@@gustavonomegrande That doesn't help when there's a glow around nekros' summons. They can literally be the same colour as the one you have set as enemy highlight too, it doesn't make it less confusing.
You think that's bad? My main is Oberon, whenever I cast renewal with a Nekros on my team my energy gets drained faster than in the energy drain nightmare missions. I need to either wait for the Nekros to go on ahead while hoping he doesn't come back or to find a spot where he almost certainly won't go to cast renewal to avoid getting sucked out of energy once Nekros summons his minions.
I run loki just for spy and rescue missions. I'm just so used playing him for those missions. Outside those missions, loki is close to useless. Really wish DE would rework loki's abilities.
Loki is one of the best defensive frames since his clone has 100% agro so anything will attack the clone+ his teleport is amazing as he can become immortal thanks to his augment so bro can indefinitely be untouchable. Invisibility isn't so bad but still great but the only problem about Loki is really just weapon buffing/nuking so Loki ends up being a sorta of immortal bum. Can't do damage but can't be damaged, so basically he's good only for spy missions and a lil helpful on defense or any other mission with a defense objective.
@V_just_V 100% aggro isnt much when you can put gloom on hildryn and Za Warudo the entire map forever as long as you arnt specifically fighting the infested His teleport is worse than kullervo, and literally everyone can do infinite invisibility thanks to shade Hes cool concept but hes powercrept by shade
I consider this a really bad take on Banshee. Her 1 can push demolysts away from Disruption consoles. With its augment it is a great armor strip. The augment on her Sonar covers her enemies in damage multipliers and the combination of Gloom and Silence makes it so nothing can touch you. She is my go to for SP and EDA.
I run her with condemn which is nice for her 1 since it doesnt knock enemies around, make them face a wall and you have them all lined up, not moving, armour stripped and usually covered in damage multipliers from her 2 augment.
You can completely stop demolysts with magus lockdown and a number of other abilities can prevent them reaching the disruption consoles too. But yeah, I don't think any frame is particularly god awful dogshit now thanks to hydroid/inaros reworks.
I did find the Nekros take weird but other than that I agree with the rest of the video. Saying this as a Sevagoth main, if someone on my team is capable of giving me more energy I would never deny those orbs. Our whole shtick is using Sow + Reap all the time while Gloom slows enemies down, and while Gloom does help you heal, I also won't say no to some free health just in case.
The fun thing about Nekros has infinite scaling using shadows, if you use nourish his summons can proc the viral aoe from getting hit then you just use terrify to strip armor and you can kill with just his 4th.
Theorem Inefection build is actually nutty, just remember at time of summoning they 'save' the stacks you had for those buffs but if they dont die recasting only updates the ones you have buffs in so you can double element and nourish so they run stupid shit like viral/corrosive with extreme damage multipliers on damage multipliers. Also i heard at extremely high levels just enemy damage scaling goes so dumb they can basically carry anyways.
as a Nekros main let me teach you a thing or two about Nekros shadows of the dead. when cast Shadows of the dead picks from a pool of enemies that you or your shadows have killed since the start of the mission. then when you use it, it picks 7 of the killed enemies to raise from the dead under Nekros controll, thease are the 7 strongest enemies in term of level and wheter or not its an eximus. It being an eximus gives it a few points of priority. So in the end you will walk around as a necromancer overlord with a squad of 7 eximus units that kills things for you. and if 1 or 2 dies thats fine there are stronger in the pool by now. now subsume soul punch for gloom and add the augment for despoil and terrify and see the grave yard fill with reqruitable soldiers. The only thing thats bad about Shadows of the dead is that its corps pool for some fucked reason resets on host migration, so a host with crappy conection or random server issues and now you randomly have no army helping you and your team with killing or defending. Also nekros was one of the reasons for the Eximus rework, cause a player geting thier hands on some of the old Eximus abilitys was tottal B,S and needed to be fixed... cough cough the Argon eximus that made all its allies around it immune to all damage untill it was dead... I wounder what happend when Nekros got 2 of those... it made Defence objectives immune to damage BTW
Banshee Is personally my go tò for levelcap distruption, i subsumed condamn from harrow for shields regen and cc, inalso use the augnent for her 1 to strip armor, the enemies in chains wont be yeeted away but Just stripped and locked in Place, dont sleep on Banshee bro
did you try banshee with Jade's subsume? it extends silence to almost 9 seconds and that plus sonars augment you have armor strip, slows and near unlimited damage, if you also use the arcane that steals overguard you have a weapons platform that might be stronger even then mesa
please do not ever cook again, Nekros team heals, team restores energy, generates bubbles, deals damage, has aggro draw CC, generates extra ammo, generates extra health orbs, and generates extra energy orbs also in Alchemy, Excavation, and Salvage, having a Nekros literally makes the mission directly faster, in fact extra loot is one of the only effects in the entire game that makes a mission faster
banshee's sonar helps make bad weapons good, this is not needed in the current warframe landscape, but that's the thing , banshee is not a warframe you use to complete, she's a warframe you take when you're bored of all the op things in your inventory and you want some fun with a squishy frame and a gimmicky yet weak weapon that you wish to make work, also i dont like gloom on banshee instead I use condemn for shield gating and banshee's sonar helps me revive her with last gasp, which is fun
Banshee is literally the best damage buffer in the game and calling her "the worst warframes" is insane. Sonar is a final multiplier, spreading it with the augment can make it overlap itself multiplicatively to give even more damage. Not even counting in the fact that it can also appear on the target's head and multiply the headshot damage bonus aswell. I don't know the exact calculation for damage, but for the sake of giving an example, imagine that the calculation is Damage x Faction modifier x Element damage x Crits. If you use Citrine as in the example given in the video, the calculation stays the same as Damage x Faction Modifier x Element damage x Crits as she only makes shots gain 300% crit chance if you hit the growths and doesn't even modify the crit damage. If you get Rhino roar buff, its Damage x (Faction modifier + Rhino Roar buff) x Element damage x Crits. If you get Banshee Sonar buff, its (Damage x Faction modifier x Element damage x Crits) x Banshee Sonar modifier. Not to mention that Electricity and Gas can target specific body parts which also allow them to benefit from her damage increase. Coming back to your lich example: you'd stun the Lich with Citrine and dealt more damage to it with red crits, yes, but you'd definitely one shot it if not two shot it with Banshee which eliminates the need to stun it in the first place. Also Silence isn't a CC ability, its a UTILITY ability. Her Silence isnt only good for leveling up stuff, it also silences abilities and it has alot of uses outside silencing Eximus abilities, hence giving you utility and not CC. For example, it's one of the main ways to deal with Violence while playing as ability dependent frames in Steel Path, as Violence has Banshee's Silence as his ability and will cancel most active abilities and will prevent you from casting any abilities for 20 seconds. Preventing him casting Silence by having your Silence up before he even spawns will prevent him from screwing you with random RNG because you got Violence out of 6 Acolytes. It's a bit niche but it also has an augment which increases finisher damage which is one of the few things affecting Ash 4 aside from being good for finisher builds. I would say stuff about Nekros too, but I think some of the other comments already said enough about it.
