I don’t think you talk too much. I enjoy all of your videos and value the information you share. You’ve got a great channel and I will continue to watch. Thumbs way up!
Thanks Eric for being eyes on the ground, I have never found any unnecessary info in your videos, always on spot and more knowledge and prespective in your content.
Can you explain why? And do you own an EV? What EV do you own? And what problems do you experience that Swapping would solve? (p.s. i own an EV Tesla Model 3)
@@HermanWillems I also own a Tesla Model 3. Answering your question: Getting to swap rather than charge solved a lot of issues/hassles of an EV, for one it's the ease of mind regarding the battery, since you swap your battery you wouldn't need to worry about the battery's health degradation. The second issue swapping solves is the time it takes to top up your battery and continue with your trip, if you chose to charge your EV it would take about 35 +-10 minutes to charge, whilst if you chose to swap you'd only have to wait 5 minutes max. And three in case of NIO you'd get to upgrade your battery. Also NIO has the best of both worlds. Fast-charging with the rate and reliability of Tesla's supercharging network and Swapping.
Talk away Eric, never let them change you :) Battery swap is still very misunderstood/disregarded. Time will tell. The benefits of having an easily removable battery pack are many, the biggest imho is significantly reducing the upfront cost of the car via battery lease.
even if this project does not succeed it will still be beneficial for consumer to have no problem changing your battery if it breaks. with tesla or others you pay 15k for that. also your 5 year old car can still get new battery tech instead of having to buy a new car
@@tonypaca3015 You mention Tesla even though the vast majority of automakers, including BYD, don’t use battery swap. And guess what? Teslas can get new batteries later on. Tesla has these things called service centers, where if you need a new battery, you bring your car there to replace it. And it’s not like swapping the battery of a NIO is free, with or without BaaS. Pros and cons, pros and cons.
@@waynelewis9110 yes you are right not only Tesla. I mentioned Tesla because I saw like 3 or 4 videos of owners complaining that their battery was broke and out of warranty and they had to pay over 10k for a new one. Meanwhile with nio you don’t pay anything because you can just swap for a new battery
@@tonypaca3015 I’ve seen a couple of those vids on Teslas, but many more on other models. The reality is that those videos are mostly for older cars like the 2013 Model S. Batteries in newer Teslas, particularly from 2019 and onward (which is less than a year after NIO started making cars), will last far longer. What do you mean “you don’t pay anything” to swap a battery with NIO? Again, if you have BaaS, you pay for it every single month. If you don’t have BaaS, and you need a new battery from NIO, guess what? You’re paying for it, in full. Either way, you’re paying. Claiming that it is free is disingenuous.
I totally agree that battery swap is much more efficient than supercharge. As the world moves into a sustainable future, EVs are going to be very common on the streets. Charging stations will then be in very high demand, and not everyone have the luxury of time to wait (~20 mins) for their cars to be charged up. A battery swap is a game-changer in this case. Also, bigger batteries are very likely to be available in the future. Bigger battery = longer charging time, in this case, waiting for your car to be fully charged is going to be such hassle. Thanks for your videos Eric, thumbs up!
My car, Tesla Model 3 RWD, can go around 425km real world. After like 300 to 400km driving around. I HAVE TO PEE OR POO. And stretch my legs and get a coffee for real. And Tesla chargers here are always next to nice hotels. So i just walk inside the lobby go to their toilet do my thing, buy a coffee and walk back. BAM !!! Batttery FULL. And i can drive again. My question to you Don JR. Do you even own an EV? Many non-EV owners talk so much "so called" experience but never experienced it themselves for real. They just make shit up for others. Rent one and do some long travel, and see for yourself. I never needed swapping.
Bigger Battery = longer charging time? Wrong, If you have ONE cell. Charge it at 1C, a battery with for example 100 cells or 1000 cells. If you both charge them with 1C each cell, yes the bigger battery can draw more current but can be full JUST as fast as the smaller battery containing fewer cells. This is just basic electrical engineering.
@@HermanWillems respectfully, I don't think you understand how batteries work. A "bigger" battery doesn't necessarily mean more cells, also you don't calculate the time to charge an EV with the time to charge a single cell, then using the cell as unit... Also I own a Tesla, and yes, 60% of times that I stop to charge I'd also leave the car to eat or for a restroom break, but just to add-on, I don't eat at a stop because I want to, I do it because I'd be bored to wait in the car but they fixed that with the entertainment you have.
