I decided to pin another comment and give a little context for anyone that might not agree with Judson’s take. First of all, the passion that has been shown in the comments (on both sides) is why I love the metal community so much. When we started this channel, we made the decision to never fake it or be disingenuous. If you saw the introduction to the song, I gave very little info or context and only shared that the song is about Mengele. His reaction was just that… His reaction. Whether anyone thinks it’s right or wrong is what is so beautiful about it. It starts a discussion and I’m so grateful for that. Metal pushes boundaries and Slayer were one of the best to ever do that. They wrote a song about one of the most atrocious events in history. Simple as that. What’s not so simple is how it’s interpreted. If someone wants to be offended that Judson found it offensive, they have every right to do that. Just like he has the right to be offended. I sometimes forget that when we started this channel, as far as I know, his knowledge of the metal world was basically the hits from the Black Album. 😂 We’re still having a blast doing this and we hope everyone is still enjoying this journey with us. He’s not going to like everything he hears and that’s quite alright, in my opinion. If every song ended and his response was “that was awesome” every time, I think it would get boring very quickly. Thanks so much for all of your feedback. Again, it’s why I love the metal community so much. -Richard
Well well well. You sure kicked the hornets nest with this one! My view is that I completely get Judson's reaction, and for the still-sensitised, his is realistically the only appropriate one to have. The point I knew you guys were the real deal was when you did Linkin Park and Judson hated it. It's the promise of sincerity which sets you apart and anyone that wants something different should simply get their entertainment elsewhere. Now to be really controversial, I think Slayer are overrated and had to rely on shock value to make a name for themselves. Like the kid at school who stuck worms up his nose. Worth a glance, but not to be taken seriously. Yeah, I said it.
@@bumblefluff79 thank you for the acknowledgement of sincerity. We’ll go down with the ship if it means not compromising our authenticity. 😂 That last part might have been the hottest take of them all. 😬 I stand by your right to your opinion and will defend it if whether I agree with it or not. We’ll stand and defend your right Braveheart style. And yes, I’m aware of my tone deafness while making a tongue in cheek Mel Gibson reference on a video with subject matter as controversial as this one.
Freedom! That's what it's all about, amen brother. The right to offend and the right to be offended are absolutely integral to an honest conversation. You can fundamentally disagree with each other and be as emotional as you want, as long as everyone has enough space to feel what they want to feel and have the maturity to walk away without trying to shut down the other's position. And Slayer aren't that bad really. Would rather listen to them than Linkin Park any day.
Jeff Hanneman said " people mistake exposure for glorification. We tell the world what people do to each other. They should be offended, but not by us".
Yep. When I first heard this song about 35 years ago or so I was horrified by it, but when I really delved into the lyrics I realized they weren't glorifying it at all. "Sadistic butcher of demise," is not glorification.
If we ignore history, we are doomed to repeat it. They are not glorifying the events or person but reminding us just how twisted and evil that a human can be.
They should have retired when Jeff died. Kerry is an arrogant dullard. He drove Lombardo away . I hope they don't do their " reunion " tour and Kerry just does his arrogant dogshit project and fades away.
The thing is.... I don't think this song is written from the killer's perspective. It's literally just descriptions of what he did. And if that upsets you, good. It should.
He was dumb. No, perhaps not that-just, unthinking. "About Not sees means pro not sees" bs. Or more probably just generally unfamiliar with how this music works.
As a massive Slayer Fan and a massive Judson fan, it was a little hard hearing his anger toward the lyrics. I can understand his Anger, totally understandable and justified critisim. Alot of History used to be told through songs, and Slayers way of that isnt for everyone. I Love Judson and this Great channel! (and you to Richard!).
How Hanneman wrote the lyrics was how he expressed his intake of the info he took in. How brutal it was written at that time, the books he was reading. As we went through the 20th century, our language is continually being softened. He was reading some hard literature.
This song is bittersweet for me. I lost most of my family in the holocaust, but I also love the song. Though it's difficult to listen to lyrically; I see it as educational. I don't feel as though it glorifies these atrocities; or that person whose name I won't speak. They're recounting real life events and a real life evil monster. It's a message; a retelling of the worst of humanity. This really happened and it's important to be reminded because if we don't learn from history, we're doomed to repeat it. It should be painful and angry; that's representative of the blatant, gruesome suffering of that time, and in that place. Monsters are real, and they walk among us. Before the holocaust, that guy was just walking around. I think the discrepancy is in age and wisdom. The younger generation currently in school should hear this (not elementary of course) but it's not a subject that should be squashed or overlooked. A lot of real history is taught in a watered down way and that's wrong. The song paints a bleak picture of the world because that was (and often currently is) very bleak and dark. It's awareness to me and yeah, it makes me angry, but that's the point. Be angry, and get off your ass and actively do the opposite. Make the world a better place so we never experience these despicable, shameful horrors of our past in our present and future. You can't sugarcoat something like this.
Sometimes a song is just another form of education. Those who forget history are doomed to repeat it. Thank you for your honest reaction. Good or bad does not matter. What matters is that 'now you know' ;)
If you just look at Hanneman and this one song you could get away with it. But if you look at his decades of career: he always had some excuse for just bringing up the first reich to the point that I don't buy it he just had a 'fascination with german history' When the guy literally collected Nazi Medals, couldn't shut up about Nazi Germany, one of the most famous Slayer logos is taken straight out of Nazi propaganda, always displayed Nazi logos on his guitars (Just not the actual swastika but the intention was the same) and writes Angel of Death. Sorry I never bought it was just shock value, it was very clear glorification just like Judson said. Metalheads just don't want to hear about how not just one but *several* of the most iconic 80s bands were basically always glorifying Nazis and that's how you later got Burzum and then actual Nazis in Black Metal or Phil Anselmo screaming 'WHITE POWER!' on a live show, etc. Until people stop lying to themselves and attribute it to just teenage angst and shock value nobody should respect metalheads because they're either Nazis themselves or too stupid to self police their own scene
@@uoabigaillevey lmao what kinda kid brings up that cringe catch phrase? Ultimately its Jeff's word against his actions. Based on his choices in words, I dont think he was a Nazi, but he definitely had a bit of an unnecessary fascination with it.
