How to Choose Water Supply Piping | This Old House
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- Опубликовано: 7 окт 2014
- This Old House plumbing and heating expert Richard Trethewey takes a look at the wide variety of water-supply pipes.
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How to Choose Water Supply Piping | This Old House
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PEX is great, but if you have a building that uses a crawlspace instead of a basement, always run long lengths of PEX inside lengths of larger PVC (or ABS) pipes, so the PVC pipe acts as a shield to prevent animals from chewing on the PEX pipe.
Pex leaches toxic chemicals into the water unfortunately
I always do that, I also run 3 inch drainage pipes underground for Main so that if there is a breakage on the Main line I just pull it out and push a new one in, specially under driveway or concrete, save my life for just another 50 dollars in material
it wouldn't be home depot without indoor birds
zxit Haha, so true
Don't forget the Mexicans standing in front of the store soliciting buisness.
4:25 vandalizing home depot property
I'm sure they got permission in advance @@SharpBlockSoft
its a classic thing on there
This show truly stands out from the rest of everybody else in the home improvement topic.
knew something was wrong when home depot had everything in the plumbing section fully stocked and organized as opposed to reality where half the stuff spaces are empty and the other half is a jumbled mess of various fittings taken and put back one thousand times per day and never reorganized.
Exactly. I've come to the conclusion that Home Depot only adds new stock and never reorganizes what's already there.
Let me add to that, you need say 5 fittings and they only have 4.
@@jamese9283 I worked at toys r us in high school and we used to stay about 2 hours after the store closed to put everything back in it’s place that customers messed up. I can’t even imagine trying to sort through bins of copper fittings at Home Depot trying to put everything back in it’s spot. You would never finish.
@@ryanalexander984 It's a workable problem among many other customer service issues that Home Depot does not address as long as the $$$ is flowing.
Going to Home Depot for pluming supplies is like getting castaway with Tom Hanks and Wilson. You will lose your mind forget why your at Home Depot and end up looking at contractor grade garbage bags and deep freezers comparing if the size is adequate for the person that asked you to go to there to buy pluming supplies. lol
I like the always present birds in the background at a home center.
Where there is seeds and warmth there will be birds. :)
how do you think the shelves get stocked
I would love to learn plumbing from Richard. Inspirational.
I love these guys. I walk thru home depot, I look at piping and have so many questions, thank goodness they have the answers!
I was so confused on the different material piping and you broke it down so simply. Thank you!
Good ol' PEX, first major plumbing endevour and loving the PEX/Sharkbite connectors combination.
And the copper thieves hate plastic.
But sadly the random poisoned rodent by our current pest control methods seek it out as they're dying of thirst.
We call those Romanians.
They should have explained that only Pex A is expandable for use in the last connection type. Pex B is for the compression fittings.
@@tkjokesterZurn makes a UL listed Pex B that can be expanded.
@@tkjokester Both can be done by heat treatment.
Beautiful explanation. Loved it.
Excellent guys, other videos teach how to do it, but you guys teach us the material as well. Thanks
That instant type brass lock fitting I have used with success it replaced the plastic "acorn " fitting and they work also but only if you install tight enough otherwise they will leak. I found that out and just got a claw hammer behind it and pried it tight, no more leak but I would not buy this type again, I had it in a tight spot that was hard to get at . Like the video says and show , so many to choose from. Good informative video. Thanks.
great tips. thanks for the video and to all the great commenters
I work at Home Depot in the plumbing dept. It's so weird to see what it used to look like now there is mostly just PEX and shark bite fittings hardly any copper or cpvc.
I also work in a Home Depot plumbing dept, funny enough, mine still doesn't look that much different than the one in the video. I still sell way more cpvc and copper than pex. Though granted I still technically only have one bay each for pex, cpvc, copper and shark bite. Just don't get a lot of people in my area springing for the pex unless their contractors.
I'm still coming in for the copper pipe and fittings. I'll be happy to help you fix something in your house with pex or whatever...
