Odin is someone that as I used more and more, the better he felt to use and the more his strengths start to shine. The amount of Skl he has (particularly for a Dark Mage) is frankly insanely good.
20:04 the reason for this disconnect is simple: laslow is cool, which means he automatically gets 17 afa's drops, which stack for him (even though they normally don't). You should have factored that into your calculations.
I love Owain/Odin. I usually reclass him into Samurai and than Swordmaster for the speed growth and Astra before classing him back into Darknight, This way you get a speedy Dark Knight with balanced strength and magic that as a good trigger skill he can bequeath to his daughter.
I used to follow the old idea of samurai Odin which was useful enough but once I tried using him for nostanking he's consistently been one of my absolute best units in every playthrough since Always just enough to accomplish anything you need him to
Also thought I should add, his "bad start" can be negated by just buying nos before the join map then trading it to him, with Elise next to him for defense he has little trouble dealing with all the enemies on his join map
You could, but in order to afford it you'd need to sell the goddess icon and also not buy anything else until after chapter 8. So probably not worth imo
I think people tend to underestimate Odin's Skill and Luck (and on other units too) because, in most FE games, those are kinda dump stats. There are so many ways to fix accuracy in FE games before (or since) Fates that it feels like a stat that doesn't matter that much. However, I'd argue this is one of the few games in the series where good accuracy is not only good, but a necessity. So many enemies, from early to lategame, punish players' misses with HP reduction or stat debuffs, so it's always nice to have a unit that can mitigate these problems just by standing next to them and having access to accurate weapons (tomes).
Having good crit avo thanks to good luck is nice too, there's a lot of good non-bronze weapons that you wanna use and not facing a crit chance even without a bronze equipped is pretty good
Not really. Skill ( and to an extent luck but less so because crit avoid can matter) only really matter in the event you reclass into a class that shares none of your weapon types. Weapon ranks and support bonuses ( especially in attack stance) can significantly boost hit rates and even if you do want to go into a class that shares no weapons with your base weapon type there’s still ways to improve their accuracy enough ( notably attack stance and the avoid lowering aura of dark mages which is a significant chunk of Odin’s accuracy). Granted Odin very much benefits from a reclass into master of arms for skills so it matters for him but I’ve had base skill and luck Arthur’s still hitting things consistently with things late into the game on some cursed Ironmans with a combo of s rank axe’s hit bonus forged bronze just being that accurate and attack stance. If you wanna boost accuracy you have the means to do so. People just tend to have a bad habit of just automatically resorting to defense stance in attack stance situations or when they need the accuracy. Most of your accuracy when you need it for high avoid enemies comes from sources entirely unrelated to your stats. Weapon hit of bronze forges skills that lower enemy avoid and raise your hit support bonuses weapon rank occasionally class bonuses. If your stats matter a decent amount for your hit on most units you’ve significantly messed up their positioning.
@@ultimaterecoil1136 All other things equal, the hit rate difference between Nyx and Odin starts at ~10% and climbs to ~20% as the game progresses. That gap is quite sizable, and relevant because a lot of useful tomes have questionable base hit rates. Especially nosferatu, which is much more effective used in defensive stance. Skill is definitely less useful on a lot of physical weapon types though, since, as you noted, they often have little reason to leave behind the more accurate bronze weapons outside of the occasional effective damage use.
@@hawkeye611 nyx doesn’t really have the bulk to use nosferatu anyway nearly as effectively as Odin regardless so either way she wouldn’t be using it. And if you really want nyx to have more hit you can always pick up lucky 7 for a 20 hit boost (or even just make her an outlaw into adventurer and use shining bow which lets her use staves as well as have flier effectiveness in a route which that is very good. Also just makes her an absurdly good pair up bot. She’s like Charolette but magic for pair up stats and adventurer already gives 4 speed 2 res and 1 move so that would be 3 magic 6 speed 1 move so if you need a massive amount of speed on a unit sometimes it’s nice to have that option. But that’s another topic.
