We 'can never win' a war: Taiwan's former president Ma on the best way to deal with China | DW News
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- Опубликовано: 27 июн 2024
- As Taiwan prepares for a knife-edge election, former president Ma Ying-jeou has made a dramatic call for a rethink of Taiwan’s whole approach to the threat of Chinese invasion. In this exclusive DW interview, Ma said attempts to deter China from attacking Taiwan would not work. “No matter how much you defend yourself, you can never fight a war with the mainland. You can never win. They're too large, much stronger than us.”
Ma also cast doubt on whether the United States would come to Taiwan’s aid if China invaded - despite US President Joe Biden repeatedly saying he would do so. Ma added that he believed Taiwan could work with China’s President Xi Jinping and said that “we have to” trust Xi on relations across the Taiwan Strait. Ma called for a return to his friendly approach to China as president from 2008-16. “We should use a non-use of military means to reduce the tension,” he said. Speaking to DW’s Richard Walker and Tsou Tzung-han, Ma blamed Taiwan’s current DPP government for the intense tensions with China. He added that in the long term, “unification” of Taiwan with China might be possible - but only if achieved peacefully and democratically.
Chapters:
00:00 Taiwan's former president Ma Ying-jeou
01:03 WAR AND PEACE
09:09 DETERRING CHINA
11:02 MILITARY SERVICE
11:52 TAIWAN'S DEFENSE SPENDING
14:30 INVASION SCENARIO
16:06 WOULD THE US HELP TAIWAN?
18:30 DIALOG WITH CHINA
20:45 TRUSTING XI JINPING
23:00 UNIFICATION WITH CHINA?
25:10 UNIFICATION VS INDEPENDENCE
26:45 NANCY PELOSI VISIT TO TAIWAN
28:35 CHINA AND THE US: NEW COLD WAR?
30:12 TAIWAN IN THE MIDDLE?
31:28 XI VS STATUS QUO
33:52 CHINAS THREAT OF FORCE
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#Taiwan #China #MaYing-jeou
During Mr. Ma's speech, It always Mainland-Taiwan, and DW guy insists using China-Taiwan. Both of them showed their positions well.
Calling it "mainland" is a reflection of Taiwan's historical (delusional) position of considering China Taiwanese territory
Whit3 reporter is not an honest broker. A propagandist.
That DW Reporter is just playing DUMB.... He wants Beijing to opt out of the use of force....... Guess what? As soon as Beijing accepts it, Taiwan will declare its Independence!!!
@@NJ-wb1cz You mean Chinese territory. There has never been a country called Taiwan. There is the island of Taiwan. There is the province of Taiwan under the administration of Republic of China.
@@ld871111 Fangpi
This is actually issue of ROC and PRC as civil war have not ended. It is actually the same as any other civil war in any other country. Even the ex president of ROC already stated it. Alot of people here wanted independence should be ready to face a war. Just being frank here.
DW News interviewed wrong person. Mr. Ma's approval rate was 9% at the end of his presidency (2016). How much can he represent Taiwanese?
As a Taiwanese, the only thing I want to say is "I am glad this guy has nothing to do with the future of Taiwan whatsoever. " He is passé, period.
When Taiwan becomes another Ukraine, let's revisit your statement
well said!
Taiwan want their freedom and don’t want authoritarian government
You're not Taiwanese
@@petertiang71Still better for Ukraine than It is for Chechnya or Belarus. Or are you just another Ruzzian troll? We know for a fact the Kremlin pays an army of online trolls.
I hope Taiwan can avoid a conflict
The problem is the opposite.
The conflict would not be ignited by Taiwan but by China.
Taiwan is nor threatening China.
China is threatening Taiwan.
@@ta0304Nice Of You To Say But Due To US Meddling As Usual This Was Bound To Happen.Since Taiwan Aligned With US They Will Bear The Consequences.And Please Don't Start With The Nonsense Of Democracy & Autocracy US & EU Track Record Is Not Great Either.😂😂😂
@@Xcelcior6780 The track record of China is worse 🤣
@@ta0304Taiwan will be the next Ukraine 🤓
He is a betrayer of Taiwan who sold Taiwan by signing 23 agreements with China.
I am a 65-year-old Taiwanese. After listening to Ma's interview, I can confirm that if Ma was still president, he would have been removed immediately.
In 5 years，you will know he is right.
You Taiwanese have been too brainwashed by the West.
To ccp he is
Do you mean physically? Who will do it, you?
Yes, you are 65 years old. You could be removed in a flick of a finger!
He's a major reason why KMT can't win a presidential election three times in a row since he left the office
Pls explain,
@@kongakau5058she this man every run prisedent she not win because here said pro china
if not for the divided vote, DPP would have lose. DPP lost the legislature, and would have lost the presidency if not for the spilt vote.
Hi guy, why Germany doesn’t ask US to promise that they will never use force to solve problems with any countries?
We would never agree to it.
And collapse financially due to unable to sell weapons ?
Because democratic countries have a right and a duty to enforce democracy where needed
We can't allow importune parts of the world to descends into chaos or be run by aggressive authoritarian regimes
Sorry , it is not the same
first German they never had civil war. Second china today is the biggest exporter to democratic countries.
DGR , it was ruled by the USSR.
The approval rating of the former president Ma dropped to as low as 9.2% before stepping down...
It's a trend, most of the politicians experience a approval rating drop during the second term. There's even a term called "Second-Term Curse"
@@yuyisong5186 Dude, its 9.2%.................
Also by stepping down I believe they mean "fled the country to China."
