God & Time | Interview Q&A
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- Опубликовано: 30 сен 2024
- Dr. Craig is interviewed on the philosophy of time and God's relationship to it.
Special thanks to Tyler Fowler, Dale Glover, and David Russell for this interview.
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Talk about perfect timing.
Great conversation, thanks for posting it. Dr. Craig's ideas about God and time are uncommon and fascinating, and I wish we could hear him talk on that subject more often.
I have been waiting for an interview from Doctor Craig on the topic of God and time for a long time now! This is a treat.
Dr. Craig's reply to the question on Hugh Ross's model was admiraly charitable.
(Yes, "Ross's" is acceptable in English. Good day!)
True story...its just like Fish and Fishes is also acceptable....
Would Dr Craig be willing to dialogue with physicist James Fodor? He authored "Unreasonable Faith" which has a chapter engaging Dr Craig's work in time. He's quite knowledgeable and would make a great conversation or debate partner.
Ps I would be delighted to moderate. Heck, I'd donate 400 dollars to a charity of Dr. Craig's choosing. Let's make it happen in August!
This is great, seeing the interview on Reasonable Faith and the impact it has had on so many below. My co-hosts on Faith Unaltered and I were thrilled with how this interview turned out and it is edifying hearing that this is a topic was appreciated since it hasn't otherwise been touched on in a lot of interviews. Look forward to having Dr. Craig back on in the future to perhaps do a discussion with other experts with different views in the next one :) God bless, Dale.
God is not becoming. God is.
This is one of the topics I most struggle with.
Omniscience is a dusty museum. Everything is old, nothing is new. God can only create the illusion of novelty.
Awesome. Always enjoy listening to WLC
Will Dr. Craig be going on Jordan Peterson’s podcast at any point in the future?
And or dialogue with James Fodor, author of "Unreasonable Faith," which directly engages Craig's work on time.
@@TheProdigalMeowMeowMeowReturnsnot impressed with Fodors book, but I’d like to see it for sure.
This is a prayer of mine!!!
Time refers to change which is a transition between states which are spatial arrangements of an empirically verifiable substance. Causal finitism is compatible with atheism. You guys need to stick to presuppositionalism and the tag argument for god. The others are just too easy to refute. Time has to do with becoming, not being. Nothing comes into being
Thank you so much for putting together this interview. *Lose the nervous laughter.*
You are most welcome, it was a pleasure having Dr. Craig on the show. Yeah, we were definitely anxious having Dr. Craig on the show given he has been so impactful for us in our faith in Christ through his work. But note to self, less nervous laughter next time :)
Yeah. Dr. Craig is a BIG deal!
@@Gruuvin1 Yep :)
This was pure bliss until about 49:00 where Craig just straight up wiffs.
The existence of the words foreknowledge or foreordained or foreknown are NOT ignored or hand waved by modern Open Theists.
They would demonstrate that these words aren't limited to later utility by theologians to describe divine timeless exhaustive attributes in a classical theistic philosophical manner. People can foreknow things using the same words. People foreirdain things.
Pointing out this fact doesn't imply the uses are IDENTICAL. Obviously God is superior to us in every way, but nothing in the text spells out the kind of metaphysical exhaustive Omniscience which is synonymous with God knowing himself but covers every fact that will ever exist.
It's an act of philosophical elegance to collapse the 2.
God does not depend on time!
To Christ all our sins were future. None past or present. He being outside of time saw all ones sins prior to them committing them. Therefore according to Lord Jesus, all in time is future.
Dr. Craig's view is that God was timeless without creation and entered into temporal relations at the moment of creation. Going from "not having created" to "having created" seems to entail a temporal change. - RF Admin
Thank you for responding to me. Yes prior to my comment I see what was implied, and certainly more than that, for He did begin the temporal.
"Having created" did entail an "addition" (temporal), to and within the eternal, which will pass away at the moment the eternal state commences.
Dear brother, I want to rewatch this again, and I might add to my reply.
Dwell on all the fullness of the Godhead bodily.
Love in the best kind, His Unconditional!