You can glaze sonar forever if you want but the fact of the matter is it literally doesn't matter how good it is if it's use is so incredibly restricted. She cannot be called the best damage buffer in the game if you cannot even use it in the majority of content because DE decided things must be immune to it, that's what I think
@@MrRandsu Sonar isn’t actually restrictive, it can proc off anything and I mean literally anything, ophanim eyes, onos prime beam, AOE/blast/gas/shock/slash procs, and with resonance you can just chain sonar into itself so you casting once or twice will self propagate. Sonar also stacks onto itself multiplicatively. Silence is silence, but I would argue her 1 and 4 are dog ass coming from a banshee main. Subsuming reave over her 4 keeps her alive with guaranteed heal/shield replenish and shield gate and nukes with sonar procs, but her 1 I genuinely hate using for armor strip the rag doll is annoying. Still my most used frame and can take to level cap without suffering damage loss or survivability struggles
not to mention the silence strat is kinda really stresful for leveling a frame and you're better off doing the "switch to asia server, then join steel path eleara on jupiter and leech off the leveling parties there" for less stress
@@malvinchau2056agree. 9min without booster, 3min with booster. The only problem it's time gated. And helminting silence on every frame is just a waste of resources
Loki's Irradiating Disarm augment makes it effective as a CC against Overguard, as irradiated teammates don't care about it. Couple that with decoy, and I could (with some effort) do level cap defense in SP Circuit. It wasn't simple or easy, but the fact that it was at all possible should say something.
DE is already reworking trinity and nyx, and the hydroid rework was kinda fire imo. Hopefully they rework Loki and my dragon boi Chroma at some point in this decade at least.
as a person who HATED loki during the "master race" era...It is kinda a shame he's basically in a state of "not bad" but just...outdone by litterly anyone who can go invis... I run Nekros as a pretty tanky monster. his 1) can be used as an execute thats spawns your 4 and/or heals everyone, terrify is a nice armor strip. also complaining his armopr strip is bad because he dosnt have a nuke just ignores the fact that Guns need armor strip too...idk, I feel its unfair to expect a frame to have a cheap strip/CC and beable to nuke...I think Nekros is just a decent weapon platform as a loot spawning Tank with an Execute on his 1 Banshee Silence is great for disabling the eximus abilities ((made jades quest SUPER friggen cakewalk)) and she has a CRAZY savage silence melee build (not as strong since they reworked covert lethality XP). but I like her with a range str build with sonar cuz you could keep spreading the weakpoints across the map.... ((also as a Oberon main I feel attacked...I cant argue but I still feel attacked cuz he's my baby)) MY biggest choice would have been NYX (who thankfully IS getting a rework) but atm Nyx has no redeeming qualities... her Chaos has same problems you have with nekros 4 except with the caviate that they can still decide to shoot you as well. her Psycic bolts are temporary armor strip, her 4 has the old "energy per damage absorbed" which means her ONLY really good build, assimilate vorhese build, means SP just instantly drains all your energy. and her passive is in a state were you cant even tell if its working or if you are just not getting shot.
Yup, my thoughts exactly with Nyx, not to mention her passive and Chaos make it so absorb isn't even used to it's fullest damage potential since a lot of enemies aren't even targeting you and/or are missing you entirely. And with the fact that it reflects a flat number of damage back to enemies, there's no reason to not replace it with Wukong's defy, which multiplies reflected damage AND gives you a defense boost. I can't wait for this rework, I hope it makes Nyx a lot better to play, because I've wanted to like her for the longest time, but just can't.
Silence also makes it to where Eximus units aren't able to use their abilities. I usually run silence on frames where I just want to chill in a survival.
Yeah but the armor strip is bugged. Need to cast twice to get actual full armor strip even if you have 100% armor strip listed on the ability . Then it’s just way too energy hungry to justify
@@GustavoFring-px3sd I mean with the meme build I’ve got on him, even at 65% efficiency, i really haven’t had energy problems. I’ve also never noticed that bug so unless it only happens sometimes I don’t really know. But I’m also on the train of an Oberon rework. I solely went meme build because fun over function
Funny thing about necro is you could build him with mod like. Equilibrium and combo it with arcane blessing top it with Despoil. pair that with thermal sunder. and you nuking the whole room. by just playing nekros.
@@ML7WL Mandatroy Range and Strenght yeah. for armor stripping part if you fighting grinner 2nd would be require to spam every now and then. If you use thermal sunder to build up a heat proc armor wouldn't be an issue since heat stack will already burn enmeies HP down faster than they could harm you. My mod build is using these following as mandatory Archon Vitality/Overextended/Adaptation/Primed Flow Transient Fortitude/Percision Intensify/Despoil/Equilibrium My arcane are Arcane Blessing and Molt Augmented. this build is base around givign enemies as much heat proc as possible. only con on steel path this build perform horribelly against eximus unit. so bringing gun for eximus is pretty mandatory.
On higher levels, lokis disarm is the best for keeping the squad alive and grouping the enemies together. With shield recharge and invis, he has one of the better survivabilitys, and decoy augment gives him infinite scailing. I like to run loki with an incaron melee currently hate or magistar with attenuation, and xatas whisper to quentuple dip on stealth damage. Since range and duration are what he scales best with tesla bank tesla coils from trainhead are one of my favorite helmiths for loki and spreds around the stealth damage. It also scales off vig swap for some reason. Nekros plus nourish and terrify = i dont even need to fight in higher missions. Or replace soulpunch with octavias reasonator and then enemies have 2 targets before even considering you. Banshee with the right set up can blow through anything. I recommend using projectile explosive weapons with resonance replacing her 4 with condemn and then condemn people near a wall and sonic blast them twice to true damage kill
Oberon, Nekros, Ivara, Banshee, Valkyr, and Chroma would most likely be the next frames to get a touch up like Trinity, Nyx, Frost, and Nova. They have been touching up old frames to make them more in time, people need to give it up time.
Remember: those frames are good if you search the build good enough. Helminth can repair them/buff their performance. All of the frames you mention can be fix with and without helminth. ANY frame is good. You dont see the point with them, but people who play with them see the point od playing with them.
What's crazy is Banshee is going to (potentially) get even more power crept by Cyte-09 because he has a sonar like ability that can highlight through walls and gives you a shit ton of punch through on top of extra weak point damage. Though you can correct me if I'm wrong about that last one. As much as I want a Chroma rework, I'd be lying if I said Banshee didn't need one first.
We just gonna ignore that sonar boost all damage from any aoe source, like corinth alt fire brumma aoe sporothrix aoe so on and so forth, sonar is so underrated.
A rule of thumb I follow in this game is "no Frame that can full strip armor(without help from a Helminth or green shards) is bad" being that this is most often one of the most important abilities you can have in terms of increasing your damage and kill-rate. Banshee *can* do this, but even in that category I think she's still dead last. Making her 1 strip requires an augment that takes up build space, it's conical instead of radial, and will ragdoll enemies across an entire tile so you can't headshot them or hit their Sonar weakpoints- you know, the whole point of playing Banshee. I still run it for the sole purpose of armor stripping Eximus through their Overguard, but that's so niche you could probably argue it isn't worth keeping. Honestly, if her 4 was any good at all I might move Gloom over her 1 instead.
You don't need a nuking ability to capitalize armor strip, his 4 act as soft cc wich is "useless" but do help minorly with damage; remember: nowadays enemy armor is capped, but enemy damage keeps going up. Towards level cap, friendly fire + armor strip is not that stupid...idk exactly the math behind nekros' specters but I suspect it is enemy damage ata base scaled by power strenght.
Banshee can get some fun things to happen with Larva. I don't remember the firing order of the abilities I have set, but I know if its not done right, you cant get the abilities to stack right. If i remember correctly, i use the 1 with the augment and strip armor, then hit them with sonar, then group with larva. From there, get a Nataruk or Fulmin in the semi auto mode to get weak point damage on basically everyone inside. Its been a minute since i tested this build. I think thats how it works, but I know it was JANK having that specific firing order since you couldnt apply either one of her other abilities when enemies were in the larva.
