They have new mechanics in the doppelgangers. Pulchra has a dodge mechanic. If you go at her with Piper, she just dodges Piper's Ex special for the entire duration of the skill.
the tactic that i came up with is by hugging her, use ben ex skill>lucy ex>follow up piper then BA to ex skill. if sometimes she does get into dodge mode, the assult still procs and it stuns her which also cancelling her dodge right away.
the good thing is that this doesn’t make it so that it becomes impossible to have piper as your main dps, it just makes it so yoiu have to adjust your strategy, maybe swap to caesar and wait for pulchra to attack , so that you can then counter and THEN use piper exi really like how this isn’t a counter to trambuilding but rather just makes you adjust your strategy.
4:29 feels like a nicer way of saying, "mechanics are getting harder to deal with so that company can sell more characters." And about your comment on Billy, I'd agree that it's somewhat ridiculous that people still cite him for these kinds of discussions; the Billy they're referring to has a limited S-rank Wengine with near-optimized disc drive stats. While it's technically possible to get those kinds of things as an F2P, it's not indicative of how most people will use low-end characters to clear Shiyu. tl;dr: Yes, people can say that solo Billy is viable...but that comes with caveats that don't really help support the idea of "Oh but you can clear content easy-peasy with low-end characters."
@@sazcxieo You're absolutely correct. People with skill issue are misled to believe that they can clear content with 4star characters because of those who reference the Solo Billy. This is because people who reference him fail to discuss how in addition to all the equipment that Solo Billy has, the player actually has the skills to complete them in fast times. They also conveniently don't mention how in a bunch of videos, Solo Billy is supported by M2 S-rank characters, enabling ridiculously fast clear times. Mihoyo capitalizes on this by releasing new characters that invalidate mechanics so that players with comparably low skill basically have to pull for them if they want to comfortably clear content. The point is, people should stop presenting Billy as some secret op character (If you have decent player skill, near-optimized drive disc stats, level 12 skills, limited Wengine, op teammates, etc.) that *everyone* should be trying out. It's disingenuous. Ofc, there will prob be people who will nitpick my assessment of Billy, saying that I'm overexaggerating or that I'm being too wordy with a possible troll. I just think more people should at least be aware of this info before they decide to invest in Billy. If you don't regret investing in Billy, great! I just really wish that people were more mindful of how they present information!
@@darkeater600I understand that we have much fake 4 star solo, but I alredy see some using just 4 star agents and winning, but it s hard, you have to make the moves without error
That double ice repel on Ambush Node 5 is actually just a big middle finger for those who pulled Ellen. Since I only have Ellen and Jane Doe as my DPS that shit kicked my ass at first, but thanks to Caesar, Soukaku and Ellen popped off and got me through that shit.
@@Rat_Fบcker yeah kinda brute forced that shit. Was running Anby before I got Caesar and I couldn't do it, but Caesar's shields and anti-interrupts really help as a lifeline.
I don't know about that.. i clear nod 5 with ellen, lycaon and saokaku team just fine. My ellen only have 2.7k dmg with 146% crit dmg( 68.4% crit rate)
@@SetRill-t9h That's cool and all, but I never had Lycaon, I was running Anby who had barely stun coverage. I just get overwhelmed easily. It was clearable on the first try once I had Caesar, but it would have possibly been clearable for me with a Lycaon.
I am still waiting for them to focus on the background stats that have existed since the beginning... The Weapon Damage Types. They are still actively tracking which damage types characters Do. It's why Caesar is Blunt/Pierce. If they start making enemies that have damage type resistances as well as elemental resistances... it'll make the relevance of certain teams much more prominent. And potentially keep new characters selling outside of power creep and waifu material.
I really like how the doppelgängers actually mimic the mechanics we players can do. It makes content harder without actually inflating their stats-like how Jane Doe doppel can pull Defensive Counters on some of our attacks, or how Pulchra can dodge. Stuff like that keeps us on our toes, essentially flips the script on us so we have to counter their counter. And just as a concept, fighting doppels of playable characters that forces us to learn their kit mechanics to counterplay is pretty cool, mimicking PvP in a PvE game
Anyone else not notice a difficulty spike on Floor 5 and struggled on 7? In 5 the enemies basically grouped them selves up for me, whereas 7 I was struggling with meeting the DPS requirement.
Hearing this makes me happy that I never fully completed the original version and that the characters I really like aren't in the game yet to do so. Even though I know that I'm missing out on a lot of polychromes and that I've been playing since release it doesn't seem worth while without long term characters
Funny story about this Shiyu cycle. I had breezed through this cycle until the final floor and was genuinely stuck, with like just shy of 5 seconds to get an S rank. And i just couldn't beat it ....... Until i realized that to break the sheilds on first half you have to focus the generator and 3 defensive assists immediately break the wolf enemies armor. So yeah no this was 1000% a skill issue on my part.
5:28 this is literally happening right now. Its almost Impossible to kill Jane using Juan or Ellen but if you have Cesar on your team she becomes a cakewalk
It makes sense... I mean, I'm quite satisfied with the characters I have and the game has been out for only a few months. I'm trying to fit Burnice in but I don't "need" her. But thinking back, my Genshin team evolved a lot over the years and I have different ones for different situations so I should expect the same to happen in ZZZ
Caesar makes one half of ambush node a cakewalk, her shield is easy to refresh and strong enough to take a few hits. Important as Pulcha & Mors have a lot of ranged/trap attacks that are hard to read/avoid. For the other half, I basically reset until I could no-hit it with Nekomata. That said, I am now building Seth as I think just having any shielder would make a big difference in this mode. Since there's no time-limit, playing carefully and defensively is a valid strategy and makes defense units much more valuable.
As a Genshin/Star Rail player, I agree that this kind of difficulty spikes also happened to Genshin and Star Rail, and now ZZZ is starting to catch up. My prediction says that there will be a character that will ignore "Enemy Resistance". Just like the example in this video with Miyabi>Ellen. Even though both of them are Ice. My other prediction says that there will be a support that just straight up remove enemy resistance in general or something like that. 😅
Enemies evolving tactics and requiring more branching out of strategies sounds like how some Ethereals form a symbiosis to effectively crush the non-corrupted, like Thanatos with a Metro Goblin or the big brute Ethereal who smashes around. Two enemies who are designed to get back in your face if you ignore one, while the other takes a shot at you while occupied, creating a constant pressure. Doppels take that to the next degree.
honestly am calling it rn that a future limited s-rank can do a weakness implant like silver wolf from hsr. Now that you mention it, I won't be surprised if Miyabi or any other future s-rank/s will have that kinda playstyle. Edit: I think it's more viable for support characters to have this kinda thing, ofc. Miyabi would be hella broken if she did, but i doubt it.
