+MalogorLP Yep, same. It would also be nice if it was mandatory to watch a teambuilding guide before going into competitive games. Because I am tired of that Torbjorn/Widowmaker/Hanzo wombocombo on offense.
This is what actually happens. For example at Numbani, Reinhardt chats "Hey guys let's defend at the 2nd floor", and pings position. And nobody listens.. nobody. Most of them jumps around near the enemy spawn and dies in a few seconds.
BLESS YOUR SOUL FOR MAKING THIS VIDEO.... You know how many times Ive spammed "group up" to people who literally want to be on the enemy spawn... *sobs* For the Love of all that is Good, DEFEND THE POINT, NOT THEIR SPAWN!
Half the people that spam "group up" at the start of a match are in weak positions. Try getting on the mic and being a person in your team's eyes instead of just a command spammer.
fashnek Some people don't have mics, and in my current position, I can't mic without having annoying background sounds that most people would turn off their voice channels at... I would definitely if I could. I have been saying group up less though on consoles it's hard to communicate otherwise. On console, when you spam group up, I usually translate that as, get to the payload/point or don't over extend, not really "Come to me". If I'm dead I especially use it to say that we need to come together, but I've been trying to spam less because, yeah, it doesn't get read after a little while. There isn't much you can do though when you don't have a keyboard or a mic....
For the case of "get to the payload/point", look at the objective HUD marker and use the "Acknowledge" command. It will literally tell the team to go to attack/defend/push the objective. So that will help. As a healer, you can also look at players and use the "Need healing" command and it will tell the player to come to you for healing.
***** I haven't tried it personally. And in looking it up, it looks like it only works if you key-bind the functions. Search the Web for "4f2zc8" and "4qmgeo" and "20745205724" for people talking about it. So maybe it doesn't exist on consoles -- that's really dumb.
This is an amazing and pretty powerful guide! I've been scared to tank some of these because I wasn't sure where I should be. This is fantastic! Thank you sir.
IIII would argue it is almost entirely dependent on the character you're playing as. I dunno what the hell a Reinhardt or Winston will do when they're 30 feet off the ground and out of the way.
Me too. The important thing to ask is how often you see people *successfully* defend them, because from my experience it's usually a bloodbath for the defense.
Mechalith you cannot defend those areas, unless the opposite team is absolute garbage but 99.9% of the time you will always lose defending out of position why do people think they can out damage the enemy team they can sit in spawn poking damage at you and you cannot do anything back
15Productionz I know, that's what I said. The defending team gets blown into chunky salsa virtually every time, and the .01% exception is when the other team is a batch of stumbling asshats you could have beaten with half your team standing around AFK anyway.
This should be required watching for anyone who plays overwatch. Thank you for making it. Also can you make a followup video showing how to attack these points.
I agree, but sometimes you really can get a minute by spawnkilling them. The bad thing is that you aren't allowed to die, because then you'll need to much time to come back.
And the problem is that you're going to die. Especially because on many maps they can shoot you without even coming out of the spawn which keeps them healed. Even if that doesn't happen they can shoot and dash back to that infinite health pack we call the spawn door. Ask your self this, do you want to fight an enemy standing near 100 health packs that only they can use? If not, don't fight near the spawn. If you're winning near the spawn your team would win regardless.
You should seriously consider updating this video for the more recently released maps. I find your content very informative and would love to see your thoughts on defending Blizzard World and Junkertown and the likes.
ive had one game where someone else knew to stand on big earls and not at their spawn. I think route 66 is one of the worst maps when it comes to people knowing where to defend.
No one wants to wait around and give up half of the first checkpoint. It's hard to get an uncoordinated non-expert team to believe that you will make up the time with an advantage during attack if the enemy team posts too far up. It's about experience at high levels. If people haven't seen it a lot and they're not used to it, then it's not likely to take hold.
Hey Unit Lost! Great video. I've found a lot of players don't pay attention to the layout of the maps and the natural choke points. I noticed you didn't cover the right-side flank of the first choke on Volskaya Industries. That's a pretty easy flank for most heroes to use and highly effective if left unchecked. Keep it up
This is probably my favorite video you have done Stylosa. It's very informative and content rich, not very much filler and verbose word spam. Great job.
Looking at these defensive point makes me kinda sad sometimes I have to admit. Look at how whole areas of maps are basically a useless mass of pixels, because they are not beneficial to hold. Hanamura first point for example. The whole part between the attackers spawn and the gate is basically useless. It only exists so the attackers have to walk too the choke. None of the side routes are any relevant. Makes me wonder why those parts of the map even exist.
They are actually very good spots to hide in as a defending Reaper. 10 seconds after the start of the map and you are already in the backline of the enemy team. You can get like a support or two before they realise what's going on, charging your ultimate in the process, and then just "Shift" to safety.
Night Burn against bad teams that dont communicate. say you get 2 kills and then they kill you. the 2 you killed will be back with their team in 10 seconds, while it will take you 30. congrats you lost the point for 2 kills.
