Can't forget that Anthony Bennett was also in that Wiggins / Love trade. Yeah he was terrible but he was still the #1 pick the year before, and people still thought maybe he could be a decent player maybe
One thing almost everyone forgets about the wiggins trade is that Flip Saunders was still the coach of the wolves at the time, and when he died wiggins was coached by some of the worst coaches he couldve had unfortunately. I still believe that Flip couldve made wiggins an all star and if he didnt die he might still be on the wolves with KAT.
The Vasquez trade had greater ramifications as well. It allowed the Raptors to trade their own first round pick in 2017 (while keeping the Bucks pick) and Terrence Ross for Serge Ibaka, and of course Norman Powell became the younger Gary Trent Jr.
Depending on how many titles Jaylen and Jayson win for the Celtics things can change but at this moment, the best trade in franchise history was made in the 1980 draft, Celtics traded their draftees Joe Barry Carroll and Rickey Brown for Robert Parish and the rights of Kevin McHale. That's a one time all star and a guy who played only for seasons for one of the best big man duos of all time.
Don't remind me. The trade actually was Parrish and the Dubs 1st rd. pick(McHale) for Rickey Brown and Boston's 1st(Joe Barry Carroll). The signing of Bernard King and World B Free the next season took some of the sting away from the departures of Jamaal Wilkes and The Big Chief.
@@hunterwade9030 Russell was traded for 2 hall of famers and they won a title one year after the trade. Russell once said that had he ended up not being traded away from the Hawks, he wouldn't have played at all. The Hawks were at St Louis and that area was pretty hostile towards black people back then.
I feel like the butterfly effect of the Harden deal for the Thunder is worth a mention. They couldn't afford Harden's contract because they gave Serge Ibaka a huge contract aswell. As we know, they traded Ibaka to the Magic in 2016 for Victor Oladipo and the rights to Domantas Sabonis. As we also know, they traded those two guys to Indy for Paul George, who they turned into Shai Gilgeous-Alexander and like 6 picks. I think even thought Harden was an MVP level player for a majority of the time he was in Houston, and they might've won a title had they kept him, we'll never know that for certain, but we do know that by extending Serge they got all the assets they have now.
Norman powell could've been a Khris backup now that you think of it. Missed out on that one since Vasquez isn't even in the NBA anymore and OG is a stud in Toronto
Chandler was was the 2nd best player for Dallas in 2011, and nobody expected it or even remembers it. Cuban completely lucked out in getting him, and never appreciated what he had while he played for him. Just let him walk in the offseason after WINNING THE CHAMPIONSHIP.
saying harden did not want out of okc wasnt true at all. does no one remember how much bitching he was doing then? you dont have to think too hard if youll recall he has complained about teammates literally every year since
Grading trades years after the fact is a tough business. You have to look at it both prospectively and retrospectively. Prospectively, did the trade make sense? Did it fill a need? Did you get real value, and what did it cost you? Retrospectively, did it work out? A lot of trades can be bad prospectively but good retrospectively, and vice-versa. The Pau Gasol trade in 2008, the one that Gregg Popovich derided, was a terrible trade based on the prospects. The Lakers didn't surrender a rotation player, and they didn't have to give up the equivalent of a lotto pick. That almost never happens when making a trade for an All-Star unless it's one of those sign-and-trades which is really just a wrinkle on free agency. Just based on the prospects, no team not in the middle of a firesale would pull that trade. Just the year before, Memphis was demanding young impact players, but in the end they settled for expiring contracts, low draft picks, and one promising 2nd-round prospect that nobody knew how good he could be (Marc Gasol). But retrospectively? It worked great for both teams. LA won two titles which they wouldn't have without Pau's skilled offense, and Memphis had a run of relevance and ended up with a deeper roster than if they just kept Pau. If you graded it for the Lakers, you give them an A because they got what they wanted and they got it for relatively cheap. For the Thunder, it's probably a B or B+, because you can't ignore the fact that they really should've gotten more out of it. Think of what the Pelicans got in return for Anthony Davis. That's what the Thunder should've done. Anyway, the hindsight/foresight balance is why the HOU/OKC Harden trade doesn't earn the Thunder an F. What could they have realistically gotten out for Harden? There was some shortsightedness on OKC's part, but that was building up to the trade instead of the trade itself. OKC's real mistake was overvaluing guys like Kendrick Perkins while refusing to pay the luxury tax in their window of contention.
