When is Sucrose better than Kazuha? | Ask Zajef Kazuha Edition #2
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- Опубликовано: 31 июл 2024
- For any questions that didn't make it to the video, the twitch VOD is available at: / 1841086726 around the 5h54m timestamp
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Timestamps
0:00 Intro
0:10 Place in the meta and Pull value
6:55 He's not a must pull
7:10 Kazuha vs Sucrose
14:31 Is he irreplaceable in mono teams
16:24 Infusion vs Swirl, does Kazuha makes 2ble swirl easier
24:46 Is his Elemental DMG bonus enough to warrant ATK goblet
25:29 Talent priority
27:40 Artifact set
31:05 TF Kazuha
32:13 EM,Anemo or Electro goblet for Aggravate
32:18 Faruzan
33:05 Is Crit valuable in EM build
33:22 How much Energy Recharge
34:55 Weapons
37:21 Freedom Sworn
37:47 Constellations
40:55 How to swirl Electro in Aggravate with Nahida
43:58 Is he good in Burgeon and Hyperbloom
45:14 Does the wind knows him
45:22 what
45:35 majj
45:36 Final thoughts
45:57 leave me alone 
Игры
The big advantage of kazhua over sucrose is his jump is fun
Suc can show you how a storm look like, upward wind, exploding wind, swirl and tons of reaction. It look like the end of the world.
my king
Tossing enemies around like salads is also fun tbf
That's why I pulled his c1❤
Problem is, sucrose is a waifu and kazuha is a dude. Sucrose wins
Being able to dodge most enemies attacks while chilling in the air is what makes him the best for me
??? kazuha only has invencibility on his E for a couple of frames so unless you're doing it pixel perfectly you are going to die, just learn how to dodge instead
I’ll agree that it’s cooler, but as the other guy said you can dodge cancel your sucrose e and it’s effectively the same
It is not the same at all lmao
@@MrGshinobi you're in the air bro. Shit won't hit you lmao.
Skill issue 😂😂
There's one main advantage for kazuha over sucrose, which is consistency of crowd control. Kazuha forces all enemies in a wide area into his vacuum in a short, repeatable burst, while Sucrose relies on a slow, expensive, infrequent pull from her elemental burst.
Against hordes of trash mobs and other groupable enemies, that can be a life saver.
another point is how hard it is to swirl anything in sucrose burst compared to kazuha burst
@@tomlux1685 this
+kazuha has consistent elemental dmg bonus, unlike sucrose’s clunky ass burst which will swirl the right element only after you pray to Jesus Christ himself
@@tomlux1685 still wondering how did they make sucrose ult so bad at absorbing elements like 1 tick of ult isn't enough while kazuha swirls pyro instantly because of a burning grass miles away
@@raynorshineee probably some shitty ass code going on, gi devs are so lazy
@@turpal-alididaev6410 sucrose also has consistent EM buff, and you dont have to swirl the right element on her ult cuz it wont change anything in your rotations, unless you care about her c6.
The thing a lot of you guys ignore is that sucrose NAs literally give you free swirl reactions dmg, like its so strong that it automatically gives sucrose a huge edge over kazuha on reaction-based teams, and given that shes already a good pick for buff-based teams I'd pick her any day over kazuha.
I love Sucrose, I love Kazuha, I love Venti. So I'm gonna roll on his banner. Looking forward to playing TF Kazuha and Saute
Based
Good luck! I have every single anemo character because I like wind, and if they're OP that's a bonus. My Genshin experience is less boring with them
Crowd control is awesome and swirl is a great reaction so anemo is probably my favourite element as well, it's just previous Kazuha banners just so happened to be around when I took big breaks from the game lol
What is TF btw?
@@keegaming992 Thundering Fury - the electro set. TF Kazuha is a team where you have Kazuha on the Thundering Fury set, another anemo unit on the Viridescent Venerer set, Fischl, and a dendro unit (usually yao yao because she heals). Zajeff has a video in which he talks more about it
sucrose's normal attack being anemo is good
I have to agree because his c6 makes since imo
Her normal attack being a little anemo blip on the enemy is so good.
@@biggestoufblip
She deals anemo damage with her normal attack
@@heather-sj2pi blip
I think whats important to note is that kazuha is way more comfortable to use compared to sucrose. His abilities cant miss since they're centered around himself and his skill has a much lower cooldown compared to sucrose's and it makes dealing with mistakes much easier. Its also easier to avoid enemies with kazuha because you can just go into the air and escape an undesireable situation.
I diagree with the comfortability. Sucrose with C1 + Sac has 3 charges on her E so the cooldown rarely matters, you can also just normal attack to get easy swirls while kazuha has to wait for his skills
fyi his abilities CAN miss, there's some enemies with too much poise to be sucked in by kazuha or enemies that teleport and move all over the map
also the thing about avoiding attacks with his E is so cope, he only has invincibility for a couple of frames so unless you do it pixel perfect you are going to die, you're much better off actually dodging.
@Gshiin it's not cope, I've done it, many, many times. Kazuha turns the triple kenki into a joke because you can easily dodge the massive cryo hit
And anytime an enemy is outside your range to be sucked in, it's the players fault, a "skill issue" if you will :3
@@tabithal2977 that's just one enemy though. against the consecrated beasts who can knock you out of the air i'd much rather just dodge with sucrose.
