@@asbcustom Semi retired now, but started off my career 55 years ago in consumer electronics. Then marine and ham radio repairs, specialising in board repairs (burnt up tracks holes etc). Nothing to the same level of expertise that continues to astound me in every one of your videos ! Please keep them coming.. Regards Alan, ham call GI0OTC
Amazing! I can't even begin to live up to your undeserved compliment, but I sincerely appreciate it! I'm getting close to a solution for this motor coil, stay tuned.
I used to be an electric motor winder for about 20 years. At that time we were sinking the motors in some type of varnish or resin. After that, we would put the motors to dry in a ventilated oven for a few hours. We also used some heat-resistant PVC film for the sides of the coils. That kind of film comes off the coils very easily after the varnish/resin dries. I hope this helps.
I may have worked on some of your motors. :) Based on the smell of some of the burned up ones I've been around, I always wondered if the dipping resin wasn't phenolic based? The PVC film is good information, I'll look into that. Thanks for your comments.
Hello Peter! Yasou! Very delicate work! Before winding the coil, I suggest lubricating the plastic walls of the frame, top and bottom, and the core for winding! That is, lubricate with a very thin layer of white silicone-Teflon grease, which is used to lubricate plastic gears! I'm sure you're familiar with it, it's thick and doesn't run! After the frame is filled with wire, saturate it with radio varnish - enamel! (in Russia it is called tsapon varnish!) After a few hours, when the varnish has hardened, disassembling the frame will be easier, since the outermost turns of the wire will not stick to the frame, thanks to the lubricant, and the coil will not fall apart when removed! Next, the surface turns of the coil will need to be wiped of grease and completely soaked!✋ Здравствуй, Питер! Yasou! Очень тонкая работа! Предлагаю перед намоткой катушки, смазывать пластмассовые стенки каркаса, верх низ и сердечник для намотки! То есть смазывать очень тонким слоем силиконовой - тефлоновой смазкой белого цвета, которая применяется для смазки пластмассовых шестерёнок! Уверен, что ты знаком с ней, она густая и не растекается! После того, как каркас будет заполнен проводом, пропитать его радио лаком - эмалью! (в России его называют цапон лак!) Через несколько часов, когда лак застынет, разборка каркаса облегчится, так как крайний витки провода, не пристанут к каркасу, благодаря смазки и катушка не развалится при извлечении! Далее, поверхностные витки катушки, нужно будет протереть от смазки и пропитать её окончательно!✋
Yasou Vadim and Христос воскресе! I didn't show it in the video but I absolutely used many different release agents (grease). The problem was the wire interlocking with the 3D printed extrusion layers mechanically. I plan to try some, as another viewer suggested, in three parts, leaving the center section inside the coil. This will obviously work, I just need to decide if I'm okay with it aesthetically. ll the best to you and yours!
@@asbcustom Воистину Воскресе!.... Alitos Anesti!🙏 Yes, Peter! Dividing it into three parts will be even better! You can make the central axis have a flat base and push the coil out of the other half, in the form of a medical syringe plunger! In general, you need to experiment!👍
Moldmaking was not your life's path then I take it :) I received your tape yesterday, by the way. I hope to have some time next weekend, it should be a fun little project.
Have you try to wrap the core with baking paper? The second solution that cames into my mind is to make a small verical cuts on the core edges ( to allow core mold to wigle) and made a small holes and soope shaped tooth's between core and sexond mold. It will expand core by small ammount after screwing and automatically shrink it after unscrewing.
Wrapping isn't feasible on this, it's just too small. The vertical cuts are a thought, they could be incorporated into the 3D print. Right now my best results have been to just leave the core integrated with the coil. It doesn't hurt a thing and reduces a lot of fussing. I'm having very consistent results with that method. Thank you for comments, I'll think about the slots.
@@asbcustom you actually want a 4 part mold. 3 pieces make up 1 side while the other side, has a tapered peg as a keystone holding the other 3 together. That way once you wind the coil, you remove the keystone allowing the other 3 pieces to fall away. If you have trouble with the varnish adhering to the plastic, add a strip of scotch tape before winding the coil. This will help hold the 4 mold pieces together pre winding. PS. on larger coils they use a rod as the keystone, so they can wind many coils at once.