@@maeschder Cringe catch phrase? Do #facts offend you? Anyone is free to have any interest they want without being judged for that interest. Their actions are what should be judged. Too many people want to abolish history.. especially history they are uncomfortable with. My belief is that all history should be preserved.. the good.. the bad.. and the ugly. From all perspectives possible. Through such knowledge and study one can gain the most understanding of the reality of the time in question.. and how it impacted the times since.. and how to avoid the negatives should they arise again. Speaking specifically of the Nazi's, one should keep the history from the perspective of a Nazi themselves, of a Jewish concentration camp victim, of an American soldier invading Germany in a ground assault, etc. Each has merit when considering the topic at hand. "Lest we forget.."
Of course. But as Richard says repeatedly - this is extreme music. It's partly designed to be shocking. Judson's reaction is exactly what Slayer were going for...
After we recorded this video, I was curious if Judson was on to something about the lyrics. I learned that Jeff Hanneman actually wrote the lyrics and not Tom Araya. Hanneman reportedly had an interest in Nazi history and even collected Nazi medals. In a 1987 interview with NME Magazine, he was quoted as saying: “I feel you should be able to write about whatever you want. Angel of Death is like a history lesson.” Turns out, these lyrics caused MASSIVE controversy. The album’s release was even delayed because Columbia Records refused to distribute it. I have been listening to metal for the majority of my life and I guess I’ve grown numb to the fact that some of the subject matter can be offensive and off putting to others. It doesn’t make me love it any less, but I also tend to forget that I’m showing this music to my friend that has never heard these songs. I will still continue to bring extremity to Judson’s ears, but I’ll be less surprised the next time he finds something offensive. I hope y’all enjoyed this one. -Richard **If you or someone you know is struggling with substance abuse and they’re ready to get help, contact us via email.** thegreatmeasures@gmail.com
It is funny how song lyrics can be controversial but Steven Spielberg directing Schindlers list or someone writing a history book on these atrocities isn't.
The topic is tough and especially as a German, whose grandparents at least did not fight against that regime and so still live with the burden or task to never allow to happen this again. As a metalhead i really understand Judson's comment, great music, but tough topic. So, i am split in two, great music, but a topic hitting in your stomach. It is not clear by the lyrics, whether they adorse the angel of death or are against it. On the other side, Slayer were young at that time and sometimes at that age, you cannot judge where things might go, like unwanted fans cheering at you.
But it does have an underlying meaning, and it is a condemnation of the worst in humanity, and also it brought awareness of the horrors of the monsters that did the worst things to many people. I would like to hear why someone actually things this is a glorification of the holocaust, because personally I never did
I loved this episode, there are several reaction channels nowadays that do nothing more than just listen to the music and make faces... you guys discuss what you liked, what you didn't like and point out the reasons, that's the coolest thing to raise healthy discussions between different points of view.
I love how you guys may have different perspectives on something and still have such a meaningful, fun and respectful conversation. Only but R E S P E C T to both of you!
Best video so far by you guys: open, honest and passionate. Well done. I bought Reign in Blood the day it came out here in Ireland way back in the dark ages. I was always fascinated with WWII, especially the war in Europe as I had relatives who fought and died in it. This song was HUGELY controversial when it came out, people here were shouting for it to be banned etc etc. For me , I loved the song , the musicianship, the power and I was fascinated by the subject matter...in all its awfulness. I went out , bought a book on Mengele , read Richard Evans' Trilogy on The Third R&ich...and tired to educate myself as much as I could on the subject matter. There is not right or wrong here to my mind, Slayer made thousands and thousands of young people educate themselves to the horrors that human beings are capable of ..the fact it is not a Itzhak Perlman solo violin piece honoring the dead of that wretched place is irrelevant. It outlines the atrocities and horrors of Auschwitz Birkenau. And it does it well. But I gotta give top marks to Judson...I get where you are coming from. I just disagree with you thats all. Respect to you both and keep up the great work...
Superb comment, from a fellow Irish man!! This channel has really taken a leap upwards in positive estimation off the back of this episode. Well done, maith thù!! (Patrick, Galway)
It's awesome to see such a genuine reaction to uncomfortable subject matter like this. There is nothing wrong with his perspective at all, same for Richard!
One of the GREATEST Thrash Metal songs off one of the GREATEST Thrash Metal albums!!! Also, Richard Effigy of the Forgotten is one of the best death metal albums of all time...dig the shirt.... Good discussion fellers about the music
86/87 was when the Big 4 became the Big 4. Four albums that were the perfect distillation of what they had all been building towards for the last 5 years. Almost no production, no mainstream influence, just raw talent and energy.
Despise The Sun EP (with Dave Culross on drums strangely enough, must be why they broke up if Mike Smith was out, at the time), is the best short and sweet DM experience to me, especially since Suffocation always had that little hint of thrash to it, the 5th and final song on it, forgot the title just now, which is an old song from their first release, on a 7 inch from 1990, to me is possibly the best DM song ever. I'm more into thrash, so just 5 epic songs like this is enough for me when it comes to DM, typically, especially when it's such a AAA+ release, from 1998. Thankfully they reformed 7 years later!
Thank you Judson for your opinion. I can definitely see what you are trying to convey and appreciate what you have to say. What you did was remind me to think about the subject matter and be willing to discuss with those who are offended as to why they feel that way. The first time I heard Slayer was '86/'87 and, took me a while to warm up to them and become one of my favorite bands. The subject matter of their songs can be a challenge and thanks for reminding me, especially since I have a 5 year old daughter. Keep up the good work and thanks to both of you for entertaining me and pointing out there is great music in METAL!
It's interesting, as soon as I saw the song title, I knew Judson would have a fit. What I think he is not taking into consideration are the market forces that were present at the time that this was written. Slayer had recently emerged as a force in this new genre of Metal. There was a motivation to push boundaries, playing faster, more chanotically, more aggressively, to outdo their last release, and in some ways they became known for that, for making music that would offend the sensibilities of those not committed to the genre and the style of music. In this sense, culturally, Slayer was an acid test for metalheads back in the day. Slayer's hallmark was the pure aggression and violence that their music represented, and "if it offends you, then fuck your sensibilities" kind of thing. Also keep in mind that this was released in the time of the PMRC and their attempts to put warning labels on certain types of music (rap and metal specifically), having such a label became a badge of honor. The horror show comparison was apt. For Judson's sake, in terms of comparing the "art" of Slayer to the fine arts world, it would be apt to compare Slayer's music to the work of Joel Peter Witkin or Francis Bacon, who also dealt with darker, sometimes offensive subjects. Beauty is not the sole purpose of Art. The purpose of Art is to provoke an emotional reaction, and sometimes the emotion that is provoked is one of disquiet and upset.
