10 Facts you might not know about Spartan-IV's
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- Опубликовано: 1 май 2023
- In this episode: Today we continue with our 10 Things series and take a look at the Spartan-IV's! #halo #halolore #spartans
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Another reason the S-4 augmentations might need tune ups is because as an open and legal program, it has to meet those standards. That means eventually, people are going to retire. Having augments that drop in efficacy means that in the future, they'll likely still be enhanced to some degree, but not so much that it's a potential problem. I'm not talking about sports or jobs, I'm talking about civil wars. Just look how many issues they've had with Spartans going rogue, and you can see why this might be an important thing for the UNSC to consider.
That actually sounds possible
@@Floodkilleryup. Look at micky
The other consideration is that their potential children might be more receptive to augmentation and enhancements.
ONI might be looking at a longer game.
With as corrupted as the UNSC and ONI and the earth government are do you blame them?
@@mjpraetorian4386 Yep. Him and that woman from the comics were who I was thinking of. Also Naomi from the novels, who would have been perfectly justified in turning on the UNSC and siding with her dad.
Hate how the IV's were implemented into the lore with the whole "separate branch" thing, but love the concept of the IV's. Lovely to hear some extra lore about them.
Love here, love there, my guy you is Cupido 😎👉👉
In practice, the S-IV's are the logical conclusion to the Spartan program. The S-II's were proof of concept, but far too few and expensive, despite their extraordinary effectiveness. The S-III's demonstrated that Spartans could be cost-effective in large numbers. The S-IV's are then the final product.
I would've liked to see each branch getting Spartans, giving reasons for different armors, color schemes, attitudes, etc
@@helljumperomega5151 elaborate. Isn't that already the case? Genuine question.
@@Commander_Raveth no, they specifically worked with the spacenavy. It’s why we almost always work with marines. And have naval rank. All fall under ONI.
The constant tune-ups for the 4s is probably intenional; it's a good way to limit risks if a 4 defects.
Just like the 7-year age limit for AI. It's purposely done.
@@perilousturtle2171 you sure about that?
You saw through the BS 👍 something seemingly dismissive but with a broader possible intent. The colonial disputes after the covenant war surely inspired this since ONi wouldn’t want them to have a sudden change of allegiance after their investment.
@@HybrydATP64 considering in cannon spartan 2s have gone awol it makes sense
i wonder how different the Covenant war would have been if the full 300 Spartan II's had been trained and augmented
judging by how quickly the SIIs got thinned out, probably not that differently
@@Gofaw "How quickly they got thinned out."
What you mean the majority of them living until the second to last year of the war, and digging their heels in at the Fall of Reach (the largest and most important military complex of all human territory and the one that put up the best fight)?
Yeah they really didn't die fast.
Or rather, they died all at once after twenty years of the most brutal war humanity ever fought and the most important battle of said war.
@@admiralmurphy1543 most of them died on Reach, around half of them give or take. I say they got thinned out quickly because they took such heavy losses in what was arguably only the second large engagement against the Covenant after Harvest
The UNSC didn't have the resources to train more S-II's. MJOLNIR was unimaginably expensive early on, too much to justify the expenditure when the UNSC was frantically trying to replenish catastrophic losses.
Imagining a retired Spartan-IV as a grandparent with their grandkids. "Grandpa/Grandma, I wanna go uppies!" *Pick up the kid and throws them 20 feet in the air and catches them.*
just gotta do it outside, otherwise that kid is going to make a ceiling angel
Just imagine if someone is dumb enough to kidnap their kids or grandkids. That’ll be Taken to the Max right there.
More so once the old fire team or their buddies find out. Those idiots would be dead faster then any grunt back in the day. 😝
Considering what Spartan means to most citizens and UNSC personnel and what they know, the marketing for a potential recruit and the drive it would give them to excel in their duties if they believe there’s a chance to become a Spartan IV, even if it’s monumentally small, cannot be underestimated. Calling Spartan IVs Hoplites would not yield as strong and determined of a fighting force. Plus there’s also the morale even a singular Spartan IV can provide to a Marine
@@MidanMagistrate Fancy meeting you here. And yeah, their resilience is often blown into mythical proportions. Sure they can survive falls and impacts most can’t but a plasma grenade or beam rifle will still kill. Hell, they had to worry about AP munitions before shielding was a thing because the suits didn’t self seal
Names have power sometimes the spartan name was glorified in the human covenant war and it makes sense why they are still called spartans
I agree fully! Look at todays armed forces. If we take US Green Berets they are a Tier 2 special forces. They are still special forces but not considered Tier 1 like Delta or Seal Team 6, but have the term “special forces” has the impact on morale for both friendly and enemy forces. This would have been the same for UNSC a d Covenant.
True. A lot of fans forget that Halo is a fleshed-out, mostly logical universe where practicality reigns supreme for the UNSC above petty feelings. This includes morale and recruitment tactics. Older fans don’t like it, but still calling IVs ‘Spartans’ is something every smart military would use as recruitment tools. Older fans underestimate the power of words
@@alexfrost2799I would say older fans do understand....words are important...and I can completely understand the worry of watering down exactly what a Spartan "is"....I for one don't really consider Spartan IVs fully Spartans....adopted cousins....but if that's good enough for MC....then it's good enough for me ...