I give as much credit to the video editor for this informative and direct to the point explanation.
Thxs
i have tried every thing to change my bath under the sink valves you gave me some good ideas on what i want now is the time to up grade plumbing , thank you
Avoid CPVC. They become brittle over time and they easily crack and break. I think PAX is the way to go for new construction or repiping.
Galvanized steel piping was used for plumbing well into the mid-1950s. I have three rental properties that were built in the mid-50s and all have that piping!
Well when you are ready to change to copper or pex, let me know and I'll come repipe your houses. If you live near Panama City FL
A town near me , Plainview NY, has something in their water supply that was causing pinhole leaks in copper supply piping in over 100+ homes. That's compelling enough proof to covert to PEX in my renovation.
Pex has bigger problems than 100yr old solder joints.
They probably used 50/50 instead of what's required today which is lead free silver solder. Someone in your water department messed up big time by letting untreated corrosive water into the system. Pex fittings would fare no better, and introduce mice problems now and o-ring problems 20-50 years from now
PE compression fittings are fantastic! I used them to connect different kinds of pipes with the same size and they can hold the pressure on my pressure tank good enough. and they can be easily replace and just hand tighten can finish the job.
Great helpful videos, please keeping new updates videos
Here in Texas it's CPVC for everything. HD sold out everything in minutes during the freeze last month when all our pipes burst. New houses use the pex stuff.
Callie Masters y’all must have really hard water. Or just to be cheap. In New Jersey new homes with terribly hard water have cpvc and very few copper connections.
Great advice sir 👍
Where I live they were putting galvanized water pipe into new construction all the way up into the early 60s. Also, spend the extra money and use the type L copper, it's just so much sturdier and gives you more peace of mind in the long term. In addition, try to use the sharkbite style fittings in an exposed location only and not covered in insulation behind drywall. In the extremely rare chance it leaks, at least you'll be able to get to it and see it, rather than have to hunt it down.
As for PEX, it works great if you have the space to use the tools, but if you are working in close quarters, you can spend more time getting the tool into place than actually making the connection. This is where sweating copper can actually be easier, so long as fire precautions are taken into consideration.
Good info.
the expansion method is very similar to coax cable connectors. Very nice
Cool pipe insulation in background. Heat and frost insulators
This stuff is great.
It keeps surprising me how things can be different in specific countries. This video did not even mention Polypropylene "PPR" Tubing (connected by welding fittings - very fast and durable), while in my country (Czech Republic, middle of Europe) PPR tubes are used almost exclusively, except for PE tubes for underground applications. Similarly for drain pipes - in these videos you always glue PVC pipes, but we've stopped using glued PVC probably 10 - 20 years ago, everything is now polypropylene ("HT" system) connected just by pushing one piece into another (there is a rubber gasket).
www.google.com/amp/s/www.flowguard.com/blog/should-i-choose-cpvc-or-ppr-piping%3Fhs_amp%3Dtrue
There seems to be many downsides to PPR
@@donovanboyda6141 I did't say our way was better, just different. Btw, although many of the facts noted in the article are true, you must keep in mind that it is a promotion article of a company that sells or makes one type of piping, so naturally they will present it as the best thing that was ever invented ;-)
Tomáš Kot didn’t say you said it was better either.
Awesome! It Just gets me excited
In sweden you're not allowed to have any fittings inside walls at all on tapwater. Some are allowed on heating. Unless enclosed in a waterproof housing with a pipe out through the wall leading the water out. So no chance of water damage unless you put a screw through a pipe. So we use pex or alu-pex in 99% of cases when doing hidden installations.
2 words Flexi pipe
I hate American building codes. We have pipes in walls, HVAC lines prone to rodent attack. Toilet flanges are an absolute joke. Subfloor with plywood is a joke. Cabinets and counters are made with particle board that swells from moisture. Drywall is non-removable for maintenance. Floors are not designed for maintenance. Improper vapor barriers are used. Basements are designed for flooding. Roof shingles can fail easily and cause damge to the plywood underneath it and all the squishy insulation underneath that followed by the water sensitive ceiling beneath that. If you're lucky, the leak won't track down a wall to destroy the wall and subfloor. I swear the buildings are designed for water damage and rodent infestation. I'm no contractor, but from what I've seen, America is a joke.
