With that said, nothing beats opening a panel to see the VFD say "GND FLT" and you know immediately to break out the megger, or an undervoltage alarm that stopped the unit from running during a brownout. I think the majority of the hate for variable (or even contactor two-stage) comes from companies installing the absolute cheapest controls they can get.
@@afridgetoofar1818 The more complicated systems help by giving you diagnostic information, and some of the problems with more complicated systems come from installers using cheaper controls. I would add ignorance by the installer and poor training of the homeowner as problems as well.
@@got2liv4him Trane uses high-quality controls in their variable speed systems and the inverters have short-circuit protection so the inverter locks out instead of letting itself get fried and gives out an alert code.
This is a good video for those of us needing to replace our older, worn out systems. Of the three types, we were able to eliminate the variable speed. Your words were well delivered. Nice job.
Id say installing antique single speed single stage systems after 2023 is out of desperation because you only have that type available due to back logs of the newer seer2 or that’s my understanding!
A properly sealed single stage. Then, thermo image a year later. Checking for leaks. And lots of insulation and a couple of properly placed trees. This has always been my solution for my rentals in the great state of Texas
I have the top Trane multi stage, variable speed furnace basement unit. LOVE IT. In an OLD 1,500 sf drafty home, with a bedroom and baby room built onto the house decades after the house was built. The addition vent work was done poorly and improperly and impractical to R&R given I'm 70, single, on a tiny fixed income. This fan runs very slow but is always on to help circulate cool or warm from the rooms that have better ventilation to the 2 rooms that have poor ventilation from ducts not well designed or installed! This is huge, it works, and when retrofitting an old drafty home that needs new windows you cannot afford yet need a furnace/AC, I'd say this is mandatory. With the minus 16 cold snap here, this unit worked GREAT and the fan normally runs slow and almost silent even when actively pushing warmed air - but at minus 16 this baby KICKS ON THE AFTERBURNERS!!! The old type furnaces cannot adjust this well to need and when they are between cycles, they do nothing to circulate the warm room air to the cooler room. If you have a home like mine, spend the extra money and get what I got. Mine came with a 10 year warranty and I won't even live that long, so................... :)
I would like you to make a video about the features that are available on ac units. You mentioned a blue UV light in one of your videos... this one? I dunno. At any rate, where I am they're all car salesmen and you can't believe anything they say and it's virtually impossible to get an apples to apples comparison. Your videos have helped SO MUCH. I really appreciate everything that you're doing. I've shared your videos all over the place. You are the best of RUclips.
Last year we installed a VS system into our 120 year old, 1,500 sq ft craftsman cottage in humid, Houston TX. It made the home dramatically more comfortable. It does not run absolutely continuously as you say. It will shut off when it requires less than 25% of capacity to hold target temperature. It holds target humidity perfectly, all the time. One other advantage to VS systems, is they don't have a huge current draw on start-up. This makes it possible to run them from a standby generator. Our 4T VS system start-up surge is just 12A(vs 90A+ for the old system.) We can run our entire home from a 9.5 kW invertor generator. Which we might need to do after a hurricane strike.
Great video, very basic explanation of a confusing topic. Really liked your auto comparison, makes it easy to understand. Thanks for sharing. My AC is 14 yrs old and has a leak. I decided to replace my 4 ton one stage unit with an upgraded 2 stage unit.
I recently evaluated the cost benefit of two stage vs single stage heat pump replacing a single stage ac unit and single stage gas furnace. The energy savings was such that the payback against the higher initial cost was 11 years. MUCH too long in my mind considering the life expectancy is about 15 years. I got prices on variable speed units but the price difference was double again that of the two stage machine. Also, the repair costs of variable speed units are astronomical due to the proprietary circuit boards that are typically the weak point for reliability. Availability of these boards can be an issue if a quick turn around on repairs are desired. I’m told that these boards are not usually carried in the truck due to the high cost unlike capacitors that are currently the most common failure. Ultimately, I went with a single stage heat pump with a two stage natural gas back up. With this, I got a reliable, more energy efficient system (heat pump), at the lowest installed cost with the lowest repair costs.
@@raindogs451 Incorrect. If you can run in 1st stage longer than you could with just 1 stage, you'll be saving energy since your system will be operating at peak efficiency more often. In addition, it is easier for the compressor to start up as well.
@@hj8607 This only applies to older Trane two compressor XL18 and XL20i systems. That system is no longer made. Everyone else either uses the Copeland hot gas bypass compressor design or Carrier and company for their highest end Infinity systems from around the 2000s used a Bristol compressor that either ran one or two pistons to adjust capacity, which was an utter disaster for reliability (switched to the Copeland compressor sometime ago). Infinity Greenspeed uses a fully variable compressor.
@@raindogs451 have to disagree. We replaced our original single-stage equipment last year and found that it provided greater comfort. No more warm spots and our home feels cooler with the new system with the stat set at 71 than it did with the old system with the stat set at 68. In fact 3/4 of us feel that when the new system is set to 70 is too cold. I know it’s debatable whether 2-stage saves $ but in my experience it absolutely offers greater comfort.
I recently told my TStat I had a single instead of dual stage. See in 2 stage, the fan is slower in 1st stage. Problem, air flow wasn't high enough and we had hot spots. So instead I experimented and tuned the CFM of the fan to my single stage. This resulted in no hot/cold spots, ideal humidity, and good run times. Still early in testing phase, but so far so good.
Here in Phoenix Arizona I think the single stage works best at cooling the entire house without hot spots. The muti-stage systems take forever to cool and leave hot spots here. Plus the air is so dry here that I dont want the AC to make it any dryer.
Yeah, I found a $6k system 96% efficiency Tempstar with an ECM that’s tuned and running all the time does better than two stage ac and furnace. And half the price.
If one sizes their AC system for slightly over the average summer day temperature, rather than the hottest possible days, perhaps a single stage would be the most efficient and the fan would be running most of the time. I live in MN and I tend to run my fan continuously (from the thermostat), especially in the summer and during the sub-zero times in the winter. Keeps the house temps more uniform.
I chose a two stage unit because I wanted to oversize my HVAC, (to deal with those occasional heat waves or cold snaps) and didn't want short cycling and comfort issues . When the target temperature is close (within 2 to 3 degrees) my unit uses less energy and cycles less. When the heat load increases or the room temperature is too far from the target temp. the unit kicks in to full mode, seems to reduce overall kwh usage. It's like having two separate systems, one small and one large where as the smaller, less energy consuming unit works until the larger more energy consuming unit is needed.
I have a small older home, in Kentucky, and in 2015, I had all the windows replaced, and had a Carrier variable speed system installed. Since then, the system has pretty much paid for itself with the savings in utility bills. It keeps the house very comfortable, and does it quietly. It wasn't cheap, but it's been a life saver, because I have COPD, and by keeping the humidity down constantly, I can breathe much easier.
Very nice video. I was in HVAC field in the military. So in base housing, you always saw system failures because people wouldn't take care of anything, and you would see homes with windows open with the A/C running. I think the installing company is by far the most important these days. I have an American Standard system and the only problem I had was the motor for the fan failed at 17 years. The technician came out at 7pm to put in a fan motor and I did help him a little. He said basically the same things you are pointing out. The tach told me I had about 7 years of life left on my heat pump and to start saving up for it. He said he would go with a Carrier as well. American Standard has been pricing themselves out of business lately. Goodman was also mentioned, and they are getting better than they used to be. I would consider the SEER rating of a system too. Especially if you live in the Gulf coast area around Alabama or Texas.
@@beammeupscottsp7952 What videos by GrayFurnaceMan. He recommends only using the old style spun floss filters if it is only 1" thick. Buy a separate room air filter to use in problem area.
You are absolutely right about the variable speed system and humidity. I once tested this with a window unit, rewiring it so the fan only ran when the compressor was running. This gave the condensate time to drain between cycles. Setting it on the same temperature as before, the humidity level was noticeably lower and the room felt cooler. Used less electricity too. Having said that, I have found the most cost-effective HVAC setup to be a single stage system and ceiling fans
I don't know about other brands, but Carrier and Bryant both default to a 15 min fan off drain period when dehumidification was called for at any point during a cycle. That's for variable speed. So if it's a hot day the system may run near 100% at minimum fan speed and modulate fan and compressor speed to maintain something like a 40F coil. Once setpoint is reached the compressor and fan will turn off for 15 min before resuming continuous fan circulate. If it's a less demanding day but humid, the system could run at a lower 40% output and even lower speed. It will still stop the fan after temp setpoint and drain. My main issue with the Bryant variable speed is that when it's trying to dehumidify, the fan is running at a crawl. My upstairs gets no air and downstairs gets cold. I don't have any zoning unfortunately to make this work better. I just have to dampen at the registers and increase the minimum cooling cfm or change dehumidify mode fan speed from normal to high.
God Bless You ❤ Cowgirl has learned a ton from your video and now because of you have the knowledge to move forward in what i need to choose for a new Electric Heat Pump Air Conditioner..... Southeastern Indiana ❤
As a retired Bryant territory manager , bravo. Good unbiased explanation of what’s available out there. I loved selling the 698B with the 50% unloading scroll. I guess it’s gone now. Been out of the game for a decade.
We love our Bryant 880TA 4-ton drive VCA blower furnace, Bryant 189BNV048 Air conditioner, Bryant Connex thermostat and AprilAire filtration system and humidifier for year round usage here in Denver. I love the 5-stage AC unit as it spends a majority of it's time in 1-3 stages and runs a continuous fan to make sure all areas of the home are about the equal temperature. I am now a Bryant dealer.
Excellent commentary. I would add as pro’s for multistage systems. 1. Better for zoning 2. No more hard starts so you dont have to have a huge generator or add soft starts to the unit. 3. Variable speed heat pumps can go down to lower temps (
This is all great info! I live in Colorado and have a two-story home with one furnace in the attic and one furnace in the basement. I decided to go with two-stage furnaces on both levels. And to pay for that two-stage AC upstairs. It works out awesome that way. The upper unit does all the work in the summer and the lower unit does most of the work in the winter. I only wish I would've opted for a 90% efficient furnace in the Basement. I went with 80% in the attic because it gets so cold up there in the winter I was afraid it might condensate in the PVC. You probably have the best info on RUclips. I'm signing up just to follow you 🙂
80% units are far superior and you probably just need a little larger furnace in the basement to overcome the temperature and a VCA blower motor to push that hot air up to the upper levels of the home. I own an HVAC business that also does insulation upgrades. A high insulation factor in your attic allows for a smaller furnace on the lower portion of the home. It is very inexpensive to upgrade but makes a huge different in cooling, heating, sound deadening and critter deterrent. High-efficiency furnaces are rarely worth their cost.