@@HermanWillems What is wrong about you EV drivers that every comment is about Pee or POO :D Try to find positive side from the NIO BaaS service than thinking why the regular charging via cable is the only one and the best way to charge. It is not, because it is always better to have more options to charge your EV. I do not understand why this so big problem for people which already have EVs.
@@iSot80 ye fine I understand you. But it will never be profitable without asking crazy prices for swapping. I only pay 40 euro a month for driving around. Before with gasoline cars a lot. With swapping it would be just as expensive as gasoline cars again.....
Battery swap is not just battery swap..the batteries in time will get much better in the future. You can keep your car and when better batteries come up . Voila .. longer mileage with same car.. Brilliant 😊
the improvement is great. save 1 minute in time and now is 4 minutes per swap, and next generation will be 3 minutes. I hope next generation they increase the top area of the station to fit 6 more batteries and also the bottom area to fit 3 more batteries and also for better ground clearance in case of heavy snow/rain. that will make 30 batteries stored in total. also put a big screen inside of these swap stations so they can run some advertising like in gas stations and make some extra profit.
Battery swap, imho, could have a bright future, especially if there would be a standard that goes across brands. Imagine NIO holding the key to swapping other brand's batteries as well. There would finally be no reason to prefer a fossil clunker over an electric car, ever again. Not that there are many right now, but it's the charging that puts many people of, especially if they can't charge at home.
Yea I mentioned in my other video about nio power the other day they mentioned the new station is flexible enough to be able to offer swaps for other brands, and their own sub brands
The main reason battery swap does not make sense (at least at the moment) is because the biggest contraint to make electric cars is the battery. So they are making less cars to have the battery swap system.. and from what I am seeing now this will be the biggest constraint for quite some time
Nope... They don't need that many more batteries than there are cars, about 2 to 3% max. which is, on the whole, negligible. Those batteries also bring money in the bank as grid balancing energy storage. So this argument doesn't work.
@@David34981 lets say they have 10 battery packs at the battery swap station ready to be swapped. Thats ten freaking battery packs that equals to 10 extra cars they can build. So yeah that arguement is right on the money.
@@David34981 So NIO claims that they will help with grid balancing... How do you think that will be done? Are you thinking that they will discharge the battery packs while there are customers lining up to get their swaps? Have you ever been waiting in a line in to order some food while you watch the attendant take phone calls in front of you for carry out orders? It's a real turn off. Not good for business.
@@TeslaDo_d Do you really think that (BaaS station 3.0 version) they will going to discharge all batteries to low levels? No, balancing means giving power to grid seconds to minutes when there is a need for example high stress on grid = many EVs charging via regular cable charging. Balancing means BALANCING not discharging to empty.
What's the cost? It's more about what is sustainable and practical. If nio can release the financials of a battery swap station then it'll help settle the debate. With a Tesla SC site it roughly costs $250k. After that it's simple maintenance and it's ran to be profitable.
So many Tesla chargers in my country. And my country is a country full of EV's and there are always 80% space for charging your car. And you see people just charging there for 15 minutes and be gone directly. It goes quickly, so the charging spots are far from full and empty quickly again. If you have 2 cars in front of you swapping. You have an equal time of charging a regular Tesla.
I wish there were battery swap stations on 99/i5. I have no confidence in the crumbling power grid of California to handle large scale super charging networks. We get power fluctuations when it's too hot, too cold or too windy. The swap stations would help to balance the grid during those fluctuations. Can't imagine the impacts to the grid during peak hours when more fast charging stations are in place. The charging experience is horrible for non Tesla. Fast charging only works fine when no one else's splitting the capacity. That's if you can find one that actual works. The super charging networks might actually work better in China given that they have a much more advanced/newer national grid.
Why don't they upgrade the Grid in California? Here in the Netherlands my OLD house from the end of the 60's has 3 phase connection 25Amps each phase to zero 230AC volt. I can easily connect a 11kW charger that Tesla gave me. And 11kW means the battery is full in 5 hours. And then i can drive around almost 2 weeks on that little tiny 5 hour charge.
Please try to understand that 10 batteries fast charging in a swap station is the same current draw as 10 cars sitting at fast chargers. In fact, there is extra load on the grid due to the power needed to run the swap station. There is no magic used to charge the batteries in the swap stations.
@@HermanWillems basically too much politics and not enough budget and engineers. In my area(NorCal), you can get up to $1000 incentives for a maximum allowed 32amps and 7.7kw, which definitely takes longer than 5 hours to be 90% charged, but it's more than adequate for daily commute. It sucks when I have to take longer trips like driving to SoCal.