@moonless6491 in more and more ways these days I'm afraid
I started working in the plumbing industry in Iceland a couple of years ago, and the difference between American and Icelandic plumbing is quite big. My companys favourite plumbing material is Al-pex from Rehau, it has pex at the center, aluminium coating ontop of that and over that we've got another coating of pex. In my town, because of the water, we can't use copper pipes, we used to use them for heating, but now we don't use them at all, and in drinking water, it's a complete no-no, because of the amount of oxygen in the water.
Jon.Hardars what is the purpose of the al-pex versus the regular pex?
What you mean because of the amount of oxygen in the water.
@@Juan.Melendez It has an aluminum core.
@@edwardmarshall2035 I lnow that. But what is the purpose of it?
@@Juan.Melendez probably to deter rodents from chewing through it. I have never used Alu-pex.
3:20 Redid my entire 2 story house with that myself.
It couldn't have been easier and faster to do.
Great technology!
Thanks, good info.
lmao putting the shark bite on a copper pipe at Home Depot
mark- actually the shark bite has a simple release
yup and walk away hehehe
I paused youtube legit 3 times before I realized the birds were in the video.......
That was cool
Besides copper which plastic is the safest health wise?
This must be the “home center” they are always referring to. Lots of orange 😉
30 years ago I worked in a factory that mad x-linked PE water pipe. Sold like crazy across Europe.
I like how they only commented about galavanised pipes oxidatiting and causing rust and clogging. But not how toxic it is.
this great
Useful information and I did learn something, BUT a lot of left out/mislead information too.
Here in Phoenix we have roof rats and they eat plastic, I've repaired homes that we're destroyed by slow drips where rats chewed a hole for water but just enough for a slow leak and that ruined all the studs, drywall, mold etc. Copper or pay for a major repipe and new construction.
libertyn jeopardy have you tried using Pex A (uponor expandable pex) I’ve heard that mice do not eat it do to the taste in the plastic. It is made of different material than Pex B (your crimp style pex) might be worth looking into
Best of luck
@@mike617 I was going to ask if rats eat Pex, thanks for the answer!
Lee S keep in mind, there is pex A and pex B..pex A supposedly mice and rats will not eat
Thousands of homes have pex piping now
In Europe/Canada people stopped using copper 20-30 years ago lol
Can you connect to different systems together?
thnku
Choosing water supply materials really should include information on which are suitable for big temperature swings and outdoor / sheltered use.
I have 70 year old galvanized coming from my well, in an outdoor well house that was partially replaced with the wrong PVC that I now am in a crunch to fix because most of the new pipe/fittings didn't make the weekend freeze and the galvanized just needs it. I was going to go with new galvanized pipe and fittings. I wish I could find some old unused stock with American made steel.
Galvanized Steel was used well into the 1970's. My house was built in 1974 and aside from a few copper additions put in circa 1990 everything is steel.
These dudes literally just taking tools and fittings off the shelf and compressing them liberally.
I had an idea for a prank video if someone had enough friends and money to pay for all materials. Spit up into teams and see who could build the most epic structure before they get kicked out of the store.
If there's nobody there to help you then there's nobody there to stop you
The plumbing contractor for my mom's house used the red PEX tubing for both the hot and cold water. Same thing for the contractor that did my oldest sister's house.
colour doesn't matter unless you are racist. :)
@@MyKonaRC BLUE PIPES MATTER.
Semper Fi Perhaps. But probably he or she didn’t have any blue on hand so they ran all red to finish the job.
There are no performance differences between red, white, blue and white PEX and all are intended for use in potable water systems. The colors can be used to easily distinguish between hot and cold distribution lines. Orange PEX pipe is an oxygen barrier PEX pipe used only for hydronic heating applications.
