@@pedropierre9594and where will you flee where the Nids wont follow and how will you keep moving the populace of the Imperium ... if you are not to give the Nids feed?
The problem with Scorched Earth is that you eventually run out of earth to scorch. It also depends on the 'Nids not working out what you're doing, and just going for your throat directly. (Many Japanese island fortresses were simply bypassed by the US military during WW2.)
One could argue that recent actions by the Tyrannid hive fleets reflect this, ignoring more tempting targets to go after chapter homeworlds, such as the Baal system. While they don't offer as much value for the cost required, their destruction does open up other systems for invasion now that their defenders were taken out.
@@patrickmcginty3234 The fact they are actively avoiding the Outsider"s dyson sphere suggests they are not only able to pick their fights, but are good at it too.
@@TruculentSheep The fact that the Tyrannids definitively won the Octarius War also shows that they have priorities other than simply obtaining biomass. They could have simply used the orks there as an infinite source of biomass. Instead, they sent the Swarmlord to take out the Overfiend of Octarius, effectively ending any chance of organized resistance that allowed the orks to benefit from the never-ending fight. I think they used that war as a means of quickly developing a hive fleet that is formidable enough to go after its true target, the Sol system. What's more, with the genestealer cult that was present on Terra, the Hive Mind would have been made aware at just how fortified the Sol system was. This means that it had to do more than just amassing endless numbers of bioforms to be able to. And now, thanks to the Octarius War, the Tyrannids have just the force they need to make the assault.
The Tyranids are a great Alien race for stories in 40K but various pieces of "lore" written about them they are by far way to powerful. They can either swarm a planet with micro bugs that can swarm and eat space marines, clog visors, breathing vents. They seemingly can spit out a new monster as and when they encounter a threat, consume any creature and make it's counter part at the drop of a hat. Destruction is either through expensive (to the Imperium mainly it seems) attrition warfare or by it's own violation, virus bombing planets to make them unviable for the nids to sustain from. Baal only really got saved from the Tyranids because the Black Crusade succeeded.
@@terron7840 because the Imperium is at odds with the Necrons over the Pariah Nexus. If completed the Pariah Nexus would kill the Emperor and cut humanity off from warp travel, dooming them entirely.
I still don't know why the Imperium hasn't installed doomsday weapons on worlds in the Hive Fleets path. The weapons are designed to exterminatus a world once its human defenders fall. That way even worlds that are doomed can know that even if they lose, the Tyranids will still never win. Essentially a dead man switch, which guarantees the Tyranids will be at their weakest when the weapon goes off. Meaning the Tyranids take a world, right before it can regain biomass the device triggers. The Tyranids try to find or deactivate the devices before or during an invasion, causing the device to go off. Do it a few times and the Hive Mind will become skittish and desperate to find the devices without setting them off either during or even before an invasion (using a gene stealer cult). Meaning the Hive Mind will ignore the a worlds defenders and concentrate solely on finding the device or devices. Either way you give pause to Hive Mind and teach it fear and paranoia as it can never know if taking a world means it will get resources from it. At the same time, I am of the deep belief 10th Edition will finally give us real information about the Hive Mind, its true thoughts, its past and its future plans.
'Nids are like zombies, but exponentially worse. The zombie is nearly always weaker/less effective in combat then the original armed person. But 'nids, pound for pound of the people they consume + all the other plants and life they consume are far more deadly than the average person. It's a battle, by definition, neither the Imperium or *even the combined forces of the galaxy* could hope to win against. That is, unless the battle could somehow be taken to the 'nids hive mind directly. I suspect that's what either 10th edition or the next will try to tackle. After all, if they could destroy, or even impair the actual hive mind, then all the 'nids in the galaxy would become little more than nuisances.
The hive mind is made up of every single tyranid. Special tyranids are able to direct that vast amount of information collected from each tyranid and use it to fight their enemy. The hive mind dies only when every tyranid does
Wouldn’t it make more sense to allow the Nids to engaged with the planetary defenses, take losses, commit biomass to the planet and then implement Exterminatus?
He will have to make hard choices. Nobody mentions it but Tyranids also won octarius war. So imperium will face them advancing from two different directions. This war might be as existentialy important as man of iron war.
@Ali Goudarzi i think it was bellived they where starting to win Havent outright won to my knowledge but are dominating the situation So it could be eveolved on in 10th if they do go in giving my bug boys some victories/lovw
I actually heard the Death Korps of Krieg are being sent in to tip the balance back out of the nid's favor. Makes sense since there is an awesome Death Korps set in the Octarius Kill Team game set.