The recent banners are chock full of Anomaly characters that have built the groundwork for a more stable, if not thriving Disorder Economy, and I would not be surprised if in like 4-5 banners they directly countered Anomaly/Disorder with some enemy trait that has "All Anomaly and Disorder damage deals 65% less damage" and then they start rolling out more crit based dps agents
The only real difficulty spike I felt was a) not knowing the animations of the new doppelgangers as well and b) the concept that the enemy is also allowed to have a dodge button
Yeah i was surprised that dopple jane can parry and the three furry dopple can block and dodge especially pulchra, litterally dodging full bar of piper ex bruh
I think you're right, BUT... I guess that the most important element that maybe will make older characters still viable adding to everything you said, from positioning to timing, is how we manage to take the most of their abilties, disc sets and rotations within these new and existing characters. My account right now was based around team Zhu Yan (with amby and nicole all maxed out) and Jane doe (with grace all maxed out and seth all at 50), but I was still struggling with the new nodes. And what resolved the issue was building a koleda and a M6 Ben I had (all maxed out at 50), mixing them up with Jane and Grace here and there. Now I've cleared all the end game with S rank. It has been FUN to build and, most important, FUN to play. Now I'm hopping to get Burnice to team up with Jane, and see wich character will take the third spot (maybe my M6 Lucy still at lv 30)
considering in HSR, which is a far less skill expressive game, by virtue of being a turn based game where you are forced to take hits and cant dodge for instance, a lot of what you can do will be tuned out of combat in that game. its different from ZZZ in that respect. but in HSR there are accounts who have done absolutely 0 pulls that are full clearing and 3 staring all the content to this day all over youtube. sure it takes them a lot of farming and artifact tuning etc etc etc but its possible this isnt a death knell for our 1.0 characters, build them well and keep them updated and they will serve you well. Serve you as well as newest banner character, maybe not as strong as the newest shiniest character, but still very possible.
@@demon_spawn1535 wish I could read more of this around youtube and every other gacha community. Stick to the characters you enjoy even if they are 4 stars/ A rank, is something that will ever payoff even if it takes more farming here and there. But this tunning is also part of the fun. I started HSR really messing up my account, I didn’t get the game right back then. And guess what? I felt in love with a 4 stars kkkkkkk. Flashforward and I built a team around it focusing to make it the best as possible. Never been happier playing 🥹 haha. Obs: imma f2p too
All i want is that all characters feel like they serve a purpose somewhere. I don't wanna feel like all this leveling and grinding was wasted on some characters years down the line
i think that as we go deeper into the game, specific teams we’ve built will be able to take on specific enemies we encounter. for example, maybe ellen joe will be good at killing Etherals whereas Miyabi will be good at killing a different enemy. That will hopefully make us feel like our resources weren’t wasted
Shiyu 5 was really the only PAIN floor, the two robots that just runs away attacking from a distance with both of them having big ahh hitboxes so it's rough to deal damage to them at the same time, and the two last shadow dudes which rely heavily on rng for them to group up since they like to jump and dash around alot. Took me around 2-3 days to beat that floor while the other floors took only 1-2 tries, that floor really whooped my ahh.
I think what ZZZ did here is the right thing, because it increased difficulty by requiring finer control and reaction from the player instead of outright powercreep. This round of Shiyu requires more dodges, more parries, smarter positioning, caring about order that you kill enemies, etc. instead of just making the enemies tankier or adding mechanics that are unbeatable unless you use a certain specific character. I felt like I really needed to engage with the core combat mechanics, and the intricacies of my character kits much more than before, but what I didn't feel like was that I was falling behind in the dps race, or that my teams were being hard countered like I did in other Hoyo games
guys it's not powercreeping "meanwhile mihoyo eventually adds a BS mechanic that requires a specific character and that character has no re-roll banner yet" gee wonder why I can only complete two levels of shiyu defense! Mihoyo: "subtle"
i have high hopes that, rather than making counters to certain teams or characters, they make counters to specific playstyles. in genshin, team building matters more than anything. of you always have the best team, you can just briese through the game. in zzz, not so much. for zzz, the way you play matters way more than your team composition, and i hope that it stays that way. they could for example introduce new counter mechanics for some new enemies, or have an enemy that punishes attacking at the wrong time. but maybe im just coping because i could never not use piper as my main dps, and i just dont want her to become unplayable some day
You can clear SD even with A ranks if you are lvl 60 and have top stats on disk drives and maxed skills/core passives/w-engine. Important is to match the element weakness and you can clear any stage.
You can still clear all content in HSR on a no pull account to this day if you have kept your farming rotations up and collected all your freebies, and by clear I mean fully clear 3 star everything. there are several youtube accounts proving it. If you can do that in HSR, you can do it in the far more skill expressive ZZZ as well. sure the time challenges might be a little stringent at times, but a well made team is going to do everything you need from it.
On floor 5 of Shiyu Defense, not only you fight with doppelgangers, you also have 3 waves of enemies on both sides. In my opinion that is what difficults a lot that stage... Stage 7, on the first half, the enemies have a big ice shield... As for the extra difficulty, it's obivous they will try to change it. We have 3 months of gameplay, we already having some characters at Lv. 60. Either they change some stuff, or the end game will be a breeze in the park. Let's worry about it when we see what will be their approach instead of panicking
I will not move on to next node unless I get a s rank. Crti node 5 this time got me so traumatized I was so hyper focused in node 6&7 that I didn’t realize they were easier than 5 💀
I did feel the spike. It's not genshin level of bs yet, but fighting jane in the 7-2 where my jane died like 4 times with opponent being on 10% hp left made my muscles lock up. In the end, while I didn't have the best time, still had a minute to spare for S. The fifth I only had 10 seconds to spare though.
Re-runs are a guarantee, I have patience and can wait for the characters I have to skip, losing out on 3-4 pulls a month because I didn't pull X unit on X banner isn't going to brick my account
its a relief to see i wasnt the only one finding floor 5 impossible,i S ranked every other one easily,even 6 and 7,but i just couldnt beat 5 for the longest of time,and all my friends said its a mere skill issue (it was).Other than the 5th floor though,the difficulty of the floors was still pretty easy
The difficulty spike is more noticeable when you only give yourself 2 hours to try and brute force through everything and your Billy isn't even that leveled so he can't brute force yet.
doppelganger have way higher daze meter the dev telling us to stop using stun character and try to fit a defense unit in your current team (also change swing jazz that need stun into proto punk that only need assist / dodge) and then the stage suddenly feel easier
This is a good commentary and the difficulty will definetly be on the mechanics also on jane fight she parries our attacks so is something that will be added in more enemies on the future idk how we can win against that if they where to do it more frecuently but there is already that on the game
I find the doppleganger is fun to againts with. With multiple dodge from Jane she can easily fighting the dopples. For floor 5 1st phase i just brute force it with Zhu yuan. It does seem more challenging now and its a clear sign that the usual matching element of weakness is not the case anymore later.
a big point, using HSR though, people are still able to 3 star all the end game content on no pull accounts. those old 1.0 characters are still good and capable to fully clear content. you have to be smart with how you build things and what artifact sets you use. but assuming you play the game and keep your builds updated, you constantly improve your teams gear etc. you should be able to clear everything in the game. bonus characters that arent given out via events are just a bonus. I could go in with my Seele in HSR and keep up with all the current end game content, I just have to have a team built around what shes capable of, and ofc only use her in scenarios that she can excel in. which is honestly a lot if you have silver wolf. I understand trying to sound warnings about powercreep, its always gonna happen. but even in Genshin, with a proper team setup, assuming you arent going into a fight where she isnt viable, ganyu still claps, Childe can still clap all of the content in Genshin to this day if he is built well and ofc it isnt one of the enemies that makes Hydro not a viable damage type. Hoyo has always kept a fine line between new characters being stronger and feeling worthwhile to pull while keeping the old characters able to clear if you have kept them up.