How's Zelensky's approval rating? @@bigfly97
@@bigfly97true
"Do you believe he is lying?"
"Well, his name is Lai."
Thanks for this impressive demonstration of the kind of sophistication one can expect from the KMT!
People in Taiwan know Lai Qingde as Lie Cheater.
😂😂😂 @@SUPERPOWERCHINA_
True
The reply isn’t humorous nor meaningful. Ma lied on his promise to donate his income when he cannot achieve GDP growth.
I'm not a KMT supporter but I still thought it was humorous lol 😂 Yeah it was kinda bit of a cheap shot by Ma 😅
It's time to get Ma checked into a seniors centre, because he has clearly lost his mind.
He's clearly one of the smartest chinese on that island
When dw decided to interview ma, its already an unfair game, ma's personal option does not represent the people of Taiwan, he had a lowest satisfaction rate of supports while he was in office. He represents noone but himself only. It is unwise of dw to give him an interview. It's almost like interview Trump and ask him thoughts on immigrants, very unwise.
Freedom of speech.
The same can be said for anyone. All individuals only represent their own views. No one can represent the view of all Taiwanese people. We should listen to what Ma has to say and make our own determination as to whether or not what he's saying is credible.
The title should be “Unification is acceptable to me” said Ma
He is such a loser ; Not Taiwan !!!
It’s a shame that DW didn’t use HK as an example to ask President Ma, as he was keeping trying to deliver the messages that TW needs to keep contacting and dialogue with China. The fact is CH doesn’t keen to keep their promises especially when matters contradict their core interests. Ask Hong Kong people to learn.
If China wants, it can learn from the UK and arrange a governor in Hong Kong 🤣 At that time, Hong Kong people didn’t seem to have any complaints.
President Ma would not accept participation in such an interview if such content were included, in the first place.
Post-edit: Ma's last lines of the interview may infer something about the situation that occurred in HK if applied in Taiwan.
In earlier times, Pres Ma always made it clear 1 China was the ROC. The HK-SAR model was ruled out. For DW news to ask this question would be irrelevant.
What about Hong Kong?
It's still largely autonomous with Hong Kong governed by Hong Kongers.
For the most part for that mattered, nothing's changed in HK. But of course, if have the freedom of talking about TS Massacre, HK gaining independence, cursing the CCP etc is what floats your boat and give you the hard on, then clearly you don't belong in HK.
@@youxkiotrue
Only acceptable for himself, Not for Taiwanese people
After I watch the whole interview I think what Ma ever did is like waiting for death
He doesn't understand that things have changed, China military is not the same as it was in 2008 or 2012, they didn't have the world largest navy or aircraft carriers back then, he also doesnt understand deterrence, deterrence is not about winning is about making it very costly and painfull if they invade so they're discoure to do so, a example of succeful deterrence would be Switzerland in WW2.
If you create conditions that force China to attack, they'll attack no matter how costly, just like Japan attacked Pearl Harbor.
Would it be okay for Texas, California, Hawaii, or any state to declare independence. What promote such moves.... Everybody should stick to his compound and own national issues.
Texas is a functioning part of USA, Taiwan has never been part of PRC. BIG difference. Even then, I think Texas should have the right to succeed if they wish. You would need tricky negotiations though on how to divy up federal resources invested in Texas, like military bases, etc.
@@bobmalonza6929Taiwan is the real government of Mainland China technically.😂😂😂
Texas was once an independent country.........and it has threaten to leave the US several times. @@jeremytine
What Ma openly ignores is that during his presidency, despite him giving in to most of the PRCs demands for "good relationships", China has increased military build-up, missile deployment, coercive measures and gave very little concessions to Taiwanese businesses. He is scared about China's military threat, this is clear, yet he seems not to be able to grasp that civil liberties are worth struggling for.
What utter rubbish. You're making up lies. Taiwan faced ZERO threats during his time. The U.S needs an excuse to turn this into another Ukraine situation. The U.S and its lackeys are taking the wrong path and allowing the empire of lies to determine their foreign policy
Dear friend, Has god never gave you eyes?
Can you see what is going on in Ukraine?
After many many years, Asian people go to bed with a filled belly.. We as asian should have a long long way to go.. Definitely chinese communist party is not end of the world.. But we should be able to resolve our differences to grow beyond..
First, I have to say Taiwan's military force has never been a problem. The mainland's military development is always for ensuring that the U.S. has to talk with us by history and logic rather than force, which the U.S. has done a lot. Do research by yourself, instead of just believing what U.S. or "international" portrait.
Second, just try to research ECFA by yourself and check how much unreasonable/unnecessary benefit has been given to Taiwan in the last decade. Then consider what the mainland got in either Taiwan's behavior or just words. When you try to conclude something, you should first learn the facts, not what the Taiwan media told you for justifing themselves.
Look at 🤕ill-crane, how do u achieve civil liberties when u loose ur life?
The fact of the matter is Taiwan and China belong to one race.
I would never respect an opponent who laid their arms down and rolled out the red carpets before war even starts.
Would Xi?
For general Chinese people point of view, the best way for Taiwan is to maintain statues quo. It is not only for Taiwan but also for mainland China. China itself currently has many internal challenges that may drive the country to unexpected direction. A democratic Taiwan would be a excellent example for the people across the strait what a Chinese society can achieve under democratic system. The existence of Taiwan could be a driving force for China's progress. It is ideal both sides can be close-tired under democratic system.