This is correct, and essentially what I did with the two-pieces. The keystone was the inner profile that was slightly larger and expanded the outer profile, but not enough to overcome the interlocking effect. This is solved by printing the parts standing up so the layers run the same direction as release (perpendicular to how they were in the video). A couple of viewers suggested this at about the time I considered it, the test coil is in the oven as I type. I also think the break-away version will work if I use a more brittle filament, the PLA hung on too well and just twisted a little, but it is promising.
One thought, perhaps using dissolvable filament would be the best bet? Then for the adhesive, maybe use one of the locktite products as they cure in the absence of air. Just a couple ideas.
I'll have to look into dissolvable filament, I had no idea it exists, thanks! The anaerobic adhesive is desirable, I just need to find one that won't affect the wire insulation. A little research is needed.
Very familiar with PVA, the viscosity is too high to wick out, and the same drying problems exist. The Superglue will dissolve the PLA then? That might be something to consider, I didn't notice any breakdown of the filament, I'll test it out. Thanks.
In fact yes, that's exactly what happens. I have a test of that drying now, using the 3 piece mold idea also posted by a viewer. Thank you for watching and posting your ideas.
Cool vid. On my Tascam i have one coil that was damaged. I managed to get a circuit by splicing into the coil but only manage about 5 ohm and the other 3 are at 14 ohm. Funny thing is the deck runs just fine, even with the 1 coil at a different resistance. Is that because the other 3 keep the capstan in sync? There is no speed drift and it keeps dead on 3000khz when i run a tape. Im leaving it be for now, but the home made coil idea has my diy senses tingling. :)
@@asbcustom It seemed OK. I dont have a good test tape (£10/ bucks ebay tone tape) so both the mkii show .09 or .10 i think. But my recordings from source sound really good. Both hold pitch, spot on. If i remember right, when i first got the deck it would not spin up sometimes, and thats when i found the severed copper to the coil. Seems OK now since i tapped into the coil. I was surprised it ran so smooth. 3 x 14 ohm coils may support the one thats 5ohm. I think they run in pairs though, i remember probing an ic somewhere and got 28 ohm & 20ohm
If you're willing, and once I get this all sorted, I'd like to send a new coil that you could do a before and after W&F test against your 5Ω one. This would be very valuable information to see tested properly.
@@asbcustom Im always up for a bit of experimentation in the name of science. You are saying pull off the 5ohm repaired coil and pop on a replacement running at 14-15 ohm? One you made? That would be interesting indeed. You think the 5 ohm runs a bit rich compared to the 14ohm? It would be interesting to see if it makes any difference. W/F would occur if there was a disturbance in the speed on a micro level? One that was undetected by the WFGUI software?
Not the speed so much, that can be compensated for. I think the discontinuity in the magnetic field would destabilize the flutter more than anything else. Since you have a W&F tape already, I think it would be beneficial to do a before and after coil change out test, in as controlled conditions as possible. It doesn't even matter if the W&F tape is accurate, this is a simple comparison, and if the testing conditions are as similar as possible, would have merit.
It would, yes, but require yet another set of molds to manufacture for the wax pour and release. I am trying to do it in a single operation, if possible. Thank you for your comment!
I thought I was patient and careful in my work. BUT this takes it to a whole new level, well done !
Thanks Alan! What kind of work do you do?
@@asbcustom Semi retired now, but started off my career 55 years ago in consumer electronics. Then marine and ham radio repairs, specialising in board repairs (burnt up tracks holes etc). Nothing to the same level of expertise that continues to astound me in every one of your videos ! Please keep them coming.. Regards Alan, ham call GI0OTC
Amazing! I can't even begin to live up to your undeserved compliment, but I sincerely appreciate it! I'm getting close to a solution for this motor coil, stay tuned.
