS4.0. Check PDK specialist sites and Porsche's own PDK ratio PDFs for both cars. Re acceleration and gear ratios you are sensing the normal difference in delivery between NA and Turbo. The Turbo as a very tiny lag and then a kick, getting to max torque very quickly and then dropping off at the top end. This means that it feels and sounds more torquey and faster but the figures show it's wrong. The NA is really linear / progressive and doesn't have that initial kick but unlike the 3.4s, the GTS4 has 80% of max torque from 2,500-3,000 rpm and it increases to max by just over 7,000 rpm. It is smooth and linear which is very easy control / balance and that is why most sports car drivers prefer it. The 3.4s torque took far longer to ramp up. This is why the manual feels so special with the GTS4 because there is no lag at all (I know the 2.5T has very little lag for a Turbo as most modern Turbo cars do) and there is no kick down delay that you get with the PDK. Because there is so much torque from 2,500 you do get loads of fun, event before 4-5000rpm and as the valves open up to 2000rpm and then from 4000rpm, you get a lot with that angry exhaust note. I'm guessing the after market 2.5T one Ped has has different valve setup - but again, all Turbo 4s have loud exhaust - some like it. I used to love the Scooby exhaust / engine sound unlike many and don't dislike the 2.5T, but it isn't the supercar NA sound of the GTS4. As I said previously, it is also nothing like the 3.4s which was like a banshee). What else? Well - the seat space. I'm fairly certain this is a misconception that is probably down to seat types. I might be wrong, but I don't believe Porsche changed the engine bay / bulkhead is different between the 2.5T to GTS4. If the Porsche UK GTS4 was the same as they usually are, it would have had the 18way seats (mine does). These are bigger than several of the other seat options and certainly doesn't go quite as low - perhaps it also has less max space in front of it. Measure that actual firewall to bulkhead to see if there is actually a difference. Hopefully you can see I've not given any subjective thoughts here - just clarified points and correct some incorrect 'facts'. I do have my own thoughts and they should not be taken as points of fact - just my perceptions. The GTS4 manual feels more like a composed, pure, large engined supercar. It isn't really measurably faster but as a controllable (progressing and predictable on the edge) car it feels very close to perfect to me. The 2.5T may feel more exciting if that is what you've mostly driven and if you are focused on very short stretches of straight road between corners but if you get used to the GTS4.0, I think you may start to feel more part of the machine and that then becomes very exciting. Time spent driven in many different situations is required to really decide what you prefer. As mentioned, the gearing thing isn't an issue for most with the GTS4 and is no different from the 2.5T when looking at PDK - it just feels different. With so much Torque delivered so linearly from 2-2.500rpm, the manual feels and sounds great well below licence losing speeds. I ran it in for 2000 miles keeping it below 4000rpm and had loads of fun. What would I have if I had the choice again today - the GTS4 everyday of the week. Again, that's me, not anyone else. I would also so, my thoughts are far from unique. Most reviews from well regarded reviewers place it well ahead from the 2.5T GTS as a driving and sensory experience. That still doesn't mean it's better or worse, but it should suggest to people that they need to spend weeks driving each (very hard to do unless you've had both) driving in all different conditions to make a decision - and also, please, check facts and ignore subjective stuff until you've checked properly for yourselves.
I think you’re spot on about the weight as it increased significantly when 2.5T replaced 3.4 NA due to the weight of the turbo and ancillaries. If there isn’t a cabin space difference, most people would prefer the 4.0. However, when faced with the £20,000 price difference I’m certain most people would be content with the 2.5t, which is easily tuned with a map to match or exceed the power of the 4.0.
@@adrianbennett3761 Hi Adrian. Yes agree, price difference is huge and will have a big impact. I also think there will be many that just love turbo torque delivery. Whilst the GTS4 has the same max torque (stock) and delivers 75% of it from about 3000rpm (mitigating any real concerns about the 'long gearing' that is only raised by all those that haven't drive one for a long period), it isn't as abrupt. A bit like electric car torque delivery, everyone smiles when they get a big kick in the back - for me, that wears off after a while. For many it doesn't and that's fine. If you prefer that, the 2.5 is better for you. I, like many others, love the linear delivery the NA offers with no turbo lag and in my case, no kick down lag you get with a PDK. Re tuning, you do surprisingly get a fair bit from a GTS4 if you are brave enough, but nothing like what is possible with the 2.5 (in a similar way to most other performance Turbo cars (eg BMW). That isn't my thing, but for many, it is.
Just put an aftermarket exhaust on the 4.0 and and it’s no contest.. even a Cargraphic valve controller on the standard exhaust would make a considerable difference.. it sounds like you’re trying to convince yourself that the 4cyld GTS better than the 4.0.. ps I owned a 718 spyder until a year ago. Apologies if this hurts, I’m a subscriber and enjoy your productions
Not trying to convince myself of anything. I love both for different reasons but cost and fit means the 2.5 is the car for me 👍
@@PetrolPed the 2.5 actually COSTS MORE later when you consider the terrible resale value of the 2.5
I have always loved a WRX. I have a 718-2.5L tuned with an inconel exhaust. I love it. Mind you I also have a diesel Panamera so there might be something wrong with me. There are a lot of cars getting around now sounding like 718Ss. Smaller Mercs, BMWs etc, fast sub 3 and 4 second cars. If you drive a 4.0GTS, or a 911, I take the criticism. It you drive a Camry...
I’ve had both flat 4 and flat 6 Boxsters so no axe to grind, but…
There is a lot of self justification bias here:
The 0-60 times quoted are PDK (2.5) vs. Manual (4.0). In reality there is effectively nothing between them with equivalent transmissions. Misleading
The weight difference is incorrect. It’s hard to get apples to apples because of different measurement criteria but 4.0 probably 15-30 kg more. Misleading
The comment about the bulkhead position is ridiculous. The cockpit dimensions are identical. Were the seats the same spec.? Misleading
I don’t normally comment but this level of inaccuracy is unacceptable.
😂😂 exactly what I thought
No bias I can assure you. Getting comparison stats is tricky, especially for cars that aren’t made any more. I took them from a source I thought was accurate but clearly it wasn’t. Don’t worry though the internet is correcting me.
I may be wrong about the reason for cabin space but honestly could explain it any other way. The seats were identical and set up the same way yet there was still less legroom in the 4.0. Not misleading…fact 🤷♂️
But now loads of people down the pub will be saying the 6 cylinder Boxster has a smaller cabin which is simply untrue. It would be good if you could establish why you had the issue and give an explainer in a subsequent midweek 180 or something?