@@TeslaDo_d hmm, isn't the max charging rate 160kwh for a swap station whereas 250kw for a v3, and would roughly result in higher current drain? When integrated with the grid, battery swap stations can help to balance the grid and reduce the strain on the system. Would fast charging help in anyway to reduce the pressure of the grid? California has been pushing for renewable energy sources, but the grid was not designed to handle this ever-growing intermittency, one of the most significant challenges to the stability of the grid. So it might not be an issue for other states/countries but it's a real threat to California.
@@madchenwheat9364 I have seen some videos on RUclips from Dr. P. While he is waiting in line for his swap, his car can show him the status of each of the batteries in the swap station so that he can estimate his wait time and the amount of charge he will be receiving. Imagine sitting in line and you see all these batteries with 90% charge....then they suddenly start to drop 89%, 88%, 87%... This is how the 'grid balancing' would work. So now you're sitting in line and watching you're expected range disappear before you get parked in the swapper. I would be slightly more than irritated. But yes, if the swapper isn't busy and the grid needs help, I would think that they could quickly sacrifice half of their battery bank to dump energy to the grid for some quick cash. I just wouldn't do it with customers waiting in line. I would guess that the 160kW rate is the maximum per battery and not the maximum power to the entire station. Super chargers provide a maximum of 250kW, and this lasts for only a few minutes per car due to the charging curves of the batteries.
The best benefit is the ability to update battery technology without removing a fixed one. Just let NIO change out all the batteries in their swap stations while you’re sleeping. Next day you have state of the art technology without buying a new car.
Great Nio content. I like it and find it fascinating how you speak Chinese I guess Mandarin. Could you speak in an upcoming video how you learned and how long have you been speaking. Thanks
If the goal in the west is to remove the combustion vehicle off the road then battery swap will definitely do well in cities like New York. Most houses in new York city are typically two to three families and we have all these buildings apartments which do not have a garage so where will they charge over night battery swap is perfect for us in populated cities.
Great Video Eric, I totally I agree with u but would you think Nio will be successful or at least profitable after all the current ev price war and all the hate and negative comments Nio is having (low demand, free swaps, old tech, seat gate) and the war between china and USA for Taiwan? Thank you for your answer
Talk all you want Eric, not sure if it was constructive feedback or the commenter just stated 'You talk too much, which is pretty blunt when they are coming to your channel. Great coverage from Afonso in Germany today at the new NIO house. What is the minimum charge on a fresh battery when you swap? Just curious because when NIO EV's keep getting added to the road and all batteries are being taken they wouldn't have time to recharge them all if demand keeps coming... Maybe there would be a cargo truck re-stocking batteries they charged off-peak hours? I hope that makes sense, GO NIO! $NIO
Multiple batteries are held in each swap station, and are being charged constantly whether there is a car coming in to get a swap or not. This is the point NIO is making about how they can achieve greater throughput compared to a supercharge only station. Energy can be stored in the batteries held in the swap station, which means if a bunch of cars show up, you can have 4 NIOs supercharging at full speed, while the other 4 wait in line to get packs already charged to 90-93% one after another. After 20 minutes all 8 NIOs would have finished charging/swapping, but a normal 8 stall supercharger station would struggle to simultaneously charge 8 cars all at full speed. NIO's 2.0 swap stations store 13 batteries inside and can perform up to 300 swaps per day, while the 3.0 swap stations store 21 batteries each and can perform up to 400 swaps per day. The advantages to this system include the fact that at the beginning of each day, you start out with every battery fully charged and ready for swapping. As cars come in and get batteries, (no minimum charge requirements, since I think they charge you by the difference in SOC between you depleted battery and the full one your swap to) the station starts to recharge the depleted ones, at a lower speed (I think around 40 kW?), which is good for battery health since high speed DC charging at 200 kW plus degrades the battery faster. In the best case scenario, there is a steady stream of cars coming in to swap batteries, but each car only needs to be at the station for less than 10 minutes because there is not much wait and a fully charged battery in the station ready for swapping. But Nio's point is that even in the worst case scenario where the station is swamped with cars waiting, a 3.0 swap station plus 4 NIO supercharger outside can still charge twice as many cars per hour compared to an 8 stall supercharger station which only does DC fast charging. Both setups are equal in size, but the NIO setup will charge more cars under peak conditions. Although it is also true the NIO setup which includes a swap station and 21 batteries stored inside at all times also costs more to setup than just putting in 8 superchargers. That's part of why you pay a premium for NIO vehicles.