很遗憾的告诉你，大部分的中国大陆人，都不认为中国台湾省是一个理想的榜样。新加坡倒是一个不错的学习目标，虽然新加坡在大部分西方人眼中也不是一个所谓的民主自由的地方。
But in a way that is also the problem. Taiwan is a persistent example of a society the mainlanders can never have with the CCP, so Taiwan is a permanent example to the masses of people of a potential post CCP mainland China. This threatens the CCP’s political influence .
No one fancy Taiwan I can assure you.
@@user-vt6ps5fb7nSingapore? Taiwan is 50x larger than Singapore. Taiwan's potential for growth and change is much larger than Singapore's. Taiwan has preserved many originalities in the aspect of society elements which Singapore is diluting even faster. I guess in many years later, you will still hear interesting stories from Taiwan, but Singapore could be just a boring mega work-office place.
@@noelocs you're talking about imaginary "potentials" instead of actual realities. Please come back down from your daydreams 😂
Regarding this interview report, as a Taiwanese, I need to give advice, because Mr. Ma has resigned from office in 2016, and his approval rate is quite low due to poor governance. From 2016 to 2023, the world situation has changed rapidly. In view of the Hong Kong incident, the mainstream public opinion of the Taiwanese people is to oppose reunification and maintain the status quo. Therefore, Mr. Ma’s personal opinions cannot represent the people of Taiwan. Please ask Western media to be more careful in their reporting arrangements and question design, so that their reporting can be more timely. This is 2024, not Mr. Ma’s era.
True
Thanks for adding context.
As a person who lives in HK, I want to point out that the stuff that happened in 2019 was funded by your buddies America. Good luck to you
@@yunkil Regardless of whether it was supported by America, the result was HK losing it's free speech and what little democracy it had. You would know that if you were a real person who really lives there.
@@yunkil
How was the Money distributed in Hong Kong by the USA ?
Did every protester get a Pay Check to Protest , how did they get paid?
The People of Hong Kong's Will was on Display.
The Protest was a natural response to Authoritarian Rule.
Russia blames the USA for the Orange Revolution.
The Arab World blames the USA for the Arab Spring.
The USA/CIA wishes it was that easy to throw money into a country and cause Revolutions without the People feeling disenfranchised.
After seeing what has happened to democracy in Hong Kong, I'm not sure why anybody would expect anything different to happen to Taiwan, if any sort of unification were to occur...
Because hongkong leaders already kneeled to China. Taiwan have not. Hence the issue in hongkong was between it's leader/govt with it's people. Taiwanese govt and people are aligned that they do not want to be a part of China. They know they will not win a war, but atleast make the other side hurt as much as possible trying to achieve their goal.
Taiwan is a US vassal already, I don't see the difference changing overlords
@@Mana-dq7pn Is not this guy kneeling to China?
What? We never allowed democracy in Hong Kong, who told you it was a democracy under British rule?
As a mainlander, I don’t want to see what happened in HK happens again in Taiwan. If there’s a unification, it’s would be a total complete unification.
I'm African living in Europe.
I think the US and it's European allies are using Taiwan like Ukraine.
China has a longer breath in this conflict.
Even if China loses today if there's a conflict, they'll try and try again until they succeed.
Even if it takes another hundred years, DEMOCRATICALLY or otherwise.
Peace to all Chinese speaking people ❤
Taiwan is getting attacked by China. The anti-China sentiment is earned due to the actions by China. Why can't you see that?
The only thing you can see is conspiracy of American and European imperialists. When America invaded Afghanistan, you blame on America and call them "warmongers". But when Russia invaded Ukraine, you say Russia didn't do anything wrong and its all because America was expanding NATO. (You don't even understand why Ukraine was trying to join NATO).
You have blatant anti-west double standard mindset. I know what you want to do. You just want to hate America, so you are justifying the Chinese imperialism. I would not surprised, even if you support China when China invaded Taiwan.
No one is making Russia and China to go to war. Like seriously the US is losing more money by actually giving money and weapons to Ukraine here. They didn’t make Russia invade either. It is their own greed and paranoia.
It is just about greed and paranoia from Russia and China
You said it yourself. China will try and try again. That means you agree with their greed. And you hate US and Europe for trying to stop that greed. I mean stop fighting. China is literally big enough so as Russia. I don’t see your point of encouraging their greed.
@@andromedamessier3176 is Ukraine attacking donbass again and again their greed? EU and US recognise Taiwan as Chinese territory. Taiwan is not anymore independent than Donbass is. what is insane is the west is doing to China what it accuse Russia of doing to Ukraine which is to support seperatism.
For People who have never been to Mainland china, Taiwan or Hong Kong. Please go visit all 3 places if you can. You will have a much better understanding. We should all try to strive for peaceful coexistence.
We could, but the U.S. and U.K. has been meddling with HK and Taiwan for far too long.
CIA and MI6 really got their hands in many of the modern civil unrests events.
@@catsNcodetheir meddling has brought us to the current state of affairs ie the declaration of the right to use force is a product of the insincere and deceptive goals originally negotiated and agreed upon, say one thing do another
That's true. Once you have seen how people live in these places, contentedly going about their own business, you'll start to wonder what democracy has ever to do with people's daily lives.
Don't just visit, actually talk to the people. You'll learn that the Taiwanese people largely do not consider themselves Chinese.
So they are Americans?
"Look what you made us do!" -- China, according to this guy
It is! But be careful: it is not "China" but yes "CCP-PLA." Why? Because you have Chinese people crying for democracy when things go very wrong. Most well-learned (Eastern) Chinese people know well how democratically developed countries, such as in Northern Europe thrive under a democratic government.