I simply don't think there will be an enemy that counters a specific agent because of how the combat of Zenless works, if an enemy doesn't allow me to click button with Ellen, I can simply stun the enemy with Lycaon and then mash with Ellen. I think they only added a counter to Ganyu because she was going against the combat of Genshin, or at least their vision of what Genshin combat is. So unless we have a character that straight up bends the combat mechanics to their will, I don't think that will be the case for Zenless, if anything, I think they'll only add enemies with unique patterns for players to learn and adapt to, which is exactly what I feel about the doppelgangers or all of the Shiyu Defense, if I failed to clear, that's my skill issue or gear issue
I'm still clearing with S11 and Anton no problem o_o I think it's just a matter of getting your two teams built up. The only pulls I've done in this game so far were for Caesar to buff my S11 because S11 is my GOAT. Lighter is next. But I wasn't having trouble even before I pulled at all, at least not once I got my DPS lvl 60 and built.
could all of these shiyu's defense trying ot make it to force us to get the new ppl in the game? could it be so people will spend more money ie: jane gets out dated due to a new person being super over powered? but then in another stance couldn't some chars such as zhu yaun be concidered trash or would the game make her even better?
@@flossinonyou Solo clears, as in billy with no support? yeah, games made for a full team, but there are youtube accounts to this day showcasing HSR full clearing all content on accounts they dont do any pulls on. they only take the freebies, IE they have Dr Ratio as he was given out for free, and other characters you can obtain from various events. so 1 M0 A rank? nah. 3 M0 A ranks that are well build otherwise? should be doable.
I can't complete the shiyu defense modules. I wouldn't even try take the 10th one until I farm my teams. I don't even like the second team that much, but maybe if I max my dps out I can clear this up with an A.
Great video Flossin. Personally i welcome any new challenge that asks me to spread love to multiple agents and experiment different approaches to shiyu defense, however i dont fully know if i feel the same about characters becoming obsolete, at least not any time soon. Less effective and power crept? Sure, but obsolete? I dont think so, or at least i hope not. Personally i cant see a character pairing like Lycaon and Rina ever being bad, and even in a game like genshin, standard 5 stars are still being used (jean became more used after furina launched for example). Something to note that wasnt mentioned was the difference in the shiyu buff we had this reset vs the last. Last reset had a 100% uptime and gave atk and crit damage (i think) vs this one which is only active during a shield and only gives atk, which is objecitvely far worse for our agents across the board even with ceasar on the team, which was their goal with this buff (incentivize us to pull for her) Id wager that next reset will be an anomaly buff and might even be eaiser when our janes/grace/pipers are procing their elements for big numbers alongside burnice. However if hoyo chooses to give us a buff that relates to off field damage then ill cede this point. At the end of the day though i do think youre on the right track and i appreciate your thoughts and insight here. Personally i cannot wait to see what the future holds for this game
It depends on the concept of difficulty you have, shinyu 5 personally it doesn't feel difficult it just takes a while since there are more enemies and why my zhu yuan team doesn't have the same investment That my Anomaly team which is Piper and Grace, I think the ambush node content is harder as you fight 2 bosses that do a lot of damage and are very aggressive.
I have scored better than in the previous Shiyu Defense, but it's only because I have upgraded my characters a lot since then. I know that it's much harder now, I'm pretty sure I could now S rank everything from the previous round but I absolutely cannot this time. The enemies are just too tanky for my agents, especially because I still don't have a good fire DPS (why won't you come home Soldier 11)
Cleared first part of shiyu defense 17 with zhu yuan in 49s for this and previous resets and have videos for it on my channel.. just get a dps agent for each element/type and you're good
I felt the difficulty increase, but so far I was able to clear it easily, I got three strong teams that I can switch and they are holding out fine, I am hoping for stronger foes in the future.( Got the first comment o/)
My worries are more about rampant power creep, which is one of the reasons I kinda lost my interest in HSR. You start releasing meta breaking characters every patch and then if you step out of the game for a few months your account is now obsolete and struggles. The moment they released someone STRONGER than Acheron I knew shit was gonna hit the fan. As long as older characters can still clear the content and aren't unusuable, it's fine, but if they go overboard they'll back themselves into a corner where A ranks are useless and you can't release any more shielders because Aventurine does it all with some sprinkles on top so preservation is now doomed to have either better and better characters or just release mid niche units that can't compete. I get it, evolving the meta is important, but games like Langrisser will have literal free units (the ones you get from the start of the game) completing endgame content adequately because they balance new content around those units. An S rank should be a bonus and a QoL, not a prerequisite for not suffering through the game IMO. Of course, they can always go back and buff earlier units, which would just solve the whole issue, but yk that's most likely not happening until it's way too late. EDIT: Adding onto that, I feel like ZZZ's main problem has been that there are way too few A ranks so when you need flexible characters you HAVE to pull up 90+ pulls out of your nose or something. Genshin released a bucket load of 4 stars and you have so many options to pick from that it's not really an issue, ZZZ really does need to do the same, otherwise new players will be locked out of new game mechanics and content just because they haven't pulled for unit A or B, and that sucks a LOT.
If I see old characters countered, I hope they also get places where they just get better, like Himeko in PF or how some Genshin characters become relevant when characters or artifact sets are released, like how Jean became viable when Furina showed up. I don't like to have characters roting in my accounts... Even If I have like 40 of them like Genshin, I want to be encouraged to play as many as possible.
My one issue is that I currently have 2 teams built. Soldier 11, and Piper. So there's just no way I can ever clear 5th floor, as ennemies are resistants to both physical and fire in the first half. I think elemental weaknesses and resistances make too much of a difference honestly, like my Soldier gets so pathetically weak against these robots. If either of my team was of a different element I would have had no problem and that's such bs to me, like my pull rng straight up got me elements that I can't clear with
yo wanna ask abt soldier 11 is she good ? i have her c1 with her weapon is she worth the materials ?? (i can clear shiyu defense easy with my other characters so its really not needed to level her up unless she make a diff)
i personally find soldier 11 really fun since you can constantly deal fire attacks if you time her combos right. The Brimstone just makes her even more insane in my opinion. I’d says she’s definitely worth the level up in my eyes, but everyone has a play style they enjoy.
Lv 60 Ben died 2-3 times (I ve played everyday for 70 days ) The reason I can't finish the shiyu defense id because my second team doen't have Ben Ben should've been an S rank
For floor 5, I think people's main complain is in 2nd stage. I sure everyone should have no problem clearing floor 5 stage 1 within 2 min (or am I missing something). So the problem is stage 2. It should takes you 1 min per wave clear. So stage 1 for 2 min and stage 2 for 3 min. Simple.
idk i was struggling on the first shiyu defense with 6th and 7th lvl, I was playing ellen and soldier 11, but as I got my second team with zhu yuan everything was a breeze, this particular defense was by far the easiest for me as I finally finished leveling skills on all my characters
If by "older strategies", you mean: Get two premium DPS agent to 60, min max them, throw in two pairs of of under-leveled supports and instant S-clear shiyuu as soon as it drops by mashing the attack button... Ok, i can see why those "strategies" might not be viable long term.
