Titus 1:15 To the pure all things are pure, but to those who are defiled and unbelieving nothing is pure; but even their mind and conscience are defiled. This speaks volume indeed. Amazing message! Thank you for sharing ❤
If you're willing to acknowledge men can be soulmates then why can't they live a happy and peaceful life together as a monogamous couple? Serous question!
@@RecoveringFundamentalist I don't think it's that simple. I've read the scriptures that involve same-sex acts, and the condemnation of those acts. It's worth pointing out that the manner same-sex acts played out in the late Bronze Age/early Iron Age is totally different from a consensual relationship. It was usually done as a way to shame men, as seen with the gang rapers in Sodom & Gomorrah. The Bible never makes an example out of a same-sex couple living together as a bad thing. Only the act of sex itself is condemned. I think that is interesting when in the span of one's romantic life with all its nuances, and expressions of love, it always gets boiled down to the sex part. Some gay couples don't even have sex. Hence why I asked about coupling in general and didn't bring up intercourse. End of day you can say sin is sin. But then what is the point of Jesus's sacrifice? Wasn't it to save sinners? Do Christians have so little faith as to believe that Jesus wouldn't meet them halfway on the things that cannot be helped? And i do believe that sexuality cannot be helped. Otherwise, everybody would choose to be straight because it's a lot easier to navigate socially.
God also said it's wrong to lust after another man's wife. He also said thou shalt not kill. And do not offer sacrifices to other gods. Yet he himself allowed others to commit and get away with those offenses. Your god has serious issues.
@@RecoveringFundamentalist change my mind about what?? That's the problem with you christians. You always think that this fear tactic can work on everyone. Well it cannot work on me. I do not fear your imaginary "god" in the sky. You always try to use fear anytime anyone shows y'all legitimate flaws in you all storybook. Your god himself said not to sacrifice humans to Baal and those other gods yet he wanted Abraham or whatever his name was to sacrifice his own son. He even went back on his own words and sacrifice his son for a world that stayed the damn same. He ended the first earth population to get rid of "sin" then as soon as the flood was over Noah got drunk asf. He said do not kill then he himself sent men to kill entire nations even the dogs.. he told his "men" to dash the babies against the wall. What kind of bloodthirsty tyrant do you ppl really believe in? He can send me to hell if that place even exist which I also don't believe it does but I'll never kneel to a murderous being that you ppl have Godified.
Their relationship was far more than just mere friendship. If you think same-sex love only means just what goes in the bedroom then you are quite delusional.
If David and Jonathan weren't sexually involved, then why doesn't anybody know if they were or not. Also, there are men who leave women for men and Jonathan was sexually immoral anyway. Thirdly, the Bible talks about them disrobing in front of each other. I find it hard to believe that would have been mentioned if it wasn't pertinent. If this was just a brotherhood story one thing is for sure...it is way deeper and explicit than any other story of brotherhood in the Bible. One last thing...the only other story in the Bible where it talks about two people disrobing in front of each other was the story of Adam and Eve!
Oh my word. I should have known the crazy left would say something like that. They loved each other as blood brothers even though they weren't. Thank you for this video, Dr. Brown. Spot on. 💯🎯
The mere face you have to make people “crazy left” because people stating the obvious. It was a hard reality. Everyday gay men have families and chase women for fun. David said out his own mouth his love with Jon was better than any experience with ANY woman. Saul called Jon perverse for choosing the son of Jesse. The evidence is there
@TheMuscleLover the same college scholars that are convincing men to chop their genetilia off? Good try they will gladly exchange chopping theirs off in the future for a 1 way ticket out of their final destination. But once you're in there's no way out for eternity.
Johnathan knew David would be King and did not get jealous over Davids' success, but Micah became bitter and jealous when David danced with all his might at the success the Lord gave the King. She should have been loyal to Davids's success, as a wife she loved David less than Johnathen. That's the kind of love they had.
as bisexual christian I can almost assure that if David said that and his sin was Lust, homosexuality it is the same category of Lustful sin so to assume that your word is true and only your word is true without any confirmation from God, you had committed the sin of judgment, does that makes you a better christian? better than me? or I don't deserve to go to heaven just because I should believe your word? I made a pact with God for love I want to be with a guy and this story in the Bible is the only story that gives me peace, so to assume that you can decide who is right and who is wrong is basically saying that you are God and that's wrong because nobody will ever know besides yourself, Salvation is through Faith not actions, I feel save and I'm a man of God, I assure you that God will give me this guy as long as I keep having my faith on him and not on man. I invite you to get close to God and ask him if he would do what you are doing condemn people to hell based on assumptions without knowing the heart, God Bless you.
