Love the content on nickyboi's channel but his "for fun" outlook on balancing and design would and I would bet has, based on riots frequent referencing of him, destroy the game.
just give him build variety and movement speed scaling on his E and W also they should have given him a legacy skin where he is a crystal scorpion again and with his Q he picks up his spire
Add him a way to transform like Kayn, keep the model for tank version and add the flying scraped one as a more faster version with a movement speed based kit.
The biggest crime was destroying his lore. Really felt like a “stop calling seraphine cringe please :(“ change. Probably arcane related but still, lame.
What I think they should have done is this should have been a different Skarner. Keep all the old Skarner lore, just say the original Skarner died and became a hextech crystal.
Man, looking at the scraped version makes me wish they have done the same tipe as Kayn that can transform, keep the current model as a tank/bruiser and add the flying version as a more faster version that can only catch only one with the ultimate but can be affected by movement speed like old Skarner.
Miss Fortune, Kassadin, Alistar got brand new models, but no new voice lines, and their models are still lacking animations. Fiora got a whole a rework, and no new voice lines
7:17 nah they could have done so much more, by this logic kha is only an insect, they should have focused more on the crystal aspect of the old one when doing the new design
I have the theory that they fucked up so much the bracken lore with seraphine that they decided to complete remove the cristal part so they can make new hextech lore. I mean, they had to change her lore to avoid sound like a villain and then they did Arcane and Skarner's rework, idk sound weirdly fitting
@@MeilM135 I mean you could still go for a crystal theme, like he's apparently addored by his people, have his armor be made of really brilliant gems crafted by his people idk, like there is a dozen ways of making the new lore cohesive with a similar style to old skarner.
From a skarner main: - no build versatility - every non-tank build nerfed to the ground - extremely slow compared to the old one - E extremely clunky - has to be underpowered cause of pro-play - no crystals
As one of the og skarner players his crystals were a mistake on his previous rework they give away far to much information on where you are in the jungle he should have been able to drop them where he needed them or not put visual indicators on the mini map placing them on destroyed towers like azier would have been cool as well
You can add that is new ult is useless (because it's very quick, very hard to hit and since he his slow he can't move them anymore). The whole point of his ult, it's was to isolate a carry. Now it's just a Sion Q but without damage.
@TheSsaboy absolutely not to mention I'm not even actually isolating anyone anymore because odds are good I grabbed that tank support/top lane with the adc so they are still in the way 1 sec later when it end effectively accomplishing nothing
They honestly should have made him more akin to Hecarim than a Rammus. Old Skarner’s best builds were the ones where you come in at 1000 movespeed, kidnap someone, and then drag them away kicking and screaming for dear life. If they let him be the speedy crab scorpion he was always meant to be, there’d be no issue. Also, and maybe this is just me, I don’t think his E should have a visual que. I think it’d be way funnier for everyone if he just comes out of nowhere like a Fiddle Ult and possibly scares the life out of the enemy ADC. Idk why him and Briar have Visual and Audio indicators for their E and Ult respectively, new champ design is weird
Yeah no, I need the visual queue because being napped from a wall is not fun, especially since he can go through them. Playing midlane would just be hell.
Morde and Skarner used to be brothers, kidnaping people and dragging them to brazil. Now Morde sits alone at the grave of his crystal brother, while an impersonator walks in his place.
I have the theory that the main reason to remove the crystal part of his lore is to avoid the controversy with Seraphine. I mean, the bracken's lore was in league for so many years, and the second Seraphine sounded like she was using the bracken's souls without care in her lore. Suddenly, we had that part of lore change with Arcane and the rework
@@blendon8 I mean.... Taking lol lore seriously is insane, even for them. Besides which, skarner was always worth more than a million Seraphines. Frankly 'champions' like seraphine are DUMB af, cater to a buncha incel metro asians, and arent even champions at all "How about this person, and theyre edgy and cool, and something about music and being famous" .... you mean like 3/4 of the faceless boring trash characters youve released since you started pandering to asian markets? Theyre ruining their game pandering to slanters For everyone, including the sliver eyes
@@Tha_dud_yuu And it probably IS true. Skarner was not only known to be a scorpion, he is the crystal scorpion. Even Taric says special things to him as a crystal collector back then. Riot killed the gameplay identity AND the backstory of Skarner
As somebody who was a Skarner main for 2-3 seasons, with like 200k mastery as a casual player, I can say I didn't vote for the rework because I knew this would happen. One of my favorite champs lost their whole identity, and I knew it would happen as soon as I saw that poll show him at the top. Skarner's crystal aesthetic, the fun times of shredding people with q, being fast despite having no gap closers. It was great. But now he's this thing that I just can't get behind. Skarner was one of my favorite league champions design and gameplay wise, and it makes me sad as hell seeing what he is now. RIP my Brakern Brother.
Old Swain/Fiddlesticks main. I feel your pain somewhat. Swain isn’t too bad after but the bouncing crows they took from Fiddlesticks made him boring af to play anywhere but jg. My highest rank was playing support Fiddlesticks and it just is boring af now
@@spaghettu3729traded immense skill expression and constant mobility for boring ass linear gameplay that takes as much skill as yuumi sigh…they destroyed him.
Skarner and Asol both… it REALLY sucks to play unique champs in this game. Riot HATES champions being unique and niche, they need all champs to be recolors of eachother. RIP Asol and Skarner. Riot needs to add skarner and asols old kits back :(
I am a firm beliver that og Skarner's only problem was his old passive, yes it was the most uniqe part of his kit, but that was the problem, it made him inconsistent. Without it, he's painful to play, with it, he's REALLY good. If Riot just changed the passive and updated his visuals everybody would've been happy.
All he needed was to swap his q and passive, so you instead placed where you want the crystals and your aoe splash would happen passively without the unnecessary need to spam the q key. Like it was really simple...
He feels clunky right now especially with 3 abilities that that hinder his movement speed (E) or just flat out make him stop (R+Q+Q2). His E is also extremely telegraphed along with it initially slowing him down so it kinda easy to throw CC at him. Why play him over other engage tanks like sejuani or zac?
This exactly. The champion used to be constantly fast asf now legit almost all his abilities stop him for some reason despite the champ being a scorpion which should mean his mobility is tied into move speed only. It’s like they didn’t even try.
yeah he feels so slow to play I just get bored instantly and there's no instant satisfaction of using your spells cause your damage is all in your passive which you don't really see or feel
My problem with him is the how clunky he feels, to use your Q you must wait for him to stop, pick up the rock, and THEN you can do anything, his E has this huge slow before accelerating instead of keeping your momentum, his ult locks him in place and is not as reliable as before, I know these "issues" are to keep him balanced but it really made it less snappy than his past abilities.
It really feels like they concocted the perfect formula to suck out everything that was actually fun about Skarner. He was old and simple, yes, but felt suprisingly smooth to play apart from his passive, and could reasonably use almost any combination of stats. There were so many items he could build. Imagine if they leaned into that. An ancient skorpion, guiding the humans he guards with his troves of knowledge. Have him be adaptable, a manifestation of the evolving wilds, a creature that grows to match every scenario. And that's why he gets to be flexible with items, use every stat, maybe even have a passive that interacts with them. Hell, keep the crystal image and have them change colour depending on what stat he invested the most gold into.
Skarner barely needed a rework. Only his Passive needed changes and the rest of his kit should have been buffed/adjusted to compensate. I used to play him a fair bit, and his biggest flaws were that he wasn't tanky enough to get in there, but when he singled out an opponent, he was able to drag them back into his team and change the tide of battle because of it. His Q was perfect, just needed some buffs, his W (while boring) was perfect for getting in there and tanking hits, which should have been beefed up more, and his E was weak but enable him to initiate his whole "stick to his prey" gameplay. His Ult was already perfect the way it was, probably needed some small tweaks at best. The new Skarner does nothing to make him enjoyable to play. He feels slow, boring, and tedious to play. I miss his stickiness, where foes couldn't escape you once you initiated on them. Bring back THAT Skarner. Also, they removed his "Skar, Skar, Skarner !" voiceline when he's in brush. 0/10 rework.