If you want something a bit off the wall in the hyper-fast tech death realm, y'all should check out Ophidian I and their song "Diamonds". Very strange, Icelandic band. Of the top tech death bands, I find they have the least rigid sound, their music is insanely original.
What pisses me off is that the bastard was never caught and that so many Nazis were never held accountable for their crimes. Anyway, to this day such people do what they want and no one will punish them for it. That's why when I listen to this song, I have red spots in front of my eyes.
Let me put it to you this way… had it not been for Slayer I might not have learned about Mengele because that part of WWII history was glossed over and sanitized when I was in school. A lot of teachers didn’t want to touch it, but the Punk and Metal bands I listened to did. Just like Iron Maiden, they wrote about it and it piqued my curiosity. They weren’t saying they were for it, they were just presenting a side of history that doesn’t always get notice or attention because it is so offensive. That’s just part of the Punk ethos that Slayer embraced. Jeff Hanneman himself was a student of WWII history because his dad, who he was very close to, was a soldier serving in Germany at the time these actual events took place and he had a lot of artifacts that he brought with him. They fascinated Jeff when he was a kid and it caused him to learn more about what happened. The song isn’t glorifying it, it’s just presenting it as a matter of fact. It’s up to us to decide how we feel because he didn’t want to be preachy about. Regarding Mengele himself, Jeff said “We know he was a bad man and what he did was horrible, why do you need for me to have to say that outright or that it was wrong? We already know that.” Also, there are some glimpses of condemnation in the lyrics that aren’t always picked up on… the opening line of the song itself could be directed at Mengele himself as a punishment for his crimes in a Karmic sense. A sort of poetic justice. I also think people forget that in the mid 80s when this song was made there were a lot of stories about Mengele escaping the Nuremberg Trials and living in Argentina and still being alive at the time. The line of the song “Rancid Angel of Death… flying free” was put in there as a reminder the guy could still be out there, but it was also a condemnation of Mengele. One of the meanings of the word rancid is: distinctly unpleasant or foul; offensive. I remember a lot of news coverage about escaped Nazis officers being found and arrested and sent back to Germany to stand trial… in the 80s and 90s this was still happening. Hell, we still have some WWII vets still alive today, though they’re in their late 90s if not 100 years old now. You guys are probably too young to remember that, but even I as a 12 year old in 1986 was fascinated by those news stories. Every time it happened it was huge. We’re a lot farther away from 1945 now than we were in 1986 so it hasn’t happened in a long time.
I'm not familiar with the Black Dahlia Murder song you mentioned. But, based on how you described it, my hunch is that it's about Gilles de Rais. Maybe I'm wrong. Celtic Frost has a song about him - "Into the Crypts of Rays." Macabre has a song about him, too - "The Black Knight." I'm sure there are others.
I love the song because I love history and metal. When they are put together, it’s even better. Slayer also did song about Unit 731 from WW2. The Japanese unit did all kinds of horrific experiments on people like the Nazis. They also wrote a song from the POV of a terrorist.
Huge Mike Patton fan, you consider reacting to "The Real Thing" by Faith No More? This reaction is proof you do honest work here, gentlemen. Mike is considered a genius to some people and love to hear your take on some of his work.
Metal is anger, anger towards humanity, anger towards yourself, and anger that everyone walks around not talking about things that are important. Metals wants to talk about the hard and difficult gruesome realities everyone ignores. They put it in your face so you can’t ignore it when you hear it. Because society will always spiral into chaos because we ignore the things we shouldn’t ignore, because we don’t like to think about it. Metal confronts it. That’s why I love it.
I love his reaction and commentary about the song, he is totally right, Judson is probably a trained musician and he understand art fundamentals in any area (painting, poetry etc) probably, but this is no high art, Slayer members wrote this in their early 20s, while drinking beer and watching a Nazi documentary tv show on History channel and after learning about Mengele they said at unison probably " dude , we have to make a song about him" and thats it, the song is a time capsule in the life of Slayer, is has no ulterior motives or anything else. Metal is really simple and dumb in general and there is not much beyond being fast ,loud and aggresive. thanks for the video.
Jeff Hanneman wasn't glorifying the Nazis, He was telling how evil humans can be towards one another!. The same, is with his many history lessons put to his fucking awesome music!.
I first heard Angel of Death before learning about WW2 in school. When reading and listening to the lyrics, I remember imagining a sci fi / fantasy setting where an alien race called the Aryan race came from the skies to invade, torture, and obliterate a Mordor-like place.
I think the song and the band did exactly what it was intended and that was to Piss someone off!! It’s SLAYER for crying out loud! Me and my brother listened to this album repeatedly when it came out until we knew all the lyrics
Judson is completely warranted at his assessment. This has been an objection to shit like this since it came out, it's not a new conversation. Judson is an adult with a heart and a soul and he drew a line, that's how art and taste and creativity works.
I loved the passion and honesty of this reaction! As others have mentioned, I think the point was to bring a deeper awareness to how cruel humans can be to one another. Most of us have heard of the holocaust, but may not know just how bad it was. I myself knew so many people died, but not how they died. They don't teach that at school. I think they should, especially for the younger generations now who don't know how good they have it nowadays. But also to be aware of some not-so-nice people out there . . . half the time they've got their heads locked onto the goddamn phones and don't know what their surroundings are (off on a tangent, sorry!) Being an illustrator and writer myself, I understand Judson's point about perhaps a 'lack' of creativity. I think that was the point. Be blunt, and hard about it. Cold hard truth is needed sometimes. Also, maybe the point was also that how can a 'normal' person ever relate to such evil because the idea of murdering others in such horrific ways is so alien to most of us . . . do we really want to get into such minds? Anyway, great reaction, as always!