The Condensate Water may Freeze in the Winter in the attic, not Condensate! That is the worst case for too cold an attic, unless you have Spray Foam insulation in the Roof Joist, then the temp will not go to freezing in the South Eastern Zones, don't know about the North.
I bought a Carrier knock off Arco Aire. It is veritable but to 6 district speeds. So simpler freq drive. But it runs almost continuous so it dehumidifies continuous. I recommend this style unit. 40 years experience in the industry
When the fan runs constantly your evaporator works just like a water pad on a humidifier and puts all that water back in the house. I have seen a 5% drop in humidity when letting fan turn off between cycles, try it!
@@kenthomas4668 Ken I agree with you if you have a single speed compressor. But the question was about multi speed compressors. My Arco/Carrier unit had a compressor inverter that would run the compressor down to 5000btu. The evaporator stayed at saturated temperature so continued to dehumidify. The condenser and evaporator fan also slowed down and sped up to maintain evaporator and condenser temperature/pressures. What you say is true with a single speed or possibly a 2 speed. But the newer inverter style compressor, the evaporators will not give up the condensation back to the air.
I live in an area where AC is needed for about 3.5 mo./yr. 11 yr. ago, when I replaced my 47 yo systems, I chose simple single stage units. The total cost for 2 complete systems installed with 10 yr. transferrable parts and service warranty was $6200. That included 5" filter boxes and TXVs replacing piston valves. To avoid the short cycling you described it's very important that the units be correctly sized for the space. If you buy units that are too large thinking they will air condition "better", you will have those issues. It's MUCH better to have units that are on the small side for the space than too large. Allowing a little increase in thermostat "swing" will solve some of those short cycling problems.
I've been in countless homes with undersized AC systems. I have NEVER been in one that had an oversized system that caused problems. If you have trouble with humidity with an oversized system it is because it is not set up properly. The laws of physics dictate that an oversized system will dehumidify better than an insufficient system so if that's not the result you're getting it was installed incorrectly. Usually the setting for drying the coils after a cooling cycle is defaulted to ON to get better SEER ratings. You want that setting OFF.
I have a variable speed furnace with variable a/c. The biggest advantage not mentioned is how quiet the system is. 90% of the time you can’t hear it operating inside the house. Outside is a low hum. I have the best Trane thermostat but it doesn’t show the variable operation under usage. It only shows heat or second stage heat. On cool it shows cool or second stage. For what these systems cost I would have thought it would provide more granular information.
Have always had 2 ton 3 ton 2 stage systems, but do to pandemic supply issues had to go with a single 3 ton unit which has provided quite comfortable temperatures and humidity removal. Although I am not a HAVC person, in my opinion, I think that proper sizing is a very critical aspect when selecting a heating or AC unit.
"Proper sizing" generally means bigger equipment is worse for both temps and humidity which is the route you may have went here. (Obviously, sizing depends on the square footage of the home, climate, insulation values, etc). Also, going with a DC, ECM fan motor also helps in this area too. With the great efficiency gained in electricity costs, u can now turn your indoor fan to run 24/7 or to cycle on every 15 minutes for more even home temperatures.
Same applies to geothermal heatpump. I just replaced a single stage with a two stage. Heat is definitely more even throughout the house. One really nice side effect is much quieter operation most of the time and better air filtration. Humidifier works better too. Can't wait to see its performance in air conditioning mode.
I bought a 10K Midea U shaped window ac to cool half my house. It's variable speed and super quiet even on high. It runs most of the time ramping up and down and it will shut off completely if it's cool enough. The thing is a beast easily cooling four rooms including a kitchen, living room, family room, and dining room. And again super quiet. I don't know how long it will last but so far so good. We have an old Trane central ac but the electric bill just kills me in the summer. I think this will be cheaper to run, but we're not quite into summer yet.
Variable speed was worth every penny in my house. I live in a high humidity area and it helps keep my indoor humidity comfortable by running low all day long.
@@smokeysmith1282 I live 20 miles north of New Orleans. In a the low land marshes. My nest has a humidity sensor and I have a few other ones. Ones on a weather station with indoor and outdoor stats.
My home has a Trane XV18 variable speed system. It does in fact turn off once temp and humidity settings are reached. Six years old, it has always worked this way.
You need to look at multizone systems if you want the most comfort and reduced run times. Problem most HVAC installers are not up to doing the more detailed design and installation required. The cost per zone is about $500. Most installers have a cut and go approach.
@@wildcaveman5310 if you have pressure equalizer in a loop back you can keep the pressure equalized. My two multizone (3) single speed systems have been for running 22 years with no issues with a pressure equalizer. It's part of design details that need be understood by a good installer/designer.
@@larkincrutcher3424 bypass dampers can function but are inherently inefficient. Also very careful planning needs to be done to not overcool the coil leading to liquid in the compressor. Yes it can be done but that doesn’t make it a good design.
Have a Trane variable speed system installed about 6 years ago, my electric bill went from $194 a month down to $118 a month. Although due to rise in electricity prices now, my electric bill is now is $177 a month. Just love the Trane Home software on my android phone, shows me the daily and monthly temperature history back a full year as well as average temp for any given month. Don't notice any excess humidity in the house ever, even when we get a full week of 90 degree days.
We had a Bryant variable speed furnace and AC installed in Minnesota. The blower ran 24 x 7, but almost always at a very low and very quiet speed. The temperature was very uniform during the winter and summer. It was drastically better than the old single speed furnace and AC. When the AC was running it would alternate between “cooling” and “dehumidification” on the thermostat. When the system alternated between “cooling” and “dehumidification”, it got rid of the excess humidity without making the house feel too cold. We moved to Florida, where heat pumps are used for AC and heating, plus there are air handlers in the garage. Is there a variable speed HVAC heat pump system? Can a heat pump system alternate between “cooling” and “dehumidification”? There’s also whole house dehumidification that could be added which is supposed to remove humidity better when the outside humidity is high, but the outside temperatures aren’t very warm, like in the upper 60’s or low 70’s.
Lennox makes the El18vpv heat pump.mic you use their S30- thermostat it will run variable speed. Mitsubishi also makes the SUZducted variable speed heat pump by far the most quiet unit ever made.
Bryant makes a variable speed AC and a Rotary 5-stage AC system. They also offer these units in HP models. You can use an AHU instead of a furnace but personally, I would still buy a furnace as you will need heat strips for emergency heat, just in case as AUX heat. Two stage 80% two-stage furnaces are really inexpensive in Florida because very few people buy them. You can probably score a smoking deal. You can have humidification 24/7 on this furnace or AHU and offer the best cooling. I prefer the 5 stage system because it is 25%, 40%, 65%, 80% and 100% of cooling modes and will change as the Bryant Connex thermostat will control. The fan will run constantly and as can be increased and decreased to support humidification. You can run 350 CFM per ton of cooling. I am not sure if your home has one or two HVAC systems. The goal is to run from 72-75 degrees around 45-55% humidity. AprilAire has dehumidifiers that can be hooked into your return air ducting and it will pull the humidity down further, which will feel much cooler. I hope this helps. Bryant and Carrier are the same brand but the Bryant Evolution is the matching Carrier Infinity. You can get straight AC or a HP in either model and brand. If that does not work for you, Daikin/Amana also has a variable speed system that is also amazing for a reasonable price. Please comment, if you have any questions and I will get back to you as soon as I can.
MN is fun to heat/cool. 100+ degrees with dew points in the upper 60’s to lower 70’s in the summer. Winter brings -25 to -35 not factoring wind chills. It’s crazy
Thank you so much for posting this helpful, easy-to-understand video. We need to replace both our heater & air conditioner and were leaning toward a variable-speed unit, but after learning our house probably just isn't big enough to warrant the expense we're reconsidering.
I live in an area where the potential for AC use is year round with 9 months of continuous cooling. I got a VFD 3 ton unit and I would never go back to a single speed unit. It was at least $50 a month in savings. The value is completely based on where you live and your house.
How does using a single speed compressor with a variable air handler compare in terms of efficiency and comfort? I am finding tons of videos and info on 2-speed and variable compressor systems but nothing on a single speed system with the newer premium/variable air handler
Good on explaining the different stages Of condensing units. ie A/C Single, two, or variable speed but with that comes SEER ratings and how going up 1 SEER is about a 15% increase in efficiency And how a single stage standard is 14 SEER now. Where years ago might have only been 10 SEER or how a new 2 stage unit can be up to 18 SEER in efficiency. Or a variable speed unit could be up to 24 SEER in efficiency. Explaining SEER ratings goes hand in hand with the kind of unit a person may buy. Or need. It definitely helps when you talk about how one is more efficient than the other. SEER ratings are everything And there was no mention of that in this video.
I have installed 2 stage units since 1987 and everyone loves them , overall life is as good or better than most units . Fly by companies and techs don’t know how to operate single stage and are completely lost on anything with more than 2 wires
I live in Florida so humidity is an issue with comfort in and air conditioned space. My A/C when out at my old house. I went from a 12seer to a 17.75seer two stage system. The two stage system did run longer but it controlled the humidity so you could run it a degree or two hotter and get the same comfort. It also dropped the power bill by about $30-$40 a month. My new house (still in FL) has a cheap builder's grade A/C but since it was sized to less tons per square foot than the older house, it runs frequently enough to keep humidity in check. And since the new house has better insulation and double pained glass, the power bills are about the same between the two house (1600sq/ft on the old house, 2800sq/ft on the new house). When the current system bits the dust, I will be replacing it with a 2 stage on the new house too. I am hoping the extra air flow will help the "hot spot" in the computer room/office and over all drop my power bill again.