@@aniiboyo keep coping with a catalyst unit with 0 interruption resistance and low base HP and def
21:46 THIS WHOLE TIME I WAS WONDERING WHY MY AYAKA DIDNT DO MORE DAMAGE AFTER KAZUHA SWIRL 😭😭 THANK YOU FOR POINTING IT OUT OMG
Bro rotation is different in Ayaka freez team.
@@user-steve6336 Yes. General rule is do not apply hydro before swirling with Kazuha. So, Ayaka Dash N1 into Kazuha E on first rotation, then Shenhe E, Ayaka N2C into Kazuha E on second rotation
@@arjunmuruganandam3373 or just shenhe E then Kazuha then kokomi then ayaka
@@willpickering5829 2nd rotation can face what he demonstrated sometimes
Zajeff is THE guide channel.
>Just use sucrose
me about to pull kazuha while not having a sucrose.
You wont regret it i have kazuha and i will never build sucrose
@@Tkt_t I have sucrose and will never build kazuha.
@@ame5851 I have sucrose and kazuha and have both built
@@sabsain2399 I don't have sucrose and kazuha and haven't built either of them
@qœp66 I don't have both kazuha and sucrose and I built either of them
Man I wish Hoyo would implement some UI icons to show which element is swirled and VVed. Same with all the other buffs and shields. Would make life so much easier.
hoyo implementing QoL COPIUM
"Skill and Burst cooldowns do not reset after retrying the chamber in spyral abyss." I've been mentioning this issue in every survey and they still haven't fixed this. I'm pretty sure they just need to add just 1 f*cking line of code to fix that. Do you really think they will add such a good qol feature like that in the future? I'm pretty sure they won't.
@@purp1e200 same bs as the Mondstadt weapon domain. The long CD still sticks even after clearing and retrying the stupid domain again.
@@purp1e200 It's honestly so lazy, they could easily fix it and not a single person would be upset with it so it's not like you can argue that it could cause an argument between players
Holy shit who makes his thumbnails? They are so good. I want to know how to make tthese type of pictures
I know right I love it ❤❤❤
Editing is really good aswell
8:04 In my experience, Sucrose being a 4 star was much worse actually, I've been playing for a year and haven't got her up until recently from a free wish on standard, whereas I had Kazuha since 2.8 as my first limited 5 star... getting a specific 4* is harder than specific 5* because there's no pity and if you're f2p you won't roll on every banner. I really wish they'd expand the 4* character options on the starglitter shop.
Same, man. Same. I tried to pull for her in raiden's first banner. Got mona and raiden before my c0 sucrose came
Yeah. I agree with this. Anecdotally, I was pulling to get Heizou on the previous Kazuha rerun. Only pulled Ningguang and some weapons for 70 wishes. No Heizou or Thoma. Only got Heizou on the same pull as when I got the 5*. Imagine if I were pulling for a more useful 4* like Bennett or XQ or Sucrose. So, yeah, it can be much easier to get a 5* than a specific 4* on banners.
Yep! I had Venti, Kazuha, and Heizou before Sucrose!
Me too, I got Kazuha first before Sucrose and after I got her, even at C1, she's just felt so much worse to use than Kazuha. So clunky. After listen to everyone hyping about Sucrose, she disappoint me.
Not to mention, it's been 2 years of playing and I still don't have her c6 RIP (she's c5).
Starglitter shop really need increase in 4* options, I 100% agree with you.
@@panjimartiandaru3081 Omg I had the same experience! When I finally got her I was happy because everyone hypes her up so much, but her grouping feels really bad to use and everything in her kit feels super clunky indeed. I know she's technically good or whatever but I'll use Kazuha and Heizou over her any day just because they're so much more fun to play
editing in this was so fun and made things easier to understand thank you editors
“When is Kazuha better than Sucrose? I can’t decide between the two.”
Me with neither: “Wow, such a hard decision for you. Must suck.”
Just use whatever you want exept if you have a big on fielder who nécessite a realy long time on field or freeze/childe team. Other than that the 2 of then are équivalent and dépend of your playstyle.
I also didn't have any anemo grouper except Heizouge for almost a year. It's painful.
Now, I only have C0 Sucrose since 3.4. C0 Kazuha will be an upgrade for freeze and aggrevate over a C0 Sucrose and I will not have to worry about anemo units soon. Let's go.
Honestly? I'd say Kazuha unless you don't like him and care about saving primos
Its 1:15 am and
i got 2 tests tommorow and already got Kazuha, but ill be damned if i dont watch this first
Bro if u dont take your ass to bed man, lock in bro
I still watched this even though I already have Kazuha & Sucrose built bc I always learn something new from your videos. I didn't know about you have to hold e on Kazuha to get the cryo swirl on freeze teams! I usually hold anyways but I occasionally pressed if I'm running out of time or felt lazy.
When I use Sucrose, she groups enemies for me. When I use Kazuha, I group the enemies. That's enough for me.
how do you aim her skills correctly?
@@thornszk dash backwards.
@@thornszk maybe instead of standing in the middle, stand outside of the group of enemies?