This is why I watch you guys, honest opinions and reaction. Even though we consider something a masterpiece as a metalhead, someone just might not. For example I played Sepultura - Roots Bloody Roots to my colleagues once and they looked at me like I was schizophrenic. Then I realized, we hear metal differently. I've been exposed to it since childhood I see nothing wrong with it. I considered black metal too much once but today it's one of my favorite metal genres. Shit, I lost my train of though... point is these guys are bros
I think this gets lost in the discussion at times too. I was three months old when this album was released. I have no idea how the cultural and societal climate was when it came out.
I see this song along the lines of less of a glorification of who he was and what he's done and more as a reminder. We all hear "Those who forget the past are doomed to repeat it"
Literarily, I think the most interesting line in the song is "just a matter of time, 'til you rip yourselves apart" - it sounds like he's talking about the Nazi regime itself.
I appreciate Judson’s multiple Jim Halpert-esque “wtf is this” looks at the camera during the song 😂 For real though, the argument that this type of music attempts to push boundaries and provoke a meaningful reaction is incredibly misguided, to me. If this song was condemning these events, why would they expect it to elicit a pissed off reaction, like you say their intentions are. To me, that is only the result because the message in these descriptions is neutral at best - which you really shouldn’t be about this subject matter. Judson’s “painting of swastikas” comparison was spot on imo. If you want to portray the villain from their perspective, make the portrayal human, find an ounce of relatability and nuance, instead of solely focusing on the most offensive thing about them just to piss people off? And don’t make it about a genocide of people whose children are still alive, ffs. I just don’t see the point, but i guess it’s fine that i’m not the audience for extreme metal🤷🏻 Did you really think Judson was gonna go for this though? Sorry for the rant, i was an English lit major, and this kinda shit is a huge pet peeve of mine.
In all honesty, the lyrics being so thought provoking was nowhere near my radar. Like I referenced in the pinned comment, I’m so desensitized to metal lyrics that I sometimes forget that I’m showing these songs to someone that hasn’t heard them before. I was just on the phone with Judson about this, and you’re thinking is along the same lines as his. I think people that are upset with his reaction aren’t fully considering that his initial feeling was real and authentic. It’s his opinion. It’s why we make these videos. People don’t have to agree with it and they can tell him he’s wrong, but we’re also not going to give some disingenuous take on the art so we don’t upset anyone.
@@Greatmeasures You had to talk it over again because your discussion/his take is getting a lot of people outta their seats?😂 Considering it seemed to matter a fair deal to Judson, i think it’s great you took the time to talk honestly about what you both get from this type of music instead of quickly dismissing it to focus on something else, just because you disagree. It’s quite reasonable that you would have different viewpoints given your many years of different musical interests, like you being desensitized. I think you are absolutely going the right way about this for a reaction channel - with what you are saying in your pinned comments too - keep it up!
Do Dead Skin Mask next. It's about Ed Gein who wore skin suits and had ears as pull rings for window shades. Silence of the lambs and Texas chainsaw massacre was also based on Ed Gein.
History is BRUTAL...this song tells a history lesson, we can not change history...these forbidden experiments did advance Medical knowledge by 100 years. if some good can come out of tragedy, it is a small step towards mankind's future
I decided to pin another comment and give a little context for anyone that might not agree with Judson’s take.
First of all, the passion that has been shown in the comments (on both sides) is why I love the metal community so much.
When we started this channel, we made the decision to never fake it or be disingenuous. If you saw the introduction to the song, I gave very little info or context and only shared that the song is about Mengele.
His reaction was just that… His reaction. Whether anyone thinks it’s right or wrong is what is so beautiful about it. It starts a discussion and I’m so grateful for that. Metal pushes boundaries and Slayer were one of the best to ever do that. They wrote a song about one of the most atrocious events in history. Simple as that. What’s not so simple is how it’s interpreted. If someone wants to be offended that Judson found it offensive, they have every right to do that. Just like he has the right to be offended.
I sometimes forget that when we started this channel, as far as I know, his knowledge of the metal world was basically the hits from the Black Album. 😂
We’re still having a blast doing this and we hope everyone is still enjoying this journey with us. He’s not going to like everything he hears and that’s quite alright, in my opinion. If every song ended and his response was “that was awesome” every time, I think it would get boring very quickly.
Thanks so much for all of your feedback. Again, it’s why I love the metal community so much.
-Richard
Well well well. You sure kicked the hornets nest with this one!
My view is that I completely get Judson's reaction, and for the still-sensitised, his is realistically the only appropriate one to have. The point I knew you guys were the real deal was when you did Linkin Park and Judson hated it. It's the promise of sincerity which sets you apart and anyone that wants something different should simply get their entertainment elsewhere.
Now to be really controversial, I think Slayer are overrated and had to rely on shock value to make a name for themselves. Like the kid at school who stuck worms up his nose. Worth a glance, but not to be taken seriously. Yeah, I said it.
@@bumblefluff79 thank you for the acknowledgement of sincerity. We’ll go down with the ship if it means not compromising our authenticity. 😂
That last part might have been the hottest take of them all. 😬
I stand by your right to your opinion and will defend it if whether I agree with it or not. We’ll stand and defend your right Braveheart style.
And yes, I’m aware of my tone deafness while making a tongue in cheek Mel Gibson reference on a video with subject matter as controversial as this one.
Freedom! That's what it's all about, amen brother.
The right to offend and the right to be offended are absolutely integral to an honest conversation. You can fundamentally disagree with each other and be as emotional as you want, as long as everyone has enough space to feel what they want to feel and have the maturity to walk away without trying to shut down the other's position. And Slayer aren't that bad really. Would rather listen to them than Linkin Park any day.
@@bumblefluff79 allow me to pile on. They have maybe five songs and if you’ve heard them, you’ve heard them all. Also Kerry King is not great.
@@bumblefluff79 Well said. I think it’s time to revisit LP again. 😬
Jeff Hanneman said " people mistake exposure for glorification. We tell the world what people do to each other. They should be offended, but not by us".
Yep. When I first heard this song about 35 years ago or so I was horrified by it, but when I really delved into the lyrics I realized they weren't glorifying it at all. "Sadistic butcher of demise," is not glorification.
Kerry King also trolled ""Yeah, 'Slayer are Nazis, fascists, Communists' - all that fun shit. And of course we got the most flak for it in Germany." )
Jeff Hanneman R.I.P.