Guy is just really submissive... You know?
"We're independent, no we're not, well...we kinda are, maybe, oh and we're Taiwan, no we're the Republic of China, well we're both, oh...we're confused...oh and we're just collecting the F16s for a rainy day. Oh no, why did you attack and destroy everything...maybe there's a phone around here that still works...ring ring...hey America, they're attacking and we're almost totally dead...where are you guys...wait you're making chips in Arizona now and buying the cheap ones from China?!" -- Taiwan/ROC/new Ukraine, according to the DPP
@@SUPERPOWERCHINA_ Taiwan #1
If this guy was the leader of Ukraine, there would not be Ukraine anymore at this point. Or would be kind of a Belarus like ukraine...
Ukraine getting smaller all the time with the help of USA and Europe.
@@juliethurner4099 Yet it still exist, which without the USA and Europe would not be the case.
Yep; it's because Ukraine's administration and citizens were willing to fight that international supports were able to come.
Had it been like Afghanistan or waiving white flag than even if some nations wants to; will be unable to help it.
This guy's approval rate went below 2 digits (9%) and cost his party's follow up presidential election in a big way....
Note: this guy's family members and family grave are all located in the mainland so to me; its hard to tell if they are being taken as hostage that can roam freely.
e.g O__o were they able to leave mainland together to vote in Taiwan's election?
You mean Ukraine would have all there land, there would be no war 🤡
yes ukraine still exists without young men @@yoshyoka
At the end of his presidency, Ma only had 9% approval rating. Now even the presidential candidate of his own party distances himself from Ma. How much Ma's view can represent Taiwanese is highly questionable.
His views do not represent Taiwan. I don't understand why the Taiwanese government allows a former president to travel to a hostile country for an unsanctioned visit. There should be a law barring such actions by former presidents.
@@tatonga03so what do you expect? Cut ties immediately and prepare for war?
@@adrianchong5883 people just don’t want to be governed by the current Chinese government. And they will resist especially young people. I mean who want to be governed by a government that has cancel culture as its foundation?
@@adrianchong5883 people don’t wanna be govern by current Chinese government. I mean who wanna be govern by a government with cancel culture as its foundation? Ofc young people will resist.
@@andromedamessier3176 CCP has more appproval rate then any western goverment lol. before you say these are chinese mad up propoganda but the truth is survey was done by western group.
He is Neville Chamberlain. Next time he should raise a piece of paper from his pocket.
Ma is very despicable of saying Lai as Lie with no respect to the family surname. Ma...
You simply has disgrace yourself. No surprise once was described " a daft!
As a 27yr old man from Taiwan, I completely disagree with Ma's statements. He constantly emphasizes the extensive communication he had with China during his presidency, but what we all know is that it came at the cost of sacrificing our dignity for the sake of peace. This is also why the Sunflower Movement occurred towards the end of his term. Xi's ambitions are clear, and instead of trying to persuade an aggressive nation, why not focus on strengthening our own national defense? While I agree that there should be more connections with China in every aspect, I am unwilling to do so if it means compromising our dignity and principles. At least, that's how my peer group feels. In the current global context where countries are emphasizing 'de-risking,' why not engage more with neighboring Southeast Asian countries or various European nations? It seems unwise to insist on warming up to a country that keeps a cold stance. Just look at the example of Ukraine - if you believe economic exchanges alone can gradually change an authoritarian state, I think we all know what the outcome might be. Namaste🙏
Yes look at the example of Ukraine, to see what happens when you needlessly antagonize a neighboring government
Thank you for the insight
So as a Taiwanese, what made you believe your dignity had been compromised during Ma's time as President?
You may be happy to hear that the KMT-candidates just distanced themselves from Ma's comments.
Maybe they share his view secretly, but they do not dare to give that impression publicly.
Ukraine might not be the best thing mentioned given all the ‘unwavering’ support they’ve been receiving, all those promises… concrete promises even, not like the vague ones given to Taiwan
Ma told his staff to never refer to the other side as China but the mainland.
No so many former presidents in the world would share perspectives on current administrations, because it's vital to understand that their views may not align with the majority sentiment. In the case of Ma, characterized as a "bumbler" by the Western press, it's noteworthy that opinions from him and his party, no longer in power, may not represent the majority of Taiwanese people.
Not to mention that Ma, with a notable low point of 9.2% approval from the citizens of Taiwan during a specific period, is one of the worst presidents of Taiwan.
He wants Taiwan to become Hong Kong 2.0. 🤡
Seriously though he's pretending like china Taiwan relationships are in a vacuum
He wants Beijing to become Taipei 2.0.
So what's wrong with that ?
You are spouting silly neoliberal lies. @@waynethegreat23
@@fortpark-wd9sxThat's how delusional disorder looks like.
I think Ma is very wise and reasonable but also too optimistic. The main question here is not about choosing between "unification" vs. "independence" vs. "status quo". The real question is: "Should Taiwan be ruled by the CCP or not?" because, at the end of the day, this is "the ultimate" and "the only goal" of mainland China involving the Taiwan matter. Trying to be nice to China doesn't seem to change this fact.
The one country two system is amongst the option out there.
They probably should strike a deal that's in their favour while Taiwan still has the chips.
@@Baz.007 The one country two system has never been an option for the taiwanese since it can not guarantee the independency of political and economical systems of Taiwan. It's just a slave or colony agreement.