Thanks for an awesome video once again. Did they talk about the ability to leave the car while swapping? This was atleast show int the release video. Also I thought the power was supposed to stay on during the swap in 3.0🤔
Yeah if you can't get out. You still have to sit still, can't even use the infotainment system. When i charge my Tesla. I just step out the car, walk to the toilet. Get a coffee, when i get back the battery is already full. This is my REAL WORLD experience. I don't feel swapping will add anything or solve any problem in my life to be honest.
Your point at 3:40 is entirely misleading because you could achieve the exact same thing with superchargers and electricity storage batteries, except the batteries wouldn't have to be made to fit into an EV so it could be less energy-dense material. If you're going to have a battery swap station, you will need to buy batteries that get charged and swapped with empty batteries. If peak energy demand were really worth handling, Supercharging stations could also just get a battery that would discharge at peak times. You don't at all dig into the discussion of how much a station costs relative to however many Supercharger stalls, all of the engineering limitations introduced by forcing a robotic stall to be compatible with many different makes and models of EVs, or how much more maintenance it would require than a simple Supercharger stall. If all you do is say that battery swapping would be faster than charging, which is painfully obvious, and then do verbal sleight of hand to create an advantage that isn't necessarily unique to battery swapping, but then never dig into any of the cons of battery swapping, then you did not at all address the title question "Why battery swapping is still better than SuperCharging" and I am left only with the conclusion that "it probably isn't".
Sure you could add a big battery and charge from that, but that would increase the footprint would it not? You gotta put the battery somewhere. You'd have less charging stalls in that case. Also these two videos, presumably you watched the other, aren't really about the costs to the company, though they did say that with the third generation the costs have come down and the value provided has greatly increased (From 5 to 21 batteries in same footprint), and now has the flexibility to support more car sizes and batteries (including from other brands). From my experience driving EVs in US, Europe and China, and having far too many problems with fast charging not working, but battery swapping working 100 percent of the time, I can't say for certain which requires more maintenance. The obvious answer is a giant battery swapping robot requires more, and if so, then NIO does an admirable job keeping them maintained and operational and most charging companies fail that maintenance task miserably, especially considering it should be easier and cheaper. Thanks for the comment, it is certainly an interesting topic. As a user, in most instances of public "charging," battery swapping is a better experience. From a company perspective, apparently NIO thinks it is better, in conjunction with the 4 other types of energy replenishment outlined. A lot of other companies are now getting onboard with battery swap in China, so there must be something to it. It probably isn't the answer everywhere in the world. So is it better, maybe a better answer than it is or it isn't, is "it depends."
battery swapping will never become a viable main-stream solution for evs, regardless of how fervently some in the tiny minority of nio owners and enthusiasts seem to believe in it.
I doubt German or any European countries are not allowing NIO to build these swap/charge stations. The problem would more be that each one costs more to setup than a simple supercharging lot containing only DC fast chargers, and how much money does NIO have to invest in putting a bunch of these swap stations all over the place versus how many cars they are managing to sell in Europe.
@@tren133 Oh, Germany and Europe will totally approve them. But in Germany it will take ages. Nio started in the Netherlands and Germany more or less at the same time. While the Netherlands already have 4 PSS you find in Germany only 3. Relative to the size of the countries the Netherlands cover by like 70%, while Germany is covered by maybe 10%. I‘m less worried about NIO’s financials than Germany’s way of how they understand fast development.
yes these cars are expansive, BUT I assume that rich people can not afford to wait 6 hours or overnight for their vehicle to be in active mode. Therefore these cars are best for buissy rich people who wants LUXURY EV
I don’t think you talk too much. I enjoy all of your videos and value the information you share. You’ve got a great channel and I will continue to watch. Thumbs way up!
Love the 3.0 stations..Hope they add more drive through stations such as the one in Beijing.
Thanks Eric for being eyes on the ground, I have never found any unnecessary info in your videos, always on spot and more knowledge and prespective in your content.
@6:10 - there are 6 million charging points in China now and growing fast .
Battery swap is definitely the way to go, so much good stuff to it, let's go NIO
Can you explain why? And do you own an EV? What EV do you own? And what problems do you experience that Swapping would solve? (p.s. i own an EV Tesla Model 3)
@@HermanWillems I also own a Tesla Model 3.
Answering your question:
Getting to swap rather than charge solved a lot of issues/hassles of an EV, for one it's the ease of mind regarding the battery, since you swap your battery you wouldn't need to worry about the battery's health degradation. The second issue swapping solves is the time it takes to top up your battery and continue with your trip, if you chose to charge your EV it would take about 35 +-10 minutes to charge, whilst if you chose to swap you'd only have to wait 5 minutes max. And three in case of NIO you'd get to upgrade your battery.