No offense, but people couldn't give more fucks about old Skarner. That creature was whack as hell. Not only he is a monster champion (which means the popularity is gonna be naturally lower than the human champions) but all of his old design (including lore, appearance, that odd map passive, etc) simply didn't belong to the current days, totally out of place with the rest of the game. That Skarner was a product of his time, aka OLD ASS League (the one with the summoners), and people didn't really talk about him that much. It was only relevant when the champ was occasionally OP, but that was it.
@@dieptrieu6564 *passive Malzahar with suppression is balanced just fine, so are champions with point-click ults His only problem was that he relied too heavily on his team to help with his passive to be viable. So he was either too weak without passive working, or if tuned, too strong with it, no in-between
God I was so dissapointed with skarner's rework. I am specially annoyed at the whole "crystal scorpion isn't original enough" bit that they said before just slapping down a grey blob and calling it a day. They could have done so much for him appearance wise, even if they moved away from the crystal theme but they somehow went for the single most boring thing possible.
As if a literal crystal scorpion isn't the most basic and boring idea they could ever have come up with. Also, he's not grey. He's teal with orange highlights. Are you blind?
They got a decade of time to Come up with something new. Yet they completely delete a champ from a loyal player base and replace it with another random tank with a boring kit. If its boring design atleast give it a visual update with a small kit rework would have been 10 times better.
Only thing i really dislike is the fact that they removed build variety, the only way you can play him now is building full tank and before when he was kinda like a bruiser/statchecker he was kinda fun to play
The biggest reason that skarner is currently garbage, is his scaling(only really hp) and his ult being unusable, since 90% of all champions have escapes, and 100% of players have flash.
Og Skarner just pressed R, and dragged someone (mainly ADC or echanter sup) into a gangbang. New Skarner needs external CC to actually land his R, and if it's a three-man ult then hope you didn't drag the fed enemy Darius with you.
@@ChucktheSpicyChicken New Skarner feels clunky and is only a stat checker now. No build variety and they should have deleted his ult in favor of a better kit. I liked him most before he got all of his abilities changed around or mini reworked.
If u think skarner R is unusable then ur delusional. Even playing him in masters elo there are always ways you can kidnap someone that oversteps especially tank supports thinking they are fine but if u R into E on them ur team just demolishes them.
@lithin3567 Unless the Skarner hit you into a wall with his E, you can littarly walk away and if he does hit the E you can just flash at the last second. And if he finishes R prematurely at best, he gets 0.5 seconds of suppression and unless you jumped him under tower or he has allies nearby that suppress has been wasted. Only way you can land a full R as Skarner is if you have something like a Morgana Q, Ornn in general, or a Sion Q or R.
Highly disagree with the stuff around character design - I do agree his kit is not that exciting or exhilarating as the build diversity was basically gutted within a single patch - I would say simply reverting some of the damage scaling changes is what would make the most sense and fix a lot of his problems and that's all we need
I don't know how anyone would see damage scaling by max HP as a good idea. I really like that for example Sions spells scale with AD and AP, so he can not really build damage (if you are not Baus).
Damage scaling with max HP is not necessarily a problem. It allows tanks such as Zac to deal enough damage to compete without giving them such high base damage that they still deal damage when they are 0/9. It translates gold into damage output, which is still very important for tanks on toplane or in jungle. If they had that kind of damage regardless of the gold they earned, they would move to support if their remaining kit allows it. But if it's the ONLY damage scaling your champion has, then that obviously kills the build variety because then you are locked into just 1 playstyle. It WOULD be nice if you could focus on different aspects of you champion's kit by building different stats - as old Skarner allowed you to do as well, or how you could play old Aatrox or old Sion as AP nukes - , but Riot is Riot.
I'm still so sad Riot deleted my main-... Old Skarner was incredibly fun and had BUILD VARIETY! You could build LITERALLY ANYTHING on him and it was GREAT! But now? You're a slow, generic tank.
Join the club. I miss when rengar's ferocity stacks persisted out of combat, when his bonetooth necklace stacks were more interesting than "+Ad%", when ap rengar was a *somewhat* viable meme build
That was my biggest issue, with the other reworks, they atleast tried to keep the same fantasy of the champ alive, but they completley gutted it. Like sion got completley overhauled, but still filled the idea of a tank juggernaut that wants to be right inthe fight. Aatrox, while very different, still fit the same niche as a sustain fighter.
Okay but I want the giant scorpion to be ugly. League has been cannibalizing its own art direction for years to ensure every new champion is pretty or cool looking. I don't want more monster champions like Kha'Zix (aka a human-shaped bug). I want a monster champ where people's first reaction to it is "What the hell is that thing?"
ugly in this sense is that the color pallete is boring and the general theme of the champion just feels like big scorpion, he doesn't need to be hot, but he is most certainly ugly was nasty colors and a boring art direction.
They could do so much with him like fantasy monster hunter shit but instead they decided to go normal scorpion with 3 tails and grey pallete, just make the zerg version mutalisk with wings you showed as concept riot...
thats exaclty the issue. Skarner is in pro play prison, He's either too op that he is picked all the time in high elo, or just undertuned enough where he's increadibly boring. High winrate =/= good design.
4:05 I think the passive was what many hated about Skarner and ruin his old kit.. cuz all of his abilities individually were good and together they were very viable for different builds and runes but his passive was horribly inconsistent throughout the game and with an VERY easy counterplay.. Making him a new and consist passive (like the current one) and updating a little the rest of his abilities would have been perfect..
I played a lot of old Skarner top, and it's passive was actully good. I'm shure your wondering how could a top skarner say that. Well skarner E gived every bonus of the passive while the ennemy was stun, so it was incredible to just use e on a minion wave, get huge attack speed, move speed, mana regen and stun all the minion to regain an other e while pushing the wave and regaining the mana in the progress. You could even throw your e on the wave and the ennemy at the same time to get a free trade.
A flying skarner that can fly to his crystals anytime sounds fun.. 😂 it would also be fun if Skarner could pull an enemy while leaping. (Leaping distance would vary and be way longer if it could reach inside the area of his crystal spires.)
I disagree. Should they have reworked it like Aatrox? Why did the champion become popular? His popularity comes from the fact that he is broken, the champion literally IKs a champion if he hits his 3 Qs. He was doing a full lethality build that didn't make him fragile, the champion healed so much that he ignored the fragility of the lethality build and even if he was against a tank, the lethality build still worked because of the damage from the 3 Qs. Aatrox has already entered the Life Spiral, like Lee Sin, Ahri, etc. No matter the reason, the moment one of their win rates drops or leaves the top 10 in the lane, Riot will automatically buff them. Skaner, on the other hand, is in the Death Spiral, like Cho'Gath, Kog'Maw, Quinn, etc. They don't care about these champions anymore, if their win rates are low or they are RIP, they will go months or years without appearing in the Patch Notes. If a broken build appears on a champion who is in the Life Spiral, it will stay there for 03 or 04 patches without being removed. But if it is on a champion who is in the Death Spiral, in the next Patch Notes they will remove the interaction.
As someone who played skarner alot before quitting early this year, i got to try skarner before he was butchered, i didnt particularly mind the appearance change but i feel like his entire gameplay was too different, even the ult felt more clunky to use and felt like it took away what the old ult was meant for, i dont think i couldve ever imagined a rework in a game be this alienating and miss the whole point
Nah the failure was them taking so long for the rework. Udyr had to move through Covid, post covid, and each of his forms needing their own model so the community was surprisingly patient. The rework is fine. The only thing I missed was being able to go AS on skarner. Like seriously I HATED that old passive why would you ask for it to be kept in some form?
I loved the passive. It was bad, it was annoying at times, but the sense of "map control" it added was really cool. I think they could have simply improved it instead of changing it.
Skarner used to be a verry fast bruiser with low (but fast) damage Now he is just slow and his cooldowns feel to long for what they do he used to basically have a perma shield witch was his way of being a bruiser Skarner is just a worce nunu now The way i woyld rewok him is that fruendly towers act as his pillars. Affecting the lane they are in and the jungle they are next to. He can also place a crystal on a destroyed tower with a 30sec cooldown. But it has health like a ward abd only 1 can be actif at yhe time. And it would function more like his old pasive withouth the mana regen
I played a lot of Skarner and the no.1 reason why I don't like the new one is that he's so slow, even when going through walls. And you can't really build him fast either in a way that makes sense. Full movementspeed Skarner in late game used to be a menace and super fun. For his design: as stupid and simple the idea of scorpion x crystals was, it had a charm and it was fairly unique. Also imo his ingame model looked really good for being so old (I wished they ever bothered to update his spells). They removed this design to retcon the hexcrystal lore because people were shitting on Seraphine or something, I don't even remember. What a shame.
i'll miss the old skarner, people say he was unplayable and boring but before the rework riot buffed him and holy moly, that was the only thing the character needed in my opinion, a good and balanced buff.