@@thornszk walk to the side press E once , Q and spam E
Tf does that mean? Bro just dropped some shenanigans and micdrop like Obama and head for the exit
Love the ending 😂
Still gonna try to pull for Kazuha in case both side of the spiral abyss need CC and for future exploration
The swirl segment was very insightful. I will need to check my rotations now, because I might have missed swirls. (Plunge infusion never made me second-guess myself)
I love your editor give him a raise (I suppose you already pay him well but give him a raise)
Thank you so much for showing all the math. Such clear and concise info!
My biggest mistake in my early days playing genshin was spending everything to get his c2 thinking it would be great for me to end up using him with ayaka mono cryo, i pulled for cyno thinking he would at least benefit of it ended up benching cyno too
I'm on C2 Kazuha, I really want him to be my only C6 on my account as he's the reason I started playing, hoping to get another couple of cons this run and then hoepfully the last two on his next rerun :)
Goddamn dedication. You go get him!
@@dighad3824 lol I actually just ended up getting C5 with my primo reserves 😅 the temptation to spend for C6 is too tempting…
Mr.Zajef, amazing Vids as always. Love your content❤❤❤
I feel like at least from the title this video connects exactly to what I want like it went right to my brain.
just want to let y'all know that this video posted after his 12 hrs stream (we thank you for the entertainment you bring to us mr jonathon)
i like how it's clear majority of the comments just got clickbaited for the algorithm and watched 2 seconds of video tops
I don't even play abyss, I just pull for cute chars, and I wanna pull for kazuha lul
Love your vids
Yeah who cares if you clear abyss 5 seconds faster lol
To me i feel i will play whatever I can beat the abyss with and is fun to play or character i really like
Thank you for making this video! As a new Kazuha haver, it was really informative \o/
ending was gold wth om
I didn't know all that information about XQ making it harder to double swirl pyro with Kazuha, nor did I know about that whole freeze team tid bit. That's great information! Thanks Zajef.
i heckin love guoba swirl
tried out the sukokomon thing and so many numbers popped up. it was amazing
Very informative video and I learn a lot about Sucrose and Kazuha. I love both of them and I like how detailed you talk about both of the characters. I learn a lot about how to set up aggravate teams correctly and getting the electro buff and swril. It's refreshing seeing a video talking about both of them without trashing either Sucrose or Kazuha.
Zajef, may I ask you to explain why do you recommend using fischl E before Kazuha E ? Doesn't Oz snapshot, so therefore by doing fischl before Kazuha you're not gaining the 40%+ elem dmg buff on Oz + A4 & aggravates ?
In a Keqing team for example, isn't it better to do Keqing E > Kazuha EQ > DMC EQ (or Q only to gain animation time) > Fischl E > Keqing ?
Kazuha's E cooldown is quick enough to reapply VV before it expires (generally after Keqing QEE + 2 or 3 CA). I've been using this rotation in most of my speedruns and had better success with it than the usual recommended rotations I see everywhere with Oz as the opener. I can ensure you I've tried every possible rotations over 200+ times each, and didn't find as much consistency when Oz was the opener. My cleartimes were lower and my setups were more scuffed (this last point might be just a feeling tho i'm not sure)
Another way would be to apply your idea at 42:04 by doing Keqing E > DMC EQ > Keqing E > Kazuha EQ > Fischl E > Keqing, it works too but I dislike the time loss reswitching to Keqing one more time, it extends the overall rotation and seems to lower cleartimes & overall comfort.
I think that starting with Fischl and losing Kazuha buff on her first Oz is too much of a loss,
Also, by getting Kazuha buff beforehand & by applying dendro before spawning Oz, you get a rather nice nuke with Oz spawning & Fischl C2 (got some AOE 50k+ spawning Oz sometimes), but I'm up for debate 🤔
As a low spender / almost F2P player, I do have some speedruns here ruclips.net/video/Em71dgOKiDI/видео.html or ruclips.net/video/tlKfVKp1Rrw/видео.html (don't mind the title it was originally a private video for a friend lol) if you'd want to check how I play her beforehand. It's not perfect but I do think I have a rather good comprehension of her kit & play her atleast good enough to have this kind of discussion.
For Nahida Idk since I don't have her, but I do think the same logic could be applied by not getting electro swirl before spawning Oz atleast.
This question has been in my mind since dendro has released, and I could never find as much success with the fischl starter rotations 😕
Also one thing I'd like to point out, is that Kazuha does have a way bigger range with his succion than Sucrose's E, and it's also much more effective imo as it pulls instantly everyone to one place rather than slowly towards the middle without quite making it to the end.
And her burst auto-aim can be a pain to use and time loss. I've tried c6 Sucrose multiple times with Keqing / DMC (or yaoyao) / Fischl, and never had I got better results with her than my c0 Kazuha, I always had 10+ seconds spared with my Kazuha, especially on floors that benefits a lot from good multiple pulling like current 12-1-1 for example, where I just couldn't manage to get under 55sec with Sucrose & had troubles getting under 1 min, but could way more easily & reliably get 44 sec with Kazuha ruclips.net/user/clipUgkxX9XqFb2Lh0Pvh--V-CSvUYWVguS6pDN6
For other teams I don't know, I didn't try / test them as much as you & Sucrose is probably better when dps units are off-field (fischl + beidou or yae), but for on-field aggravate carries like Cyno / Keqing, I must say that my c0 Kazuha has been overshadowing my c6 Sucrose since as much as I can remember, on every abyss rotations & every chambers, I almost always get way better cleartimes with him than her, it's not even close & it's much more simpler to use & reliable.
