DF Retro Hardware: MiSTer FPGA - A Brilliant Mini Emulation System Explored!
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- Опубликовано: 29 янв 2021
- What is the MiSTer FPGA? Well, an FPGA is a special kind of processor that can be programmed to emulate other processors at the most fundamental level, meaning stunningly accurate retro emulation... provided that talented developers provide the necessary emulation cores. In this video, John shows off his MiSTer, some of his favourite games and his bespoke set-up.
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I would love to see more videos about MiSTer, some core reviews and comparisons vs software emulation
I'm waiting on my analog IO board to come but I am going to do various videos comparing SNES, and other consoles I have on hand right now, so GB/C/A as well
11:09 what's the game name?
@@pirateclick1d169 the one in the background? That's Windjammers on the Neo Geo.
IMO, open source FPGA implementation/archival of original gaming hardware is tremendously exciting. Please continue coverage of the MiSTer! I already frequent DF for its detailed PC gaming coverage, and I'd love to see the same treatment delivered to FPGA based gaming platforms!
I'd love to see more DF Retro Mister breakdowns. Can only be good for the retro scene to have more people interested in the fpga scene and the core development!
I agree with this notion. The more people know about this, the more developers join the project and the faster its goal is reached. I watched a video about the MiSTer from Game Sack years back, and this video here only advanced my knowledge about the MiSTer.
Fantastic video, and thank you for the shout outs. So happy to see the MiSTer project getting the attention it deserves ❤️
I already said how awesome your Cave core was on Twitter and Patreon, but I’ll say it again fantastic work, it’s been a blast!!!
Thanks for your work! MiSTer is BeSTer.
I would be absolutely into more mister coverage! Some of my favorite stuff out there and it's moving and growing so fast!
The PC-Engine video emulation is insanely accurate. I often use the MisTer PCE core to test out my PCE dev stuffs.
I love to see mr. Linneman talking about retro stuff
Not new stuff then huh? 😅🤷♂️
@@Toni_De_Arcadia new stuff is also nice... but I think retro stuff is extra special for mr. Linneman... you can see the sparkle in his eyes lol
What's the game at 11:09
The whole carrier arwing "screen loading in differently" is the same quirk that caught out billy mitchell cheating the donkey kong arcade game. They found out he was cheating because the way the screens loaded in during his videotapes was in keeping with mame, rather than the blocky way of screens loading in as per the original hardware, also as with carrier arwing here. A series keeping tabs on FPGA vs emulation versions would be brilliant....the mister FPGA deserves regular coverage as its ever evolving.
I wonder if fPGA will be used by the inheritors of his cheating legacy. I bet in 50 years emulation and FPGA will be basically indistinguishable
@@spyczech I'd bet there will be MiSTer FPGA cores in less than 5 years which are indistinguishable from original hardware. Apparently, some of the best FPGA implementations already in MiSTer based on delidding ICs and studying them with microscopes are so accurate that they should be able to run in parallel with real hardware for years without desynchronisation. Also, some original arcade hardware, such as the Cave CV1000 boards, are apparently natively built on FPGAs in the first place - in this particular case, even in the same family of FPGA as the DE10 used in the MiSTer itself.
@@spyczech FPGA Donkey Kong is literally EXACTLY like the real PCB. You could write the ability to use cheats into the core yourself if you know VHDL or verilog.
@@JonnyTenebrous Bruh, there's already cores that are indistinguishable from real hardware. The Neogeo core? Furrtek built it using all the chips he's decapped on a neogeo. His cores are literally 1:1 exact copies that can be put together to make a new neogeo, or you can fab some of his cores onto ASICS, and get an adapter for them to fit on a real neogeo, and they work just fine.
@@youtubesuresuckscock AHAHAHAHAHA! "Cheapo devices". Bruh, the Cylcone V on the DE-10 nano is 250-300USD alone. IT's cheaper cause it's heavily subsided for school.