If we ignore history, we are doomed to repeat it. They are not glorifying the events or person but reminding us just how twisted and evil that a human can be.
They should have retired when Jeff died. Kerry is an arrogant dullard. He drove Lombardo away . I hope they don't do their " reunion " tour and Kerry just does his arrogant dogshit project and fades away.
The thing is.... I don't think this song is written from the killer's perspective. It's literally just descriptions of what he did. And if that upsets you, good. It should.
“Music is a reflection of society, we just reflect the darker side of it”
(Quote from Tom Araya of Slayer)
Music can and does change societes pushing them in certain directions.
'This pisses me off!' The most perfect response. Mission accomplished.
The pianist seems to be taken hostage by the metalhead 😃
He can never leave! 😂
Favorite comment so far 😂
I always listen for Morse code on the piano.
please stay awhile, i won't keep you long, i'll keep you forever.
He really didnt like the lyrics
I really appreciated the honest reaction.
i think it is quite boring
He was dumb. No, perhaps not that-just, unthinking. "About Not sees means pro not sees" bs.
Or more probably just generally unfamiliar with how this music works.
I love the fact that you guys can discuss the song from such different perspectives. Wish we as a society were more open to difficult topics.
Thank you 🤘
This is the second best comment 🎉
As a massive Slayer Fan and a massive Judson fan, it was a little hard hearing his anger toward the lyrics. I can understand his Anger, totally understandable and justified critisim. Alot of History used to be told through songs, and Slayers way of that isnt for everyone. I Love Judson and this Great channel! (and you to Richard!).
How Hanneman wrote the lyrics was how he expressed his intake of the info he took in. How brutal it was written at that time, the books he was reading. As we went through the 20th century, our language is continually being softened. He was reading some hard literature.
I agree with the man to some extent. Music awesome. Lyrics horrible. Morally unjustifiable.
😆
This song is bittersweet for me. I lost most of my family in the holocaust, but I also love the song. Though it's difficult to listen to lyrically; I see it as educational. I don't feel as though it glorifies these atrocities; or that person whose name I won't speak. They're recounting real life events and a real life evil monster.
It's a message; a retelling of the worst of humanity. This really happened and it's important to be reminded because if we don't learn from history, we're doomed to repeat it. It should be painful and angry; that's representative of the blatant, gruesome suffering of that time, and in that place. Monsters are real, and they walk among us. Before the holocaust, that guy was just walking around.
I think the discrepancy is in age and wisdom. The younger generation currently in school should hear this (not elementary of course) but it's not a subject that should be squashed or overlooked. A lot of real history is taught in a watered down way and that's wrong. The song paints a bleak picture of the world because that was (and often currently is) very bleak and dark. It's awareness to me and yeah, it makes me angry, but that's the point. Be angry, and get off your ass and actively do the opposite. Make the world a better place so we never experience these despicable, shameful horrors of our past in our present and future. You can't sugarcoat something like this.
I’m truly sorry to read that your family went through that. Respect to you and your loved ones.
Sometimes a song is just another form of education. Those who forget history are doomed to repeat it.
Thank you for your honest reaction. Good or bad does not matter. What matters is that 'now you know' ;)
If you just look at Hanneman and this one song you could get away with it. But if you look at his decades of career: he always had some excuse for just bringing up the first reich to the point that I don't buy it he just had a 'fascination with german history' When the guy literally collected Nazi Medals, couldn't shut up about Nazi Germany, one of the most famous Slayer logos is taken straight out of Nazi propaganda, always displayed Nazi logos on his guitars (Just not the actual swastika but the intention was the same) and writes Angel of Death.
Sorry I never bought it was just shock value, it was very clear glorification just like Judson said. Metalheads just don't want to hear about how not just one but *several* of the most iconic 80s bands were basically always glorifying Nazis and that's how you later got Burzum and then actual Nazis in Black Metal or Phil Anselmo screaming 'WHITE POWER!' on a live show, etc.
Until people stop lying to themselves and attribute it to just teenage angst and shock value nobody should respect metalheads because they're either Nazis themselves or too stupid to self police their own scene
@@dimitriid You are free to have an opinion.. does not make it correct.
Facts do not care about your feelings.
@@dimitriid he also write "SS-3" song about Reinhard Heydrich :P
@@uoabigaillevey lmao what kinda kid brings up that cringe catch phrase?
Ultimately its Jeff's word against his actions. Based on his choices in words, I dont think he was a Nazi, but he definitely had a bit of an unnecessary fascination with it.
@@maeschder Cringe catch phrase? Do #facts offend you?
Anyone is free to have any interest they want without being judged for that interest. Their actions are what should be judged.
Too many people want to abolish history.. especially history they are uncomfortable with. My belief is that all history should be preserved.. the good.. the bad.. and the ugly. From all perspectives possible.
Through such knowledge and study one can gain the most understanding of the reality of the time in question.. and how it impacted the times since.. and how to avoid the negatives should they arise again.
Speaking specifically of the Nazi's, one should keep the history from the perspective of a Nazi themselves, of a Jewish concentration camp victim, of an American soldier invading Germany in a ground assault, etc. Each has merit when considering the topic at hand.
"Lest we forget.."
SLAYERRRRRRRR!!!!
Man, on a surface level Judson's reaction is fully correct. To be revulsed by the lyrics is a natural reaction, it is human. Love the discussion.
Unfortunately, all of his criticisms are very surface level. It is quite surprising to me
Of course. But as Richard says repeatedly - this is extreme music. It's partly designed to be shocking. Judson's reaction is exactly what Slayer were going for...
After we recorded this video, I was curious if Judson was on to something about the lyrics. I learned that Jeff Hanneman actually wrote the lyrics and not Tom Araya. Hanneman reportedly had an interest in Nazi history and even collected Nazi medals. In a 1987 interview with NME Magazine, he was quoted as saying:
“I feel you should be able to write about whatever you want. Angel of Death is like a history lesson.”
Turns out, these lyrics caused MASSIVE controversy. The album’s release was even delayed because Columbia Records refused to distribute it.
I have been listening to metal for the majority of my life and I guess I’ve grown numb to the fact that some of the subject matter can be offensive and off putting to others. It doesn’t make me love it any less, but I also tend to forget that I’m showing this music to my friend that has never heard these songs.