On Numbani in a solo-q comp match, we made it to the second point, but one of the players on the team had internet problems and disconnected. We switched to defending and one of the members wanted to defend right at their spawn. when we lost the point very quickly they blamed me for wanting to defend on point. It was so frustrating.
Attacking properly is moving as a group with a decent comp, combo-ing ults, and communication. Defense is harder and more important because if your whole team doesn't defend at the same choke or if they over-extend or if they do anything that is different than what the team as a whole needs to do to defend, then the attack can just bust through. On Attack it's more so intuitive what you're trying to do and how you're going to do it. As long as you make decisions as a group, everyone on attack should honestly just fall into their roles and most of the time you'll be fine.
This video explains all the good attack routes. It explains which points are going to be hardest to break, therefore that's where you should use your ults. Shows the flank routes and which routes you can take in order to take advantage of a bad defense. Just watch the video thinking from the perspective of an attacker. That being said he probably will make a how to attack video.
This video was quite informative for me. Showed me why I have difficult times on some maps, compared to others. I hope you keep doing stuff like this. Overwatch is one of those games where I really want to continually improve my skills on.
This guide was an immense help! I've just recently picked up the game and I've got the game's basics down but this really pushed me to actually plan a bit more about my attack. And for that, I thank you!
Outstanding video. As a newer player still learning this sort of thing is *immensely* valuable. I do end up on Rein a lot and I'm going to base my defence around the areas you suggest. I realize this just changes the place where I'll die alone in solo queues, but good practice and who knows, maybe some people will actually make use of my shield and we'll do better :). Thanks so much for posting this.
Love these kinda vids! Your map guides are what first led me to your channel. You should definitely finish that series so you have individual guides of all the maps up.
Before people play competitive, can it be a requirement for people to watch this video? Actually put it in the game and say "before playing comp, you're required to watch this video" ("so you're not a complete moron") it doesn't add on. I hardly play comp, but I see mistakes, and people don't want to listen. :\
Love this video, made me play better straight away. I thought I knew the chokes but I didn't know how important high ground was and the firing angles through the corners.
That's the problem I've been having. When I try to suggest different strats or what have you I get greeted with "It's only quick play" then my team quickly proceeds to s**t themselves
This is really good. I've always wondered where I'm supposed to stand sometimes on these maps. I realize people don't play builders as much but having a video on where to put Turrets and Sentries as the builder classes would be awesome too. Thanks for the video.
This is exactly the type of video I have been looking for. You certainly have experience with this game. Please make more videos like this! Very helpful
Personally, I think Zarya is a little overpowered. I find myself steamrolling through choke points and getting massive charge momentum. In some games, I think I'd be stupid not to play Zarya because she just works so efficiently.
Nooraldeen Hasan Yeah but zarya is used more like a support than a tank, stand back and farm shield / spam right click until u have ult to use with someone else.
I agree with all of this, great stuff. Another quick tip. When defending from on top of Big Earls, you can contest the payload without jumping down. This is really strong as Reinhardt and almost forces the attack to flank up.
So glad you made this video hopefully allot more people will discover how the maps are meant to be played. Rather then just throwing matches through overextention over and over again
Attacking is the easy part. If they don't defend properly and you move as a team, just kill them and don't die, communicate with your team on when to push in, and coordinate ults. If they do defend these chokes properly, do the exact same things as I said before, except maybe focus on taking out supports and breaking Rein's shield
+Islarf If you're uncoordinated and don't communicate then yes you will get shit on, on that map. There hasnt been one time on Eichen where I havent taken the first point unless my team is anti-social tards playing a social team game.
Great vid! On Hollywood after the opposing team gets the payload a really great place to setup is on the roof of the Saloon facing the giant doors that they'll be coming through. You've got much better line of sight on the enemy, you're much closer to your spawn point and because you can see them much further out you've got a lot of time to take down anyone that tries to get up close and personal. It's a really solid defense all around try it out sometime.
Great vid. I've destroyed teams single handed from that shuttle spot as Junkrat before. I was the only one up there and for some reason their hitscans were not shooting at me, just their Zen who I killed mercilessly over and over again.
Seen so many teams smash it in defense only to fall apart doing attack.. ..a big area for improvement with a lot of players is learning how to counter defense strats.
Because of the dynamics of the first push. Its the only time anyone is playing together during that game. When they defend that and you have people who start trickling its usually bye bye game.
The 'ch' in Eichenwald(e) isn't pronounced like a 'k', its a Sound not used in english, which sounds like a cat hissing. would be great if more People say it right, because even Athena/announcer doesnt get it accurate.
Actually you're wrong about CH not being used, there are a few words that make use of it one of them you even used in your comment "whiCH". And this comment will probably make me look like a smartass.
Like you said, the sound isn't in English so it isn't pronounced like that in English, I'm German and say it correctly but all of my friends call me stupid ;-;
So you want people to pronounce a sound they don't know? Ziemlich dämlich. Blizzard appended the "E" at the end, which deviates from the german notation.