Galvanized is fine for the first 30 years, then clogs up and rusts. Was also used in some homes for gas lines. Copper is king, will never clog or deteriorate; but, freezes quickly and can split or leak at the joints if frozen. Must be wrapped and kept from the cold. CPVC is easier to cut and a little more forgiving then copper, but gets delicate with age. Flex pipe I’ve dealt with very little, but seems to be quick and inexpensive. All of the above minus galvanized can be connected with a compression connection nowadays, making repairs and installs much easier across the board.
Bone Stock Garage 👍
Pex is the future. The stuff I work with, has a 25 year manufacturers warranty.
@@edwardmarshall2035 I've found that the warranty length is directly proportional to the difficulty of claiming said warranty
In all new home construction in the northwest they use pex. My home was built in the late 90s and is CPVC. I asked a plumber what it would cost to repipe he said 4500 to 5 G. I work in construction and have some friends that know friends and see if they want to make 2k doing it for me as a side job
Planning to re pipe my home which one will be better and which one last longer
What is so nice about PEX is that if there is an earthquake it can flex inside the wall where other pipes can be ridged and brake flooding the area and causing damage.
Erm, type K is common on some jobs. L is not the thickest copper and while at it, before galvo, water was run in cast iron with lead joints. That was when plumbers were really plumbers.
They also had a lower life expectancy.
The biggest advantage of Pex is it cuts days off a job. Take your average 2 story house; to rough that with copper water lines, it'd take about a week, with Pex it takes a day and a half. That's a HUGE difference when you're jumping from house to house one after another. We just finished a cul-de-sac of 4 houses, all fitted with Pex, if we fitted them all with copper, it would have taken another week and a half easy. Time is money, another week on a job site is costing you potentially thousands. Not to mention copper is much more expensive, there's no question Pex is going to overcome copper, it already has and it's already been around for 20 years. Don't forget, Europe was using it well before the US adopted it, it's track record is proven. Look around any new construction, you're going to have a hard time finding one that's fitted with copper. Copper is dying a slow death just like cast iron. Retrofitting and renovations, yes, we still try to replace copper with copper but even then, in many cases it makes much more sense just to use Pex especially in tight spaces, who the hell would still rather lug a solder tank around and struggle just to make one connection in a tight space when you can grab a stick of Pex and a sharkbite fitting and be done in seconds?
Sure, the old-school plumbers will argue with you all day why you should still use copper but out there on the job sites, it's no longer practical from a time perspective and more importantly, money perspective. Pex costs a third of the price and takes a third of the time to install, that's the bottom line.
Richard a true professional Copper is King , I worked in a Industrial plumbing and fitter supply house years ago and have friends that are Master and Journeymen plumbers and some PIPE fitter friends . I know the pipe fitter friends cant do plumbers jobs or even have the knowledge of a true plumber, the fact I don't understand why anyone would ever put plastic in thier home vs copper is beyond me lots of reasons to use copper ie longevity, home value , home owner insurance rates and a plethora of other reasons . Oh Richard you didn't mention there are 3 types copper one you left out Type k green writing , anyway you are a true professional sir.
That's weird - Home Depot always kicks me out when I go around putting the connections onto the ends of the pipe they have.
Strange they didn't show any press fit copper fittings. That's what all plumbing/heating people use around here, and that's what I'm using to do work in my own house with a manual pressfit tool. It works real good and I won't accidentally burn my house down :D
They did at 2:12 … as a plumber I would not use “squish to fit” in anything inside a wall or hard to reach
Ok great video Rich T now could one of your producers PLEASE TELL US what is the brand name of that wonderful mechanical Pex expander and crimping tool so we can get to work!!
Search for REHAU EVERLOC+
In New Zealand we use Pex (bute) it’s truly incredibly unbelievably fantastically good.
But will it stand the test of time? Copper has a proven 1000 year record.