Loki is one of the best defensive frames since his clone has 100% agro so anything will attack the clone+ his teleport is amazing as he can become immortal thanks to his augment so bro can indefinitely be untouchable. Invisibility isn't so bad but still great but the only problem about Loki is really just weapon buffing/nuking so Loki ends up being a sorta of immortal bum. Can't do damage but can't be damaged, so basically he's good only for spy missions and a lil helpful on defense or any other mission with a defense objective.
I half agree with the Nekros take. But his shadows do deal good damage if you use nourish and give it to your shadows. The issue is, it's based on the enemy's level. So you will only see your shadows deal massive damage if the enemies you fight against are level 900+. He needs to get the nyx rework treatment. I hope he does get it one day
I agree that Banshee and Loki are the two worst frames in the game at the moment. Nekros' shadows have synergy with his desecrate ability, giving more loot, but then again, that isn't a point in his favor. Nekros is only good if you use his augments, which makes the frame needlessly tedious. His augments (all of them) should just be integrated with his base kit. The augments should do something new instead of making the abilities useable.
Thing is for the terrify on gauss thing, gauss doesnt even need it. Why cast terrify then tsunder when tsunder with redline(which u should have up 90% time) full strips on all enemies and then deals all remaining heat damage as one blast instance
I do level cap void cascade with banshee with condemn and i never die and delete the map with the corufell sonar full cast speed efficiency, also arcane aegis barrier. So i cannot agree with this take unless its for regular steel path missions because in those you dont need that type of damage to kill stuff therefore its better to pick something else
Also Silence deactivating Eximus abilities is way too underrated, considering they are the most likely thing to kill you due to random arson behind the corner explosions, blast eximus knocking you down, guardian eximus making everyone unkillable and so on
I honestly think banshee has potential, for a me a warframe being strong, or meta or whatever is irrelevant as long i can make it efficient and fun Try one day if you want survivability a banshee with octavia resonator, or banshee with ballistic gallery from mesa with the augment, making enemies be deaf and blind so the only way they can see you is by touching them Also builds with Yarelys subsume is interesting, as habilities hit the main torso body part making the swablades with their augment able to hit weakspots, for longer runs its funny to cast it and see 50+ million damage from a yarely saw True, she isnt the easiest frame to build, but yet offers a lot of utility in form of deafening enemies with silence and multiplicative final damage multiplication for everyone, even the enemy friendly fire with radiation can proc the weakspots Its true that frames like nekros and loki maybe need something more, loki mostly, or others like valkyr need help, but banshee... i see her as a glass cannon that with some love can be very surprising This isnt a rant for saying banshee being weak btw, just my point of view in the frame, im not having any intention of saying this as an attack of "hOw DaRe YoU" just pointing out my experience with the frame :3 Thanks for reading, have a nice day and happy thanksgiving!
banshee; gooning over big numbers with resonance stacking not really something unique to her, but she does have access to the biggest damage multiplier in the game with her 2 augment, you might (correctly) say it requires aiming, when like well scaled toxic lash + roar, or just harmony with like 3 mods on it, doesn't require that to achieve pointless levels of damage, but it's still the biggest by a pretty huge margin, and an arca plasmor shot or corufell heavy attack take the whole aiming part out of the equation but yeah i won't get all valkyr main about it, she needs some help
I haven't played WF in a good while, but I can shed some light on Banshee. She doesn't technically NEED gloom to survive, it's just unreasonably complicated and mentally draining to play. Silence should be used in an ambush/hit and run style, stunning enemies right as they enter shooting range. You must be consciously aware of Silence's range to apply/reapply where necessary to stun lock dangerous enemies. Resonance is required for damage, but Savage can help secure those dangerous kills too; I often ran both. Sonic Boom is similarly critical for saving you from minor mistakes. The really difficult part is the movement. I don't know if this still applies, and it's just theoretical, but in my experience enemies try to predict where you're moving. If anyone makes it past silence and still has the chance to fire at you, bullet jump, back flip, roll to the side while in the air, and cut off your own movement. I could go over an hour in Kuva and Fissure Survivals without going down back when I played by manipulating the aim... assuming that's what I was actually doing? This is a 0 failure policy playstyle and you'll suffer for any and every mistake you make, probably with your life, but you can be terrifyingly efficient. You could also subsume a different ability onto her 4, but I wouldn't know what would best synergize. I stuck with OG Banshee on principle. You could still play with Gloom, but the point of learning to avoid gloom reliance is to free up that helminth for something else.
also banshee had ONE use for me and it was the MR18 or 19 test i think when you had to kill the enemies and orbs without being detected. but probably could have used anything else
I disagree, there's a frame that uses silence better than for just leveling. Silence takes Zephyr from being really darn strong to literally unkillable, since eximus abilities are the effectively only thing that can hurt her through turbulence. This has been my TED Talk, thank you for coming.
I'm really curious to see how Banshee will work with Cyte-09's new subsume, which was confirmed to be Evade, the stealth move. Octavia will still remain the queen of stealth, and I usually use Loki for that anyway, but more curious how Sonar will try to make Evade as useful an ability as it could feasibly be on her.
Technically nyx ult and hydroids old puddle were strong but when its so boring to play neither were enough to pull them from the bottom. Also ranke and kps matter a lot
6:16 that just so wrong the more crit damage you do the less damage the lith take just like base damage for lith you need multishot and fire rate and if you can also use something that they not adapt to like 50% chance on not-crit shot for 2000% damage
"desicrate is the only thing he has going for him" Incorrect His 4 has scaling, swap his 1 or 3 for a damage buff and now you have allies that scale above enemy level Your 1st can be used to gain a specific undead while your 4 pulls from a bag of enemies While loki safe guard switch can be used on person like targets which means he allows you to go endless in arbitration While i do ageee now with the banshee argument, stropha + weak points + breach surge + first ability armor strips instantly
brother i did a banshee omni sp void cascade into the lvl 1200's with banshee with my only defensive mods being prime vigor and rolling gaurd. i replace her 4 with breech surge then shoot the glowy bits for damage integer overload.
her armor strip is a cone that REQUIRES an Augment. Her sonar doesn't work with heat, slash and blast DoT (unless sonar is effecting specifically the torso of the enemy, on some enemies it just doesnt work at all. Melee Influence Electric procs don't get boosted by Sonar. Her sonar doesn't work with most AoE weapons. Her silence can be subsumed onto any other frame. Most of the time her DPS boost relies heavily on your luck (No i'm not gonna count shooting enemy weak spots one by one, that is stupidly slow). Near level cap (70-107 exos in cascade) she struggles with survivability heavily because she's a pure shield gate frame. I love banshee but she only looks good on paper, in a real scenario she falls off compared to any other Weapon platform. I suggest using Electric shard Torid, Dual Toxocyst & Angstrum inc on her since they are good at horde clearing while also hitting the weak spots pretty consistently and has enough damage to go level cap while also making use of her kit.
i worked with Banshee a long time... trying to make her "good". and the result is... well. She has basically infinite scaling damage if u put Xatars Whisper on 1 or 4 (we allready established that these abilitys are worthless anyways) and play with Sobek + Acidshells and her Sonaragument - surely u can play other frames but in terms of AOE damage she plays in a good state - u r also relativly save cause of the Voidbubbles of Xatar and Silence so Enemys will attack u overall "less". If u wanna play Banshee cause she has a cool Abilitydesign in my opinion just try this out, its really fun. (Xoris with Melee Influence and Gas + Electric) works also good
i can't exactly agree or disagree with nekros. like armour strip and extra cc with augment is good on terrify but like 1 is a bit questionable so maybe subsume... but as you said what are you gonna do with the armour strip? no nuking. (and the best thing i can think of is dark verse and i find subsuming dante questionable as is) and then 4... i love the idea of raising dead people to fight for me but also like they don't exactly do too much so most of the time i just don't even use nekros even though i love him
you have weapons..... put nourish over 1. now your shadows have stagger, viral, and draw aggro. drop despoil and use duplex bond for 3 verglas' or burning claws killing defenseless enemies. they're slowed, distracted, staggered en masse, and are talking 20x more damage from your debuffs.