Great informative video, thank you! Here are my opinions after 21-years in the HVAC industry, from service to sales: The AC system is not only removing heat from your home but it is also dehumidifying. However, it's ONLY dehumidifying when it's running. This is why a two-stage or more system does a much better job of dehumidifying which makes you more comfortable in your home and I recommend them if you have ranch style home. The problem with staged AC-system is if you have a 2-Story home, because multi-stage AC's run lower, longer. They don't run in high long enough to help push the heavier, denser air upstairs, thereby you can end up with higher temps upstairs than you would have with a single-stage AC system. Unless you have a zoned system for up and down, I recommend single-stage AC systems to my customers and if you live in a ranch then you will love the extra comfort of multi-stage ac systems. Price of course will be the deciding factor in all decision-making. And please understand that with the higher and higher efficiency ratings mandated by the EPA on the HVAC manufacturers, these units don't last 20, 30 or 40 years anymore. Get a 10-Year Parts & Labor warranty if you can and then cross your fingers after it expires. Finally, make sure the company who installs the new equipment is going to still be in business for the next ten-years it's under warranty too!
We did variable speed. Added returns in each room upstairs..problem solved. Definitely a consideration if u able to change design or cost of zoning controls is a factor.
I have had two stage Heatpump system that replaced an old single-stage gas A/C for 4 months and experienced both heating, cooling. I also have a new single-stage gas A/C on other side of the same home that was installed before the heat pump 2 stage system and I can make out the difference post install. It is the best. I no longer have humidity issues in the home. It is night and day more comfortable than a single stage. They are both Trane systems.
One of the things he did not mention is multi-zone mini-splits normally operate as variable speed because the variable number of inside evap units needing to run at any given time.
I have a Bryant, 5 stage compressor, variable speed fan/blower each, it does on/off. The fans will run after compressor turns off to dehumidify. I live South Louisiana, high humidity, It is the most confirmable system ever had.
I install the AmanaGoodman 2 stage and it’s very good. Also install a lot of Gree Flexx would suggest you look at it as a very good cost vs value option. Variable speed outdoor but single speed indoor. Uses any thermostat and qualified for tax credit.
He’s right and i agree with it all. Those houses feel stale and the air isn’t comfortable-ppl who live in them are usually old and don’t care. It kind of reminds me of the old days when like old ppl especially Italians or polish ppl don’t open their windows in NY because they didn’t want to clean dust off of all the Chinaware and Nick nacks in the house. So this time period I’m talking about nobody had A/C even if they had money-they just didn’t waste money on it for 2x weeks of hot weather a year plus the nights get cool and a lot of ppl would open windows at night to let in cool fresh air to sleep. I live in Florida now and I’m a builder & you can’t open windows at night cuz it’s 80 humid degrees out-so i know a bit about what this guy is saying. I’ve seen the variable speed brand new units in freshly built homes or freshly remodeled homes or apt complexes grow mold with in a month or 2. I don’t recommend them to anyone -I’ve seen nasty stuff happen and it’s not healthy for this part of country and i don’t even think it’s good for up north-the air in the house seems stale. The 2 speed is worth the money ppl-you will save a lot on electric and make the extra cost back pretty quick. Same goes for the pool. You want the same. If you just stick a single speed in vs 2 stage on pool it’s easy an extra $100 a month electric difference. If you use a variable speed pool pump don’t set it too low in RPMs because it won’t really clean the pool it’s moving water too slow and ppl don’t realize the bad stuff in the pool is in the top 6 inches of water and you want to remove that layer over and over to keep it safe. A clear water pool doesn’t mean it’s safe. It can have bad bacteria in that top 6 inches. So AC unit and pool pump will have same issues if RPMs are set too low-it equals stale not healthy air or water. But definitely get 2 stage and save money and it will last longer. You will make money back quickly. And on pool pump you can set RPMs of the motor so you can make it so it acts like a 2 stage or make your own settings of a w stage & have it kick higher every couple hours to skim top layer off fast then kick down to low speed for awhile. We should have that type of control on our ac units on an app so you can set speed of motor for different parts of day or according to weather.
Yeah, I’m trying to weigh overall what I meed it to do (keep my house at 70 F, at the lowest cost overall including monthly bills and new systems every 15 yrs). The lowest cost system due to easier to repair and replace seems more cost effective to do the same task.
In my practical experience a portable dehumidifier is a great help in making a house comfortable during the times when the weather is not really hot. It adds some heat load making the system run more, plus it dehumidifies. If you have an old house I love a lot of small window units.
a window AC unit can be similarly priced, and often has a dehumidify option, but this places the heat load outside. Its a bit more expensive, but its also more efficient, however, its higher maintenance if you dont plan to incorporate it into your heating/cooling as you dont want to leave modern window AC units in place if you're not using them because they seem to all be designed to retain water so the fan can splash water up onto the condenser, though modifications could probably be made so that water is not retained.
@@denvera1g1I drilled a hole in the bottom of mine. I thought it was suppose to drain out 😂. Anyway, it cooled better and stays quiet with a drain hole.
@@seabass22 I think the water is supposed to increase efficiency by splashing up onto the condenser, allowing for evaporative cooling of the condenser. Extremely humid and hot climates might not see much of a difference, but it shouldnt reduce the cooling performance compared to no water, its still added surface area after all
Thoughts on a single stage condenser with a two stage gas furnace? My biggest concern is the humidity. Since installing new insulation in attic and new roof, the amount of humidity is noticeably higher. The most recent estimate I got he said I didn't need to get. 2 stage or variable.
I upgraded to a variable speed 5 ton carrier heat pump, propane furnace dual fuel system. Cost me around 9k including installation. 2500 sq ft, single story house. I am very happy with it! Hardly ever notice it's running and it does turn off, usually in the evening. Heat pump reaches its limit around 10-12 degrees then the furnace takes over. On average I'm saving $20 a month on electric and only fill once every 3 years on propane as appose to annually before.
The answer to this question depends on where you live. In my area some homes end up needing a dehum but it’s cheaper monthly to use a 2 stage or variable speed for dehum than run both of them.
Great video!! Just a quick question would 2 stage be better for a house which has less optimal insulation? Parts of the house has cold spots and half of the second floor is above garage and is usually colder during winter and warm during summer. Any thoughts?
I like the new water heaters and cloths driers that are air conditioners. I also like it when the condensers are coated in water to become like evaporative cooler powered.
Your video is very informative for the layman yo understand. It was professionally done and I like how the sound was done. Thanks, now I think I have a better idea what type of AC im going to purchase.
I would add that yes a two stage or variable is more and may not get your return it has to do more than money. A two stage or variable system helps with comfort and for some the extra cost is worth it.
Agreed. Along with temp/humidity comfort, there is noise comfort. I've lived in places where the TV volume needed to be adjusted to the on/off cycles of single stage systems.
I think it also depends on the type of insulation and age of the house, newer sealed houses would benefit from variable or multi stage systems. My house is not sealed like a new house, so i sealed and insulated the best i could, installed a higher seer system, and a whole house dehumidifier. I use the ecobee enhanced to run the AC and dehumidifier. I added some ecobee remote sensors to keep the temp more level through out rooms.
As someone who worked as a tech and installed many units of different grades. My next unit will be variable speed. They cost more but in my opinion are worth it. The unit only runs as hard as it needs to. I live in NW Alabama (Hot and muggy) I put a one ton heat pump in my workshop My bill was $34 in August and I figure about $5 of that is lighting.
Are the fans for blowing the air through the house variable speed too? I'm used to the fan being noisy and that would be annoying if I had to listen to them it all day.
I also installed an economizer, with it’s own thermostat. So I can run it with or without the A/C. It works really well bringing in cool night air all night with the A/C off.
@@lmeredeemed5043 In as much as it replaces inside air with outside air, yes, but that's where the similarity ends. No windows or doors need to be open, and the outside air is passed through the system filter before being discharged through the HVAC registers. It's more akin to the fresh air damper on a car HVAC system.
Hello learn a lot from your video,but have question, new ac unit install created vacuum? My man don’t know why ,would you please help it sucking more than it blow? Must appreciate if you able tell me how to solving this problem
My variable compressor is chugging away, efficiently and quietly satisfying demands, especially during this year’s heat waves. That is in my house. Commercially, a slightly different system can use large variable output compressors that are additionally staged in order to satisfy demand. Regardless of application, control systems are the crux of design (including retro-fits) and must be carefully chosen for best return on investment.
Added notation has us all aware of cost of utilities our systems are subject to in sometimes complex ways. While Return On Investment underlies many considerations, achieving maximum ROI must include examination of many facets, sometimes almost laughably including ‘newer’ practices, such as frictionless magnetic crankshaft bearings. However, controlling HVACR systems to accommodate rapidly changing energy pricing structures. Not only must we consider our basic rate, but other elements such as time of day usage, and ‘demand’ rates may easily affect what we pay. For example, a n additional startup of a compressor that does not have ‘soft start-up’ hardware, may trigger a demand rate for an entire month, regardless of how long that load runs, even if for just a few minutes. Reactively controlling systems is best left to electronically controlled systems, with computer interface for the operators, be they a single homeowner or a commercial building operator, technician, supervisor, manager or owner. Teamwork matters.
Have a 2 speed Trane. Ultimate comfort. Properly sized, it just keeps the house very comfortable. The old unit would turn on/off creating muggy feeling or hot spots. Worth the money. In addition, I was able to keep the temp set a few degrees warmer as result. I did see a savings on monthly bill.
What does variable speed refer to? There are two main components, the compressor and the fan that pumps the air thru the house. Is it slowing down both, the compressor and the fan?
Here in Phoenix Arizona we dont get much humidity so its not an issue plus the air is so dry here the more the 2 stage blows the more uncomfortable my sinuses are. I actually have to put humidity back in the air here. I like the single stage in the hot desert.
I sell either two-speed or inverter/variable VOLUME (of refrigeration) in Florida due our humidity. The inverter/ volume can be programmed to a set % of humidity. This is great feature for health and comfort.
" minimal difference in initial cost" that's really surprising to hear. I'm getting quotes for variable systems that are over doubling the single speed system quotes. I'm talking 10k vs 26k type of different which is pretty a damn huge difference imo. I want the variable speed, but I was hoping for like 15-18k not 26k.