And here I am with the "any champions I main, they got changed" curse. Pick up Morde, gutted. Switch to Vikor, hex core gone. Master Urgot, crabbed. Flying swords with Irelia, now auto to death. Balling with ASol, balls no more. What's wrong with unpopular picks? Let me and their fan enjoy the champions.
If at least they kept some level of uniqueness and identity when reworking them it would be fine, but I'm still fuming about A-sol. One of the most unique playstyle in the game reduced to just infinite scaling stacks and DoT....
Have to agree on this most champs I liked got reworked. Super unlucky I really liked old Morde, Ryze, Aatrox and now Skarner. Nothing left for me honestly. It was a fun road but I will quit after Dragonball Sparking Zero comes out since I used to play BT3.
if you actually enjoyed this champs pre rework, i'm afraid you have a thing for bad design, not unpopular champs. like, old urgot? really? you think that was good?
As a former Skarner main i have no clue why Skarner’s passive was the main point for needing a rework. It was so useful as a tracking/invading tool. One of the coolest passives in the game honestly.
On paper, it was a cool idea. But in praxis, this passive was way too problematic for Skarner. If the Spires gave him too much power, he had to be weak outside of them or else he would steamroll literally everyone. But if he was strong outside the Spires, then the passive had to be weak and practically become useless outside of tracking, and even that isn't very reliable. TLDR: Spires were a total balancing nightmare for Skarner.
@@Citrin1s Nah, they had pretty good reason to delete the spires In fact you could have just kept his kit the same and just replaced the spires with a well designed passive and you're basically good to go
Let me hold the Q rock forever, remove the timer. And make it so higher level Q rock gives more hits before it breaks. And make the amount of hit you can do scale off something so i can make infinite Q rock build.
I dont know man, I really enjoy this rework. It was funny asf in toplane with your crazy E outplays, the thing is that it happened like with ksante, nerfed to the ground so you just feel useless, and that is boring, like his Q damage was reduced alot, W shield, slow and damage, E cooldown and damage, R duration and cooldowb
I honestly like his design, but I'm one of the 5 guys who like ugly and monster champs (I mained Urgot and Mundo before landing on my beloved Yorick, when autofill jg I spam Voli K6 and RekSai) but when you mentioned the Voidborns yeah I'd have to agree, I can see him not being appealing compared to other monster champs and it kinda looks out of place in the game, like, you're forced to use a skin if you play reworked Skarner
I don't like skarner rework cuz he fails at everything that was cool about skarner, build variety, sustain dps, single target displacement and lockdown. He still is as tanky as old skarner but that's what made him useful, not what made him cool. Old skarner was fundamentally functional, he just needed to have a new passive that made him not breakdown as soon as someone learnt the matchup. What he didn't need was a redesign, especially when he actually had a healthy base of mains who only had one real problem with his kit, his passive. The core gameplay philosophy of skarner was fundamentally sound it just needed to be made functional. And the biggest thing that really killed the new skarner as an old skarner player, is that nothing scales with movespeed, old skarner's most iconic stat. At the end of it all he's not appealing to new players because he's been pigeon-holed too hard into one playstyle while not achieving anything old skarner mains wanted from him in the first place. I have a personal issue with how they took the mangled corpse of old skarner's beauty of an ult and ruined it by: Not making it point and click (consistent), not making it scale with ms(fun) and not making it turn (versatile)
I still like to play new Skarner, I at least have fun with him 😢. Even play some games with old Skarner before the rework to get a feel of how much will change
what I liked about old skarner was the movespeed and that I forced the enemy adc to build Quick Silver. to also add the point and click CC, I like point and click CCs
I believe if they keep his old design as crystal scorpion it would really fun to look at. As for gameplay, I have to say... I feel like doing nothing when I'm playing as skarner. Like I feel like I'm hitting them with wet noodle.
I keep hearing the argument for Skarner’s E to scale with Movement speed, but that simply wouldn’t work if they kept the set distance he can travel. If you want his e to scale with movement speed, you need the distance cap removed too
Why it wouldn't work? You cross the same distance, but faster. Seems quite strong to me. If initial E slowdown becomes less severe, it will make it stronger too
@@Moonflush If it scales with movement speed then the E will become even harder to drift and control, like with Nunu W going too quickly. if there’s a minor speed buff to it, then that’s fine
This video seems really biased to me. If you like big monster champs, you probably wouldnt think he is ugly. I also dont think he is boring at all. I think most juggernaut fans would probably like Skarner. He also has a surprisingly deep learning curve. And old Skarner was deathly unpopular. Last rework to his kit basically fucked skarner. But his old old kit wasnt exactly great either, so reverting it wasnt a great idea. I also dislike how people always rave about his health ratios. Yeah, you are pretty much forced to build health on him, but.... does that matter? You are pretty much forced to build a certain way on almost all champs in league anyway. Health gives him durability and damage, very similar to Mundo. It can be argued that a more AD oriented Skarner might be a better idea. Still keeping some of the health scalings, but bumping his AD scalings up so stuff like BC and Titanic become good on him. Titanic particulary is rather fun to use on him and it'd be great to have it as a legitimate option available depending on situation. But that is just a few measly numbers changes away.
There are 4 things that make it a bad rework (imo) 1. His E is just cunky AF. It slows you down to 10 ms (no matter how fast you are), and then your ms has to ramp up again, only for it to be capped at like 800. Just remove the slow it gives and that ability would be waaaaaay better. The cap is fine on itself, but imagin running in from base with homeguard with like 600ms, only to be basically crippled for like 0.2 secs. Just feels awful. 2. His Ult cast time is too long. People complained about his ult having like almost no counterplay (cuz it was Point-And-Click), now its stupid easy to dodge it. The fact that its AOE does not help really much to compensate. Make the cast animation shorter, so it feels usable without the need of other CC's 3. His Ult literally cripples him Why is that? Why can i not flash when i ulted? Unlesss i activated ghost (or some other ms-boost from my teammates), the pull-disctance is just comically short. Remember those "YOU ARE GOIN TO BRAZIL" Pulls? Literally impossible unless you have a Thresh in your team (if you can even interact with his Lantern while Ulting someone). 4. His passive makes absolutely no sense on him Honestly his Passive is just dogsh*t. Dont give him DOT, maybe be like "After 3 consecutive hits, reduce the targets armor/magic resist by 2-10.5% (based on Level) for 5 seconds", cuz the damage output is cute at best and borderline useless in all honesty. He is not supposed to be the Damage Dealer, he is supposed to be a Tank making the life of the Damage Dealers easier by crippling the enemy team. The DOT can be keept since its not really doing much anyway in my experience(or lower it for champions to balance it out). The Q and W are fine. Maybe i would make it when Skarner pulls a rock out with his Q that he gets an Attack Speed Bonus for the time he has the Rock on him. Dang this turned out with waaaaaay more text than i thought lol
I think the design is good , I mean It's a matter of taste in the end, but I respect your opinion.....and I also agree with making his E scale with movement speed and these shit
I think little tweaks could make a big impact. First and foremost if you say "on year" dont have it be TWO FULL YEARS to get it done. There's no excuse fo rit and ANY hype you had aorund him died long before he managed to actually come out. Give him some AD scaling so he can have an offensive option like Malphite. Make it so his wall run lowers your speed by 10% or something rather than a flat amount. (MS scorpion jumpscare!) Make him something more than just a bland meat shield with CC and a three hit passive! I might not be the biggest fan of the formal crystal bug but the fact is i'd rather get discourse of another Sona vs Seraphine situation because THIS leaves NOBODY happy.
I think if they changed his e by making skarner slide after it runs out and he only stops if he hits something or he keeps losing move speed until fully stops
They like to add long channeling abilities to new tanks which makes them more balanced but more frustrating to play. The delays on the Q when its a spam ability or the E start movement feels really annoying compared to mundo or old skarner fast reaction ones. I still remember how horrible ornn E was.