@@Butonz1 true, but Tyranids defeated the whole octarius sector Ork empire. Their warboss is dead. Krieg is not there to stop them, they are there to stall them. More meat for the grinder. Also It seems like my earlier comment referencing a video explaining the war got deleted. youtube really is unredeemable.
"'Some must be sacrificed if all are to be saved.' At first, I took that as revelation for the future. Now I see that it is as much about how we got here... ...as about where we are going. I think that one sentence is the greatest burden I have ever known." - Inquisitor G'Kar
The finality of the nid end game victory condition is exactly why there will never really be any significant Nid victory lorewise. The most important thing in 40K is that sweet SWEET status quo!
all the races in 40k represent some aspect of humanity, eldar are elites, necrons are ptsd war survivors, tau are collectivists, orks are primitive, they all allow for stories that are themed as humanits vs xenos, but are actually humanity vs the humane. the tyranids are foreign, they're more like insects, there is no philosophical meta structure possible, the story of the tyranids is solely how the imperium treats and views them
Honestly,in the real lore the final battle should come down to the Tyranids vs Necrons as both have weapons that do not require metal bullets. However GW will use plot armour to have the imperials win.
Yea like in storm in chaos or end times 😂. Lore serves to sell the new toys nothing more ,Leviathan will get retconed if it will sell more stuff later on.
you call that a victory ? a victory where even after being lucky to kill the hive prince so early on they were still almost whiped out by weaker feral forms and a demoniac intervention . whats their next excuse next time ? are they always gonna keep winning this way ? is there even a time where they defeated the tyranids for real on 1v1 instead of counting on the "firing at the mountain to cause an avalanche" trick ?
is there really a victory possible against those things ? i dont think they are beatable even if the necrons intervene . and we all know that tyranid's weapons can do damage to necron's body with their bio acidic weapons the same kind of damage a necron weapon can do to a tyranid . and we all know based on kronos and tiamat and others that if tyranids want they can easily create a specialised hive fleet that is anti necron with special combat forms . we saw how tyranids surpassed the eldar and chaos in their own games . how 1 Zoanthrope defeated a craft world . how kronos hunt demoniac forces like foxes . and how even nurgle's marines got sick and ill by tyranid bioweapons . so are we gonna keep this necron saviors narrative going and just ignore all these facts about tyranids insane weaponry and adaptability against literally every possible enemy in the galaxy ? not even the imperium or necron's halo arrays like galactic mass destruction weapons can truly eliminate them assuming the necrons or imperium can make them work to begin with . if the skavens caused the fall of the empire and cathay in warhammer fantasy i dont see why these here cant
The strategy outlined, is fight a fighting retreat. Allow the tyranid forces take the world as your forces move off world. Allow the hive ships to move in and begin consuming the biomass off the world. Then, exterminatus the planet and burn off the atmosphere, destroying all tyranid mass on the planet, refusing to them the spoils of further biomass, and hopefully killing the hive ships that siphon the biomass off as the atmosphere erupts. You don't win against the tyranids. You lose real big, and hope they lose even bigger. It's a war of attrition against a foe that breeds by eating your losses and pooping out more of your enemies. So destroy the biomass in your wake as you retreat and literally starve them out.
To defeat the Necrons, you would need to make a devise that can nullyfy and destroy any psychically linked being. Think of some kind of Psydestroyer from Starcraft 2.Tyrranids are inherently psychich and so anti warp weaponry should work on them.
@@MSte21 there is at least in 3 different mentions of it in the codex and novels so yeah if they can make a plague marine fall ill then i don think the necrons can be any different .
Kryptman is a poster boy for good ideas, terrible execution: "deny the Tyranids biomass - exterminatus a planet" = or you could just atl. try to bleed tyranids on the planet, and when it's lost, when hive ship is in orbit and ready slurp the sweet, sweet biomass from the planet, blow it up - denying the new biomass, and damaging it's own. "make our enemies fight - sic an orcs' at 'em" = or just atl. try to throw the to the warp - tyranids just'll lose biomass, since warp-spawn doesn't have any, and chaos forces have another enemies to worry about.
If I knew about about the tyriands as much as Kryptmen(I apologize if I spelled it wrong) I would give them no more than one or two days to evacuate the planet before killing everything on the planet. Otherwise I would agree with Venris.
In the bat-shit-insanity that is 40K (a galaxy populated by BDSM Space Elves, Egyptian robots and Cockney Mushroom-Orks), the Tyranids are far and away the most ridiculous.
If I lived in WH and I had one wish from a genie to get rid of one faction, it'd be the Tyrannids. Hands down. Those guys? Total jerks. I mean, seriously.
