I personally just want balancing and that's it, idc about new stuff unless it's new executions. However, I'd appreciate if they moved the tribute and death match maps over to dom, that'd be very nice.
I imagine the weird short tempered nerf means the new character probably has that feat. Usually why they do these weird nerfs. Balancing for something that hasn't released yet.
I think it’s because of Heavy spamming aramushas no doubt, musha is still in need for a nerf he’s stupid in any fight if you’re skilled with him, even if you spam you win
@@Blacklungs-Sanji not really lol if you're skilled with him you play defensive, the fact that you're talking about spam just shows you cannot react to his lights, and that's on you He is insanely good if you're skilled, i am just questioning your own skill, sounds to me like you are still learning the game and how to block properly, and are not at the level at which you would actually complain about his insane recoveries that give him great defence
I don’t understand what’s so wrong with orochi’s kick being nerfed, it now functions like all other bashes in the game. Now it’s more like nobushi’s kick where you only need to read if they’re going to follow up with an attack on miss, rather than reading 3 mixups deep.
There is something to be said for experimentation but the change clearly wasn’t welcome, and if it wasn’t welcome for one hero imagine the outcry if it transferred to more heroes. Personally I want to see For Honor shift away from Bash: The Game
Your pronunciation of Ching Shi is most pleasing to the ear, Mr Freeze ;) My guess on the weapon is more towards Paidao due to it's larger size, but a Hudiedao (proper name of the ''Butterfly sword'') is pretty acceptable too. Although the Paidao and Hudiedao look very similar (the Paidao is just larger and was put in use a bit after the age of piracy historically) I think it will be a Paidao due to the bigger size which fits the gameplay of For Honor better in favor of the hero. I can't tell if I'm excited, honestly. I'd rather have Ubisoft stay more towards the Ming-era of China and earlier because that still borders the medieval era of the world. Piracy is a bit too modern for my taste and it can honestly make or break my feel of the game. On the other hand, a Wu Lin after 2 years. I'm pretty conflicted on my feelings regarding this hero. The Orochi nerf is just sad, not much to say as i'd be preaching into the choir. Shugoki and Raider nerfs seem pretty reasonable overal.
Well, considering the Wokou (chinese name for japanese pirates) raided the coast from the 13th to 16th century, I would say that piracy as theme for asian factions is still perfectly medieval! Im honestly very pleasantly surprised with the themeing of this hero This is one thing the devs always fuckin nail on the head
Meanwhile in a game where naked men raid villages that use weapons designed to rend flesh while a different kind of people stare at the horizon with full plate armour and magic stones.
For those saying Orochi has been neutered, if removing the ability to dodge cancel on whiff of the kick is most of that is required to make him bad, he was never a well designed rework to begin with.
@@SanctuaryGhost You just answered your own question. It can be feinted to counter any light the opponent might throw. If parrying is too hard, a block or dodge/deflect is still possible.
Raider Changes are perfect IMO. Shugo changes might be a bit to much of a nerf, i have to see how it works out. I'd completely fine If they just changed the dodge recovery cancel after a missed kick to have a Longer delay, so people cant deflect Dodge attacks at all Times. Didnt really believe they would straight Up remove it. I wanted a slight Nerf for him, but thats definitely too much. Idk about shinobi, i never understood the character really and i doubt i will understand His moveset and His gameplay after this rework we have been Testing Out for half a year.
For the shugoki nerf i agree with the demon ball nerf but the damage is harsh. His character even says heavy hitter and now he does less damage than a few other characters.
I just think it's funny how the group of people who complains the most about dodge attacks got a character nerfed for having the ability to punish them.
I’m kind of tired of Ubi getting scared of every move that stuns in the game. I don’t think taking away raider’s knee stun was necessary, especially since guardbreak can give someone a heavy now so I just see the knee move a lot less now anyway.
Did the knee stun even add anything really? If they used the knee and went for a light it's guaranteed, and I don't think the stun impacted much if they decided to zone instead for a mix up. The stamina drain removal is nice and I will admit the stun affect and sound was satisfying
The knee move still does 27 confirmed damage for you while a gb punish is only 24 unless there are players nearby to interrupt. The stamina drain was very high, which helped the raider a lot, but he can definitely survive without it because this move still has other uses.
Ubi has been pretty weird towards balancing in the last 2 years. They release a strong hero, it gets lots of backlash, it gets nerfed, suddenly people dont play it anymore, and then they buff it again. They should make up their mind, either push for a higher overall power creep of all heroes, or don't, but they can't just stand in the middle, they need to take a stance regarding this.
I mean there are some stuns that I can understand got removed like can’t punch and glad bash but why remove the knee? You can decide between the heavy or the wallsplat knee for stam damage/pressure and the guaranteed light
@@Bear-pi9ro they are not removing the knee, they are just removing the insane stamina damage (when coupled with stamina regen pause after gb) and the stun which was not necessary anyways since at top level it made no difference, and was simply annoying at lower skill levels
My only concern with shinobi is his front roll into double dodge addition. I hope it's not a case where if someone reads the flip kick and dodges it, they still get hit by a kick from shinobi anyway. I guess we'll wait and see. Excellent changes for him overall.
Hopefully shinobi won’t be able to punish players trying to dodge flip kick with the dodge kick on reaction, but I won’t mind needing to make a read between two bashes.
Damage nerfs "are always good", but in Shugo's case they are a bit excessive, given that Shugo cannot vortex his mixup (contrary to e.g. Raider), his heavies are chargeable (and as such slower), so he ought to be rewarded a bit more to trade efficiently, especially in teamfights. Furthermore, Short-tempered (aka "a feat which no one using") has been directly quoted as an incentive for Shugo's damage nerf, and has been also nerfed in turn. That's actually weird in the way like old Shields Up and Protected Revive, have been smashed down with nerfs. One would've expect that with Smokebomb changes and charged heavies nerf, Short-tempered could become at least remotely viable T2 pick to compensate for the latter, but the balancing team seems determined to somehow prevent this.
@@atynniehawke9341 Unnecessary* They nerfed what was needed already. No more demon ball into hug and side dodge headbutt is punishable. Heavies that slow should be higher damage.
I look forward to my baby boy conq actually becoming a viable pick for high level. I've stuck with him ever since I first started a few years back. I notice his flaws and drawbacks but I still love the hero. Maybe, just maybe, it's my turn to have fun and let loose. I hope that he feats get better or just replace some of them too
Consider this: if you are being punished for punishing a whiff kick, are you really performing the punish corretly or are you just dodge attacking beacause you refuse to learn or adapt to anything new?
@@_reichtangle_3750 it’s a dodge attack, which were literally made to counter bashes. Taking away the one viable punish while giving the the opponent 4 counters, one being a punish for the punish, is not on the player but on the character’s move set.
