Thanks, I'm just a regular guy using the BMW Service DVD to accomplish these tasks. ( I do have an A&P Certificate, so that specialized training helps)
You make fantastic videos and give excellent instruction, thanks for this. I am new to BMW with a used '23 1250GS and have purchased the full tool kit from Pilz. My question is what mileage would you recommend doing this procedure? I plan to keep this bike for a long time and like to stay ahead on maintenance. Thanks!
It's not a "necessity" to do this Cam Timing...as a matter of fact, the only reference to using these tools in the BMW Service DVD is to use them when a Camshaft is REPLACED. That said, if you live anywhere close to New England in the USA, where I live, or could attend one of the BMWST.COM START or FART Rallies, I do this procedure on 2 bikes a day. To answer your question, the engine needs about 12k miles to allow everything in the valve train to break-in and normalize before doing this. If you do it before that, then you might need to do it again after it gets 12k miles on it...if you have well over that mileage, no problem, you will just enjoy a smoother engine that might run better.
When using MY DIY Cam Chain Tensioner, yes 12mm of bolt extension is the same for the WetHead and the ShiftHead. This is NOT a direct application of tension on the Cam Chain...it's what's required only with MY DIY TOOL and is completely different than the number of turns with the OEM Tool. Totally "Apples and Oranges". There is no need to use any kind of cam chain device to do the Valve Clearance check. If you are just "somewhat close" to being at TDC, as evidenced by the piston near the spark plug hole, and the laser etched marks on the ends of the cams being "far apart, away from each other" (on the R1200 WetHead) then you will have the cams on the base circle so you can measure the clearance.
Where did you find the specs and procedures? BMW has made their manuals online and dealer only access. My shop can't access them for 2021 and newer because I'm a private shop and not an official BMW dealer. Even though I am BMW factory certified.....
I have the BMW Original DVD from 2019 and the engine has not changed up until the 1300 as you know. I'm just an amateur mechanic, so don't go by anything I say or do.
At 4 minutes in you use your tool to rotate the camchain sprocket. I notice you turn it in a CW direction (when viewed from the rear, face-on) so that the tight side of the chain during rotation would be on the bottom. Wouldn`t this put undue strain on both the camchain tensioner and guides? It could also introduce any slack in the chain to the top chain run causing camshaft timing retardation and failure of the camshaft setting tool to fit, or is this known by BMW to be the case and is what the camchain tensioner special tool is for - to tension the lower run of the chain thus eradicating the slack on the top run thus pull the camshaft timing back to spec? If so it`s a rather crude way of doing it.. Ideally during camshaft timing and/or valve clearance adjustment it is the crankshaft that should be turned in the normal direction of rotation but there is no provision for that on these 1250 engines.
This is just the way the BMW Service DVD specifies the engine to be tuned over. There is very little resistance on the crankshaft once the spark plugs are removed.
This video is gold. Thanks for taking the time to put it together. One question: Where do I get a good set of feeler gauges for a '20 R1250RT Shiftcam Engine and do you sell the tools (cam alignment jigs, cam tensioner, 8mm TDC locking ping, 16mm torque adapter, and Engine turning bar?
I was making one set from 2 that covered just the range needed for the 1200/1250. One set was from Amazon, and one set was from Hornig...which is no longer available. Sorry, I have not found another source for the second essential set.
Hi, first of all let me start by saying that it is a pleasure to see such an organized way of working while at the same time explaining everything very clearly. I have a 2021 BMW R 1250 GSA with 9k km, with an annoying rattle between 2k to 3.5k RPM coming from the left head. Despite many attempts at BMW dealership, they say the sound is normal and no solution has been found. Today I drove another 1250 GSA from the dealership with 2k km and that one didn't have that annoying sound. In you experience, did you ever come across any 1250 engine with a ticking noise beyond normal and if so, could your provide some guidance/advise? I'm conscious that all boxer engines are noisy but not like a bag of nails inside the engine. Many thanks from Portugal
Impressive; thank you. Three questions: 1) what symptom would you expect to hear/feel from a boxer engine that is not perfectly timed? 2) do you have any guess of the % of engines operating that are not correctly timed? 3) is checking timing a usual and customary shop service/check?