Really good video. i played some rankeds with my friends (platinium levels) but we always felt against experimentate players. With your video every new team can have an easy acces to strategies and i enjoy this. Thank you dude
Great video, very informative. I've missed the importance of high ground I believe so it's good to see strong positions. I'd love to see some similar strategy type videos for control maps as well
@Unit Lost - Great British Gaming : You can use a D.Va, Winston, Genji, Pharah, Mercy, and Lucio on attack for the first point at least, and your whole team can flank and get around the back or over top the roofs. For Winston though, you have to go over the building in front of your spawn because Winston's jet pack can't get the distance or be able to wrap around the right side.
The double-corner choke-points (S-curves, dog-legs) are great because not only is the enemy coming around a corner, allowing you first shot, but you're generally standing next to your own corner so you can grab cover and get healed if you start taking heavy fire. Several other positions like Big Earl's have similar cover (e.g., the Big Earl's sign). Your supports can't do good work if you won't stop getting shot for a few seconds!
"Oh, there's a bird!" Found that hilarious for some reason. In all seriousness though, super helpful video. I've never realized how important using the high ground truly is. I echo the requests for an assault version of this.
Lots of good info, including a number of spots I either hadn't considered or have seen virtually every team I've been on try to hold and get obliterated but didn't have a good alternative in mind.
With all due respect, what is your Overwatch Rank and competitive score? If it is higher than Stylosa's then you have a valid argument but if it is lower, then what you are saying isn't valid and you should probably listen to what he is saying
The idea is that, if you move in closer on the points he says to avoid, they'll kill you and then they'll end up moving the payload much farther in the long run while you're waiting to respawn, waiting to run back, etc. It's more effective in the long-term (i.e. over an entire game) to use these points than to constantly be trying to contest the payload.
You do indeed. You LET them push the payload... until they get to the choke. Because the thing is, it doesn't matter if they get the payload up to that point. Remember, there is a limit on how fast the payload can be pushed, and holding further back means that in order for them to get the payload to where you're setting up, they'll have to push for a while. That means you get that much extra time to get the whole team together and set up properly on the high ground and every hero on your team gets to pick out the best spot for that particular hero. Then, as they get to the choke point, everyone on your team is able to instantly rain fire down on them as soon as they come around the corner, whereas they have to either keep peeking around the corner and fire up at you (much harder to do), or try to push through despite all the damage coming at them, which is likely to result in you winning. Yes, you let them push the payload up that far, but because you have so much extra time to set up and because you are now closer to your spawn than they are to theirs, you will have the advantage in almost every single fight. What would you prefer? Holding way up close to their spawn in order to try and make sure the payload doesn't go far? Because then they have an insane spawn time advantage. You kill one of them and they're back in a few seconds. They kill one of you and that person has to walk all the way back from your spawn, while in the meantime they now have a numbers advantage on you. Basically, what would you rather do? Go right up and try to stop the payload from moving and bank on winning every single fight, or take a strategic and positional advantage in such a way that you're that much more likely to win every fight?
With all due respect, you don't seem to have played a lot of the game... If you play a lot you will notice that there are certain map areas were is just generally tough to defend and you end up just feeding the enemy team. So the idea of "giving them time to move the payload" doesnt really exist, cuz you will be dead and they are going to move anyway. On the other hand, there are areas where its easier to defend and you can actually take advantage of the enemy team that way. These are called choke points.
Highrise at 18:55 is just perfect fo Rein + Bastion combo. I had far more games on 66 where atackers got stuck on the 1st bridge right at spawn rather than on Big Earl's. Same for Dorado the long tunnel after 1st check is extreemly tough to push trough. May be different for premade vs premade games tough. I do not think defending close to enemy spawn is bad. The key is to know when to fall back and to not let them wipe you.
Great video! I really enjoyed the light music in the background, makes Overwatch seem kind of fancy. I will from here on now hold out my pinky out when I drink PBR while playing Overwatch.
Very VERY helpful ! Thank you very much ! It's often counter-intuitive to let the attackers walk freely during the first seconds of the game. And most of the time, when playing on quick match, everyone rushes (so you tend to follow, especially if you're a tank or a healer). Now I know how to proceed and I'll make sure I do it ;-)
So to sum up, all the control points/payload checkpoints have a strong choke right before/on top of them and it's the height of folly to try to defend right after a control point/payload checkpoint. Also that "fallback" position on King's Row first point actually just saved my game. We set up a D.Va, Reinhardt, Bastion, Lucio, and a couple others on the point and in that little nook between the flank house and the first payload door.
Loved this video, Stylosa. For some this is obvious, but for others it obviously isn't considering the number of people I see NOT using the high ground. I'd love to see a tactics video on KotH maps.
Hey Sty, this video is great and super helpful. Unfortunately, it's almost always the case that I find myself in teams where no one else has really bothered to watch tactic videos like yours so they're defending at all the spots you say to never defend at (even people who have tons of play time). I wish it was more well-known that winning games isn't all about kill steaks, perfect ults, or luck and is really about teamwork, positioning, and good composition.
