Subwoofer Placement for Home Recording Studios
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- Опубликовано: 6 дек 2018
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Today, in a video brought to you in collaboration with Adam Audio, we're talking about whether you can hear where a Subwoofer should be placed in your setup - left or right? Does it make a difference? And if it does, does that justify having a sub on each side?
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The position on the left was the best in the first two tests.
I’m planning to get the Adam Sub 7 to complete my Adam’s T5V setup ;)
Cheers m8 🔥 Good info
I would suggest make anything below 90hz as mono, there are lots of way to do that. One of it is by using Izotope Imager.
You need f place the sub at the same distance of your monitors first, cuz you can get a phase differences if sub is in a different distance, thats what you hear differences between left, center and right, bass frequencies are mono and omnidirectional but they need be at the same distance of you mic, you was hearing phase differences because distances was different, only matter the phase no the side. Sorry if my english is bad, is not my main language.
Exactly
Very interesting to notice that there is a huge difference in both cases (A, B, C test). With the whole spectrum, the difference was much more clear than with the low spectrum only. Having said that, I was wrong with the first test and right with the second (with very simple speakers, that is).
I stumbled across this video while looking into the "best" solution for my situation. After watching a load of reviews (mostly Yamaha HS5/7/8 and Adam T and AX series) I started to think that smaller monitor speakers with a subwoofer is better than picking the largest speakers from a series. For example, the Adam A3X with sub7 (or Adam T7V with T10s for the same money) will be a better solution than the A8X without subwoofer. The same might go for the Yamaha.
If the amount of money is a problem, you can start with the speakers and add a subwoofer later (or two, depending on what you are aiming for).
It seems that most reviewers notice a slight better performance in mid-range when adding a subwoofer (as in bass, of course).
actually i liked the version where there was no sub.. hmmm interesting. perhaps we do need bigger speakers which can go deeper than decouple subs.. I am on a sub shopping regime, might have to change speakers now to get bigger ones which can go low. Whats your take after using 2 subs for this while? any tips?
20hz? Probably not! 40hz very possible! I like the setup with two subs. It sounds fuller and more wholesome in the bottom end. But even one sub is good. Without the subs, there is something important missing.
Make the Bass mono and use a visualization for identify issues. More subs making more issues in the room
is there any reason why not to put the a7 on top of the subs? (in a way that the twitters are in an ear level of course)
(will look like a pa system setup...)
what do you think about that @Hop Pole Studios
?
Good idea, just difficult in a lot of circumstances. In practice it’s easier to just have them on the same depth and distance from the listener. There’s a whole refurb happening now, video coming in the new year!
Thanks
I'm curious, Adam talks about having matched subs so that the sound stays linear at different volumes. Is this something you tested, or are they just linear at the volume that you monitor at?
yes that is the question
I could not to hear a difference with Sony mdr -1am2 that in Sony’s marketing specs saying is should play 3-100000Hz in sub positioning and barely a difference with no sub, with sub and with two subs. Does mic recording show the difference in left and right tracks with different positioning (it could be shown in video)?
It seems to me it would be better to have s10, because it can play lower frequencies up to 25 Hz. I would like to know - this sub at what frequency goes down when sine sweep is played? Can it play flat until 28 Hz and then goes down or 28HZ is barely heard? All manufacturers should be adding next to frequencies +-decibels. :(
I have a large desk and the only place I can stand it is on the centre of the desk floor base which is quite substantial. It is a down firing yamaha hs8s. Should I place it on layers of carpet underlay or something?
Been a stereo sub guy for many years. Directly below my monitors in phase. I turn my cerwin Vega dx 9’s ( 15 inch subs ) upside down and sit my monitors on top of those with a ton of of foam under them to decouple it.
Wow interesting I would like to see a pic
I got both tests wrong so I’ve gaffa taped my sub upside down onto the roof above my head. Sorted.
I could only tell it appart with the below 100hz sound. Whats weird though ist that while I could clearly tell where the initial impulse came from when it was left or right it had a pretty strong echo on the other side. When it was in the middle it just sounded muffled.
Cool video. I preferred the sound of C for both tests in my Sennheiser headphones and adam 7 speakers + sub10. On the second test, I preferred no sub and two subs. I tend to listen to how the sub effects the other elements of the song rather than focusing on the hype of the bass. If the rest of the mix sounds better than I prefer that position with subs. The 1 sub made the snare sound like it had less spank and more phase-ish on my system. Two subs brought it back for some reason.
I also thought C sounded best on both the tests, which in both cases, the sub was on the right. A and B sounded like there were phasing issues around the crossover frequencies maybe. I noticed when he did the no sub vs one vs two subs comparison, the sub was in the middle when there was just one sub. I wonder how the no sub vs one vs two would have sounded if he would have placed the sub on the right with just one sub? I would think two subs would cause more phasing issues, but who knows.