Hi Andrew, answers to your questions: 1) I think that a slightly out of time set of cams generally runs a little rougher, both at idle and at intermediate RPMs as well. Sometimes it represents as hard starting, but that is more likely the timing reluctor being out of time, and is part of establishing correct alignment for all the valve train components. There may be a little less economy also from less than optimal flow thru the heads. 2) My experience with doing about 100 Cam and Valve checks is that about 85% of the "First Look" timing checks need some adjustment of both the cams and timing reluctor. 3) I don't know for sure, but I don't think shops would do a Cam Timing check unless some part of the valve train was disassembled for the replacement of a component. This procedure is not called for in any of the normal mileage or calendar service sheets.
@@Boxflyer11 I can confirm that a bmw dealer does not do cam timing checks and alignments. Quote: "we can only replace the cams." You might also get excess vibration between 4200-4800 rpm on wetheads 1200 lc. Because of the special tools needed it's unfortunately something I cant do myself. These tools are hard to come by.
Great videos, thank you very much. I'm going to be taking this job on later this week. I noticed a slight difference from the R1250 service manual. After the ignition timing is adjusted, they remove the alignment jig and the TDC locating pin, crank the engine with the barring tool until it is at TDC again, lock it with the pin, then re-install the alignment tool a second time to check the timing. Do you see any value in this?
That would be fine, BUT, I would not keep the tension on the Cam Chain Tensioner. I'd slack it off before turning the engine over to relieve some of the excess pressure on the slack side of the cam chain...it's just too tight for turning the engine over. It's basically doing another complete setup to check timing after you just went thru the setup to align all the components. I DO turn the engine over after checking and replacing any of the valve shims with the Cam Chain Tensioner slacked off. This has proven to give me credible readings immediately after touching all the surfaces that can leave "crap" on these critical clearance surfaces...it's my practice after doing well over 100 of these checks.
I think there is a huge mistake in the BMW RepROM. If you want to have a go at figuring out why a single 25mm bolt that’s the same bolt as 2 others gets a different torque than the single 35mm on the LH EXH, that’s the only different one of the 4…have at it. I believe that paragraph is wrong and the only way to error on the safe side is to torque ALL the bolts to 65Nm. I’m doing soooo many of these that it would be impossible to catch up with every bike that would be under torqued following the BMW way so I could add 8% to 2 shorter 25mm bolts and 1 bolt that’s 35mm long. Do what you like, but I doubt BMW will respond to this error when they won’t share the RepROM with anyone.
Good morning, I have a 2023 BMW rt and the engine rattles and I’m thinking something is out of timing. I traded in a r1250 gs for a 2023 r1250 rs for my California bike for my daughters house. This engine runs perfect no clatter no noise when under load. Both engines run perfect at idle the clatter on the rt is only when under load and generally when letting clutch out although it does still clatter when under load. I’m going to bmw this morning because the turn signals don’t cancel and the engine noise. I’m certain they’re going to say it’s normal engine nois which it isn’t. Are the mechanics at bmw dealerships qualified or capable of doing this at the dealership like you did or do they avoid this at all costs. Also where do you work out of I’m in the Chicago area. Thank you Duane
@duanecarlson5008, working with the dealership can be frustrating...at times, but while still in the warranty period is really their business. The relationship of the clutch noise and clatter under load sound to me to be different sources, but one thing you don't mention is the miles on the bike. I've been doing borescope documentation on the last 15 or so bikes I've worked on...almost every bike under 15k miles still show that both sets of valves have not seated completely. What this can result in is poor sealing of the combustion chamber making uneven power pulses. If it's the intake valves that are still breaking in, the intake charge can be affected so that even more uneven combustion occurs. Overall assessment, is that running the bike with lots of heavy throttle (but not high RPM) to finish the break-in of the engine is critical...nothing that the dealer, or other maintainer can do, it's the process of getting everything settled in with the engine to make it run smooth. The Service DVD only references using the Cam Timing Tools for replacement of a camshaft...NOT for the re-adjustment back to factory original setting that I do in this series...dealers are not inclined to do this for any complaints related to noise or perceived poor running. Another important maintenance step in this troubleshooting effort is to use some high PEA concentration fuel system cleaner. I don't recommend using more than 1oz per gallon of fuel, and try to only do 2 tank fulls per oil change to guard against oil contamination. (recent oil analysis does not show degraded oil quality, but enough is enough) I like Redline SI-1 or Chevron Techron. I'm in Rhode Island, and work in my garage. I'm not a business, just an enthusiast working for free on other folks bikes...I don't charge for any work I perform. Good luck with your bikes.