Loki, banshee, Chroma, Limbo, Nekros all deserve a Caliban rework. they are all good frames, but outdated. Loki should be a agent of chaos, his decoy if held should split into 3 decoys that run around and harras the enemies electric shots. his teleport should be auto target. Banshees 4th should be castable while running and shooting with a bigger radius. her 1st should blast away unprotected enemies and drop on the floor the protected ones. Nekros 1st should have a punch trough, each enemie hit should be added to the 4th shadows as a 7+ His 3rd should slowly apply sleep status to the enemies in the vicinity chroma should select his element by holding each of the power buttons, his first should be castable in mid air making him hover and increase the 1st abilities strenght by 500%
Caliban got a rework this update man. Limbo and banshee work fine enough and just need small tweaks. Nekros and Chroma while with uses def do need some more bigger changes, with chroma having 2 good abilities and 2 shit ones, and nekros generally not bringing much other than insane energy and health for everyone else which, while great a good while ago and still nice to have, energy isnt that big of a deal anymore. For loki im eh on him, he fills a niche even if hes not the best at it.
I use banshee for disruption. I subsume gloom on her 4 and use her 1 with augment to armor strip. I'm just so used to using banshee for disruption i don't use any other frame for disruption 😂
In game they are weak and outdated. But in actual lore, Loki - How to kill what you can not see? nekros - Raising an undead army to over run civilizations. banshee - A scream can liquify you innards and shatter bones and concrete alike. thats OP for me.
I use banshee for farming a TON of Lith and Meso relics. with the quake augment everything gets one shot. its boring but if you need relics fast then its excellent.
No, not at all and you need to branch out your definitions. Nekros first: As an ability frame, Nekros subsists off of something that outclasses pretty much every other frame in terms of potential; Enemy damage levels. As things are, nothing in the game can deal as much damage as your own enemies can, having them at your service is the easiest way to guarantee high damage, you also create a subservient list of eximi units, some of which can afford you extreme damage reduction (Guardian), Infinitely scaling single target damage (Jade Light) or even HP and Energy regen (Leeches), not to mention that higher drop rates in SP survival and SP alchemy not only gives the entire team easy cruising for modes that you can lose despite doing everything right by simply being unlucky enough, but that's not all. Nekros' summons are close to or simply immortal and if you build him right or have the right teammates you have a permanent sleuth of about 11 entities drawing fire away from both yourself and your team. Overall this is an uninformed take that probably comes from lacking the resources or strategies to actually bring Nekros to his almost infinitely scaling potential. This not even to mention how teamwide energy and health generation (In the form of orbs nonetheless, which are not turned off by channeled abilities like other energy generation methods and stack with Arcane Energize, Energizing Shot, Equilibrium AND Amber Archon shards or Violet ones for essentially endless supplies of resources for no cost other than some HP and an augment) is simply the best possible support behind only Trinity hitting 4 and 2 Banshee's Silence and Sonar combo both disables enemy abilities making eximus units both predictable and unchallenging (Looking at you, health leech Bonewidow in Elite Archimedea) and boosts damage to insane degrees when copled with the right helminths or mods, all of this in a package that also includes armor strip and the worst single ability in the world, her 4 IS indeed worthless, but it's paired with 3 of the single most versatile and useful abilities in the game. Poor research does not excuse misinformation, but we all make mistakes and because of that I encourage you to try these things outside of what you are told is good. Loki is just sad though, so hey, 1/3 Be better.
I predict Nyx because she is a CC frame with bad CC and her "Terminator" build only turns her into a slower version of Oldkong, who was the worst frame before the beautiful GabeN cosplayer that is Pablo saved him. Anything I could want from her Oberon gives me and then some. (Her 1999 buffs cannot come soon enough.) EDIT: Nyx was not even mentioned, but Oberon (who I consider a direct upgrade to Nyx) was made a dishonorable mention. Society. Bottom Text.
Subsuming shooting gallery onto loki and slotting in the augment disables pretty much every enemies AI. Banshee chain finisher builds hit damage cap for goofy level cap scaling.
Koumei. Outside of hyper extended duration missions, Koumei is in the spot of being a less generally potent version of Lavos. Her 1 is best with low range while her 4 is the opposite. Her 3 is genuinely just a worse Mesmer skin and only becomes KINDA mesmer skin at home when you roll triple 6s. With oberon you can become the team’s support in arbitrations for safety nets and Archon Hunts. Hell, any mission against the sentient is made easier with Oberon as Radiation damage does more damage to robotic health, which the sentient are. Koumei. My vote for least useful at the time of this comment is Koumei
Not all banshee builds use Glood. Some use Harrows's ability for easy shieldgate AND to cheese bullet sponge enemies, cause if you chain them uo and use Banshee's 1 on them they will lose half of their HP. Yes, any enemy that can be chained and affected by Banshee's 1 will lost half of their HP in just 2 ability casts.
Silence stops acolytes from using abilities, too, so that mfer violence won't be disabling your abilities and removing your buffs no more. Also, a lot of sentients don't have melee attacks, only ranged attacks that count as abilities you can disable. It's kinda fnuuy watching them being legit unable to do anything to hurt u. Imo Chroma is quite high on the list of the worst frames in the game, dude only has an ability and a half going for him and even those are outclassed
I'm a main Nekros and his 4 skill shadow of the dead it's a good skill if you know about strategy. Shadow of the dead will litery call the atention of all the enemies towards the shadows i used this some many times on defense missions because the enemies stop focusing on the pod and they start focusing on the shadows i even have videos on my channel proving that
I agree on Banshee. Although I don't agree on that Silence is only useful for leveling. Silence is incredibly useful on frames that rely on CC to not die. Eximus abilities for Frames like Limbo or Vauban are a death sentence, so having the ability to disable them is very useful. But yes this does prove your point that silence is better used on other frames. And people saying Oberon tbh are people that don't really know how to play him tbh. He's a no brainer pick in the Circuit to me because he keeps the team alive, strips armor in quite a big radius, provide status immunity as long as you're standing on Hallowed ground and makes enemies fight eachother which is extremely useful in high level excavation and Defense.
Silence for adaro leveling is not even the best and fastest way, out of range eximus killing on eidolon plains gives affinity way faster, no helminth, only archwing, a projectile weapon strong enough to 1shot. How to: Go up enough that the enemy AI freezes and shoot at them, while the projectile is on its way, get out of the archwing until the eximus dies, get back on the AW, repeat.
Nah man Oberon is outclassed and what he does got powercrept THEN HE WAS THROWN TO RAILJACK MISSIONS ONLY, AS AN ELITE DROP RANDOMLY. He has no niche besides a second life i guess but even that takes an augment, all his augs besides carpet can be base and he'd still kinda just be mediocre but you still have the issue of you need like 200% in every stat for usability unlike most frames, i unironically stopped trying to use him after hp/armor rebalance because i cant spam big aoes overlapping on strip. Chroma unironically got outclassed in everything and it's so bad his ward isn't that good besides cold being acceptable and his ult getting a random credit booster in an aoe, man needs an entire kit retool. Loki is good for resource runs in open worlds, Nekros can run a summoner build and actually have an insane kill squad but no one knows theorem arcanes exist and desecrate spamming life orbs can be built around too while increasing team survivability. I found any teammate banshee is great but idk refresh is needed especially with cyte-09 showing up.