The thing about Spartan-IVs being around already in 2552 and the "Battleborn" teens being the first ones is something I've noticed before, but that I hardly ever see other people mention.
It wasn't really ties together till recently and even then, most people skipped both books so
@@KillerOrca It's the only book in the franchise I did not read, as I thought it was a “kid” book. Wow, profound lore, though.
I agree, I feel like a lot of peoples knowledge is limited to the games, and video based lore, many don’t read the books or go that in depth, so it’s understandable that it’s not commonly mentioned.
Pretty certain that it's mentioned a few fireteams were at least around as early as late '52 and '53. Shadow began training as early as 2551 I think.
It's because both books were ass and most people don't consider 343i lore canon.
i think the maintainance is a temporary upkeep for the first ~7 years of augmentation to make sure every cell is augmented and there is no deaugmentation creep.
the earlier methodes using more drastic aproaches ensured full coverage better, but were more restrictive and needed children. children also have faster cell replacement, so a shorter stabilisation time is present
1. Oni wanting spartans that operate to that degree without armor is 100% an attempt to inject plainclothes super soldiers into civilian populations
2. I'd definitely like to know what happens when spartan IVs can't get their tune ups and if they can still receive them post retirement
I highly doubt the UNSC would allow retired Spartans to get augment tune ups. Technically, it would be military grade property, and you don't let civvies have that. Plus, probably as a precaution in case any Spartans go rebel.
I think it’s also worth noting that some SIVs might be now adult SIIIs in better armor
Given how ONI operates that is very feasible, soon as the young Spartans get to a certain age you create new/fake id's for them add in you just had this apocalyptic war from which you can make up several scenarios for where these particular soldiers came from. Matter as a fact The Spartan Branch recruits veterans with exceptional service or new service men and women that show potential who's to say those new recruits with potential aren't the older SIIIs
There were nearly three hundred surviving S-III's after the war, so that's a safe bet.
I don't remember exactly where I read it, but I do recall that there was a strong possibility that the Spartan IIIs that survived Onyx were adopted into the IV program.
They aren't considered IV's but there are III's serving in the Spartan Branch with the IV's. Its mentioned that Master Chief trained with some a few times on the Infinity before Infinite happened.
@@mekboy7403how'd it go?
Food for thought
Imagine if someone like Forge's daughter "Sgt Forge who was am Orion 1" or let's say Sgt Johnson had a kid that grew up and joined the unsc and became an odst and subsequently signed on to become a spartan 4... they'd have essentially alot going for them making them theoretically the cream of the crop of spartan 4s
Especially if they have genetic markers aside from being children of Orions.
There's no way Johnson doesn't have a kid. That's such a wasted opportunity. Especially since he got laid in Contact Harvest.
@@jackychang9148 With an ONI officer, so we might never know. Actually I was thinking on Buck and Veronica, if they have a child ONI will know almost at the same time than the mother and there is no way that child will not be under supervition in order to know their full potential.
@jackychang9148
While it would be a bit fan fictioney, You could have Johnsons kid become a Spartan III instead. Considering that contact Harvest takes place 5 years before the III program. You just need the oni girl to die via covenant shortly after that period and for their kid to get enlisted.
You brought up a good point about “after enlistment” happenings and the societal backlash of it all. With that in mind I wouldn’t put it past ONI to “Box” any retiring Spartans in cryosleep under the guise of mental issues or threats to the public at large. If not done in a nice way I’d say they’d simply pull a “hunt the truth” and suggest that all Spartans retire to a resort planet that doesn’t exist.
Yeah, I really hope they explore the ONI plot-line in the future. How they are essentially drunk on power and the whole "Either die a hero or live long enough to see yourself become the villain" philosophy. The Coovenant or Insurrectionists do not need to be the good guys for ONI to be the bad guys.
I'm sick of having ONI get away with their crimes and none of the characters in the mainline games do nothing about it. John would have a great back and forth with the head of oni considering she is a spartan washout, they could argue about alot of things to flesh out both characters.
@@RubyGalaxyYT unfortunately regardless of who’s at the reigns of ONI; it’s a necessary evil. Sections are separated in order to run multiple operations with plausible deniability for each.
The only way I could see any of the more twisted members getting their dues is if an ONI spartan (not Locke) decided to liquify assets under standing orders from before the human covenant war under the pretense that these individuals were more of a threat than the insurrectionists.
I specify spartan because they’d be a big enough asset that someone would notice if they disappeared; and strong/ smart enough to handle anything an un-augmented ONI operative could throw at them. I’m thinking possibly the spartan fireteam hanging out with the Banished that got cut loose behind enemy lines?
Even the Spartan IVs will be replaced by fives and then six's and on and on until the process matures and every soldier begins receiving some sort of Augment, then likely something resembling the spartan 2 augments but better will take the stage.
I assumed the Spartans in London were 3's as I've read some lore before that during the battle of earth Spartan 3s were covertly deployed to London and other major cities
IIRC *all* available UNSC assets were redeployed to Earth during the battle. Which probably included all remaining Alphas, Betas (with the exception of Tom-B292 and Lucy-B091) and the entirety of Gamma Company (excluding Saber, Katana and Gladius)
I could imagine seeing some Spartan 4s taking up jobs like fire, fighting, or some form of rescue service?