I think it sucks that the free characters are starting to be invalidated now. Like Anby now feels middling at the late stages even with c6. Nicole is only keeping up because of the vacuum and def down. Anby is too stiff compared to Qingyi. Like this isn't just a difficulty scale, it's just a money creep. Anby can't go beyond her kit with additional customization
i can only get A rank at 5 and 7 and its my first team fault, and i can assume it the 90% of the People problem who gets the jane/seth at the second team and forgot or dont have the resources to get the 1s team stronger
I'm assuming this is in reference to Ambush 5 and not Crit 5? I didn't have much trouble with Ambush, but I pulled Caesar and have Seth so really it was just a matter of keeping my shields up during the fight, and that's *really* easy to do with those characters. That's the thing though, Hoyo are always going to cater content to the new characters so that you're incentivized to pull them. The previous teams were all built to be as fast as possible so they ended up being glass cannons, whereas this time around it doesn't matter how fast you are, you just have to hit the enemy more than it hits you. I wouldn't be surprised if we get more mechanics like that for other types of unit, Razor is another good example of an enemy who you want to fight with anomaly, and I'll bet there will be units you have to stun or freeze in future.
I absolutely am not prepared. Shiyu Defense has been kicking my butt since the beginning to the point I started completing minigames achievements for polychromes instead of trying to complete the harder Shiyu Defense levels. I've yet to properly analyze Doppelganger Jane Doe... Edit: God I want Pulchra to become a playable character... errr for her fluffy tail, of course. Ha ha... Though they'd need to diversify her style cause very similar to Billy. Or maybe update the starting roster's abilities cause they're basically non-existent compared to newer characters. (Again, I am very naive, yes.)
Newbie here and I cant relate. Im still so weak that my ass gets handed to me my the 7th node in the very first shiyu defense group. How am i suppose to beat a physical resistant enemy when my main dps is physical?! (Piper)
To be honest, I don’t think it helps that the blessing this time around only comes into effect with a shield, while other blessings were easily trigger able through things you’ll naturally do like dodge counter, cause anomaly, and use EX specials, while shield is something you cant naturally do in combat without having Ben, Seth, or Caeser. This makes teams like an Ellen team or a ZY team significantly weaker this time around, which usually most players have one or both of as one of their teams.
Shiyu defense in 2025 be like Ballet Quartet: 5 million hp Takes no damage from attacks that deals less than 10k damage 5k defense Attacks 2hko defenders No elemental weakness Passive skill: Each time you hit Ballet Quartet, Ballet Quartet's atk&def raises by 0,5%, up to 50% (permanently) Characters hit by Ballet Quartet's attacks loses 5% atk&def for 15 seconds (up to 20%) Ballet quartet deals double damage to shields When hp is 66% or below, Ballet quartet's damage taken is reduced by 7,5% and anomaly build-up resistance increases by 50%. Ballet quartet reduces defense-reduction debuff taken and your character's Pen-ratio by 5% for each 30 seconds that have elapsed from start of battle (up to 33%)
Tbh, I feel we just have copiun disks still. I'm still rocking sub 100 crit dmg on ellen and zhu... with ellen having her sig. My only character over 100 is soldier lol
Somehow i find these guys harder than jane but thats probably a skill issue specifically when they try to use their guns, and pulchra's ultra instinct, its just so annoying
i literally cant complete end game content with Ellen(c0, no signature w-engine/lvl 60)/Soukaku/Lycaon squad. I mean, its probably skill issue or some build mistakes, but i literally cannot complete one of critical node levels because i deal 0 dmg.
god i feel that pulchra one, if she doesnt have atleast a location related trust bar then im boycotting hoyoverse by not spending any money on their games (im a f2p account from zzz launch)
Hmm i don’t feel any difference but then again finally got burnice to 50 and since zzz now durr durr disorder thing just die so my lv 50 burnice with piper 60 and Lucy 60 cleared easy so can’t give an op dint feel no changes the dople were annoying but a good grouping and yea
I dont feel any spike in difficulty from the time Jane banner was released all the way to the second half of october shiyu i have cleared all of them S rank
Honestly, i think you just have to play the mode correctly, always parry and or dodge incoming attacks, try not getting any damage that way you will maximize your damage output
It's still easy, trust me ZZZ still the most f2p game of miHoYo from my PoV(Well, my first half team is kinda a little bit of wheling tho but I also saw some free team clear faster than me) I even cleared latter half of 5 and 7 floor with Billy solo no hit taken, mid-stats too. I even cleared DISPUTED and AMBUSH with Billy solo no hit taken. Proofs are in my channel if you are interested.
I would not mind if endgame fights were more punishing. I don't like damage sponges and flat HP increase. I would rather see more damage from enemies and more complicated attack patterns. Make this game a freaking souls-like for god's sake.
![BLACK BAG - Official Trailer [HD] - Only in Theaters March 14](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/Du0Xp8WX_7I/mqdefault.jpg)
Ngl, shiyu defense had been clapping my ass similar to how I clap my Zhu Yuan body pillow, it’s tuff to take it all in man 😢
Yes its so hard i could remember how my uncle used to clap me underneath the sheets every night
ookay what…
That's so rough. MAN 🗑️
Double the pleasure 😩 boohoo how sad
What the fuck? 😂😂😂😂
They have new mechanics in the doppelgangers. Pulchra has a dodge mechanic. If you go at her with Piper, she just dodges Piper's Ex special for the entire duration of the skill.
Yeah, its Op
You can cancel it with Nicole EX
@@ClickBaitForever thanks for the hint
the tactic that i came up with is by hugging her, use ben ex skill>lucy ex>follow up piper then BA to ex skill. if sometimes she does get into dodge mode, the assult still procs and it stuns her which also cancelling her dodge right away.
the good thing is that this doesn’t make it so that it becomes impossible to have piper as your main dps, it just makes it so yoiu have to adjust your strategy, maybe swap to caesar and wait for pulchra to attack , so that you can then counter and THEN use piper exi really like how this isn’t a counter to trambuilding but rather just makes you adjust your strategy.
4:29 feels like a nicer way of saying, "mechanics are getting harder to deal with so that company can sell more characters." And about your comment on Billy, I'd agree that it's somewhat ridiculous that people still cite him for these kinds of discussions; the Billy they're referring to has a limited S-rank Wengine with near-optimized disc drive stats. While it's technically possible to get those kinds of things as an F2P, it's not indicative of how most people will use low-end characters to clear Shiyu.
tl;dr: Yes, people can say that solo Billy is viable...but that comes with caveats that don't really help support the idea of "Oh but you can clear content easy-peasy with low-end characters."
all of the links i’ve been sent of Billy clearing also have Caesar & Qingyi at M2. not very relatable
All i read was tldr skill issue
@@sazcxieo You're absolutely correct.
People with skill issue are misled to believe that they can clear content with 4star characters because of those who reference the Solo Billy.
This is because people who reference him fail to discuss how in addition to all the equipment that Solo Billy has, the player actually has the skills to complete them in fast times. They also conveniently don't mention how in a bunch of videos, Solo Billy is supported by M2 S-rank characters, enabling ridiculously fast clear times.
Mihoyo capitalizes on this by releasing new characters that invalidate mechanics so that players with comparably low skill basically have to pull for them if they want to comfortably clear content.
The point is, people should stop presenting Billy as some secret op character (If you have decent player skill, near-optimized drive disc stats, level 12 skills, limited Wengine, op teammates, etc.) that *everyone* should be trying out. It's disingenuous.
Ofc, there will prob be people who will nitpick my assessment of Billy, saying that I'm overexaggerating or that I'm being too wordy with a possible troll. I just think more people should at least be aware of this info before they decide to invest in Billy.
