Celestion Redback vs Vintage 30 shootout
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- Опубликовано: 12 сен 2024
- Celestion Redback vs Vintage 30 is a shootout video we have been asked for many times so here it is. Both are fantastic speakers but bring different qualities to a mix. Here we start with a direct shootout and then move to a mix of both.
The Celestion Redback is a high powered, clean sounding speaker but still very vertsatile and the Celestion Vintage 30 is one of themost usedmodern speakers known for its versatility.
To do this we recorded both speakers in an identical 1x12 setup, same mics, mic placements, amps and settings by re-amping the same scenario through several different styles.
We love to hear your thoughts on anything speaker related, if you've used this pair before or the individual speakers, or if you have any suggestions please get in touch.
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Gear used:
Zilla Fatbaby 1x12 cab
Marshall JMP 100W
Celestion M creamback
Celestion Alnico cream
Laney VC15
Deisel Schmidt
Peavey 5150
Marshall silver jubilee
PRS CU22
Fender EJ Strat
Ibanez Artist
These are hands down the best speaker demos on the interwebs. Thanks for taking the time to put these together! So many options to try...!!!
That's very kind of you, I'm glad you enjoy them, it's always nice to hear kind words like that.
In comparisons like this the Redback can sound dark, but it really isn’t if turn up the treble on your amp a bit. I find it to be very balanced and smooth. Sounds great with distortion and really holds together at high volume. It might be my favorite Celestion.
Love your demos. Well done. Thank you.
(Edit: I wanted to elaborate on what you're saying with evidence shown in the video) If you look at the graph, it has the same bass response, but lower response on the rest of the spectrum. Unless the tone is cranked on the the V30 demo, youn probably just need to drop the bass or raise the mids and treble a touch to compensate.
been looking into getting the redbacks, would you think a treble booster would be a good investment to compensate for the lacking in the highs or do you think the amps treble control would be good enough?
The redback has become my favorite speaker EVER! Thanks to your channel, thanks to the pair of redbacks i own, i love it more and more everyday, the lows are just so perfect and chunky, the annoying 5khz peak of the V30 is not there, but the complex celestion signature mids are there and preserved! What a great speaker for heavy music this is!
exactly my thoughts ! I have 2 redbacks on bottom and 2 alnico creams on top in my friedman 4x12 and it’s by far the best combination for me.. and I tried almost all of the celestion speakers combined :)
@@obestertomas i have warehouse retro 30 (mesa oem v30) and eminence legend 1275 with 2 redbacks on top, sounding phenomenal in my oversized cab!
I use the Redbacks with English V30s. I am struggling with cutting the band mix and wondering if it's the Redbacks or not. I did use CL80s before the Reds.
I may try Reback/K100 in my 412.
@@Bognerman14 just crank up the mids in the amp to a sweet spot, are you mixing metal?
@@enriquekikzdelapazbichain1126 Hey! I need more time to tweak.
I was using V30/CL80 and loved it and now V30/Redback.
I thought of trying V30/K100 which I like or Redback/K100.
Why are you saying to crank the mids with the Redbacks? I have to play with the mids and highs. Right now, my main amp is a Mark V.
The guys I am playing with play a mix of clean and very heavy metal.
Thank you.
First off .. Many thanks for taking the time to do these comparisons. I like them both Redback doesn’t come alive until you throw some juice at it . Reminds me of Marshall JCM800 once you get past 6-7 the magic happens throw a booster in front of it and a Boss Eq or what ever eq
now your set adjust to liking . Play around with your amp . I will say the speaker is where you don’t want to skimp
I have these mixed in a 412. You almost forget that the redbacks are there. Then you palm mute something and immediately poo yourself. (The redbacks add some nice dimension to cleans too.)
with which speakers did you mix the redbacks?
@@larsemiliozapata7804 English V30s
@@larsemiliozapata7804"These" implies both speakers in this video. So im guessing Redbacks & V30 speakers.
I have Redbacks in a marshall 1936 2x12 cab with an open back. I've used Fender, Marshall and Dumble style amps and they all sound great with this cab. Very easy to dial in a lot of different tones
There are multiple ways to interpret this, and context is important. The Redback here comes off as much duller than the V30, but we're talking about a 1x12 cabinet. In the room, a 1x12 with a V30 can be a bit harsh and piercing. In a bigger cab with multiple speakers, the V30 can be a killer sounding speaker. But if you have to use a 1x12 and you have a powerful amp, the Redback is a godsend! It will give you gobs of low-end, won't saw your ears off, and won't crack under pressure when fed from a 100W tube amp turned up. This "duller" sound is why it's such a useful speaker when you don't want to carry a big ass cab.