I used to be an electric motor winder for about 20 years. At that time we were sinking the motors in some type of varnish or resin. After that, we would put the motors to dry in a ventilated oven for a few hours. We also used some heat-resistant PVC film for the sides of the coils. That kind of film comes off the coils very easily after the varnish/resin dries. I hope this helps.
I may have worked on some of your motors. :) Based on the smell of some of the burned up ones I've been around, I always wondered if the dipping resin wasn't phenolic based? The PVC film is good information, I'll look into that. Thanks for your comments.
@@asbcustom unless you are located in Romania, there's very little chance you ever touched my ">30 KW motors lol. Keep up the good work!
Not in Romania, no, but I have several Romanian friends, splendid people all, and quite brilliant!
Hello Peter! Yasou! Very delicate work! Before winding the coil, I suggest lubricating the plastic walls of the frame, top and bottom, and the core for winding! That is, lubricate with a very thin layer of white silicone-Teflon grease, which is used to lubricate plastic gears! I'm sure you're familiar with it, it's thick and doesn't run! After the frame is filled with wire, saturate it with radio varnish - enamel! (in Russia it is called tsapon varnish!) After a few hours, when the varnish has hardened, disassembling the frame will be easier, since the outermost turns of the wire will not stick to the frame, thanks to the lubricant, and the coil will not fall apart when removed! Next, the surface turns of the coil will need to be wiped of grease and completely soaked!✋
Здравствуй, Питер! Yasou! Очень тонкая работа! Предлагаю перед намоткой катушки, смазывать пластмассовые стенки каркаса, верх низ и сердечник для намотки! То есть смазывать очень тонким слоем силиконовой - тефлоновой смазкой белого цвета, которая применяется для смазки пластмассовых шестерёнок! Уверен, что ты знаком с ней, она густая и не растекается! После того, как каркас будет заполнен проводом, пропитать его радио лаком - эмалью! (в России его называют цапон лак!) Через несколько часов, когда лак застынет, разборка каркаса облегчится, так как крайний витки провода, не пристанут к каркасу, благодаря смазки и катушка не развалится при извлечении! Далее, поверхностные витки катушки, нужно будет протереть от смазки и пропитать её окончательно!✋
Yasou Vadim and Христос воскресе!
I didn't show it in the video but I absolutely used many different release agents (grease). The problem was the wire interlocking with the 3D printed extrusion layers mechanically. I plan to try some, as another viewer suggested, in three parts, leaving the center section inside the coil. This will obviously work, I just need to decide if I'm okay with it aesthetically.
ll the best to you and yours!
@@asbcustom Воистину Воскресе!.... Alitos Anesti!🙏
Yes, Peter! Dividing it into three parts will be even better! You can make the central axis have a flat base and push the coil out of the other half, in the form of a medical syringe plunger! In general, you need to experiment!👍
Working on it, stay tuned.
I think every part of this requires more patience than I've ever had at one time before.
Moldmaking was not your life's path then I take it :)
I received your tape yesterday, by the way. I hope to have some time next weekend, it should be a fun little project.
на 27:20 if you make hooks at the ends of the coil wires, you can dip the coil in glue and then hang the coil to dry
sir, thanks for the video
That will work yes, I just need to get a working coil first. Thanks for watching.
Have you try to wrap the core with baking paper?
The second solution that cames into my mind is to make a small verical cuts on the core edges ( to allow core mold to wigle) and made a small holes and soope shaped tooth's between core and sexond mold. It will expand core by small ammount after screwing and automatically shrink it after unscrewing.
Wrapping isn't feasible on this, it's just too small. The vertical cuts are a thought, they could be incorporated into the 3D print. Right now my best results have been to just leave the core integrated with the coil. It doesn't hurt a thing and reduces a lot of fussing. I'm having very consistent results with that method. Thank you for comments, I'll think about the slots.
What if you make a three-part form, and simply leave the triangle-shaped center part inside the coil and install it like that?
That is actually a great idea. I was trying the break-away solution but three parts are better. Thank you.
@@asbcustom You are welcome. I'm glad if I helped.
It's printing now.