.@@ReasonableFaithOrg
So this guy doesn't believe that God could have created other creations? That this creation is God's only creation? This is nonsense! What does he imagine God doing before He begins to create?
Does he think that God is merely existing without performing anything actionable? If this is the case, then one can argue that God existed in some kind of coma like state forever and for reasons unknow God just woke up and went to work creating stuff.
Yeah, right! That makes total sense! Not!!!
I can't believe anyone would buy into this logic. Time therefore must be infinitely regressable and there is no beginning or ending to absolute existence. There is only a beginning to state of being and that state of being can become over and over again forever into infinity.
Therefore, there must be an infinite number of creations which are state of beings and if there is an infinite number of creations or state of beings then there must be an infinite number of Gods which is also a state of being.
The problem is simple for the entire body of Christianity. Stop trying to fit all of the infinite into one God! It doesn't work! Which is why all your philosophical arguments can't explain more than a single solitary creation.
I will therefore reiterate. There are countless creations going back and going forward in time and space. It is time and space that is truly infinite exactly like all the numbers imaginable on the number line.
However, God exists on that number line of all existence as a clearly definable position with a beginning and an end. Two arbitrary numbers indicating His beginning and His end. However, infinite because everything in-between thos numbers is infinitely divisible and therefore infinitely infinite.
This gives God His unique state of being while maintaining His infiniteness. And within that infiniteness which is an infinity of infinities God can do whatever the hell He pleases for infinity.
Wrap your head around that Dr Craig!!!
@51:00 you guys talk about the knowledge of Peter's betrayal 3 times before the Cock crows twice. Food for thought, cannot God hold back the crows of roosters -or- if you don't like that, cannot God arrange antagonists to question Peter in the manner that was known to get under Peter's skin, thus prompting the sort of reaction? I see no reason to put all the eggs in the single basket of simple knowledge when it's IMO just as possible, he was active in bringing those events about.
Love Dr. Craig but I find his definition of the present not completely satisfying. The reason it that is does not define what we as humans commonly understand as the present. When someone refers to ;"the present", most often, they are referring to an unspecified amount of time we reference as "now". I don't see how "now" is definable in strict measurement sense. For this reason, I think defining the present (past of future) stickily in units of time does not correctly convey the complete meaning of the present (past or future). I don't pretend to have the solution to this, but I do recognize a problem with its completeness.
Doesn't have to be a specified amount of time. I think we can't measure present in units.
I've always considered myself a fairly nerdy guy, but about ten minutes into this interview I was in over my head.
Yes!!!
Being doesn't create Becoming. Come on Bill.
Definitely one of my favorite interviews
If Sonship is a feature of Christ’s Manhood, is it at all problematic for it to be temporal? Sonship is one of the things that the WORD takes back to eternity. John 1:14.
It would be great to hear Dr. Craig’s opinion on Maxwell, Tesla, and Russell’s theories regarding Ether Physics.
I am new to apologetics. This has given me a lot to think about. Now I can’t ever say “in the present moment” without thinking that that the present potentially encompasses all time if you don’t define the eon, epoch, era or period.
I still need to contemplate what it means to be outside of time.
I pity you
@@midlander4 In that 12 second clip you recorded in your kitchen why would you film a personal letter that has your address on it?
@@MarkyMarkJ nice try. And my address is what exactly? Still no sky wizard 🤣
"Before there was a beginning, there was GOD. GOD began the beginning and GOD started start. GOD is bigger than the Beginning " - DR Myles Munroe
Bs
@@midlander4 ..i agree...Beautiful Saying indeed....or did you mean best sentence...never mind... either way its tops
Today I learned 2 things from this video.
1) Apparently I am an open theist. This is news to me.
2) Apparently I have no arguments against only timelessness, and none against Craig's view. I thought I did this in numerous publications, like "The Divine Timemaker." But maybe I am wrong.