@@ultimaterecoil1136 Reclassing Nyx to improve her hit rates uses a resource that's limited for most of the game, reach level 5 promoted, and she still won't be able to use tomes with it unless you use a second heart seal. You could choose to have her stick in Adventurer, which is a probably her best option, but that also comes with the caveat that the shining bow she likely wants to use is probably going to be a pain to reach without an arms scroll. When I brought up the comparison, it wasn't to say you can't fix hit rates with other tools. You can make Base Benny double master ninjas in Conquest, but that doesn't make his low speed not a problem. In the same way, that Odin requires very little extra to excel in his role is a major advantage for him, and his high skill/luck contributes to this.
Great Video! I'm enjoying using Odin a lot right now in my current Hard mode run, so it was fun to hear a breakdown of his performance when I've experienced it this last week! If you're accepting requests, I'd love to hear a good analysis on Niles. I've still never used him past chapter 11 (and only then for the chests) because Mozu has always been a better bow unit for me, and most people who talk about Niles automatically assume that you're going to be using Kidnap and the Prison. It kinda feels like he gets ranked S Tier for that, and then they move on before discussing in depth what Niles himself can do.
For a little bit when I got into conquest lunatic after watching Zoran I underrated Leo reflexively after learning how good Odin was. Some guy on reddit destroyed me with facts and logic and stat averages and now I know their utility is damn near equivalent
In regards to the question at the end of the video, I would truly like an analysis of his fellow retainer Niles, especially when ignoring his capture utility. While strong, I think it obfuscates Niles as a physical bow unit especially when compared to the likes of Mozu/Effie or BowKnight Selena/Lasow and even Mr Boots man.
Odin helping me not suffering on chapter 10 truly makes him one of the best units. Such a shame he cant reclass to witch to nos tank as a dark knight or malig knight :(
I used Odin as a dark mage in my first playthrough and he did pretty great, I used nos tanking for awhile and eventually swapped over to Leo. But I did my first playthrough on the highest difficulty and I did each route simultaneously. And boy was I not expecting conquest to be so much harder. Odin genuinely probably saved my run.
This is a great video analysis. I've done both Dark Mage and Samurai paths for Odin and while Samurai Odin is fun you're right in saying that he preforms better as a Dark Mage with Nos while the Heart Seals is better off used on Mozu, Elise, or as I'm seeing in another playthrough by CodingAnt, on Nyx. Plus I'd argue that if you really want to use the Levin Sword with Odin he'd probably do more with it as a Dark Knight then as a Sword Master unless you really grind out for Swordfaire and Life and Death but at that point that's two Heart Seals used on him for just high player phase damage when Leo or a Nohr Noble Corrin can get better use out of the Levin Sword
I’ve only done one CQ Lunatic run, I did Corrin Marriage and swept the entire game. I am heavily biased but Odin is my goat. I one rounded Takumi as his darkness is was simply darker than Takumi.
never in my life have i played conquest so i dont have much to say but i sat my ass down and watched the whole video anyway, it was an interesting listen 👍
wait, i thought you were the one leading us. Oh crap, we must have both thought the other one was leading. Now we'll never make it to the party on time.
Can you explain how to make a Takumi killing Mozu? I played conquest like 300 hours in hard classic when it was originally released. Beat it a few times withotu minmaxxing or excessive reclassing (mostly just giving characters their natural upgrades, not the ones through friendship or marriage) and now a decade after I'm trying to beat it in lunatic.
Essentially, you want to use her as an archer throughout most of the game to build her bow rank so that she'll have A bows for the crescent bow (brave weapons are usually the best way of one-rounding Takumi), and late into the game you'll want to use heart seals to grab most of the level 15 skills she ahs access to, those being life and death, spendthrift, and bowfaire. Thankfully none of these require any specific supports. In combination with quick draw these skills will give her an extra 29 attack which makes her one of the best Takumi killers. Hope this helps!
To answer the thumbnail by the way: yes
Gay homosexual gay
Odin is someone that as I used more and more, the better he felt to use and the more his strengths start to shine. The amount of Skl he has (particularly for a Dark Mage) is frankly insanely good.
I know right? He always delivers especially in the accuracy department
20:04 the reason for this disconnect is simple: laslow is cool, which means he automatically gets 17 afa's drops, which stack for him (even though they normally don't). You should have factored that into your calculations.