Use to be a Skarner main wayyyyy back, butt eventually, one discovers there is actual life elsewhere :! Those early sketches look nice, they should've completely reworked him as a multi form champ where, like Kayn, you can chose a form and stick to it. That flying monster sketch looked great.
I realized the other day that I am ranked 5 mastery Skarner, but I’ve used him like once since the rework lmao. Tbf, thats mostly because I only play bot and support
I personally like playing Skarner, might be cause I like playing tanks so I don't find it boring, I might be a psychopath, who knows. But they definitely should uncap the E ms and make it faster, also more variety in builds could help make him more interesting for sure, for most people at least.
9:20 yeah like removing his hole unique thing in stances and change them into just Abilities he has, making them feel so Semi cohesive. Like they work just fail to understand what made staying in stand or not intersting, so now you're just forced to keep switching.
Grey Blob was on point, Skarner Rework couldve really needed some better colors. Tho I really like the new Skarner as a character and his model (I think the 3 Stingers are really badass), the colors spark no excitement and I think what would've made him cooler is if he wouldve came with some accessories people made for him like Asols Crown. But for the gameplay tho... I think there are things that are left to be desired. They didn't fully leaned into the giant ancient warrior Kaiju aspect with some abilities and the earthbending isnt there at all. Skarner doesn't ever summon a wall or uses a technique that he practised over 100 of years he just feels like a big scorpion who throws rocks. Passiv a 3Hit woohoo, Q Pulls out a rock and throws it, W farts, E Burrowing Grappler Train actually something cool, R could've just been completely reworked at this point? Impale was Old Skarners thing to drag an enemy champion around it worked because he was speedy, the new one tho is a slow and heavy tank.
I just love this new rework The teal rock thematic with the bulky upper body and even more monstrous look is just so fucking good. I aggressively hated Skarner's passive, and thought while his moveset can be funny it had little to no skill expression beyond what every other character already has. I think the new combo-centric design is much better then the old one, though I will say the speedy skarner and more attack focused aggressive playstyle is a bit lost for more controller aspects I personally love controller style tanks, like most in smite, so this is right up my ally.
Litterally made a champion they can't buff without him being pick or ban but the only difference is they actually nerf him when he his strong vs every other 200yr champ
I can relate to you skarner main. I still can't forgive riot about what they do with mordekaiser rework. I never play skarner but rework skarner feels like sluggish (idk the word is correct or not for his slow movement). I feel slow playing him. I love non-dash champion like chogath, morde, fiddle, but none of them made me slow as skarner rework eventhough skarner have abilities to walking through the wall. I think if riot want to create skarner as a big guardian ancient scorpion, but still feels like old skarner, i think they should make his abilites scaling with health, ap, and AD. I remember old skarner have flexible build. If you want tanky, build health and resistance, if you want damage build ap or ad. Or you can go semi tank if you like.
Yeah, range damaging abilities that also provide shield at the same time are literally cancer. It was a totally clear failure design since Sett release.
I was hoping they would make him more of a caster than a tank. I loved the concept of the shrines and i was dreaming they would make more of his kit revolve around "capture and hold" parts of the jungle.
There seems to be a systematic problem at riot where a lot of issues from previus reworks of any kind seem to have been adressed or learned from in every new rework. For example almost every rework makes a build diverse champ into a 1 build with 2 interchangable items champ, where the only time the build changes is when an item is insanely broken or has a weird interraction with the champ that was noticed in korea. Or when reworking a champ just straight up replacing almost every unique mechanic and replacing it with generic abilities with 1 unique niche like skarner being able to now go through walls, yey? It feels the devs are either too scared to make a champ that can have more then 1 build, or someone is stopping them from breaking the template
Rell, Kench also got changed, Kench R and W got swapped and Rell E was changed to be ramping speed boost with dmg on it in aoe from tether to an ally and any enemy in-between is stunned. which was a good chain cc with her W, sad it was changed :(
Damn, the reworked Skarner looks like a colorless blob. Maybe they could've made him, idk, a different kind of scorpion. Ooooh, maybe a crystal scorpion? How cool would that look?
Nah, a crystal scorpian who's entire species has been killed for the sake of advancing tech of an entire city is not original enough, a colourless boomer blob is an extreamly creative design, you just don't understand fine art.
Gameplay is bad, lorewise is the best choice they made ever Edit: related to the video: if this "canadian guy" was canadian then he would know about letterkenny
Incorrect + rework is awesome actually + you stole skarner video before I could finish mine + ratio
nice ratio. here is one for you
NickyBoi from Friday Night Funkin omg
where skarner video
@@DumbsLIVE na bro where is volibear rework
Love the content on nickyboi's channel but his "for fun" outlook on balancing and design would and I would bet has, based on riots frequent referencing of him, destroy the game.
just give him build variety and movement speed scaling on his E and W
also they should have given him a legacy skin where he is a crystal scorpion again and with his Q he picks up his spire
Add him a way to transform like Kayn, keep the model for tank version and add the flying scraped one as a more faster version with a movement speed based kit.
@@jheoz5078 that be cool as fuck
Giving him more different scalings would make him way more fun to Play (at least for otps)
His spire? 👀
@@pongsapaksubpokatorn6138 yeah his old passive
The biggest crime was destroying his lore. Really felt like a “stop calling seraphine cringe please :(“ change. Probably arcane related but still, lame.
What I think they should have done is this should have been a different Skarner. Keep all the old Skarner lore, just say the original Skarner died and became a hextech crystal.
@ofanichan I would've kept the hextech crystals as elder Brackern, who, after reaching a certain age, become enlightened and transform into crystals.
Man, looking at the scraped version makes me wish they have done the same tipe as Kayn that can transform, keep the current model as a tank/bruiser and add the flying version as a more faster version that can only catch only one with the ultimate but can be affected by movement speed like old Skarner.
I mean, he barely had lore before, since they retconned most of it a long time ago.
@TheSorrowfulAngel Skarner himself had very little lore but the Brackern did thanks to them being involved with hextech
REMEMBER THEY CHANGED SHEN BUT DID NOT GIVE HIM NEW VOICE LINES
He brings no money
Thanks for reminding me. They couldn't afford a new VA.
@@justinjakeashton Indie company
Miss Fortune, Kassadin, Alistar got brand new models, but no new voice lines, and their models are still lacking animations. Fiora got a whole a rework, and no new voice lines
lux get new voiceline every years
7:17 nah they could have done so much more, by this logic kha is only an insect, they should have focused more on the crystal aspect of the old one when doing the new design
I have the theory that they fucked up so much the bracken lore with seraphine that they decided to complete remove the cristal part so they can make new hextech lore. I mean, they had to change her lore to avoid sound like a villain and then they did Arcane and Skarner's rework, idk sound weirdly fitting
@@MeilM135 I mean you could still go for a crystal theme, like he's apparently addored by his people, have his armor be made of really brilliant gems crafted by his people idk, like there is a dozen ways of making the new lore cohesive with a similar style to old skarner.
From a skarner main:
- no build versatility - every non-tank build nerfed to the ground
- extremely slow compared to the old one
- E extremely clunky
- has to be underpowered cause of pro-play
- no crystals
As one of the og skarner players his crystals were a mistake on his previous rework they give away far to much information on where you are in the jungle he should have been able to drop them where he needed them or not put visual indicators on the mini map placing them on destroyed towers like azier would have been cool as well
@@spifinatorsxpwindow3379 I'm like 90% certain the no crystal point was because Skarner is no longer a crystal scorpion, not the dominion crystals.
@dothackmultiweapon ya, definitely. I was referencing his previous rework 😅
You can add that is new ult is useless (because it's very quick, very hard to hit and since he his slow he can't move them anymore).
The whole point of his ult, it's was to isolate a carry. Now it's just a Sion Q but without damage.
@TheSsaboy absolutely not to mention I'm not even actually isolating anyone anymore because odds are good I grabbed that tank support/top lane with the adc so they are still in the way 1 sec later when it end effectively accomplishing nothing
They honestly should have made him more akin to Hecarim than a Rammus. Old Skarner’s best builds were the ones where you come in at 1000 movespeed, kidnap someone, and then drag them away kicking and screaming for dear life. If they let him be the speedy crab scorpion he was always meant to be, there’d be no issue.