Hi, love ur channel, I have got a r1250rs, with a damaged cylinder head, the chain has been knocked off and I’m replacing the head. Is there a way of timing the head without the cam setting tool? My local BMW garage will not sell me the tool. Thanks Jason
@jasonlee8282 You can physically configure the cams to be coarsely aligned (in the right gear teeth) once the cam chain is installed. (If you have not changed the relationship of the cam drive gears to the camshafts themselves) This can be done by using the laser etched marks and 3 flat sides on the opposite cylinder cams. Set the "known cylinder" cams 180 degrees out of TDC by rotating the engine so you can see the 8mm slot in the access plug on the side of the engine. Then you can install the newly installed cams so that the intake cam has the 3 flat sides up and the 2 vertical sides are parallel to the machined surface of the head. The exhaust cam needs to have the laser etched mark on the end at the bottom and the flats also parallel to the cylinder head. At this point, you need to do a Valve Clearance procedure. The engine should run at this point, but the full procedure of using the 8mm TDC tool, the Cam Chain Tensioner, and the Cam Alignment Jigs would be highly recommended to set both sets of cams, and most importantly the LH Exh cam timing reluctor for the engine to run exactly as it came from the factory.
Excellent video, well explained and very detailed, I want to ask you about the chain tensioner tool, do its measurements apply to R1200gs LC? Greetings from Argentina
Ciao, great video! thanks for sharing. would be possible for you to provide dimensional measurements of the camshaft jig? I’d really like to machining them on my own
The turning tool works well for both the 1200 and the 1250. Sure is nicer than putting an oily hand on the tire anytime you need to turn the engine over…which I do every time between installing new shims and doing the follow up measurements.
The part that’s sometimes the significant thing to complete the total improvement after doing the cam timing and valve clearance is to reset the Adaptive Values that the engine needs to run at its maximum efficiency.
On the GS-911 software, under the Engine section, there are 7 specific modules to reset. 1) DTC/ASC, 2)Camshaft Adjustment, 3)Knock sensors, 4)Mixture, 5)Throttle Valve, 6)Twist grip, 7)Gear shift/transmission. Each and every one of these is influenced by changes in Cam Timing, so they all need to be "sync'd" up after making adjustments to the Cams.
Glad you enjoyed it. I'm working hard on the remaining parts of Valve Clearance on the LH side and then the same Cam Timing and Valve Clearance checks on the RH side...
@@Boxflyer11 No problem. If you by any chance know the bmw tools required to do the cam timing and valve adjustment please post. I'll get it and do it myself. I'm due for service in the next 3000 miles.
Talking about educational. That is some great Mechanic level training right there. Thank you!
Thanks, I'm just a regular guy using the BMW Service DVD to accomplish these tasks. ( I do have an A&P Certificate, so that specialized training helps)
SIR...outstanding video on the valve system service. Thank you so much.
You are welcome
Fantastic content 👌
Glad you liked it
You make fantastic videos and give excellent instruction, thanks for this. I am new to BMW with a used '23 1250GS and have purchased the full tool kit from Pilz. My question is what mileage would you recommend doing this procedure? I plan to keep this bike for a long time and like to stay ahead on maintenance. Thanks!
It's not a "necessity" to do this Cam Timing...as a matter of fact, the only reference to using these tools in the BMW Service DVD is to use them when a Camshaft is REPLACED.
That said, if you live anywhere close to New England in the USA, where I live, or could attend one of the BMWST.COM START or FART Rallies, I do this procedure on 2 bikes a day.
To answer your question, the engine needs about 12k miles to allow everything in the valve train to break-in and normalize before doing this. If you do it before that, then you might need to do it again after it gets 12k miles on it...if you have well over that mileage, no problem, you will just enjoy a smoother engine that might run better.
Absolutely superb explanation of the wonders of the shiftcam engine thankyou for the time and effort to produce this video ...
CaptainChunk54 👍
Glad you liked it, I need to get back in the garage and make more!
Is the pre-tensioning (12mm) of the cam chain the same for the 1200LC engine? Is that pre-tension also required if only valve clearance is checked?