I will still continue to bring extremity to Judson’s ears, but I’ll be less surprised the next time he finds something offensive. I hope y’all enjoyed this one.
-Richard
**If you or someone you know is struggling with substance abuse and they’re ready to get help, contact us via email.**
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"It's the sickest, most vile filth imaginable!" - Normie
"Yeah, isn't it awesome?!" - Metalhead
@@steezydan8543 😂 Accurate
It is funny how song lyrics can be controversial but Steven Spielberg directing Schindlers list or someone writing a history book on these atrocities isn't.
The topic is tough and especially as a German, whose grandparents at least did not fight against that regime and so still live with the burden or task to never allow to happen this again. As a metalhead i really understand Judson's comment, great music, but tough topic. So, i am split in two, great music, but a topic hitting in your stomach. It is not clear by the lyrics, whether they adorse the angel of death or are against it. On the other side, Slayer were young at that time and sometimes at that age, you cannot judge where things might go, like unwanted fans cheering at you.
@@IIChristisKingII I guess song lyrics cannot fully display the context and also intentions of the writer.
But it does have an underlying meaning, and it is a condemnation of the worst in humanity, and also it brought awareness of the horrors of the monsters that did the worst things to many people. I would like to hear why someone actually things this is a glorification of the holocaust, because personally I never did
Same. I didn’t view it as a glorification.
Whatever is it, its Slaaayer maaan ,poetic 😂
Saved me typing that, ty!
Seeing Judson upset is as disturbing as seeing Mr. Rogers cursing and kicking kids!🤣🤣
I love your comment man 🤘🤘🤘🤘🤘🤘🤘🤘
Man, watching Judson's body language shift throughout the song was telling. Loved the discussion you guys put on every single time!
I loved this episode, there are several reaction channels nowadays that do nothing more than just listen to the music and make faces... you guys discuss what you liked, what you didn't like and point out the reasons, that's the coolest thing to raise healthy discussions between different points of view.
I love how you guys may have different perspectives on something and still have such a meaningful, fun and respectful conversation. Only but R E S P E C T to both of you!
If you don’t learn from history your bound to repeat it. We ignore history at our own peril
Absolutely
Great to see an intelligent honest reaction
One of the best metal song of all time .
This song is a warning. Tells story that not a lot of people knows it. Respect.
It's so refreshing to hear a difference of opinions where both sides can actually speak and listen to each other!
Best video so far by you guys: open, honest and passionate. Well done. I bought Reign in Blood the day it came out here in Ireland way back in the dark ages. I was always fascinated with WWII, especially the war in Europe as I had relatives who fought and died in it. This song was HUGELY controversial when it came out, people here were shouting for it to be banned etc etc. For me , I loved the song , the musicianship, the power and I was fascinated by the subject matter...in all its awfulness. I went out , bought a book on Mengele , read Richard Evans' Trilogy on The Third R&ich...and tired to educate myself as much as I could on the subject matter. There is not right or wrong here to my mind, Slayer made thousands and thousands of young people educate themselves to the horrors that human beings are capable of ..the fact it is not a Itzhak Perlman solo violin piece honoring the dead of that wretched place is irrelevant. It outlines the atrocities and horrors of Auschwitz Birkenau. And it does it well. But I gotta give top marks to Judson...I get where you are coming from. I just disagree with you thats all. Respect to you both and keep up the great work...
Thank you so much. I love the discussion
Superb comment, from a fellow Irish man!! This channel has really taken a leap upwards in positive estimation off the back of this episode. Well done, maith thù!! (Patrick, Galway)
It's awesome to see such a genuine reaction to uncomfortable subject matter like this. There is nothing wrong with his perspective at all, same for Richard!
It's explains the attoricity committed and for us not to forget or repeat mistakes
One of the GREATEST Thrash Metal songs off one of the GREATEST Thrash Metal albums!!! Also, Richard Effigy of the Forgotten is one of the best death metal albums of all time...dig the shirt.... Good discussion fellers about the music
86/87 was when the Big 4 became the Big 4. Four albums that were the perfect distillation of what they had all been building towards for the last 5 years. Almost no production, no mainstream influence, just raw talent and energy.
nice suffocation t shirt. effigy of the forgotten is such an incredible album!!!
Pierced From Within
🤘
Despise The Sun EP (with Dave Culross on drums strangely enough, must be why they broke up if Mike Smith was out, at the time), is the best short and sweet DM experience to me, especially since Suffocation always had that little hint of thrash to it, the 5th and final song on it, forgot the title just now, which is an old song from their first release, on a 7 inch from 1990, to me is possibly the best DM song ever. I'm more into thrash, so just 5 epic songs like this is enough for me when it comes to DM, typically, especially when it's such a AAA+ release, from 1998. Thankfully they reformed 7 years later!
Thank you Judson for your opinion. I can definitely see what you are trying to convey and appreciate what you have to say. What you did was remind me to think about the subject matter and be willing to discuss with those who are offended as to why they feel that way. The first time I heard Slayer was '86/'87 and, took me a while to warm up to them and become one of my favorite bands. The subject matter of their songs can be a challenge and thanks for reminding me, especially since I have a 5 year old daughter.
Keep up the good work and thanks to both of you for entertaining me and pointing out there is great music in METAL!
It's interesting, as soon as I saw the song title, I knew Judson would have a fit. What I think he is not taking into consideration are the market forces that were present at the time that this was written. Slayer had recently emerged as a force in this new genre of Metal. There was a motivation to push boundaries, playing faster, more chanotically, more aggressively, to outdo their last release, and in some ways they became known for that, for making music that would offend the sensibilities of those not committed to the genre and the style of music. In this sense, culturally, Slayer was an acid test for metalheads back in the day. Slayer's hallmark was the pure aggression and violence that their music represented, and "if it offends you, then fuck your sensibilities" kind of thing. Also keep in mind that this was released in the time of the PMRC and their attempts to put warning labels on certain types of music (rap and metal specifically), having such a label became a badge of honor. The horror show comparison was apt. For Judson's sake, in terms of comparing the "art" of Slayer to the fine arts world, it would be apt to compare Slayer's music to the work of Joel Peter Witkin or Francis Bacon, who also dealt with darker, sometimes offensive subjects. Beauty is not the sole purpose of Art. The purpose of Art is to provoke an emotional reaction, and sometimes the emotion that is provoked is one of disquiet and upset.