Also, and maybe this is just me, I don’t think his E should have a visual que. I think it’d be way funnier for everyone if he just comes out of nowhere like a Fiddle Ult and possibly scares the life out of the enemy ADC. Idk why him and Briar have Visual and Audio indicators for their E and Ult respectively, new champ design is weird
Yeah no, I need the visual queue because being napped from a wall is not fun, especially since he can go through them. Playing midlane would just be hell.
@@mustangcody its called Wards … use them when you have them
Morde and Skarner used to be brothers, kidnaping people and dragging them to brazil. Now Morde sits alone at the grave of his crystal brother, while an impersonator walks in his place.
Peak rank silver? Normal/ARAM player?
True. I played DOTA. It is scary when a Batrider just blinked in front of me and the Ulted and his Pudge hooks him and drag me to a 5v1
I have the theory that the main reason to remove the crystal part of his lore is to avoid the controversy with Seraphine. I mean, the bracken's lore was in league for so many years, and the second Seraphine sounded like she was using the bracken's souls without care in her lore. Suddenly, we had that part of lore change with Arcane and the rework
This is 100% the reason, and they'll never admit it. They really tried to sweep that little bit of lore under the rug.
I get it aswell but its like they put minimal effort into the champ.
@@blendon8 I mean.... Taking lol lore seriously is insane, even for them. Besides which, skarner was always worth more than a million Seraphines. Frankly 'champions' like seraphine are DUMB af, cater to a buncha incel metro asians, and arent even champions at all
"How about this person, and theyre edgy and cool, and something about music and being famous" .... you mean like 3/4 of the faceless boring trash characters youve released since you started pandering to asian markets?
Theyre ruining their game pandering to slanters
For everyone, including the sliver eyes
You guys want this to be true so bad it’s honestly funny if it was 😂
@@Tha_dud_yuu And it probably IS true. Skarner was not only known to be a scorpion, he is the crystal scorpion. Even Taric says special things to him as a crystal collector back then. Riot killed the gameplay identity AND the backstory of Skarner
The best power fantasy was being the guy who was playing the least played champ in the game and getting comments like "this skarner is insane"
I miss my old Skarner
As somebody who was a Skarner main for 2-3 seasons, with like 200k mastery as a casual player, I can say I didn't vote for the rework because I knew this would happen. One of my favorite champs lost their whole identity, and I knew it would happen as soon as I saw that poll show him at the top. Skarner's crystal aesthetic, the fun times of shredding people with q, being fast despite having no gap closers. It was great. But now he's this thing that I just can't get behind. Skarner was one of my favorite league champions design and gameplay wise, and it makes me sad as hell seeing what he is now. RIP my Brakern Brother.
Same happened with Aurelion Sol, 1.4 Million points. Insanely unique gameplay turned into un-interactive stacking champ :(
@@spaghettu3729 Glad to see im not alone in feeling that :"< evey day without old sol makes me sad
Old Swain/Fiddlesticks main. I feel your pain somewhat. Swain isn’t too bad after but the bouncing crows they took from Fiddlesticks made him boring af to play anywhere but jg. My highest rank was playing support Fiddlesticks and it just is boring af now
@@spaghettu3729traded immense skill expression and constant mobility for boring ass linear gameplay that takes as much skill as yuumi sigh…they destroyed him.
Skarner and Asol both… it REALLY sucks to play unique champs in this game. Riot HATES champions being unique and niche, they need all champs to be recolors of eachother. RIP Asol and Skarner. Riot needs to add skarner and asols old kits back :(
I am a firm beliver that og Skarner's only problem was his old passive, yes it was the most uniqe part of his kit, but that was the problem, it made him inconsistent. Without it, he's painful to play, with it, he's REALLY good. If Riot just changed the passive and updated his visuals everybody would've been happy.
yeah shavnge W and passive and old skaner wolud be good same with galion even old galio flash ult was busted
All he needed was to swap his q and passive, so you instead placed where you want the crystals and your aoe splash would happen passively without the unnecessary need to spam the q key. Like it was really simple...
He feels clunky right now especially with 3 abilities that that hinder his movement speed (E) or just flat out make him stop (R+Q+Q2). His E is also extremely telegraphed along with it initially slowing him down so it kinda easy to throw CC at him. Why play him over other engage tanks like sejuani or zac?
This exactly. The champion used to be constantly fast asf now legit almost all his abilities stop him for some reason despite the champ being a scorpion which should mean his mobility is tied into move speed only. It’s like they didn’t even try.
yeah he feels so slow to play I just get bored instantly and there's no instant satisfaction of using your spells cause your damage is all in your passive which you don't really see or feel
My problem with him is the how clunky he feels, to use your Q you must wait for him to stop, pick up the rock, and THEN you can do anything, his E has this huge slow before accelerating instead of keeping your momentum, his ult locks him in place and is not as reliable as before, I know these "issues" are to keep him balanced but it really made it less snappy than his past abilities.
Don't forget that you can't W while in E despite it being pretty much the exact same functionality as sion R + W
It really feels like they concocted the perfect formula to suck out everything that was actually fun about Skarner.
He was old and simple, yes, but felt suprisingly smooth to play apart from his passive, and could reasonably use almost any combination of stats. There were so many items he could build.
Imagine if they leaned into that. An ancient skorpion, guiding the humans he guards with his troves of knowledge. Have him be adaptable, a manifestation of the evolving wilds, a creature that grows to match every scenario. And that's why he gets to be flexible with items, use every stat, maybe even have a passive that interacts with them.
Hell, keep the crystal image and have them change colour depending on what stat he invested the most gold into.
Skarner barely needed a rework. Only his Passive needed changes and the rest of his kit should have been buffed/adjusted to compensate.
I used to play him a fair bit, and his biggest flaws were that he wasn't tanky enough to get in there, but when he singled out an opponent, he was able to drag them back into his team and change the tide of battle because of it. His Q was perfect, just needed some buffs, his W (while boring) was perfect for getting in there and tanking hits, which should have been beefed up more, and his E was weak but enable him to initiate his whole "stick to his prey" gameplay. His Ult was already perfect the way it was, probably needed some small tweaks at best.
The new Skarner does nothing to make him enjoyable to play. He feels slow, boring, and tedious to play. I miss his stickiness, where foes couldn't escape you once you initiated on them. Bring back THAT Skarner. Also, they removed his "Skar, Skar, Skarner !" voiceline when he's in brush. 0/10 rework.
No offense, but people couldn't give more fucks about old Skarner. That creature was whack as hell. Not only he is a monster champion (which means the popularity is gonna be naturally lower than the human champions) but all of his old design (including lore, appearance, that odd map passive, etc) simply didn't belong to the current days, totally out of place with the rest of the game.
That Skarner was a product of his time, aka OLD ASS League (the one with the summoners), and people didn't really talk about him that much. It was only relevant when the champ was occasionally OP, but that was it.
@@KD_Oliveira
Doesn't change the fact that the current version sucks ass and needs to go back to the drawing board.
@@Pikmaniak His old design can never be balanced cause of the ult, tho.
@@dieptrieu6564 *passive
Malzahar with suppression is balanced just fine, so are champions with point-click ults
His only problem was that he relied too heavily on his team to help with his passive to be viable. So he was either too weak without passive working, or if tuned, too strong with it, no in-between
God I was so dissapointed with skarner's rework. I am specially annoyed at the whole "crystal scorpion isn't original enough" bit that they said before just slapping down a grey blob and calling it a day. They could have done so much for him appearance wise, even if they moved away from the crystal theme but they somehow went for the single most boring thing possible.
As if a literal crystal scorpion isn't the most basic and boring idea they could ever have come up with. Also, he's not grey. He's teal with orange highlights. Are you blind?
They got a decade of time to Come up with something new. Yet they completely delete a champ from a loyal player base and replace it with another random tank with a boring kit. If its boring design atleast give it a visual update with a small kit rework would have been 10 times better.
@@nem3732 What sort of drugs are you on, and how many times were you slammed into your skull as a baby?
You couldnt be more wrong
@@nem3732He’s a scorpion with three tails now, and crab claws. It’s not much better.