Stop scaremongering. China and Taiwan existed peacefully side by side for decades until the US dropped the One China foreign policy principle, and suddenly chaos. We've seen this exact provocation play out in eastern Europe. Leave Russian and Chinese spheres of influence alone.
The problem is US will try everything to destroy TW Once after unification
Ruled by CCP is not a problem...1.4 billions ppl ruled by CCP and China becomes a super power...why Chinese in Taiwan cannot be ruled by CCP...they are willing to be ruled by the American puppy government...
Mr. Ma, I respect your loyalty and dedication, even if the KMT plays you like that. But if you're skeptical about Japan and the U.S. lending a hand, why bank on China? Seems like this speech is more about bagging votes. Ｗhether you're all about the '92 Consensus with 'One China, Different Interpretations,' or wrongly painted by the DPP as flirting with 'One Country, Two Systems,' neither fits Taiwan's future. We can't bet our sovereignty on any country's kindness; Taiwan's got to navigate its own path between the U.S. and China.
If Taiwan's independence depends on other countries, that is not independence. We should not understand "unification" as the big one swallows the small one. It can be the small one changes the big one. If Taiwan's people want a truly democratic and independent country, they should go beyond defending themselves but to negotiate with the mainland with the intent of maintaining a peaceful relationship. Does Taiwan's people have the confidence to make the world a place for their descendants?
Wishful thinking on your part. Taiwan doesn’t have any power over China hence it can only negotiate from a position of weakness and China knows this.
I can see his argument being viable 10 years ago. However it seems absurd post-Hong Kong and you kind of have to question his motive and maybe see where his paychecks are coming from. HK was a wakeup call to the entire world, especially Taiwan.
what happened to HK?
@@gtaraya
Elections are boggling with Chinese Communist Party, no more freedom of speech and business activities are also monitored by CCP.
@@gtarayayou've been leading a very isolated life
Hong Kong was ruled by the UK government before 1997. When the UK returned Hong Kong to China in 1997, the UK and China signed a peaceful agreement stipulating that China would not change any policies and would keep Hong Kong the same as when the UK ruled. However, when Xi Jinping became the president of China, he broke the agreement, sending Chinese military and law enforcement into Hong Kong, changing some legislations, and brutally arresting people who said anything negative about China, including the CEO of the largest democratic press.
He's very realistic ! People cannot afford the illusion that China can be beaten by force. The US can't manage the Ukraine situation, let alone Taiwan. The only way forward is a peaceful unification in order to avoid senseless deaths and destruction in a war for unification. Living is move valuable when alive
Giving up when faced with an existential threat is not leadership
Well..... his party the KMT is literally the nationalist party...... of China, not just any party of any country, but the nationalist party, of China. So they can't exactly go on the independence route can they, they'll have to form a new party. To go the way it was intended they'll have to say they'll lead Taiwan to unify China at some future date..... which is just crazy talk.....
, leadership means to do what is best for the people and going against China is not the best 😂
What existential threat?? China and Taiwan are both Chinese with the same origin. Both have to unify to make China as a nation and country, great again
I think he means something else. Like winning back the mainland from the ccp.
Look at Palestine and Ukraine.
When Ma was President of Taiwan, this guy wasn't born yet hence his knowledge of Taiwan's history is so shallow and naive.
Thumb down for him for not doing adequate research.
How strong is the military proposition for present Taiwan he don't even know.
And after this interview, Ma was absent to the pre-election campaign of Hou, the presidential candidate recommended by Ma's own party, KMT. When being asked, Ma just replied that he was not invited.
That's because Ma is enormously unpopular.
過於樂觀，相信只要表達自由民主的希望，就能保護自己。住在鱷魚群旁邊，卻認為羊只要不要激怒鱷魚就能安全。甚至拒絕一切外援保護，想卸下自我防備，以換取友善對待。我想他完全是站在中國的立場思考一切的問題。
他的目的只是为了避免战争而已，老共要是宣布放弃武统，他肯定也是站在台独的最前线。不过战争已经不可避免了。绿营梦想的维持现状已经不可能了。赖清德一旦赢得选举，对台湾的打压就会开始。一开始是经济，然后大陆的飞机会飞越台湾岛上空，直到战争爆发。
鳄鱼不会跟你谈更不会坐下来干瞪眼直接干，拿鳄鱼来比喻也就这点认知！你自己比喻是羊早就开战了也因为你是羊结局都一样你还能叫？那么牵强就别比喻
Crocodiles are not human and have limited rational behavior.
But extending your metaphore: one day the sheeps decided to arm up and start a fight to death with the crocodiles.
台湾不需要马英九！台湾需要像乌克兰泽连斯基总统一样伟大的领导人！
@@jaoolai5299 你的觀點很薄弱，因為不符現況，而你又不願意他人自由表達意見，代表你無法反駁自由世界的看法，只希望他人閉嘴。
DW should interview the KMT candidate Hou Yu-ih instead of ex-president Ma. Totally different leagues and it is more about choosing the leader not the party.
Hou will not be forthcoming . He has an election to run.
KMT hates Taiwan, love CCP, love Xi. KMT wants to sell Taiwan to China.
And that is why his party lost
“His name is Lai”
That shows you what kinda person Ma is.
People should know that Ma’s position is not the majority position in Taiwan.
But it is the majority CCP position. Like they own the South China Sea, East China Sea and parts of India.
@@pl5094 Taiwanese. They vote this weekend.