Good idea, I like that, it's just very practical, reminds me of power rangers lightspeed rescue having the team made of emergency service members.
I’m not going to lie. I was surprised I knew all 10. Apparently I paid more attention to the 4s than any other generation
I didn't know they were around as early as Reach. I figured they were purely a post-war thing.
@@dianabarnett6886 there are many people that think that, there are also people that don’t know the Infinity was used before her official launch.
@@dianabarnett6886 It's a retcon so
Thw whole time thing with the Spartans is that you have to realize , john is around 40-50 YEARS of age during the events of halo, i shouldn't have been surprised to see newer Spartans in training with newer armor that could match the chiefs. BUT that's just the armor....
Oh yea he definitely is but to think with cryogenic sleep his body is only mid 30s at the most because we honestly don’t know how often they kept chief online during travel through space if they kept him as a mind they absolutely needed in the crew or a crew member they needed for strictly field ops
Can you do “10 things you might not have known about Elites” next? I think that would be cool since the covenant side of halo lore is a part that I think many halo fans probably know less about as a whole.
I kinda disagree with the notion that the IV’s haven’t earned the title of spartan, considering that most of the IV’s are soldiers that survived the human-covenant war
Well when I say they are not Spartan, I mean in the sense that they don't match the reason why the Spartans were called Spartans. Being child super soldiers. However, if "Spartan" is merely the title they use to refer to augmented super soldiers, such as how Orion Project has been retroactively called Spartan 1, then sure they are Spartans in the sense they wear the power armor and are augmented.
But as hinted by Jun, most Spartan 4s are not on the level of Spartans 2 and 3. Likely due to both the fact their augmentation is less intense but their training coming at a later date
Another issue is of course while it would be more appropriate to call them Orion 4, out of universe that would be a bad move since Spartan is synonymous with Halo.
I feel Spartan 4 was always the ultimate goal and makes sense the UNSC would try to achieve this over continuing Spartan 3 which was the next best choice. It was bound to happen and was always more ideal.
Again, I feel all we need as a fanbase is a good game that focuses on Spartan 4s. Such as Halo Reach. Spartan Buck would have been a good idea to help fans get eased into it imo.
@@lionheartedlux I agree with what you’re saying overall, but also kinda disagree in a couple areas, the thing about the title of “spartan” is that yes they were named after the legendary warriors of Greece and the 2’s and 3’s were parallels of said warriors in their upbringing, the problem I have is that this topic always turns into a convoluted way of cherry-picking what constitutes a spartan, whether it’s upbringing, how battle hardened the soldier is, how expressive they are etc… there are so many examples for and against every argument as to what makes a spartan… a spartan. From what I can tell, the meaning of what makes a spartan in universe is kind of the whole question of “does the suit make the man, or man make the suit” originally with the 2’s it was the man who made the suit, it’s arguable that the shift of that question started with the introduction of the 3’s since the 2’s set the standard, and that standard is to be the best of humanity, fighting against impossible odds to keep humanity from being eradicated from the covenant, kinda like what chief said to Lasky at the end of halo 4 and what he said to Fernando at the start of infinite.
I do heavily agree that the 4’s are in dire need of good P.R. Because fireteam majestic did so much damage to the 4’s, I will say people are starting to open up to the 4’s since infinite, and the rubicon protocol though, since they’re finally shown to be doing what Spartans are supposed to be doing, fighting against impossible odds, even if it means they’ll most likely die in the process
Tons of men and women survived the war. That doesn't mean anything
@@fankgaming7753 that’s not the point I was making, what I was trying to say is that they survived the war which resulted in the deaths of billions upon billions of people, and despite all of that, they were selected because they were scouted due to catching the eye of the program, which was run by Spartans of the previous two branches, all I’m saying is, they at least deserve to be called Spartans, even if they’re fodder in comparison to the previous two company’s
That's like saying a Persian soldier should be considered a Spartan because he survived a previous battle or war. Doesn't matter. He didn't grow through the culture and face the same obstacles.
Oh cool! I’ve been meaning to research S-IVs for a bit, so thanks for doing this! It’s a good jumping off point.
There's that S2 that tested Chief's mk6 prior to Halo 2's events that mentioned she was retiring soon after to start a family
I love these types of videos because there was plenty I didn’t know about Spartan IVs the constant tune ups being the most surprising. I knew like 2 or 3 things about IVs prior to this video.
It would be cool to see Master Chief mentoring a Spartan 4 something similar to MC interactions with Echo 216 but I guess his encounter with Griffin is as close as we’ll get. I’d love to see Master Chief tell a Spartan 4 to “take a knee” after experiencing a hard decision involving a lot of lives etc
Spartan-IVs have the latest augmentations and armor technology. But either way, I love them in *Halo 4,* *Halo 5: Guardians* and *Halo: Infinite.*
So do all other Alice spartan 2/3’s that are still in combat
Most of Rubicon Protocol’s main characters I’d argue are true Spartans. I absolutely love how they’re portrayed, as near-unstoppable war machines but also fundamentally different from the likes of Blue Team or Noble. Not just weaker, different. It’s clear in their behavior and interactions with other soldiers that there was a time when they were, well, normal Marines. In some ways they are even portrayed as more « human » and relatable than the Helljumpers, which would be completely unimaginable for Spartans II or III. I love this.
i agree
Yeah Rubicon Protocol was the book we need to introduce the IV's and did them justice unlike to absolute shambles that was Spartan Ops.