Kinda sad they are nerfing orochi to make him basically useless.. roach was always so fun to fight how he is now, it was really fun reaction time test basically. and it felt so good and fun to win against
I think the weapon will be a pidao instead of a hudiedao or butterfly blade even though there are different kinds and they did have river pirate hudiedao and the hero is a pirate, but we only see one blade in the trailer and with kyoshin we even saw his sheath in the trailer so in my opinion it's a pidao identical to butterfly blades from southern China and not those that are commonly used in martial arts like wing Chun, those blades tend to be shorter than most 19th century pidao and hudiedao commonly used my military and pirates in the 19th century in China also most pirate hudiedao were unhilted weapons commonly made as boarding mele weapons ideal for stabbing but the back sides of the blades could be used to subdue opponents or could be easily flipped in the hand to deliver a killing blow or to slit a throat, a pidao however were commonly about 2ft in length and had thinner blades often in a triangular or cofin shape and were commonly hilted like other versions of hudiedao used by military and martial arts instead of those commonly associated with the Chinese river pirates, we can also assume that as the trailer shows a sword of moderate length about 2ft or so and shows a hilted blade with a very triangular blade shape with a thin blade face and the fact we are shown a full front silhouette of the new hero and are only shown 1 weapon in hand I think we can assume she is holding a pidao, as I think we would have seen 2 blades if she had hudiedao
@@OkamiVtuber a pidao and many styles of hudiedao are extremely similar to cutlass, as they're popular 19th century swords when there would have been a European influence dao is just a single edged sword pidao were often single blade swords often about 2ft and often used with a shield which is why they were called pidao basically shield knife, although hudiedao were often used by Chinese pirates and southern styles look very cutlass like and can also be short and stubby like those used in wing Chun, hudiedao just means 2 blades or double swords, and jian are double edged swords but you have different types of jian that's why I called it a pidao because we see one sword about 2 ft in length with a characteristic pidao shape not 2 blades which would suggest butterfly blades or hudiedao, a cutlass is a European style single edged sword style from a European Saber but not all sabers are cutlass, it's a wu lin hero so it makes sense they would carry a Chinese weapon and those commonly used by Chinese pirates and also military of the 19th century were pidao and hudiedao calling it a cutlass is like saying highlander has a claymore, or calling cents Gladius a xiphos similar swords but still not claymore or a xiphos
I hate the stamina drain removal on both raider or conq. Shugos nerfs make no god damn sense. Nerf the bash, not his fucking identity. "Hard hitter" with a 26 unblockable. Really losing my patience for this game.
The nerfs on shugo and raider are welcome, Oro's nerfs are disappointing. I don't play shinobi, but he seems to be finally fun to play against and lastly, conq rework...OH boy I love that reworks. Looks fun AF. Thanks for the cover of the stream, it's a good recap.
Shugo's nerf has added another layer of pain to my crisis of a soul, i'm now just sitting here and wondering... why did i pump a quarter of my reps and half my time into him?
I started playing Orochi yesterday and i agree that he is op and spammable but he isnt season 2 Cent or Flashbang Raider, i still lose and get beat while playing Orochi and it doesnt have to be a player that is much better than me. Orochi is really fun tho but im sad that he is getting such a big nerf
He not even OP HE IS A TIER shugo raider and aramusha are still S tier... Orochis dmg is just to high... Was not reason to scrap the whole mobility kit... PPl cried and cried and as usual ubisoft caters to the 90% of the community that is freaking CRAP and have the nerve to have a competitive scene... At this point this game is becoming a joke honestly....
@@booniegaming2098 Well i agree with you but the way you presented your argument makes you no different than the people who complain and cry on the for honor subreddit
they should've just adjusted the damage numbers instead of needing his mobility. literally felt like assassin when moving as him. agile. there plenty of characters that can beat him.
@@booniegaming2098 I agree that raider is S tier but I also disagree that orochi is A tier now.I think orochi was slightly overtuned due to his bash that could not be punished not for his high damage which personally I don’t see how he has high damage I don’t see it being too high.
People weren't crying about reacting to dust devil, they were complaining about making the right read and just having them dodge, punish your counter offence..
I think some of the Shugoki changes are very questionable. The damage nerfs would be absolutely fine if they were part of a more generalised nerf to everyone's damage, but now Shugoki is left with uncharged finisher heavies that deal 2 more damage than his neutral heavies, or almost anyone's neutral heavies, for that matter, and unblockables that deal average or below average unblockable damage despite being significantly slower than other heroes' unblockables. Sure, the side heavies have very big hitboxes, but they're still 1300ms and very vulnerable to being interrupted with bashes, they should've compensated those nerfs with something, but they didn't
It may be a Vanguard. That seems like the pattern. We have two new hybrids(Gryphon, Kiyo) and warmonger as our one and I’m assuming this new hero will be a vanguard
God I’m so happy they fixed conq. He has my favorite weapon combo in the game but I just refused to play him. Glad to see they’re putting the flail to good use this time
I think they went too far with the Orochi Nerf - his kick mixup was already fairly easy for reaction monsters to deal with, and now it's practically useless. It looks like Shinobi and maybe Conq will be replacing Orochi as the defensive monsters. Raider and Shugoki nerfs were good, and the Shinobi rework looks like it'll be a lot of fun!
Luckily for us, the devs aren’t balancing around the top who can react to orochi, why would you balance around the minority of the players? The “bad” majority is where the money is at and if nerfing orochi will make new players stay around longer and cause normal players to enjoy the game more, that’s what they will do cause that’s where the money is at.
@@Slowedbrew nah they shouldn't do that - the game will mostly just get worse if they listen to lower level players. This Orochi nerf does almost nothing for the "bad" majority, they'll still struggle like hell against him. But for those who learn to differentiate between an indicator and Storm rush, Orochi will be much easier to deal with now more than ever before (and as was said, he was already fairly easy to deal with especially with static guard heroes). Really, Dust Devil should have Storm Rush animation but they do a kick instead - that would make the mixup actually work as they intended. And would be a much better justification for making this mixup more punishable or less damaging, or both.
Idk about the front dodge light losing its undodgeable property, kick nerf was enough, orochi wasn't even in the same tier as raider and shugo anyways (both in duels and 4v4s)
Orochi was broken lmao if you don’t think he wasn’t on the same tier as raider and Shugoki and even better than them then you are smoking something it’s so fun playing against a character you literally couldn’t do much against against orochi it was literally always his turn orochi was better in duels than raider but raider is only better than orochi in 4’s due to ha and wide arcing unblockable and heavies
@@for3v3xyy0ung I played as orochi for a bit and found there were some characters and players that could beat out orochi. idk maybe it's just a player skill thing?