Dante did destroy many worlds that stood between Baal and the Tyranids, it seems to be a popular strategy to starve the Tyranids wherever possible.
When any biologic mass will be consumed and used against you, it's hard not to.
Would not say popular but unavoidable ...
@@Ower8x i say popular because you really could just, not fight at all as well dun dun dun
@@pedropierre9594and where will you flee where the Nids wont follow and how will you keep moving the populace of the Imperium ... if you are not to give the Nids feed?
The strategy even has an In-universe name: "The Kryptman contingency"
From a triage perspective, Kryptmann isn’t wrong, but his Octarius gambit was flawed.
was a stopgap measure left unatended, they didnt nuke the planet after the tiranid victory.
The problem with Scorched Earth is that you eventually run out of earth to scorch. It also depends on the 'Nids not working out what you're doing, and just going for your throat directly. (Many Japanese island fortresses were simply bypassed by the US military during WW2.)
One could argue that recent actions by the Tyrannid hive fleets reflect this, ignoring more tempting targets to go after chapter homeworlds, such as the Baal system. While they don't offer as much value for the cost required, their destruction does open up other systems for invasion now that their defenders were taken out.
@@patrickmcginty3234 The fact they are actively avoiding the Outsider"s dyson sphere suggests they are not only able to pick their fights, but are good at it too.
@@TruculentSheep
No biomass and the outsider is now held in tesseract labyrinths.
@@TruculentSheep The fact that the Tyrannids definitively won the Octarius War also shows that they have priorities other than simply obtaining biomass. They could have simply used the orks there as an infinite source of biomass. Instead, they sent the Swarmlord to take out the Overfiend of Octarius, effectively ending any chance of organized resistance that allowed the orks to benefit from the never-ending fight. I think they used that war as a means of quickly developing a hive fleet that is formidable enough to go after its true target, the Sol system.
What's more, with the genestealer cult that was present on Terra, the Hive Mind would have been made aware at just how fortified the Sol system was. This means that it had to do more than just amassing endless numbers of bioforms to be able to. And now, thanks to the Octarius War, the Tyrannids have just the force they need to make the assault.
The Tyranids are a great Alien race for stories in 40K but various pieces of "lore" written about them they are by far way to powerful. They can either swarm a planet with micro bugs that can swarm and eat space marines, clog visors, breathing vents. They seemingly can spit out a new monster as and when they encounter a threat, consume any creature and make it's counter part at the drop of a hat. Destruction is either through expensive (to the Imperium mainly it seems) attrition warfare or by it's own violation, virus bombing planets to make them unviable for the nids to sustain from. Baal only really got saved from the Tyranids because the Black Crusade succeeded.
THANK YOU ive been saying this, the Tyranids are way too powerful, when they lost a battle is because of some bs they are not written right
I wonder why the Imperium hasn't been working with the Necrons more often like they did in Cadia agains the eye of terror.
@@terron7840 Because it's heresy.
you could say such thing about like every race a bit
@@terron7840 because the Imperium is at odds with the Necrons over the Pariah Nexus. If completed the Pariah Nexus would kill the Emperor and cut humanity off from warp travel, dooming them entirely.
I still don't know why the Imperium hasn't installed doomsday weapons on worlds in the Hive Fleets path. The weapons are designed to exterminatus a world once its human defenders fall. That way even worlds that are doomed can know that even if they lose, the Tyranids will still never win. Essentially a dead man switch, which guarantees the Tyranids will be at their weakest when the weapon goes off. Meaning the Tyranids take a world, right before it can regain biomass the device triggers. The Tyranids try to find or deactivate the devices before or during an invasion, causing the device to go off. Do it a few times and the Hive Mind will become skittish and desperate to find the devices without setting them off either during or even before an invasion (using a gene stealer cult). Meaning the Hive Mind will ignore the a worlds defenders and concentrate solely on finding the device or devices. Either way you give pause to Hive Mind and teach it fear and paranoia as it can never know if taking a world means it will get resources from it. At the same time, I am of the deep belief 10th Edition will finally give us real information about the Hive Mind, its true thoughts, its past and its future plans.
Kryptman did nothing wrong. He was right strategically but also when he argued that dying by Exterminatus is a better death than by Tyranids.
'Nids are like zombies, but exponentially worse. The zombie is nearly always weaker/less effective in combat then the original armed person. But 'nids, pound for pound of the people they consume + all the other plants and life they consume are far more deadly than the average person. It's a battle, by definition, neither the Imperium or *even the combined forces of the galaxy* could hope to win against. That is, unless the battle could somehow be taken to the 'nids hive mind directly. I suspect that's what either 10th edition or the next will try to tackle. After all, if they could destroy, or even impair the actual hive mind, then all the 'nids in the galaxy would become little more than nuisances.