@@hobblyjig that’s insane. Mind you, my system was installed in fall 20, and I’m in the Midwest so not sure what the current market conditions are like, or how they compare to you locally. At the time, for the 4 ton gas furnace and a/c choices I was given between a 13 seer single stage ranged from about 10.5 and 13k for the variable speed. Now, I did pay about $17k total for the project because they were also installing a whole new duct system (doing a whole-house renovation essentially), the old system was a heat pump with electric heat so they had to run gas, new line set, everything. But on paper there was really only about a $2500 difference between equipment cost on the two systems. To me that’s minimal in the big picture considering the comfort and convenience of one over the other imho, but maybe he was able to make up some higher margins on the extra work, I don’t know. That’s not to say I didn’t have some outrageous bids, also, but the key difference was finding a small local installer that doesn’t have 40+ fancy work trucks running around town. That’s been my experience anyway.
Here’s where I’m at with this, I know if you have the money a fancier system is great. However, they are a lot more expensive to repair, not to mention the cost difference to start with. For that reason, I won’t even install a variable speed system unless the customer has tons of money and can afford it. But to each his own on this matter.
Why do you say the “blower is always running” at 9:03 referring to variable systems? I have a carrier infinity system and located in Georgia. My fan is set to auto, should it be set to on? My home isn’t large but I do have spray foam and new windows.
I went from a 2 ton single stage to a 3 ton variable stage and I don't regret it. It kept my my house alot cooler and it dropped my electricity bill almost $150 month. That was in a 1400 sq ft home in 2016. I did have it financed which cost me around $200 a month, so with the energy savings I was essentially $50 a month. I bought my next house in 2021 which had a 3.5 ton single stage AC and the end of the year I replaced it and got a 5 ton variable. I'll probably never get a single stage AC. I'll get a two stage before I ever consider single stage.
Got myself a variable inverter mini split and I am quite satisfied. I use it at 40% capacity for higher dehumidification and at 110% for extra cooling. Both are without any time limit which is the selling point.
@@rufflesinc Some units are designed to run above rated capacity. For example, our Maytag IQ Drive runs from 40% up thru 118% So, our 3 ton system can run like a 3.5 ton system if circumstances call for it. I don't know why they just don't call it a 3.5 ton system that runs from 20% - 100%.
One of the main benefits of a Variable speed system is humidity control and when set up and sized properly it should work better than a 2-stage system. The variable systems will shut off if there isn't a demand. We install 2-stage and variable Carrier / ICP almost exclusively around my area. When it's 95 degrees and 80% RH the variables will out perform the 2-stage.
We got a variable system in our old house and I remember the day they installed it and turned it on it seemed like the house temperature dropped quickly, but it wasn't the temperature it was the fact it had sucked out all the humidity that made 76 degrees seem like 65. Our summer utility bills went from about $280/mo to about $150 a month. It was crazy how much of a difference it made.
@@cadamham in NC we regularly get 90 degrees with 75% humidity in summer and it can be 80+ degrees and 90% humidity at 3am. and thats going to get far more common and worse the next 5 to 10 years
I’ve had all types, but now have a variable speed. I like the fact that it keeps the house exactly on temperature, but it is hard to get used to the fact that it n ver shuts off.
I have a houseboat. I just had an air conditioning company install the carrier two-stage 17-seer heat pump. All electric. 3-ton. The dealer told me that a 3-ton would be more than efficient. It is not. Our 1999 house walls are 1" thick plywood with no insulation in the walls and the windows are single pane. Keep in mind there are several windows on a houseboat. When the houseboat was built in 1999 they installed a 3-ton train air handler heat pump unit, single stage. We did buy the boat 9 years ago and it has never been sufficient. It always struggled to get down to 74° on a day with the outside temperature being roughly 80 to 85 degrees. The carrier just installed is a 3-ton and has 2 speeds on the indoor fan motor. Both of those are so low that it doesn't push out the cold air as much as we needed them to. My question is it was just installed 4 days ago and we are not pleased with it. I looked online and I was very impressed with the infinity carrier 18VS. We do have hotspot areas in the houseboat. I am considering the 4-ton infinity 18VS. Since this unit that we have now was installed 4 days ago and I will be contacting the installing company to upgrade to a 4-ton because he told him several times that a 3-ton will do the job. I am concerned about him asking for a lot more money for the 18VS infinity unit upgrade because basically, he would be installing an air conditioning unit 2 times. I don't mind paying more for the 4-ton 18VS but at the same time, I don't want to be paying more in labor costs because of their mistake. They are basically going to have to install the 2nd unit for free. I'm hoping someone can tell me what is the dealer cost for both of these units. The indoor unit that they installed is product #FV4CNB005L00EEAA model#FV4CNB005. The outdoor unit is product #25HCB636A0031030, model #25HCB636A310. I want to pay this contractor the difference between both of these units. I just don't want to pay them twice for installing the correct-sized unit when they should've got it right the 1st time.
I'm not sure if it's been mentioned already, but it doesn't make much sense to say that a variable speed system doesn't remove as much humidity, since the surface tension on the evaporator can only hold so much water. It has to drip off, and while the evaporator may rarely if ever get dry, it should still remove just as much water, if not more.
Totally agree with your statement about the humidity and the variable speed system. I’ve used a couple of inverter air conditioners many many times they do not remove the humidity. In fact, humidity increases as the inverter decreases its speed. You need ice cold coil to remove humidity a cool coil will not do that at all and the humidity will continue to rise.
That's only true if it's not designed/setup properly ..... One you don't need an 'ice cold coil" you only need it to be below the dew point by a few degrees but above freezing .... Secondly in a properly designed/setup variable speed system the blower fan speed is lowered in step with the compressor/condenser fan speed ..... When you move less air across the evaporator then it absorbs less heat and stays below the dewpoint and you still get condensation/dehumidification and because it's always moving air you don't get hot/humid spots like an upstairs where the return air is often choked off by length and limited places to run return air ducts. Return air is the more important part of dehumidification and cooling in general because if you can't get the hot humid air back to the evap coil then the refrigerant can't absorb the heat or remove the humidity
@@longjohn526 well put. Each time I tried several inverter air conditioners. I measured the humidity carefully, and as the compressor went down, so did the evap and condenser fans the humidity rose in the space yet in the same space when I try a cycling unit that also cycled off the fan and the humidity remained more constant.
I hope your aren't confusing *relative* humidity vs actual water content. Because as temps decrease, relative humidity goes up. While what you are saying does make sense, your inverter unit has to make a choice - maintain a target temp vs a target dew point. The intersection of both at levels of what you want may not happen, but you won't get there any better with a non inverter unit. All a single stage unit does with a thermostat that accounts for humidity just internally drops its set point by around 2 deg F.
the common issue in my little town: most of the homes are 100ish years old. They had various upgrades as things became available. ff to now and its been retrofitted with central air/heat initially in the 60's and updated furnaces as they wore out or got cold air added- the common issue for almost all of the houses is the conditioned air does not make it to the upstairs or rooms furthest away from the unit. There are vents there but nothing comes out of them. The basement gets ice cold, most of the downstairs receives a sufficient supply. Blocking vents just makes the a coil freeze up. Mine has a huge unit i dont know the btu but I am not only speaking about my house. Is there a fix that does not require replacing or adding units to the houses? In my case I believe the unit has plenty of conditioned air to give but the restrictive ducts dont deliver very far so it gets dumped into the basement to prevent the A coil from freezing up.
running a single stage 8o% gas furnace now. looking at adding either a heat pump or AC for the summers. one of the quotes I got was for a variable speed inverter heat pump. would the efficiency benefits of that be negated by my existing furnace?
I like the simple systems. Single speed, less controls to fail.
With that said, nothing beats opening a panel to see the VFD say "GND FLT" and you know immediately to break out the megger, or an undervoltage alarm that stopped the unit from running during a brownout. I think the majority of the hate for variable (or even contactor two-stage) comes from companies installing the absolute cheapest controls they can get.
@@ShutupimslowIn English, please.
@@afridgetoofar1818 The more complicated systems help by giving you diagnostic information, and some of the problems with more complicated systems come from installers using cheaper controls. I would add ignorance by the installer and poor training of the homeowner as problems as well.
@@got2liv4him Trane uses high-quality controls in their variable speed systems and the inverters have short-circuit protection so the inverter locks out instead of letting itself get fried and gives out an alert code.
@@davidperry4013 I was translating shutupimslow's comment for afridgetofar1818.... and lol about Trane's high quality controls...
You not only know what you're talking about, but your presentation is first class. Thank you.
This is a good video for those of us needing to replace our older, worn out systems. Of the three types, we were able to eliminate the variable speed. Your words were well delivered. Nice job.
A quantum leap backwards!
Id say installing antique single speed single stage systems after 2023 is out of desperation because you only have that type available due to back logs of the newer seer2 or that’s my understanding!
Just had you guys install a 4 ton system in our home. They did a great job and the unit was installed skillfully.
A properly sealed single stage. Then, thermo image a year later. Checking for leaks. And lots of insulation and a couple of properly placed trees. This has always been my solution for my rentals in the great state of Texas
Variable speed was recommended for my heat pump so that it can run all the time for both cooling and heating. Works pretty well.
variable speed blows away even dual stage
Really good description of how they work and pros and cons of each.
I have the top Trane multi stage, variable speed furnace basement unit. LOVE IT. In an OLD 1,500 sf drafty home, with a bedroom and baby room built onto the house decades after the house was built. The addition vent work was done poorly and improperly and impractical to R&R given I'm 70, single, on a tiny fixed income. This fan runs very slow but is always on to help circulate cool or warm from the rooms that have better ventilation to the 2 rooms that have poor ventilation from ducts not well designed or installed!
This is huge, it works, and when retrofitting an old drafty home that needs new windows you cannot afford yet need a furnace/AC, I'd say this is mandatory. With the minus 16 cold snap here, this unit worked GREAT and the fan normally runs slow and almost silent even when actively pushing warmed air - but at minus 16 this baby KICKS ON THE AFTERBURNERS!!! The old type furnaces cannot adjust this well to need and when they are between cycles, they do nothing to circulate the warm room air to the cooler room. If you have a home like mine, spend the extra money and get what I got. Mine came with a 10 year warranty and I won't even live that long, so................... :)
4 months later are u still alive
Be nice!