I think defense is very situational. It is meant to be dynamic by design. Yes, there are key chokepoints on every map which you do a great job of describing. But, there have been MANY times in my experience where my team has won matches defending right on the payload or objective AND even on their spawn point. When you can no longer hold that position THEN you simply fall back to the first choke point. A good example of this strategy is the spawn point in Dorado.
Love these vids. Unfortunately, on low-level games (which I play), people tend to run on suicide missions all by themselves so it's really hard to take advantage of all-team strategies.
One thing that only I seem to be aware of is that at 22:46 the little windows over that gate can actually be shot through. an attacking pharah or soldier or whatever can really hurt a team all stuck up on the top of the tower. I only ever use it if we get stuck there because normally we jsut plow straight through to the bridge
Hey sty, Thank you for this video. When I started playing Overwatch, I had no idea what to do, and now I feel like I can make a difference in the out-come of the game. Thank you, ans stay awesome
as much as i wanted to hate this as I know most of this info i really enjoyed this good job. The music is very calming but at the same time helps the with pace of the video
I wish this video were mandatory to watch before you entered competitive. It sure would save me a lot of frustration.
I thought exactly the same thing ...
I wish it was mandatory to have played on Eichenwalde a few times. I had matches in which teammates didn't know what to do and where to go...
+MalogorLP Yep, same. It would also be nice if it was mandatory to watch a teambuilding guide before going into competitive games. Because I am tired of that Torbjorn/Widowmaker/Hanzo wombocombo on offense.
was*
@Austrian Carper That combo will never work without a Symmetra to back them up!
This is what actually happens.
For example at Numbani, Reinhardt chats "Hey guys let's defend at the 2nd floor", and pings position.
And nobody listens.. nobody.
Most of them jumps around near the enemy spawn and dies in a few seconds.
so true
+Pla Bonga It's the worst man. When you see that you know that you've lost the point before the match even starts.
As a Reinhardt main, i know what ya' talking about.
then you may have an amazing voice because that never works for me either
no i mean i get flat out messaged no by the team, they hear me they just don't
Take a shot every time he says "Let's say you've lost this"
That said, great video
*Dies*
"highground"
challenge accepted. see you on the other side
"You wanna SMASH them with damage"
pokemen go sucks
BLESS YOUR SOUL FOR MAKING THIS VIDEO....
You know how many times Ive spammed "group up" to people who literally want to be on the enemy spawn... *sobs*
For the Love of all that is Good, DEFEND THE POINT, NOT THEIR SPAWN!
Half the people that spam "group up" at the start of a match are in weak positions. Try getting on the mic and being a person in your team's eyes instead of just a command spammer.
fashnek Some people don't have mics, and in my current position, I can't mic without having annoying background sounds that most people would turn off their voice channels at... I would definitely if I could.
I have been saying group up less though on consoles it's hard to communicate otherwise.
On console, when you spam group up, I usually translate that as, get to the payload/point or don't over extend, not really "Come to me". If I'm dead I especially use it to say that we need to come together, but I've been trying to spam less because, yeah, it doesn't get read after a little while. There isn't much you can do though when you don't have a keyboard or a mic....
For the case of "get to the payload/point", look at the objective HUD marker and use the "Acknowledge" command. It will literally tell the team to go to attack/defend/push the objective. So that will help.
As a healer, you can also look at players and use the "Need healing" command and it will tell the player to come to you for healing.
fashnek Can you do this on console??? I tried doing it and it didn't work?
***** I haven't tried it personally. And in looking it up, it looks like it only works if you key-bind the functions. Search the Web for "4f2zc8" and "4qmgeo" and "20745205724" for people talking about it. So maybe it doesn't exist on consoles -- that's really dumb.
now if only i can get randoms to listen to me and do this
I struggle just to get my friends to do this xd
Same, people really don't understand the high ground advantage... -_-
I don't think lately even a single random has ever understood it when I said it.
The sad part is some people will say, "Then just get some friends to play with" as a response to this comment
PS4 gamertag "jonesherbs" hit me up i play smart and crank jokes whilst
This is an amazing and pretty powerful guide! I've been scared to tank some of these because I wasn't sure where I should be. This is fantastic! Thank you sir.
So to sum up: Wait for them to come around the corner... then SMASH them!
dont forget to also drop down onto them
24:21 That bird though. Absolutely ridiculous!
What do you do when 98℅ of the people in your rank bracket think low ground is advantageous?
You bang your head against a wall
+Serdoma Gaming That technique is probably what addled their brains enough for them to think this in the first place...
^
IIII would argue it is almost entirely dependent on the character you're playing as. I dunno what the hell a Reinhardt or Winston will do when they're 30 feet off the ground and out of the way.
I try to tell my team that all the time but they never listen so I just join them.
I'm alright at Overwatch, I've clocked about ninety hours, but this video still had me like "Oh..."
funny, the areas he said to ignore is where i see people defend
funny, the areas he said to ignore is where i see people always defend
that's cuz some people aren't too smart.
Me too. The important thing to ask is how often you see people *successfully* defend them, because from my experience it's usually a bloodbath for the defense.