If you don't regret investing in Billy, great! I just really wish that people were more mindful of how they present information!
@@darkeater600I understand that we have much fake 4 star solo, but I alredy see some using just 4 star agents and winning, but it s hard, you have to make the moves without error
there's also the massive factor of the current shiyu catering to physical attribute, which people overlook for some reason
That double ice repel on Ambush Node 5 is actually just a big middle finger for those who pulled Ellen. Since I only have Ellen and Jane Doe as my DPS that shit kicked my ass at first, but thanks to Caesar, Soukaku and Ellen popped off and got me through that shit.
doesn't matter how resisted they are they're not stoping 3,000+2,000 damage Ellen
@@Rat_Fบcker yeah kinda brute forced that shit. Was running Anby before I got Caesar and I couldn't do it, but Caesar's shields and anti-interrupts really help as a lifeline.
I don't know about that.. i clear nod 5 with ellen, lycaon and saokaku team just fine. My ellen only have 2.7k dmg with 146% crit dmg( 68.4% crit rate)
Not really. And Ellen players been eating well till now, with almost everything being ice weak. It was about time the weakness changes.
@@SetRill-t9h That's cool and all, but I never had Lycaon, I was running Anby who had barely stun coverage. I just get overwhelmed easily. It was clearable on the first try once I had Caesar, but it would have possibly been clearable for me with a Lycaon.
Only hard part was picking what team gets Caesar >_>
Yes! That's so true.😅😂
I am still waiting for them to focus on the background stats that have existed since the beginning... The Weapon Damage Types. They are still actively tracking which damage types characters Do. It's why Caesar is Blunt/Pierce. If they start making enemies that have damage type resistances as well as elemental resistances... it'll make the relevance of certain teams much more prominent. And potentially keep new characters selling outside of power creep and waifu material.
Read in another comment section so testing required but apparently Shadow Pulchras dodge stat only dodges slashing attacks
I really like how the doppelgängers actually mimic the mechanics we players can do. It makes content harder without actually inflating their stats-like how Jane Doe doppel can pull Defensive Counters on some of our attacks, or how Pulchra can dodge.
Stuff like that keeps us on our toes, essentially flips the script on us so we have to counter their counter. And just as a concept, fighting doppels of playable characters that forces us to learn their kit mechanics to counterplay is pretty cool, mimicking PvP in a PvE game
They very much do inflate their HP though.
Anyone else not notice a difficulty spike on Floor 5 and struggled on 7? In 5 the enemies basically grouped them selves up for me, whereas 7 I was struggling with meeting the DPS requirement.
this week was definitely harder than previous ones, looking forward for the next ones and I'll be ready with jane + burnice
Nah you need a proper 2nd squad for shiyu
@@sazcxieojane alone can carry a whole round. So you can do a burnice-centric team for 2nd half
Use Jane and Burnice on two separate teams that's my plan
you make a good point sir. I will focus on horizontal building.
I can totally see them adding a Shiyu where some stages generate doppelgangers of meta teams.
Eldenring mimic fight?
Bro don't give them ideas wtf
Hearing this makes me happy that I never fully completed the original version and that the characters I really like aren't in the game yet to do so. Even though I know that I'm missing out on a lot of polychromes and that I've been playing since release it doesn't seem worth while without long term characters
Funny story about this Shiyu cycle.
I had breezed through this cycle until the final floor and was genuinely stuck, with like just shy of 5 seconds to get an S rank. And i just couldn't beat it
.......
Until i realized that to break the sheilds on first half you have to focus the generator and 3 defensive assists immediately break the wolf enemies armor.
So yeah no this was 1000% a skill issue on my part.
I can still clear it with my physical focus team(All agents are A rank) but we'll see if that will change in the future
5:28 this is literally happening right now. Its almost Impossible to kill Jane using Juan or Ellen but if you have Cesar on your team she becomes a cakewalk
It makes sense... I mean, I'm quite satisfied with the characters I have and the game has been out for only a few months. I'm trying to fit Burnice in but I don't "need" her.
But thinking back, my Genshin team evolved a lot over the years and I have different ones for different situations so I should expect the same to happen in ZZZ
Caesar makes one half of ambush node a cakewalk, her shield is easy to refresh and strong enough to take a few hits. Important as Pulcha & Mors have a lot of ranged/trap attacks that are hard to read/avoid.
For the other half, I basically reset until I could no-hit it with Nekomata. That said, I am now building Seth as I think just having any shielder would make a big difference in this mode. Since there's no time-limit, playing carefully and defensively is a valid strategy and makes defense units much more valuable.
I'm struggling so hard against shadow Jane. Dodging seems to fail half the time, she chews through my agents, and her stun window is so short
She's poorly balanced.
As a Genshin/Star Rail player, I agree that this kind of difficulty spikes also happened to Genshin and Star Rail, and now ZZZ is starting to catch up.
My prediction says that there will be a character that will ignore "Enemy Resistance". Just like the example in this video with Miyabi>Ellen. Even though both of them are Ice.
My other prediction says that there will be a support that just straight up remove enemy resistance in general or something like that. 😅
Enemies evolving tactics and requiring more branching out of strategies sounds like how some Ethereals form a symbiosis to effectively crush the non-corrupted, like Thanatos with a Metro Goblin or the big brute Ethereal who smashes around. Two enemies who are designed to get back in your face if you ignore one, while the other takes a shot at you while occupied, creating a constant pressure. Doppels take that to the next degree.
honestly am calling it rn that a future limited s-rank can do a weakness implant like silver wolf from hsr. Now that you mention it, I won't be surprised if Miyabi or any other future s-rank/s will have that kinda playstyle.
Edit: I think it's more viable for support characters to have this kinda thing, ofc. Miyabi would be hella broken if she did, but i doubt it.
Lmao don't give them any ideas
It be funnier if the made an enemy thats weakness is the attack type of the characters.
The recent banners are chock full of Anomaly characters that have built the groundwork for a more stable, if not thriving Disorder Economy, and I would not be surprised if in like 4-5 banners they directly countered Anomaly/Disorder with some enemy trait that has "All Anomaly and Disorder damage deals 65% less damage" and then they start rolling out more crit based dps agents
Shiyu difficulty spike is real. Where def/supporters are more appreciated and needed.
The only real difficulty spike I felt was a) not knowing the animations of the new doppelgangers as well and b) the concept that the enemy is also allowed to have a dodge button
Yeah i was surprised that dopple jane can parry and the three furry dopple can block and dodge especially pulchra, litterally dodging full bar of piper ex bruh
I think you're right, BUT... I guess that the most important element that maybe will make older characters still viable adding to everything you said, from positioning to timing, is how we manage to take the most of their abilties, disc sets and rotations within these new and existing characters.
My account right now was based around team Zhu Yan (with amby and nicole all maxed out) and Jane doe (with grace all maxed out and seth all at 50), but I was still struggling with the new nodes.
And what resolved the issue was building a koleda and a M6 Ben I had (all maxed out at 50), mixing them up with Jane and Grace here and there. Now I've cleared all the end game with S rank.
It has been FUN to build and, most important, FUN to play.