As a bisexual Christian myself I couldn’t agree more with you. People are so quick to judge just because it’s something they cannot feel/relate to. Just like how straight men and women can actually romantically fall in love, I feel the same way. But also with guys.
Please.. Jonathan strips naked before David while offering him the symbols of his authority as gifts. He does this during a first meeting long before a "men serving at arms" deep friendship could have even been formed - more typical of a love at first sight meeting. Yep..that surely sounds wholly platonic. This man is in denial of what the text is actually saying.
They had a covenant that resembled marriage they were knit closer than with a woman, they were Echad soul knitted together. The text doesnt explicitly say the had physical relations but knowing say the language of song of songs maybe there's things we dont pick up on. And they did kiss . Why couldn't there be a homosexual or bisexual patriarch? Moses murdered a man... We all have a thorn. God chose David for his heart, flesh is corrupted at best. 1 Corinthians 1:28- God chose the lowly things of this world and the despised things-and the things that are not-to nullify the things that are. Most people who would discount such a possibility don't understand the scriptures are written in PaRDeS, with at least 4 levels of interpretation. Jewish exegesis. Jeuss himself says everything he has told his disciples is in parables.
I find this scripture fascinating. The story of King David reveals the complexities of human nature, showcasing his incredible capabilities as a leader while also exposing his vulnerabilities. His actions, including the tragic episode involving Uriah and Bathsheba, demonstrate the depths of his flaws, particularly in regards to his sexual relationships., and that spirit of Lust, makes people do crAzy things With multiple wives and concubines, it's likely that his palace witnessed indulgent behavior. Perhaps this is why David's repentance is a recurring theme, as he grappled with his own weaknesses and the consequences of his actions.
I'm not suggesting Jonathan and David had any sexual relations. Their relationship seemed to be like brothers. I am an only child but did have an adopted brother, and we would wrestle and fight growing up. But if anyone tried to get between us, we would team up and turn on them. That's what brothers do. Another interesting piece in the bible is how this is the Bronze age, but it is mentioned Saul and Jonathan had sword "like no other". And all other swords would break under Jonathan's and Saul's swords. This is a reference to the first Steel Swords in the bible. Not everything is strictly black and white in the world. A steel dagger was even found in King Tut's tomb, and he was alive hundreds of years earlier than our bible characters.
The words are perfectly clear. A comparison is being made between the love David had for Jonathan and the love he had for women, that is to say sexual love. The pleasure he took in the first outweighed the second. That is what is being said.
Jonathan was one of the most loyal and Holy loving, brave, never give up Warriors in the entire HOLY BIBLE THAT IS TRUTH. +++. PRAISE GOD ALMIGHTY YHWH AND HIS CHRIST + HOLY GHOST. IN LPRD ALMIGHTY AND REDEEMER CHRIST JESUS OF NAZARETH'S HOLY NAME. AMEN AND 🙏 AMEN 🙏.
2 Samuel 1:26 I am distressed for thee, my brother Jonathan: very pleasant hast thou been unto me: thy love to me was wonderful, passing the love of women. This passage means that David and Jonathan did have a type of sexual intimacy, but when their wives were not available out of need. They were in war many times without access to their wives and needed a form of release of sexual tension. That is why David says passing and not greater than the love of woman. He was not homosexual. The dictionary states the word passing means: going around something. Also what is the love of woman, it is romantic affection. If David did not mean a type of sexual affection, he would have used the term passing the love of mankind instead. Also, another analogy would be about killing during war time. It is not considered murder although another human being is killing to protect other's and so why should having sexual interaction in time of need with the same sex automatically make one homosexual. Masturbating does not fulfill all needs.
David knew the word of God and the laws He laid down on homosexuality. God would never condone such relationships and neither would it of entered David’s mind if it had happened God would have condemned David in the bible and we would of heard about the condemnation. Anyone who thinks this doesn’t know the word of God rightly.