On the final note, great video as always and truly appreciate all your efforts & theorycrafting. I've been following you since 1+ year and it's a pleasure to watch your videos even during times where I'm not playing much of Genshin like current "dead" patches (waiting for Fontaine) x)
I have fully built Venti and Sucrose that I use almost every abyss and often 36*, but I'm still going to try to get him (have to win 50/50) because he is more fun to play
Is Fav really better than Xiphos if they're both at R1? I feel like I'd need an ungodly amount of crit rate to make Fav work, making me lose even more EM than I was already losing without the weapon substat
the Vsauce music over the swirling electro explanation lmao
This video was nice since it explains the difference between sucrose and kazuha to me in such detail. I see content creators go “kazuha is not a must pull” yet so many of their videos have kazuha as their recommended teammates in other character guides, so it comes off as huge mixed message for me, and don’t go to detail and just say that sucrose is a “fine” replacement without explaining why
Meta and power level aside, Kazuha is also extremely comfortable in general. Enemies are spread out? Just use your skill with a 6s cooldown and then pull them again with your plunge. This is mostly why people love him so much, it’s not even a matter of numbers, it’s just that amazing comfort and it’s also fun.
Sucrose feels awful to play while Kazuha feels great, thats what it comes down to.
If you have limited resources then you can make due with Sucrose but a lot of people will invest in a kazuha simply because it makes overall gameplay just so much more comfortable.
Venti comes with similar gameplay frustration cuz his Ult always goes into the wrong direction if an enemy walks a tiny amount during the cast.
Characters with skills that auto target are just a lot clunkier than those who center their skills on themselves.
@@luminous3558 Sucrose feels awful “to most people” or “in most scenarios”. Don’t assume things for others, personally I enjoy Sucrose a lot more in certain teams, even though I agree that Kazuha feels amazing. It depends, for example National, I would never play Kazuha there, idem for taser and soup, Sucrose just feels so better and much smoother TO ME PERSONALLY. The fact that those teams perform a bit better with her is just a nice optional imo.
It depends
One thing i'm enjoying more and more about Kazuha : using him as a driver for Candace in Hyperbloom. His fast normal attacks are great for applying a lot of hydro. Also, it makes rotations easier, when everyone has a 15 seconds cooldown.
However, i'm not sure which set would be better for him : VV doesn't do that much here. So, should i go for Gilded ? Thundering Fury ? Or maybe even Desert Pavillon (more ATK speed ) ?
he's not the one proccing the hyperbloom is he? then if he's the one proccing then Gilded it is. otherwise stick to VV since you're playing with candace's hydro infusion and using him as a driver.
@@usmanya5110 Kazuha will proc some Hyperbloom with his burst. But that depends on rotation (and if you can use Kuki's burst every rotation, to guarantee an Electro absorption). Still, i'm wondering if it's better to absorb hydro or electro, though...
But even with an electro absorption, his burst ticks slower than Kuki's skill : he will own less Hyperbloom overall.
42:30 yo wtf where are you getting these animations from!?
om but seriously this was very helpful! Especially the infusion vs swirl section
LEAVE ME ALONE
Succ gouba swirl: im rent free, in ur head
Hey people my Kazuha has almost 1000 EM without needing an EM goblet so I gave him an Anemo Goblet, is that alright?(I'm not gonna change it at this point, that much VV farming has destroyed my soul but I want to hear your opinions) he has 160 ER also.
no, give him an EM goblet, his damage comes from swirls, not from raw anemo damage, so giving him an anemo goblet would just cripple your team
yeah its fine, er is much more valuabe when you cross the 800em mark tbh, i personally reach 1000em with iron sting but use fav sword and keep him around 850 and hes still good
if he already has near 1000 EM and you're not finding his ER too low it should be alright. EM would be a decent boost but unless u really want to grind more VV it's chill. anemo dmg doesn't affect swirl as @Gshiin said
@@MrGshinobi yeah I know but I've always heard that EM becomes less relevant as you approach the 1000 so i figured that since he has good enought numbers and all talents at 9(and is usually paired with Bennett so he gets the attack buff) diversifying his damage is not that bad of an idea.
wow give whoever did the electro swirl graphic near end of the vid a raise
*You have provoked a gang war*
I think it should be worth mentioning that its so much easier fo get a c0 Kazuha than getting a c6 Sucrose. Honestly, I'd prolly quit this game than to have to spend another version relying on Sucrose for grouping mobs.
Depends on how long you played
Sucrose honestly really only needs C2 to reach her peak, C6 is a negligible difference
That'd be relevant if her C6 was mandatory for them to be comparable, but it's not.
At C0 she's already at like +90% of her potential (and the missing 10% is situational, like C4 for Taser, otherwise C4 is next to useless) and is already enough to generally be a sidegrade to Kazuha. Sometimes a little better, sometimes a little worse.