Money better spent on INSULATION!
I would like you to make a video about the features that are available on ac units. You mentioned a blue UV light in one of your videos... this one? I dunno. At any rate, where I am they're all car salesmen and you can't believe anything they say and it's virtually impossible to get an apples to apples comparison. Your videos have helped SO MUCH. I really appreciate everything that you're doing. I've shared your videos all over the place. You are the best of RUclips.
Last year we installed a VS system into our 120 year old, 1,500 sq ft craftsman cottage in humid, Houston TX. It made the home dramatically more comfortable. It does not run absolutely continuously as you say. It will shut off when it requires less than 25% of capacity to hold target temperature. It holds target humidity perfectly, all the time.
One other advantage to VS systems, is they don't have a huge current draw on start-up. This makes it possible to run them from a standby generator. Our 4T VS system start-up surge is just 12A(vs 90A+ for the old system.) We can run our entire home from a 9.5 kW invertor generator. Which we might need to do after a hurricane strike.
Because that four ton system is drastically oversized and the VS system is operating at the correct capacity to remove moisture.
@@Modernhvacllc Here in South Texas 4T on this size and age of home is dead common. Not considered oversized at all, given the summer heat.
This what I hear of modern VS systems. Thank you for sharing.
Where in houston
@@CCCC-tq8yo The Heights
Perfect and very timely as I'm about to replace my AC and Heater
Great video, very basic explanation of a confusing topic. Really liked your auto comparison, makes it easy to understand. Thanks for sharing. My AC is 14 yrs old and has a leak. I decided to replace my 4 ton one stage unit with an upgraded 2 stage unit.
I recently evaluated the cost benefit of two stage vs single stage heat pump replacing a single stage ac unit and single stage gas furnace. The energy savings was such that the payback against the higher initial cost was 11 years. MUCH too long in my mind considering the life expectancy is about 15 years. I got prices on variable speed units but the price difference was double again that of the two stage machine. Also, the repair costs of variable speed units are astronomical due to the proprietary circuit boards that are typically the weak point for reliability. Availability of these boards can be an issue if a quick turn around on repairs are desired. I’m told that these boards are not usually carried in the truck due to the high cost unlike capacitors that are currently the most common failure. Ultimately, I went with a single stage heat pump with a two stage natural gas back up. With this, I got a reliable, more energy efficient system (heat pump), at the lowest installed cost with the lowest repair costs.
2 stage in AC will save no energy, it is primarily for comfort, and that itself is highly dubious. 2 stage is largely smoke and mirrors.
@@raindogs451 Incorrect. If you can run in 1st stage longer than you could with just 1 stage, you'll be saving energy since your system will be operating at peak efficiency more often. In addition, it is easier for the compressor to start up as well.
@@hj8607 This only applies to older Trane two compressor XL18 and XL20i systems. That system is no longer made. Everyone else either uses the Copeland hot gas bypass compressor design or Carrier and company for their highest end Infinity systems from around the 2000s used a Bristol compressor that either ran one or two pistons to adjust capacity, which was an utter disaster for reliability (switched to the Copeland compressor sometime ago). Infinity Greenspeed uses a fully variable compressor.
After warranty repairs KILL ROI.
@@raindogs451 have to disagree. We replaced our original single-stage equipment last year and found that it provided greater comfort. No more warm spots and our home feels cooler with the new system with the stat set at 71 than it did with the old system with the stat set at 68. In fact 3/4 of us feel that when the new system is set to 70 is too cold. I know it’s debatable whether 2-stage saves $ but in my experience it absolutely offers greater comfort.
I recently told my TStat I had a single instead of dual stage. See in 2 stage, the fan is slower in 1st stage. Problem, air flow wasn't high enough and we had hot spots. So instead I experimented and tuned the CFM of the fan to my single stage. This resulted in no hot/cold spots, ideal humidity, and good run times. Still early in testing phase, but so far so good.
Here in Phoenix Arizona I think the single stage works best at cooling the entire house without hot spots. The muti-stage systems take forever to cool and leave hot spots here. Plus the air is so dry here that I dont want the AC to make it any dryer.
Yeah, I found a $6k system 96% efficiency Tempstar with an ECM that’s tuned and running all the time does better than two stage ac and furnace. And half the price.
If one sizes their AC system for slightly over the average summer day temperature, rather than the hottest possible days, perhaps a single stage would be the most efficient and the fan would be running most of the time. I live in MN and I tend to run my fan continuously (from the thermostat), especially in the summer and during the sub-zero times in the winter. Keeps the house temps more uniform.
I chose a two stage unit because I wanted to oversize my HVAC, (to deal with those occasional heat waves or cold snaps) and didn't want short cycling and comfort issues . When the target temperature is close (within 2 to 3 degrees) my unit uses less energy and cycles less. When the heat load increases or the room temperature is too far from the target temp. the unit kicks in to full mode, seems to reduce overall kwh usage. It's like having two separate systems, one small and one large where as the smaller, less energy consuming unit works until the larger more energy consuming unit is needed.
Derp
Nope wasted money
I have a small older home, in Kentucky, and in 2015, I had all the windows replaced, and had a Carrier variable speed system installed.
Since then, the system has pretty much paid for itself with the savings in utility bills.
It keeps the house very comfortable, and does it quietly.
It wasn't cheap, but it's been a life saver, because I have COPD, and by keeping the humidity down constantly, I can breathe much easier.
replacing the windows was huge, the unit meh!
@@kenthomas4668 For sure! Triple pane does a lot!
Very nice video. I was in HVAC field in the military. So in base housing, you always saw system failures because people wouldn't take care of anything, and you would see homes with windows open with the A/C running.
I think the installing company is by far the most important these days. I have an American Standard system and the only problem I had was the motor for the fan failed at 17 years. The technician came out at 7pm to put in a fan motor and I did help him a little. He said basically the same things you are pointing out. The tach told me I had about 7 years of life left on my heat pump and to start saving up for it. He said he would go with a Carrier as well. American Standard has been pricing themselves out of business lately. Goodman was also mentioned, and they are getting better than they used to be. I would consider the SEER rating of a system too. Especially if you live in the Gulf coast area around Alabama or Texas.
We just a 4 ton unit installed. It comes with a 1 inch slot for filter size 18 30 1. Is merv 8 good for it, can we use merv 11 of needed?
@@beammeupscottsp7952 What videos by GrayFurnaceMan. He recommends only using the old style spun floss filters if it is only 1" thick. Buy a separate room air filter to use in problem area.
You are absolutely right about the variable speed system and humidity. I once tested this with a window unit, rewiring it so the fan only ran when the compressor was running. This gave the condensate time to drain between cycles. Setting it on the same temperature as before, the humidity level was noticeably lower and the room felt cooler. Used less electricity too.
Having said that, I have found the most cost-effective HVAC setup to be a single stage system and ceiling fans
I don't know about other brands, but Carrier and Bryant both default to a 15 min fan off drain period when dehumidification was called for at any point during a cycle. That's for variable speed. So if it's a hot day the system may run near 100% at minimum fan speed and modulate fan and compressor speed to maintain something like a 40F coil. Once setpoint is reached the compressor and fan will turn off for 15 min before resuming continuous fan circulate.
If it's a less demanding day but humid, the system could run at a lower 40% output and even lower speed. It will still stop the fan after temp setpoint and drain.
My main issue with the Bryant variable speed is that when it's trying to dehumidify, the fan is running at a crawl. My upstairs gets no air and downstairs gets cold. I don't have any zoning unfortunately to make this work better. I just have to dampen at the registers and increase the minimum cooling cfm or change dehumidify mode fan speed from normal to high.
God Bless You ❤ Cowgirl has learned a ton from your video and now because of you have the knowledge to move forward in what i need to choose for a new Electric Heat Pump Air Conditioner..... Southeastern Indiana ❤
As a retired Bryant territory manager , bravo. Good unbiased explanation of what’s available out there.
I loved selling the 698B with the 50% unloading scroll. I guess it’s gone now.
Been out of the game for a decade.
If you are referring to the 50% reciprocating compressor by Bristol, that was a collasal pos.
We love our Bryant 880TA 4-ton drive VCA blower furnace, Bryant 189BNV048 Air conditioner, Bryant Connex thermostat and AprilAire filtration system and humidifier for year round usage here in Denver. I love the 5-stage AC unit as it spends a majority of it's time in 1-3 stages and runs a continuous fan to make sure all areas of the home are about the equal temperature. I am now a Bryant dealer.
Great video buddy, very informative. Was having issues with my unit not knowing it was a Stage 2 system.
Happy I was able to help!
Excellent commentary. I would add as pro’s for multistage systems. 1. Better for zoning 2. No more hard starts so you dont have to have a huge generator or add soft starts to the unit. 3. Variable speed heat pumps can go down to lower temps (
This is all great info! I live in Colorado and have a two-story home with one furnace in the attic and one furnace in the basement. I decided to go with two-stage furnaces on both levels. And to pay for that two-stage AC upstairs. It works out awesome that way. The upper unit does all the work in the summer and the lower unit does most of the work in the winter. I only wish I would've opted for a 90% efficient furnace in the Basement. I went with 80% in the attic because it gets so cold up there in the winter I was afraid it might condensate in the PVC. You probably have the best info on RUclips. I'm signing up just to follow you 🙂
You were right to do 80% in attic. The 90% produce condensate water that would freeze if not in an insulated box.
80% units are far superior and you probably just need a little larger furnace in the basement to overcome the temperature and a VCA blower motor to push that hot air up to the upper levels of the home. I own an HVAC business that also does insulation upgrades. A high insulation factor in your attic allows for a smaller furnace on the lower portion of the home. It is very inexpensive to upgrade but makes a huge different in cooling, heating, sound deadening and critter deterrent. High-efficiency furnaces are rarely worth their cost.