Now I'm hopping to get Burnice to team up with Jane, and see wich character will take the third spot (maybe my M6 Lucy still at lv 30)
considering in HSR, which is a far less skill expressive game, by virtue of being a turn based game where you are forced to take hits and cant dodge for instance, a lot of what you can do will be tuned out of combat in that game. its different from ZZZ in that respect.
but in HSR there are accounts who have done absolutely 0 pulls that are full clearing and 3 staring all the content to this day all over youtube. sure it takes them a lot of farming and artifact tuning etc etc etc but its possible
this isnt a death knell for our 1.0 characters, build them well and keep them updated and they will serve you well. Serve you as well as newest banner character, maybe not as strong as the newest shiniest character, but still very possible.
@@demon_spawn1535 wish I could read more of this around youtube and every other gacha community. Stick to the characters you enjoy even if they are 4 stars/ A rank, is something that will ever payoff even if it takes more farming here and there. But this tunning is also part of the fun.
I started HSR really messing up my account, I didn’t get the game right back then. And guess what? I felt in love with a 4 stars kkkkkkk. Flashforward and I built a team around it focusing to make it the best as possible. Never been happier playing 🥹 haha.
Obs: imma f2p too
All i want is that all characters feel like they serve a purpose somewhere. I don't wanna feel like all this leveling and grinding was wasted on some characters years down the line
i think that as we go deeper into the game, specific teams we’ve built will be able to take on specific enemies we encounter. for example, maybe ellen joe will be good at killing Etherals whereas Miyabi will be good at killing a different enemy. That will hopefully make us feel like our resources weren’t wasted
Shiyu 5 was really the only PAIN floor, the two robots that just runs away attacking from a distance with both of them having big ahh hitboxes so it's rough to deal damage to them at the same time, and the two last shadow dudes which rely heavily on rng for them to group up since they like to jump and dash around alot. Took me around 2-3 days to beat that floor while the other floors took only 1-2 tries, that floor really whooped my ahh.
I had trouble with Pulchra but I managed to beat Shiyu before even getting Caesar. But she is a big help now.
I think what ZZZ did here is the right thing, because it increased difficulty by requiring finer control and reaction from the player instead of outright powercreep. This round of Shiyu requires more dodges, more parries, smarter positioning, caring about order that you kill enemies, etc. instead of just making the enemies tankier or adding mechanics that are unbeatable unless you use a certain specific character. I felt like I really needed to engage with the core combat mechanics, and the intricacies of my character kits much more than before, but what I didn't feel like was that I was falling behind in the dps race, or that my teams were being hard countered like I did in other Hoyo games
guys it's not powercreeping "meanwhile mihoyo eventually adds a BS mechanic that requires a specific character and that character has no re-roll banner yet" gee wonder why I can only complete two levels of shiyu defense! Mihoyo: "subtle"
@@MarkFin9423what mechanic are you talking about?
It absolutely did make the enmies tankier though. The are massive HP sponges.
i have high hopes that, rather than making counters to certain teams or characters, they make counters to specific playstyles. in genshin, team building matters more than anything. of you always have the best team, you can just briese through the game. in zzz, not so much. for zzz, the way you play matters way more than your team composition, and i hope that it stays that way. they could for example introduce new counter mechanics for some new enemies, or have an enemy that punishes attacking at the wrong time. but maybe im just coping because i could never not use piper as my main dps, and i just dont want her to become unplayable some day
You can clear SD even with A ranks if you are lvl 60 and have top stats on disk drives and maxed skills/core passives/w-engine. Important is to match the element weakness and you can clear any stage.
I just got s rank on pillars 10&11, using lvl 50 A ranks
You can still clear all content in HSR on a no pull account to this day if you have kept your farming rotations up and collected all your freebies, and by clear I mean fully clear 3 star everything.
there are several youtube accounts proving it.
If you can do that in HSR, you can do it in the far more skill expressive ZZZ as well. sure the time challenges might be a little stringent at times, but a well made team is going to do everything you need from it.
On floor 5 of Shiyu Defense, not only you fight with doppelgangers, you also have 3 waves of enemies on both sides. In my opinion that is what difficults a lot that stage... Stage 7, on the first half, the enemies have a big ice shield...
As for the extra difficulty, it's obivous they will try to change it. We have 3 months of gameplay, we already having some characters at Lv. 60. Either they change some stuff, or the end game will be a breeze in the park.
Let's worry about it when we see what will be their approach instead of panicking
I will not move on to next node unless I get a s rank. Crti node 5 this time got me so traumatized I was so hyper focused in node 6&7 that I didn’t realize they were easier than 5 💀
I did feel the spike. It's not genshin level of bs yet, but fighting jane in the 7-2 where my jane died like 4 times with opponent being on 10% hp left made my muscles lock up. In the end, while I didn't have the best time, still had a minute to spare for S. The fifth I only had 10 seconds to spare though.
Re-runs are a guarantee, I have patience and can wait for the characters I have to skip, losing out on 3-4 pulls a month because I didn't pull X unit on X banner isn't going to brick my account
what's up guys it's flossin
it’s flossin + knives for extra flair
its a relief to see i wasnt the only one finding floor 5 impossible,i S ranked every other one easily,even 6 and 7,but i just couldnt beat 5 for the longest of time,and all my friends said its a mere skill issue (it was).Other than the 5th floor though,the difficulty of the floors was still pretty easy
Real my time on this was 4:59 like dude i had to optimize my tun so bad.
And every other floors were baby easy
@@xbgsheikiii3593yeah, me too
The difficulty spike is more noticeable when you only give yourself 2 hours to try and brute force through everything and your Billy isn't even that leveled so he can't brute force yet.
just by not having dps for a certain element is already hard before, I didnt even complete any shiyu defense with full S
doppelganger have way higher daze meter
the dev telling us to stop using stun character and try to fit a defense unit in your current team (also change swing jazz that need stun into proto punk that only need assist / dodge)
and then the stage suddenly feel easier
This is a good commentary and the difficulty will definetly be on the mechanics also on jane fight she parries our attacks so is something that will be added in more enemies on the future idk how we can win against that if they where to do it more frecuently but there is already that on the game
I find the doppleganger is fun to againts with. With multiple dodge from Jane she can easily fighting the dopples. For floor 5 1st phase i just brute force it with Zhu yuan.
It does seem more challenging now and its a clear sign that the usual matching element of weakness is not the case anymore later.
Tbh I didn't even notice the hike up in difficulty
a big point, using HSR though, people are still able to 3 star all the end game content on no pull accounts. those old 1.0 characters are still good and capable to fully clear content. you have to be smart with how you build things and what artifact sets you use. but assuming you play the game and keep your builds updated, you constantly improve your teams gear etc. you should be able to clear everything in the game. bonus characters that arent given out via events are just a bonus.
I could go in with my Seele in HSR and keep up with all the current end game content, I just have to have a team built around what shes capable of, and ofc only use her in scenarios that she can excel in. which is honestly a lot if you have silver wolf.
I understand trying to sound warnings about powercreep, its always gonna happen. but even in Genshin, with a proper team setup, assuming you arent going into a fight where she isnt viable, ganyu still claps, Childe can still clap all of the content in Genshin to this day if he is built well and ofc it isnt one of the enemies that makes Hydro not a viable damage type.
Hoyo has always kept a fine line between new characters being stronger and feeling worthwhile to pull while keeping the old characters able to clear if you have kept them up.