For what it is worth, I will inform Tyler that he got you wrong, so that will be corrected on our end going forward Ryan :)
*The Enuma Elish would later be the inspiration for the Hebrew scribes who created the text now known as the biblical Book of Genesis.* Prior to the 19th century CE, the Bible was considered the oldest book in the world and its narratives were thought to be completely original. In the mid-19th century CE, however, European museums, as well as academic and religious institutions, sponsored excavations in Mesopotamia to find physical evidence for historical corroboration of the stories in the Bible. ***These excavations found quite the opposite, however, in that, once cuneiform was translated, it was understood that a number of biblical narratives were Mesopotamian in origin.***
*Famous stories such as the Fall of Man and the Great Flood were originally conceived and written down in Sumer,* translated and modified later in Babylon, and reworked by the Assyrians ***before they were used by the Hebrew scribes for the versions which appear in the Bible.***
***In revising the Mesopotamian creation story for their own ends, the Hebrew scribes tightened the narrative and the focus but retained the concept of the all-powerful deity who brings order from chaos.*** Marduk, in the Enuma Elish, establishes the recognizable order of the world - *just as God does in the Genesis tale* - and human beings are expected to recognize this great gift and honor the deity through service.
*"Enuma Elish - The Babylonian Epic of Creation - Full Text - World History Encyclopedia"*
*"Sumerian Is the World's Oldest Written Language | ProLingo"*
*"Sumerian Civilization: Inventing the Future - World History Encyclopedia"*
("The Sumerians were the people of southern Mesopotamia whose civilization flourished between c. 4100-1750 BCE."
"Ancient Israelites and their origins date back to 1800-1200 BCE.")
*"The Myth of Adapa - World History Encyclopedia"*
Also discussed by Professor Christine Hayes at Yale University in her 1st lecture of the series on the Hebrew Bible from 8:50 to 14:30 minutes, lecture 3 from 28:30 to 41:35 minutes, lecture 4 from 0:00 up to 21:30 minutes and 24:00 up to 35:30 minutes and lecture 7 from 24:20 to 25:10 minutes.
From a Biblical scholar:
"Many stories in the ancient world have their origins in other stories and were borrowed and modified from other or earlier peoples. *For instance, many of the stories now preserved in the Bible are* ***modified*** *versions of stories that existed in the cultures and traditions of Israel’s* ***older*** *contemporaries.* Stories about the creation of the universe, a cataclysmic universal flood, digging wells as land markers, the naming of important cultic sites, gods giving laws to their people, and even stories about gods decreeing the possession of land to their people were all part of the cultural and literary matrix of the ancient Near East. *Biblical scribes freely* ***adopted and modified*** *these stories as a means to express their own identity, origins, and customs."*
*"Stories from the Bible"* by Dr Steven DiMattei, from his website *"Biblical Contradictions"*
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In addition, look up the below articles.
*"Yahweh was just an ancient Canaanite god. We have been deceived! - Escaping Christian Fundamentalism"*
*"Debunking the Devil - Michael A. Sherlock (Author)"*
*"The Greatest Trick Religion Ever Pulled: Convincing Us That Satan Exists | Atheomedy"*
*"Zoroastrianism And Persian Mythology: The Foundation Of Belief"*
(Scroll to the last section: Zoroastrianism is the Foundation of Western Belief)
*"10 Ways The Bible Was Influenced By Other Religions - Listverse"*
*"January | 2014 | Atheomedy"* - Where the Hell Did the Idea of Hell Come From?
*"Retired bishop explains the reason why the Church invented "Hell" - Ideapod"*
Watch *"The Origins of Salvation, Judgement and Hell"* by Derreck Bennett at Atheologica
(Sensitive theists should only watch from 7:00 to 17:30 minutes as evangelical Christians are lambasted. He's a former theist and has been studying the scholarship and comparative religions for over 15 years)
*"Top Ten Reasons Noah’s Flood is Mythology - The Sensuous Curmudgeon"*
*"Forget about Noah's Ark; There Was No Worldwide Flood | Bible Interp"*
*"The Search for Noah’s Flood - Biblical Archaeology Society"*
*"Eridu Genesis - World History Encyclopedia"*
*"The Atrahasis Epic: The Great Flood & the Meaning of Suffering - World History Encyclopedia"*
Watch *"How Aron Ra Debunks Noah's Flood"*
(8 part series debunking Noah's flood using multiple branches of science)
*"The Adam and Eve myth - News24"*
*"Before Adam and Eve - Psychology Today"*
*"Gilgamesh vs. Noah - Wordpress"*
*"Old Testament Tales Were Stolen From Other Cultures - Griffin"*
*"Parallelism between “The Hymn to Aten” and Psalm 104 - Project Augustine"*
*"Studying the Bible"* - by Dr Steven DiMattei
(This particular article from a critical Biblical scholar highlights how the authors of the Hebrew Bible used their *fictional* god as a mouthpiece for their own views and ideologies)
*"How do we know that the biblical writers were* ***not*** *writing history?"* -- by Dr Steven DiMattei
*"Contradictions in the Bible | Identified verse by verse and explained using the most up-to-date scholarly information about the Bible, its texts, and the men who wrote them"* -- by Dr. Steven DiMattei
Sounds like you want to start a class of your own….