Ma was ditched by Taiwanese. When he stepped down in 2016，his approval rating was only 9.2%. He only represents a very small fraction of Taiwanese opinion. Current President Tsai I-Wen from DPP party is now in the end of her second term and her current approval rating is above 50%. Tsai and DPP's approach represents the majority of Taiwanese opinion.
He wants to surrender Taiwan to China, its not just an opinion in my view, this is a high treason against taiwanese people, he should be immediately arrested
it doesn't matter what they think China will take over regardless
If her proving rating is so high. How comes that DPP lost election in 2022
But he is right
There's no way to win militarily
Taiwan best option is to prevent war and get a diplomatic solution
@@baha3alshamari152 It wouldn't be the first time they Try to invade it. And proven records show they can fail. History looms large.
With a Chinese as a president in Taiwan, it's without a doubt Republic of China can never win any war. He is right about that! He had done whatever necessary to make sure CCP win its war with Taiwan military during his era. That is very kind of him.
KMT Presidential candidate Hou Yu-ih today said that he doesn't agree with Ma. He also removed Ma from tomorrow's campaign rally.
Well DPP candidate Lie Ching-te said he does not support Taiwan independence before the election. He lied.
That is the key question: Did you visit Taiwan when I was president? - and Xi was President in China.
Western Media Reports portrays the current tension as something that started few years ago
Current tension started when he (Ma) stopped to build the strong defense military capability. Shame
A dialog with China always goes like this. "This is what we want. You have to accept all our conditions before we allow dialog to begin."
The West has no business getting involved in the negotiations between the two sides. The United States wants a war with China. And they are using Taiwan as a proxy. US Empire wants war in China. War in Gaza. War in the Ukraine. Global war for profit.
"everybody move to south" israel.
Is that how Europeans have dealt with China?😅
I think you’re confusing China with the US
Yep. Just ask the Philippines. Duarte was over-the-top pro CCP and anti-US. Then meets with the CCP. . . and immediately pivots back to the US. Well done Xi. That 4D chess again?
Mr. Ma could not represent Taiwanese voices. We as Taiwanese strongly object to what he has said during his interview.
He presented Taiwanese view as he was full president for 8 years. 😁😁
As a past President, he presented Taiwan better than you. Secondly, the youths in TW should join the armed forces and prepare to fight. Join the army yourself have you?
In Singapore our national service every men must do is 2 years in the army . How to do battle with only 4 to 12 months ?
they are just reducing the war tension during ma ying jeou times
6 months training, 1.5 year goyang kaki !
Taiwan knows it's futile to fight China, so it's for show.
@@thedo9607 the reduction was made in DPP rule... DPP don't trust the army.
Hong Kong is not a country, and it did not have military forces to support itself.
Taiwan has military forces, so they can use It to support themselves when they negotiate and make deals with china,if they can avoid the war. War is not the only way to solve problems.
Do you know what is china in 1950?
I have not seen it. But my parents had lived through it. War is a destruction and kills anyone. it doesn't matter who is good or evil.
Hong Kong was a British colony that was leased until 1996. The UK was Treaty bound to return HK to China in 1996, and the only question is how that would happen. The UK could have breached the Treaty and attempted to hold HK by fighting another Opium War with China; however, it was abundantly clear that HK was indefensible. Had the UK fought, China would have prevailed and imposed MASSIVE reparations on the UK, starting with the nationalization of all British assets in HK.
Look how that unification is working for the people of Hongkong . Lol
working fine if u ask me
There is a reason he is a "former" president. That's why the KMT is unvotable for nowadays.
It should be up to people of Taiwan, if they want a unification with China.
Majority Chinese （Mainland China）win over minority （Taiwan island Chinese）is the core idea of democracy , isn't it ?
China isn't even a democracy@@lisa.e5776
so just let any state succeed, like what Donetsk and Luhansk is doing in Ukraine?
@@drexplordinaireDonetsk and Luhansk "People's Republics" are an artificial product created by Russia. They didn't organically come from a civil war between ideologies like Taiwan vs Mainland China
Taiwan is China! 😊
yeah, yeah, china promised Hong Kong can stay as it was in 1997 too.
what could go wrong?
Your type and the US type can go wrong. 😂
isn't hk much better than pre 97? at least the head of state is kind of elected, prior to that only British could hold that position n many top posts. the hk people were 2nd grade citizens
@@etoadnoweh. Russia has elections too but there's no real choice
HK in 1997 made up a quarter of China's GDP today it makes up less than 5 percent things change.
@@GIedits-vf7reya just look at US they supposedly have real choices but only knuckle heads are being offered for election by powerful oligarchy behind the scene.
He wants to avoid another Ukraine for his country.
It is always good to be in negotiating terms with your neighbours, rather than trusting others to help you.
know the meaning of your words before you speak them. Negotiation implies some level of fairness. Can you tell me the fairness of them negotiating with china?
It is better off for peaceful situation for both sides
I don't think China considers Taiwan as a "neighbor"
There will be peace in the Taiwan strait as long as the US stops interfering with other countries' internal affairs. Period!😮😮😮
As long as China stops interfering. Period! What a bully!
Tragedy
Same goes for China
Ma has his tail between his legs when it comes to backbone issues. Chiang is turning in his grave with disgust of this appeasement with communists.
His view cannot say for Taiwan
KMT hates Taiwan, love CCP, love Xi. KMT wants to sell Taiwan to China. So they can retire in US. with billion. Ma has US green card.
The journalist doesn't know what he's talking about. It's a Western view. Peace is always best not spinning war all over the world. Well done to President Ma
and that was why KMT lost an election and will continue to lose this time until the end of time.
yes
Pure brilliance from the interviewers. Why not ask all countries to promise not to use military power to achieve what they want! World peace 101!