@@for3v3xyy0ung nope, raider was better in duels too, at least in top tier, if you're bad enough any hero can make you struggle of course, the game is in the best balancing state it's ever been in, basically every hero is at least usable, it's just that at top level some are gonna struggle way more than others
i like the new conq but i do feel the damage dose need looking into as its not the highest, a lot of it is confirmed damage but im no pro at the game and just find it fun to play
@@skeletrin8759 what's crazy is no one will actually show you the punish and if they do it's some crazy hero specific move you gotta do before the kick even happened.
@@menalgharbwalsharq648 mhm, i am hoping these changes keep him viable (got 21 reps on the sucker), but i honestly can't say im sad about recovery on kick being removed
Nice I assumed it would be a viking which in my opinion is just alright but I'd like to see another Chinese character and also buff Chinese like tiandi or Shaolin at least a couple of tiny tweaks
Orochi needed a little bit of a nerf, I mean he was 100% unpunishable. Nobody could punish me except other people using Orochi, or if I was dumb enough to not open with his kick and got parried.
I get that Orochi was made to be THE dodge specialist, but he didn’t need to be able to dodge out of LITERALLY every recovery and attack. You couldn’t even touch him if he kept using the kick/dodge attack mixup. Dodge attacks now countering the kick is a very good change.
Balance changes were mostly welcome though I think a few of them needed further consideration. I have no objections to Raider's changes, the only one of Shugoki's I disagree with is fully charged top heavy finisher, I think 38 was a little too high but 32 is a little bit of an over nerf given that it has very little team fight application unlike the side unblockable heavies which did need to be lower given the hitbox. As for Orochi I do agree with the dodge cancel removal on whiffed kick as it was difficult to punish and Orochi has lots of pressure options, the kick will just have to be more considered when used as a ganking tool, but the removal of undodgeable on the forward dodge light really hurt the mix up even if it was a pain to fight Orochi as another assassin (Though that's a reflex guard issue as opposed to single character balancing). I agree with you that Orochi's damage needed tuning down. I still don't like that Ubi has retained the deflect beating out armour or the fact that it grants a combo light and/or starts chains, but with those in mind I think this is why Slip Through was addressed as Orochi's high damage went higher with this feat and Orochi's playstyle largely revolves around utilising dodge cancels. The new change sounds good on paper but I think that they may have overlooked how it applies to Shinobi, Shooting Stars is a high damage tier 2 feat that Shinobi runs or will run quite commonly and although the patch notes say the feat checks for an attack landed "shortly" after a dodge, testing will need to be done to see if this will let Shinobi hold onto the bonus for a short time to do big damage with the feat. If this time window is big enough too since again "shortly" isn't really a known figure of time yet, it will be worth testing to see if this applies to things like neutral heavies, ballista shots or if the buff is wasted on soldiers/pikemen. Shinobi certainly looks like they've done a good job, it will be interesting to see how backflip chain interactions work and we'll have to see if the change to front dodge kick will still allow it to be confirmed after the Shooting Stars feat. Looking forward to your thoughts on Conqueror as he looks like he'll be an immensely fun hero to play now. Though time will tell after the TG to see how viable he really is since on paper he looks great, although I think his feats will still hold him back as a serious Dominion pick. I hope I'm wrong though.
Heroes like Jorm or Highlander would require much more extensive changes, given that the very mechanics they are based on (e.g. Jorm's stamina drain) are outdated in relation to the whole game core. Conq, on the other hand, is updated in relation to his dynamics and chains, without fundamental changes to the game itself.
Removing the dodge recovery only means that there will be counterplay to his spam because he won't be able to chain kicks constantly. Right now there is absolutely no counterplay when he starts with the spam. No punishment on whiff is stupid and I don't understand how you stand by it. Will people still get hit with his shit? Yes. But atleast this time it won't be a 50-50 spamfest. I do however see a pattern where you call out everyone ("moaning" because they disagree with a subjectively bad game mechanic) with a different opinion then yours. Just because you think that is somehow healthy for the game, doesn't automatically make it true. Makes you seem very opinionated. Just my 2 cents.
*Ignoring all the freeze specific stuff* I absolutely agree, no hero in the game should EVER have that amount of pressure. Orochi allowed literally ZERO breathing room for whoever he was fighting. It almost seems as if it is never your turn to be offensive because of the mix-up bombarding you with non stop guessing games. Look I know Orochi is going to suffer from this nerf and we need to find a new way to make him viable, but why the hell are so many people going out of their way to defend such a blatantly unhealthy game mechanic. We should not be sacrificing the games overall health for the sake of character viability.
it's not an opinion that you can counter the kick... those are facts you just chose to ignore those as they don't fit within your agenda. great job there buddy.
@@fkkfreeze I said there is no counterplay to his spam. You _guessing_ right against Orochi, doesn't make it a counter. The problem is the "it's my turn now" every turn, that Orochi has. Unless you guess (No, not read. You can't "read" which of the 3 moves (one having 3 variations) he would do from a forward dodge), you get hit by something and he can just continue his shit until you guess right while simultaneously doing it so fast. Add a Tiandi next to him to reset Orochis stamina with his feat, and he can just spam until tomorrow. The only character that has a proper counter to his bs is BP. Again, no counterplay to the *spam* Again, *opinion* on a subjectively bad game mechanic (this being dodge recovery cancels) But you chose to ignore what I wrote because ego got the best of you. But that's fine. Great job there buddy.
I don't find that Orochi got that bad of a nerf. I personally don't like when bashes ar un-punishable, like orochi's live kick. Being able to dodge-cancell a bash recovery is just stupid imo. The removal of the undodgeable properties on the front-dodge light was unnecessary, but i think the change to the kick is healthy I'm ofc open to hearing your opinion
The nerf on the Kick was unnecessary, in out of the kick and his top heavy UB, his other offensive tools are weak and poor, the dodge cancel on the kick to allows it to have a viable offensive tool because this tool is safe, on the other hand the kick is not a viable offensive tool if we remove the dodge cancel recovery from it because the kick is completely reactable and free punishable
@@SkallComrade You shouldn’t need to do that. Reading shouldn’t be a thing when it comes to punishing a bash. And thankfully that’s been made the case for Orochi like everyone else
@@kaijuslayer3334 you know you can just dodge the kick in reaction and you are still safe, moreover you can take back the priority etc... Anyway now Oroshit is pretty poor now
@@SkallComrade But almost all other bashes can be punished. It’s not a matter of being safe, it’s the fact throwing a bash should be punishable. And also, the main change was the kick recovery. If that makes Orochi shit, then his rework was never well designed
I think it’s fine anymore damage nerfs and they will be useless it’s like old gryphon follow up kick got nerfed to 24 and is 600ms it’s abit unfair to compare the 2 considering raiders slower but my point is slow moves should hit hard because it gives you a lot of time to avoid the move(or roll away still haven’t solved that problem for raider)
Can’t wait for a pirate hero! Aside from that I believe everything regarding Raider and Shugo was warranted. Orochi is in a better spot now in that he is not blatantly broken. As someone who doesn’t really play Orochi, I found him to be a really strong character if you have good enough reaction times. The kick is no longer a spam move that you can’t get punished for. Initially I was of the opinion that removing his tracking dodges would weaken him too much, but now I am unsure. Against other dodge attacks he has a significant advantage. Now the hero will require a little more forethought when fighting rather than spamming dodge lights and kicks with the occasional 50/50 U heavy. I didn’t have much trouble fighting them. Still, I don’t believe we need a character centered around dodge recovery meta to be overly-difficult to deal with. Shinobi is also looking good, but we will need to see him in live first to clarify if he has been effectively reworked. Conqueror seems quite over-tuned from what I saw in the livestream. Of course we will have to test him ourselves to accurately gauge his status. If nothing else he will definitely be strong.