I work for home insurances here in Sacramento, Ca, and let me tell you something, DO NOT USE those cheap Pex water supply tubes, they are one of the worst designs for houses, 5 out of ten jobs we get are from Pex pipes, exploding, rats chewing through them (hot pipes) fittings coming out, small pin holes, unnoticeable cousing up to 10k on damages, including microbial growth, mold, its just a headache ! What do you expect from platic that explodes because it gets too hot with simple water from boiler or tubing that a rat can chew, just use copper!
There's a special PEX called PEX-AL-PEX that's used for high heat usage where temps go above 140F. It's two layers of PEX with a core of aluminum between the layers of PEX. As for the rats chewing on pipes, maybe get rid of the rats since they're a health hazard in the first place.
What I learned the hard way is copper can erode and corrode. In AZ and at least some parts of TX the soil can cause leaks. Surprised me.
type k copper has a thicker wall than type L. It has green writing on it. It's generally used in commercial and industrial use. I've installed thousands of feet of type k. Generally used for medical gasses in hospitals.
LJU It goes MLK easy to remember by Martin Luther King... thin, thicker, thickest.
Where are we at with copper and press fittings now? I've heard some of the PEX fittings have failed quite a bit.
What is that last connector type calling for the PEX , I have seen pro-pex expanders but nothing with a sleeve like that
I believe it’s by Rehau and they offer both brass and plastic fittings. I used the brass set up and they are totally bombproof but expensive.
I wish my Home Depot was so neat like that.
Why i don't see ppr pipe?
You can use pov for cold water supply. Cpvc is used for hot water. Most plumbers chosse to use Cpvc so they dont have to buy seperate pipe
UPONOR FOR LIFE!!!!
No mention of multilayer?
My Home Depot and Lowes (here is SoCal) doesn't sell CPVC-- only sells PVC. And I believe that PVC is fine for supply lines. (Offen, service line from street to house is PVC.)
Make sure you read your PVC pipe, and ensure its rated for the pressure you're using it for.
We’re going pex! It’s perfect for our renovation..
How'd it turn out?
@@DctorSkillz1 so far, so good!
Anybody know the brand name of the last tool used?
M copper is used for gas applications and oil fired burners.
Is the water supply pipe for a mobile home park the responsibility of the park or the mobile homeowner?
Remember, the crimp style fitting will not work unless you tug on them and say that's not going anywhere, they work just like ratchet straps.
PVC was used for fresh water connections,always some way to jack up prices with special tools,pipe,whatever.
I was thinking that too no reason why you can't use PVC for cold water
Was looking for this comment my whole country is plumbed in pvc all my life! 😂😂
"that's tight" that's what he said
🤣🤣🤣😂😂
Eeeewww!! You realize that girls like reading comments too. LOL!! bleh
Good idea to take out my copper pipes, throughout my house and install Pex ?
The reason is water running through my ranch style home is very noisy. I do have access to all the plumbing fixtures in my house through my basement.
Noisy, how? You having water hammer issues? You can look into it. Sounds like a dream repipe.
@@generalvanman8270 he might be having dripping water faucet somewhere(kitchen/bathroom) in the house. I had the same issue of noisy water piper every time you flush or use any tap...recently I changed all my faucets and that noise is gone forever.
@@100sankum yep air is in the lines and usually the noise culprit. Repair/replace leaky fixtures and fittings
I would go with the pex I've heard it also has the ability to expand if the water lines freezes my copper pipes drive and bursted in my crawl space I have a 1955 house.
When my parent's bought their house in 1995 they had yet to move in and in January of 1996 came a 13 degree cold day and the copper pipes in the attic burst and they had to travel 1200 miles to a flooded house because the water company did not come out and shut the water off when they were supposed to. So, a 1959 house here that ended up with a huge water bill (not as huge as it could have been because the water company saw their mistake) and they had to fix the ceiling. To this day you can see the ceiling where the burst pipe had happened.