MAME still runs all CPS1/2 games without their wait state emulation properly. SF2 runs faster on mame than SF2 Turbo on Turbo 4 mode, which it totally shouldn't. The MAME dev team has known for over a decade and refuse to fix it. While on MiSTer? It's running exactly like it should. You don't understand that FPGAs literally become the full PCB logic that you code them too, do you?
This actually did increase my interest in arcade games now. I may have to invest in one and go down this rabbit hole.
I've owned one for over a year now and can pretty much say it is my single best retro gaming purchase. I initially bought it for the 'perfect' Amiga core, but now it is my goto for dozens of games/systems.
The Mame/Arcade rabbit hole is truly endless. Ninja Baseball Batman. Start there.
Best device ever. You wont regret it.
I have a MisterFPGA setup connected to a CRT and it is awesome. It "feels" like the real hardware.
Its impressive how good the snes core is. And i have a super NT to compare. Not playing on crt. I dont need that experience. ;)
@@martinmoller4947 The SNES core is more accurate than the Super NT and is getting more accurate as time goes on, while Super NT, not so much.
@@jackbootshamangaming4541 possible. And i guess more devs are working on the MiSTer cores. Kevtris did still a impressive job. I put the snt back in the box. Using the MiSTer is so convenient. Hope we get save states for snes core and every core possible.
It “tastes” like the real hardware.
@@logan_cadfgs Nah, real hardware for the systems this emulates is old enough that they still used leaded solder, so real hardware would be slightly sweeter.
This is just what I needed! I've been MiSTer- curious for a while now. Keep 'em coming!
Great video. I've always been fascinated by the FPGA scene. Never had the money for a system though. I hope you'll keep up the DF retro releases. They're all so fantastic.
I would love as much MiSTer content as you would love to create.
I think my favorite part of these videos is the music. Something about the complexity of these tunes somehow being composed despite the technological limitations of the time is just awesome.
would love to see more Mister videos! I especially like the comparisons to MAME if you get access somehow to original hardware to see how far these cores have come with accuracy
This video sucked and showed almost nothing. Go to Smokemonsters channel for better MiSTer information
I wouldn't be without my MiSTer now. I'm a massive Amiga fan and the Amiga core is a thing of beauty.
I was originally going to get a Vampire for my A500, but after doing cost/feature comparison to the MiSTer, I went with the MiSTer as it gave me the opportunity to play some consoles and computers I didn't have on-top of a great Amiga core.
Love my MiSTer. Would definitely like more in depth MiSTer content and comparisons.
Great video John, it really felt like the DF Retros of old. Hopefully you enjoyed making this, thank you so much!
And yes, please do try to keep tabs on the project, and doing the MiSTer/software emulation/real hardware comparative if you can.
Timely review! I just picked one up a few weeks ago and have been putting together a Shmups on MiSTer video for our crowd. Playing the old MSX games I haven’t before on the CRT while also getting an hdmi out for capture is pretty awesome. Just starting to test some of the original controller connection options , but really enjoying its versatility so far.
Great to see your best-in-the-business expertise applied to the MiSTer John - thank you! I got started on it during 2020 lockdowns and it's been a brilliant way of bringing arcade gaming memories back. No rush, but more please!
Hell yeah John. Great video as always. I would love to see you cover MiSTer more. 👊🏽
always up for more MiSTer coverage. thanks for the video john!
Thanks for the video. Kept hearing about the MiSTer on and off for a while now, so it's great to see a new video explaining it all.
Definitely would love to see more MiSTer videos .MiSTer seems to add cores and updates to cores each week so it's moving very fast .Anyone thinking about getting a MiSTer just get one you won't regret it
I had my MiSTer since the pandemic stuff happened, best decision ever. Buy it, you won't regret it!