At 5:55, no Harden was not okay with coming off the bench, which is why he demanded a trade. Pesti was just getting what he could for a disgruntled player.
It seems hypocritical to give Indiana the benefit of the doubt because Kawhi might not have developed if he wasn't traded, but not give the benefit of the doubt to OKC when Harden might not have developed next to Russ and KD.
Yeah OKC was still fringe title contenders from 2013-16 but unfortunately a few of those runs got derailed with injuries. Martin was a solid contributor on the 13’ team but Westbrook went down with the torn meniscus in rd1 where we all knew it over. 2014 they ran into arguably the most complete Spurs team of all time and took them to 6 games and Ibaka was out the first two games. Which was much more competition than the heat gave them in the finals that year 2015 Durant and WB missed 69 games combined and were a lost tiebreaker away from getting the 8th seed 2016 they put together the most impressive postseason run in awhile after rd1 beating the 67 win spurs in 6 games and taking a historic 73-9 Warriors team to 7 despite being up 3-1. This is the only series you can harp on the Thunder big two for the blown lead and really the only “failure” of the post James Harden trade. All these years they were better than the Rockets minus 2015. F- should really be a C-C+ because they still were contending in the short term til they lost KD. Rockets ended up better than them for the years after but still hadn’t made the finals just like OKC
I mean, harden was already a very good player, averaging 18ppg. We didn't see the MVP level playing coming, but he was obviously an amazing player, and a star in the making. Indiana traded the 15th pick for George Hill, who was already a solid player
When you look at Indiana's roster over the last 10 years they have had so much talent moving through that organization but they can never get it just right. Either the star gets hurt or the second best guy wants out or something else like that is always happening to the pacers. If you took their All Star team of the last 10 years they could be NBA champions.
2015 toronto gets normal powell and og anunoby for Vasquez. 2020 Norman powell gets traded for Gary trent JR. 2022 GTJ and OG anunoby +2 frp gets traded for durant. Vasquez for durant.
He almost reached 25ppg 4 years before the trade. The year before the trade he averaged 17, he only played one year for OKC and only averaged 14. That's an F-
I’ve only seen a couple of your vids, but a suggestion: Leave a little time at the end so people like me can Like the video before my playlist goes to the next one.
I don’t agree with the James Harding grade I believe rockets gets an A , but okc was not an F Adam was amazing for years and helped russ get those triple dubs he apart of history!
Charlotte, Sacramento & possibly Minnesota are worst run nba franchises …. A Revolving door of coaches, Players. Poor drafting and talent management. Am I wrong ?
I knew harden would become greater. I knew OKC could never keep him after his contract was up. Guy was made to become a superstar. Just had to get out the 6th man role.
Hey man , i really Love and admire Your knowledge all around the the NBA and i am appreciating Your wisdom. All that cutting in that Video makes you appear kinda hyperactive.just take Your Time man . People like me aint in a hurry
Lmfao there’s a difference between being held responsible by a peer and being held responsible by someone who has done it. KAT still hasn’t won anything either but people only look down on Wiggins. He was expected to be the lead scorer which is something no one would have expected if he was with LeBron.
@@Reqzy10 Sure Wiggins was overhyped and didn`t live through expections but people who say Wiggins was only good cuz he`s on the warriors forget how good he was on the wolves. Obv not great but nowhere near bad as some people make it seem as. He averaged 23 PPG in his 3rd season and go see his stats. when he was on the warriors he was able to showcase what he was able to do also defensively he improved
![EXPOSING Every NBA Team [2022]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/G4N5KUWjIWg/mqdefault.jpg)
Can't forget that Anthony Bennett was also in that Wiggins / Love trade. Yeah he was terrible but he was still the #1 pick the year before, and people still thought maybe he could be a decent player maybe
It sucked that he sucked, probably more so for him though I guess 😂 was nice having Canadians drafted #1 for a min though
@@taylorgordon2696 yeah up here we don’t have the greatest first overalls. Bennett kind of scared everyone off
@@Anth3120 at least wiggins has had a very solid career so far
One thing almost everyone forgets about the wiggins trade is that Flip Saunders was still the coach of the wolves at the time, and when he died wiggins was coached by some of the worst coaches he couldve had unfortunately. I still believe that Flip couldve made wiggins an all star and if he didnt die he might still be on the wolves with KAT.