What your listening to is not directionality it’s phase, you’ve move your sub out of phase with your main monitors aswell as moving the sub around the room means your sitting in and out of room modes, your not hearing where it’s coming from.
thanks for making this video I just wanted to know how you connect those pair of subs to each monitor I also have a sub in my studio and want to try this could you please help me.
First of all thank you for your efforts and dedication.sir I have money issues so can I mix and master song with only one sub.please tell.
I’m sure one sub is fine! Two really is a luxury, but a single properly placed sub can work well
dude ur my hero. thats exactly what i thought! two sub 8's for a set of a7's and ur close to a set of adam s3x-h or s3h, the former i also own, and i am sure i can emulate the effect with 2 subs and be done with it. The only thing i acutally do think is still a hazzle is that there is no bypass function, for when i want to casually listen to music at times where neigbors might not appreciate my enthusiasm XD). As far as i know you cant switch from full range including woofer to bypassing the woofer AND the HPF at the flick of a switch.
I listen to music a lot of days on my pc stereo speakers that have a sub so im some what use to a sub and when I used headphones I could tell that C was in the Center. Something strange happen though when you put the sub on the right and left aka B and C they both sounded on the left I never felt the the sub was ever on the right.
yeah same but for me they both felt right
Same here
in my opinion makes sense the two woofers for your practical use but one woofer its the best system in relation to price quality. thanks for the explanations
i plan to build system with 2 sub woofers even before i watched this video loll.. it is like having 3 way system (high, mid, bass/low) for cheaper price than buying 3 way monitor speakers that cost thousand dollars.. loll.. it is just my opinion anyway, worth to try.. as we see in this video, the bass becomes stereo when you use 2 sub woofers left n right , and i love it loll !!
Yes. I got 2 a7x for 600 euros used. I woukdnt even get one sub 8 for 600 tho. maybe a sub 7 for 400 later even if spl missmatch is an issue
@@marcusstrymon693 I end up with 2 jbl series 3 and a Presonus Temblor T10 and i love the system costed me around 350 total with the series 3 second hand.
And as a side note the sub is kept at 5% LOL my house falls apart if I let it go louder.
yes i could. Left and center, not so much on the right
does this pair offer a on/off switching with a footswitch ? I do it like this i make my subwoofer extremely loud because it is harder to hear lows because of the equal loudness curve... i turn it on when i shape and eq the bass and kickdrum and overall subbass and turn it off again for levelling ... that way it is easier for me to properly hear and judge bass and subbass.
There’s no footswitch, but they do come with a remote control
@@adamsteelproducer ahh nice ! and great episode man!
Fact you dont necessarily need a sub to mix bass, or for mastering. I've mixed and mastered 2 and a half albums, solo, and the quality is dank as hell. Will a sub help u seperate bass quicker, hella yes. So I just ordered a aub for my home studio :D
Agreed, have made some great mixes without one. Just got my first sub though, as I’m tired of testing my mixes on other systems and going back to the home studio a dozen times till I get the bass just right lol
Of course it’s possible to mix without a sub, but if we’re going down that argument route it’s also possible to mix without speakers at all, some hit records have been mixed on headphones. Doesn’t mean it’s easier- I know loads of “top mixes” get sent back by the mastering engineer (who usually has a very full range system) with notes on things that need changing before they get released
Nice. Wouldn't it be better to swap the adams with the ns10-type? Seems a bigger compromise with the adams not having a good alignment at ear level. Im about to buy some adams monitors because of your channel. Youve got me inspired to get on and get a working setup after 25 years wanting to.
I’m changing the entire setup around at the moment- but I’m happy with the Adams higher up. It’s hard to tell from that camera angle, but they’re on angled iso mounts so the tweeters are pointed at my ears- it’s very common in studios where the console is quite tall. As long as the tweeters and woofers line up and point at the right place, it’s all good. And the NS10s are too far apart to be the ideal placement, I only use them for secondary mix checking anyhow
@@adamsteelproducer cheers i get what you mean, would be interesting after to do a vid about ns10s. As ive always known about them, ive only just realised how nasty they are yet are always going to be useful and quite weird they have been introduced again.
Well technically they haven’t been brought out again as far as I know, the ones I use are clones (Studiospares SN10s) and the other big release was by Avantone, another clone. The point remains the same though, they have a very focused midrange and no sub-bass so if a mix works there, it should work anywhere
@@adamsteelproducer yep, people will buy em so someone will make em.
I have a sub in the studio but I have no idea how loud it should be.. when the sub is loud mixes are too thin and when sub is low mixes are too boomy.. I'm basically not using it and just using my eyes looking at audio analyzer not to go above -3db at end of mastering chain but would love to know if anyone out there has an answer.. thanks!