I simply don't think there will be an enemy that counters a specific agent because of how the combat of Zenless works, if an enemy doesn't allow me to click button with Ellen, I can simply stun the enemy with Lycaon and then mash with Ellen. I think they only added a counter to Ganyu because she was going against the combat of Genshin, or at least their vision of what Genshin combat is. So unless we have a character that straight up bends the combat mechanics to their will, I don't think that will be the case for Zenless, if anything, I think they'll only add enemies with unique patterns for players to learn and adapt to, which is exactly what I feel about the doppelgangers or all of the Shiyu Defense, if I failed to clear, that's my skill issue or gear issue
I have too many good units and been too lucky as f2p that I can crush everything rn
I'm still clearing with S11 and Anton no problem o_o I think it's just a matter of getting your two teams built up. The only pulls I've done in this game so far were for Caesar to buff my S11 because S11 is my GOAT. Lighter is next. But I wasn't having trouble even before I pulled at all, at least not once I got my DPS lvl 60 and built.
It's finally a little bit more challenging. Still can clear with easy with my E2 characters.
This Shiyu Defence cycle was good challenge!
couldn’t agree more!
Ceasar just makes it easy af. Makes my ellen have 4035 att with my ellen having a crit rate of 98% with 176% c dmg. Enemies die quickly.
How did you increase both her crit stats so much i barely got arround 70rate and 100 dmg
@@noah_0696 probably thorugh ellen's w engine which givevs crit rate on passive on top of the crit the engine naturally gives
Mine's at 95% crit rate with passive from ellen wengine
Damn i didnt get that one 🥲
>knees deep into calculus 2
wow he just like me fr
could all of these shiyu's defense trying ot make it to force us to get the new ppl in the game? could it be so people will spend more money
ie: jane gets out dated due to a new person being super over powered?
but then in another stance couldn't some chars such as zhu yaun be concidered trash or would the game make her even better?
By increasing the difficulty, Hoyo is telling us recess is over, time to buy some S rank agents 😮
no more solo clears with M0 A-Ranks 😅
@@flossinonyou Solo clears, as in billy with no support? yeah, games made for a full team, but there are youtube accounts to this day showcasing HSR full clearing all content on accounts they dont do any pulls on. they only take the freebies, IE they have Dr Ratio as he was given out for free, and other characters you can obtain from various events. so 1 M0 A rank? nah. 3 M0 A ranks that are well build otherwise? should be doable.
I can't complete the shiyu defense modules. I wouldn't even try take the 10th one until I farm my teams. I don't even like the second team that much, but maybe if I max my dps out I can clear this up with an A.
Great video Flossin. Personally i welcome any new challenge that asks me to spread love to multiple agents and experiment different approaches to shiyu defense, however i dont fully know if i feel the same about characters becoming obsolete, at least not any time soon. Less effective and power crept? Sure, but obsolete? I dont think so, or at least i hope not.
Personally i cant see a character pairing like Lycaon and Rina ever being bad, and even in a game like genshin, standard 5 stars are still being used (jean became more used after furina launched for example).
Something to note that wasnt mentioned was the difference in the shiyu buff we had this reset vs the last. Last reset had a 100% uptime and gave atk and crit damage (i think) vs this one which is only active during a shield and only gives atk, which is objecitvely far worse for our agents across the board even with ceasar on the team, which was their goal with this buff (incentivize us to pull for her)
Id wager that next reset will be an anomaly buff and might even be eaiser when our janes/grace/pipers are procing their elements for big numbers alongside burnice. However if hoyo chooses to give us a buff that relates to off field damage then ill cede this point.
At the end of the day though i do think youre on the right track and i appreciate your thoughts and insight here. Personally i cannot wait to see what the future holds for this game
thanks for letting me know about the buff! i honestly keep forgetting that shiyu does this, so i’ll be sure to take it into consideration going forth.
It depends on the concept of difficulty you have, shinyu 5 personally it doesn't feel difficult it just takes a while since there are more enemies and why my zhu yuan team doesn't have the same investment That my Anomaly team which is Piper and Grace, I think the ambush node content is harder as you fight 2 bosses that do a lot of damage and are very aggressive.
I have scored better than in the previous Shiyu Defense, but it's only because I have upgraded my characters a lot since then. I know that it's much harder now, I'm pretty sure I could now S rank everything from the previous round but I absolutely cannot this time. The enemies are just too tanky for my agents, especially because I still don't have a good fire DPS (why won't you come home Soldier 11)
Cleared first part of shiyu defense 17 with zhu yuan in 49s for this and previous resets and have videos for it on my channel.. just get a dps agent for each element/type and you're good
Only stage 5 was harder. That may have even been a mistake. We need to see more updates to know if its actually a trend or not.
I felt the difficulty increase, but so far I was able to clear it easily, I got three strong teams that I can switch and they are holding out fine, I am hoping for stronger foes in the future.( Got the first comment o/)
By the end of the day important thing is you are having fun or not
Had to totally replace my Grace Anby Anton team for shiyu 5
I'd prefer they maintain the difficulty and add 2-3 more levels (same thing they did in hsr)
My worries are more about rampant power creep, which is one of the reasons I kinda lost my interest in HSR. You start releasing meta breaking characters every patch and then if you step out of the game for a few months your account is now obsolete and struggles. The moment they released someone STRONGER than Acheron I knew shit was gonna hit the fan.
As long as older characters can still clear the content and aren't unusuable, it's fine, but if they go overboard they'll back themselves into a corner where A ranks are useless and you can't release any more shielders because Aventurine does it all with some sprinkles on top so preservation is now doomed to have either better and better characters or just release mid niche units that can't compete.
I get it, evolving the meta is important, but games like Langrisser will have literal free units (the ones you get from the start of the game) completing endgame content adequately because they balance new content around those units. An S rank should be a bonus and a QoL, not a prerequisite for not suffering through the game IMO.
Of course, they can always go back and buff earlier units, which would just solve the whole issue, but yk that's most likely not happening until it's way too late.
EDIT: Adding onto that, I feel like ZZZ's main problem has been that there are way too few A ranks so when you need flexible characters you HAVE to pull up 90+ pulls out of your nose or something. Genshin released a bucket load of 4 stars and you have so many options to pick from that it's not really an issue, ZZZ really does need to do the same, otherwise new players will be locked out of new game mechanics and content just because they haven't pulled for unit A or B, and that sucks a LOT.
If I see old characters countered, I hope they also get places where they just get better, like Himeko in PF or how some Genshin characters become relevant when characters or artifact sets are released, like how Jean became viable when Furina showed up. I don't like to have characters roting in my accounts... Even If I have like 40 of them like Genshin, I want to be encouraged to play as many as possible.
142 days left for the idols..
My one issue is that I currently have 2 teams built. Soldier 11, and Piper. So there's just no way I can ever clear 5th floor, as ennemies are resistants to both physical and fire in the first half. I think elemental weaknesses and resistances make too much of a difference honestly, like my Soldier gets so pathetically weak against these robots. If either of my team was of a different element I would have had no problem and that's such bs to me, like my pull rng straight up got me elements that I can't clear with
I'm still S ranking the pillars being 10+ levels under, so it's definitely mechanics, not power scaling
yo wanna ask abt soldier 11 is she good ? i have her c1 with her weapon is she worth the materials ?? (i can clear shiyu defense easy with my other characters so its really not needed to level her up unless she make a diff)
her attack looks so goood !
i personally find soldier 11 really fun since you can constantly deal fire attacks if you time her combos right. The Brimstone just makes her even more insane in my opinion. I’d says she’s definitely worth the level up in my eyes, but everyone has a play style they enjoy.