Well said. I am enjoying the discussion on this topic. So many viewpoints and opinions and for the most part, it’s been very civil.
Spot on ! Reign in Blood changed Metal forever
Makes me wonder if the level of pissed off would be different if Judson was subjected to much later Slayer song called Unit 731.
Hey man that was epic truly entertaining 😂😂😂😂😂😂😂
I have never heard that drum roll without getting chills
Oh I've been waiting for this day 🤘💚
One of the best Slayer songs. The breakdown destroys all.
great honest reaction, loved it
If you want something a bit off the wall in the hyper-fast tech death realm, y'all should check out Ophidian I and their song "Diamonds".
Very strange, Icelandic band. Of the top tech death bands, I find they have the least rigid sound, their music is insanely original.
Great reaction!Love the discussion afterwards!
What pisses me off is that the bastard was never caught and that so many Nazis were never held accountable for their crimes. Anyway, to this day such people do what they want and no one will punish them for it. That's why when I listen to this song, I have red spots in front of my eyes.
Slayer working as intended!! FUCKING SLAYER, BROS!!!!
Glory of Love and Angel of Death. Two 80s classics in one video.
Great reaction
Sometimes, it's not about remembering it, more than it is that we never forget it
Let me put it to you this way… had it not been for Slayer I might not have learned about Mengele because that part of WWII history was glossed over and sanitized when I was in school. A lot of teachers didn’t want to touch it, but the Punk and Metal bands I listened to did. Just like Iron Maiden, they wrote about it and it piqued my curiosity. They weren’t saying they were for it, they were just presenting a side of history that doesn’t always get notice or attention because it is so offensive. That’s just part of the Punk ethos that Slayer embraced. Jeff Hanneman himself was a student of WWII history because his dad, who he was very close to, was a soldier serving in Germany at the time these actual events took place and he had a lot of artifacts that he brought with him. They fascinated Jeff when he was a kid and it caused him to learn more about what happened. The song isn’t glorifying it, it’s just presenting it as a matter of fact. It’s up to us to decide how we feel because he didn’t want to be preachy about.
Regarding Mengele himself, Jeff said “We know he was a bad man and what he did was horrible, why do you need for me to have to say that outright or that it was wrong? We already know that.” Also, there are some glimpses of condemnation in the lyrics that aren’t always picked up on… the opening line of the song itself could be directed at Mengele himself as a punishment for his crimes in a Karmic sense. A sort of poetic justice. I also think people forget that in the mid 80s when this song was made there were a lot of stories about Mengele escaping the Nuremberg Trials and living in Argentina and still being alive at the time. The line of the song “Rancid Angel of Death… flying free” was put in there as a reminder the guy could still be out there, but it was also a condemnation of Mengele. One of the meanings of the word rancid is: distinctly unpleasant or foul; offensive. I remember a lot of news coverage about escaped Nazis officers being found and arrested and sent back to Germany to stand trial… in the 80s and 90s this was still happening. Hell, we still have some WWII vets still alive today, though they’re in their late 90s if not 100 years old now. You guys are probably too young to remember that, but even I as a 12 year old in 1986 was fascinated by those news stories. Every time it happened it was huge. We’re a lot farther away from 1945 now than we were in 1986 so it hasn’t happened in a long time.
Love the song, but also love his reaction.
Amazing reaction.
The folding of the arms that shack of the head. I thought “Ruh roh, he’s mad, and we’re going to hear about it “ Loved this discussion
This album just slaps so damn hard.
Preach
The feel good song of the summer!
😂
This song is a history lesson . Enough said !!
Great reaction, very passionate!
He groovin' on the breakdown 😂
Art reflects reality. An artist should know this.
Also, I enjoyed the conversation.
Great measures!
I'm not familiar with the Black Dahlia Murder song you mentioned. But, based on how you described it, my hunch is that it's about Gilles de Rais. Maybe I'm wrong.
Celtic Frost has a song about him - "Into the Crypts of Rays." Macabre has a song about him, too - "The Black Knight." I'm sure there are others.
Yup that is who the black dahlia song is about. It has a great opening riff and an amazing melodic solo towards the end.
When Judson got his thoughts together i think he made a good point.
I love heavy metal so much
I love the song because I love history and metal. When they are put together, it’s even better. Slayer also did song about Unit 731 from WW2. The Japanese unit did all kinds of horrific experiments on people like the Nazis. They also wrote a song from the POV of a terrorist.
Huge Mike Patton fan, you consider reacting to "The Real Thing" by Faith No More?
This reaction is proof you do honest work here, gentlemen. Mike is considered a genius to some people and love to hear your take on some of his work.
Metal is anger, anger towards humanity, anger towards yourself, and anger that everyone walks around not talking about things that are important. Metals wants to talk about the hard and difficult gruesome realities everyone ignores. They put it in your face so you can’t ignore it when you hear it. Because society will always spiral into chaos because we ignore the things we shouldn’t ignore, because we don’t like to think about it. Metal confronts it. That’s why I love it.
I already liked it,just for the intro 🤘🙂🎶
First time I see Judson so excited!
give ya man some Infant Annihilator 😳
😂
I love his reaction and commentary about the song, he is totally right, Judson is probably a trained musician and he understand art fundamentals in any area (painting, poetry etc) probably, but this is no high art, Slayer members wrote this in their early 20s, while drinking beer and watching a Nazi documentary tv show on History channel and after learning about Mengele they said at unison probably " dude , we have to make a song about him" and thats it, the song is a time capsule in the life of Slayer, is has no ulterior motives or anything else. Metal is really simple and dumb in general and there is not much beyond being fast ,loud and aggresive. thanks for the video.
so good, i rate this discussion
Slayer pushed the envelope showing darkest side of humanity!
Great vid, not that I want judson pissed off lol, but this is a good platform for discussing the inner workings of metal music
Jeff Hanneman wasn't glorifying the Nazis, He was telling how evil humans can be towards one another!. The same, is with his many history lessons put to his fucking awesome music!.
I mean this is such basic stuff. It’s the most fundamental thing that music does, why would it be confusing.