When using MY DIY Cam Chain Tensioner, yes 12mm of bolt extension is the same for the WetHead and the ShiftHead. This is NOT a direct application of tension on the Cam Chain...it's what's required only with MY DIY TOOL and is completely different than the number of turns with the OEM Tool. Totally "Apples and Oranges". There is no need to use any kind of cam chain device to do the Valve Clearance check. If you are just "somewhat close" to being at TDC, as evidenced by the piston near the spark plug hole, and the laser etched marks on the ends of the cams being "far apart, away from each other" (on the R1200 WetHead) then you will have the cams on the base circle so you can measure the clearance.
Where did you find the specs and procedures? BMW has made their manuals online and dealer only access. My shop can't access them for 2021 and newer because I'm a private shop and not an official BMW dealer. Even though I am BMW factory certified.....
I have the BMW Original DVD from 2019 and the engine has not changed up until the 1300 as you know. I'm just an amateur mechanic, so don't go by anything I say or do.
At 4 minutes in you use your tool to rotate the camchain sprocket. I notice you turn it in a CW direction (when viewed from the rear, face-on) so that the tight side of the chain during rotation would be on the bottom. Wouldn`t this put undue strain on both the camchain tensioner and guides? It could also introduce any slack in the chain to the top chain run causing camshaft timing retardation and failure of the camshaft setting tool to fit, or is this known by BMW to be the case and is what the camchain tensioner special tool is for - to tension the lower run of the chain thus eradicating the slack on the top run thus pull the camshaft timing back to spec? If so it`s a rather crude way of doing it..
Ideally during camshaft timing and/or valve clearance adjustment it is the crankshaft that should be turned in the normal direction of rotation but there is no provision for that on these 1250 engines.
This is just the way the BMW Service DVD specifies the engine to be tuned over. There is very little resistance on the crankshaft once the spark plugs are removed.
This video is gold. Thanks for taking the time to put it together. One question: Where do I get a good set of feeler gauges for a '20 R1250RT Shiftcam Engine and do you sell the tools (cam alignment jigs, cam tensioner, 8mm TDC locking ping, 16mm torque adapter, and Engine turning bar?
I was making one set from 2 that covered just the range needed for the 1200/1250. One set was from Amazon, and one set was from Hornig...which is no longer available. Sorry, I have not found another source for the second essential set.
Fantastic demonstration. Very helpful. I’m not sure why but my audio was cutting out. Maybe my system causing that.
Glad it helped!
Hi, first of all let me start by saying that it is a pleasure to see such an organized way of working while at the same time explaining everything very clearly. I have a 2021 BMW R 1250 GSA with 9k km, with an annoying rattle between 2k to 3.5k RPM coming from the left head. Despite many attempts at BMW dealership, they say the sound is normal and no solution has been found. Today I drove another 1250 GSA from the dealership with 2k km and that one didn't have that annoying sound. In you experience, did you ever come across any 1250 engine with a ticking noise beyond normal and if so, could your provide some guidance/advise? I'm conscious that all boxer engines are noisy but not like a bag of nails inside the engine. Many thanks from Portugal
"9k and MANY Attempts at BMW"...Plenty of warranty left...the dealer needs to be the final say on this.
Nice job, a very good and didactic videos for people who like mechanics, thank you a regards from Portugal
Thank you, I’m glad you enjoyed them.
Impressive; thank you. Three questions: 1) what symptom would you expect to hear/feel from a boxer engine that is not perfectly timed? 2) do you have any guess of the % of engines operating that are not correctly timed? 3) is checking timing a usual and customary shop service/check?
Hi Andrew, answers to your questions:
1) I think that a slightly out of time set of cams generally runs a little rougher, both at idle and at intermediate RPMs as well. Sometimes it represents as hard starting, but that is more likely the timing reluctor being out of time, and is part of establishing correct alignment for all the valve train components. There may be a little less economy also from less than optimal flow thru the heads.
2) My experience with doing about 100 Cam and Valve checks is that about 85% of the "First Look" timing checks need some adjustment of both the cams and timing reluctor.
3) I don't know for sure, but I don't think shops would do a Cam Timing check unless some part of the valve train was disassembled for the replacement of a component. This procedure is not called for in any of the normal mileage or calendar service sheets.