@@flossinonyou shes already lvl 50 imma lvl up her teammates
ngl, i don't mind the difficulty spikes, as long as they arent timegated and reward actual skill (like ambush and disputed)
we're so cooked 🗣📣🔥
Lv 60 Ben died 2-3 times (I ve played everyday for 70 days )
The reason I can't finish the shiyu defense id because my second team doen't have Ben
Ben should've been an S rank
For floor 5, I think people's main complain is in 2nd stage. I sure everyone should have no problem clearing floor 5 stage 1 within 2 min (or am I missing something). So the problem is stage 2. It should takes you 1 min per wave clear. So stage 1 for 2 min and stage 2 for 3 min. Simple.
5-1 is not hard, but optimizing it to have enough time in 5-2 was just pain. The big robot constantly sliding away cost me the S so many times...
Or they heard that many players said it was too easy and they said bet
idk i was struggling on the first shiyu defense with 6th and 7th lvl, I was playing ellen and soldier 11, but as I got my second team with zhu yuan everything was a breeze, this particular defense was by far the easiest for me as I finally finished leveling skills on all my characters
If by "older strategies", you mean: Get two premium DPS agent to 60, min max them, throw in two pairs of of under-leveled supports and instant S-clear shiyuu as soon as it drops by mashing the attack button... Ok, i can see why those "strategies" might not be viable long term.
I think it sucks that the free characters are starting to be invalidated now. Like Anby now feels middling at the late stages even with c6. Nicole is only keeping up because of the vacuum and def down. Anby is too stiff compared to Qingyi. Like this isn't just a difficulty scale, it's just a money creep. Anby can't go beyond her kit with additional customization
i can only get A rank at 5 and 7 and its my first team fault, and i can assume it the 90% of the People problem who gets the jane/seth at the second team and forgot or dont have the resources to get the 1s team stronger
I'm assuming this is in reference to Ambush 5 and not Crit 5? I didn't have much trouble with Ambush, but I pulled Caesar and have Seth so really it was just a matter of keeping my shields up during the fight, and that's *really* easy to do with those characters.
That's the thing though, Hoyo are always going to cater content to the new characters so that you're incentivized to pull them. The previous teams were all built to be as fast as possible so they ended up being glass cannons, whereas this time around it doesn't matter how fast you are, you just have to hit the enemy more than it hits you. I wouldn't be surprised if we get more mechanics like that for other types of unit, Razor is another good example of an enemy who you want to fight with anomaly, and I'll bet there will be units you have to stun or freeze in future.
I absolutely am not prepared. Shiyu Defense has been kicking my butt since the beginning to the point I started completing minigames achievements for polychromes instead of trying to complete the harder Shiyu Defense levels. I've yet to properly analyze Doppelganger Jane Doe...
Edit: God I want Pulchra to become a playable character... errr for her fluffy tail, of course. Ha ha... Though they'd need to diversify her style cause very similar to Billy. Or maybe update the starting roster's abilities cause they're basically non-existent compared to newer characters. (Again, I am very naive, yes.)
you need a good team and level
You’re not alone! It took me a long time to understand Jane Doe’s mechanics
Newbie here and I cant relate.
Im still so weak that my ass gets handed to me my the 7th node in the very first shiyu defense group. How am i suppose to beat a physical resistant enemy when my main dps is physical?! (Piper)
lets go
To be honest, I don’t think it helps that the blessing this time around only comes into effect with a shield, while other blessings were easily trigger able through things you’ll naturally do like dodge counter, cause anomaly, and use EX specials, while shield is something you cant naturally do in combat without having Ben, Seth, or Caeser. This makes teams like an Ellen team or a ZY team significantly weaker this time around, which usually most players have one or both of as one of their teams.
Shiyu defense in 2025 be like
Ballet Quartet:
5 million hp
Takes no damage from attacks that deals less than 10k damage
5k defense
Attacks 2hko defenders
No elemental weakness
Passive skill:
Each time you hit Ballet Quartet, Ballet Quartet's atk&def raises by 0,5%, up to 50% (permanently)
Characters hit by Ballet Quartet's attacks loses 5% atk&def for 15 seconds (up to 20%)
Ballet quartet deals double damage to shields
When hp is 66% or below, Ballet quartet's damage taken is reduced by 7,5% and anomaly build-up resistance increases by 50%.
Ballet quartet reduces defense-reduction debuff taken and your character's Pen-ratio by 5% for each 30 seconds that have elapsed from start of battle (up to 33%)
Tbh, I feel we just have copiun disks still. I'm still rocking sub 100 crit dmg on ellen and zhu... with ellen having her sig. My only character over 100 is soldier lol
For real, I can't even finish building my characters because of the extreme resource starvation compared to the other Hoyo games.
Then why did they give her such a ginormous ra- anyway back to shuya defense
Somehow i find these guys harder than jane but thats probably a skill issue specifically when they try to use their guns, and pulchra's ultra instinct, its just so annoying
Tl;Dr
PULL MORE.
When the game first came out: this is to easy
The game now: "it's difficult"
Note:I still find the game incredible easy
So far, Shiyu Crit has been easy for me, its Ambush 5 thats beating my ahh
LOL same. I barely even noticed the so called "spike" in Critical but I definitely went sweaty gamer on Ambush 5.
Yeah, meanwhile, I have no idea how to deal with 2 Thanatos-es on the 4th
@@Fabelaz oh that was pure hell
i literally cant complete end game content with Ellen(c0, no signature w-engine/lvl 60)/Soukaku/Lycaon squad. I mean, its probably skill issue or some build mistakes, but i literally cannot complete one of critical node levels because i deal 0 dmg.
I hope not, I love playing Ellen I don't wanna drop her 😑
Floor 5 has too much HP while floor 7 is challenging enough. That's on me anyways
I didn't find anything difficult about Floor 5 whatsoever. So I don't know.
god i feel that pulchra one, if she doesnt have atleast a location related trust bar then im boycotting hoyoverse by not spending any money on their games (im a f2p account from zzz launch)
People had a hard time with node 5 ?
Hmm i don’t feel any difference but then again finally got burnice to 50 and since zzz now durr durr disorder thing just die so my lv 50 burnice with piper 60 and Lucy 60 cleared easy so can’t give an op dint feel no changes the dople were annoying but a good grouping and yea
I dont feel any spike in difficulty from the time Jane banner was released all the way to the second half of october shiyu i have cleared all of them S rank
Honestly, i think you just have to play the mode correctly, always parry and or dodge incoming attacks, try not getting any damage that way you will maximize your damage output
It's still easy, trust me
ZZZ still the most f2p game of miHoYo from my PoV(Well, my first half team is kinda a little bit of wheling tho but I also saw some free team clear faster than me)
I even cleared latter half of 5 and 7 floor with Billy solo no hit taken, mid-stats too.
I even cleared DISPUTED and AMBUSH with Billy solo no hit taken.
Proofs are in my channel if you are interested.
I would not mind if endgame fights were more punishing. I don't like damage sponges and flat HP increase. I would rather see more damage from enemies and more complicated attack patterns. Make this game a freaking souls-like for god's sake.
It will never ever be a Souls-like in any way. it's a button mashing gacha game lol