Damn, I knew I must have been missing something 😔
I love Owain/Odin. I usually reclass him into Samurai and than Swordmaster for the speed growth and Astra before classing him back into Darknight, This way you get a speedy Dark Knight with balanced strength and magic that as a good trigger skill he can bequeath to his daughter.
I used to follow the old idea of samurai Odin which was useful enough but once I tried using him for nostanking he's consistently been one of my absolute best units in every playthrough since
Always just enough to accomplish anything you need him to
Also thought I should add, his "bad start" can be negated by just buying nos before the join map then trading it to him, with Elise next to him for defense he has little trouble dealing with all the enemies on his join map
You could, but in order to afford it you'd need to sell the goddess icon and also not buy anything else until after chapter 8. So probably not worth imo
I think people tend to underestimate Odin's Skill and Luck (and on other units too) because, in most FE games, those are kinda dump stats. There are so many ways to fix accuracy in FE games before (or since) Fates that it feels like a stat that doesn't matter that much. However, I'd argue this is one of the few games in the series where good accuracy is not only good, but a necessity. So many enemies, from early to lategame, punish players' misses with HP reduction or stat debuffs, so it's always nice to have a unit that can mitigate these problems just by standing next to them and having access to accurate weapons (tomes).
Having good crit avo thanks to good luck is nice too, there's a lot of good non-bronze weapons that you wanna use and not facing a crit chance even without a bronze equipped is pretty good
Not really. Skill ( and to an extent luck but less so because crit avoid can matter) only really matter in the event you reclass into a class that shares none of your weapon types. Weapon ranks and support bonuses ( especially in attack stance) can significantly boost hit rates and even if you do want to go into a class that shares no weapons with your base weapon type there’s still ways to improve their accuracy enough ( notably attack stance and the avoid lowering aura of dark mages which is a significant chunk of Odin’s accuracy). Granted Odin very much benefits from a reclass into master of arms for skills so it matters for him but I’ve had base skill and luck Arthur’s still hitting things consistently with things late into the game on some cursed Ironmans with a combo of s rank axe’s hit bonus forged bronze just being that accurate and attack stance. If you wanna boost accuracy you have the means to do so. People just tend to have a bad habit of just automatically resorting to defense stance in attack stance situations or when they need the accuracy. Most of your accuracy when you need it for high avoid enemies comes from sources entirely unrelated to your stats. Weapon hit of bronze forges skills that lower enemy avoid and raise your hit support bonuses weapon rank occasionally class bonuses. If your stats matter a decent amount for your hit on most units you’ve significantly messed up their positioning.
@@ultimaterecoil1136 All other things equal, the hit rate difference between Nyx and Odin starts at ~10% and climbs to ~20% as the game progresses. That gap is quite sizable, and relevant because a lot of useful tomes have questionable base hit rates. Especially nosferatu, which is much more effective used in defensive stance.
Skill is definitely less useful on a lot of physical weapon types though, since, as you noted, they often have little reason to leave behind the more accurate bronze weapons outside of the occasional effective damage use.
@@hawkeye611 nyx doesn’t really have the bulk to use nosferatu anyway nearly as effectively as Odin regardless so either way she wouldn’t be using it. And if you really want nyx to have more hit you can always pick up lucky 7 for a 20 hit boost (or even just make her an outlaw into adventurer and use shining bow which lets her use staves as well as have flier effectiveness in a route which that is very good. Also just makes her an absurdly good pair up bot. She’s like Charolette but magic for pair up stats and adventurer already gives 4 speed 2 res and 1 move so that would be 3 magic 6 speed 1 move so if you need a massive amount of speed on a unit sometimes it’s nice to have that option. But that’s another topic.
@@ultimaterecoil1136 Reclassing Nyx to improve her hit rates uses a resource that's limited for most of the game, reach level 5 promoted, and she still won't be able to use tomes with it unless you use a second heart seal. You could choose to have her stick in Adventurer, which is a probably her best option, but that also comes with the caveat that the shining bow she likely wants to use is probably going to be a pain to reach without an arms scroll.