*** Sincere questions from a soul seeking truth in God’s word. Not trying to start debates or fights. ***** Why does the Biblical view of marriage and divorce change throughout history? Further, why was Moses given authority to allow something (divorce) outside the perfect plan of God in Genesis? How many other rules/laws did Moses create outside of God’s perfect plan? Did he do this to please the people? And how do we know what God truly wanted if Moses did bend to the culture (unless I misunderstood, which is highly likely and the reason I am asking)? This causes confusion because one could think, “is gay marriage now allowed bc hearts are hardened, even though most see it as outside the perfect plan of God in Genesis?” To that point, Bible claims the government is appointed by God and therefore we should submit to its rules. The government permits gay marriage in many places, including the US. Which government is God’s? The one that permits or not? Or were they simply speaking about the Roman government? Which no longer exists, but we assume they are referencing all governments, no? These are legitimate questions I would love to be answered honestly by you, sir. I can’t find anyone who truly knows the Bible to have these discussions with me in an honest way. I’m not attacking scripture, but trying to interpret. When Jesus was asked about divorce: "Moses, because of the hardness of your hearts, permitted you to divorce your wives, but from the beginning it was not so" (Matthew 19:8). This verse seems to indicate that when hearts are hardened, it’s okay to marry and divorce outside of God’s plan in Genesis. Why? Romans 13 1 “Everyone must submit himself to the governing authorities, for there is no authority except that which God has established. The authorities that exist have been established by God.” These authorities once allowed for polygamy and they no longer do in the US- which was appointed by God? Or does God’s plan change at moments in history? Thank you in advance for your help with understanding all of this.
I appreciate your questions here and maybe we can talk sometime, Yah willing. I don’t know if I have answers to your questions but I’m intrigued by your inquiring mind
soul mate NO, from the same realm in heaven YES. are there different realms in heaven, YES.. 4 OF THEM but good word brother. could of saved the lust part but good word lol
David,was talking about the kind of friendship of loyalty he should have had with Micah his wife. Johnathan loved David through all his troubles.
Titus 1:15 To the pure all things are pure, but to those who are defiled and unbelieving nothing is pure; but even their mind and conscience are defiled.
This speaks volume indeed. Amazing message! Thank you for sharing ❤
If you're willing to acknowledge men can be soulmates then why can't they live a happy and peaceful life together as a monogamous couple? Serous question!
Because God said it’s a sin, that’s why. Serious and honest answer
@@RecoveringFundamentalist I don't think it's that simple. I've read the scriptures that involve same-sex acts, and the condemnation of those acts. It's worth pointing out that the manner same-sex acts played out in the late Bronze Age/early Iron Age is totally different from a consensual relationship. It was usually done as a way to shame men, as seen with the gang rapers in Sodom & Gomorrah. The Bible never makes an example out of a same-sex couple living together as a bad thing. Only the act of sex itself is condemned. I think that is interesting when in the span of one's romantic life with all its nuances, and expressions of love, it always gets boiled down to the sex part. Some gay couples don't even have sex. Hence why I asked about coupling in general and didn't bring up intercourse.
End of day you can say sin is sin. But then what is the point of Jesus's sacrifice? Wasn't it to save sinners? Do Christians have so little faith as to believe that Jesus wouldn't meet them halfway on the things that cannot be helped? And i do believe that sexuality cannot be helped. Otherwise, everybody would choose to be straight because it's a lot easier to navigate socially.
God also said it's wrong to lust after another man's wife.
He also said thou shalt not kill.
And do not offer sacrifices to other gods. Yet he himself allowed others to commit and get away with those offenses. Your god has serious issues.
@@shotta_way you’ll bow the knee as well one day to my friend. I pray you change your mind before it’s too late
@@RecoveringFundamentalist change my mind about what??
That's the problem with you christians. You always think that this fear tactic can work on everyone. Well it cannot work on me. I do not fear your imaginary "god" in the sky. You always try to use fear anytime anyone shows y'all legitimate flaws in you all storybook. Your god himself said not to sacrifice humans to Baal and those other gods yet he wanted Abraham or whatever his name was to sacrifice his own son. He even went back on his own words and sacrifice his son for a world that stayed the damn same. He ended the first earth population to get rid of "sin" then as soon as the flood was over Noah got drunk asf. He said do not kill then he himself sent men to kill entire nations even the dogs.. he told his "men" to dash the babies against the wall. What kind of bloodthirsty tyrant do you ppl really believe in? He can send me to hell if that place even exist which I also don't believe it does but I'll never kneel to a murderous being that you ppl have Godified.
Their relationship was far more than just mere friendship. If you think same-sex love only means just what goes in the bedroom then you are quite delusional.
Dr. Brown is setting the record STRAIGHT!!
ha! truth!
YEAH STR8 TO BED LOL
@@johnjack5835 No such thing as homophobic amoung Christians. Just true to Gods Word.
But he’s skipping ALOT in the the process lol
I enjoyed this message this morning. I had a relationship like this and ppl didn't understand. I was more like a daughter to this couple.