@@Boxflyer11 I can confirm that a bmw dealer does not do cam timing checks and alignments. Quote: "we can only replace the cams."
You might also get excess vibration between 4200-4800 rpm on wetheads 1200 lc.
Because of the special tools needed it's unfortunately something I cant do myself. These tools are hard to come by.
Great videos, thank you very much. I'm going to be taking this job on later this week. I noticed a slight difference from the R1250 service manual. After the ignition timing is adjusted, they remove the alignment jig and the TDC locating pin, crank the engine with the barring tool until it is at TDC again, lock it with the pin, then re-install the alignment tool a second time to check the timing. Do you see any value in this?
That would be fine, BUT, I would not keep the tension on the Cam Chain Tensioner. I'd slack it off before turning the engine over to relieve some of the excess pressure on the slack side of the cam chain...it's just too tight for turning the engine over. It's basically doing another complete setup to check timing after you just went thru the setup to align all the components. I DO turn the engine over after checking and replacing any of the valve shims with the Cam Chain Tensioner slacked off. This has proven to give me credible readings immediately after touching all the surfaces that can leave "crap" on these critical clearance surfaces...it's my practice after doing well over 100 of these checks.
@@Boxflyer11 thank you very much for sharing your knowledge.
I think, there is a slight mistake in the video. According to BMW RepROM:
Camshaft sprocket to camshaft tightening torques
Exhaust, right, M10 x 1.25 x 25 - 10.9
65 Nm
other camshafts, M10 x 1.25 x 35 - 10.9
60 Nm
In the video it calls all 65 Nm
I think there is a huge mistake in the BMW RepROM.
If you want to have a go at figuring out why a single 25mm bolt that’s the same bolt as 2 others gets a different torque than the single 35mm on the LH EXH, that’s the only different one of the 4…have at it.
I believe that paragraph is wrong and the only way to error on the safe side is to torque ALL the bolts to 65Nm.
I’m doing soooo many of these that it would be impossible to catch up with every bike that would be under torqued following the BMW way so I could add 8% to 2 shorter 25mm bolts and 1 bolt that’s 35mm long.
Do what you like, but I doubt BMW will respond to this error when they won’t share the RepROM with anyone.
Well done, Brad. Looking forward to seeing what I assume will be the rest in the series.
I got #2 out today, 3&4 are in work also.
Good morning, I have a 2023 BMW rt and the engine rattles and I’m thinking something is out of timing. I traded in a r1250 gs for a 2023 r1250 rs for my California bike for my daughters house. This engine runs perfect no clatter no noise when under load. Both engines run perfect at idle the clatter on the rt is only when under load and generally when letting clutch out although it does still clatter when under load. I’m going to bmw this morning because the turn signals don’t cancel and the engine noise. I’m certain they’re going to say it’s normal engine nois which it isn’t. Are the mechanics at bmw dealerships qualified or capable of doing this at the dealership like you did or do they avoid this at all costs. Also where do you work out of I’m in the Chicago area. Thank you Duane
@duanecarlson5008, working with the dealership can be frustrating...at times, but while still in the warranty period is really their business. The relationship of the clutch noise and clatter under load sound to me to be different sources, but one thing you don't mention is the miles on the bike. I've been doing borescope documentation on the last 15 or so bikes I've worked on...almost every bike under 15k miles still show that both sets of valves have not seated completely. What this can result in is poor sealing of the combustion chamber making uneven power pulses. If it's the intake valves that are still breaking in, the intake charge can be affected so that even more uneven combustion occurs.
Overall assessment, is that running the bike with lots of heavy throttle (but not high RPM) to finish the break-in of the engine is critical...nothing that the dealer, or other maintainer can do, it's the process of getting everything settled in with the engine to make it run smooth.
The Service DVD only references using the Cam Timing Tools for replacement of a camshaft...NOT for the re-adjustment back to factory original setting that I do in this series...dealers are not inclined to do this for any complaints related to noise or perceived poor running.
Another important maintenance step in this troubleshooting effort is to use some high PEA concentration fuel system cleaner. I don't recommend using more than 1oz per gallon of fuel, and try to only do 2 tank fulls per oil change to guard against oil contamination. (recent oil analysis does not show degraded oil quality, but enough is enough) I like Redline SI-1 or Chevron Techron.
I'm in Rhode Island, and work in my garage. I'm not a business, just an enthusiast working for free on other folks bikes...I don't charge for any work I perform.