When I brought up the comparison, it wasn't to say you can't fix hit rates with other tools. You can make Base Benny double master ninjas in Conquest, but that doesn't make his low speed not a problem.
In the same way, that Odin requires very little extra to excel in his role is a major advantage for him, and his high skill/luck contributes to this.
Great Video! I'm enjoying using Odin a lot right now in my current Hard mode run, so it was fun to hear a breakdown of his performance when I've experienced it this last week!
If you're accepting requests, I'd love to hear a good analysis on Niles. I've still never used him past chapter 11 (and only then for the chests) because Mozu has always been a better bow unit for me, and most people who talk about Niles automatically assume that you're going to be using Kidnap and the Prison. It kinda feels like he gets ranked S Tier for that, and then they move on before discussing in depth what Niles himself can do.
Niles is definitely one of the main considerations right now!
I've been looking forward to this video
For a little bit when I got into conquest lunatic after watching Zoran I underrated Leo reflexively after learning how good Odin was. Some guy on reddit destroyed me with facts and logic and stat averages and now I know their utility is damn near equivalent
In regards to the question at the end of the video, I would truly like an analysis of his fellow retainer Niles, especially when ignoring his capture utility.
While strong, I think it obfuscates Niles as a physical bow unit especially when compared to the likes of Mozu/Effie or BowKnight Selena/Lasow and even Mr Boots man.
Odin helping me not suffering on chapter 10 truly makes him one of the best units. Such a shame he cant reclass to witch to nos tank as a dark knight or malig knight :(
C'mon intsys let men wear the cool witch outfit!
I used Odin as a dark mage in my first playthrough and he did pretty great, I used nos tanking for awhile and eventually swapped over to Leo. But I did my first playthrough on the highest difficulty and I did each route simultaneously. And boy was I not expecting conquest to be so much harder. Odin genuinely probably saved my run.
They don't call him hero of the ages for nothing
This is a great video analysis.
I've done both Dark Mage and Samurai paths for Odin and while Samurai Odin is fun you're right in saying that he preforms better as a Dark Mage with Nos while the Heart Seals is better off used on Mozu, Elise, or as I'm seeing in another playthrough by CodingAnt, on Nyx. Plus I'd argue that if you really want to use the Levin Sword with Odin he'd probably do more with it as a Dark Knight then as a Sword Master unless you really grind out for Swordfaire and Life and Death but at that point that's two Heart Seals used on him for just high player phase damage when Leo or a Nohr Noble Corrin can get better use out of the Levin Sword
As for a character I'd to hear talked about I'm curious to hear about Benny
Nos tanking is the best utility.
I’ve only done one CQ Lunatic run, I did Corrin Marriage and swept the entire game. I am heavily biased but Odin is my goat. I one rounded Takumi as his darkness is was simply darker than Takumi.
never in my life have i played conquest so i dont have much to say but i sat my ass down and watched the whole video anyway, it was an interesting listen 👍
Dang your making me wanna play conquest again.
Dani Doyle brought me here.
wait, i thought you were the one leading us. Oh crap, we must have both thought the other one was leading. Now we'll never make it to the party on time.
Can you explain how to make a Takumi killing Mozu? I played conquest like 300 hours in hard classic when it was originally released. Beat it a few times withotu minmaxxing or excessive reclassing (mostly just giving characters their natural upgrades, not the ones through friendship or marriage) and now a decade after I'm trying to beat it in lunatic.
Essentially, you want to use her as an archer throughout most of the game to build her bow rank so that she'll have A bows for the crescent bow (brave weapons are usually the best way of one-rounding Takumi), and late into the game you'll want to use heart seals to grab most of the level 15 skills she ahs access to, those being life and death, spendthrift, and bowfaire. Thankfully none of these require any specific supports. In combination with quick draw these skills will give her an extra 29 attack which makes her one of the best Takumi killers. Hope this helps!
Odin is useful but can't believe he deserves top tier.
Top tier is reserved for corrin azura and xander. Everyone else is in a lower tier. Odin is one of the higher value units though.
Damn Camilla in shambles right now
Them being gay should have been a thing