+1
I did today... Because of this video lol
.... And with this Product there is a way to buy it already Pre Loaded with games or no? I could research it but since you have one I rather get a real first hand response. Thanks in Advance 😇
@@cMARVEL360 its possible. But its really not difficult. You dont have to write code. Just use the Mr Fusion image for the micro sd card and get scripts for doing stuff like update. Update all is a very good script. You have a basic graphical interface which is really good.
Got to say John the production on these videos just gets better and better. Keep up the good work!
A series of videos which keeps us up to date about the MiSTER or FPGA world in general would be greatly appreciated. But first, thanks very much for this episode!
Please keep up coverage on the MiSTer! This has been an informative joy to watch.
You really should have mentioned Sorgelig, without him there would be no Mister! As for the comparison with original hardware I am very interested in this, especially as regards the arcade cores. I have had variable results testing against my own hardware such as the Amiga 1200, some games show lag on the Mister that do not on the real machine (Rainbow Islands for example). Overall the Mister is an amazing device, getting clean video output from computers like the Atari 800xl and C64 is practically impossible with real hardware but the mister does it perfectly.
Great video, look forward to seeing more on Mister from you John. Excellent insight as always.
More MiSTer FPGA content please. I have a lot of old Computers and consoles but the chip level emulation of FPGA makes this a really great idea and can be used more easily. Love the old and new tech so please keep it coming!
Love my MiSTer. It does so much wonderful stuff and it's updated all the time.
Excellent introductory video on MiSTer, John! It’d be awesome to see more content about it. Comparisons. Individual cores... it’s a massive topic now, but I think it’s the best path forward in retro
Actually one of the worst videos I've seen about it. He didn't show off or discuss any of the other cores, and didn't really show off any of the UI or menus.
This is the way!
Heres hoping to see more MiSTer content and comparisons.
Thanks so much for this. I love the setup you came up with.
It's very helpful to see an example like this.
At last, a DF video about MISTer! Thanks!
This is so amazing! Great job to everybody involved.
I love your DF Retro stuff, John. Keep up the good work!
That was great, John. Thank you for your work
Im hoping to see more on this great little device. I've been thinking about getting one of these and after watching this video im going to pull the trigger on it later this year. Great video!
I love the MiSTer project. I don't even play any of my original hardware anymore. I get so excited every time a new arcade core gets released. It's like get a free PCB in the mail.
Great stuff as always, thanks, John!
MiSTer FPGA for the win! Definitely my preferred way to play retro games these days! Other than when I need to grind out some save state practice on retroarch :-) Dodonpachi Training Stage Select coming soon!
😎🖐🏾
Looks like I'm late to the party :D
Outside of the input lag - What does it bring to the table, practically speaking? I have an entire emulation box setup with my CRT @15Khz, but I'd like to know what practical benefits their are by comparison other than input lag.
@@retropulse03 accuracy, and mostly potential, maybe for very simple very old 2D systems software emulation can do the trick, but for more complex systems there is a point where software emulation is going to get too complex to get close to the real thing. Not saying that FPGA is there yet, but the potential of FPGA is massive compared to software emulation where things are pretty much hitting a dead end when it comes to accuracy.
Also, for me the inputlag is the most important metric so it's definitely a huge factor of the appeal. But I'm strictly theorizing here, practically I've only tried a few software emulators for PS1/2 or SNES and found them pretty underwhelming in terms of quality, accuracy, and smoothness. But there has been some great things too, like the SNES 9x high res mode 7 and widescreen hack which are just incredible on some games. So both have their advantages I guess, but to me FPGA sounds more promising for the accuracy and responsiveness part.