@@nem3732 You are not saving Skarner with those arguments lol
Only thing i really dislike is the fact that they removed build variety, the only way you can play him now is building full tank and before when he was kinda like a bruiser/statchecker he was kinda fun to play
asol needs to be in the fuck you tier more than any other
The biggest reason that skarner is currently garbage, is his scaling(only really hp) and his ult being unusable, since 90% of all champions have escapes, and 100% of players have flash.
Og Skarner just pressed R, and dragged someone (mainly ADC or echanter sup) into a gangbang.
New Skarner needs external CC to actually land his R, and if it's a three-man ult then hope you didn't drag the fed enemy Darius with you.
@@ChucktheSpicyChicken New Skarner feels clunky and is only a stat checker now. No build variety and they should have deleted his ult in favor of a better kit. I liked him most before he got all of his abilities changed around or mini reworked.
If u think skarner R is unusable then ur delusional. Even playing him in masters elo there are always ways you can kidnap someone that oversteps especially tank supports thinking they are fine but if u R into E on them ur team just demolishes them.
@lithin3567 Unless the Skarner hit you into a wall with his E, you can littarly walk away and if he does hit the E you can just flash at the last second. And if he finishes R prematurely at best, he gets 0.5 seconds of suppression and unless you jumped him under tower or he has allies nearby that suppress has been wasted. Only way you can land a full R as Skarner is if you have something like a Morgana Q, Ornn in general, or a Sion Q or R.
@@ChucktheSpicyChicken And what rank are you and how much have u played skarner?
Highly disagree with the stuff around character design - I do agree his kit is not that exciting or exhilarating as the build diversity was basically gutted within a single patch - I would say simply reverting some of the damage scaling changes is what would make the most sense and fix a lot of his problems and that's all we need
I don't know how anyone would see damage scaling by max HP as a good idea. I really like that for example Sions spells scale with AD and AP, so he can not really build damage (if you are not Baus).
Damage scaling with max HP is not necessarily a problem. It allows tanks such as Zac to deal enough damage to compete without giving them such high base damage that they still deal damage when they are 0/9. It translates gold into damage output, which is still very important for tanks on toplane or in jungle. If they had that kind of damage regardless of the gold they earned, they would move to support if their remaining kit allows it.
But if it's the ONLY damage scaling your champion has, then that obviously kills the build variety because then you are locked into just 1 playstyle. It WOULD be nice if you could focus on different aspects of you champion's kit by building different stats - as old Skarner allowed you to do as well, or how you could play old Aatrox or old Sion as AP nukes - , but Riot is Riot.
Oh wao 😓😰😰😫 no way damage that scale off hp xd no so unfair
I'm still so sad Riot deleted my main-... Old Skarner was incredibly fun and had BUILD VARIETY! You could build LITERALLY ANYTHING on him and it was GREAT!
But now? You're a slow, generic tank.
yeah just go malphite Lmao this new skanrer i havent even palyed (semi skanrer main played more rammus j4)
Man , I feel you. Happened the same to me with Asol. So sorry for you skarner mains
@@maximus2463I played quite a bit of Asol too and I miss him :[
Join the club. I miss when rengar's ferocity stacks persisted out of combat, when his bonetooth necklace stacks were more interesting than "+Ad%", when ap rengar was a *somewhat* viable meme build
I miss my speedy boy skarner
me too kid, me too...
That was my biggest issue, with the other reworks, they atleast tried to keep the same fantasy of the champ alive, but they completley gutted it. Like sion got completley overhauled, but still filled the idea of a tank juggernaut that wants to be right inthe fight. Aatrox, while very different, still fit the same niche as a sustain fighter.
Okay but I want the giant scorpion to be ugly. League has been cannibalizing its own art direction for years to ensure every new champion is pretty or cool looking. I don't want more monster champions like Kha'Zix (aka a human-shaped bug). I want a monster champ where people's first reaction to it is "What the hell is that thing?"
Fr
Where do you see the human in kha? Wat?
@@feedarman4888i once met a girl that kept insisting that "the bug man is hot!!!!" So most people see kha zix as human i think
ugly in this sense is that the color pallete is boring and the general theme of the champion just feels like big scorpion, he doesn't need to be hot, but he is most certainly ugly was nasty colors and a boring art direction.
They could do so much with him like fantasy monster hunter shit but instead they decided to go normal scorpion with 3 tails and grey pallete, just make the zerg version mutalisk with wings you showed as concept riot...
I think the ruination was definitely a bigger failure than the skarner rework
Idk, they sold a lot of skins and made a lot of viego mains
The ruination created viego and ahkshan. Also yassified thresh. Definetely a failure.
u diffently didnt play when they reworked classes that is biggest filures
@@nonameimpotantlive9233whatt kat and lb rework were funny
@@x-nimator9997not yass thresh, handsome
I remember people were saying that pre rework Taric was so old, that his feet looked like 2 blocks of cement.
Skarner had just released and already his rework needed a CGU
Ah yes the 72% win rate in worlds "failure".
thats exaclty the issue. Skarner is in pro play prison, He's either too op that he is picked all the time in high elo, or just undertuned enough where he's increadibly boring. High winrate =/= good design.
4:05 I think the passive was what many hated about Skarner and ruin his old kit.. cuz all of his abilities individually were good and together they were very viable for different builds and runes but his passive was horribly inconsistent throughout the game and with an VERY easy counterplay.. Making him a new and consist passive (like the current one) and updating a little the rest of his abilities would have been perfect..
I played a lot of old Skarner top, and it's passive was actully good. I'm shure your wondering how could a top skarner say that. Well skarner E gived every bonus of the passive while the ennemy was stun, so it was incredible to just use e on a minion wave, get huge attack speed, move speed, mana regen and stun all the minion to regain an other e while pushing the wave and regaining the mana in the progress. You could even throw your e on the wave and the ennemy at the same time to get a free trade.
"Skarner is riot's biggest failure ever"
Wrong. Yuumi exists.
@@Scottishcyclops228 #deleteyuumi
I'll take 70 Yuumis over what they did to my boy.
@@NankerooSame
Mmmm yuumi
A flying skarner that can fly to his crystals anytime sounds fun.. 😂 it would also be fun if Skarner could pull an enemy while leaping. (Leaping distance would vary and be way longer if it could reach inside the area of his crystal spires.)
Skarner is a failure but for Riot it doesn't even crack top 50
bro made a rework list and skipped ryze's lmao
correction, Lee Sin ASU has been out since May 1st
I'm dumb as shit lmao
@@DumbsLIVE ahaha all good
I disagree.
Should they have reworked it like Aatrox?
Why did the champion become popular?
His popularity comes from the fact that he is broken, the champion literally IKs a champion if he hits his 3 Qs. He was doing a full lethality build that didn't make him fragile, the champion healed so much that he ignored the fragility of the lethality build and even if he was against a tank, the lethality build still worked because of the damage from the 3 Qs.
Aatrox has already entered the Life Spiral, like Lee Sin, Ahri, etc. No matter the reason, the moment one of their win rates drops or leaves the top 10 in the lane, Riot will automatically buff them.
Skaner, on the other hand, is in the Death Spiral, like Cho'Gath, Kog'Maw, Quinn, etc. They don't care about these champions anymore, if their win rates are low or they are RIP, they will go months or years without appearing in the Patch Notes.
If a broken build appears on a champion who is in the Life Spiral, it will stay there for 03 or 04 patches without being removed.
But if it is on a champion who is in the Death Spiral, in the next Patch Notes they will remove the interaction.
As someone who played skarner alot before quitting early this year, i got to try skarner before he was butchered, i didnt particularly mind the appearance change but i feel like his entire gameplay was too different, even the ult felt more clunky to use and felt like it took away what the old ult was meant for, i dont think i couldve ever imagined a rework in a game be this alienating and miss the whole point
Nah the failure was them taking so long for the rework.
Udyr had to move through Covid, post covid, and each of his forms needing their own model so the community was surprisingly patient.
The rework is fine. The only thing I missed was being able to go AS on skarner.
Like seriously I HATED that old passive why would you ask for it to be kept in some form?
apparently ppl liked to "run fast on the jungle" and that's it, but realistically it was a garbage passive.