Also NIO has the best of both worlds. Fast-charging with the rate and reliability of Tesla's supercharging network and Swapping.
Talk away Eric, never let them change you :) Battery swap is still very misunderstood/disregarded. Time will tell. The benefits of having an easily removable battery pack are many, the biggest imho is significantly reducing the upfront cost of the car via battery lease.
Hoping Shell adds a charging station at every one of their thousands of locations. They have wanted to get into the network game.
even if this project does not succeed it will still be beneficial for consumer to have no problem changing your battery if it breaks. with tesla or others you pay 15k for that. also your 5 year old car can still get new battery tech instead of having to buy a new car
@@tonypaca3015 You mention Tesla even though the vast majority of automakers, including BYD, don’t use battery swap. And guess what? Teslas can get new batteries later on. Tesla has these things called service centers, where if you need a new battery, you bring your car there to replace it. And it’s not like swapping the battery of a NIO is free, with or without BaaS. Pros and cons, pros and cons.
@@waynelewis9110 yes you are right not only Tesla. I mentioned Tesla because I saw like 3 or 4 videos of owners complaining that their battery was broke and out of warranty and they had to pay over 10k for a new one. Meanwhile with nio you don’t pay anything because you can just swap for a new battery
@@tonypaca3015 I’ve seen a couple of those vids on Teslas, but many more on other models. The reality is that those videos are mostly for older cars like the 2013 Model S. Batteries in newer Teslas, particularly from 2019 and onward (which is less than a year after NIO started making cars), will last far longer.
What do you mean “you don’t pay anything” to swap a battery with NIO? Again, if you have BaaS, you pay for it every single month. If you don’t have BaaS, and you need a new battery from NIO, guess what? You’re paying for it, in full. Either way, you’re paying. Claiming that it is free is disingenuous.
Talk more Eric! EASY!!!!
Hi Eric, always asaustive in the temachiche, thank you so much for yet another masterpiece! Keep updating us. A warm greeting.
I totally agree that battery swap is much more efficient than supercharge.
As the world moves into a sustainable future, EVs are going to be very common on the streets. Charging stations will then be in very high demand, and not everyone have the luxury of time to wait (~20 mins) for their cars to be charged up. A battery swap is a game-changer in this case.
Also, bigger batteries are very likely to be available in the future. Bigger battery = longer charging time, in this case, waiting for your car to be fully charged is going to be such hassle.
Thanks for your videos Eric, thumbs up!
My car, Tesla Model 3 RWD, can go around 425km real world. After like 300 to 400km driving around. I HAVE TO PEE OR POO. And stretch my legs and get a coffee for real. And Tesla chargers here are always next to nice hotels. So i just walk inside the lobby go to their toilet do my thing, buy a coffee and walk back. BAM !!! Batttery FULL. And i can drive again.
My question to you Don JR. Do you even own an EV? Many non-EV owners talk so much "so called" experience but never experienced it themselves for real. They just make shit up for others. Rent one and do some long travel, and see for yourself. I never needed swapping.
Bigger Battery = longer charging time? Wrong, If you have ONE cell. Charge it at 1C, a battery with for example 100 cells or 1000 cells. If you both charge them with 1C each cell, yes the bigger battery can draw more current but can be full JUST as fast as the smaller battery containing fewer cells. This is just basic electrical engineering.
@@HermanWillems respectfully, I don't think you understand how batteries work.
A "bigger" battery doesn't necessarily mean more cells, also you don't calculate the time to charge an EV with the time to charge a single cell, then using the cell as unit...
Also I own a Tesla, and yes, 60% of times that I stop to charge I'd also leave the car to eat or for a restroom break, but just to add-on, I don't eat at a stop because I want to, I do it because I'd be bored to wait in the car but they fixed that with the entertainment you have.
@@HermanWillems What is wrong about you EV drivers that every comment is about Pee or POO :D Try to find positive side from the NIO BaaS service than thinking why the regular charging via cable is the only one and the best way to charge. It is not, because it is always better to have more options to charge your EV. I do not understand why this so big problem for people which already have EVs.
@@iSot80 ye fine I understand you. But it will never be profitable without asking crazy prices for swapping. I only pay 40 euro a month for driving around. Before with gasoline cars a lot. With swapping it would be just as expensive as gasoline cars again.....