@@deus_nsf You're right when it comes to PS2 emulation, it's far from perfect and for many games the performance and accuracy is hit and miss. Then again, PS2 FPGA isn't even a thing at all... But when it comes to those consoles which are available on FPGA like NES, SNES, Genesis, Game Boy etc. there are amazing emulators out there with cycle-accuracy. So I'm not sure what underwhelming experience you're speaking of when it comes to SNES or even PS1. For PS1 (which doesn't exist as FPGA yet) there is Mednafen/Beetle-PSX which is the most accurate PS1 emulator out there and runs pretty much every game you throw at it with high accuracy. If you use the Retroarch frontend, it supports Run-Ahead for many cores so input latency becomes a non-issue. I think the problem is that people who had a bad experience with software emulation often fall into one of these categories: 1. They're trying bad or outdated emulators 3. They don't take the time to research and set everything up properly 3. They use hardware that is either weak or not suited for accurate emulation like ARM devices, Raspberry Pi's, NES/SNES minis, hacked consoles, their phones and tablets, or simply old PCs. Obviously they'll have a subpar experience then. But if you actually run the most accurate emulators on a beefy PC connected to a TV with original controllers through adapters, you can have a near-perfect original console experience for most systems up to the PS1 era and it's in no way worse than using something like a MISTer. In addition, you get tons of features on top like shaders if you want to recreate the CRT look on a modern screen if you're into that kind of stuff (something which requires a half-decent GPU, btw). Please note that I'm talking solely about consoles up to the 5th gen. I don't have any experience with Arcade systems and this might indeed be an area where the MISTer shines compared to software emulation.
I would love to see more content about fpga emulation in general. Thanks for the video!
Awesome to finally see a DF video for MiSTer!
Would love to see some more in-depth comparisons in the future, with other FPGA consoles and software emulation- but that is a tall order so I certainly understand taking things in stride. There is a lot to unpack in that little box ^-^
More like this John, please! Love it!
Good to see "Mr. Big" finally covering this. I've had one for almost a year now already.
Really cool setup and video :D thanks John
Man, that MiSTer setup looks super cool. I like how small it is so you could kinda shove it anywhere you might have room.
It's tempting...
Get a MiSTer. Thank me later. :D
@@martinmoller4947 I mean, I think they're super cool and would make a really neat "project," but I can't really be spending too much money the next few months and I already have an AVS, a Mega SG, and a Super NT for my light FPGA needs.
I'll thank you like... _way_ later when I eventually get one, lol.
@@chinohormann have a super NT too. Hardly used after getting the MiSTer. You also get neo geo, tg16, gba in fpga quality. And cps 1,1.5, 2 arcade cores. Just to name a few. Its convenient to use. But you are having already a nice fpga setup.
@@chinohormann I already sold my Mega SG and it pretty much paid off my entire MiSTer. Will sell my Super NT next for probably $400-450, then get rid of a lot of my games. If you are using the Analogue systems primarily with the jailbreak or flash carts, a MiSTer is better in every way.
@@KokoTheGorilla69 i keep my super NT bc i like to have this piece of hw.
I enjoyed this a lot and I doubt I'd ever buy one. I grew up with all these games and I love both the nostalgia and the tech behind the scene. Keep it up John.
Great content! Very informative. Would love to see more MiSTer coverage.
yo the animation in that golf game is absurdly smooth
Neo Turf Masters is a fantastic game!
Turf Masters is such a good game. There's still people playing it online lol
Was thinking exactly the same thing!
Great work! I just recently built my own, I would definitely be interested in more videos about the MiSTer and new cores coming to it!
That was a good video about the MiSTer John! :D
More MiSTer, yes please 👍 Such a great project!
A proper evaluation by DF compared to original arcade hardware would be incredible. You are by far the most capable and informative group to do this. Please make a followup.
Here's my contribution to giving you an edge with the algorithm. Keep doing what you're doing guys!
I would absolutely love more MiSTer content and I'm sure many people unfamiliar with it would love to have an overview on what they need to buy exactly if they want to build one themselves, how to set it up etc.
Really enjoyed this video, especially the comparisons. I would love to see further comparison videos of MiSTer, software emulation, and original hardware. Even though I'm a hardcore software emu fan, I think MiSTer is a very interesting and exciting project.
Glad to see you back John! Remember to do a DF Retro F.E.A.R some time please!