Flip was a genuinely g coach
The Vasquez trade had greater ramifications as well. It allowed the Raptors to trade their own first round pick in 2017 (while keeping the Bucks pick) and Terrence Ross for Serge Ibaka, and of course Norman Powell became the younger Gary Trent Jr.
Depending on how many titles Jaylen and Jayson win for the Celtics things can change but at this moment, the best trade in franchise history was made in the 1980 draft, Celtics traded their draftees Joe Barry Carroll and Rickey Brown for Robert Parish and the rights of Kevin McHale.
That's a one time all star and a guy who played only for seasons for one of the best big man duos of all time.
Well the Russell trade but the Mchale trade was huge
Don't remind me. The trade actually was Parrish and the Dubs 1st rd. pick(McHale) for Rickey Brown and Boston's 1st(Joe Barry Carroll).
The signing of Bernard King and World B Free the next season took some of the sting away from the departures of Jamaal Wilkes and The Big Chief.
@@hunterwade9030 Russell was traded for 2 hall of famers and they won a title one year after the trade. Russell once said that had he ended up not being traded away from the Hawks, he wouldn't have played at all. The Hawks were at St Louis and that area was pretty hostile towards black people back then.
@@Mr.Sax. I know but there is a chance he ends up in New York so it was not set in stone that Boston was where he would end up
@@hunterwade9030 What? Who's going to NY?
I feel like the butterfly effect of the Harden deal for the Thunder is worth a mention. They couldn't afford Harden's contract because they gave Serge Ibaka a huge contract aswell. As we know, they traded Ibaka to the Magic in 2016 for Victor Oladipo and the rights to Domantas Sabonis. As we also know, they traded those two guys to Indy for Paul George, who they turned into Shai Gilgeous-Alexander and like 6 picks. I think even thought Harden was an MVP level player for a majority of the time he was in Houston, and they might've won a title had they kept him, we'll never know that for certain, but we do know that by extending Serge they got all the assets they have now.
That Milwaukee trade from 2015 is absolutely crazy to look at now.
Norman powell could've been a Khris backup now that you think of it. Missed out on that one since Vasquez isn't even in the NBA anymore and OG is a stud in Toronto
The last one is absolutely shocking. Even 7 years years later it still has an impact on the raptors😲
Yea the raptors won a title with Norman and then flipped him for Gary Trent JR
OKC got Adam's so I dont think the deserve an F. A starting center should warrant at least a D, though maybe not much more.
Maintain that if OKC were still in Seattle they would have been more comfortable dipping into the luxury tax in a bigger city and paying Harden
Chandler was was the 2nd best player for Dallas in 2011, and nobody expected it or even remembers it. Cuban completely lucked out in getting him, and never appreciated what he had while he played for him. Just let him walk in the offseason after WINNING THE CHAMPIONSHIP.
they could`ve ran it back maybe if they kept him
@@tj5180 Dirk called Chandler the best teammate he ever played with.,
You make really cool and interesting ideas. You Mix it up with both current news and reminiscent videos. it’s dope.
Glad you like them!
Would love to see 2004-2009 trades next
What’s even crazier about the Milwaukee deal is Powell and OG would end up on the Raptors team that beat them after being down 0-2 in the ECF 2019
Wtf that OG trade is crazy. Milwaukee still won a title
I'm not here for the Greivis hate. 🤣
“In today’s NBA you would never trade James Harden”
i don't think the Kawhi trade was the biggest trade of the year. It might have been the most important, but not the biggest
This was a goat ass video.
I love the breakdown of this type of stuff
saying harden did not want out of okc wasnt true at all. does no one remember how much bitching he was doing then? you dont have to think too hard if youll recall he has complained about teammates literally every year since
Grading trades years after the fact is a tough business. You have to look at it both prospectively and retrospectively. Prospectively, did the trade make sense? Did it fill a need? Did you get real value, and what did it cost you? Retrospectively, did it work out? A lot of trades can be bad prospectively but good retrospectively, and vice-versa.
