Boosting a bird, things you should know when installing power brakes and master cyl 1968 Firebird
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- Опубликовано: 5 фев 2025
- Power brake upgrade is a great and relatively simply enhancement for a first generation f-body car. But there are a couple things not covered in the directions that I had to learn that hard way and wanted to share with you these tips to save you some potential grief or disappointment.
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Jon Forehan VVG
6780 west Washington street
Indianapolis IN 46241
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this video was just shown to a group of over 100 people on accident lol they will leave that meeting knowing a little more about boosting a firebird now!!!
😂
LoL now that is a meeting I would like to attend 😂👍
That’s just great! Free advertising thanks buddy.
Remember the first time I lightly tapped the All Drum manual brakes on my 68 firebird on the Garden state parkway in New Jersey and the front right locked up on me right before the Toll. What a ride!! let off on the brakes and she straighted up before the toll..
Been there before too. Drum brakes are
Sensitive. You are right it’s an interesting ride, all the more reason to
Swap over to disc brakes
Just bought my first muscle car (1970 GTO) and the brake booster had a healthy coating of rust on it. Thanks to my wallet and to Summit Racing, I have a replacement brake booster and master cylinder. And, now thanks to your video, I have an idea of how to install it. If you never hear from me again, then don't install it how I will. If you do hear from me again, then it went well and I recommend the process to everyone!
Very cool like the 70 gto its on my wish list to own.
It's a lot easier to do on the ground instead of under the dash LOL! Great video as always.
Yes it is. Just not as flexible as I used to be.
That’s for the information! It will come in handy when I get to this point!
Awesome! Glad to help and nice to know another car is coming back to life too.
Great video! I just ordered my new bracket for the switch because I’m switching from manual four-wheel drum to power boosted four-wheel disc on my 68 Camaro. 🤘
Right on!
May of already been mentioned but I would also paint the master cylinder before installing, a lot easier to paint off the car that way you don’t mess up the pretty brake lines and plated booster, not trying to be picky or critical, just a tip.🤷🏻♂ Btw they’re supposed to be black if you’re doing a back to original restoration. Great video. Thanks
Yes much easier off the car for sure. I paint Mine a cast grey to look similar to the bare metal.
Great video!! Very good explanation of the process
Glad it was helpful!
Would definitely like to see your brake bleeding procedure. Great tips on installing this brake and booster.
I will do that. I used a vacuum style bleeder to draw the fluid thru. Less mess and chance of getting brake fluid on fresh paint.
I know it is too late, but a little tip on those brake lines when you get one that isn't quite the right angle. You can take a box end wrench and put it on the fitting and you have great leverage to adjust the bend very easily. By using the fitting and not putting it directly on the line, there is much less chance of crimping the line.
Thanks! I see that working great.
as usual, great tips. Wish I had seen this video before installing on my 69 Camaro. Good common sense and know how. Thanks for sharing Jon. BTW, I also ran out of shielding gas last friday and could not finish my frame jig. Didn't know Tractor supply carried shielding gas.
Very welcome, our TSC stores in Indy normally has it. I don’t know if that is nationwide
Hello buddy that bracket is very important
Yes it is and it seems there are a few that don’t see the value.
Nice job.
Thanks!
Good explanation, I ended up bleeding the master cylinder before installing it, was harder to deal with trying not to spill anything.
Definitely not a bad idea. I use a vacuum bleeder and have had great success that way
Myself
Great work. You saved me a bunch of time figuring things out. Im not there yet bust soon hopefully. Thanks for the tips on this process. Now i have to go check my parts pile and see what im missing lol. Keep the great videos coming, cant wait to see more.
Anytime friend, i might have to make an detour south and see your bird. It’s looking really nice.
@@VinylVillageGarage That would be awesome.....someday when i get it back lol.
I have a little free time this summer so I may have to make it happen
@@VinylVillageGarage sounds good to me. We will have see how it goes and try and figure something out this summer.
Sounds great.
Another great one - thank you!
Thanks for watching, at this rate you will have seen everything soon. I guess I should make more videos. 🤣 thanks again
@@VinylVillageGarage Yesss!😄
Great video!!