ONI would never let a spartan retire lmao
They have at least two times.
Randal and the S-2 that tested Chief's gen 1 mk 6 armor before he got it in Halo 2 (I think her name was Maria)
If it was ever found out that ONI killed a spartan wanting to retire, the entire Spartan branch would nail one to the wall for all to see with the dirty laundry to.
Maria-062 retired during the war.
Regarding the full number of Spartan-IV’s is that I do personally believe that there is quite many of them, taking in account the first class of IV’s came out in 2553 and the second in 2554, we can refer that it likely only took 1-2 years to train, augment, rehabilitate into their new body, and train again until they graduated. So I think that they would likely keep on making more classes every year, and there are likely more than one Spartan training center like Laconia station or AJAMS. So I do believe that the real number of IV’s if we go from roughly 150 members per year starting in 2553-2560 would be at least 1,000 in total being produced, add in larger classes from more funding and more training centers that number could easily be closer to 1,500 or even 2,000 and will only increase with time, whats the point of having ODST’s when you can send in a Spartan-IV Fireteam that would have the same, if not, better result than an entire ODST platoon?
I think a cool video topic would be to look at each of the known Spartan-IVs and identify, as objectively as possible, which ones exhibit traditional Spartan characteristics. I'm interested to see if certain ones are more Spartan-like than we initially thought.
Considering Johnson is the first Spartan, all the IVs exhibit traditional Spartan characteristics. It is the II's and III's that were different.
@@Jadiaz-ev9hm while that may be true, it was ultimately the IIs that defined what it meant to be a Spartan. The Orion program, to my understanding, was deemed a failure in the eyes of ONI. While there were several candidates who exhibit characteristics we'd colloquially deem "Spartan-like," the IIs and even the IIIs are generally more widely-known, publicized, and have traits about them that set them apart from baseline humanity.
When I say something is traditionally Spartan, I'm referring to the traits and characteristics of the individual who resemble what a baseline S-II or S-III would be. Like you said, Johnson is definitely Spartan-like, but more in some ways than others. The real pickle with this is actually sitting down and truly defining, objectively, what a traditional Spartan is. This is all just my opinion, so I'm not saying you're right or wrong. More so just elaborating upon what I already said.
@@Jadiaz-ev9hm Sgt Forge aswell and he has a daughter who "if she wasn't a sort of pirate" would make and excellent spartan 4 with her specific gene pool.
Who knows maybe Sgt Johnson has a son who might be following in his footsteps that we don't know about... imagine the possibilities
@@Jadiaz-ev9hm Johnson was part of Project ORION, which had very little connection to Halsey's program. He wasn"t a Spartan.
@@Cailus3542 except you are wrong. Spartans fell under the highly classified Orion project umbrella. Do you know why they are called Spartan II's III's and IV's? Because Johnson and others augmented first were Spartan I's officially.
You don't call something II if there was not an original before it. The canon lore outright states Johnson is a Spartan I. Hence if we want to look at what Spartan qualities are, we should look at the originals.
You can argue the IV's don't act like the II's or III"s, but they do carry on like Johnson. And if Johnson is held in such high regard, then the IV's should be as well.
Their augmentations may not be like the Spartan 2 or 3's, but it's much more humane there's no one kidnapping children and replacing them with flash clones where they die instantly devastating the families. I'd take Spartan IV augmentations any day over being kidnapped as a kid. Spartan IV are still strong and leave the battlefield wrecked and littered with covenant corpses just like any other Spartan would. I don't doubt any Spartans ability because at the end of the day that whole sub group of super soldiers are stronger, faster, smarter, and tougher than any peak human.
Mate, fantastic channel and what a brilliant video. Keep it going, bud.
Since Spartans are very similar to 40k Space Marines, there should be no surprise there is an equivalent to Spartan IVs, they were called colloquially False-startes, adult humans that, due to either the need to rapidly replace numbers, or having a personal relationship with their primarch, were selected for augmentation. False-startes were roughly 75% as strong as a true Astartes [who like Spartan 2/3 are selected before puberty for genetic compatibility].
To explain Primarchs for the unfamiliar, imagine if every Spartan II had a slightly different augment set to make them better at different tasks [like the experimental upgrades of the 3&4s] and had a class of Spartan III and IV that not only had the same augments and were trained by their prototype, but as part of their augment, received a retrovirus to splice their DNA with that of their progenitor so they adapted better to the implants. That is a Primarch [and why Space Marines are all male: they are partial clones of their Primarch who were clone sons of the Emperor]
something to keep in mind is that mjolnir gen 2 augments spartan 4s to be roughly onpar in strength, reaction time, agility etc... to a spartan 2. yes their augementations are lesser, but theyre not meant to be fighting out of armor anyway.
I personally wish that they were called Orion-IIs instead of Spartan-IVs personally.