And even if her C6 was mandatory, saying it's easier to get C0 Kazuha is also false. Well, not necessarily false but very subjective. For instance, you can get her C6 overtime without sacrificing any pity for unwanted 5* by just getting her randomly on her banners or the standard. You can also buy her from the shop whenever she's on it for 'free'.
It highly depends on how you see things/your definition of 'easier'.
C6 barely matters though, it's only good in Freeze and Aggravate because even in teams like National you would prefer absorbing hydro rather than pyro. Except C1, all her other constellations are essentially useless, C6 only matters when I said earlier.
@@Merquitarika HUH? She's in the shop? If only man, I wish!
Me who has Sucrose, will get Venti as a waifu pull, and plans to get Kazuha listening to the pull value section: *Interesting.*
I really enjoyed and appreciate the detailed explanation at 42:15 about the order of operations and how they trigger the reactions.
On the surface it's a simple E-(swap)-E but there's a lot more going on.
I would love if we could see more of this. Explanations how and why (some popular) rotations work, what is critical / what to pay attention to not mess it up (the devil is in the details).
Or how and why some team comps work and others don't (what about an unit's kit is important or can be replaced by similar unit).
Is there a library of these explanations? Some dedicated past videos... or a playlist maybe? Or a wiki with timestamped video segment links?
I missed the community post to ask a question for this 😔
Kazuha has better grouping, his short CD is super forgiving, most people play freeze or some mono team where kazuha is better.
Sucrose is really fricking good but a little trickier to use.
edit: man swirl freeze auras is so dank
excited for kazu
Does the rotation for electro buff in aggravate teams still work if you also use Nahida's burst ? 🤔
Would the Lisa NA trick work with Yae’s turrets or does reapplying electro while off field fuck it over?
Fun(?) fact: just in terms of pure buffs c6 sucrose with hakushin provides as much elemental damage bonus as a 1000 em kazuha (if you manage to electro swirl the janky Q) and depending on how much you team can make use of em, this makes her even more buffing than c2r1 kazuha on these teams.
That's not to diss on kazu boi he's on my hyper team, it's just goes to show how insane the older 4*s are
It's easy to swirl electro on teams where it matters
Perfect I have 5 catalyst billets lying around. And in team comp with Beidou/Fischl/Yaoyao will be none issue
The main reason i value kazu more,that new enemies can be grouped only by 5* anemo chars,so u need put a lot more effort in self grouping mechanics with sucrose or reset few times,when with kazu its more consistent thing(and not sucrose swirling some other element from u if enemies have infused att)
If sucrose had kazuha's E and Q, she would be the best anemo unit in the game by a significant margin imo
@@d3m3nt3d_t3acup_ she kinda is right now, as long as reactions stay meta
I feel like the only difference between Sucrose and Kazuha is that one grants EM and other grants damage bonus
Its right but that not all to it, what you also get from kazuha is higher of field personal damage and better grouping while sucrose giving higher damage as a driver
Kazuha have Better grouping if we can call succrose a grouper lol succrose dies quicker...and auto target make her worse...the only one time you can think you may use her over kazuha is against bosses.
@@Omar00Ljust sounds like you can't dodge for shit tbh. Git gud
unrelated to the main content of the video but what's the song names that plays throughout most of the video, has a jazz feel to it and want to know the names since older vids used to have song name source like tracktribe stuff
The ending clip got me, i was ready for the voicelines but that leave me alone clip just hits different
I’m rolling for Alhaitham. I just love him and his sarcastic humor and how it bounces off other characters. I really want to see him interact with non-sumeru characters and see how they get along. If I do have any leftover primos I do plan to roll for Kazuha though, because he’s super useful for both combat and exploration, and he’s fun in the story as well.
I'm opposite. I completely hate his personality. But I respect different taste.
@@ame5851 he's an inconsiderate, abrasive dick. I got him today :D
@@ame5851 Exactly, sumeru smartass try to shut the fuck up challenge for 1 millisecond (impossible)
Pulled for him for the same reason. But also what I can say to you is that if you play him with hyperbloom and learn his rotations(which is not as demanding as many people say) he kills everything.
@@solosol5430ust got him (at 180 pity sadly). Got him to 90 6/6/6 with decent stats. He’s already great. Gonna need to farm edgymooch for his boss mats unfortunately.
Edit: just tested him on aeonblight drake and holy shit. Even at 6/6/6 he kills it comfortably in one rotation (without even using his burst). And a scuffed rotation at that.
Aside from my Hu Tao vape, Alhaitham Hyperbloom is my best comp easily. And it’s better at AoE than Hu Tao Vape so I’m honestly considering making it my highest investment team.
Sucrose's auto-targeting and weaker grouping makes her less fun to play for me. There's also Kazuha's ability to avoid damage through both his Skill launching him over attacks, and his long Burst animation providing a mountain of i-frames. Obviously, I use Sucrose for Taser teams, and wherever else that she's the more appropriate choice, but having less fun with her influences me to use those teams less often.
I started in 2.0, so she was the only grouper I had until Venti came back in 2.6, and then Kazuha in 2.8. She was invaluable getting me through the Abyss back then. She's earned her stripes.