If David and Jonathan weren't sexually involved, then why doesn't anybody know if they were or not. Also, there are men who leave women for men and Jonathan was sexually immoral anyway. Thirdly, the Bible talks about them disrobing in front of each other. I find it hard to believe that would have been mentioned if it wasn't pertinent. If this was just a brotherhood story one thing is for sure...it is way deeper and explicit than any other story of brotherhood in the Bible. One last thing...the only other story in the Bible where it talks about two people disrobing in front of each other was the story of Adam and Eve!
They were like brothers it was love.
True.. god gave me my now brother Brandon and it’s literally the same thing as Johnathan and David
Oh my word. I should have known the crazy left would say something like that. They loved each other as blood brothers even though they weren't. Thank you for this video, Dr. Brown. Spot on. 💯🎯
you could not sound more delusional.
This is horrible
Turn something nice into something bad
There is literal proof of this by scholars that they were lovers. Just because you hate gays. Doesn’t mean god does.
The mere face you have to make people “crazy left” because people stating the obvious. It was a hard reality. Everyday gay men have families and chase women for fun. David said out his own mouth his love with Jon was better than any experience with ANY woman.
Saul called Jon perverse for choosing the son of Jesse. The evidence is there
@TheMuscleLover the same college scholars that are convincing men to chop their genetilia off? Good try they will gladly exchange chopping theirs off in the future for a 1 way ticket out of their final destination. But once you're in there's no way out for eternity.
Johnathan knew David would be King and did not get jealous over Davids' success, but Micah became bitter and jealous when David danced with all his might at the success the Lord gave the King. She should have been loyal to Davids's success, as a wife she loved David less than Johnathen. That's the kind of love they had.
as bisexual christian I can almost assure that if David said that and his sin was Lust, homosexuality it is the same category of Lustful sin so to assume that your word is true and only your word is true without any confirmation from God, you had committed the sin of judgment, does that makes you a better christian? better than me? or I don't deserve to go to heaven just because I should believe your word? I made a pact with God for love I want to be with a guy and this story in the Bible is the only story that gives me peace, so to assume that you can decide who is right and who is wrong is basically saying that you are God and that's wrong because nobody will ever know besides yourself, Salvation is through Faith not actions, I feel save and I'm a man of God, I assure you that God will give me this guy as long as I keep having my faith on him and not on man. I invite you to get close to God and ask him if he would do what you are doing condemn people to hell based on assumptions without knowing the heart, God Bless you.
As a bisexual Christian myself I couldn’t agree more with you. People are so quick to judge just because it’s something they cannot feel/relate to. Just like how straight men and women can actually romantically fall in love, I feel the same way. But also with guys.
Please.. Jonathan strips naked before David while offering him the symbols of his authority as gifts. He does this during a first meeting long before a "men serving at arms" deep friendship could have even been formed - more typical of a love at first sight meeting.
Yep..that surely sounds wholly platonic.
This man is in denial of what the text is actually saying.
He took his clothe off and gave him his sword and after that he didnt let him return home, they signed and agreement and they kissed ... 🤔
They had a covenant that resembled marriage they were knit closer than with a woman, they were Echad soul knitted together.
The text doesnt explicitly say the had physical relations but knowing say the language of song of songs maybe there's things we dont pick up on.
And they did kiss .
Why couldn't there be a homosexual or bisexual patriarch? Moses murdered a man... We all have a thorn.
God chose David for his heart, flesh is corrupted at best.
1 Corinthians 1:28-
God chose the lowly things of this world and the despised things-and the things that are not-to nullify the things that are.
Most people who would discount such a possibility don't understand the scriptures are written in PaRDeS, with at least 4 levels of interpretation.
Jewish exegesis. Jeuss himself says everything he has told his disciples is in parables.
Wow. Skipped over so much context leading up to Jonathan's death.
I find this scripture fascinating. The story of King David reveals the complexities of human nature, showcasing his incredible capabilities as a leader while also exposing his vulnerabilities. His actions, including the tragic episode involving Uriah and Bathsheba, demonstrate the depths of his flaws, particularly in regards to his sexual relationships., and that spirit of Lust, makes people do crAzy things With multiple wives and concubines, it's likely that his palace witnessed indulgent behavior. Perhaps this is why David's repentance is a recurring theme, as he grappled with his own weaknesses and the consequences of his actions.
I'm not suggesting Jonathan and David had any sexual relations. Their relationship seemed to be like brothers. I am an only child but did have an adopted brother, and we would wrestle and fight growing up. But if anyone tried to get between us, we would team up and turn on them. That's what brothers do. Another interesting piece in the bible is how this is the Bronze age, but it is mentioned Saul and Jonathan had sword "like no other". And all other swords would break under Jonathan's and Saul's swords. This is a reference to the first Steel Swords in the bible. Not everything is strictly black and white in the world. A steel dagger was even found in King Tut's tomb, and he was alive hundreds of years earlier than our bible characters.