orochi bash was only ever broken against people who never learnt that empty dodge -> light would force the orochi to make a read and perform a dodge to not be punished by. This option can then be punished with a light parry if he dodge attacks and you have advantage if he empty dodges, allowing you to start your offence. This tech has been known since the release of the rework and there is no reason everyone should not know this, especially if they are having problems with the move. It amost seems silly to nerf a charachter because of the playerbases refusal to learn something simple.
@@_reichtangle_3750 Yea, this move isn’t that viable. The orochi doesn’t need to make a read because it is safer to either backstep light, or go into a backstep heavy which then forces the opponent to make another read. Several heroes have long whiff recoveries and animation startups. Only tracking lights could actually instigate a read from an orochi. Most characters don’t have the ability to counter this, with the exception of zerker if he dodges early because his hyper armor kicks in early enough to continue his chain even if he is hit.
@@_reichtangle_3750 Also if you know the enemy is trying to make you make a read you can anticipate the attack and get a deflect. Easier said than done of course, but leave it to the reaction gods to kill people consistently with this tech.
![Felix "Unfair" | [Stray Kids : SKZ-PLAYER]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/Oswujxm2Ag0/mqdefault.jpg)
*oro, pk, warden, Shugo patting conq on the back and welcoming him to the multiple rework club*
*hl, jorm, and Shaolin literally decomposing*
Lawbringer lookin like a rusted Tin man wasting away now😓
Imagine HL, Jorm or Shaolin become viable xD
Nuxia its just in a trash heap somewhere lol always forgotten
@@coreydemc Nuxia ? Who is tf character ? XD
Who's nuxia btw?
Super annoyed we aren't getting any new/reworked maps it's been 2 years since we got a new one
We had changes to the Forge, Gauntlet and Beachsite in relatively recent past, what are you on about?
@@MrAliquam think he means a new map and maybe more added to other maps like new areas
I personally just want balancing and that's it, idc about new stuff unless it's new executions. However, I'd appreciate if they moved the tribute and death match maps over to dom, that'd be very nice.
@@MrAliquam wow litterally one new pathway on 3 maps how cool😐😐😐😐
@@calus_bath_water Be thankful they didn't just gave up the balancing.
I used to main Shinobi and I am extremely excited for the huuuge rework. It’s going to be great
Shinobi was the first dlc hero i got
@@banditdoggo same lmao
i miss the throwing attack :(
I just got this game yesterday, but I instantly clicked with him. Has the Rework already happened?
@@Saxandfifths yeah
I imagine the weird short tempered nerf means the new character probably has that feat. Usually why they do these weird nerfs. Balancing for something that hasn't released yet.
I thought they did it because it was really quite good for shugo, which people were calling op, which is also why shugo got nerfed as a whole.
I think it’s because of Heavy spamming aramushas no doubt, musha is still in need for a nerf he’s stupid in any fight if you’re skilled with him, even if you spam you win
They were also nerfing shugo, and smoke bomb so they prob knew people would swap to ST
@@Blacklungs-Sanji not really lol if you're skilled with him you play defensive, the fact that you're talking about spam just shows you cannot react to his lights, and that's on you
He is insanely good if you're skilled, i am just questioning your own skill, sounds to me like you are still learning the game and how to block properly, and are not at the level at which you would actually complain about his insane recoveries that give him great defence
Piracy and Chill gaming
Eyyyy
Shinobi’s forward dodge heavy looks so goofy, I love it
basically for the new hero we got assassin's creed rougue trailer
Thanks, now I cant unsee it
I don’t understand what’s so wrong with orochi’s kick being nerfed, it now functions like all other bashes in the game. Now it’s more like nobushi’s kick where you only need to read if they’re going to follow up with an attack on miss, rather than reading 3 mixups deep.
ye, why wouldn't we want something new a different that might be a cool addition for other heroes as well.
puzzling
There is something to be said for experimentation but the change clearly wasn’t welcome, and if it wasn’t welcome for one hero imagine the outcry if it transferred to more heroes. Personally I want to see For Honor shift away from Bash: The Game
Trueee orange=bad, ubi pls revert to pre-ccu so that I can win my fights taking 3 cans of red bull and 10 pills of adderall.
Maybe because nobushi is garbage tier and orochi actually felt nicer to play and fight
@@YankeeGD hey man you do you :)
Conq looks really cool now, I hated playing him before because he was so stiff, but his rework looks pretty solid tbh.
I hate that they added a fucking undodge/bash casino. They are adding it to literally everyone and its so annoying
Pretty solid? Lul he'll be busted af
Your pronunciation of Ching Shi is most pleasing to the ear, Mr Freeze ;)
My guess on the weapon is more towards Paidao due to it's larger size, but a Hudiedao (proper name of the ''Butterfly sword'') is pretty acceptable too. Although the Paidao and Hudiedao look very similar (the Paidao is just larger and was put in use a bit after the age of piracy historically) I think it will be a Paidao due to the bigger size which fits the gameplay of For Honor better in favor of the hero.
I can't tell if I'm excited, honestly. I'd rather have Ubisoft stay more towards the Ming-era of China and earlier because that still borders the medieval era of the world. Piracy is a bit too modern for my taste and it can honestly make or break my feel of the game. On the other hand, a Wu Lin after 2 years.
I'm pretty conflicted on my feelings regarding this hero.
The Orochi nerf is just sad, not much to say as i'd be preaching into the choir.
Shugoki and Raider nerfs seem pretty reasonable overal.
Well,
considering the Wokou (chinese name for japanese pirates) raided the coast from the 13th to 16th century, I would say that piracy as theme for asian factions is still perfectly medieval!