The hive mind is made up of every single tyranid. Special tyranids are able to direct that vast amount of information collected from each tyranid and use it to fight their enemy. The hive mind dies only when every tyranid does
Wouldn’t it make more sense to allow the Nids to engaged with the planetary defenses, take losses, commit biomass to the planet and then implement Exterminatus?
He will have to make hard choices. Nobody mentions it but Tyranids also won octarius war. So imperium will face them advancing from two different directions. This war might be as existentialy important as man of iron war.
Shit? When? Who said this? This is the end if it were to be true! Why not a single channel is talking about this?
@Ali Goudarzi i think it was bellived they where starting to win
Havent outright won to my knowledge but are dominating the situation
So it could be eveolved on in 10th if they do go in giving my bug boys some victories/lovw
@@celsetialarchives5909 may emperor protect us all, thanks mate
I actually heard the Death Korps of Krieg are being sent in to tip the balance back out of the nid's favor. Makes sense since there is an awesome Death Korps set in the Octarius Kill Team game set.
@@Butonz1 true, but Tyranids defeated the whole octarius sector Ork empire. Their warboss is dead. Krieg is not there to stop them, they are there to stall them. More meat for the grinder.
Also It seems like my earlier comment referencing a video explaining the war got deleted. youtube really is unredeemable.
"'Some must be sacrificed if all are to be saved.' At first, I took that as revelation for the future. Now I see that it is as much about how we got here... ...as about where we are going. I think that one sentence is the greatest burden I have ever known."
- Inquisitor G'Kar
The nids are in it for biomass so I doubt they’d skip any buffet… since it’s on their way to the dinner table anyway. Lol
Nice B5 reference.
I hope the Blood Raven shows up in this It has been a long time, since we saw them. 😔
Because the last time we saw them was Dawn of War 3…
The finality of the nid end game victory condition is exactly why there will never really be any significant Nid victory lorewise. The most important thing in 40K is that sweet SWEET status quo!
all the races in 40k represent some aspect of humanity, eldar are elites, necrons are ptsd war survivors, tau are collectivists, orks are primitive, they all allow for stories that are themed as humanits vs xenos, but are actually humanity vs the humane.
the tyranids are foreign, they're more like insects, there is no philosophical meta structure possible, the story of the tyranids is solely how the imperium treats and views them
Speaking of old lore I have been reading the Sicarius omnibus and it's been fun watching the 2nd company learn.
As a nid player I've been waiting for this as leviathan is coming from parallel to the galactic plane so we can eat everything everywhere
We need lore on them. It's been too long since we've learned anything.
Sadly, Tarsis Ultra is now over by Tyranids due to the Iron Warriors! (Ref; The Chapter's Due!)
I read the title of this video as “The Troll of the Tyranids!” and was like, what Sister of Battle is trolling the nids? I gotta see this!
What happens if Tyranid succeed to consume or damage a primarch and get their DNA?.
What if it's Vulkan...... perpetual Tyranids!
@@Duppyman695 already a thing with old one eye and swarm lords
@@angelnatal5581 Thats scary! lol
I'm not sure Primarchs have DNA, they're made of warp shit.
@@Duppyman695Old One Eye.
Looks like the lion, The emperor exterminator is needed, But what do you guys think?
Emperor's* 😂
Agreed. The meme, "punch an Ork, punch a traitor, punch a tyranid,"
"wait, what's a tyranid?"
Rings true.
Kryptmann: “Some of you may die, but it is a sacrifice I am willing to make.”
Honestly,in the real lore the final battle should come down to the Tyranids vs Necrons as both have weapons that do not require metal bullets.
However GW will use plot armour to have the imperials win.
Yea like in storm in chaos or end times 😂. Lore serves to sell the new toys nothing more ,Leviathan will get retconed if it will sell more stuff later on.
I like it. Fond memories for us old boys of the hobby :)
Got to get the Necrons to purge the bugs.
Awesome work wolf and a awesome channel, keep up the good work brother 👏
Blood Angels dealt with the bugs before and will again! Dante to the rescue.
Wrong side of the rift.
Next.
@@jonharrison9222 A ruin storm couldn't stop The Blood Angels from getting to Terra!
Dante didn't defeat the Tyranids. Guilliman rescued them.
you call that a victory ? a victory where even after being lucky to kill the hive prince so early on they were still almost whiped out by weaker feral forms and a demoniac intervention .
whats their next excuse next time ? are they always gonna keep winning this way ? is there even a time where they defeated the tyranids for real on 1v1 instead of counting on the "firing at the mountain to cause an avalanche" trick ?