Good luck with your bikes.
Your videos are fantastic, thank you for making them.
I try to make them pertinent to issues of servicing our bikes…Thanks!
Hi, love ur channel, I have got a r1250rs, with a damaged cylinder head, the chain has been knocked off and I’m replacing the head. Is there a way of timing the head without the cam setting tool? My local BMW garage will not sell me the tool.
Thanks Jason
@jasonlee8282 You can physically configure the cams to be coarsely aligned (in the right gear teeth) once the cam chain is installed. (If you have not changed the relationship of the cam drive gears to the camshafts themselves) This can be done by using the laser etched marks and 3 flat sides on the opposite cylinder cams. Set the "known cylinder" cams 180 degrees out of TDC by rotating the engine so you can see the 8mm slot in the access plug on the side of the engine. Then you can install the newly installed cams so that the intake cam has the 3 flat sides up and the 2 vertical sides are parallel to the machined surface of the head. The exhaust cam needs to have the laser etched mark on the end at the bottom and the flats also parallel to the cylinder head.
At this point, you need to do a Valve Clearance procedure.
The engine should run at this point, but the full procedure of using the 8mm TDC tool, the Cam Chain Tensioner, and the Cam Alignment Jigs would be highly recommended to set both sets of cams, and most importantly the LH Exh cam timing reluctor for the engine to run exactly as it came from the factory.
Excellent video, well explained and very detailed, I want to ask you about the chain tensioner tool, do its measurements apply to R1200gs LC? Greetings from Argentina
Yes it does, it works the same.
Thank you for your prompt response, you are very kind. Have a nice day@@Boxflyer11
Ciao, great video! thanks for sharing.
would be possible for you to provide dimensional measurements of the camshaft jig? I’d really like to machining them on my own
I don't have those dimensions.
Hello Boxflyer, congratulations for the excellent video
What name can we give the cam adjustment tool?
Thanks
Compliments
Portugal
Thank you. All the tools are described in this video. ruclips.net/video/JzzHMZuqCWQ/видео.html
Hi, love your videos! Question, do you sell your tools? Not sure if you covered it in another video or not. Thank you!
The info is in the video about the DIY Cam Timing Tools
Oh so you don't have to turn the tire like on a 1200 engine?! Interesting. Great video. Thanks for taking the time to make it
The turning tool works well for both the 1200 and the 1250. Sure is nicer than putting an oily hand on the tire anytime you need to turn the engine over…which I do every time between installing new shims and doing the follow up measurements.
@@Boxflyer11 I gotcha 👌. I'll reference your videos whenever I need to do such jobs. Thanks
I’m curious as to whether it’s the same for a R1250 GS.
Yes, it’s the same for all R1250 engines, doesn’t matter what frame it’s in.
Boxflyer, now that my cams are correctly timed, should I expect a noticeable difference? Smoother running, etc. ?
The part that’s sometimes the significant thing to complete the total improvement after doing the cam timing and valve clearance is to reset the Adaptive Values that the engine needs to run at its maximum efficiency.
@@Boxflyer11 . Do I reset the Adaptive Values with my GS-911? Not sure what Adaptive Values means...
Found it on the GS-911 hex code website. Reset camshaft adaptation values.
On the GS-911 software, under the Engine section, there are 7 specific modules to reset. 1) DTC/ASC, 2)Camshaft Adjustment, 3)Knock sensors, 4)Mixture, 5)Throttle Valve, 6)Twist grip, 7)Gear shift/transmission. Each and every one of these is influenced by changes in Cam Timing, so they all need to be "sync'd" up after making adjustments to the Cams.
@@Boxflyer11. THANK YOU!
Great video!
Glad you enjoyed it. I'm working hard on the remaining parts of Valve Clearance on the LH side and then the same Cam Timing and Valve Clearance checks on the RH side...
New subscriber here. Great content. Keep the videos coming
Thanks for subbing
@@Boxflyer11 No problem. If you by any chance know the bmw tools required to do the cam timing and valve adjustment please post. I'll get it and do it myself. I'm due for service in the next 3000 miles.
Excellent!
I forgot to start out the video with “Well Hello”!!! Thanks for teaching me how to produce RUclips videos.
@@Boxflyer11 actually these are far better than mine