Right on. Thanks
Thanks for any info
Anytime friend
Thank you for the info , your doing a great job on the car and the videos, I like the autumn bronze dash
I wasn’t sure about it in the beginning, I see it coming together now and it will make nice custom touch
Great content, Jon. Now you have got me wondering about that spacer that goes into the MC bore- I don't recall ever seeing one in 2-3 different masters that I have installed. Gonna have to investigate!
Some.master cylinders
Don’t have they because they are solid. If yours was missing your brakes would not work. Just pointing it out to save some grief for new installs
Thanks for the info… I am about to attempt it on my 69 firebird…
Cool. Was your car a factory power brake car? If so did it have that bracket on the pedal?
@@VinylVillageGarage it was factory manual drums all around .. original 6 cylinder car
Btw . Where can u order that bracket on the pedal?
Thanks
Used to be available from almost every restoration supplier, it seems they are on back order from most suppliers. When you do find them they sell for $15
Does that little adapter have a name? Im just about to do this switch over to power brakes.
Is your car a 68 or 67 then you need the brake light switch adapter if it’s 1969 you won’t. The listing for the ad that sells them says all three years but 1969 is a no
Just did the reverse of what your doing. Pulled that damn power booster OFF the firewall! went back to manual disk brakes to gain total solid road feel of the brakes. Plus with all the cams I use I wind up with ZERO vacuum so power brakes are a total joke. I have manual disks on all 5 of my muscle cars now and LOVE IT! Power brakes never more.
Interesting, did you go with a different master cylinder then the factory disc brake one?
@@VinylVillageGarage Yes, Made a phone call to Wagner lockeed brake company, they said the manual master cylinder for disk brakes takes a 1 inch bore piston and manual drum master was 15/16s and they gave me the correct P/N# for the 1 inch bore master. I like the Wangner masters over all others because you don't have to deal with them pain in the ass wire bails to pop off to check the fluid. With all Wagner masters it's only one 1/2 inch bolt in the middle and the top lid is off. Much more EZ in my opinion. The Wilwoods are waaaaay to pricey in my opinion. I got the correct NOS Wagner master off Ebay for $46.00 from a government supply vendor. Yes I did my homework. Still got to get a shorter push rod or cut & re grind the ball end as the push rod is about 2 1/4" shorter than the power push rod. My car, my rules 😎😎 That's what happens when you have owned the same bird for 47 years. So far I have changed my 66 Olds 442 H/T & 442 Convertable over to manual disks, my 70 Chevelle from power to manual disks and my 68 400 Bird will all be manual disks and my 68 RS/SS Camaro I changed it over to manual disks all with Wanger Masters. That center bolt is VERY handy over them stupid wire bails. I build what I know works best for me and is CHEAP !.
Thanks. I did some reading a while back about bore size in relation to disc vs drum and power to manual and just never felt like it was a clear answer. Have a friend with a 1970 c10 wants to do a manual disc conversion is why. Appreciate the insight.
Great info I wished I would have know in the early 90,s, when converting from manual steering to power steering is the only difference a power steering head and a p/s pitman arm , does all the other front parts work like center link and so forth remain the same ?
From my experience yes, the only exception is the 1969 also has a v8 or 6 Cyl steering linkages that are not the same.
I have watched your video and it is great information but I have a problem been using the bottom hole in my brake pedal. It does not give me the proper ratio the ratio using the bottom hole is only 3.2 instead of a minimum of four the top would be at least five and that’s where the manual push rod attached for the manual brakes. Any suggestions?
Are you not using the factory booster or master cylinder? The bottom hose with a booster should get you the correct setup.
Have you ever had a challenge with the shuttle valve inside the compensating valve sticking or shutting off the fluid flow to either the front or rear
Yes especially when first bleeding. Or doing a repair on an older system that had a leak. Its been bad enough that I had to open a bleeder screw on the side that was working and stomp on there brake pedal to shift it back. In a perfect world that valve should be replaced but good luck getting 50 year old lines off
@@VinylVillageGarage thank you. Have you ever used the little plug with the pin on it in the light switch hole to hold it in place
I have not yet, normally short stroke the brake pedal so not to shift the valve until I get most of the air out. Then bleed as usual
Did you make new lines for the proportioning valve? The issue I'm having is that my original porportioning valve was quite low. So the front and rear brake lines don't actually reach the proportioning valve. The new valve is mounted exactly like yours. I dont know how to connect the front driver side lines to it. Even the rear is the same it doesnt seem to reach at all
This car has all new brake lines installed and they are for cars with this set up. Now your car I am assuming you have factory lines still, if so they won’t reach. Need to make or buy new lines to get that proportioning valve to work
My manual drum '68 is set up where the accelerator and brake pedal are not on the same plane. Been the way since 1976, I'm assuming the factory did this.