I want to be small Kazuha in the thumbnail being experimented on by Sucrose
Sorry i didnt get the part about swirl and infusion. Can someone dumb it down to me?
Very Thankful for these Videos, people tend to see a 5 star character as a better unit no matter what, Sucrose literally saved my abyss so many times, Kazuha is still insane though
Yeah, both are amazing and have their upsides and downsides in some situations. In the end, it would be nice to have both as you can't use sucrose on both sides.
The thing I hate is that they are neither inferior or superior to each other for the most part, they do different things along with 4pc vv, so It’s incorrect to rank them in such a way
@@junyaiwase its not that all "incorrect". I feel like ppl should atleast have an idea on how good sucrose is. You could even see that what zajef is saying is a hot take for most ppl but for TCs its literally what they thought even way before he was released.
@@jma42 untrue. many many people have known sucroses strength for a while now lol. this isnt a hot take
balls
Zajef converted me to TF kazuha so yeah kazuha fun
Two years playing Genshin, not a single fav sword in all this time. Some day in the future I hope I'll get one 😅
The editing on guoba swirl is perfect
The problem with sucrose is she feels very sht to play.
You put E one place it goes other way.
You burst in one direction, goes other way.
It absorbs random elements.
No consistent grouping.
That's why even in situations sucrose is better, people prefer to play kazuha (in most situations).
Yea Sucrose don't have that comfort value that chara like Zhongli, Kokomi, Kazuha have.
This so much, also auto attacking with succ feels like dogwater
And it's not even a skill issue, it's just that Sucrose autotarget seems to be equally bad as Ninguang's so even if she's good on paper/excel it's definitely not the case when actually playing
Unless you want to play OG National or Taser with Beidou, Sucrose is just feels so sht to play.
@@lycerisrico8943 correct, her only non-cope teams are with xingqiu and/or beidou so you don’t get massively punished for staying in place auto attacking, for freeze, aggravate or mono element teams she is _way_ worse than kaz.
I only started playing the game just before Kazuha came out, so right when swirl got buffed. At some point, somewhere at AR 30 I realized that I can just normal attack with Sucrose and enemies just die from normal attacks. And thus became a Sucrose main. When Kazuha came out I watched a few videos about him, is he good etc, tenten was amongst the videos I watched, and I'm really confused to when did anyone say that Kazuha was bad, cuz all I heard was very very good things about him. Maybe it's because as a starting player I didn't talk to any other players or something.
Sadly it is normal.
A lot of fair criticism gets thrown together with hate. And the actual haters don't care about any other viewpoint. They just take some valid criticism out of those videos/guides etc and overblow it a lot to have an argument.
So the defender think everyone hates the 5* while only arguing with a small portion of the community + thinking that the source of the haters also hates the 5* while most sources just did a fair assessment. And this is how such things happen. "Back the everyone said Kazuha is bad". It didn't really happen. People just questioned his value because he isn't always a upgrade to Sucrose and back then Venti was the king of the Abyss. So getting a third Anemo grouper wasn't that needed. Even with his buffing capabilities.
But they usually said in the same sentence: Being as good as Sucrose means he is in the top five of the whole roster so getting him isn't bad but maybe not that what you actually need or want.
that ending ICANT
oh snap FIRST. .to be honest it just depends on of you want an anemo driver with EM share or just an off-field sub dps with grouping and damage
I'm a simple man: I see Zajef, I click. That being said: Sucrose is better when you need more EM like Spread/hyperbloom. Kazuha for more general dmg boosting.
If you need EM why waste your slot using anemo?
@@quint2568 cause amemo buffs more.
@@quint2568CC, Swirls, VV shred, EM buffs, ez fav procs or ttds buff if needed, good agravate driver in Sucrose, etc, etc.
@@quint2568 VV, literally best artifact set
Hyperbloom? Shiet fuck anemo Im double hydro all day :)
Im assuming c2 kazuha > sucrose in almost every team then outside those were her anemo AA's are important (taser as example)
That's not necessarily true, since C2 Kazuha only works on the on-field character (and snapshots for vape/melt). If you run Aggravate Yae, for example, only Yae and not Fischl (who also contributes a large portion of the team's damage) and (if you run her) Nahida will get the EM, whereas Sucrose would give EM to all of them.
I think c2 Kazuha is just adding Sucrose into Kazuha. So,
In Freeze or Mono team, C2 Kazuha is just C0 Kazuha.
In Hyperbloom team, C2 Kazuha is just Sucrose with a bit more peronal damage for Kazuha and Electro unit.
Only in Vape/Melt where C2 Kazuha can shine bc you get the best of both world.
the issue w his c2 is all it does is allow your kazuha to compete w her in reaction teams, similar to sucrose's c6 for dmg%. in any situation where his c2 makes a big difference you'd get more value from C0 sucrose
@@aerohydra3849 Oh, i wasnt aware that it only benefits onfield characters. I guess its purely constelation for carries, probably HT being best example
@@SoilworkWT kinda, it buffs his own em too meaning slightly bigger buff
The last part of the video is the best part
Which software do you use in your youtube covers?