The Pau Gasol trade in 2008, the one that Gregg Popovich derided, was a terrible trade based on the prospects. The Lakers didn't surrender a rotation player, and they didn't have to give up the equivalent of a lotto pick. That almost never happens when making a trade for an All-Star unless it's one of those sign-and-trades which is really just a wrinkle on free agency. Just based on the prospects, no team not in the middle of a firesale would pull that trade. Just the year before, Memphis was demanding young impact players, but in the end they settled for expiring contracts, low draft picks, and one promising 2nd-round prospect that nobody knew how good he could be (Marc Gasol). But retrospectively? It worked great for both teams. LA won two titles which they wouldn't have without Pau's skilled offense, and Memphis had a run of relevance and ended up with a deeper roster than if they just kept Pau. If you graded it for the Lakers, you give them an A because they got what they wanted and they got it for relatively cheap. For the Thunder, it's probably a B or B+, because you can't ignore the fact that they really should've gotten more out of it. Think of what the Pelicans got in return for Anthony Davis. That's what the Thunder should've done.
Anyway, the hindsight/foresight balance is why the HOU/OKC Harden trade doesn't earn the Thunder an F. What could they have realistically gotten out for Harden? There was some shortsightedness on OKC's part, but that was building up to the trade instead of the trade itself. OKC's real mistake was overvaluing guys like Kendrick Perkins while refusing to pay the luxury tax in their window of contention.
the celtics nets trade only gets crazier as years go on
Kevin should have been in top 75 dud was a rebound machine and he a pick and pop guy behind the arc! One of my favs!
Imagine if Adams woulda flames out in OKC. That would be the worst deal ever, without Stevo becoming a high end role player
At 5:55, no Harden was not okay with coming off the bench, which is why he demanded a trade. Pesti was just getting what he could for a disgruntled player.
Haven't seen you in my feed in so long my guy. Let me go ahead and hit the bell...
Aye. Been stepping it up the path few months. I appreciate it!
Should mention that OKC chose to pay Ibaka instead of Harden. They didn’t trade him for no reason
Say whatever you want about the trade, but Greivis Vasquez was an ok player back then, a quality backup point guard.
It seems hypocritical to give Indiana the benefit of the doubt because Kawhi might not have developed if he wasn't traded, but not give the benefit of the doubt to OKC when Harden might not have developed next to Russ and KD.
Yeah OKC was still fringe title contenders from 2013-16 but unfortunately a few of those runs got derailed with injuries. Martin was a solid contributor on the 13’ team but Westbrook went down with the torn meniscus in rd1 where we all knew it over.
2014 they ran into arguably the most complete Spurs team of all time and took them to 6 games and Ibaka was out the first two games. Which was much more competition than the heat gave them in the finals that year
2015 Durant and WB missed 69 games combined and were a lost tiebreaker away from getting the 8th seed
2016 they put together the most impressive postseason run in awhile after rd1 beating the 67 win spurs in 6 games and taking a historic 73-9 Warriors team to 7 despite being up 3-1.
This is the only series you can harp on the Thunder big two for the blown lead and really the only “failure” of the post James Harden trade.
All these years they were better than the Rockets minus 2015. F- should really be a C-C+ because they still were contending in the short term til they lost KD. Rockets ended up better than them for the years after but still hadn’t made the finals just like OKC
We knew Harden was good when he got traded. Not MVP level but still we knew he was something.
Kawhi, not so much. That’s the only argument
I mean, harden was already a very good player, averaging 18ppg. We didn't see the MVP level playing coming, but he was obviously an amazing player, and a star in the making. Indiana traded the 15th pick for George Hill, who was already a solid player
As a mavs fan, it's hilarious to think we were going for lebron
Tucker would agree that players have too much power and owners need to take back that power
When you look at Indiana's roster over the last 10 years they have had so much talent moving through that organization but they can never get it just right. Either the star gets hurt or the second best guy wants out or something else like that is always happening to the pacers. If you took their All Star team of the last 10 years they could be NBA champions.
Nice video. Good research.
I like how he didn’t even mention Anthony Bennet lmao
2015 toronto gets normal powell and og anunoby for Vasquez. 2020 Norman powell gets traded for Gary trent JR.
2022 GTJ and OG anunoby +2 frp gets traded for durant.
Vasquez for durant.
Tucker what mic is that that you’re using now?
Pacers need a B+ Moving Kawhi made sense. Danny Granger was cold af they didn't need him.