Im honestly very pleasantly surprised with the themeing of this hero
This is one thing the devs always fuckin nail on the head
Meanwhile in a game where naked men raid villages that use weapons designed to rend flesh while a different kind of people stare at the horizon with full plate armour and magic stones.
For those saying Orochi has been neutered, if removing the ability to dodge cancel on whiff of the kick is most of that is required to make him bad, he was never a well designed rework to begin with.
They literally removed his undodgeable/bash mixup. it's like removing raider's storming tap
@@rage2130 he still has storm rush though
@@paddefrosk6273 you can hit him out of storm rush. Yes he can cancel out of it and parry your attack, but now he has less pressure
@@SanctuaryGhost You just answered your own question. It can be feinted to counter any light the opponent might throw. If parrying is too hard, a block or dodge/deflect is still possible.
@@rage2130 Except he still has storm rush, which can be feinted to counter potential interrupts.
0:24 “as well as the shinobi rework that is coming on the 9th, today”
the today is refering to the first part of the sentence
Raider Changes are perfect IMO. Shugo changes might be a bit to much of a nerf, i have to see how it works out.
I'd completely fine If they just changed the dodge recovery cancel after a missed kick to have a Longer delay, so people cant deflect Dodge attacks at all Times. Didnt really believe they would straight Up remove it. I wanted a slight Nerf for him, but thats definitely too much.
Idk about shinobi, i never understood the character really and i doubt i will understand His moveset and His gameplay after this rework we have been Testing Out for half a year.
For the shugoki nerf i agree with the demon ball nerf but the damage is harsh. His character even says heavy hitter and now he does less damage than a few other characters.
@@Ruairi1304 Conq also has heavy hitter.
I just think it's funny how the group of people who complains the most about dodge attacks got a character nerfed for having the ability to punish them.
My thoughts exactly. Ppl don't like when you touch to their almighty dodge attack
I’m kind of tired of Ubi getting scared of every move that stuns in the game. I don’t think taking away raider’s knee stun was necessary, especially since guardbreak can give someone a heavy now so I just see the knee move a lot less now anyway.
Did the knee stun even add anything really? If they used the knee and went for a light it's guaranteed, and I don't think the stun impacted much if they decided to zone instead for a mix up.
The stamina drain removal is nice and I will admit the stun affect and sound was satisfying
The knee move still does 27 confirmed damage for you while a gb punish is only 24 unless there are players nearby to interrupt. The stamina drain was very high, which helped the raider a lot, but he can definitely survive without it because this move still has other uses.
Ubi has been pretty weird towards balancing in the last 2 years. They release a strong hero, it gets lots of backlash, it gets nerfed, suddenly people dont play it anymore, and then they buff it again. They should make up their mind, either push for a higher overall power creep of all heroes, or don't, but they can't just stand in the middle, they need to take a stance regarding this.
I mean there are some stuns that I can understand got removed like can’t punch and glad bash but why remove the knee? You can decide between the heavy or the wallsplat knee for stam damage/pressure and the guaranteed light
@@Bear-pi9ro they are not removing the knee, they are just removing the insane stamina damage (when coupled with stamina regen pause after gb) and the stun which was not necessary anyways since at top level it made no difference, and was simply annoying at lower skill levels
Looks as raider rework*
“Wow, this is worthless!”
The new hero is possibly based on Ching Shih? Now i'm actually kinda excited. Also, that Conq rework has really piqued my interest too.
Great video and good recap of the stream.
My only concern with shinobi is his front roll into double dodge addition. I hope it's not a case where if someone reads the flip kick and dodges it, they still get hit by a kick from shinobi anyway. I guess we'll wait and see. Excellent changes for him overall.
Hopefully shinobi won’t be able to punish players trying to dodge flip kick with the dodge kick on reaction, but I won’t mind needing to make a read between two bashes.
@@Bash_Minimal Yeah that's fair enough, I feel the same.
Damage nerfs "are always good", but in Shugo's case they are a bit excessive, given that Shugo cannot vortex his mixup (contrary to e.g. Raider), his heavies are chargeable (and as such slower), so he ought to be rewarded a bit more to trade efficiently, especially in teamfights.
Furthermore, Short-tempered (aka "a feat which no one using") has been directly quoted as an incentive for Shugo's damage nerf, and has been also nerfed in turn. That's actually weird in the way like old Shields Up and Protected Revive, have been smashed down with nerfs. One would've expect that with Smokebomb changes and charged heavies nerf, Short-tempered could become at least remotely viable T2 pick to compensate for the latter, but the balancing team seems determined to somehow prevent this.
I can agree they might be a bit excessive, but only very slightly so, he did need some tweaking to dmg numbers
Yeah I'm one of the few people who uses it and now I'm gonna use juggernaut like everyone else
Shugo’s numbers have been pretty gutted, but he’s still gonna be quite good
They're perfect, tf you talkin bout, they should've give sane damage nerf to raider
@@atynniehawke9341 Unnecessary* They nerfed what was needed already. No more demon ball into hug and side dodge headbutt is punishable. Heavies that slow should be higher damage.
I look forward to my baby boy conq actually becoming a viable pick for high level. I've stuck with him ever since I first started a few years back. I notice his flaws and drawbacks but I still love the hero. Maybe, just maybe, it's my turn to have fun and let loose.
I hope that he feats get better or just replace some of them too
Yoo i might have to pick up conquer again if that rework goes through
Wish there were more heroes in the next tg, but I’m excited to trying out new conqueror. Same side light spam baby
I fully agree with the orochi kick nerf because there’s no reason I get punished for punishing a whiff kick.
Consider this: if you are being punished for punishing a whiff kick, are you really performing the punish corretly or are you just dodge attacking beacause you refuse to learn or adapt to anything new?
@@_reichtangle_3750 it’s a dodge attack, which were literally made to counter bashes. Taking away the one viable punish while giving the the opponent 4 counters, one being a punish for the punish, is not on the player but on the character’s move set.