Is there any situation where sucrose is better than a c2 kazuha
Pretty hard, but if I had to choose it's probably a team that just needs off field grouping and or dose not needs dmg% buffs just my imo I don't know actually
Every team that uses constant swirl reactions.
DPS sucrose
he answers this in the video
@@MrGshinobi i mean c2 kazuha
Well, Kazuha is a big upgrade to my account cuz i mainly use freeze and sometimes childe and keqing agg tho i usually did it with nahida and zhongli so now i can use that yao yao team and use nahida on 2nd team
how do I check your builds?
Very informative video. Would be cool if you upload something similar to eula and/or klee but because they arent gamebreaking units i sadly dont expect it to happen :/
Weird how Sucrose/Kazuha comparison by the community is so different from the YaoYao/Baizhu one...
I think they are quite similar instead, only difference is that Baizhu is not THAT overrated by the community
@@xanthee_imr that's my point, the community treats them wildly different while in practice they are similar indeed.
Most people praise Kazuha over Sucrose (as Zajeff himself mentioned he often overcompensates that with his "Sucrose is better") while the common claim regarding Baizhu is "just use YaoYao".
@@FranciscoJG Yaoyao doesnt feel awful to play so people are more receptive to her. Sucrose is one of the clunkiest units in the game while Kazuha is probably the opposite.
Its incredibly easy to use kazuha optimally while sucrose will just throw her skills in the wrong direction and infuse the wrong element without absurd micromanagement.
Most people dont want to deal with that so they choose to play the character that feels good to play.
@@luminous3558 Her off-field Dendro application is still circle impact just like people complain about Traveler and specially Collei. And the good heals demand time on field, huge dps loss like so many other things people complain.
I agree Sucrose feels clunky often but again, people exaggerate on that while overlooking YaoYao's disadvantages.
I just want kazuha so i can finally get the electroculos on top of the shogun's castle
Geo Traveler
Keqing E
Wind current gadget
@@fran99080 Yeah, I would even argue that its much easier with him since you also get a wind current
what if u dont have Sucrose after playing 2 yrs?
Thank you!
i r5'd hakushin for my sucrose for yae/nahida only to realize that she almost never triggers her hakushin for yae and now im salty. This couldn't have come at a better time. I have no Kazuha and i have C6 sucrose but i don't really get her as her pull feels really cucked and meh
Yeah, he talks so much about dps but gives zero mention for the main reason you want these units: grouping
Sucrose can do it decently with her burst, while kazuha can group enemies all the do dong day and let your AOE damage consistently wipe out waves
For Hakushin's passive to proce in quicken comps, try casting the electro first, swirling then applying dendro, especially if you have Nahida in the party. Nahida herself is not a good Hakushin holder afaik since she has too much dendro. Also make sure you saty on Sucrose after you swirl electro for a moment or two. Hakushin is a bit finicky, and not just on Sucrose. I've had the same problem with Lisa and Kokomi before. Try weaving in a few normal attacks to make sure the reaction happened while the holder is on field so that it triggers the passive. It's a bit tricky, but you can do it with a bit of practice.
Use normal then charge atk with yae so have electro but u have to be fast
Try using other Dendro, like YaoYao or MC, Nahida Dendro is just too much sometimes and makes Swirl Electro harder even with Kazuha if you're doing wrong rotation
@@dtexdarkus If ALL you are looking for is grouping and that is the main thing you want, then just use Venti who is the best at it.
"B-but, isn't kazuha and sucrose better than him because they BUFF the team..." & "Isn't floor 12 usually filled with heavy enemies?"
Grouping is a good SIDE thing on these characters, but the MAIN reason for these units contrary to what you said IS higher dps.
I’m just getting Kazuha cause I’m skill issue sucrose
Loved! The chiblis (?!) and their sounds!! So cute!.
Opinions is kazuha a must pull unit on my account if I have pre C6 yet sucrose. Or I can skip and ignore fomo hype kazuha or I need pull on him?
Pull if you like him, if you don't or if you don't care save for Fontaine, he will come back again anyway if you change idea in a few months.
i'hv been thinking this for a while now...why all those TC that always say sucrose is better, but still play kazuha a lot in their account. Even in abyss, i keep seing them using kazuha.Coz they keep asking people dont pull kazuha but they themselves pull him. walk the talk! as beginner before i believe him and skip kazuha banner, lets just say i feel so regrets coz kazuha banner only come once a year. When i said sucrose is clunky, they will said i hv skill issue.ofc i hv a skill issue, i am still a new player duh... well i still dont like using sucrose even now. She still clucky.this time i will make sure to pull kazuha.
They use kazuha because he is much more comfortable and abyss is too easy to go on full meta
Which makes QoL characters a better option despite being objectively worse mtea wose
@@Mehieddin7 Ah yes, resetting abyss 69 billion times until 36* is "objectively" more meta than 36* in the first try.
As a f2p Kazuha main who's going for his c1 (I'm planning to c6 him one day) I find him much more comfortable than Sucrose, and much more fun to play which is the main reason I pull for characters
Bennet c6 overrides kazuha c6, keep that in mind
He's infinitely more comfortable since he actually groups enemies to him and his burst AoE is bigger.