Yeah none of that's true. The reality is that JOB and GENESIS are older and truer than the mesopotamian myths which are in fact corruptions of the true account in Genesis and Job. we know this because (a) genesis 1 is so ancient the author doesn't even have pagan names for the sun and moon but just calls them 'the greater light' and 'the lesser light' and (b) the biblical text is in line with science and engineering eg the continents are originally said to be one supercontinent (1:9) and the ark has been reconstructed by marine engineers and found to be virtually unsinkable whereas the mosopotamian 'cube' or 'dingy' are jokes
"Religion began when the first scoundrel met the first fool." ----- Voltaire
No, that is how France began.
"In short, we find in them only an ignorant and barbarous people, who have long united the most sordid avarice with the most detestable superstition and the most invincible hatred for every people by whom they are tolerated and enriched." - Voltaire on the Jews in "A Philosophical Dictionary"
Maybe the venomous anti-semite shouldn't be as much of an atheist hero.
“Within 50 years of my death, religion will also be dead.”
Voltaire
Within 50 years of Voltaire’s death, his house was being used to print Gutenberg Bibles.
What an irony of history…..
Internet-atheists love posting this quote often without realizing that Voltaire, although not an adherent of organized religion himself, was NOT atheist, but rather a deist who reasoned that there is in fact a God.
This was awesome! I would love to see more discussions with Dr. Craig on the subject of time!
26:20 _"Big Bang cosmology which says that physical space and time, all matter and energy, began in the Big Bang. It was an absolute beginning before which nothing existed"_
That's not "Big Bang cosmology" but a property of *some suggested Big Bang cosmologies*
Greetings Dr. Craig. Just a suggestion. I noticed you introduced yourself as a Christian philosopher and theologian. Why not instead introduce yourself simply as a philosopher? And then if you must - a Christian theologian, or better still, a theologian of Christianity. Or even better still, as simply just a theologian.
Actually, I think it makes more sense the way Dr. Craig says it because he does have two PhD's- one in philosophy and the other in theology- so it makes sense.
Rather than Craig’s philosophical musings about human perception without evidence, I suggest reading The Order of Time by Carlo Rovelli.
Did you have a specific objection? - RF Admin
@@ReasonableFaithOrg Craig’s philosophical approach to time makes interesting speculations on the nature of God and time. While interesting, like all discussions of God made for centuries it argues for a position but does not move knowledge forward. The book I referenced covers the research being done on time that is actually moving knowledge forward.
@@waynesulak1488 Are you familiar with Dr. Craig's academic work on time? - RF Admin
Speaking of time Bill, how long does it take to drown a baby with your bare hands if your god 'commands' you to do it?
If you’re speaking of such a hypothetical, it would take only around 20 seconds. It wouldn’t matter who told you to do it.
I can't answer for Bill but it probably takes about 2 1/2 minutes to drown a baby with your bare hands. A clinical abortion usually takes about 40 minutes.
@@piracy22 I think WLC could do it faster. He's just that evil or insane, take your pick.
@@Reclaimer77 drowning is more about the victims ability to stay alive - adults can be under water longer without drowning.
@@Reclaimer77 What is evil? What is reality? Without answers to these questions, we're ALL just flinging poop with our words...
More cultspeak.