@@c0ldsh0w3r True! I forgot it was the intro of the Super Duper Marines. Dante might make another deal with Sangunous's fan boy The Silent King'
I hope the nid's get to eat one of the returning primarks, or even just a nibble on one of the random body parts, stashed away on homeworlds.
Awsome video as always mate
is there really a victory possible against those things ? i dont think they are beatable even if the necrons intervene . and we all know that tyranid's weapons can do damage to necron's body with their bio acidic weapons the same kind of damage a necron weapon can do to a tyranid . and we all know based on kronos and tiamat and others that if tyranids want they can easily create a specialised hive fleet that is anti necron with special combat forms . we saw how tyranids surpassed the eldar and chaos in their own games . how 1 Zoanthrope defeated a craft world . how kronos hunt demoniac forces like foxes . and how even nurgle's marines got sick and ill by tyranid bioweapons . so are we gonna keep this necron saviors narrative going and just ignore all these facts about tyranids insane weaponry and adaptability against literally every possible enemy in the galaxy ? not even the imperium or necron's halo arrays like galactic mass destruction weapons can truly eliminate them assuming the necrons or imperium can make them work to begin with .
if the skavens caused the fall of the empire and cathay in warhammer fantasy i dont see why these here cant
The strategy outlined, is fight a fighting retreat. Allow the tyranid forces take the world as your forces move off world. Allow the hive ships to move in and begin consuming the biomass off the world. Then, exterminatus the planet and burn off the atmosphere, destroying all tyranid mass on the planet, refusing to them the spoils of further biomass, and hopefully killing the hive ships that siphon the biomass off as the atmosphere erupts.
You don't win against the tyranids. You lose real big, and hope they lose even bigger.
It's a war of attrition against a foe that breeds by eating your losses and pooping out more of your enemies. So destroy the biomass in your wake as you retreat and literally starve them out.
To defeat the Necrons, you would need to make a devise that can nullyfy and destroy any psychically linked being.
Think of some kind of Psydestroyer from Starcraft 2.Tyrranids are inherently psychich and so anti warp weaponry should work on them.
A bioweapon that made Plague Marines sick? Whoa.
@@MSte21 there is at least in 3 different mentions of it in the codex and novels so yeah if they can make a plague marine fall ill then i don think the necrons can be any different .
Hey Wolf Lord Rho, what do you think will come of Fabien reading the book of “emperor Sanguinius” from the library of Ptolemy?
Want way back on this one
necrons fighting tyranids storys is needed.
You know I just realized that the last Chaos God is the Tyranid Hivemind Itself.
I like to think the last Old One to escape the Enslavers mutated himself into the hive mind and are wiping the slate clean to becalm the Warp.
@@rogerbrownreacts8528 That Sounds like a champion gone wrong to me…
might be time to use some of that banned AI again....
Kryptman is a poster boy for good ideas, terrible execution:
"deny the Tyranids biomass - exterminatus a planet" = or you could just atl. try to bleed tyranids on the planet, and when it's lost, when hive ship is in orbit and ready slurp the sweet, sweet biomass from the planet, blow it up - denying the new biomass, and damaging it's own.
"make our enemies fight - sic an orcs' at 'em" = or just atl. try to throw the to the warp - tyranids just'll lose biomass, since warp-spawn doesn't have any, and chaos forces have another enemies to worry about.
If I knew about about the tyriands as much as Kryptmen(I apologize if I spelled it wrong) I would give them no more than one or two days to evacuate the planet before killing everything on the planet. Otherwise I would agree with Venris.
o O (wondering when someone will come up with the 40k equivalent of a HALO Array to solve the titanic problem...)
😶
In the bat-shit-insanity that is 40K (a galaxy populated by BDSM Space Elves, Egyptian robots and Cockney Mushroom-Orks), the Tyranids are far and away the most ridiculous.
Could the tyranids assimilate a primarch into their hive mind?
They could make one superTyrannid.
Honestlynthe only way the imperium can make a lasting victory against the Nids... is to tag in the Necrons.
If I lived in WH and I had one wish from a genie to get rid of one faction, it'd be the Tyrannids. Hands down. Those guys? Total jerks. I mean, seriously.
Custodes should not be allowed within light years of Tyranids.
Wolf lorddddddd!! Let’s goo 👌👾
First to watch this video (and comment)
nice
Kryptman went a little exterminatus crazy and went into hiding because all it did was make the nids and orks stronger.
FIRST WOOOO LOL
Mc Neal is awful. 2nd book into horus heresey one of easily the worst.