As for the Spartans who appear in London during the prolonged Battle of Earth, I think they are Spartan-IIIs in GEN1 Mk. VII which is why it looks like GEN3 Mk. VII. Just my headcanon that doesn’t break existing canon
It's a safe bet that those early S-IV's were Gamma Company, yup. It's also worth noting the UNSC only called them Spartans for the propaganda value.
It's canon they were S-IVs. S-IVs deserve their title. They're of Spartan stock.
Yeah I was also thinking Orion II’s is a more accurate name but yeah the propaganda value is more important. Humans love propaganda
Dr Halsey says “Your mistake is seeing Spartans as Military hardware, My Spartans are Humanity’s next step, our destiny as a species…”
We see in halo Is that humanities future is Spartan. The Project Orion attempted to offer augmentations to base line humans. Spartan 2 substantially upgraded the potential but was ultimately limited by the limitations of Dr. Halsey’s quest for perfection. Spartan 3 took the Spartan 2 concept and saw a way to mass produce it a knocked down model of Spartan. Spartan 4 is the Military super soldier made acceptable to the masses. Adult subjects who though ultimately inferior in individual capacity vs their 2/3 Gen Counterparts are the first steps into the “democratization” of Spartans. Development of a form of engineered evolution one the lore seems to indicate is spreading possibly beyond the UNSC.
The Shinobi armor set seems to imply that beyond known military contracts. Knowledge of and a support system for Spartan 4 may already exist. It seems unlikely that such a thing could be in place for the small number of retirees and defectors of the Spartan generations that existed at that time.
Generally as technology matures it becomes more available. By Gen 4 Spartans it’s more and more likely to leak beyond ONI and UNSC control. Given the nature of both organizations “control freak psychological profiles”. It seems likely that rather than let the black market release copies they would likely try to reign in demand by controlled release.
AlLowing downgraded Forks of technologies from the Spartans into consumer products as treatment for illnesses, elective medical treatments and the like.
Well I expect some kind of Black Spartan 5 program to be on ONI’s black books (clones maybe or engineered children?). At a certain point civilians will gain access to Spartan technology.
Over time this could create a “Spartan” 6 which really is just a regular Civilian who received augmentations upon enlistment in to the services, his augmentations were probably begun before he decided to join up.
Then a 7th generation who is at that point just a civilian who due to a hard life of work in the colonies elected to undergo selective augmentations. He reports to work suits up in a powered exoskeleton that is a commercial version of Miljlnir.
The 9th generation whom has been augmented from birth and will be raised among children who have never known an age where they were not augmented. Over time the aspects of the Augmentations will become part of the Human genome. Reducing the number of needed modifications to implants like the neural link and skeletal grafting which by then are probably a quick trip to the pediatrician.
@@Velocitist my thinking is that such a program would be a generation sooner just because Oni has to be pissed that they lost the Spartan ops to its own special service branch.
They might have kept some off the books from Spartan 3s maybe augmented some of their own agents but long run. Engineered lab grown black ops Spartans seems likely. I would place it in a Spartan 5 because because it’s hard to image any other next step. I mean Spartans 2/3/4 are just going to keep getting upgrades. With new Spartan 4s joining expanding that branch well the 2s and 3s either retire or go “missing”.
The only other place I could see development in the current Generations; would be a sort of Spartan knockoff. Black market implants and augmentation taking place in illicit clinics run by trans humanist organizations copying Spartan 4s for crime syndicates and insurgents. That wouldn’t be Spartans that would be outside the UNSC and ONI, and if anything that could justify ONI’s next Gen Spartan program.
So they would become humans during the forerunner human war.
@@kieferkarpfen6897 more than. Remember the Forerunners wanted to leave the Halo technology to humanity as their chosen reclaimers. To not just reclaim their legacy but go beyond it.
Halsey said it best "My Spartans are humanity's next step are destiny as a species."
20:30 Dr Halsey did say (I think in halo 4) that she was making humanity's next evolutionary step
H4 is fanfic at best. During the orion II project she had a lot guilt with the things that would be done to the Children, and then after the war they are supposed to be the next step? Yeah, Halo really ended with 3.
@TheTower Halsey was always guilty of what she did to make the Spartans, but she also always disregarded that guilt. I mean in the same cutscene to open halo 4 she sounds guilty, in the books (namely halo first strike) she clearly states she is guilty of the process but hopeful of the product. Also in that book she kidnaps Kelly which leads directly to the opening cutscene in halo 4 of her having been detained and question for doing that, which is another link from book Halsey to halo 4 Halsey. For 343 Dr Halsey was one of the few things they did right, till halo 5 anyway
Im still kinda new to the deep lore (ive never read the books), but i would love to see a baseball team composed of either retired or off duty spartans. It would be so fun to watch that.
That's such a silly idea, it'd be epic to see a sports match between spartans I do agree
You took time to read my comments about the age of retirement. I appreciate that.
Penny for your thoughts.
Let’s say you’re right about the age thing. My argument is:
After over a century (or more) of active duty, I would argue that, at the very least, a significant majority of eligible Spartan IV retirees would prefer to stay in the military. Either as “civilian contractors” or what have you.