I can ONLY trust the opinion of someone with the handle "bob feet" (Sidenote: I was the second of three people to like Caliban before the rework and while clumsy, and while it was mad appreciated, he for sure didn't need it from my perspective as a SP endurance player)
I like Warframes that aren't meta, because once you find a way to make them broken, the chances of them getting nerfed are low. In some cases there are buffs or reworks like Caliban or Nyx, and in other cases there's nothing, like Loki; but that's fine by me as long as those off-meta Warframes aren't touched so I can keep breaking them.
@gooder5587 wukong was a meta character and they nerfed him so much to a "Jack of all trades master of none"; to the point where I questioned whether his abilities were good enough to take him to the helminth for a troll build I'm doing with my excalibur to spam allies (like revenant and nekros). Now that I heard that they improved the AI of the ally that controls Nyx, I'm thinking of leaning towards her.
@@marianoretamoso4749 wukong was meta because of his slamming bug that was used in afk strats, so I wouldn't say it is a nerf when it was actually a bug fix
Valk without question, the only useful thing she does is tank which is done better by other frames without being restricted to an ever powercreept exalted weapon. you really like the melee speed? cool put it on literally any other frame or just use fury. like Valk's only niche is that she is a invincible frame but the energy drain and melee restriction just makes her a shit revanant at that point.
Lots of Banshee in the comments which I understand but not a single comment has said Trinity and I’m shocked because I personally think she’s absolutely useless
Im a primarily solo player and i play void cascade, so my viewpoint is different from most, but i think Loki is insane. Sure, his kit isn't that great cus he doesn't do self buffing or anything of the sort, but i don't think you need all that to have a great warframe. His kit works and he has multiple survivability uses, his cc is decent as well. What makes Loki great imo is the fact that he requires so little, and since iplay void cascade i can just mod him for a BUNCH of Parkour Velocity, which is the best mobility stat in the game. As for banshee, her silence is great, although she doesn't stun eximus, but her resonance and armor strip 1st are decent as well. As a kit i wouldn't say she is useless, unlike oberon which for me feels like he only has his Regen and status immunity when on the plants. His armor strip is goofy and inefficient and his 1 gives radiation weapon buff with the augment, but who tf wants radiation on their weapon...but yeah i can understand if ppl agree with you, with the power creep, having a simple kit no longer feels that great.
I like loki too. But as a zephyr main, especially for void cascades I cant see any reason to not play zephyr. Her 3 is basically invul and her 1 makes collecting orbs trivial. I am currently asking me why play any frame besides zephyr. She does everything and can do everything. And that with almost zero invest. On her prime, I dont have a forma, helminth nor a single shard. And still I shred solo SP missions.
Oh and also my biggest problem with loki is, that his kit is plain redundand. When you are invisible you are basically unkillable. Maybe a stray bullet or an aoe. Safeguard Switch is basically the same just without invisibility. Decoy does the same in preventing the enemies to attack you. But his 4 removes the weapons from enemies and forces them to go in melee. But why even bother about that when you are invisible, have a decoy or be plain unkillable with safeguard switch? What I try to say is, he has 4 abilitys that all have the exact same output. Why do I need a radial disarm when enemys arent even attacking me? Imo his abilitys all feel like they are good when watched alone, but together in a kit, they all dont synergyze well.
Maim's her sole saving grace right now, it's extremely effective. Definitely needs a rework, but Maim alone puts her above the likes of Loki, Oberon, & friends on the 'needs a rework/slew of buffs' list.
I recently got back to "maining" Loki, after his touch-up. I'm running three augments at once, an Energy Nexus, and a whole load of Archon Shards aimed solely at boosting mobility even further. Hushed Invisibility is a rare Exilus augment that gives sound suppression to any weapon. Safeguard Switch is an invulnerability that cannot be dispelled by any usual means, not even by The Fragmented One's beam. Damage Decoy is a nice status primer that draws away the aggro, survives far longer after the touch-up, and also totally breaks the AI of certain enemies. Radial Disarm is great at further reducing the odds of being hit, and works in tandem with Decoy to group the enemies tighter. All-around great kit, focusing on versatility and adaptability. He is back to being one of my solid picks for most situations, and is quite dependable even in Elite Archimedea.
I wish more people saw nekros as bad so I didn't need to be confused what's real enemies anymore.
Oh God preach!!!
Check options for enemy highlights and your problem is gone.
@@gustavonomegrande That doesn't help when there's a glow around nekros' summons. They can literally be the same colour as the one you have set as enemy highlight too, it doesn't make it less confusing.
You think that's bad? My main is Oberon, whenever I cast renewal with a Nekros on my team my energy gets drained faster than in the energy drain nightmare missions.
I need to either wait for the Nekros to go on ahead while hoping he doesn't come back or to find a spot where he almost certainly won't go to cast renewal to avoid getting sucked out of energy once Nekros summons his minions.
@@Otacanthusyou can change the color of enemy highlights at anytime.
It’s gotta be Loki. The fact that three of his abilities are Present in Will-o Wisp alone, I literally have no reason to run Loki
I run loki just for spy and rescue missions. I'm just so used playing him for those missions. Outside those missions, loki is close to useless. Really wish DE would rework loki's abilities.
@Dan-zm5ik mate i just a shade, heck kullervo has teleports that dont need target and wisp can will-o-wisp so i think hes old
Loki is one of the best defensive frames since his clone has 100% agro so anything will attack the clone+ his teleport is amazing as he can become immortal thanks to his augment so bro can indefinitely be untouchable. Invisibility isn't so bad but still great but the only problem about Loki is really just weapon buffing/nuking so Loki ends up being a sorta of immortal bum. Can't do damage but can't be damaged, so basically he's good only for spy missions and a lil helpful on defense or any other mission with a defense objective.
@V_just_V
100% aggro isnt much when you can put gloom on hildryn and Za Warudo the entire map forever as long as you arnt specifically fighting the infested
His teleport is worse than kullervo, and literally everyone can do infinite invisibility thanks to shade
Hes cool concept but hes powercrept by shade
Banshee's Silence quickly becomes "the thing that keeps the whole team afloat" as levels rise above 150
Shut the exium skill make the run less chaotic with color
...My Yareli solos 450s
@@justalapis5768 I can solo level 9999 with any frame that doesnt mean its "good" or efficient ( even fun )
Silence stops thrax from doing their spectral magnetic laser attack in zariman missions (most of the time)
I consider this a really bad take on Banshee.
Her 1 can push demolysts away from Disruption consoles. With its augment it is a great armor strip. The augment on her Sonar covers her enemies in damage multipliers and the combination of Gloom and Silence makes it so nothing can touch you.
She is my go to for SP and EDA.
I run her with condemn which is nice for her 1 since it doesnt knock enemies around, make them face a wall and you have them all lined up, not moving, armour stripped and usually covered in damage multipliers from her 2 augment.
You can completely stop demolysts with magus lockdown and a number of other abilities can prevent them reaching the disruption consoles too. But yeah, I don't think any frame is particularly god awful dogshit now thanks to hydroid/inaros reworks.
I did find the Nekros take weird but other than that I agree with the rest of the video.
Saying this as a Sevagoth main, if someone on my team is capable of giving me more energy I would never deny those orbs. Our whole shtick is using Sow + Reap all the time while Gloom slows enemies down, and while Gloom does help you heal, I also won't say no to some free health just in case.