Ive fixxed tons of burst pex pipe their about the same id say
Can you use 5/8 for whole house
man I miss those copper prices :(
have you guys ever heard of tubolas the one that you heat and join
what is the name of the pex tool he used in the end? seems far superior pex connection
He used a Sioux Chief F2080 combo tool which Home Depot does not carry.
ericjane747 any idea where I can find it online google/amazon not showing it
@@ericjane747 that looks very useful
What is the name of this store
Pex seems like avery appealing option IF you regularly do this sort of work. For the average homeowner, they're not going to want to spend all that extra $$ for the specialty crimping or expansion tools to work with it. I'll probably go c-pvc because it doesn't require expensive tools.
the crimping tool isn't that expensive. You can rent them as well
You have to let the glue dry 24 hours plus the $8 can of glue spoils as soon as you open it. You have to get on the job and stay on it. If you have a small piece left to do later you might need a new can of glue. I an sticking with pex crimps and sharkbites, can put in service right away. I have 3 years on several kinds of joints and no fails including in walls.
there's some sharkbite style connectors for pex now too.
lets not forget about the expansion tool. plus the electric expansion tool is well worth the cost if that connection is throughout your house....
Culi as de mexico
Hello Allie.....which one are you in the vid ?
This is great, except you don't see that last PEX connection sold in stores at Home Depot.
Problem with PEX is that if you have a rodent problem, they will chew though it.
I love copper but due to theft I use PEX. I was under the understanding that sharkbites were used in areas that were exposed and required access.
Sharkbites can be concealed, although not all people trust them. They've also been recently approved for being used below grade and buried. People should trust sharkbites more. Their inner o-ring degrades slower than the pex pipe everyone fawns over.
@@jasonwomack4064 Thanks for the reply. In a few areas of Philadelphia when you install copper, the next morning it's gone.
So flux helps with the connection, ? cleaning the pipe?
If you try to solder metal, it will just oxidize like crazy. The flux prevents oxidization so you can melt the metal in the presence of oxygen without it just all oxidizing.
What tool is @4:48
Where to get it and what do you call that?
It's a wangjangler
Home Depot sells Pex-A, otherwise known as Uponor now.
No
@@bryanl9445 yes
At 2:38 he states that regular white PVC cannot be used for potable water systems that is not correct you can use PVC or CPVC for potable water systems it is recommended that CPVC be used for hotlines PVC will work to 140 and C PVC will work to 200° f
Noticed my home has PVC on the water line from the main to the water heater, maybe 60’. Is regular PVC allowed?
Wow, I've never met a plumbers merchant that would let you wander around randomly attaching fittings like that, it's amazing what you can get away with if you bring a tv camera along!
Mark Smith lol I thought the same thing like those fittings are useless now and some of them were pretty expencive. but I think they had a special arangment of either paying for it off camera or home depo(which most hadymen can tell from being them so many times) just wanted the free advertising
Sterling Blair I do that all the time at my local merchants. If I ask them a question it's likely them who go to the aisle and show me.
Am I really that lucky?
+Mark Smith Home Depot underwrites This Old House, so they have a closer relationship with the store than most people.
it's the home depot..not a plumbing wholesaler
This was a planned and scripted production so those little details, that we never see, were negotiated in cash dollars or endorsements and brand placement in the show well before the cameras rolled. Anyone that's been to a Home Depot recognizes that the show pros are in a Home Depot store... Many minutes of close to free TV advertising to a guaranteed interested audience without in-your-face hard-sell marketing and a big production bill. All it costs is a handful of plumbing fittings and a couple chunks of PEX pipe... Sounds like a Win-win proposition.
Also: If you think those expensive expansion and crimping tools are just laying about at The Home Depot for Joe Q Public to play with and maybe walk out the door with you need a serious reality check.
He didn’t show uponor/wirsboro but what was that last connection he made? I’ve never seen that. It expanded kinda like uponor, but very different. If they only make it in brass, I’m assuming that’s why I haven’t seen it yet
Did you find out what that type of fittings was?
Yeah I’ve never seen that fitting before either
Pvc can be used for cold water