I loved the passive. It was bad, it was annoying at times, but the sense of "map control" it added was really cool. I think they could have simply improved it instead of changing it.
Because the majority of the people complaining barely actually played him and have massive rose tinted glasses
Skarner used to be a verry fast bruiser with low (but fast) damage
Now he is just slow and his cooldowns feel to long for what they do he used to basically have a perma shield witch was his way of being a bruiser
Skarner is just a worce nunu now
The way i woyld rewok him is that fruendly towers act as his pillars.
Affecting the lane they are in and the jungle they are next to.
He can also place a crystal on a destroyed tower with a 30sec cooldown. But it has health like a ward abd only 1 can be actif at yhe time.
And it would function more like his old pasive withouth the mana regen
why is there no Aurelion in last category
"first champion to be forgotten twice"
Yorick: "Am I a joke to you?"
Just make his passive like fiddlewards that he can place. One change on one ability, but no reworked him into... nothing.
I played a lot of Skarner and the no.1 reason why I don't like the new one is that he's so slow, even when going through walls. And you can't really build him fast either in a way that makes sense. Full movementspeed Skarner in late game used to be a menace and super fun.
For his design: as stupid and simple the idea of scorpion x crystals was, it had a charm and it was fairly unique. Also imo his ingame model looked really good for being so old (I wished they ever bothered to update his spells). They removed this design to retcon the hexcrystal lore because people were shitting on Seraphine or something, I don't even remember. What a shame.
i'll miss the old skarner, people say he was unplayable and boring but before the rework riot buffed him and holy moly, that was the only thing the character needed in my opinion, a good and balanced buff.
And here I am with the "any champions I main, they got changed" curse. Pick up Morde, gutted. Switch to Vikor, hex core gone. Master Urgot, crabbed. Flying swords with Irelia, now auto to death. Balling with ASol, balls no more. What's wrong with unpopular picks? Let me and their fan enjoy the champions.
If at least they kept some level of uniqueness and identity when reworking them it would be fine, but I'm still fuming about A-sol. One of the most unique playstyle in the game reduced to just infinite scaling stacks and DoT....
Have to agree on this most champs I liked got reworked. Super unlucky I really liked old Morde, Ryze, Aatrox and now Skarner. Nothing left for me honestly. It was a fun road but I will quit after Dragonball Sparking Zero comes out since I used to play BT3.
if you actually enjoyed this champs pre rework, i'm afraid you have a thing for bad design, not unpopular champs. like, old urgot? really? you think that was good?
Nostalgia is indeed a disease sometimes, how can you miss a Passive that only allows you TO SPEND GOLD to buy items that upgrades your abilities
Sorry but old Urgot and Morde were a**.
They were hideous and not fun.
You forgot Asol in the "removed champion" category :(
Also, you forgot Galio in the reworks.
He's my boy!
Riot's worst mistake is always whatever last champion they release/champion rework they do nowdays, they never learn lol
UNLESS its a female champ with more than 5% pickrate. Oh, they always stick to the meta.
As a former Skarner main i have no clue why Skarner’s passive was the main point for needing a rework. It was so useful as a tracking/invading tool. One of the coolest passives in the game honestly.
On paper, it was a cool idea. But in praxis, this passive was way too problematic for Skarner.
If the Spires gave him too much power, he had to be weak outside of them or else he would steamroll literally everyone. But if he was strong outside the Spires, then the passive had to be weak and practically become useless outside of tracking, and even that isn't very reliable.
TLDR: Spires were a total balancing nightmare for Skarner.
@@springbosslpI agree, but that's not a reason to remove them entirely. They could have found better solutions.
@@Citrin1s Nah, they had pretty good reason to delete the spires
In fact you could have just kept his kit the same and just replaced the spires with a well designed passive and you're basically good to go
The champion reworks give off the feeling they ask "How can we change this" before asking "should we change this"
Yeah now everyone was main skarner and everyone loved him
Nice vid man, keep it up!
New skarner looks cool. But he would’ve been absolutely amazing if he was just crystalline purple, on top of it.
Really enjoy your history commentry vids the parodi be lovely but this stuff is also chefs kiss
Let me hold the Q rock forever, remove the timer. And make it so higher level Q rock gives more hits before it breaks. And make the amount of hit you can do scale off something so i can make infinite Q rock build.
3:00 Yuumi and Zeri should be in that list but for some reason they stay in the game...
I dont know man, I really enjoy this rework. It was funny asf in toplane with your crazy E outplays, the thing is that it happened like with ksante, nerfed to the ground so you just feel useless, and that is boring, like his Q damage was reduced alot, W shield, slow and damage, E cooldown and damage, R duration and cooldowb
I honestly like his design, but I'm one of the 5 guys who like ugly and monster champs (I mained Urgot and Mundo before landing on my beloved Yorick, when autofill jg I spam Voli K6 and RekSai) but when you mentioned the Voidborns yeah I'd have to agree, I can see him not being appealing compared to other monster champs and it kinda looks out of place in the game, like, you're forced to use a skin if you play reworked Skarner
I don't like skarner rework cuz he fails at everything that was cool about skarner, build variety, sustain dps, single target displacement and lockdown. He still is as tanky as old skarner but that's what made him useful, not what made him cool.
Old skarner was fundamentally functional, he just needed to have a new passive that made him not breakdown as soon as someone learnt the matchup. What he didn't need was a redesign, especially when he actually had a healthy base of mains who only had one real problem with his kit, his passive. The core gameplay philosophy of skarner was fundamentally sound it just needed to be made functional.
And the biggest thing that really killed the new skarner as an old skarner player, is that nothing scales with movespeed, old skarner's most iconic stat. At the end of it all he's not appealing to new players because he's been pigeon-holed too hard into one playstyle while not achieving anything old skarner mains wanted from him in the first place.
I have a personal issue with how they took the mangled corpse of old skarner's beauty of an ult and ruined it by: Not making it point and click (consistent), not making it scale with ms(fun) and not making it turn (versatile)
I still like to play new Skarner, I at least have fun with him 😢. Even play some games with old Skarner before the rework to get a feel of how much will change
what I liked about old skarner was the movespeed and that I forced the enemy adc to build Quick Silver. to also add the point and click CC, I like point and click CCs
Yah the moment they took away his Crystals and changed the lore in favour of Seraflop, welp his vgu also became a flop too... 😑
This guy makes me cringe with his sunglasses. He really do think he is him
I believe if they keep his old design as crystal scorpion it would really fun to look at. As for gameplay, I have to say... I feel like doing nothing when I'm playing as skarner. Like I feel like I'm hitting them with wet noodle.
I keep hearing the argument for Skarner’s E to scale with Movement speed, but that simply wouldn’t work if they kept the set distance he can travel.
If you want his e to scale with movement speed, you need the distance cap removed too
Why it wouldn't work? You cross the same distance, but faster. Seems quite strong to me. If initial E slowdown becomes less severe, it will make it stronger too
@@Moonflush If it scales with movement speed then the E will become even harder to drift and control, like with Nunu W going too quickly.
if there’s a minor speed buff to it, then that’s fine
This video seems really biased to me.
If you like big monster champs, you probably wouldnt think he is ugly.
I also dont think he is boring at all. I think most juggernaut fans would probably like Skarner. He also has a surprisingly deep learning curve.
And old Skarner was deathly unpopular. Last rework to his kit basically fucked skarner. But his old old kit wasnt exactly great either, so reverting it wasnt a great idea.
I also dislike how people always rave about his health ratios. Yeah, you are pretty much forced to build health on him, but.... does that matter? You are pretty much forced to build a certain way on almost all champs in league anyway.
Health gives him durability and damage, very similar to Mundo.
It can be argued that a more AD oriented Skarner might be a better idea. Still keeping some of the health scalings, but bumping his AD scalings up so stuff like BC and Titanic become good on him. Titanic particulary is rather fun to use on him and it'd be great to have it as a legitimate option available depending on situation. But that is just a few measly numbers changes away.
im sorry but the morde rework and aatrox rework was so good and i played both champs before and after rework
Skarner got shafted both in gameplay and lore. At least he looks kinda cooler now…?