Mechalith you cannot defend those areas, unless the opposite team is absolute garbage but 99.9% of the time you will always lose defending out of position why do people think they can out damage the enemy team they can sit in spawn poking damage at you and you cannot do anything back
15Productionz I know, that's what I said. The defending team gets blown into chunky salsa virtually every time, and the .01% exception is when the other team is a batch of stumbling asshats you could have beaten with half your team standing around AFK anyway.
This should be required watching for anyone who plays overwatch. Thank you for making it. Also can you make a followup video showing how to attack these points.
Awesome vid very informative. I'm always trying to tell my team not to defend at the spawn but am often ignored because noobs know best...
Agreed
I agree, but sometimes you really can get a minute by spawnkilling them. The bad thing is that you aren't allowed to die, because then you'll need to much time to come back.
And the problem is that you're going to die. Especially because on many maps they can shoot you without even coming out of the spawn which keeps them healed. Even if that doesn't happen they can shoot and dash back to that infinite health pack we call the spawn door.
Ask your self this, do you want to fight an enemy standing near 100 health packs that only they can use? If not, don't fight near the spawn.
If you're winning near the spawn your team would win regardless.
You should seriously consider updating this video for the more recently released maps. I find your content very informative and would love to see your thoughts on defending Blizzard World and Junkertown and the likes.
ive had one game where someone else knew to stand on big earls and not at their spawn. I think route 66 is one of the worst maps when it comes to people knowing where to defend.
No one wants to wait around and give up half of the first checkpoint. It's hard to get an uncoordinated non-expert team to believe that you will make up the time with an advantage during attack if the enemy team posts too far up. It's about experience at high levels. If people haven't seen it a lot and they're not used to it, then it's not likely to take hold.
Hey Unit Lost! Great video. I've found a lot of players don't pay attention to the layout of the maps and the natural choke points. I noticed you didn't cover the right-side flank of the first choke on Volskaya Industries. That's a pretty easy flank for most heroes to use and highly effective if left unchecked.
Keep it up
Can somebody say me how to defend the training area? :,(
It's hard man, you need a really good team comp and communication
I so hope everybody playing this game will watch that. Thank you Stylosa
+Elias Walker go away
Hey stylosa do you know Zylbrad?Cause he always talk about you in his videos.
he playd with him a few times
+Sluff yeah😄
+Adam Hasson oh. Thanks for telling.
Talks*
silvosa :P
This is probably my favorite video you have done Stylosa. It's very informative and content rich, not very much filler and verbose word spam. Great job.
Looking at these defensive point makes me kinda sad sometimes I have to admit.
Look at how whole areas of maps are basically a useless mass of pixels, because they are not beneficial to hold. Hanamura first point for example. The whole part between the attackers spawn and the gate is basically useless. It only exists so the attackers have to walk too the choke. None of the side routes are any relevant. Makes me wonder why those parts of the map even exist.
For flankers like Tracer and Genji so they can take out the attackers support and other squishy heroes.
i understand but i prefer maps with this clean and enjoyable graphic than a simple tunnel that brings u to the "fight point"
luckily theres a whole other team that isnt defending the choke points that make use of those areas.
They are actually very good spots to hide in as a defending Reaper. 10 seconds after the start of the map and you are already in the backline of the enemy team. You can get like a support or two before they realise what's going on, charging your ultimate in the process, and then just "Shift" to safety.
Night Burn against bad teams that dont communicate. say you get 2 kills and then they kill you. the 2 you killed will be back with their team in 10 seconds, while it will take you 30. congrats you lost the point for 2 kills.
About half of these positions, I have never even once seen my team use in hundreds of games. I will see if I can get them to work.
On Numbani in a solo-q comp match, we made it to the second point, but one of the players on the team had internet problems and disconnected. We switched to defending and one of the members wanted to defend right at their spawn. when we lost the point very quickly they blamed me for wanting to defend on point. It was so frustrating.
That sucks man
they just wanted to blame someone other than them. I'm sure they were low ranks or just dumb. but that sucks though.
Its Vaylr yeah, I went on a losing spree, now I'm in the lower gold ranks.
Get a group of friends together. Not many people in solo queue like to work together, but having a set team changes everything.
Timothy Kaemmerer Yeah, I'd love to do that. I just don't have any friends who are as obsessed with Overwatch as I am.
I watch most if not all your videos man. This is far and away the most informative video you've produced. I learned SO much. thanks very much.
so im guessing you'll make one on how to attack properly. right?
Attacking properly is moving as a group with a decent comp, combo-ing ults, and communication.
Defense is harder and more important because if your whole team doesn't defend at the same choke or if they over-extend or if they do anything that is different than what the team as a whole needs to do to defend, then the attack can just bust through. On Attack it's more so intuitive what you're trying to do and how you're going to do it. As long as you make decisions as a group, everyone on attack should honestly just fall into their roles and most of the time you'll be fine.
***** thanks i suppose fam
This video explains all the good attack routes. It explains which points are going to be hardest to break, therefore that's where you should use your ults. Shows the flank routes and which routes you can take in order to take advantage of a bad defense. Just watch the video thinking from the perspective of an attacker.
That being said he probably will make a how to attack video.