Great feed back. I take it you've used the redback a fair bit.
For me it was at 1:50 that Vintage 30 lost me.
I agree! Orange chose to put these in their “Super Crush 1x12 Combo” and I’m guessing it’s for that very reason.
I think these could get a little muddy in a 2x12 & 4x12, considering their quite dark sounding, with a lot of bass.
@@jazznotes3802 I put a Redback into a PPC112 cab hooked into my super crush head it sounds fantastic!!
Exactly my thought. I have a Engl Screamer Top with the 1x12 Engl box, and It really can be very harsh. I feel like I should maybe go for it. The V30 always have that constant bizzeling sound, very much noticable in this recording, too.
Whoa! The mixes sound freaking huge! I've got to do this in a 2x12.
Now this is how you do a side by side... Perfect!!!
Thanks for that. I'm glad you enjoyed it.
Of the two, I prefer the Redback, the Vintage 30 has very aggressive edges, whereas the Redback is bit more refined for want of a better description. They mix well though. Incidentally, back in December you asked me to remind you of a comparison suggestion I made of comparing a 2x10 with G10 Golds, G10 Creambacks, or G10 Greenbacks compared to a 1x 12 with the respective 12 in speakers. Cheers
The V30 ca be a bit aggressive. I think that is why a lot of peoplelike it but you are right, refined is probably a good word. I'm working on that video but things have been so busy. I do have it penned in tough.... keep bugging me about it ;)
Just what I was looking for after Soldano just announced their 1x12 closed back cab has a V30 and the open backed variant has the redback.
Thanks glad you liked it. Remember listen to the overall sound of the cab and cabinet, these tests are more for a reference but I'm glad you found it useful.
will you do the same video with v30 vs alnico cream ? this back to back format is by far the most helpful 🤟
Thanks Tomas, we did that video recently so should be putting it up in the next month or so. Thanks for watching.
@@ZillaCabs amazing, looking forward to it :-)
Cannot get over how much better the Redback sounds.
Glad you like it Tom. Can I ask, do you like V30s in other situations?
Two different high-end definition speakers. More highs is perceived also like "less bass" and less highs like "powerful bass". So, I think speaker and cabinet must be carefully "tuned" in confront to entire rig and personal taste.
They mix very nicely! I have an open slot next to a V30. The Redback might be the answer. I also have a Creamback waiting for its assignment. I guess I need to watch more of your videos! I see the Creamback/Redback comparison next in the queue.
Well the Creamback/Redback video didn't help at all! They mix together nicely as well! I might have to buy the Redback and try all three combinations in my own cabinet. Thank you for the great videos! Really top notch.
The redback is god tier in a 112 cab or combo. I have a redback in my redstripe peavey bandit, and its a weapon. Any issues with flabby bass, boxiness, etc associated with a 112 disappear with the redback. It has a way of making a 112 cab sound closer to a 412, even a open backed cab. It also eliminated any remaining transistor harshness. I've gotten the vintage mode of the lead channel to be very close to the Fryette tone archived by Aaron Turner on Sumac. Highly recommend the redback for a Peavey Bandit, and any other high powered 112 setup.
In a band setting the V30 cuts through the mix better. The Redback would be muddy by comparison because the bass player would likely drown out the lows and you wouldn't have the upper mid/high bump to cut through. Playing alone, the low end of the Redback might be preferable and the upper mid/high bump from the V30 could be a bit harsh. I played darker amps for years until I realized mids are your best friend to standout with a loud bass player and drummer.
The V30 got really brittle with gain. The Redback held up better. I kinda want to see a compensated comparison to see how if the Redback can get as bright clean.
I have four 4x12’s …a Jubilee with Marshall V30’s from 1987……one with Marshall V30’s from 1993…One with Marshall V30’s from 2003…..and one with Marshall V30’s from 2019……can you tell I like V30’s?…Just got a couple of RedBacks to mix with one of the cabs…I am very impressed..the RedBacks sound great,and mix extremely well with the V30’s….I don’t have any problems cutting through the mix with the RedBacks….I think I am gonna get 2 more and fill up a 4x12 with them….Great speaker…
I replaced the V30 in my closed back PPC112 cab because I needed a high wattage speaker. To be honest I’m not a fan of the V30 I much prefer the Redback over the v30 I even prefer Seventy/80 over the v30.
Excellent sound capture! Thank you
Clean the redback kills.. amazingly so... In comparison to a v30... Amazingly 3D.. the V30 also nice and acoustic... still would take a greenback for breakup
Always good hearing from you David. I'm a geenback kind of guy too but I think that is what I quite like about the redback it seems to have some of those qualities despite being a high powered speaker.