Cant wait to get one. Been eyeing these since release. Thanks for covering, I LOVE DF Retro.
MiSTer vs MAME vs Arcade HW ? Yes please!
This would be hit and miss. Neogeo was made with chip decaps but suffers from some graphical bugs from timing issues. Jotegos Capcom cores are good but he moves on to the next one so quickly (because patreon...) that bugs don't get fixed as quickly. Old arcade cores have nobody interested in improving them sometimes. Where mister shines today is consoles with nearly perfect SNES, NES, PCECD, Genesis cores and a great GBA core as well.
@@ghogan42 good to hear about the console accuracy. Before learning of Mister, I was considering getting an Analogue mega SG and Super NT, along with a couple everdrive flash carts for roms. Seems like that would be a complete waste of money now for someone with no intention of collecting actual cartridges.
Great video, as always. I'd love to hear more about the MiSTer if you'd be willing to make this into a series.
No to push other people’s work on DFs channel, but a guy by the name of Smokemonster who works closely with core creators and is pretty well known in the Mister and retro gaming community did a video on each core for the Mister you should check them out, it’s what got me to buy one👍🏾
This was a great overview, more MiSTeR please!
Yes, it'd be great to see more MISTer videos!
That shelf is pretty wobbly. I'd end up knocking it over
Great video. I’d love to see ongoing coverage and in particular in depth comparison with the original boards.
I would like to see comparisons between real and FPGA.
You can find plenty. I have compared SNES to the SNES core, and found no differences at all in various demos and such. Even Demos that use stuff that very great emulators will mess up, it does fine.
@@jackbootshamangaming4541 With SNES it is tricky because there are multiple hardware versions that behave differently in different situations. Partway through production they consolidated several chips, so the revision is commonly called 1chip. That revision isn't perfectly accurate and has visual glitches in a few places, but its video signal is cleaner.
@@coopercummings8370 we'll see we get the best of both worlds on MiSTer. Our video output is much cleaner than any SNES is, including RGB modded 1chips, yet it's based on a 2/1/3 SNES(the most common 3 chip, I have several SFCs and they're all 2/1/3s. I had a 1 chip, and some other models that were different from 2/1/3, before losing all my stuff and having to restart my collection) The MiSTer output is cleaner than my completely recapped with very high end 1% tolerance caps and resistors, with an RGB amp, 1chip, both at native 240p, and when the OSSC is used on the SNES I get better image out of the MiSTer still. We just got the 5x scaling mode added for 1080p(crops 8 pixels, 4 on top and 4 on bottom but you can offset it, and most games back then still considered those areas as potential overscan as many CRTs would overscan those, and do they're generally fit with useless info). Like I was playing Streets of Rage 2 last night and with a +4 offset, it shows the name and timing all perfectly, just cuts off the pixels above the characters names and such which are useless and only 8 original pixels.
The scaler in the MiSTer is amazing too. The OSSC pro is getting an addon board for the DE-10 nano that will do all the same things as the OSSC pro as it's going to be based on a very similar Cyclone V chip, but this way it's much cheaper as you're supplying the FPGA yourself, the addon board is going to be 200 if I recall correctly, the OSSC pro is going to be 500+...
What's that game at 11:09
Loved this, more please! Thanks :)
The MiSTer is amazing; probably my most played gaming machine. Highly accurate, easy to use and regularly updated & improved. Regular video updates would be amazing (as keeping tabs on MiSTer news can be a bit of a challenge).
Absolutely! More FPGA content please.
Been wanting to see DF talk about this machine!
Well this is more of a talk a about John's set up
He's talking about a crappy looking "arcade" setup with a tiny screen unfortunately
@@KokoTheGorilla69 some if not most people don't have the space for a full arcade machine in there home full stop, let alone in one room. So this set up is pretty ideal!
@@KokoTheGorilla69 i think his setup is very useful bc you can easy switch to pivot mode and its very compact. Slightly bigger than a raspi but fpga power for dozens of systems. I dig it a lot. Many MiSTer owner sell their Analogue consoles.