Kinda sad they are nerfing orochi to make him basically useless.. roach was always so fun to fight how he is now, it was really fun reaction time test basically. and it felt so good and fun to win against
Conqs gone have me nervous with that rework lol but they deserve a better kit. I hope they help nuxia jorm and lb next
I think the weapon will be a pidao instead of a hudiedao or butterfly blade even though there are different kinds and they did have river pirate hudiedao and the hero is a pirate, but we only see one blade in the trailer and with kyoshin we even saw his sheath in the trailer so in my opinion it's a pidao identical to butterfly blades from southern China and not those that are commonly used in martial arts like wing Chun, those blades tend to be shorter than most 19th century pidao and hudiedao commonly used my military and pirates in the 19th century in China also most pirate hudiedao were unhilted weapons commonly made as boarding mele weapons ideal for stabbing but the back sides of the blades could be used to subdue opponents or could be easily flipped in the hand to deliver a killing blow or to slit a throat, a pidao however were commonly about 2ft in length and had thinner blades often in a triangular or cofin shape and were commonly hilted like other versions of hudiedao used by military and martial arts instead of those commonly associated with the Chinese river pirates, we can also assume that as the trailer shows a sword of moderate length about 2ft or so and shows a hilted blade with a very triangular blade shape with a thin blade face and the fact we are shown a full front silhouette of the new hero and are only shown 1 weapon in hand I think we can assume she is holding a pidao, as I think we would have seen 2 blades if she had hudiedao
@@OkamiVtuber a pidao and many styles of hudiedao are extremely similar to cutlass, as they're popular 19th century swords when there would have been a European influence dao is just a single edged sword pidao were often single blade swords often about 2ft and often used with a shield which is why they were called pidao basically shield knife, although hudiedao were often used by Chinese pirates and southern styles look very cutlass like and can also be short and stubby like those used in wing Chun, hudiedao just means 2 blades or double swords, and jian are double edged swords but you have different types of jian that's why I called it a pidao because we see one sword about 2 ft in length with a characteristic pidao shape not 2 blades which would suggest butterfly blades or hudiedao, a cutlass is a European style single edged sword style from a European Saber but not all sabers are cutlass, it's a wu lin hero so it makes sense they would carry a Chinese weapon and those commonly used by Chinese pirates and also military of the 19th century were pidao and hudiedao calling it a cutlass is like saying highlander has a claymore, or calling cents Gladius a xiphos similar swords but still not claymore or a xiphos
I hate the stamina drain removal on both raider or conq. Shugos nerfs make no god damn sense. Nerf the bash, not his fucking identity. "Hard hitter" with a 26 unblockable. Really losing my patience for this game.
You helped me understand alot thank you
"Given in to the whining." Bro it was way too unhealthy for the game to leave him the way he was 😂
The nerfs on shugo and raider are welcome, Oro's nerfs are disappointing. I don't play shinobi, but he seems to be finally fun to play against and lastly, conq rework...OH boy I love that reworks. Looks fun AF.
Thanks for the cover of the stream, it's a good recap.
Shugo's nerf has added another layer of pain to my crisis of a soul, i'm now just sitting here and wondering... why did i pump a quarter of my reps and half my time into him?
@Plain Water all i can say about shugo is
"Look at how they massacred my boy"
Just picked the game back up and was mind blown how fast some of the lights were :P Gotta do some AI training just to see what's happened to everyone
So LawBringer is never getting the long over due rework of idk a new map for dominion.
I started playing Orochi yesterday and i agree that he is op and spammable but he isnt season 2 Cent or Flashbang Raider, i still lose and get beat while playing Orochi and it doesnt have to be a player that is much better than me. Orochi is really fun tho but im sad that he is getting such a big nerf
He not even OP HE IS A TIER shugo raider and aramusha are still S tier... Orochis dmg is just to high... Was not reason to scrap the whole mobility kit... PPl cried and cried and as usual ubisoft caters to the 90% of the community that is freaking CRAP and have the nerve to have a competitive scene... At this point this game is becoming a joke honestly....
@@booniegaming2098 Well i agree with you but the way you presented your argument makes you no different than the people who complain and cry on the for honor subreddit
they should've just adjusted the damage numbers instead of needing his mobility. literally felt like assassin when moving as him. agile. there plenty of characters that can beat him.
@@monkebrainedfish3130 yeah my presentation is crap but the facts are still the facts
@@booniegaming2098 I agree that raider is S tier but I also disagree that orochi is A tier now.I think orochi was slightly overtuned due to his bash that could not be punished not for his high damage which personally I don’t see how he has high damage I don’t see it being too high.
I'm just so happy for the much needed Conqueror rework.
People weren't crying about reacting to dust devil, they were complaining about making the right read and just having them dodge, punish your counter offence..
Honestly, I'm leveling Conqueror to rep 40 at least when this rework comes out.
I would say the same if a nerf weren't guaranteed before that would happen
Lawbringer still somehow getting no changes. Nice 👍👍👍
I think some of the Shugoki changes are very questionable. The damage nerfs would be absolutely fine if they were part of a more generalised nerf to everyone's damage, but now Shugoki is left with uncharged finisher heavies that deal 2 more damage than his neutral heavies, or almost anyone's neutral heavies, for that matter, and unblockables that deal average or below average unblockable damage despite being significantly slower than other heroes' unblockables. Sure, the side heavies have very big hitboxes, but they're still 1300ms and very vulnerable to being interrupted with bashes, they should've compensated those nerfs with something, but they didn't
Charged UB heavies are still a good move in teamfights. It has it's place
Shugo is in a good spot now. Idk what to tell you
Fan of the changes especially Conq. Any changes that make me want to play the hero I'm good with. Conq needed something and this is a start.
This wu lin has to be an assassin because in order with every other faction below the hybrid is an assassin like cent and glad
It may be a Vanguard. That seems like the pattern. We have two new hybrids(Gryphon, Kiyo) and warmonger as our one and I’m assuming this new hero will be a vanguard
Kind of a shame that if it's a new Wu Lin hero we aren't getting one with a shield, really would've liked that.
God I’m so happy they fixed conq. He has my favorite weapon combo in the game but I just refused to play him. Glad to see they’re putting the flail to good use this time
People who think orochi was balanced are smooth brained I love getting punished for deflecting makes sense
People who complain about the Orochi being unbalanced are unable to even form proper fucking sentences, as seen in the example A.
@@serefsevik8368 orochi was still busted af
@@ltci322
Strong ≠ Busted
Get an actual grip on reality.
I think they went too far with the Orochi Nerf - his kick mixup was already fairly easy for reaction monsters to deal with, and now it's practically useless. It looks like Shinobi and maybe Conq will be replacing Orochi as the defensive monsters.
Raider and Shugoki nerfs were good, and the Shinobi rework looks like it'll be a lot of fun!
But I shouldn’t have to make another reaaaadddd!!!!!!!! I want offense buffs, but not if they’re used against me!
Luckily for us, the devs aren’t balancing around the top who can react to orochi, why would you balance around the minority of the players? The “bad” majority is where the money is at and if nerfing orochi will make new players stay around longer and cause normal players to enjoy the game more, that’s what they will do cause that’s where the money is at.
@@Slowedbrew nah they shouldn't do that - the game will mostly just get worse if they listen to lower level players. This Orochi nerf does almost nothing for the "bad" majority, they'll still struggle like hell against him. But for those who learn to differentiate between an indicator and Storm rush, Orochi will be much easier to deal with now more than ever before (and as was said, he was already fairly easy to deal with especially with static guard heroes).