Lokis disarm can be used on defense mission to speed it up - as mobs run to mele instead of covering and shooting
nova exists
@@tntproductions9816 fr lmao
@@tntproductions9816 that and sentinels. Though mostly comes down to mod preference on that front
@@tntproductions9816 I was just about to say this, she's my go to frame for most content especially Defense lol
Nova and loki actually work well together - nova speeds them up and loki makes them come close
Bro is trolling with the thumbnail alone
The fun thing about Nekros has infinite scaling using shadows, if you use nourish his summons can proc the viral aoe from getting hit then you just use terrify to strip armor and you can kill with just his 4th.
you honestly dont even need Nourish, you just need REALLY high power strength
Here's what most tennos don't know: you can have more than 11 active shadows
Theorem Inefection build is actually nutty, just remember at time of summoning they 'save' the stacks you had for those buffs but if they dont die recasting only updates the ones you have buffs in so you can double element and nourish so they run stupid shit like viral/corrosive with extreme damage multipliers on damage multipliers. Also i heard at extremely high levels just enemy damage scaling goes so dumb they can basically carry anyways.
as a Nekros main let me teach you a thing or two about Nekros shadows of the dead. when cast Shadows of the dead picks from a pool of enemies that you or your shadows have killed since the start of the mission. then when you use it, it picks 7 of the killed enemies to raise from the dead under Nekros controll, thease are the 7 strongest enemies in term of level and wheter or not its an eximus. It being an eximus gives it a few points of priority. So in the end you will walk around as a necromancer overlord with a squad of 7 eximus units that kills things for you. and if 1 or 2 dies thats fine there are stronger in the pool by now. now subsume soul punch for gloom and add the augment for despoil and terrify and see the grave yard fill with reqruitable soldiers.
The only thing thats bad about Shadows of the dead is that its corps pool for some fucked reason resets on host migration, so a host with crappy conection or random server issues and now you randomly have no army helping you and your team with killing or defending.
Also nekros was one of the reasons for the Eximus rework, cause a player geting thier hands on some of the old Eximus abilitys was tottal B,S and needed to be fixed... cough cough the Argon eximus that made all its allies around it immune to all damage untill it was dead... I wounder what happend when Nekros got 2 of those... it made Defence objectives immune to damage BTW
Nyx is able to make mind control targets one shot but it requires work.
Facts
The host integration thing also happens to other frame abilities and the infernon modes infact it clears the whole bar. It's really annoying sometimes
Nekros has potential, but nyx and caliban do the minion thing better,
Banshee Is personally my go tò for levelcap distruption, i subsumed condamn from harrow for shields regen and cc, inalso use the augnent for her 1 to strip armor, the enemies in chains wont be yeeted away but Just stripped and locked in Place, dont sleep on Banshee bro
did you try banshee with Jade's subsume? it extends silence to almost 9 seconds and that plus sonars augment you have armor strip, slows and near unlimited damage, if you also use the arcane that steals overguard you have a weapons platform that might be stronger even then mesa
This sounds crazy, lowkey post it 🫣
Ooh and I thought the ophanim eyes Xaku trend might also be strong. Didn't try either yet I don't have much time.
Yeah i run this with secondary fortifier on the dual toxicyst
Stronger even than Mesa? Mesa is garbage with her only niche being open world bounties
please do not ever cook again, Nekros team heals, team restores energy, generates bubbles, deals damage, has aggro draw CC, generates extra ammo, generates extra health orbs, and generates extra energy orbs
also in Alchemy, Excavation, and Salvage, having a Nekros literally makes the mission directly faster, in fact extra loot is one of the only effects in the entire game that makes a mission faster
banshee's sonar helps make bad weapons good, this is not needed in the current warframe landscape, but that's the thing , banshee is not a warframe you use to complete, she's a warframe you take when you're bored of all the op things in your inventory and you want some fun with a squishy frame and a gimmicky yet weak weapon that you wish to make work, also i dont like gloom on banshee instead I use condemn for shield gating
and banshee's sonar helps me revive her with last gasp, which is fun
Why would I use a boring warframe when I'm bored I don't understand
i swapped condem for the ability of hyldrin, somehow its better, also you just need brief respite+(your method of energy)+blind rage to survive
@@nqxo9829 condemn is a preference to me because with I prefer to have max efficiency
@@gooder5587 For me, I find her squishiness along with the absurd numbers I deal with sonar fun, if you don’t like that it’s
Banshee is literally the best damage buffer in the game and calling her "the worst warframes" is insane. Sonar is a final multiplier, spreading it with the augment can make it overlap itself multiplicatively to give even more damage. Not even counting in the fact that it can also appear on the target's head and multiply the headshot damage bonus aswell.
I don't know the exact calculation for damage, but for the sake of giving an example, imagine that the calculation is Damage x Faction modifier x Element damage x Crits.
If you use Citrine as in the example given in the video, the calculation stays the same as Damage x Faction Modifier x Element damage x Crits as she only makes shots gain 300% crit chance if you hit the growths and doesn't even modify the crit damage.
If you get Rhino roar buff, its Damage x (Faction modifier + Rhino Roar buff) x Element damage x Crits.
If you get Banshee Sonar buff, its (Damage x Faction modifier x Element damage x Crits) x Banshee Sonar modifier.
Not to mention that Electricity and Gas can target specific body parts which also allow them to benefit from her damage increase.
Coming back to your lich example: you'd stun the Lich with Citrine and dealt more damage to it with red crits, yes, but you'd definitely one shot it if not two shot it with Banshee which eliminates the need to stun it in the first place.
Also Silence isn't a CC ability, its a UTILITY ability. Her Silence isnt only good for leveling up stuff, it also silences abilities and it has alot of uses outside silencing Eximus abilities, hence giving you utility and not CC. For example, it's one of the main ways to deal with Violence while playing as ability dependent frames in Steel Path, as Violence has Banshee's Silence as his ability and will cancel most active abilities and will prevent you from casting any abilities for 20 seconds. Preventing him casting Silence by having your Silence up before he even spawns will prevent him from screwing you with random RNG because you got Violence out of 6 Acolytes. It's a bit niche but it also has an augment which increases finisher damage which is one of the few things affecting Ash 4 aside from being good for finisher builds.
I would say stuff about Nekros too, but I think some of the other comments already said enough about it.
You can glaze sonar forever if you want but the fact of the matter is it literally doesn't matter how good it is if it's use is so incredibly restricted. She cannot be called the best damage buffer in the game if you cannot even use it in the majority of content because DE decided things must be immune to it, that's what I think
@@MrRandsu Sonar isn’t actually restrictive, it can proc off anything and I mean literally anything, ophanim eyes, onos prime beam, AOE/blast/gas/shock/slash procs, and with resonance you can just chain sonar into itself so you casting once or twice will self propagate. Sonar also stacks onto itself multiplicatively. Silence is silence, but I would argue her 1 and 4 are dog ass coming from a banshee main. Subsuming reave over her 4 keeps her alive with guaranteed heal/shield replenish and shield gate and nukes with sonar procs, but her 1 I genuinely hate using for armor strip the rag doll is annoying. Still my most used frame and can take to level cap without suffering damage loss or survivability struggles
not to mention the silence strat is kinda really stresful for leveling a frame and you're better off doing the "switch to asia server, then join steel path eleara on jupiter and leech off the leveling parties there" for less stress
PoE is better for frame leveling
@@malvinchau2056agree. 9min without booster, 3min with booster. The only problem it's time gated. And helminting silence on every frame is just a waste of resources
I like Nyx ,precision intensify, damage decoy, mind freak. You get an angry battering ram that spreads status everywhere.