"Sure makes for some interesting stops!"
Normally the brake pedal is slightly higher then the gas pedal. Then when depressed the brake pedal is the same height of the gas pedal.
Also when you convert manual brakes to power on standard trans does the the brake pedal have two holes also?
Yes both holes should be there.
67 Camaro here. Buying the Z shape piece now for a really high brake pedal with power brakes. So how do I go about installing it? Do I have to remove the steering column and remove the whole assembly or is it possible to work under the dash?
Very good question I have to try to install a z-bar on a car that was fully assembled it might be possible but I can’t say for sure
Thanks for the information, another great video!
Anytime, thanks!
Where did you get the brake light switch bracket ? I installed a system similar to yours but never got that bracket, I ended up welding a piece of metal.
This car still had it on the pedal. They used to sell them aftermarket but seem to be on back order. There is a template online you can print and fabricate one.
So are you going to try to bleed the whole system at once without bench bleeding the master? I tried that once and I could never get all the air bubbles out of the lines, so now I bleed the master on the car with a couple of looped brake lines I made up, it makes bleeding the lines much easier.
I have used a fluid vacuum pump to bleed them, works good and keeps the fluid cleaned up and off fresh paint.
Good video Jon !
I’m working on installing a booster and everything you have shown. I don’t have the bracket on my brake pedal. Do you know where can be found ?
This car was factory power brakes had one fortunately but i did some searching online they used to be available several places for like $15 bucks. It seems they are on back order, no surprise there. I am sure someone has one someplace or they are simple enough to fabricate Maybe I should make a couple.
What is the electrical connection that goes into that metering block
Brake fluid pressure loss switch. If you have a leak the valve shifts and blocks off the leaking size so you still have brakes and when that happens it trips that switch and turns the red “brake” light on in the instrument clutster
my 67 firebird is manual and soon to be power with no break light clip on the break pedal to take up the gap between the switch and pedal where do I find one I've looked in three different catalogs and don't see anything.!!
It was available at classic industries part 14298. It shows back ordered right now. I checked a few other places same thing. Must be like most everything else, short supply.
huh, I've had 5 68's all having power brakes, not one of them have had hat switch bracket? All of them operated the brake switch directly off the brake pedal. Looking at my Pontiac service manual now and I don't see any reference of that bracket in the diagram either? Odd.
I don’t have a 1968 manual to reference it might not be in there. I have a friend with a 68 dealer part manual I will have him look at it. Buy my experience has been of the three first gen birds that I have seen that came with FACTORY power assist didn’t matter disc or drum that bracket was on there. I did a disc conversion on my first bird years ago and didnt have that bracket and just never liked how the pedal seemed high for driving,‘stopped great! Then while tearing car apart
And saw that bracket for the first time I did some homework and everyplace I looked it was for the brake light switch for power brake cars. Then i located a bracket and readjusted pedal
Rod length and brake switch on my first bird much happier with pedal height. I could switch from the gas back to the brake pedal and felt much more natural.
@@VinylVillageGarage So just to be clear, Are you saying that this bracket in addition to locating the brake switch as a reference point for operation, that it also limits pedal return travel? I have never had an issue with a brake pedal height either? I'm not questioning your authenticity about this bracket, quite the contrary, I'm curious if this was one of those mid-year type factory changes that was perhaps not included on early year production? Did '67 have this setup? hmm.
I can’t guarantee 1967 I haven’t seen one sign my own eyes yet. I have seen them on 68 and 69. But the reproduction bracket is listed as 67-1969. So now I am curious myself.
Looks like all 1967-1969 power brake cars has this bracket
@VVG Firebird Restoration Station yes sir that's right all power brakes car's had this bracket
Hydraulic brake booster, runs off powed steering pump. Much better stopping power than a vacum booster and much cleaner looking than the huge vacuum boost canister. Hi performance camshafts dont produce lot of vacuum that is the reason hydro boost is superior, hydraulic boost dont use any vacuum at all.
Not a bad idea.
Stop in 60 secs!
Yes
It does.