Battery swap is not just battery swap..the batteries in time will get much better in the future. You can keep your car and when better batteries come up . Voila .. longer mileage with same car.. Brilliant 😊
Thanks Eric. Let's Go Nio...... :)
Thanks Eric! NIO is a beast!
Another informative video. Ty 👍
Keep on talking Eric... The more you talk , the higher the stock is going 🙌🙌🙌🙌
the improvement is great. save 1 minute in time and now is 4 minutes per swap, and next generation will be 3 minutes. I hope next generation they increase the top area of the station to fit 6 more batteries and also the bottom area to fit 3 more batteries and also for better ground clearance in case of heavy snow/rain. that will make 30 batteries stored in total. also put a big screen inside of these swap stations so they can run some advertising like in gas stations and make some extra profit.
Great video! Don't listen to the guy who said you talk to much. There's a lot to say about NIO.
Battery swap, imho, could have a bright future, especially if there would be a standard that goes across brands. Imagine NIO holding the key to swapping other brand's batteries as well. There would finally be no reason to prefer a fossil clunker over an electric car, ever again. Not that there are many right now, but it's the charging that puts many people of, especially if they can't charge at home.
Yea I mentioned in my other video about nio power the other day they mentioned the new station is flexible enough to be able to offer swaps for other brands, and their own sub brands
The main reason battery swap does not make sense (at least at the moment) is because the biggest contraint to make electric cars is the battery. So they are making less cars to have the battery swap system.. and from what I am seeing now this will be the biggest constraint for quite some time
Nope... They don't need that many more batteries than there are cars, about 2 to 3% max. which is, on the whole, negligible. Those batteries also bring money in the bank as grid balancing energy storage. So this argument doesn't work.
@@David34981 lets say they have 10 battery packs at the battery swap station ready to be swapped. Thats ten freaking battery packs that equals to 10 extra cars they can build. So yeah that arguement is right on the money.
@@David34981 So NIO claims that they will help with grid balancing... How do you think that will be done? Are you thinking that they will discharge the battery packs while there are customers lining up to get their swaps? Have you ever been waiting in a line in to order some food while you watch the attendant take phone calls in front of you for carry out orders? It's a real turn off. Not good for business.
@@TeslaDo_d Do you really think that (BaaS station 3.0 version) they will going to discharge all batteries to low levels? No, balancing means giving power to grid seconds to minutes when there is a need for example high stress on grid = many EVs charging via regular cable charging. Balancing means BALANCING not discharging to empty.
Useful insights! Thx!
Yeah, Eric! Haters gonna hate!
Off subject but what kind of bird is that calling in the background?
ruclips.net/video/ANI4lIJ7qUc/видео.html Asian koel 😂 it never shuts up
@@Eric_Garrison Its a very vocal creature! I appreciate the info.
It never stops dawn to dusk 😂
What's the cost? It's more about what is sustainable and practical. If nio can release the financials of a battery swap station then it'll help settle the debate. With a Tesla SC site it roughly costs $250k. After that it's simple maintenance and it's ran to be profitable.
So many Tesla chargers in my country. And my country is a country full of EV's and there are always 80% space for charging your car. And you see people just charging there for 15 minutes and be gone directly. It goes quickly, so the charging spots are far from full and empty quickly again. If you have 2 cars in front of you swapping. You have an equal time of charging a regular Tesla.
I wish there were battery swap stations on 99/i5. I have no confidence in the crumbling power grid of California to handle large scale super charging networks. We get power fluctuations when it's too hot, too cold or too windy. The swap stations would help to balance the grid during those fluctuations. Can't imagine the impacts to the grid during peak hours when more fast charging stations are in place. The charging experience is horrible for non Tesla. Fast charging only works fine when no one else's splitting the capacity. That's if you can find one that actual works. The super charging networks might actually work better in China given that they have a much more advanced/newer national grid.
Why don't they upgrade the Grid in California? Here in the Netherlands my OLD house from the end of the 60's has 3 phase connection 25Amps each phase to zero 230AC volt. I can easily connect a 11kW charger that Tesla gave me. And 11kW means the battery is full in 5 hours. And then i can drive around almost 2 weeks on that little tiny 5 hour charge.
Please try to understand that 10 batteries fast charging in a swap station is the same current draw as 10 cars sitting at fast chargers. In fact, there is extra load on the grid due to the power needed to run the swap station. There is no magic used to charge the batteries in the swap stations.