Loki's Irradiating Disarm augment makes it effective as a CC against Overguard, as irradiated teammates don't care about it. Couple that with decoy, and I could (with some effort) do level cap defense in SP Circuit. It wasn't simple or easy, but the fact that it was at all possible should say something.
Sometimes I wish they reworked old frames like Loki. Like his design by itself has always been cool to me. His abilities are just so outdated
unfortunately DE has said they are extremely unlikely to rework Loki because they dont want to change his identity, which is fair but also damnit
DE is already reworking trinity and nyx, and the hydroid rework was kinda fire imo. Hopefully they rework Loki and my dragon boi Chroma at some point in this decade at least.
as a person who HATED loki during the "master race" era...It is kinda a shame he's basically in a state of "not bad" but just...outdone by litterly anyone who can go invis...
I run Nekros as a pretty tanky monster. his 1) can be used as an execute thats spawns your 4 and/or heals everyone, terrify is a nice armor strip. also complaining his armopr strip is bad because he dosnt have a nuke just ignores the fact that Guns need armor strip too...idk, I feel its unfair to expect a frame to have a cheap strip/CC and beable to nuke...I think Nekros is just a decent weapon platform as a loot spawning Tank with an Execute on his 1
Banshee Silence is great for disabling the eximus abilities ((made jades quest SUPER friggen cakewalk)) and she has a CRAZY savage silence melee build (not as strong since they reworked covert lethality XP). but I like her with a range str build with sonar cuz you could keep spreading the weakpoints across the map.... ((also as a Oberon main I feel attacked...I cant argue but I still feel attacked cuz he's my baby))
MY biggest choice would have been NYX (who thankfully IS getting a rework) but atm Nyx has no redeeming qualities... her Chaos has same problems you have with nekros 4 except with the caviate that they can still decide to shoot you as well. her Psycic bolts are temporary armor strip, her 4 has the old "energy per damage absorbed" which means her ONLY really good build, assimilate vorhese build, means SP just instantly drains all your energy. and her passive is in a state were you cant even tell if its working or if you are just not getting shot.
Yup, my thoughts exactly with Nyx, not to mention her passive and Chaos make it so absorb isn't even used to it's fullest damage potential since a lot of enemies aren't even targeting you and/or are missing you entirely. And with the fact that it reflects a flat number of damage back to enemies, there's no reason to not replace it with Wukong's defy, which multiplies reflected damage AND gives you a defense boost. I can't wait for this rework, I hope it makes Nyx a lot better to play, because I've wanted to like her for the longest time, but just can't.
Yeah, nyx mind control was useless as hell.
worst take of Nekros i've ever seen before
Silence also makes it to where Eximus units aren't able to use their abilities. I usually run silence on frames where I just want to chill in a survival.
Honestly I'd say Loki. He is a relic of old Warframe. Back when people weren't zooming through missions destroying everything with pocket nukes.
Oberon also has a pretty easy to achieve 100% armor strip on top of his statue immunity and other things
Yeah but the armor strip is bugged. Need to cast twice to get actual full armor strip even if you have 100% armor strip listed on the ability . Then it’s just way too energy hungry to justify
@@GustavoFring-px3sd I mean with the meme build I’ve got on him, even at 65% efficiency, i really haven’t had energy problems. I’ve also never noticed that bug so unless it only happens sometimes I don’t really know. But I’m also on the train of an Oberon rework. I solely went meme build because fun over function
People tend to forget nekros's 3 is an instant armorstrip
Funny thing about necro is you could build him with mod like. Equilibrium and combo it with arcane blessing top it with Despoil. pair that with thermal sunder. and you nuking the whole room. by just playing nekros.
Interesting. The rest goes to strenght and range I presume? Armor stripping with the 2 often?
@@ML7WL Mandatroy Range and Strenght yeah. for armor stripping part if you fighting grinner 2nd would be require to spam every now and then.
If you use thermal sunder to build up a heat proc armor wouldn't be an issue since heat stack will already burn enmeies HP down faster than they could harm you.
My mod build is using these following as mandatory
Archon Vitality/Overextended/Adaptation/Primed Flow
Transient Fortitude/Percision Intensify/Despoil/Equilibrium
My arcane are Arcane Blessing and Molt Augmented.
this build is base around givign enemies as much heat proc as possible.
only con on steel path this build perform horribelly against eximus unit. so bringing gun for eximus is pretty mandatory.
On higher levels, lokis disarm is the best for keeping the squad alive and grouping the enemies together. With shield recharge and invis, he has one of the better survivabilitys, and decoy augment gives him infinite scailing. I like to run loki with an incaron melee currently hate or magistar with attenuation, and xatas whisper to quentuple dip on stealth damage. Since range and duration are what he scales best with tesla bank tesla coils from trainhead are one of my favorite helmiths for loki and spreds around the stealth damage. It also scales off vig swap for some reason.
Nekros plus nourish and terrify = i dont even need to fight in higher missions. Or replace soulpunch with octavias reasonator and then enemies have 2 targets before even considering you.
Banshee with the right set up can blow through anything. I recommend using projectile explosive weapons with resonance replacing her 4 with condemn and then condemn people near a wall and sonic blast them twice to true damage kill
Oberon, Nekros, Ivara, Banshee, Valkyr, and Chroma would most likely be the next frames to get a touch up like Trinity, Nyx, Frost, and Nova. They have been touching up old frames to make them more in time, people need to give it up time.
Remember: those frames are good if you search the build good enough. Helminth can repair them/buff their performance.
All of the frames you mention can be fix with and without helminth.
ANY frame is good.
You dont see the point with them, but people who play with them see the point od playing with them.
I thought I recognized that OST- Terraria Calamity Mod. You’ve gotten a sub from me!
No augment Loki: all that has going for him is invis and disarm
Wisp: invis and blind, and that's just 1 ability and her passive, her *PASSIVE*
What's crazy is Banshee is going to (potentially) get even more power crept by Cyte-09 because he has a sonar like ability that can highlight through walls and gives you a shit ton of punch through on top of extra weak point damage. Though you can correct me if I'm wrong about that last one.
As much as I want a Chroma rework, I'd be lying if I said Banshee didn't need one first.
We just gonna ignore that sonar boost all damage from any aoe source, like corinth alt fire brumma aoe sporothrix aoe so on and so forth, sonar is so underrated.
A rule of thumb I follow in this game is "no Frame that can full strip armor(without help from a Helminth or green shards) is bad" being that this is most often one of the most important abilities you can have in terms of increasing your damage and kill-rate. Banshee *can* do this, but even in that category I think she's still dead last. Making her 1 strip requires an augment that takes up build space, it's conical instead of radial, and will ragdoll enemies across an entire tile so you can't headshot them or hit their Sonar weakpoints- you know, the whole point of playing Banshee. I still run it for the sole purpose of armor stripping Eximus through their Overguard, but that's so niche you could probably argue it isn't worth keeping. Honestly, if her 4 was any good at all I might move Gloom over her 1 instead.
You don't need a nuking ability to capitalize armor strip, his 4 act as soft cc wich is "useless" but do help minorly with damage; remember: nowadays enemy armor is capped, but enemy damage keeps going up. Towards level cap, friendly fire + armor strip is not that stupid...idk exactly the math behind nekros' specters but I suspect it is enemy damage ata base scaled by power strenght.
Banshee can get some fun things to happen with Larva. I don't remember the firing order of the abilities I have set, but I know if its not done right, you cant get the abilities to stack right. If i remember correctly, i use the 1 with the augment and strip armor, then hit them with sonar, then group with larva. From there, get a Nataruk or Fulmin in the semi auto mode to get weak point damage on basically everyone inside.