There are 4 things that make it a bad rework (imo)
1. His E is just cunky AF.
It slows you down to 10 ms (no matter how fast you are), and then your ms has to ramp up again, only for it to be capped at like 800. Just remove the slow it gives and that ability would be waaaaaay better. The cap is fine on itself, but imagin running in from base with homeguard with like 600ms, only to be basically crippled for like 0.2 secs. Just feels awful.
2. His Ult cast time is too long.
People complained about his ult having like almost no counterplay (cuz it was Point-And-Click), now its stupid easy to dodge it. The fact that its AOE does not help really much to compensate. Make the cast animation shorter, so it feels usable without the need of other CC's
3. His Ult literally cripples him
Why is that? Why can i not flash when i ulted? Unlesss i activated ghost (or some other ms-boost from my teammates), the pull-disctance is just comically short. Remember those "YOU ARE GOIN TO BRAZIL" Pulls? Literally impossible unless you have a Thresh in your team (if you can even interact with his Lantern while Ulting someone).
4. His passive makes absolutely no sense on him
Honestly his Passive is just dogsh*t. Dont give him DOT, maybe be like "After 3 consecutive hits, reduce the targets armor/magic resist by 2-10.5% (based on Level) for 5 seconds", cuz the damage output is cute at best and borderline useless in all honesty. He is not supposed to be the Damage Dealer, he is supposed to be a Tank making the life of the Damage Dealers easier by crippling the enemy team. The DOT can be keept since its not really doing much anyway in my experience(or lower it for champions to balance it out).
The Q and W are fine. Maybe i would make it when Skarner pulls a rock out with his Q that he gets an Attack Speed Bonus for the time he has the Rock on him.
Dang this turned out with waaaaaay more text than i thought lol
I know you dont like new Skarner but dont be that rude to my main please (i mained old one,and got stuck with reworked)
"first chamion to be forgotten twice"
Laugh in Yorick
I think the design is good , I mean It's a matter of taste in the end, but I respect your opinion.....and I also agree with making his E scale with movement speed and these shit
2:10 lee sin asu is already out
They didn't turn him into a hot crystal scorpion mommy
Monster champions just suck
It's why ahri and lux get so many skins
I think little tweaks could make a big impact. First and foremost if you say "on year" dont have it be TWO FULL YEARS to get it done. There's no excuse fo rit and ANY hype you had aorund him died long before he managed to actually come out. Give him some AD scaling so he can have an offensive option like Malphite. Make it so his wall run lowers your speed by 10% or something rather than a flat amount. (MS scorpion jumpscare!) Make him something more than just a bland meat shield with CC and a three hit passive! I might not be the biggest fan of the formal crystal bug but the fact is i'd rather get discourse of another Sona vs Seraphine situation because THIS leaves NOBODY happy.
as someone who has mained skarner since 2014ish i personly like the rework but yeah sometimes i found myself just wandering arround eating damage
I think if they changed his e by making skarner slide after it runs out and he only stops if he hits something or he keeps losing move speed until fully stops
Idk im loving skarner. Just started playing recently tried a few champs, but skarner has stuck. I love skarner because of his insaine cc
I'm expecting your apology video for difaming my boy Skarner
I have to wear sunglasses to watch your videos (it’s 1AM)
They like to add long channeling abilities to new tanks which makes them more balanced but more frustrating to play. The delays on the Q when its a spam ability or the E start movement feels really annoying compared to mundo or old skarner fast reaction ones. I still remember how horrible ornn E was.
Use to be a Skarner main wayyyyy back, butt eventually, one discovers there is actual life elsewhere :!
Those early sketches look nice, they should've completely reworked him as a multi form champ where, like Kayn, you can chose a form and stick to it. That flying monster sketch looked great.
Honestly if Riot took inspiration from Dota’s Sand King for some abilities, I wouldn’t have complained.
I realized the other day that I am ranked 5 mastery Skarner, but I’ve used him like once since the rework lmao.
Tbf, thats mostly because I only play bot and support
I personally like playing Skarner, might be cause I like playing tanks so I don't find it boring, I might be a psychopath, who knows. But they definitely should uncap the E ms and make it faster, also more variety in builds could help make him more interesting for sure, for most people at least.
Didnt mention aurelion in champ removal
9:20 yeah like removing his hole unique thing in stances and change them into just Abilities he has, making them feel so Semi cohesive.
Like they work just fail to understand what made staying in stand or not intersting, so now you're just forced to keep switching.
how is he a failure if he's being use in worlds and one of the champ who has the highest winrate?
Grey Blob was on point, Skarner Rework couldve really needed some better colors. Tho I really like the new Skarner as a character and his model (I think the 3 Stingers are really badass), the colors spark no excitement and I think what would've made him cooler is if he wouldve came with some accessories people made for him like Asols Crown.
But for the gameplay tho...
I think there are things that are left to be desired. They didn't fully leaned into the giant ancient warrior Kaiju aspect with some abilities and the earthbending isnt there at all. Skarner doesn't ever summon a wall or uses a technique that he practised over 100 of years he just feels like a big scorpion who throws rocks.
Passiv a 3Hit woohoo, Q Pulls out a rock and throws it, W farts, E Burrowing Grappler Train actually something cool, R could've just been completely reworked at this point?
Impale was Old Skarners thing to drag an enemy champion around it worked because he was speedy, the new one tho is a slow and heavy tank.
I just love this new rework
The teal rock thematic with the bulky upper body and even more monstrous look is just so fucking good.
I aggressively hated Skarner's passive, and thought while his moveset can be funny it had little to no skill expression beyond what every other character already has. I think the new combo-centric design is much better then the old one, though I will say the speedy skarner and more attack focused aggressive playstyle is a bit lost for more controller aspects
I personally love controller style tanks, like most in smite, so this is right up my ally.
Litterally made a champion they can't buff without him being pick or ban but the only difference is they actually nerf him when he his strong vs every other 200yr champ
I can relate to you skarner main. I still can't forgive riot about what they do with mordekaiser rework. I never play skarner but rework skarner feels like sluggish (idk the word is correct or not for his slow movement). I feel slow playing him. I love non-dash champion like chogath, morde, fiddle, but none of them made me slow as skarner rework eventhough skarner have abilities to walking through the wall.
I think if riot want to create skarner as a big guardian ancient scorpion, but still feels like old skarner, i think they should make his abilites scaling with health, ap, and AD. I remember old skarner have flexible build. If you want tanky, build health and resistance, if you want damage build ap or ad. Or you can go semi tank if you like.
The Urgot Rework failed me so much they made him into a discount bane from a cool ass zombie cyborg.
You are correct Skarner top for those patches before his nerf was CANCER to play against
Yeah, range damaging abilities that also provide shield at the same time are literally cancer. It was a totally clear failure design since Sett release.
I was hoping they would make him more of a caster than a tank. I loved the concept of the shrines and i was dreaming they would make more of his kit revolve around "capture and hold" parts of the jungle.
Which category would Asol be?
4th
they completed gutted his entire identity and only keep his character (his model and personality)
There seems to be a systematic problem at riot where a lot of issues from previus reworks of any kind seem to have been adressed or learned from in every new rework. For example almost every rework makes a build diverse champ into a 1 build with 2 interchangable items champ, where the only time the build changes is when an item is insanely broken or has a weird interraction with the champ that was noticed in korea. Or when reworking a champ just straight up replacing almost every unique mechanic and replacing it with generic abilities with 1 unique niche like skarner being able to now go through walls, yey?
It feels the devs are either too scared to make a champ that can have more then 1 build, or someone is stopping them from breaking the template
He is not skarner ):
Rell, Kench also got changed, Kench R and W got swapped and Rell E was changed to be ramping speed boost with dmg on it in aoe from tether to an ally and any enemy in-between is stunned. which was a good chain cc with her W, sad it was changed :(
still miss volibear to this day 😢😢😢
Damn, the reworked Skarner looks like a colorless blob. Maybe they could've made him, idk, a different kind of scorpion. Ooooh, maybe a crystal scorpion? How cool would that look?
Nah, a crystal scorpian who's entire species has been killed for the sake of advancing tech of an entire city is not original enough, a colourless boomer blob is an extreamly creative design, you just don't understand fine art.
No you don't understand, he needs African Wakanda motifs for some reason
Gameplay is bad, lorewise is the best choice they made ever
Edit: related to the video: if this "canadian guy" was canadian then he would know about letterkenny