The words are perfectly clear. A comparison is being made between the love David had for Jonathan and the love he had for women, that is to say sexual love. The pleasure he took in the first outweighed the second. That is what is being said.
Jonathan was one of the most loyal and Holy loving, brave, never give up Warriors in the entire HOLY BIBLE THAT IS TRUTH. +++. PRAISE GOD ALMIGHTY YHWH AND HIS CHRIST + HOLY GHOST. IN LPRD ALMIGHTY AND REDEEMER CHRIST JESUS OF NAZARETH'S HOLY NAME. AMEN AND 🙏 AMEN 🙏.
What kind of man has more love for another man more than he does a woman??
One that loves his father, brother, son etc.
@@jonathonis92 more than a woman?
@@shotta_wayyes
2 Samuel 1:26 I am distressed for thee, my brother Jonathan: very pleasant hast thou been unto me: thy love to me was wonderful, passing the love of women.
This passage means that David and Jonathan did have a type of sexual intimacy, but when their wives were not available out of need. They were in war many times without access to their wives and needed a form of release of sexual tension. That is why David says passing and not greater than the love of woman. He was not homosexual. The dictionary states the word passing means: going around something. Also what is the love of woman, it is romantic affection. If David did not mean a type of sexual affection, he would have used the term passing the love of mankind instead.
Also, another analogy would be about killing during war time. It is not considered murder although another human being is killing to protect other's and so why should having sexual interaction in time of need with the same sex automatically make one homosexual. Masturbating does not fulfill all needs.
David knew the word of God and the laws He laid down on homosexuality. God would never condone such relationships and neither would it of entered David’s mind if it had happened God would have condemned David in the bible and we would of heard about the condemnation. Anyone who thinks this doesn’t know the word of God rightly.
*** Sincere questions from a soul seeking truth in God’s word. Not trying to start debates or fights. *****
Why does the Biblical view of marriage and divorce change throughout history? Further, why was Moses given authority to allow something (divorce) outside the perfect plan of God in Genesis? How many other rules/laws did Moses create outside of God’s perfect plan? Did he do this to please the people? And how do we know what God truly wanted if Moses did bend to the culture (unless I misunderstood, which is highly likely and the reason I am asking)? This causes confusion because one could think, “is gay marriage now allowed bc hearts are hardened, even though most see it as outside the perfect plan of God in Genesis?” To that point, Bible claims the government is appointed by God and therefore we should submit to its rules. The government permits gay marriage in many places, including the US. Which government is God’s? The one that permits or not? Or were they simply speaking about the Roman government? Which no longer exists, but we assume they are referencing all governments, no?
These are legitimate questions I would love to be answered honestly by you, sir. I can’t find anyone who truly knows the Bible to have these discussions with me in an honest way. I’m not attacking scripture, but trying to interpret.
When Jesus was asked about divorce:
"Moses, because of the hardness of your hearts, permitted you to divorce your wives, but from the beginning it was not so" (Matthew 19:8).
This verse seems to indicate that when hearts are hardened, it’s okay to marry and divorce outside of God’s plan in Genesis. Why?
Romans 13 1
“Everyone must submit himself to the governing authorities, for there is no authority except that which God has established. The authorities that exist have been established by God.”
These authorities once allowed for polygamy and they no longer do in the US- which was appointed by God? Or does God’s plan change at moments in history?
Thank you in advance for your help with understanding all of this.
I appreciate your questions here and maybe we can talk sometime, Yah willing. I don’t know if I have answers to your questions but I’m intrigued by your inquiring mind
Amen brother
Bromance goals. Is this really a "shocking" truth?
I thought “kiss” in the bible meant hugged? Not actually kissing with the lips
Or kissing on the cheek, which is a common form of greeting in the eastern part of the world.
Nobody really knows since the bible we read today is a totally different bible than the original bible altered by the church
So how did David become king?
Isn't it written in the bible? Which part got you confused?
It was brotherly love not no gay stuff bruh
Western minded. Us in the east from thousand years ago theres cultural thing called sworn brothers.
They had a trauma bond from abusive families. They found love and safety in each others friendships
soul mate NO, from the same realm in heaven YES. are there different realms in heaven, YES.. 4 OF THEM but good word brother. could of saved the lust part but good word lol
How convenient.
great discernment your a seer
This is wrong interpretation of David and Jonathan Love
There are sheep and goats. I think you may not be a sheep.
Haha obviously u want to deceive us by skippinhg to saul n jonathans death. Then explain to us why did they kissed each other hahahahah