The ones that do opt for retirement (that is if the UNSC “lets them”), would probably be immediately barred from most things available to normal humans, ie sports, etc etc.
Lets say for arguments sake that a significant majority of Spartan IVs opt for retirement. I think it’s probable that they would be kept separate to some degree from the rest of the population. Also, after a century, who knows how developed augmentation medical technology could be. An idea that I’ve toyed with is inspired by Halsey’s near fanatic belief that her Spartans are the future of humanity or “our destiny as a species”. The idea being that sooner or later all of humanity will be affected by Spartan augmentations or infused with them through birth or whatever else.
Anyway, tangent done. I don’t see Spartans existing merely as civilians. Following any basic understanding of human rights, it is their right to retire at some point, but I’d have a hard time believing that they would even want to. Again, after spending an entire lifetime in the military, it would essentially be all they know. Barring their increased cognitive capacity to remember a time before they became Spartans, at least in the case of Spartan IV’s, maybe.
Anyway, great video as always. Very thought provoking (at least for me, as evidenced above 😅). Thanks for being you, and doing what you do.
I think that if a spartan would retire they would go through a transition programme from soldier to civilian, psychological work, setting up a plan of what they want to do, do they want to work a non military job, all sorts of things.
@@RubyGalaxyYT that’s a fair point. I’m sure there would be resources available. I just hope that any Spartan vet agencies would be better equipped than the VA is here in the US. Point being: government run things tend to become bogged down easily.
19:44 I heard a wow and wooh from a kid lol. Glad to see that kids are involved lol
Even the kids approve
Man, your content is just great.
"Earn" is a crazy way to think since 2s are brainwashed
19:39. Sounds like someone in the background wanted to add in their own take on what is being said there 😊
Military programs change based on the resources and technology available, and the exigencies of operations. They're Spartans, their program is just different adding in it's uniqueness to the institutional knowledge of building this weapons platform.
A lot of Spartan IV's were previous Reach veterans, so the illusion that they kinda suck doesn't make much sense. That and the constant tweaks and their ability to survive re-entry into orbit and land on the ground and survive, they can very much hang with II's and III's. If they couldn't. They wouldn't make them.
Thank you, I love all the Spartan IV's except Palmer, I think Majestic, Osiris, the ones in Infinite and the Multiplayer Spartan IV's are awesome. My Halo OC Jack Coldharbor is even a Spartan 4
I love the IVs and hope to see them be the heroes Musa wanted them to be. Don't count them out.
Same here, I loved them on day 1, a sign of a more optimistic future.
Halo infinite definitely changed my views of Spartan 4s. Made them feel way more bad ass than I thought they were originally.
just imagine working with a spartan in an old bakery :D that would be awesome!
Theory for why the IVs augmentations can "wear off" is that the UNSC (and by extension ONI) knew they would eventually retire, so they planned for much of their chemical augmentations to "expire" as to avoid the risk of passing them down to offspring.
I feel Spartan's shouldn't have to be cruelly mistreated to 'earn' the title. I think, at least in terms of the halo universe, that the title of Spartan now means more than just training from a young age to be a soldier. I think it evolved to mean the peak of human capability; be that as warriors, as guardians, or protecters of humanity. They are the best of the best, beacons of hope when all seems lost. They are an ideal version humanity and what we are capable of when we work together, and what we can survive together. I think that is why ONI put so much emphasis on the media surrounding Spartan II's and IV's, because they became as much a symbol as they were military assets.(Spartan III they kept mostly hidden because they were less controllable and were so often sent on suicide missions that there was no good way to market them to the general populace.) Especially as the new Spartans were so much more public and better equipped to interact with normal people.
Remember, spartan two´s were scouted out from a young age about their genetic potential before they were taken away for the programm, aka they were already peak humanity (simply born superior) before getting the rediculous training and tech. No normal guy could compete against em, besies in social interactions
Some facts you might not know, currently you can join as Adult British Soldier at the age of 18, on revision of contracts, you can serve for 22 Years (which I did) you can then apply for extended service until the age of 55, that is as a regular Soldier not an officer, but bearing in mind you can Late Entry (LE) Commision as an officer from the ranks, but again the age limit is 55 years, on which as an officer you can extend your commision either in the Cadets or the TA. So on retirement from frontline service for the Spartans, they could, in effect, be sent to training units or to command TA / National Guard units, given the amout of experience they have.
An interesting point for one Spartan IV, Spartan Buck is married to an ONI officer: Veronica, that happens to have the approval of ONI for her relationship. It is just matter of time for small spartans IV.5 to start to appear uner ONI survilliance.
Jun: Yeah they’re alright…
*Bonita Stone enters the room*
Jun: Actually, there are a few who truly are Spartans
As far as Spartan 4 retirement goes, there would be some who would stay in the military in some way, moving up the ranks. There would be a place foe Spartans to work in the further development of new Spartans and their equipment. Some would seek fame through their abilities. I am 100% certain at least a few would want a quiet retirement as far from the military as possible. Hopefully, the UNSC wouldn't come knocking about "One more mission."
And then we get a John Rambo/Solid Snake styled story with a retired S4 soldier sent in as a one-man infiltration, stopping wars before they are ever started. Basically Rambo/Metal Gear but in space!