Watch and learn both guides for superb draw games!!!
he did a few days ago
This video was quite informative for me. Showed me why I have difficult times on some maps, compared to others. I hope you keep doing stuff like this. Overwatch is one of those games where I really want to continually improve my skills on.
so sad no one in low ranks do this, so annoying and really hard to climb up in ranking...
This guide was an immense help! I've just recently picked up the game and I've got the game's basics down but this really pushed me to actually plan a bit more about my attack. And for that, I thank you!
What if your team is full of hanzo mains, torb mains and supports that go 1v6?
Ignore the Hanzo mains. Praise the Torb mains. And stand in awe at the might of the attack supports.
You should make an updated version of this video to cover all the new characters and changes that came to Overwatch!
he has the most entertaining voice
Outstanding video. As a newer player still learning this sort of thing is *immensely* valuable. I do end up on Rein a lot and I'm going to base my defence around the areas you suggest. I realize this just changes the place where I'll die alone in solo queues, but good practice and who knows, maybe some people will actually make use of my shield and we'll do better :). Thanks so much for posting this.
This video should be played before every match for the ones that dont know how to play.
Wow, this is the best video of its kind (that I've seen). You move through a lot of information quickly, but its very clearly articulated.
You mean, standing 1 meter in front of the attacker spawn is not defending? Have you heard, Hanzo Main #4980?
My smurf is called xHanzoGodX#21490 and i approve this message
Love these kinda vids! Your map guides are what first led me to your channel. You should definitely finish that series so you have individual guides of all the maps up.
Before people play competitive, can it be a requirement for people to watch this video? Actually put it in the game and say "before playing comp, you're required to watch this video" ("so you're not a complete moron") it doesn't add on. I hardly play comp, but I see mistakes, and people don't want to listen. :\
Love this video, made me play better straight away. I thought I knew the chokes but I didn't know how important high ground was and the firing angles through the corners.
the sad thing is, no one will do this in solo q quick play
That's the problem I've been having. When I try to suggest different strats or what have you I get greeted with "It's only quick play" then my team quickly proceeds to s**t themselves
Sportaciss well not trying to be rude but it’s quickplay. If you want to be serious about the game try competitive
This is really good. I've always wondered where I'm supposed to stand sometimes on these maps. I realize people don't play builders as much but having a video on where to put Turrets and Sentries as the builder classes would be awesome too. Thanks for the video.
why is the word gullible always in the description
Well, fell for that one....
Why is this hilarious and original comment on every video.
Where?
Almost fell for it
LIKE A DAMN FIDDLE
This is exactly the type of video I have been looking for. You certainly have experience with this game. Please make more videos like this! Very helpful
20:56 BEEN HERE ALL ALONG
Was actually an extremely helpful vid, didn't think i'd watch even half of it but now i hope you make more like this.
Personally, I think Zarya is a little overpowered. I find myself steamrolling through choke points and getting massive charge momentum. In some games, I think I'd be stupid not to play Zarya because she just works so efficiently.
Zarya is op until you get past low ranks and the reapers / mccrees actually hit your head.
In some cases, even the steps you say you could take to stop a dive comp just struggle to stop the momentum of the initial push.
I guess you are correct, but in higher levels Zarya is just more coordinated and aware with the help of her teammates, it just makes her even better.
Nooraldeen Hasan Yeah but zarya is used more like a support than a tank, stand back and farm shield / spam right click until u have ult to use with someone else.
+Filip Henriksson OK, thanks for the advice
I agree with all of this, great stuff. Another quick tip. When defending from on top of Big Earls, you can contest the payload without jumping down. This is really strong as Reinhardt and almost forces the attack to flank up.
I think the problem with the payload maps is that everyone seems to have forgotten where it is......
So glad you made this video hopefully allot more people will discover how the maps are meant to be played. Rather then just throwing matches through overextention over and over again
can you do a how to attack all chokes?
Attacking is the easy part. If they don't defend properly and you move as a team, just kill them and don't die, communicate with your team on when to push in, and coordinate ults. If they do defend these chokes properly, do the exact same things as I said before, except maybe focus on taking out supports and breaking Rein's shield
***** except when youre on eichenwalde. that map is stupid on offence. the first point is impossible to take
+Islarf If you're uncoordinated and don't communicate then yes you will get shit on, on that map. There hasnt been one time on Eichen where I havent taken the first point unless my team is anti-social tards playing a social team game.
Acor i have been. but it just takes 1 junkrat to cancel the entire push.
+Cole Santora Don't mix up simple and easy. It's only arguably /easy/ to understand, since the overall plan is /simple/.
Great vid!
On Hollywood after the opposing team gets the payload a really great place to setup is on the roof of the Saloon facing the giant doors that they'll be coming through. You've got much better line of sight on the enemy, you're much closer to your spawn point and because you can see them much further out you've got a lot of time to take down anyone that tries to get up close and personal. It's a really solid defense all around try it out sometime.
Really really good vid. Hope scrubs will see this! D:
Great vid. I've destroyed teams single handed from that shuttle spot as Junkrat before. I was the only one up there and for some reason their hitscans were not shooting at me, just their Zen who I killed mercilessly over and over again.