The V30 really pops out both sound great though.
Thanks for watching.
I'd love to hear these mixed in a cab together :)
They sound great. The mixed section at the end should give a decent enough picture but it would be ideal if we could get them in a cab together for sure. Always good hearing from you mate.
@@ZillaCabs Maybe now, with restrictions being lifted, finally, I can come down and do a 'Detuned' vid with you guys :)
@@GodlessSuns I'm making one now
@@motardbrah7768 Sweet, I'd love to hear a demo whn it's done :)
@@GodlessSuns Fingers crossed its all the hype, been hearing about what a good combo they are all over haha, hope the redbacks don't suffer too much at indoor volumes
I like the celestion red backs
They are a cool speaker for sure.
Both great speakers with different advantages. I love my 412 of V30s with my Matamp GT120 and Ampeg V4 because it focuses the bass, but I prefer the Redbacks or DV-77 when I’m pairing them with an amp that already has a “grainy” dirt sound like my Rockerverb. Some amps fall in the middle like my 6505+, but that amp has a flexible presence and resonance section to tailor it to the cab/speakers. I’m lucky that I can play super loud in my band settings and really let all of the speakers shine. I think a lot of people judge these speakers based on quieter settings or on solo settings (not in a band mix) and then develop an opinion about them forever.
I chosen to run both of these speakers the vintage 30 Kirk Hammett uses them and the G12H-150 because Toni Iommi useing them I choose to run 2 of each in a Marshall 4x12
my two favorite bands
Metallica and Black Sabbath..
The mix sounds great!!
Excellent! Miss your faces and the explanations though :)
haha we were trying something new.
@@ZillaCabs Figured as much. Trust me, I know all too well how in this video making world you can never win. Great stuff regardless!
@@ChrisBuonoGuitar haha yeah, we get told we talk too much a fair bit ;) but this time it was because we didn't have loads of time.
Excellent demo.
If you were mixing the two speakers in a 4x12 angled 1960 cab. X pattern, Redback over v30 or Under?
Easy work for the Redback.
Redback sounds so perfect! OD way better too.
yeah its a great speaker, I think it is starting to get quite a bit more notice after being a slow starter. I love it. hanks for watching.
@@ZillaCabs I got one in the LE 68 RI CDR and was blown away. Was a hardcore Marshall guy and Mesa guy for years.
Which do you think would be better for bedroom levels only? No band, just practice. With a 1W tube head!
Depends on what you play but in all honesty for 1W amps I really like the EVH it just seems to work well.
will the redback sound good in a low wattage amp like a caving vintage 16 or fender blues jr thanks
Short answer: yes
Redback❤️
Glad you like it.
Wow surprised the red back sounds overly compressed...and the other comparisons with Vintage 30 it is usually the one that sounds a bit muddy...
We spent quite a bit of time trying to get them as accurate as possible.
@@ZillaCabs Not being critical of the recording process, just find the Vintage 30 to sound better to my untrained ear😂
the V30 got more of that constant bizzle-sound whilste the redback has pretty much none. (at around 3 minutes) I think the redback could save some hearing in comparison to the v30, but i feel like it could be to dark to go through the mix? The V30 definatly sounds nastier, the redback more rounded. I feel like with the redback and a bit more presence, it would be the best of both worlds. Iam thinking about changing my v30 in my engl cabinet to another speaker, as the engl screamer is also very harsh, and want to tame it a bit. What do you guys think?
I bet a 2x12 w/one of each would be sweet for metal.
yeah it's a good mix for heavier stuff for sure.
I have a Invective 4x12 with X Pattern of V30s and Creamback. I have another 4x12 cab Slanted Carvin that has all V30s and it sounds brighter and kinda harsh compared to Invective Cab while I play through my Invective Head. I don’t want to buy another Cabinet but I’d like to add 2 Redback or Greenbacks to top speakers on Carvin Cab to even out sound. Any suggestions?
For me Redback ! Because I don't like V30 16ohm version... There is a big difference between 8 vs 16 ohm... 16 load is very harsh,fizzy and thin (live situation)... Maybe it depends on the year of manufacture...Great shootout of course !!!
Yeah year of manufacture is a big thing for sure.
16 Ohm speakers are always brighter than 8 ohms.
@@scottdavidson6066 unless they are wired in parallel, makes a surprising difference. Another rabbit hole.