I first heard Angel of Death before learning about WW2 in school. When reading and listening to the lyrics, I remember imagining a sci fi / fantasy setting where an alien race called the Aryan race came from the skies to invade, torture, and obliterate a Mordor-like place.
I think the song and the band did exactly what it was intended and that was to Piss someone off!! It’s SLAYER for crying out loud! Me and my brother listened to this album repeatedly when it came out until we knew all the lyrics
This was great
i want this bro made a cover of angel of death on his piano. i would pay him 🙏
I just came to say that Slayer's re reunited concert is coming this year so it'd be the opportunity for Judson to meet them 🤘
Judson is completely warranted at his assessment. This has been an objection to shit like this since it came out, it's not a new conversation. Judson is an adult with a heart and a soul and he drew a line, that's how art and taste and creativity works.
I loved the passion and honesty of this reaction!
As others have mentioned, I think the point was to bring a deeper awareness to how cruel humans can be to one another. Most of us have heard of the holocaust, but may not know just how bad it was. I myself knew so many people died, but not how they died. They don't teach that at school. I think they should, especially for the younger generations now who don't know how good they have it nowadays. But also to be aware of some not-so-nice people out there . . . half the time they've got their heads locked onto the goddamn phones and don't know what their surroundings are (off on a tangent, sorry!)
Being an illustrator and writer myself, I understand Judson's point about perhaps a 'lack' of creativity. I think that was the point. Be blunt, and hard about it. Cold hard truth is needed sometimes. Also, maybe the point was also that how can a 'normal' person ever relate to such evil because the idea of murdering others in such horrific ways is so alien to most of us . . . do we really want to get into such minds? Anyway, great reaction, as always!
MILLIONS LAID OUT IN THEIR, CROWDED TOMBS!!
I appreciate jordin's take on this
May I suggest Zombie eaters , or land of sunshine:) great video as always !
This is why I watch you guys, honest opinions and reaction. Even though we consider something a masterpiece as a metalhead, someone just might not. For example I played Sepultura - Roots Bloody Roots to my colleagues once and they looked at me like I was schizophrenic. Then I realized, we hear metal differently. I've been exposed to it since childhood I see nothing wrong with it. I considered black metal too much once but today it's one of my favorite metal genres. Shit, I lost my train of though... point is these guys are bros
Metal doesn't sugar coat subjects. I absolutely love this album the darkest side of our humanity. I can sleep to this album.
This was a time before internet and people didn't have deep access to history as a normal. Different time.
I think this gets lost in the discussion at times too. I was three months old when this album was released. I have no idea how the cultural and societal climate was when it came out.
slayer is my favorite christian rock band
The subject matter is typical of Slayer's cataloge. That's why I love Slayer!!
GWAR!!!!!!! This makes me want to experience GWAR. This is one of the best reasons.
I love his paino as much as I love metal. Music knows no boundaries for me.
1986. RIP Jeff
Wahhh Judson. Wise up
I see this song along the lines of less of a glorification of who he was and what he's done and more as a reminder. We all hear "Those who forget the past are doomed to repeat it"
I'm a metalhead who likes Slayer, but I agree completely with Judson. This disturbs me too.
Literarily, I think the most interesting line in the song is "just a matter of time, 'til you rip yourselves apart" - it sounds like he's talking about the Nazi regime itself.
9:54 😂 Love Judson haha.
It's only a song. Just like a book or a film.
yes…. they played a song and said words…. that’s it.
Love the face pulling in this one 😂
Best T-shirt print ever . . . .
I appreciate Judson’s multiple Jim Halpert-esque “wtf is this” looks at the camera during the song 😂
For real though, the argument that this type of music attempts to push boundaries and provoke a meaningful reaction is incredibly misguided, to me. If this song was condemning these events, why would they expect it to elicit a pissed off reaction, like you say their intentions are. To me, that is only the result because the message in these descriptions is neutral at best - which you really shouldn’t be about this subject matter.
Judson’s “painting of swastikas” comparison was spot on imo.
If you want to portray the villain from their perspective, make the portrayal human, find an ounce of relatability and nuance, instead of solely focusing on the most offensive thing about them just to piss people off? And don’t make it about a genocide of people whose children are still alive, ffs.
I just don’t see the point, but i guess it’s fine that i’m not the audience for extreme metal🤷🏻
Did you really think Judson was gonna go for this though?
Sorry for the rant, i was an English lit major, and this kinda shit is a huge pet peeve of mine.
In all honesty, the lyrics being so thought provoking was nowhere near my radar. Like I referenced in the pinned comment, I’m so desensitized to metal lyrics that I sometimes forget that I’m showing these songs to someone that hasn’t heard them before.
I was just on the phone with Judson about this, and you’re thinking is along the same lines as his.
I think people that are upset with his reaction aren’t fully considering that his initial feeling was real and authentic. It’s his opinion. It’s why we make these videos. People don’t have to agree with it and they can tell him he’s wrong, but we’re also not going to give some disingenuous take on the art so we don’t upset anyone.
@@Greatmeasures You had to talk it over again because your discussion/his take is getting a lot of people outta their seats?😂
Considering it seemed to matter a fair deal to Judson, i think it’s great you took the time to talk honestly about what you both get from this type of music instead of quickly dismissing it to focus on something else, just because you disagree. It’s quite reasonable that you would have different viewpoints given your many years of different musical interests, like you being desensitized.
I think you are absolutely going the right way about this for a reaction channel - with what you are saying in your pinned comments too - keep it up!
@@Olivia_Neumann thank you so much. You’ve been one of our biggest supporters for a long time and we appreciate you for it.
@@Greatmeasures Oh don’t mention it, just remember me in your will 😂
@@Olivia_Neumann I’ll add you, but I’m afraid you’ll be sorely disappointed. 😂
damn judson just let it all out
Do Dead Skin Mask next. It's about Ed Gein who wore skin suits and had ears as pull rings for window shades. Silence of the lambs and Texas chainsaw massacre was also based on Ed Gein.
History is BRUTAL...this song tells a history lesson, we can not change history...these forbidden experiments did advance Medical knowledge by 100 years. if some good can come out of tragedy, it is a small step towards mankind's future
Should do pre-Nymphetamine era Cradle of Filth