Really, Dust Devil should have Storm Rush animation but they do a kick instead - that would make the mixup actually work as they intended. And would be a much better justification for making this mixup more punishable or less damaging, or both.
Well looks like us jorm mains are gonna have to suffer a whole other season to get another shot
Thanks ubi
Still no jorm changes :(
Maining conq now
Get ready for all the meta chasers crying about the removal of their crutch until they move on to the next most powerful hero.
When do theese nerfes be in game?
this thursday, dec 9th
Idk about the front dodge light losing its undodgeable property, kick nerf was enough, orochi wasn't even in the same tier as raider and shugo anyways (both in duels and 4v4s)
Orochi was broken lmao if you don’t think he wasn’t on the same tier as raider and Shugoki and even better than them then you are smoking something it’s so fun playing against a character you literally couldn’t do much against against orochi it was literally always his turn orochi was better in duels than raider but raider is only better than orochi in 4’s due to ha and wide arcing unblockable and heavies
@@for3v3xyy0ung I played as orochi for a bit and found there were some characters and players that could beat out orochi. idk maybe it's just a player skill thing?
@@for3v3xyy0ung nope, raider was better in duels too, at least in top tier, if you're bad enough any hero can make you struggle of course, the game is in the best balancing state it's ever been in, basically every hero is at least usable, it's just that at top level some are gonna struggle way more than others
@@for3v3xyy0ung as someone who plays the game competitively, I can tell you right here and now that oro wasn’t as good as raider or shugo
So they turned Shinobi into Orochi. Nice one goobisoft
I'm kind of worried about shinobis deflect it takes so long to initiate I wonder if it would even work in ganks
Oh conq, I have very high hopes for you my friend
Never been so stoked for a hero
Love your videos like always
i like the new conq but i do feel the damage dose need looking into as its not the highest, a lot of it is confirmed damage but im no pro at the game and just find it fun to play
U right. It is a butterfly sword. It looks like a Chinese one as well since it’s long.
I'm very confused about the direction they went with conqueror. Sounds like it will be a pain.
Also can we get the second video within like five hours?
No
@@fkkfreeze ;-; but now I gotta watch it at undisclosed timing
Why is sugo is a nerf
another season lawbringers mains cry 😢
People can punish the kick now.. Orochi was broken and that damn kick couldn't be punished.. That's finally changed.
factually untrue
@@fkkfreeze youre delusional...
@@skeletrin8759 what's crazy is no one will actually show you the punish and if they do it's some crazy hero specific move you gotta do before the kick even happened.
I've shown the punishes in a video.
disprove them... go ahead. show me.
@@fkkfreeze Yeah, just gotta guess out of the millions of options he can do easily so you can "punish" him
They can just bait the forward dodge light and cancel the recovery, the kick just had to many options on whiff, im glad its getting reduced.
We will see if the numbers are ok. Maybe it is too slow to recover we can t saybat this point since it was undodgeable
@@menalgharbwalsharq648 mhm, i am hoping these changes keep him viable (got 21 reps on the sucker), but i honestly can't say im sad about recovery on kick being removed
Nice I assumed it would be a viking which in my opinion is just alright but I'd like to see another Chinese character and also buff Chinese like tiandi or Shaolin at least a couple of tiny tweaks
Still waiting on some nuxia improvements
When the new hero will come out?
Jan 27th
Conq is about to be literally unstoppable
But its only TG
They need to sort out aramushas all guard
So hyped 4 years long term player err day baby. God I love this game
Can’t wait to main conq again
Orochi needed a little bit of a nerf, I mean he was 100% unpunishable. Nobody could punish me except other people using Orochi, or if I was dumb enough to not open with his kick and got parried.
Blitss punished you, infact he punished you a lot
@@ficedulamortis6434 Word
-sighs in sad orochi main- we just cant have anything.
I get that Orochi was made to be THE dodge specialist, but he didn’t need to be able to dodge out of LITERALLY every recovery and attack. You couldn’t even touch him if he kept using the kick/dodge attack mixup. Dodge attacks now countering the kick is a very good change.
Cool. I've only been complaining about those two characters raider and orochi..... gokis ight tho I guess
Only conq in testing grounds? Kinda disappointing if you ask me
I hate how they didn't nerf orochi's tacking on top heavy finisher. I hate getting g sniped 15 feet by that shit
Hope ur right about the hero
It would be amazing
The new hero is so far away unfortunately but hopefully the shinobi and tgs hold up
Balance changes were mostly welcome though I think a few of them needed further consideration. I have no objections to Raider's changes, the only one of Shugoki's I disagree with is fully charged top heavy finisher, I think 38 was a little too high but 32 is a little bit of an over nerf given that it has very little team fight application unlike the side unblockable heavies which did need to be lower given the hitbox. As for Orochi I do agree with the dodge cancel removal on whiffed kick as it was difficult to punish and Orochi has lots of pressure options, the kick will just have to be more considered when used as a ganking tool, but the removal of undodgeable on the forward dodge light really hurt the mix up even if it was a pain to fight Orochi as another assassin (Though that's a reflex guard issue as opposed to single character balancing). I agree with you that Orochi's damage needed tuning down. I still don't like that Ubi has retained the deflect beating out armour or the fact that it grants a combo light and/or starts chains, but with those in mind I think this is why Slip Through was addressed as Orochi's high damage went higher with this feat and Orochi's playstyle largely revolves around utilising dodge cancels. The new change sounds good on paper but I think that they may have overlooked how it applies to Shinobi, Shooting Stars is a high damage tier 2 feat that Shinobi runs or will run quite commonly and although the patch notes say the feat checks for an attack landed "shortly" after a dodge, testing will need to be done to see if this will let Shinobi hold onto the bonus for a short time to do big damage with the feat. If this time window is big enough too since again "shortly" isn't really a known figure of time yet, it will be worth testing to see if this applies to things like neutral heavies, ballista shots or if the buff is wasted on soldiers/pikemen.
Shinobi certainly looks like they've done a good job, it will be interesting to see how backflip chain interactions work and we'll have to see if the change to front dodge kick will still allow it to be confirmed after the Shooting Stars feat. Looking forward to your thoughts on Conqueror as he looks like he'll be an immensely fun hero to play now. Though time will tell after the TG to see how viable he really is since on paper he looks great, although I think his feats will still hold him back as a serious Dominion pick. I hope I'm wrong though.
I don't get why they chose conq for a rework, while less used character gets nothing?
Heroes like Jorm or Highlander would require much more extensive changes, given that the very mechanics they are based on (e.g. Jorm's stamina drain) are outdated in relation to the whole game core. Conq, on the other hand, is updated in relation to his dynamics and chains, without fundamental changes to the game itself.