So I have a 2x12 loaded with Mesa V30s and I find the highs too be too much when I crank my 100 watt EVH head. I tried some K100s but they didn't really address that. Someone recommended the Redbacks but the 150 watt rating made me worried they wouldn't play well at low volumes. Is that a concern? The V30s sound great at low volumes (like living room level practice low). Are the redbacks okay at the 60-80 DB output volume or do they really need to be cranked? Any speakers I am missing trying to tame harsh highs in a high gain setting with a 2x12 cab?
Redbacks work great at low volumes. Sound is clear and full at any volume with my jcm800.
Gotta get a 4x12 Evh cab for that head, it all makes sense once you do.
What amp is driving the speaker though ?
Check the description. They use a few different ones - JMP100, 5150, Laney VC15, Silver Jubilee etc
v30 wins for me, redback better for metal but I play country and classic rock
Help, please…combo Engl Thunder 50w 1*12. Is Redback a good way :)?
what kind of music do you play?
Vintage 30’s shootouts our subjective…. Depends on the amp and your pickups in your own guitar Humbucker or single coils three you go I’ve had them all as well V30’s and G12T75’s kick ass and take names every time I’m a humbucker player through a JCM800 and a MKII plexi I’m simple
delay Eq in the fx loop and TC Electronic 2240 through the front of the amp with a cheap Maxon 808 and MXR -104 modded TC sustainer black box
With a few Keeley 2010 loopers for true bypass and off and running again as the above stated pickups
and what genre you play but that being said
EVH , Ratt , Quiet Riot , Journey , Ozzy Randy Rhoads days , Dio BlackSabbath, that’s what I play daily and asked all the time how do you get your sound thanks for taking the time for the shootout
I like my V’s and 75’s maybe one day I will try a red back but if ain’t broke I isn’t going to fix it 🤘
All these shootouts are subjective and not fair tests, we all eq setups different to our needs and our ears, these are just a very small, basic example in one situation. Thanks for watching.
Have you got the tab for that awesome riff you play in a lot of these videos? I feel like I've heard it a thousand times haha. ruclips.net/video/OxbLMACASbY/видео.html Yes I can get close by ear but it's just perfect in your recordings.
Why/how does a v30 always win? I have them in all of my amps because everything else sounds like mud to my ears
They do have a distinct sound, that if you're in to it, then it's hard to step away from. I really like the V30, not sure why a lot of people say they hate it so much.
I'm a mid range guy. The Vin 30 sounds a bit better. Any other recommendations that you can point me to? Also, I love the way you a/ b speakers. You don't stay on one too long. Ty for sharing.
G12-K100 vs G12H-150 Redback?
Been asking for this comparison as well. K-100/V30 and K-100/DV-77 are my fav combos, so I’d love to hear it with a Redback!
Any chance you guys could do the same with the Redback vs Seventy/80?
We'll be getting to that one in the not so distant future hopefully.
@@ZillaCabs hell yeah! Thanks! I’m guessing they’re more similar than the Redback and Vin 30. Considering swapping my 70/80 for a Redback, so would be stoked to see that before I drop the $. Got an Orange Crush Pro 120 and a 1x12 closed back cab.
@@holdfastweightlifting3620 redback in a PPC112 cab sound absolutely killer with the crush amps.
The V30s sounds better to my ears. They sound so alive compared to the RBs which sound dull
I do hear what you are saying there. I'll be honest, there are a lot of compromises in videos like this and I do feel that the redback maybe didn;t come out as well as it could have. I think we will rerun this video at a later date and tweak the eq slightly. Thanks for watching.
lol. Dial an amp in and the redbacks gonna sound amazing. The v30’s sound scratchy and harsh
@@ZillaCabs the V30’s are some of the worst speakers for rock. No one will admit it but I will lol. Redbacks for life !
Just got a Friedman Smallbox combo with this redback in it, hating it from this vid, way too dark and muddy sounding, perhaps wrong way to make a decision. I'm at home and can't crank this beast up much past 2 without getting arrested, so no way for me to really be able to test drive this redback properly. But, think I will replace it with my Alnico Cream 90 watt Celestion.
All that hi end garbage on the vintage 30 might be what you need to cut through the mix in a band situation.
All that high end garbage is a bit more organic and musical in the UK made V30’s.
the vintage 30 sounds better to me its more present
The vintage 30 sounds terrible
really? tone is very subjective, I;ve never really understood why people hate the vintage30 though, there may be better suited speakers but I'd never say it sounds terrible.
@@ZillaCabs It's just that high frequency static sort of noise. I wonder if maybe not everyone hears it. It would certainly explain the drastically different opinions of the V30 we see. It doesn't sound terrible though.
@@nickaslanidis6156 I think it's more that some people just don't like it, like how some people don't like greenbacks.