Great video John. More vids on mister would be great!
The MiSTer is my best gaming related purchase. If I could keep only one device, this would be it.
Thanks for the look at this device, I've been wondering if it's worth buying in for myself. Would love to see more as it develops!
There are years worth of videos on RUclips that show/explain more then this. PS1 is currently being worked on, and might be the ceiling in terms of what consoles this device can cover
I love the comparison stuff. Would love to see more as to track the accuracy of MiSTer as it continues to improve and mature.
Great video as always. You guys rock!
I have just finished putting together my MiSTer and enjoying every bit of it so far. It's the best.
Oh what a Saturday evening, a new DF Retro video!
CPS2 beta was released yesterday by Jotego!
Definitely would love an Astro City vid! Been tossing around the idea of importing one. Missed the LRG offering.
I like your setup, man!
YES! I've been waiting for this. MLiG is doing their own video very soon too! I got my mister earlier this month and love it. I got it for the consoles, and now I've been using ton of the arcade cores, and getting into the computer ones now.
The Electric Underground gave a lot of praise to the DoDonPachi core. A DF side by side with actual hardware for any of the cores would be a very welcome video!
Excellent stuff. As much Mister as possible please, Mister!
Great to see some Mister content!
I got mine during lockdown like many others here. Every time I play it’s like going back to the 90’s. Megadrive, SNES and neogeo are perfect. I know there is a lot more on here but I’m just revisiting stuff I had as a kid. If any one is on the fence jump in and then send some money to jotego’s patreon. The guy is a legend. Really looking forward to the cps 2 stuff.
Great idea to place your arcade setup on the wall like that. I've already got what I need to do the same with my Raspberry Pi 4. I'm now going to wall mount mine tomorrow; hopefully it will turn out similar to yours. Thanks for the inspiration.
Nice, thank you John. I allways whant to know more about the Mister😊👍.
I picked up a mister last year. It's pretty incredible. There are retro computer cores for it as well, which is great.
Yes do more videos on MiSTer! This FPGA stuff really interests me
I'm certainly interested in more MiSTer coverage, expecially the harwere vs MiSTer vs emulation - also console hardwere!
Don't know why, but in this video it's REALLY noticeable when John is looking at his script
Yeah.. he seems to be making a lot less eye contact with the camera. I still love this DF content though
Great coverage of the MiSTer project. Nice to see that the 68000 core is up and running! These developers are amazing! Like your arcade "kiosk... I did something very similar (with MAME) several years ago, but it's a great solution! I've been following MiSTer for the same reasons you are (arcade gaming). In my mind (for now anyway), MiSTer is definitely the best solution for long term arcade game preservation.
thanks for this ..yes i would love to see more in depth comparisons on original hardware if possible vs FPGA vs software
Great video. Really interesting.
Amazing project!
I'll use it as inspiration!
Great video!
What a shame they didn't give credits to Sorgelig, the "father" of this amazing project
@b m He doesn't hate arcades. They're just not something he is very into himself. Without him, the Arcade Cores wouldn't be here even really.
If someone is not throwing him some coin on Patreon or contributing to the project in some way then that's the shame.
giving him credits is a way to contribute
@@Naytai-mh1pl Kinda hard to buy a cup of coffee or food or gas or pay the electricity or buy equipment with "credit on RUclips". Anybody that owns a MiSTer can afford to spend $1.00 a month to support him. If you're using Jotego's stuff then $1.00 to him means for $2.00 a month you're getting a whole heck of a return on your investment.
@@murrij Totally agree. But the question here is not just the financial support, which is great, obviously.
More than that, giving credits to someones work is a matter of respect, especially when you can monetize over it. This is priceless.
Superb vid Cheers 🍻👍
The absolute best investment I've made for retro gaming.
And even getting more valueable. Cps2 and ps1 core. :) maybe Saturn. Who knows.