You mean that's all it would take ? Wow, nobody ever thought of that. Just disarm your country and ask your aggressive neighbors not to use military force against you. Lol
There are people in this world that don’t benefit from peace!
That's hilarious man. Thanks, I needed a chuckle.
good point: Why not ask all the Powerful Countries to promise not to use military power to achieve what they want!-
Ask the Americans not to flex their military strength by sending weapons they involved in the current 2 wars, Ukraine and Israel. China is not involved in any wars at the moment.
I thought KMT party were losses 5% votes in this presidential election yesterday because this interview come out.
KMT party totally disagree this statement from their former party chairman.
the western reporter look disappointed it seem
He always sticks to the tones of CCP announcement and represents the several percents of Taiwanese who want to be unified with China.
Those who share with Ma's sentiment is no more than single digit of Taiwan's population and depleting fast as we speak.
People in the west always have this misinformation about CCP trying to take over Taiwan by force. But if you speak Chinese and do a survey of the Chinese people, 90% now support a military solution to take over Taiwan and CCP (because of its dictatorship ironically) still hopes for a peaceful solution. A large majority of mainland Chinese people actually support DPP to win the election, so that the CCP will have no choice but to follow the mainstream Chinese people to take over Taiwan.
He is your ex president! His wisdom bring peace to ROC and PRC during this period.
@@yaucharles91 The ex president has personal reason. He can't make money anymore in Taiwan so he hopes he will win more favor from China to get his share of wealth.
Taiwan is China!
The one was a bit silly to keep asking if we could request nonuse of forces. One of the answers could be a counter question "what price you will pay?" This is a negotiation process. You cannot ask a huge thing for nothing.
I know right, a similar response could come back asking "can Taiwan then promise to never declare independence? Can Taiwan promise to never expand it's military?". You are on point that it's about the negotiation, and giving up leverage is a silly thing to ask.
China top 1 strategy is to stopped unnecessary imports from Taiwan. Stop ECFA. Taiwan economy will collapse like Ukraine. No war needed.
he's just trying to provoke people into saying idiotic things, just to increase tensions. 🤣🤣
Because KMT hates Taiwan, love CCP, love Xi. KMT wants to sell Taiwan to China. So they can retire in US. with billion. Ma has US green card.
Ma said everything Wang Jingwei said. Wang had a better relationship with Japan when Japan invaded. Wang criticized whoever wanted to defend. Wang said no military to escalate the tension. Whoever tried to defend should be blamed for escalation. Well said.
It's not same. What japan and China think and do are completely different from each other. One, japan was stepping on China's sovereign and China asserted Taiwan as belonging to China, as part of the sovereign.
@@clementyap1009 Every dynasty in history had a different territory. The territory of ROC is not a part of PRC. Therefore, Japan colonized and PRC tries to colonize.
thank you Richard (reporter) !
不是有希望才堅持
對的！
莫道螢光小，猶懷照夜心!
即使是螳臂當車，我們也不會放棄守衞台灣！💪
那你準備替美國打戰？
One sentence to sum up Ma’s personal vision, dream, heritage, and his policies - he’s a red sparrow!
KMT hates Taiwan, love CCP, love Xi. KMT wants to sell Taiwan to China. So they can retire in US. with billion. Ma has US green card.
Ma makes laugh, basically he’s saying the rapist is much larger and stronger no matter how you train and prepare yourself you can never fight it off, you can only try to negotiate and not do anything to provoke the rapist, funniest announcement at its finest 😂
Please do not distort President Ma's thinking using unmoral misleading headline to propagate your ideaology! It is shame to youself and damage DW's image! from a Taiwanese Chinese.
Ma doesn't need anyone to misinterpret his statement. He can make a fool of himself without any help.
Finally I understand. He said unification peacefully and democratically. It means the collapse of CCP. 🙂
Well he is that lucky , China under Xi's ruling actually falling apart on every fields
It will never happen.
It means the collapse of ROC
Mr Ma is basically suggesting that Taiwan should submit to China to have peace. He should be arrested by Taiwan authorities for high treason.
He is a very known Pro Beijing guy..
Or they have to negotiate a peace agreement instead of rejecting diplomatic solutions
There's no way to win militarily against PRC
Has anybody taken a poll where the status quo is not an option? Or maybe that's too dangerous.
Man am I so glad that Ma is no longer president
Oh God, here goes China Ma again. The president with the 9.2% approval rating. Now you know why!
At last, DW find the another half of Taiwan. That's rare.
I am a Taiwanese. Ｍa has been far away from what Taiwan people want. What he says is only his personal opinion. We don't like him, and we don't like what he says.
This is not just a simple issue for China and Taiwan. It's an important problem for all countries including the US in the Pacific. So they won't let China do what China wants.
China can do what they want because it is acknowledgeable by all countries that Taiwan belonged to China
Taiwan is China! 😊
Washington isn't going to let China have its way with Taiwan until US high end chip manufacturing facilities are up and at full rate production. TSMC just broke ground in Arizona last Summer. This is a critical US and Allied (NATO & AUKUS) defense issue. The USG is spending $231 Bn on this.
@@anthonykaiser974 Whatever you think never really equal to what happens
Sooner or later, the Chinese Communist Party will realize that China cannot control Taiwan.
Impostor
Calm down ducky.
The immediate goal for Taiwan is to make every effort not to be another Ukraine. Taiwan should maintain neutrality and not be a proxy for another country.