@@HermanWillems basically too much politics and not enough budget and engineers. In my area(NorCal), you can get up to $1000 incentives for a maximum allowed 32amps and 7.7kw, which definitely takes longer than 5 hours to be 90% charged, but it's more than adequate for daily commute. It sucks when I have to take longer trips like driving to SoCal.
@@TeslaDo_d hmm, isn't the max charging rate 160kwh for a swap station whereas 250kw for a v3, and would roughly result in higher current drain? When integrated with the grid, battery swap stations can help to balance the grid and reduce the strain on the system. Would fast charging help in anyway to reduce the pressure of the grid? California has been pushing for renewable energy sources, but the grid was not designed to handle this ever-growing intermittency, one of the most significant challenges to the stability of the grid. So it might not be an issue for other states/countries but it's a real threat to California.
@@madchenwheat9364 I have seen some videos on RUclips from Dr. P. While he is waiting in line for his swap, his car can show him the status of each of the batteries in the swap station so that he can estimate his wait time and the amount of charge he will be receiving. Imagine sitting in line and you see all these batteries with 90% charge....then they suddenly start to drop 89%, 88%, 87%... This is how the 'grid balancing' would work. So now you're sitting in line and watching you're expected range disappear before you get parked in the swapper.
I would be slightly more than irritated.
But yes, if the swapper isn't busy and the grid needs help, I would think that they could quickly sacrifice half of their battery bank to dump energy to the grid for some quick cash. I just wouldn't do it with customers waiting in line.
I would guess that the 160kW rate is the maximum per battery and not the maximum power to the entire station. Super chargers provide a maximum of 250kW, and this lasts for only a few minutes per car due to the charging curves of the batteries.
The best benefit is the ability to update battery technology without removing a fixed one. Just let NIO change out all the batteries in their swap stations while you’re sleeping. Next day you have state of the art technology without buying a new car.
Great Nio content. I like it and find it fascinating how you speak Chinese I guess Mandarin. Could you speak in an upcoming video how you learned and how long have you been speaking.
Thanks
If the goal in the west is to remove the combustion vehicle off the road then battery swap will definitely do well in cities like New York. Most houses in new York city are typically two to three families and we have all these buildings apartments which do not have a garage so where will they charge over night battery swap is perfect for us in populated cities.
Will always be better....
Great Video Eric, I totally I agree with u but would you think Nio will be successful or at least profitable after all the current ev price war and all the hate and negative comments Nio is having (low demand, free swaps, old tech, seat gate) and the war between china and USA for Taiwan? Thank you for your answer
Talk all you want Eric, not sure if it was constructive feedback or the commenter just stated 'You talk too much, which is pretty blunt when they are coming to your channel. Great coverage from Afonso in Germany today at the new NIO house. What is the minimum charge on a fresh battery when you swap? Just curious because when NIO EV's keep getting added to the road and all batteries are being taken they wouldn't have time to recharge them all if demand keeps coming... Maybe there would be a cargo truck re-stocking batteries they charged off-peak hours? I hope that makes sense, GO NIO! $NIO
Multiple batteries are held in each swap station, and are being charged constantly whether there is a car coming in to get a swap or not. This is the point NIO is making about how they can achieve greater throughput compared to a supercharge only station. Energy can be stored in the batteries held in the swap station, which means if a bunch of cars show up, you can have 4 NIOs supercharging at full speed, while the other 4 wait in line to get packs already charged to 90-93% one after another. After 20 minutes all 8 NIOs would have finished charging/swapping, but a normal 8 stall supercharger station would struggle to simultaneously charge 8 cars all at full speed.
NIO's 2.0 swap stations store 13 batteries inside and can perform up to 300 swaps per day, while the 3.0 swap stations store 21 batteries each and can perform up to 400 swaps per day. The advantages to this system include the fact that at the beginning of each day, you start out with every battery fully charged and ready for swapping. As cars come in and get batteries, (no minimum charge requirements, since I think they charge you by the difference in SOC between you depleted battery and the full one your swap to) the station starts to recharge the depleted ones, at a lower speed (I think around 40 kW?), which is good for battery health since high speed DC charging at 200 kW plus degrades the battery faster.
In the best case scenario, there is a steady stream of cars coming in to swap batteries, but each car only needs to be at the station for less than 10 minutes because there is not much wait and a fully charged battery in the station ready for swapping. But Nio's point is that even in the worst case scenario where the station is swamped with cars waiting, a 3.0 swap station plus 4 NIO supercharger outside can still charge twice as many cars per hour compared to an 8 stall supercharger station which only does DC fast charging. Both setups are equal in size, but the NIO setup will charge more cars under peak conditions. Although it is also true the NIO setup which includes a swap station and 21 batteries stored inside at all times also costs more to setup than just putting in 8 superchargers. That's part of why you pay a premium for NIO vehicles.