Im glad that in lore they recognize that, they really aren't Spartans, not all of them, but there are a few
I recently came across some information that suggests that telomeres, or at least their length, may not actually be a significant factor in senescence (aging). Of note, lab mice are known to have incredibly long telomeres, but not one lab mouse will ever die of old age. Not because they are incredibly long lived, in fact they are the opposite. But, the reason they will never die of old age is that they become tumor ridden. And this is notable in contrast to their wild mouse counterparts that have telomeres of a normal length, and do not have a notable occurrence rate of tumors.
20:30
Imagine Tennis only played by retired Spartans.
It would be insane to watch, because:
1, they’d be exerting forces on the tennis balls and rackets, either one or both would break fast
2, it would not only be at a faster pace, but possibly go for longer than a regular match due to their reaction time.
3, would be stupidly dangerous if a tennis ball DID manage to fly off the court and into the crowd. The events would need a cage to protect the people watching, lest they get hit by a supersonic serve
I would love to see a video on these “True Spartan”, Spartan IV’s. Assuming there are examples of them.
3:12
"Helot", meaning "captured", were native Dorians (Minoan, Mycenian... unknown) treated as POWs. Unlike slaves, they got to keep half the harvest, could sell excess in the agora, owned by the Spartan state not individuals, were assigned individual Spartan assigned farms as unbreakable family units, and it was illegal to kill them without sufficient reasoning.
2:52 They earned that name through deeds not from merely being drafted in
Imagine ONI doing something good. It still benefits them, but for once they made a call that wasn't kicking a puppy down some stairs.
10:08 Honestly, the bickering reminds me of an odst team, which is probably what they were prior
I’ve had a theory that one of the Spartan fugitives held on the Spartan training station along side Micky seen in the novel Bad Blood could possibly be Dorian. Dorian wasn’t a fan of the UNSC and would definitely have a reason for going rouge once the Covenant was defeated and if he and his friends would be forced to remain in service afterwards.
As Halsey said, Spartans are humanity's next step. Our destiny, as a species.
Eventually, all humans are to be "Spartans". A species that lives over a century or centuries, resistant to illnesses and all that.
Now I’m imagining a retired Spartan going to a gym with regular people and bench pressing 2,000 pounds for warm up and absolutely blowing the minds of the people in there
The Aug's being passed on genetically by retired Spartan's could fit into the Librarian's "culmination of a thousand life times". The furthering of humanities genome. Oh yes, humans going back to the level of the Ancient humans that fought the Didact.
11:30 The Spartan-IV's augmentation degregration over time is actually most likely due to them not being a genetic match for the augmentations. However ONI would see this as beneficial, if a Spartan IV defects, their abilities are going to be significantly weaker. If anything this might be ONI wanting full control, especially when Spartan IV's have less time training. Their minds are harder to break and indoctrinate. Potential for defection is higher.
"Spartan" is such a neat word. Fun to say and mentally saying it.
Regarding 'earning' the title of Spartan. I think it's important that while yes the training methodology mirrored the ancient Spartans of Laconia the age of the recruits was less intentional and more an unfortunate consequence of the augmentation plan. Had the UNSC been able to get away with adults like Orion they would've done to avoid the ethical issues. Additionally, the fact remains that the SII and SIII were never going to be redone in any capacity simply because of the costs involved and they were not efficient programs long term. SIV on the other hand is as acknowledged by the Master Chief in Shadows of Reach.
Earning the title Spartan is also quite a loose phrase. Take the novel Silent Storm. By this point, the SIIs had passed training 'earning' their title, and yet were complete novices when it came to military dynamics and the experience of older officers and enlisted men and women who at that point had been in battle many times. The SIIs proved they are superior but learned a lot of lessons and realised that a little bit of smoke had been blown up their asses and having the title Spartan didn't automatically mean they were intrinsically above and beyond other UNSC soldiers, that these older yet inferior men and women had earned they positions for a reason.
So does passing Spartan training necessarily earn them the title? I would argue that the IIs and IIIs were all predisposed to fit the standard that the IIs began. The IVs however have a bit a of harder job to mold themselves into that mindset and standard hence why those chosen or either highly experienced or have the markers for potential. You notice that the Spartans in Rubicon Protocol have a very Spartan mindset and every so often their original personas break through reminding us they were once regular soldiers but have been elevated and made better.
So I think the IVs have earned the title Spartan. Those selected have met the standard, it's harder and not all make it but those that do carry the legacy of the IIs and IIIs before them.
I don't think they'd ever be allowed to leave the military. Their military experience and mental augmentations would make them ideal for promotion to command positions like a captain/admiral or being in charge of training new gens of Spartans. Because as you say, their augmentations need maintenance & I'd bet there would be serious health issues beyond merely losing their augmented abilities and so the best way to keep those is to stay in the military.
this guys british, and i dont know how veterans are treated in britain, but in america theyre treated terribly. they get very little help from the government dealing with the things theyve been put through, in terms of physical and mental health. we have unfortunately a pretty big population of homeless veterans. it would be interesting to see the equivalent of that when it comes to spartans. him talking about spartan retirment made me think of that.