At that time Kawhi trade is not that Big.
Take a shot every time he says “it’s the most lopsided traded….”
Minor don’t disrespect k Martin like that he was averaging 25ppg before he was traded for harden he was one of the better scores of the 2000s
He almost reached 25ppg 4 years before the trade. The year before the trade he averaged 17, he only played one year for OKC and only averaged 14. That's an F-
Tyson Chandler!! He is the man
Luka Doncic dominates
That OKC trade still pains me. Russ, Durant and Harden in their primes would've be more destructive than Curry, Klay and Draymond in their primes
Tucker do you ever play ball? If so, who would you consider to be your player comp?
I’ve only seen a couple of your vids, but a suggestion:
Leave a little time at the end so people like me can Like the video before my playlist goes to the next one.
Kawhi Leonard to Spurs best trade 🔥🔥🔥 2010-15
Man fat kevin love, one of my first loves
The harden deal was so lopsided? How many championships did houston win with harden?
Jaylen Brown next video Sporting Logically 🙏🙏🙏
How did OKC hurt you?
If we consider Wiggins a busy, do we consider chandler a bust?
Nets trade will never happen again
Paul George clippers trade: exists
The mavs were trying to get CP3? That would've been crazy
I don’t agree with the James Harding grade I believe rockets gets an A , but okc was not an F Adam was amazing for years and helped russ get those triple dubs he apart of history!
OKC wanted a big so they pretty much chose Ibaka over Harden
4:25 as a thunder fan I’m still salty over this 🙃🙃🙃
It was either Ibaka or harden and thunder chose ibaka
You can't grade the Nets with an F coz DLo was the piece they move for KD to be there. I guess it counts for something.
Charlotte, Sacramento & possibly Minnesota are worst run nba franchises …. A Revolving door of coaches, Players. Poor drafting and talent management. Am I wrong ?
Indiana literally has the worst decision making skills
I knew harden would become greater. I knew OKC could never keep him after his contract was up. Guy was made to become a superstar. Just had to get out the 6th man role.
Why do keep calling Harden an MVP candidate? He was MVP. Slightly disrespectful
I think Steven adams was at least a decent pick up. Don't think it's a total F but maybe a c-d.
didn`t they also get kevin Martin who was quite decent
That 2013 trade tho 😭🤣🙃😐
:(
James Harden would not have become what he did if he would have gotten the contract.
Harden was a big playoff choker and in 2012 finals he played horrible.
Anyone wanna be in a cartoon?? Trade me your voice for a RUclips appearance haha.
My voice too deep
@@MrJames-ww5em impossible! We all have different voices so characters need that to haha
Hey man , i really Love and admire Your knowledge all around the the NBA and i am appreciating Your wisdom. All that cutting in that Video makes you appear kinda hyperactive.just take Your Time man . People like me aint in a hurry
Indiana traded the pick not kawhi
Nope they picked Kawhi then did the trade
ruclips.net/video/-K8WYe85P3I/видео.html there is the video from draft night if them selecting kawhi
Wiggins was supposed to be LeBron’s Scottie. I said it then and will continue to say it after seeing what he is now in Golden State. Smh.
Man chill 😂
you gotta be kidding right 💀 wiggins has literally been trash every single year except this year lmao.
Lmfao there’s a difference between being held responsible by a peer and being held responsible by someone who has done it. KAT still hasn’t won anything either but people only look down on Wiggins. He was expected to be the lead scorer which is something no one would have expected if he was with LeBron.
@@Reqzy10 🤣🤣🤣 you’re talking like he had any winners on those Timberwolves outside of Jimmy Butler.
@@Reqzy10 Sure Wiggins was overhyped and didn`t live through expections but people who say Wiggins was only good cuz he`s on the warriors forget how good he was on the wolves. Obv not great but nowhere near bad as some people make it seem as. He averaged 23 PPG in his 3rd season and go see his stats. when he was on the warriors he was able to showcase what he was able to do also defensively he improved
The james harden trade is hugely reminiscent of the haliburton sabonis trade
The pacers will never win a championship they cursed
Jesus Christ loves you ‘n
Fourth
sixth
First
Second
@@sheepyplays9511 third
Bro pleaasseee stop using this music its soooo overused 🙏🏼🙏🏼🙏🏼🙏🏼