Why not just compare with reference songs that you know have a good amount of sub?
LOL i got all those tests wrong lol i have a pr of JBL MK3s im thinking of a sub but....im in a spare bdrm and dont really think i NEED one...i can just use my AKG headphones for anything in the 100-40hz...any opinions?
Monitoring with full range speakers and cans sounds quite different. If you can afford it, get the sub/subs. Two subs also helps to balance a room, and isn't really only about volume.
i heard people comment that adam's subs have small physical weight to them,
and so they rumble, make unwanted noises and move (physically) in high levels...
do you experience any of that too?
Not found that, the Sub8s are very heavy. Maybe the Sub7 might be light? But not the ones I have, you can see me struggle to lift them as they’re really quite chunky
@@adamsteelproducer ok thanks
Sub 7 is bad. Sub 8 is minimum. Note that the B string of a bass has 30Hz and sub 8 produces 28Hz. Quite at limit.
I Want Sub 10. BUT!! 2x?! Not sure! it's insane to think now. I will just get one Sub 10 for the moment. 25Hz will really make the difference.
Sub 10 Mk2 has 21Kg. That's quite heavy!!!
You don't need 2 subs necesarily. You can verify the low stereo with headphones too.
Not so often you put the lows in stero. If it's the bass, this instrument will go up to the mids so it's easy to fix.
How did you calibrate the subs and the mains together with each other?
Partly by ear, partly by pink noise and an FFT (looking for a dip around the crossover point), then when I was happy I used Sonarworks to get the final balance. Ended up with the subs at about 100Hz cutoff -3dB (which makes sense running 2 of them)
Sup bro lol
in my AT ATH M50Xs, I could not hear ANY difference.
on my blon 03 i could. its subtle. you can hear the decay trail of the bass drum a bit longer cause the lowest low end is more apparent.
how about a3x with two sub 7s?
I'm building a studio in my spare room. My bedroom just has too many doors windows and a closet that takes the best places for my desk. I'm waiting for lumber prices to drop so I can build and actually have my guitar gear next to my desk for once.
yes i heard it in that order second pass
Test 1, I could definitely hear B was left, the others were more difficult. Test 2 A was clearly left. Maybe my headphones or hearing are biased.
Just buy some Yamaha HS8s. They have plenty of low end all the way down past 20hz and they cost less than one of those Adam subs
They really don’t, even their tech sheet doesn’t claim that kind of range
@Hop Pole Studios, did you experience that the a7x's mid range was clearer after you added the subs? I heard due to the a7's woofers not having to work so hard, they free up some detail in the lower mids to mids.
I have a ADAM F5 and those then 80hz switch is turned on (with sub) mids play clearer.
In my hesh 3 I could not hear any difference
😂 thank you, listening on an iPad, so no sub, one sub, two sub sound identical, that is total silence 😂
th
I messed up completely the first test, but I was pretty sure about B center in the 2nd run
I think that in an asymmetrical bass situation, you can't hear very much where it comes from, but you feel the "asymmetricalness"
So, basically, you have to test your room to find out the best place for sound.
That part’s universally true- the video highlights how people often use a sub as an afterthought given the common myth that low frequency can’t be located
A Left, B Right, C Center. Being I have Dyslexia, my body feels sound, and so do my ears, and I can tell where the sound is coming from. Round 2 A Left, B Right, C Center. Again, this is what my brain was telling me. xD
Dude. Dyslexia is a learning disability that causes problems with reading, writing and spelling. It does not give you voodoo powers within subharmonic monitoring. You also got both rounds wrong. If you pay attention, he gives you the answers in the video. If you were just trolling and not being serious then that's fucking hilarious though lol.
On the last test... With my high quality monitor headphones, you can definitely tell you have 2 subs, right and left. I think it's worth it to have 2 subs in a high end studio.
i am using HS8 to hear this video, and i also can tell the difference with 2 sub woofers too.. !! it is like the bass becomes stereo loll and i love it ! i plan to buy 2 sub woofers so it becomes stereo too ( 1 left n 1 right ) like in this video.. loll...
Buying 2 is best solution ? My money :(
C felt like on the left too? Am I going deaf?
Isn’t your desk going to act like a second speaker box?
Not really no. It’s full of stuff. Also the subs are floated on spikes and not touching the desk so there’s no direct acoustic transfer
@@adamsteelproducer what about the sound waves? Isn’t it like putting the sub in a tiny room? I have my sub in a similar spot and I’m worried it’s not the best spot 😬
YOU HAVE 2 SUBS ???? OMMOOOO !
i dont want 2 subs . ;D
0:21 because they're expensive
Sorry. This test is ridiculous! It depends only of the sound at the listeners at home.