Defending is far easier than attacking capture points in solo queue.
Seen so many teams smash it in defense only to fall apart doing attack.. ..a big area for improvement with a lot of players is learning how to counter defense strats.
No, the new hotness is 3 tanks; 3 healers!
Because of the dynamics of the first push. Its the only time anyone is playing together during that game. When they defend that and you have people who start trickling its usually bye bye game.
This was EXTREMELY helpful. This type of knowledge will help my game and I'm glad Overwatch Central linked me here. Keep it up good sir.
The 'ch' in Eichenwald(e) isn't pronounced like a 'k', its a Sound not used in english, which sounds like a cat hissing. would be great if more People say it right, because even Athena/announcer doesnt get it accurate.
Is it a shh?
Actually you're wrong about CH not being used, there are a few words that make use of it one of them you even used in your comment "whiCH". And this comment will probably make me look like a smartass.
Like you said, the sound isn't in English so it isn't pronounced like that in English, I'm German and say it correctly but all of my friends call me stupid ;-;
So you want people to pronounce a sound they don't know? Ziemlich dämlich. Blizzard appended the "E" at the end, which deviates from the german notation.
i thought school was an english word :/
Really good video. i played some rankeds with my friends (platinium levels) but we always felt against experimentate players. With your video every new team can have an easy acces to strategies and i enjoy this. Thank you dude
this is a quick video. looks a the time: 25 minutes
So long story short:
"It's over Anakin! I have the high ground!"
Anyway, great video Sty as always. :D
I see peoples always trying to defend on wierd positions
on Route 66. Some peoples go standing on the payload and trying to defend :D
Great video, very informative. I've missed the importance of high ground I believe so it's good to see strong positions. I'd love to see some similar strategy type videos for control maps as well
RIP scrub teams that will never use this information.
@Unit Lost - Great British Gaming : You can use a D.Va, Winston, Genji, Pharah, Mercy, and Lucio on attack for the first point at least, and your whole team can flank and get around the back or over top the roofs. For Winston though, you have to go over the building in front of your spawn because Winston's jet pack can't get the distance or be able to wrap around the right side.
Are you talking about Eichenwalde first point?
Yep.
Hate people who says "Early 320p YAY". Something with it that makes me want to bang my head in to the wall.
Is that a pro genji?
360*
+LowEloPlayer 360NoScope**
That moment when the replies get more likes the the original comment
The double-corner choke-points (S-curves, dog-legs) are great because not only is the enemy coming around a corner, allowing you first shot, but you're generally standing next to your own corner so you can grab cover and get healed if you start taking heavy fire. Several other positions like Big Earl's have similar cover (e.g., the Big Earl's sign). Your supports can't do good work if you won't stop getting shot for a few seconds!
24:21 :D
"Oh, there's a bird!" Found that hilarious for some reason. In all seriousness though, super helpful video. I've never realized how important using the high ground truly is. I echo the requests for an assault version of this.
Actually this is horribly wrong! You should be trying to spawn camp them as Widow, Hanzo, Rein and Soldier. I think I am right, I am rank 1300
Lots of good info, including a number of spots I either hadn't considered or have seen virtually every team I've been on try to hold and get obliterated but didn't have a good alternative in mind.
I don't like these tips! Seems wrong. Giving them so much time to move the payload.
There's a reason why it's called Defensive Choke Points.
With all due respect, what is your Overwatch Rank and competitive score? If it is higher than Stylosa's then you have a valid argument but if it is lower, then what you are saying isn't valid and you should probably listen to what he is saying
The idea is that, if you move in closer on the points he says to avoid, they'll kill you and then they'll end up moving the payload much farther in the long run while you're waiting to respawn, waiting to run back, etc. It's more effective in the long-term (i.e. over an entire game) to use these points than to constantly be trying to contest the payload.
You do indeed. You LET them push the payload... until they get to the choke. Because the thing is, it doesn't matter if they get the payload up to that point. Remember, there is a limit on how fast the payload can be pushed, and holding further back means that in order for them to get the payload to where you're setting up, they'll have to push for a while. That means you get that much extra time to get the whole team together and set up properly on the high ground and every hero on your team gets to pick out the best spot for that particular hero. Then, as they get to the choke point, everyone on your team is able to instantly rain fire down on them as soon as they come around the corner, whereas they have to either keep peeking around the corner and fire up at you (much harder to do), or try to push through despite all the damage coming at them, which is likely to result in you winning. Yes, you let them push the payload up that far, but because you have so much extra time to set up and because you are now closer to your spawn than they are to theirs, you will have the advantage in almost every single fight.
What would you prefer? Holding way up close to their spawn in order to try and make sure the payload doesn't go far? Because then they have an insane spawn time advantage. You kill one of them and they're back in a few seconds. They kill one of you and that person has to walk all the way back from your spawn, while in the meantime they now have a numbers advantage on you. Basically, what would you rather do? Go right up and try to stop the payload from moving and bank on winning every single fight, or take a strategic and positional advantage in such a way that you're that much more likely to win every fight?