The Condensate Water may Freeze in the Winter in the attic, not Condensate! That is the worst case for too cold an attic, unless you have Spray Foam insulation in the Roof Joist, then the temp will not go to freezing in the South Eastern Zones, don't know about the North.
Great explanation! Never understood all of this but now I do. Fantastic video!!
I bought a Carrier knock off Arco Aire. It is veritable but to 6 district speeds. So simpler freq drive. But it runs almost continuous so it dehumidifies continuous. I recommend this style unit. 40 years experience in the industry
When the fan runs constantly your evaporator works just like a water pad on a humidifier and puts all that water back in the house. I have seen a 5% drop in humidity when letting fan turn off between cycles, try it!
@@kenthomas4668 Ken I agree with you if you have a single speed compressor. But the question was about multi speed compressors. My Arco/Carrier unit had a compressor inverter that would run the compressor down to 5000btu. The evaporator stayed at saturated temperature so continued to dehumidify. The condenser and evaporator fan also slowed down and sped up to maintain evaporator and condenser temperature/pressures. What you say is true with a single speed or possibly a 2 speed. But the newer inverter style compressor, the evaporators will not give up the condensation back to the air.
I appreciate the info. Good to be able to explain the difference in two stage and variable speed
I live in an area where AC is needed for about 3.5 mo./yr. 11 yr. ago, when I replaced my 47 yo systems, I chose simple single stage units. The total cost for 2 complete systems installed with 10 yr. transferrable parts and service warranty was $6200. That included 5" filter boxes and TXVs replacing piston valves. To avoid the short cycling you described it's very important that the units be correctly sized for the space. If you buy units that are too large thinking they will air condition "better", you will have those issues. It's MUCH better to have units that are on the small side for the space than too large. Allowing a little increase in thermostat "swing" will solve some of those short cycling problems.
I've been in countless homes with undersized AC systems. I have NEVER been in one that had an oversized system that caused problems. If you have trouble with humidity with an oversized system it is because it is not set up properly. The laws of physics dictate that an oversized system will dehumidify better than an insufficient system so if that's not the result you're getting it was installed incorrectly. Usually the setting for drying the coils after a cooling cycle is defaulted to ON to get better SEER ratings. You want that setting OFF.
I have a variable speed furnace with variable a/c. The biggest advantage not mentioned is how quiet the system is. 90% of the time you can’t hear it operating inside the house. Outside is a low hum. I have the best Trane thermostat but it doesn’t show the variable operation under usage. It only shows heat or second stage heat. On cool it shows cool or second stage. For what these systems cost I would have thought it would provide more granular information.
for me quiet is not a concern
Have always had 2 ton 3 ton 2 stage systems, but do to pandemic supply issues had to go with a single 3 ton unit which has provided quite comfortable temperatures and humidity removal. Although I am not a HAVC person, in my opinion, I think that proper sizing is a very critical aspect when selecting a heating or AC unit.
"Proper sizing" generally means bigger equipment is worse for both temps and humidity which is the route you may have went here. (Obviously, sizing depends on the square footage of the home, climate, insulation values, etc).
Also, going with a DC, ECM fan motor also helps in this area too. With the great efficiency gained in electricity costs, u can now turn your indoor fan to run 24/7 or to cycle on every 15 minutes for more even home temperatures.
Great teacher. I was able to have an educated conversation with my contractors because of you!
Same applies to geothermal heatpump. I just replaced a single stage with a two stage. Heat is definitely more even throughout the house. One really nice side effect is much quieter operation most of the time and better air filtration. Humidifier works better too. Can't wait to see its performance in air conditioning mode.
Very nice video, echos what my local AC guy told me, always nice to hear it from another source!
I bought a 10K Midea U shaped window ac to cool half my house. It's variable speed and super quiet even on high. It runs most of the time ramping up and down and it will shut off completely if it's cool enough. The thing is a beast easily cooling four rooms including a kitchen, living room, family room, and dining room. And again super quiet. I don't know how long it will last but so far so good. We have an old Trane central ac but the electric bill just kills me in the summer. I think this will be cheaper to run, but we're not quite into summer yet.
Great Job explaining a 2 stage system.Thank You
i am using a ecobee thermostat where I can set the on and off cycles like 15 min on 15min off works good
Variable speed was worth every penny in my house. I live in a high humidity area and it helps keep my indoor humidity comfortable by running low all day long.
What is a typical humidity level that your unit achieves?
What’s your location?
Do you have standalone or individual humidity sensors in your home?
@@smokeysmith1282 I live 20 miles north of New Orleans. In a the low land marshes. My nest has a humidity sensor and I have a few other ones. Ones on a weather station with indoor and outdoor stats.
My home has a Trane XV18 variable speed system. It does in fact turn off once temp and humidity settings are reached. Six years old, it has always worked this way.
You need to look at multizone systems if you want the most comfort and reduced run times. Problem most HVAC installers are not up to doing the more detailed design and installation required. The cost per zone is about $500. Most installers have a cut and go approach.
Never run zone designs without using an inverter (full variable) system. The static pressure will destroy the unit.
@@wildcaveman5310 if you have pressure equalizer in a loop back you can keep the pressure equalized. My two multizone (3) single speed systems have been for running 22 years with no issues with a pressure equalizer. It's part of design details that need be understood by a good installer/designer.
@@larkincrutcher3424 bypass dampers can function but are inherently inefficient. Also very careful planning needs to be done to not overcool the coil leading to liquid in the compressor. Yes it can be done but that doesn’t make it a good design.
Have a Trane variable speed system installed about 6 years ago, my electric bill went from $194 a month down to $118 a month. Although due to rise in electricity prices now, my electric bill is now is $177 a month. Just love the Trane Home software on my android phone, shows me the daily and monthly temperature history back a full year as well as average temp for any given month. Don't notice any excess humidity in the house ever, even when we get a full week of 90 degree days.
I have variable speed and my house is at 50% humidity inside. I really like it. My house is 1750 sqf.
What’s the tonnage rating of the unit and where do you live 😂?
We had a Bryant variable speed furnace and AC installed in Minnesota. The blower ran 24 x 7, but almost always at a very low and very quiet speed. The temperature was very uniform during the winter and summer. It was drastically better than the old single speed furnace and AC. When the AC was running it would alternate between “cooling” and “dehumidification” on the thermostat. When the system alternated between “cooling” and “dehumidification”, it got rid of the excess humidity without making the house feel too cold.
We moved to Florida, where heat pumps are used for AC and heating, plus there are air handlers in the garage. Is there a variable speed HVAC heat pump system? Can a heat pump system alternate between “cooling” and “dehumidification”? There’s also whole house dehumidification that could be added which is supposed to remove humidity better when the outside humidity is high, but the outside temperatures aren’t very warm, like in the upper 60’s or low 70’s.
Lennox makes the El18vpv heat pump.mic you use their S30- thermostat it will run variable speed. Mitsubishi also makes the SUZducted variable speed heat pump by far the most quiet unit ever made.
Bryant makes a variable speed AC and a Rotary 5-stage AC system. They also offer these units in HP models. You can use an AHU instead of a furnace but personally, I would still buy a furnace as you will need heat strips for emergency heat, just in case as AUX heat. Two stage 80% two-stage furnaces are really inexpensive in Florida because very few people buy them. You can probably score a smoking deal. You can have humidification 24/7 on this furnace or AHU and offer the best cooling. I prefer the 5 stage system because it is 25%, 40%, 65%, 80% and 100% of cooling modes and will change as the Bryant Connex thermostat will control. The fan will run constantly and as can be increased and decreased to support humidification. You can run 350 CFM per ton of cooling. I am not sure if your home has one or two HVAC systems. The goal is to run from 72-75 degrees around 45-55% humidity. AprilAire has dehumidifiers that can be hooked into your return air ducting and it will pull the humidity down further, which will feel much cooler. I hope this helps. Bryant and Carrier are the same brand but the Bryant Evolution is the matching Carrier Infinity. You can get straight AC or a HP in either model and brand. If that does not work for you, Daikin/Amana also has a variable speed system that is also amazing for a reasonable price. Please comment, if you have any questions and I will get back to you as soon as I can.
MN is fun to heat/cool. 100+ degrees with dew points in the upper 60’s to lower 70’s in the summer. Winter brings -25 to -35 not factoring wind chills.
It’s crazy
Why not switch the a/c fan to on for a single stage?
Thank you so much for posting this helpful, easy-to-understand video. We need to replace both our heater & air conditioner and were leaning toward a variable-speed unit, but after learning our house probably just isn't big enough to warrant the expense we're reconsidering.
I live in an area where the potential for AC use is year round with 9 months of continuous cooling. I got a VFD 3 ton unit and I would never go back to a single speed unit. It was at least $50 a month in savings. The value is completely based on where you live and your house.
it's because variable AC have direct current compressors which consume half the power needed to cool a space compare to alternate current compressors
@@firstlast-pt5pp yup and reasonable sized generator can run them since there’s no inrush current.
How does using a single speed compressor with a variable air handler compare in terms of efficiency and comfort? I am finding tons of videos and info on 2-speed and variable compressor systems but nothing on a single speed system with the newer premium/variable air handler
Good on explaining the different stages Of condensing units. ie A/C Single, two, or variable speed but with that comes SEER ratings and how going up 1 SEER is about a 15% increase in efficiency And how a single stage standard is 14 SEER now. Where years ago might have only been 10 SEER or how a new 2 stage unit can be up to 18 SEER in efficiency. Or a variable speed unit could be up to 24 SEER in efficiency. Explaining SEER ratings goes hand in hand with the kind of unit a person may buy. Or need. It definitely helps when you talk about how one is more efficient than the other. SEER ratings are everything And there was no mention of that in this video.
I have installed 2 stage units since 1987 and everyone loves them , overall life is as good or better than most units .