He can also take a hit, unlike Sucrose, lol.
How do you main a support at c0 btw? not trying to be mean or anything. But someone like Heizou is just better for that role
@@Forakus literally everything in this game is waste of primos when national team is still better than anything else in abyss,so why telling ppl what to do in pve game,let them enjoy doing they stuff
@@luisestevan3272
Tbh having Heizou as a side main he doesn't really "do" anything
Wait, what happens with tf kazuha with sac sword and C1?
I loved that guoba swirl meme lol
new player, no sucrose so kazuha is my only option until rerun 😇
He is so good in abyss 12-1b, he can avoid the cryo herald plunge attack by flying, and made that chamber done in 1 min. I was stupid putting him in the first team.
mr editor thanks for the nahida electro swirl diagrams lol
One of my favorite teams is childe vaporize with Kazuha. Xiangling and childe feel great together and Kazuha pulling it together with his buffs, grouping, and c2 EM feel great.
I really think he oversells sucrose because the community oversells Kazuha and he wants to be an anti-man.
In reality Kazuha is not a must pull (because no character is a must pull) but if you have both Kazuha and Sucrose, most players won't play Sucrose over Kazuha even on the teams she is *technically* more dps. Because while sucrose might bring slightly bigger numbers in some teams, Kazuha will bring better grouping, safer rotations, and more consistency in actual gameplay. All 3 of which often result in better clear times than just the highest potential number on paper.
If anything illustrates this point, just watch Zajef streams or clips where he often resets on his Abyss runs with sucrose teams because she gets killed/CC'd/doesnt group properly/etc.
Also keep in mind all these comparisons to sucrose presumes she is C6 which cant be guaranteed while you can guarantee a c0 5star.
TLDR: Don't feel pressured to pull for Kazuha, because great 4star alternatives exist, but in most situations Kazuha will outperform those 4stars and even when he doesn't he will generally be more comfortable to play.
"and more consistency in actual gameplay."
Honestly that's the most important part to me. Hate how the auto aim can occasionally bork your ultimate with Sucrose. lol
main reasons why nobody uses venti over kazuha anymore unless Kazuha is busy in the other chamber and CC is required.
I play on a phone and have slow reflexes. My C6 sucrose often dies. I am with u, pulling for Kazuha to be more comfy. After that I will have to deal with bad VV farming luck(not enough EM or ER) and that everyone wants my fav sword!
Consistency is not counted in judging Genshin characters, else Noelle would be META.
Genshin design on which team has higher peak. With the reset button.
"I really think he oversells sucrose because the community oversells Kazuha and he wants to be an anti-man."
He literally says it in the video 😂(7:24) and also that calling Sucrose better than Kazuha is clickbaity (7:43).
About C6 Sucrose, that constellation doesn't even matter except in Freeze and mono teams, for example in National you would rather have a hydro infusion to get consistent reverse vapes instead of a pyro infusion, making C6 just a joke. C0 Sucrose already deals more damage than Kazuha in aggravate if you have an Hakushin Ring refined to R3 or more, for example (in ST, while in AoE Kazuha's damage becomes more relevant).
I agree that Kazuha is usually more comfortable and for most also more fun to play, so people generally prefer him, but overall the comparison with Sucrose in this video is genuinely right and remember that the point of view is that of a TCer, things like "more fun", "satisfaction" etc. are subjective and everyone can feel that just by trying the character in the trial, so that's not something useful to outline when you compare how characters actually perform and what numbers they bring in. He also already addressed reliability and comfort of Kazuha's grouping anyway, as well as rotations etc.
I couldnt play my Ganyu team without Kazuha.
Its really the only team i use him (also monopyro), but i also dont use Sucrose anywhere lol, she is lvl 80.
the funny thing is when it comes to ganyu, venti is actually better...its the OG power couple but many players esp newer ones dont know it
@@whisperwalkful maybe he means ganyu melt build
@@whisperwalkful Most of the time Kazuha is better. I have Venti too and i sadly almost never use him.
He is good only if you have many medium and small enemies to pull. But abyss have been just big enemies, like the consacrated beasts.
I use Ganyu, Kokomi, Kazuha and Shenhe in the first side currently and it works great.
@@whisperwalkfulLOL only in 1.X was venti better than kazuha, kazuha just brings way more to the table like melt ganyu and the new ganyu melt burn.
I was watching the previous kazuha ask zajeff
The thumbnail tho 😂😳
But if lucky enough to have C1 kazu double swirling is actually 100% achievable
They're situational. The great thing about Kazuha, is that you can control what gets swirled and your E and Q won't miss due to targeting issues.
I've had abyss runs messed up because the wrong element swirled or venti's vortex was fired at the wrong enemy. It's great to be able to set up a Pyro field in the abyss against the e abyss lector team.
If I use venti or sucrose, the lector are able to walk out of the field. Because they chase you aggressively. Where as if you put up a Pyro field with Kazuha, the lector will chase you around in it and break their shields.
I got Kazuha before Sucrose, so I've never really tried Sucrose yet. I do have her at C6 now, so I want to build her, but really struggling to get EM VV pieces.
It's been a long time since I've heard TF Kazuha.
Sounds like music to my ears