@@asbcustom you actually want a 4 part mold. 3 pieces make up 1 side while the other side, has a tapered peg as a keystone holding the other 3 together. That way once you wind the coil, you remove the keystone allowing the other 3 pieces to fall away. If you have trouble with the varnish adhering to the plastic, add a strip of scotch tape before winding the coil. This will help hold the 4 mold pieces together pre winding.
PS. on larger coils they use a rod as the keystone, so they can wind many coils at once.
This is correct, and essentially what I did with the two-pieces. The keystone was the inner profile that was slightly larger and expanded the outer profile, but not enough to overcome the interlocking effect. This is solved by printing the parts standing up so the layers run the same direction as release (perpendicular to how they were in the video). A couple of viewers suggested this at about the time I considered it, the test coil is in the oven as I type. I also think the break-away version will work if I use a more brittle filament, the PLA hung on too well and just twisted a little, but it is promising.
One thought, perhaps using dissolvable filament would be the best bet? Then for the adhesive, maybe use one of the locktite products as they cure in the absence of air. Just a couple ideas.
I'll have to look into dissolvable filament, I had no idea it exists, thanks! The anaerobic adhesive is desirable, I just need to find one that won't affect the wire insulation. A little research is needed.
You can try PVA plastic, it is water-soluble. Also, superglue will rapidly cure in water while the mold dissolves.
Very familiar with PVA, the viscosity is too high to wick out, and the same drying problems exist.
The Superglue will dissolve the PLA then? That might be something to consider, I didn't notice any breakdown of the filament, I'll test it out. Thanks.
What if you print the triangle standing, not flat on the surfsce, so the layer lines wouldn't be parallel to the wire, but perpendicular?
In fact yes, that's exactly what happens. I have a test of that drying now, using the 3 piece mold idea also posted by a viewer. Thank you for watching and posting your ideas.
I have seen coils turned into an oil residue! Just like tape belts : (
Is printing it on its side not a viable solution? Than the lines are square to the windings
Yes, I have a test of that in the works just now. Thanks for your post!
Cool vid. On my Tascam i have one coil that was damaged. I managed to get a circuit by splicing into the coil but only manage about 5 ohm and the other 3 are at 14 ohm. Funny thing is the deck runs just fine, even with the 1 coil at a different resistance. Is that because the other 3 keep the capstan in sync? There is no speed drift and it keeps dead on 3000khz when i run a tape. Im leaving it be for now, but the home made coil idea has my diy senses tingling. :)
I remember your mentioning it Rick. How is the W&F following the repair?
@@asbcustom It seemed OK. I dont have a good test tape (£10/ bucks ebay tone tape) so both the mkii show .09 or .10 i think. But my recordings from source sound really good. Both hold pitch, spot on. If i remember right, when i first got the deck it would not spin up sometimes, and thats when i found the severed copper to the coil. Seems OK now since i tapped into the coil. I was surprised it ran so smooth. 3 x 14 ohm coils may support the one thats 5ohm. I think they run in pairs though, i remember probing an ic somewhere and got 28 ohm & 20ohm
If you're willing, and once I get this all sorted, I'd like to send a new coil that you could do a before and after W&F test against your 5Ω one. This would be very valuable information to see tested properly.
@@asbcustom Im always up for a bit of experimentation in the name of science. You are saying pull off the 5ohm repaired coil and pop on a replacement running at 14-15 ohm? One you made? That would be interesting indeed. You think the 5 ohm runs a bit rich compared to the 14ohm? It would be interesting to see if it makes any difference. W/F would occur if there was a disturbance in the speed on a micro level? One that was undetected by the WFGUI software?
Not the speed so much, that can be compensated for. I think the discontinuity in the magnetic field would destabilize the flutter more than anything else. Since you have a W&F tape already, I think it would be beneficial to do a before and after coil change out test, in as controlled conditions as possible. It doesn't even matter if the W&F tape is accurate, this is a simple comparison, and if the testing conditions are as similar as possible, would have merit.
A mold made of wax that can then be melted later?
It would, yes, but require yet another set of molds to manufacture for the wax pour and release. I am trying to do it in a single operation, if possible. Thank you for your comment!