With all due respect, you don't seem to have played a lot of the game... If you play a lot you will notice that there are certain map areas were is just generally tough to defend and you end up just feeding the enemy team. So the idea of "giving them time to move the payload" doesnt really exist, cuz you will be dead and they are going to move anyway.
On the other hand, there are areas where its easier to defend and you can actually take advantage of the enemy team that way. These are called choke points.
Great video - thanks for sharing this and I really hope more people get onto the teamcentric style of playing that you push.
Now this is the Unit Lost I once was subscribed for.
As a Reinhardt main I do find this helpful. It'll help me organize my teams defense. Thank you Stylosa!
Highrise at 18:55 is just perfect fo Rein + Bastion combo. I had far more games on 66 where atackers got stuck on the 1st bridge right at spawn rather than on Big Earl's. Same for Dorado the long tunnel after 1st check is extreemly tough to push trough. May be different for premade vs premade games tough.
I do not think defending close to enemy spawn is bad. The key is to know when to fall back and to not let them wipe you.
I would love to see more videos like this. Especially flanking routes/defensive positioning for flankers in the setup phase.
Awesome vid, applied this and noticed better positioning play personally (despite solo queue). Thx!
Map awareness is so important like I've only played eichenwalde this weekend trying to remember all the pack locations and pathways
Great video! I really enjoyed the light music in the background, makes Overwatch seem kind of fancy. I will from here on now hold out my pinky out when I drink PBR while playing Overwatch.
This helped me see a lot of things I was doing wrong on maps where I traditionally struggle. Thanks Sty!
Very VERY helpful ! Thank you very much ! It's often counter-intuitive to let the attackers walk freely during the first seconds of the game. And most of the time, when playing on quick match, everyone rushes (so you tend to follow, especially if you're a tank or a healer). Now I know how to proceed and I'll make sure I do it ;-)
So to sum up, all the control points/payload checkpoints have a strong choke right before/on top of them and it's the height of folly to try to defend right after a control point/payload checkpoint.
Also that "fallback" position on King's Row first point actually just saved my game. We set up a D.Va, Reinhardt, Bastion, Lucio, and a couple others on the point and in that little nook between the flank house and the first payload door.
Thanks for making this video, I watched a couple of your strategy videos and they definitely improved my overwatch game :D :D
Very helpful, great work! I was little surprised with the 2nd point on Hanamura, because usually the defending team is all over the place...
Hey, this video is fantastic. I'm sure there's some slightly out of date info, but I think this is going to help me a LOT.
Best defensive positioning video I've found so far.
Loved this video, Stylosa. For some this is obvious, but for others it obviously isn't considering the number of people I see NOT using the high ground. I'd love to see a tactics video on KotH maps.
I just watched a 12 minute ad in the middle of your video because i was too lazy to skip it
you owe me one mate :)that sweet sweet revenue
Helpful thanks. At the lower ranks I find people seem to always rush way too far forward and dismiss my suggestions to setup at a better point.
Hey Sty, this video is great and super helpful. Unfortunately, it's almost always the case that I find myself in teams where no one else has really bothered to watch tactic videos like yours so they're defending at all the spots you say to never defend at (even people who have tons of play time). I wish it was more well-known that winning games isn't all about kill steaks, perfect ults, or luck and is really about teamwork, positioning, and good composition.
I think defense is very situational. It is meant to be dynamic by design. Yes, there are key chokepoints on every map which you do a great job of describing. But, there have been MANY times in my experience where my team has won matches defending right on the payload or objective AND even on their spawn point. When you can no longer hold that position THEN you simply fall back to the first choke point. A good example of this strategy is the spawn point in Dorado.
Can we get a petition to have this video play when you first start playing competitive, it's would help so much
Love these vids. Unfortunately, on low-level games (which I play), people tend to run on suicide missions all by themselves so it's really hard to take advantage of all-team strategies.
Thank you so much for this video. Just yesterday I was wondering where to set up in a few maps and now I know. Thanks
Very useful, there were some spots I was not aware of their usefulness, so thank you.
Watching this I just realized how much detail Blizzard put into their maps. Each map is just so beautiful.
Solid vid! Really helpful thanks! Now it's just a matter of getting all my friends to watch all 25 min of this HAHA
One thing that only I seem to be aware of is that at 22:46 the little windows over that gate can actually be shot through. an attacking pharah or soldier or whatever can really hurt a team all stuck up on the top of the tower. I only ever use it if we get stuck there because normally we jsut plow straight through to the bridge
Hey sty, Thank you for this video. When I started playing Overwatch, I had no idea what to do, and now I feel like I can make a difference in the out-come of the game.
Thank you, ans stay awesome
Loving the lounge music. Talking about murdering the enemy team and taking people out while listening to such calming classy music. Love it.
as much as i wanted to hate this as I know most of this info i really enjoyed this good job. The music is very calming but at the same time helps the with pace of the video
This should almost be called how to defend: The high ground points. Love this vid. Helped this noobie out a lot!