Fly by companies and techs don’t know how to operate single stage and are completely lost on anything with more than 2 wires
I live in Florida so humidity is an issue with comfort in and air conditioned space. My A/C when out at my old house. I went from a 12seer to a 17.75seer two stage system. The two stage system did run longer but it controlled the humidity so you could run it a degree or two hotter and get the same comfort. It also dropped the power bill by about $30-$40 a month. My new house (still in FL) has a cheap builder's grade A/C but since it was sized to less tons per square foot than the older house, it runs frequently enough to keep humidity in check. And since the new house has better insulation and double pained glass, the power bills are about the same between the two house (1600sq/ft on the old house, 2800sq/ft on the new house). When the current system bits the dust, I will be replacing it with a 2 stage on the new house too. I am hoping the extra air flow will help the "hot spot" in the computer room/office and over all drop my power bill again.
Appreciate the explanation. 2 stage condenser w/ a variable stage handler here in FL
Great informative video, thank you! Here are my opinions after 21-years in the HVAC industry, from service to sales: The AC system is not only removing heat from your home but it is also dehumidifying. However, it's ONLY dehumidifying when it's running. This is why a two-stage or more system does a much better job of dehumidifying which makes you more comfortable in your home and I recommend them if you have ranch style home. The problem with staged AC-system is if you have a 2-Story home, because multi-stage AC's run lower, longer. They don't run in high long enough to help push the heavier, denser air upstairs, thereby you can end up with higher temps upstairs than you would have with a single-stage AC system. Unless you have a zoned system for up and down, I recommend single-stage AC systems to my customers and if you live in a ranch then you will love the extra comfort of multi-stage ac systems. Price of course will be the deciding factor in all decision-making. And please understand that with the higher and higher efficiency ratings mandated by the EPA on the HVAC manufacturers, these units don't last 20, 30 or 40 years anymore. Get a 10-Year Parts & Labor warranty if you can and then cross your fingers after it expires. Finally, make sure the company who installs the new equipment is going to still be in business for the next ten-years it's under warranty too!
We did variable speed. Added returns in each room upstairs..problem solved. Definitely a consideration if u able to change design or cost of zoning controls is a factor.
This is an excellent presentation holy cow !!!!
I have had two stage Heatpump system that replaced an old single-stage gas A/C for 4 months and experienced both heating, cooling. I also have a new single-stage gas A/C on other side of the same home that was installed before the heat pump 2 stage system and I can make out the difference post install. It is the best. I no longer have humidity issues in the home. It is night and day more comfortable than a single stage. They are both Trane systems.
One of the things he did not mention is multi-zone mini-splits normally operate as variable speed because the variable number of inside evap units needing to run at any given time.
Minisplit systems are a different configuration than the far more common residential split system contractors install is probably why.
@@srobeck77 not any more.. all manufacturers are coming out with mini split condensers hooked to evap coils and air handlers. Way of the future.
@@philliprogers7987 Its still a bolt on after the fact solution as always will be.
Great explanation of the various options in modern AC systems. Thank You
I have a Bryant, 5 stage compressor, variable speed fan/blower each, it does on/off. The fans will run after compressor turns off to dehumidify. I live South Louisiana, high humidity, It is the most confirmable system ever had.
I install the AmanaGoodman 2 stage and it’s very good.
Also install a lot of Gree Flexx would suggest you look at it as a very good cost vs value option.
Variable speed outdoor but single speed indoor. Uses any thermostat and qualified for tax credit.
Thank you for posting such a helpful video
Hello , what are your thoughts on mini split systems , thank you
He’s right and i agree with it all. Those houses feel stale and the air isn’t comfortable-ppl who live in them are usually old and don’t care. It kind of reminds me of the old days when like old ppl especially Italians or polish ppl don’t open their windows in NY because they didn’t want to clean dust off of all the Chinaware and Nick nacks in the house. So this time period I’m talking about nobody had A/C even if they had money-they just didn’t waste money on it for 2x weeks of hot weather a year plus the nights get cool and a lot of ppl would open windows at night to let in cool fresh air to sleep. I live in Florida now and I’m a builder & you can’t open windows at night cuz it’s 80 humid degrees out-so i know a bit about what this guy is saying. I’ve seen the variable speed brand new units in freshly built homes or freshly remodeled homes or apt complexes grow mold with in a month or 2. I don’t recommend them to anyone -I’ve seen nasty stuff happen and it’s not healthy for this part of country and i don’t even think it’s good for up north-the air in the house seems stale. The 2 speed is worth the money ppl-you will save a lot on electric and make the extra cost back pretty quick. Same goes for the pool. You want the same. If you just stick a single speed in vs 2 stage on pool it’s easy an extra $100 a month electric difference. If you use a variable speed pool pump don’t set it too low in RPMs because it won’t really clean the pool it’s moving water too slow and ppl don’t realize the bad stuff in the pool is in the top 6 inches of water and you want to remove that layer over and over to keep it safe. A clear water pool doesn’t mean it’s safe. It can have bad bacteria in that top 6 inches. So AC unit and pool pump will have same issues if RPMs are set too low-it equals stale not healthy air or water. But definitely get 2 stage and save money and it will last longer. You will make money back quickly. And on pool pump you can set RPMs of the motor so you can make it so it acts like a 2 stage or make your own settings of a w stage & have it kick higher every couple hours to skim top layer off fast then kick down to low speed for awhile. We should have that type of control on our ac units on an app so you can set speed of motor for different parts of day or according to weather.
Even covered VFD systems - very nice - thank you! =)
I have a Carrier Infinity 23 SEER system and it is super quiet and efficient but costly to repair. I've had to change control boards at $2,000 twice.
Did the warranty not cover that?
Why does the warranty not cover the boards?
Yeah, I’m trying to weigh overall what I meed it to do (keep my house at 70 F, at the lowest cost overall including monthly bills and new systems every 15 yrs). The lowest cost system due to easier to repair and replace seems more cost effective to do the same task.
You can buy a lot of power with 4k
In my practical experience a portable dehumidifier is a great help in making a house comfortable during the times when the weather is not really hot. It adds some heat load making the system run more, plus it dehumidifies. If you have an old house I love a lot of small window units.
a window AC unit can be similarly priced, and often has a dehumidify option, but this places the heat load outside.
Its a bit more expensive, but its also more efficient, however, its higher maintenance if you dont plan to incorporate it into your heating/cooling as you dont want to leave modern window AC units in place if you're not using them because they seem to all be designed to retain water so the fan can splash water up onto the condenser, though modifications could probably be made so that water is not retained.
@@denvera1g1I drilled a hole in the bottom of mine. I thought it was suppose to drain out 😂.
Anyway, it cooled better and stays quiet with a drain hole.
@@seabass22 I think the water is supposed to increase efficiency by splashing up onto the condenser, allowing for evaporative cooling of the condenser.
Extremely humid and hot climates might not see much of a difference, but it shouldnt reduce the cooling performance compared to no water, its still added surface area after all
Thoughts on a single stage condenser with a two stage gas furnace? My biggest concern is the humidity. Since installing new insulation in attic and new roof, the amount of humidity is noticeably higher. The most recent estimate I got he said I didn't need to get. 2 stage or variable.
I upgraded to a variable speed 5 ton carrier heat pump, propane furnace dual fuel system. Cost me around 9k including installation. 2500 sq ft, single story house. I am very happy with it! Hardly ever notice it's running and it does turn off, usually in the evening. Heat pump reaches its limit around 10-12 degrees then the furnace takes over. On average I'm saving $20 a month on electric and only fill once every 3 years on propane as appose to annually before.
What do you think about 5 stage heat pump system Bryant 288BNV?
The answer to this question depends on where you live. In my area some homes end up needing a dehum but it’s cheaper monthly to use a 2 stage or variable speed for dehum than run both of them.
Great video!! Just a quick question would 2 stage be better for a house which has less optimal insulation? Parts of the house has cold spots and half of the second floor is above garage and is usually colder during winter and warm during summer. Any thoughts?
That dude in the storm killed me. 😂😂informative video.
I like the new water heaters and cloths driers that are air conditioners. I also like it when the condensers are coated in water to become like evaporative cooler powered.
How small (sq. ft.) is a single stage good for?
Your video is very informative for the layman yo understand. It was professionally done and I like how the sound was done. Thanks, now I think I have a better idea what type of AC im going to purchase.
Did u
Thanks for your honesty
I would add that yes a two stage or variable is more and may not get your return it has to do more than money. A two stage or variable system helps with comfort and for some the extra cost is worth it.
Agreed. Along with temp/humidity comfort, there is noise comfort. I've lived in places where the TV volume needed to be adjusted to the on/off cycles of single stage systems.
I think it also depends on the type of insulation and age of the house, newer sealed houses would benefit from variable or multi stage systems. My house is not sealed like a new house, so i sealed and insulated the best i could, installed a higher seer system, and a whole house dehumidifier. I use the ecobee enhanced to run the AC and dehumidifier. I added some ecobee remote sensors to keep the temp more level through out rooms.
As someone who worked as a tech and installed many units of different grades. My next unit will be variable speed. They cost more but in my opinion are worth it. The unit only runs as hard as it needs to. I live in NW Alabama (Hot and muggy) I put a one ton heat pump in my workshop My bill was $34 in August and I figure about $5 of that is lighting.
Are the fans for blowing the air through the house variable speed too? I'm used to the fan being noisy and that would be annoying if I had to listen to them it all day.
I also installed an economizer, with it’s own thermostat. So I can run it with or without the A/C. It works really well bringing in cool night air all night with the A/C off.
So I take it that the economizer is a whole house fan?
@@lmeredeemed5043 In as much as it replaces inside air with outside air, yes, but that's where the similarity ends. No windows or doors need to be open, and the outside air is passed through the system filter before being discharged through the HVAC registers. It's more akin to the fresh air damper on a car HVAC system.
Hello learn a lot from your video,but have question, new ac unit install created vacuum? My man don’t know why ,would you please help it sucking more than it blow? Must appreciate if you able tell me how to solving this problem
My variable compressor is chugging away, efficiently and quietly satisfying demands, especially during this year’s heat waves. That is in my house. Commercially, a slightly different system can use large variable output compressors that are additionally staged in order to satisfy demand. Regardless of application, control systems are the crux of design (including retro-fits) and must be carefully chosen for best return on investment.