The only thing stopping China art the moment is the threat of the USA responding. China thinks it owns Taiwan, fear is thee only thing stopping China.
How can Taiwan maintain neutrality when it comes to either declaring independence or continuing as an autonomous region? It's either one or the other
No, there is a third option: maintain status quo which is de facto independence and maintain a dialogue with China for eventual unification and integration. Again, under no condition should Taiwan be a proxy of another nation.@@FarisAl-Said
The situation doesn't compare at all because unlike Ukraine and Russia, both Taiwan and PRC are ethnic and cultural Chinese.
Are the Russians and Ukrainians both Slavs? Did you know that the Russians started their nation as the Kievan Rus? Also, because Taiwan and PRC are both ethnic and culturally Chinese there is a greater likelihood of national unity and integration - the dialogue should be maintained to effectuate unification when the time and condition are right.@@pfefferle74
PLEASE CHANGE RHE TITLE “ UNIFICATION IS A SMALL MINORITY OF TAIWAN”
I used to think KMT just lacks guts and is afraid of CCP and don't see the evil change of CCP and don't know how to deal with them other than do what CCP likes.. but after listening to this, I think the KMT's or Ma's idea is "we should have happily become a part of China already if it were not for the objection from Taiwan people and from US". And on the other side, DPP's idea is probably "we sould have been an independent democratic country already if it were not for the CCP".
Actually, KMT and the current KMT candidate has distanced himself from Ma's remarks already. Ma's way of thinking simply doesn't represent the majority, whether it be KMT, DPP, or the others. His thinking is quite out of the times and most people and media commenters just laughed off another of his odd remarks. Very sad ex-president of Taiwan!
@cate9963 not sure if KMT is truly distant from this kinda mentality or they are just forced to pretend this way for the election.
@@cate9963 If you understood Chinese and listerned to some of the KMT's election rally speeches during the last few days, you would find that they're very close to the CCP.
Taiwan won't avoid conflict if its independence is silent enough. Ma speaks about dangers of war, but the bigger danger is indulging forever leaders who abuse power and gobble up resources/territories of sovereign neighbors.
is it really a bigger danger for you personally? it is rather a bigger danger for the ruling elite trying to retain their world power but for you surely the danger of dying in a war should take the priority
so you'd rather have taiwan become another ukraine? a destroyed economy/country is better than peaceful coexistence???
Don't act like America and the west Is that clean.
@@kevinjiang2613 nah, these c.i.a. bots always believe America did nothing wrong
@@kevinjiang2613the West isn't clean. True. Does that make it OK for China to act the same?
Taiwan doesn't have to win a war against the CCP. It just has to successfully defend their country.
Taiwan is NOT a country
Defend how? And at what cost?
Which is absolutely impossible without the aid of the US military. If the US and China fight everyone loses.
sounds easy enough hey ? ...
Bruh be realistic...ITS AN ISLAND, NOT UKRAINE...THERES NOWHERE TO RUN WHEN IT ALL GOES DOWN! now imagine what the Taiwanese death toll would be??..I'm all for "fighting for your right" but there is too much at stake here
Thank you for reminding us why we can never believe in KMT.
The title is misleading! He said acceptable with conditions.
the DW Richard Walker is out of his depth in understanding Asian politics especially China's.
If Ma understands the politics, why is he unable to provide a clear explanation???
This one never care about the willingness of Taiwanese! I even wonder if he a Taiwanese or Chinese(ROC)?
I am speechless after watching Ma’s interview. He sounds like a uncrowned king, not like an elected official. Why being a Taiwanese so hard for him ?
=3 even his own party members came out to oust what Ma said since they know it is not what the Taiwanese people want. Not sure if its right to call this a Black Horse event for those in his political party. He remain in history as the only person with under 2 digit (approval rate of 9-9.2%) at the end of his presidency.
Ironically I think some Taiwanese can thank him for his action caused several political awareness in Taiwan (even if its to vote this sellout OUT of power)
No he is being smart and trying to save Taiwan's skin.
Because kmt is Pro chinese nationalism only anti communism.
But dpp is anti chinese nationalism and anti communism.
Kmt believe they are chinese From roc, Just like north and south vietnam
D pp believe they are only taiwanese just like usa and uk.
Its your problem.
He earns LOTS OF ¥¥¥ from his friend, Xi
At this point, why unify with a state in the middle of severe decline. If we were talking pre Xi Jinping then I could somewhat understand.
Currently Hongkong is a shadow of what it was, all of the major cities are on the precipice of economic disaster and foreign investment has pulled put.
The issue should be about governance. If Taiwans are not happy with the governance in China then they should be left alone.
So are Scotland, Texas, and California.
I don’t know anything about internal politics in Taiwan but this gentleman seems so defeatist that I question if he isn’t in the pocket of the CCP.
The reporter call Ma is the"Taiwan's former president Ma" but Taiwan is one of the provinces of China, according to Ma's idea. How can Ma call himself as the former president, I don't get it ?
I think Mr. Ma should use his mother tongue, Mandarin, for the interview. This will not only help him deliver his ideas and messages clearly, but also avoid any misunderstandings in communication.
It’s a good talk. It would be nice if the other DPP candidate could be interviewed as well in English
LOL. Ma is taking a lot of flak for this interview.
They are not native English speakers. Why should they give interviews in English?
@@magnetospin Because Ma thinks his English skills are good enough to give interviews in English.
Our new VP speaks good English.
sounds like someones been paid allot of money