Thanks for an awesome video once again. Did they talk about the ability to leave the car while swapping? This was atleast show int the release video. Also I thought the power was supposed to stay on during the swap in 3.0🤔
Yeah if you can't get out. You still have to sit still, can't even use the infotainment system. When i charge my Tesla. I just step out the car, walk to the toilet. Get a coffee, when i get back the battery is already full. This is my REAL WORLD experience. I don't feel swapping will add anything or solve any problem in my life to be honest.
I'm just a dummy but a deal with 7/11eleven seems like a no brainier in the USA 🤔🧐✅
Your point at 3:40 is entirely misleading because you could achieve the exact same thing with superchargers and electricity storage batteries, except the batteries wouldn't have to be made to fit into an EV so it could be less energy-dense material. If you're going to have a battery swap station, you will need to buy batteries that get charged and swapped with empty batteries. If peak energy demand were really worth handling, Supercharging stations could also just get a battery that would discharge at peak times.
You don't at all dig into the discussion of how much a station costs relative to however many Supercharger stalls, all of the engineering limitations introduced by forcing a robotic stall to be compatible with many different makes and models of EVs, or how much more maintenance it would require than a simple Supercharger stall.
If all you do is say that battery swapping would be faster than charging, which is painfully obvious, and then do verbal sleight of hand to create an advantage that isn't necessarily unique to battery swapping, but then never dig into any of the cons of battery swapping, then you did not at all address the title question "Why battery swapping is still better than SuperCharging" and I am left only with the conclusion that "it probably isn't".
Sure you could add a big battery and charge from that, but that would increase the footprint would it not? You gotta put the battery somewhere. You'd have less charging stalls in that case.
Also these two videos, presumably you watched the other, aren't really about the costs to the company, though they did say that with the third generation the costs have come down and the value provided has greatly increased (From 5 to 21 batteries in same footprint), and now has the flexibility to support more car sizes and batteries (including from other brands).
From my experience driving EVs in US, Europe and China, and having far too many problems with fast charging not working, but battery swapping working 100 percent of the time, I can't say for certain which requires more maintenance. The obvious answer is a giant battery swapping robot requires more, and if so, then NIO does an admirable job keeping them maintained and operational and most charging companies fail that maintenance task miserably, especially considering it should be easier and cheaper.
Thanks for the comment, it is certainly an interesting topic. As a user, in most instances of public "charging," battery swapping is a better experience. From a company perspective, apparently NIO thinks it is better, in conjunction with the 4 other types of energy replenishment outlined. A lot of other companies are now getting onboard with battery swap in China, so there must be something to it. It probably isn't the answer everywhere in the world. So is it better, maybe a better answer than it is or it isn't, is "it depends."
battery swapping will never become a viable main-stream solution for evs, regardless of how fervently some in the tiny minority of nio owners and enthusiasts seem to believe in it.
It’s not meant to be. Watch the videos you’ll see nios theory on it being one of 4 better solutions than refueling ice or supercharging
if EU can push usb c for smartphone then why not with ev?
Hopefully german authorities will understand that soon and let them spread fast!
I doubt German or any European countries are not allowing NIO to build these swap/charge stations. The problem would more be that each one costs more to setup than a simple supercharging lot containing only DC fast chargers, and how much money does NIO have to invest in putting a bunch of these swap stations all over the place versus how many cars they are managing to sell in Europe.
@@tren133 Oh, Germany and Europe will totally approve them. But in Germany it will take ages. Nio started in the Netherlands and Germany more or less at the same time. While the Netherlands already have 4 PSS you find in Germany only 3. Relative to the size of the countries the Netherlands cover by like 70%, while Germany is covered by maybe 10%.
I‘m less worried about NIO’s financials than Germany’s way of how they understand fast development.
yes these cars are expansive, BUT I assume that rich people can not afford to wait 6 hours or overnight for their vehicle to be in active mode. Therefore these cars are best for buissy rich people who wants LUXURY EV
What’s your stock price prediction EOY ?
No. Swapping is not better than supercharging.
I’m curious why people comment without engaging with the content. Perhaps you can enlighten us
Better yet, don't get an EV at all.
I agree, public transport is a better solution but good luck getting people on board
You talk to much 🤣 where is the snack shack? 🌯🥤
Post it on twitter pls, and ur twiteer user name so i can repost it