Added notation has us all aware of cost of utilities our systems are subject to in sometimes complex ways. While Return On Investment underlies many considerations, achieving maximum ROI must include examination of many facets, sometimes almost laughably including ‘newer’ practices, such as frictionless magnetic crankshaft bearings. However, controlling HVACR systems to accommodate rapidly changing energy pricing structures. Not only must we consider our basic rate, but other elements such as time of day usage, and ‘demand’ rates may easily affect what we pay. For example, a n additional startup of a compressor that does not have ‘soft start-up’ hardware, may trigger a demand rate for an entire month, regardless of how long that load runs, even if for just a few minutes. Reactively controlling systems is best left to electronically controlled systems, with computer interface for the operators, be they a single homeowner or a commercial building operator, technician, supervisor, manager or owner. Teamwork matters.
Have a 2 speed Trane. Ultimate comfort. Properly sized, it just keeps the house very comfortable. The old unit would turn on/off creating muggy feeling or hot spots. Worth the money. In addition, I was able to keep the temp set a few degrees warmer as result. I did see a savings on monthly bill.
How much money did you save
How does a VS handler with single stage condenser fit into this equation?
What does variable speed refer to?
There are two main components, the compressor and the fan that pumps the air thru the house.
Is it slowing down both, the compressor and the fan?
Here in Phoenix Arizona we dont get much humidity so its not an issue plus the air is so dry here the more the 2 stage blows the more uncomfortable my sinuses are. I actually have to put humidity back in the air here. I like the single stage in the hot desert.
Thanks for pointing that out. We’re going with a Rheem single stage 13.4 SEER packaged heat pump for AZ house.
I sell either two-speed or inverter/variable VOLUME (of refrigeration) in Florida due our humidity. The inverter/ volume can be programmed to a set % of humidity. This is great feature for health and comfort.
Great presentation! Very informative! 👍
Can a residential Amana 5 Ton unit be replaced with Commercial 10 Ton carrier unit
Love my variable speed system, and for the minimal difference in initial cost I wouldn’t choose anything else again.
" minimal difference in initial cost" that's really surprising to hear. I'm getting quotes for variable systems that are over doubling the single speed system quotes. I'm talking 10k vs 26k type of different which is pretty a damn huge difference imo. I want the variable speed, but I was hoping for like 15-18k not 26k.
@@hobblyjig that’s insane. Mind you, my system was installed in fall 20, and I’m in the Midwest so not sure what the current market conditions are like, or how they compare to you locally.
At the time, for the 4 ton gas furnace and a/c choices I was given between a 13 seer single stage ranged from about 10.5 and 13k for the variable speed.
Now, I did pay about $17k total for the project because they were also installing a whole new duct system (doing a whole-house renovation essentially), the old system was a heat pump with electric heat so they had to run gas, new line set, everything. But on paper there was really only about a $2500 difference between equipment cost on the two systems. To me that’s minimal in the big picture considering the comfort and convenience of one over the other imho, but maybe he was able to make up some higher margins on the extra work, I don’t know.
That’s not to say I didn’t have some outrageous bids, also, but the key difference was finding a small local installer that doesn’t have 40+ fancy work trucks running around town.
That’s been my experience anyway.
Here’s where I’m at with this, I know if you have the money a fancier system is great. However, they are a lot more expensive to repair, not to mention the cost difference to start with. For that reason, I won’t even install a variable speed system unless the customer has tons of money and can afford it. But to each his own on this matter.
That being said I’ll install a higher seer system if they want it.
Why do you say the “blower is always running” at 9:03 referring to variable systems? I have a carrier infinity system and located in Georgia. My fan is set to auto, should it be set to on? My home isn’t large but I do have spray foam and new windows.
I went from a 2 ton single stage to a 3 ton variable stage and I don't regret it. It kept my my house alot cooler and it dropped my electricity bill almost $150 month. That was in a 1400 sq ft home in 2016. I did have it financed which cost me around $200 a month, so with the energy savings I was essentially $50 a month. I bought my next house in 2021 which had a 3.5 ton single stage AC and the end of the year I replaced it and got a 5 ton variable. I'll probably never get a single stage AC. I'll get a two stage before I ever consider single stage.
Got myself a variable inverter mini split and I am quite satisfied. I use it at 40% capacity for higher dehumidification and at 110% for extra cooling. Both are without any time limit which is the selling point.
how does an AC run at 110%
@@rufflesinc Some units are designed to run above rated capacity. For example, our Maytag IQ Drive runs from 40% up thru 118% So, our 3 ton system can run like a 3.5 ton system if circumstances call for it. I don't know why they just don't call it a 3.5 ton system that runs from 20% - 100%.
One of the main benefits of a Variable speed system is humidity control and when set up and sized properly it should work better than a 2-stage system. The variable systems will shut off if there isn't a demand. We install 2-stage and variable Carrier / ICP almost exclusively around my area. When it's 95 degrees and 80% RH the variables will out perform the 2-stage.
We got a variable system in our old house and I remember the day they installed it and turned it on it seemed like the house temperature dropped quickly, but it wasn't the temperature it was the fact it had sucked out all the humidity that made 76 degrees seem like 65. Our summer utility bills went from about $280/mo to about $150 a month. It was crazy how much of a difference it made.
80% RH and 95F is extremely rare
Correct, very rare. Dew point would be 87.8 F.
@@cadamham unless you are in Florida (and the numbers feel reverse at night)
@@cadamham in NC we regularly get 90 degrees with 75% humidity in summer and it can be 80+ degrees and 90% humidity at 3am. and thats going to get far more common and worse the next 5 to 10 years
I’ve had all types, but now have a variable speed. I like the fact that it keeps the house exactly on temperature, but it is hard to get used to the fact that it n ver shuts off.
I have a houseboat. I just had an air conditioning company install the carrier two-stage 17-seer heat pump. All electric. 3-ton. The dealer told me that a 3-ton would be more than efficient. It is not. Our 1999 house walls are 1" thick plywood with no insulation in the walls and the windows are single pane. Keep in mind there are several windows on a houseboat. When the houseboat was built in 1999 they installed a 3-ton train air handler heat pump unit, single stage. We did buy the boat 9 years ago and it has never been sufficient. It always struggled to get down to 74° on a day with the outside temperature being roughly 80 to 85 degrees. The carrier just installed is a 3-ton and has 2 speeds on the indoor fan motor. Both of those are so low that it doesn't push out the cold air as much as we needed them to. My question is it was just installed 4 days ago and we are not pleased with it. I looked online and I was very impressed with the infinity carrier 18VS. We do have hotspot areas in the houseboat. I am considering the 4-ton infinity 18VS. Since this unit that we have now was installed 4 days ago and I will be contacting the installing company to upgrade to a 4-ton because he told him several times that a 3-ton will do the job. I am concerned about him asking for a lot more money for the 18VS infinity unit upgrade because basically, he would be installing an air conditioning unit 2 times. I don't mind paying more for the 4-ton 18VS but at the same time, I don't want to be paying more in labor costs because of their mistake. They are basically going to have to install the 2nd unit for free.
I'm hoping someone can tell me what is the dealer cost for both of these units. The indoor unit that they installed is product #FV4CNB005L00EEAA model#FV4CNB005. The outdoor unit is product #25HCB636A0031030, model #25HCB636A310. I want to pay this contractor the difference between both of these units. I just don't want to pay them twice for installing the correct-sized unit when they should've got it right the 1st time.
I'm not sure if it's been mentioned already, but it doesn't make much sense to say that a variable speed system doesn't remove as much humidity, since the surface tension on the evaporator can only hold so much water. It has to drip off, and while the evaporator may rarely if ever get dry, it should still remove just as much water, if not more.
Work with your idea before, and Icf home if you could put a two-stage and a separate air recirculator? Worth the cost and effort over a variable?
Totally agree with your statement about the humidity and the variable speed system. I’ve used a couple of inverter air conditioners many many times they do not remove the humidity. In fact, humidity increases as the inverter decreases its speed. You need ice cold coil to remove humidity a cool coil will not do that at all and the humidity will continue to rise.
its called tempered air
That's only true if it's not designed/setup properly ..... One you don't need an 'ice cold coil" you only need it to be below the dew point by a few degrees but above freezing .... Secondly in a properly designed/setup variable speed system the blower fan speed is lowered in step with the compressor/condenser fan speed ..... When you move less air across the evaporator then it absorbs less heat and stays below the dewpoint and you still get condensation/dehumidification and because it's always moving air you don't get hot/humid spots like an upstairs where the return air is often choked off by length and limited places to run return air ducts. Return air is the more important part of dehumidification and cooling in general because if you can't get the hot humid air back to the evap coil then the refrigerant can't absorb the heat or remove the humidity
@@longjohn526 well put. Each time I tried several inverter air conditioners. I measured the humidity carefully, and as the compressor went down, so did the evap and condenser fans the humidity rose in the space yet in the same space when I try a cycling unit that also cycled off the fan and the humidity remained more constant.
@@longjohn526 Well put. On a new install Variable speed units will pay for themselves.
I hope your aren't confusing *relative* humidity vs actual water content. Because as temps decrease, relative humidity goes up.
While what you are saying does make sense, your inverter unit has to make a choice - maintain a target temp vs a target dew point. The intersection of both at levels of what you want may not happen, but you won't get there any better with a non inverter unit.
All a single stage unit does with a thermostat that accounts for humidity just internally drops its set point by around 2 deg F.
is there any benefit on using a swing thermostat?
the common issue in my little town: most of the homes are 100ish years old. They had various upgrades as things became available. ff to now and its been retrofitted with central air/heat initially in the 60's and updated furnaces as they wore out or got cold air added- the common issue for almost all of the houses is the conditioned air does not make it to the upstairs or rooms furthest away from the unit. There are vents there but nothing comes out of them. The basement gets ice cold, most of the downstairs receives a sufficient supply. Blocking vents just makes the a coil freeze up. Mine has a huge unit i dont know the btu but I am not only speaking about my house. Is there a fix that does not require replacing or adding units to the houses? In my case I believe the unit has plenty of conditioned air to give but the restrictive ducts dont deliver very far so it gets dumped into the basement to prevent the A coil from freezing up.
running a single stage 8o% gas furnace now. looking at adding either a heat pump or AC for the summers. one of the quotes I got was for a variable speed inverter heat pump. would the efficiency benefits of that be negated by my existing furnace?