I think he tune up of augmentations suggests that they need to take doses of their augmentations like a professional bodybuilder does. You *don't just take Test or D-bol once and get jacked, it has to be done in doses over a period of time.
3:02 I've always thought that those prlicans that John sees, were the ONI team sent for him
It’s hard for me to imagine the UNSC allowing these Spartans to even retire, at least for a century’s worth of service if they live that long. Especially considering the money going into each individual to make them Spartans.
For when they retire i could see the working for military as trainers and engineers as such
Like these top 10 keep ‘em coming plzkthx lol
If i built a super soldier I'd insure they needed regular high end maintenance...there's probably no better way to insure loyalty
Just don't send them on long rang recon.
Thank you 😊
An idea: naturally produced Spartans from prior generations breeding. ( perhaps artificial means for those not wanting to do so by physical means)
Any offspring of super soldiers will be poked and proded like no-other child before it.
Potential evolutional jump or a higher level of genetic match for future augmentation.
Peak efficiency would be born Spartans without medical alterations later in life.
To help focus on the mental aspect a family or tribe grouping where parental figures and training cadre can be brought in.
Best results are stable children understanding they're bred to be guardians of humanity while ensuring they understand and have humanity themselves.
I agree I think they should be called hoplights because they are in-between Spartan and odst
After looking at Master Chief and Blue Squad it could be possible that the higher ups made it a requirement for the IV's to get regular tune ups. If one went rouge they wouldn't be able to maintain their strength and the like.
Could you imagine having over 100 years worth of PTSD in one person. Augmented or not, that has to take a toll on the brain.
Imagine a spartan working at burgerking n he knocks you df out cause you told him he got your order wrong and you want to speak to the manager.
I have a hard time imagining Spartans retiring. Even 4's, who have basically voluntarily given over control of their biology to the military indefinitely. Seems like a lifelong sort of commitment.
Let's be honest, knowing the unsc and oni, s4 won't retire, they will either be rolled into non combat roles or be made to disappear by oni, they would never risk their augmentations being used outside military applications
This channel has more passion for halo than what 343 ever did.
Geeer that 3v3!😡
Me as a Brazilian and a big fan f halo im very surprise for Rio de Janeiro (Brazil) be mentioned, i've never knew about that
a good question is if that lets say a spartan actually retires, lets say a spartan II for example. Would any of the increased bodily functions pass on to a child if they had one?
If the Spartan 1.1s are any indication, yes.
How would that happen? Most Spartan augmentations are not genetic.
Maria-062 retired and had a child, though whether or not that child carried over her augmentations isn't known.
00 has a clear bias against the IVs that his Spartan IV vids are hard to take seriously.
The Spartan 2's training and program is the best way forward.
Any sport a retired spartan would be a part of would more than likely have a class for them or they would be denied. Life would go on as normal for everyone.
I'd like to see a video comparing spartans with ancient humans I get the feeling spartans are a step back towards our original genesong I think the librarian hinted at this but I'm 100% on that
Can you do a video of the Top 10 things we don’t know about the Elites?
So with the tune ups on the augments its actually explained in a few novels.being able to augment Spartan 2s where few and far between due to genetics. With 4s there was much more advanced medical tech to be able to augment humans. They were still dependent on genetics but with the tech in place they could negate alot of the actual genetic defects
Its more as the S-II program had very strict genetic requirements, all its candidates were basically going to be the perfect human beings with or without augmentations they were in the 99th percentile in terms of genetic perfection, that genetic perfection had an unseen side effect and essentially amplified their augmentations, hence why most S-IIIs don't quite match up either. The S-IIIs had a much wider gene pool selection, far less restrictions, hence why the augmentations they received, while similar, didn't have the success to the same degree. The S-IVs for the most part have the least invasive augmentations and next to no genetic requirements, they get augmented but not to the same degree as the others and the Gen2 armor was expected to make up the difference between them and the earlier classes
I wonder how long it would take the UNSC to get all enlisted personnel and officers up to the Spartan- IV standard of augmentation. ~1500 Spartans were hard enough for the Covenant to deal with. Imagine if there were 100 million.
Well if the talking point is the spartan 2s and 3s earned the title of "spartan" because they were trained from children. We can still give the Veteran adults who fought the covenant as either odsts or Marines like bucknor agent locke can call themselves spartans as they have been fighting the covenant as children or at least in their teens and early 30s.
There wasnt 4's before the end of the covenant war. June is literally the guy who recruited the first spartan 4's
I love H4, and the technological progression of armor. Uhhhh…. yeah forerunner and covenant tech WILL influence humanity and designs.
Hold up. how is a reaction time increased beyond 100%?
If a standard reaction time is say 300 milliseconds [IDK, just a number] and after augmentation its 200ms then that's an increase of 33%. 300% would be they do it 600ms before it even happens.
From what I know about Spartan agoge, is that the boys would be taken at 7 and from the age of seven to 13 it would learn politics, dance, poetry, literature, history, and various other topics. From the ages of 13 to 20 the Spartan would learn war. They would learn wrestling, tactics, diplomacy, ect, ect. Fitness was a constant regardless I think. I could be wrong though, so don't cite me on this it's been a while since I've looked into it.
Retired spartan 4s will produce a need for augmented police because they will need a way to keep them in check