New pirate hero looks like shay from assassins creed
Good changes overall, let's wait and see how it plays out.
Am I the only one upset that we only got one hero for 2021??!!
Removing the dodge recovery only means that there will be counterplay to his spam because he won't be able to chain kicks constantly. Right now there is absolutely no counterplay when he starts with the spam. No punishment on whiff is stupid and I don't understand how you stand by it.
Will people still get hit with his shit? Yes. But atleast this time it won't be a 50-50 spamfest.
I do however see a pattern where you call out everyone ("moaning" because they disagree with a subjectively bad game mechanic) with a different opinion then yours. Just because you think that is somehow healthy for the game, doesn't automatically make it true. Makes you seem very opinionated.
Just my 2 cents.
*Ignoring all the freeze specific stuff* I absolutely agree, no hero in the game should EVER have that amount of pressure. Orochi allowed literally ZERO breathing room for whoever he was fighting. It almost seems as if it is never your turn to be offensive because of the mix-up bombarding you with non stop guessing games.
Look I know Orochi is going to suffer from this nerf and we need to find a new way to make him viable, but why the hell are so many people going out of their way to defend such a blatantly unhealthy game mechanic. We should not be sacrificing the games overall health for the sake of character viability.
it's not an opinion that you can counter the kick... those are facts
you just chose to ignore those as they don't fit within your agenda. great job there buddy.
@@fkkfreeze I said there is no counterplay to his spam. You _guessing_ right against Orochi, doesn't make it a counter. The problem is the "it's my turn now" every turn, that Orochi has. Unless you guess (No, not read. You can't "read" which of the 3 moves (one having 3 variations) he would do from a forward dodge), you get hit by something and he can just continue his shit until you guess right while simultaneously doing it so fast. Add a Tiandi next to him to reset Orochis stamina with his feat, and he can just spam until tomorrow. The only character that has a proper counter to his bs is BP.
Again, no counterplay to the *spam*
Again, *opinion* on a subjectively bad game mechanic (this being dodge recovery cancels)
But you chose to ignore what I wrote because ego got the best of you. But that's fine. Great job there buddy.
moving the goalpost, icic
countering is not countering
@@fkkfreeze You're just being petty at this point. You know exactly what I meant.
Sorry but no Viking next season is a dealbreaker
Wack to see literally everyone they rework get new moves in their kits but Raider is for some reason just left out.
New Viking when!?
That backflip is too much I can’t fucking touch em
empty dodge and then gb, backflip spammers cant do shit against that lol
The shugoki nerf Is very necessary!!!!!! I went up against a guy who kept using the back breaker move. SMH
I honestly dislike getting characters midway through seasons. I just want to play new guys when their seasons come out instead of waiting even more.
Parrot?
I don't find that Orochi got that bad of a nerf. I personally don't like when bashes ar un-punishable, like orochi's live kick. Being able to dodge-cancell a bash recovery is just stupid imo. The removal of the undodgeable properties on the front-dodge light was unnecessary, but i think the change to the kick is healthy
I'm ofc open to hearing your opinion
The nerf on the Kick was unnecessary, in out of the kick and his top heavy UB, his other offensive tools are weak and poor, the dodge cancel on the kick to allows it to have a viable offensive tool because this tool is safe, on the other hand the kick is not a viable offensive tool if we remove the dodge cancel recovery from it because the kick is completely reactable and free punishable
moreover you can punish the kick with a correct read currently
@@SkallComrade You shouldn’t need to do that. Reading shouldn’t be a thing when it comes to punishing a bash. And thankfully that’s been made the case for Orochi like everyone else
@@kaijuslayer3334 you know you can just dodge the kick in reaction and you are still safe, moreover you can take back the priority etc...
Anyway now Oroshit is pretty poor now
@@SkallComrade But almost all other bashes can be punished. It’s not a matter of being safe, it’s the fact throwing a bash should be punishable. And also, the main change was the kick recovery. If that makes Orochi shit, then his rework was never well designed
Imo raider needed a bigger damage nerf. 2 or 6 less damage will not make a difference whatsoever. I also think orochi needed a damage nerf as well.
I think it’s fine anymore damage nerfs and they will be useless it’s like old gryphon follow up kick got nerfed to 24 and is 600ms it’s abit unfair to compare the 2 considering raiders slower but my point is slow moves should hit hard because it gives you a lot of time to avoid the move(or roll away still haven’t solved that problem for raider)
Ah yes, now dealing with players i beat now using an op ninja just to feel overpowered. Let the nightmare begin
Every character play the same now as soon as the update hit i will just uninstall hope they release for honor 2 soon.
Shinobi Gang 🐱👤
Can’t wait for a pirate hero! Aside from that I believe everything regarding Raider and Shugo was warranted. Orochi is in a better spot now in that he is not blatantly broken. As someone who doesn’t really play Orochi, I found him to be a really strong character if you have good enough reaction times. The kick is no longer a spam move that you can’t get punished for. Initially I was of the opinion that removing his tracking dodges would weaken him too much, but now I am unsure. Against other dodge attacks he has a significant advantage. Now the hero will require a little more forethought when fighting rather than spamming dodge lights and kicks with the occasional 50/50 U heavy. I didn’t have much trouble fighting them. Still, I don’t believe we need a character centered around dodge recovery meta to be overly-difficult to deal with. Shinobi is also looking good, but we will need to see him in live first to clarify if he has been effectively reworked. Conqueror seems quite over-tuned from what I saw in the livestream. Of course we will have to test him ourselves to accurately gauge his status. If nothing else he will definitely be strong.
orochi bash was only ever broken against people who never learnt that empty dodge -> light would force the orochi to make a read and perform a dodge to not be punished by. This option can then be punished with a light parry if he dodge attacks and you have advantage if he empty dodges, allowing you to start your offence. This tech has been known since the release of the rework and there is no reason everyone should not know this, especially if they are having problems with the move. It amost seems silly to nerf a charachter because of the playerbases refusal to learn something simple.
@@_reichtangle_3750 Yea, this move isn’t that viable. The orochi doesn’t need to make a read because it is safer to either backstep light, or go into a backstep heavy which then forces the opponent to make another read. Several heroes have long whiff recoveries and animation startups. Only tracking lights could actually instigate a read from an orochi. Most characters don’t have the ability to counter this, with the exception of zerker if he dodges early because his hyper armor kicks in early enough to continue his chain even if he is hit.
@@_reichtangle_3750 Also if you know the enemy is trying to make you make a read you can anticipate the attack and get a deflect. Easier said than done of course, but leave it to the reaction gods to kill people consistently with this tech.
Still waiting for Lawbringer Rework/Buff