Its been a minute since i tested this build. I think thats how it works, but I know it was JANK having that specific firing order since you couldnt apply either one of her other abilities when enemies were in the larva.
Loki is one of the best defensive frames since his clone has 100% agro so anything will attack the clone+ his teleport is amazing as he can become immortal thanks to his augment so bro can indefinitely be untouchable. Invisibility isn't so bad but still great but the only problem about Loki is really just weapon buffing/nuking so Loki ends up being a sorta of immortal bum. Can't do damage but can't be damaged, so basically he's good only for spy missions and a lil helpful on defense or any other mission with a defense objective.
I half agree with the Nekros take. But his shadows do deal good damage if you use nourish and give it to your shadows.
The issue is, it's based on the enemy's level. So you will only see your shadows deal massive damage if the enemies you fight against are level 900+. He needs to get the nyx rework treatment. I hope he does get it one day
I agree that Banshee and Loki are the two worst frames in the game at the moment.
Nekros' shadows have synergy with his desecrate ability, giving more loot, but then again, that isn't a point in his favor. Nekros is only good if you use his augments, which makes the frame needlessly tedious. His augments (all of them) should just be integrated with his base kit. The augments should do something new instead of making the abilities useable.
Thing is for the terrify on gauss thing, gauss doesnt even need it. Why cast terrify then tsunder when tsunder with redline(which u should have up 90% time) full strips on all enemies and then deals all remaining heat damage as one blast instance
I do level cap void cascade with banshee with condemn and i never die and delete the map with the corufell sonar full cast speed efficiency, also arcane aegis barrier.
So i cannot agree with this take unless its for regular steel path missions because in those you dont need that type of damage to kill stuff therefore its better to pick something else
Also Silence deactivating Eximus abilities is way too underrated, considering they are the most likely thing to kill you due to random arson behind the corner explosions, blast eximus knocking you down, guardian eximus making everyone unkillable and so on
I honestly think banshee has potential, for a me a warframe being strong, or meta or whatever is irrelevant as long i can make it efficient and fun
Try one day if you want survivability a banshee with octavia resonator, or banshee with ballistic gallery from mesa with the augment, making enemies be deaf and blind so the only way they can see you is by touching them
Also builds with Yarelys subsume is interesting, as habilities hit the main torso body part making the swablades with their augment able to hit weakspots, for longer runs its funny to cast it and see 50+ million damage from a yarely saw
True, she isnt the easiest frame to build, but yet offers a lot of utility in form of deafening enemies with silence and multiplicative final damage multiplication for everyone, even the enemy friendly fire with radiation can proc the weakspots
Its true that frames like nekros and loki maybe need something more, loki mostly, or others like valkyr need help, but banshee... i see her as a glass cannon that with some love can be very surprising
This isnt a rant for saying banshee being weak btw, just my point of view in the frame, im not having any intention of saying this as an attack of "hOw DaRe YoU" just pointing out my experience with the frame :3
Thanks for reading, have a nice day and happy thanksgiving!
banshee; gooning over big numbers with resonance stacking
not really something unique to her, but she does have access to the biggest damage multiplier in the game with her 2 augment, you might (correctly) say it requires aiming, when like well scaled toxic lash + roar, or just harmony with like 3 mods on it, doesn't require that to achieve pointless levels of damage, but it's still the biggest by a pretty huge margin, and an arca plasmor shot or corufell heavy attack take the whole aiming part out of the equation
but yeah i won't get all valkyr main about it, she needs some help
I haven't played WF in a good while, but I can shed some light on Banshee. She doesn't technically NEED gloom to survive, it's just unreasonably complicated and mentally draining to play. Silence should be used in an ambush/hit and run style, stunning enemies right as they enter shooting range. You must be consciously aware of Silence's range to apply/reapply where necessary to stun lock dangerous enemies. Resonance is required for damage, but Savage can help secure those dangerous kills too; I often ran both. Sonic Boom is similarly critical for saving you from minor mistakes. The really difficult part is the movement.
I don't know if this still applies, and it's just theoretical, but in my experience enemies try to predict where you're moving. If anyone makes it past silence and still has the chance to fire at you, bullet jump, back flip, roll to the side while in the air, and cut off your own movement. I could go over an hour in Kuva and Fissure Survivals without going down back when I played by manipulating the aim... assuming that's what I was actually doing?
This is a 0 failure policy playstyle and you'll suffer for any and every mistake you make, probably with your life, but you can be terrifyingly efficient. You could also subsume a different ability onto her 4, but I wouldn't know what would best synergize. I stuck with OG Banshee on principle. You could still play with Gloom, but the point of learning to avoid gloom reliance is to free up that helminth for something else.
Volt! Random speed boosts?! Rush exists!
Making a functional Oberon build was extremely fun recently. He is definitely significantly worse, but I just like torturing myself.
1:00 Nyx is worse than Loki, well that didn't age well, since that Nyx rework looks very juicy
honestly, she was decent before the rework. she's going to be an absolute monster now, though.
also banshee had ONE use for me and it was the MR18 or 19 test i think when you had to kill the enemies and orbs without being detected. but probably could have used anything else
I disagree, there's a frame that uses silence better than for just leveling. Silence takes Zephyr from being really darn strong to literally unkillable, since eximus abilities are the effectively only thing that can hurt her through turbulence. This has been my TED Talk, thank you for coming.
I'm really curious to see how Banshee will work with Cyte-09's new subsume, which was confirmed to be Evade, the stealth move.
Octavia will still remain the queen of stealth, and I usually use Loki for that anyway, but more curious how Sonar will try to make Evade as useful an ability as it could feasibly be on her.
Technically nyx ult and hydroids old puddle were strong but when its so boring to play neither were enough to pull them from the bottom. Also ranke and kps matter a lot
Let's go limbo, somehow not done bad
6:16 that just so wrong the more crit damage you do the less damage the lith take just like base damage for lith you need multishot and fire rate and if you can also use something that they not adapt to like 50% chance on not-crit shot for 2000% damage
"desicrate is the only thing he has going for him"
Incorrect
His 4 has scaling, swap his 1 or 3 for a damage buff and now you have allies that scale above enemy level
Your 1st can be used to gain a specific undead while your 4 pulls from a bag of enemies
While loki safe guard switch can be used on person like targets which means he allows you to go endless in arbitration
While i do ageee now with the banshee argument, stropha + weak points + breach surge + first ability armor strips instantly
brother i did a banshee omni sp void cascade into the lvl 1200's with banshee with my only defensive mods being prime vigor and rolling gaurd. i replace her 4 with breech surge then shoot the glowy bits for damage integer overload.
There is room to dramatic improve all the warframes in mentioned including Oberon
her armor strip is a cone that REQUIRES an Augment. Her sonar doesn't work with heat, slash and blast DoT (unless sonar is effecting specifically the torso of the enemy, on some enemies it just doesnt work at all. Melee Influence Electric procs don't get boosted by Sonar. Her sonar doesn't work with most AoE weapons. Her silence can be subsumed onto any other frame. Most of the time her DPS boost relies heavily on your luck (No i'm not gonna count shooting enemy weak spots one by one, that is stupidly slow). Near level cap (70-107 exos in cascade) she struggles with survivability heavily because she's a pure shield gate frame. I love banshee but she only looks good on paper, in a real scenario she falls off compared to any other Weapon platform. I suggest using Electric shard Torid, Dual Toxocyst & Angstrum inc on her since they are good at horde clearing while also hitting the weak spots pretty consistently and has enough damage to go level cap while also making use of her kit.
i worked with Banshee a long time... trying to make her "good". and the result is... well. She has basically infinite scaling damage if u put Xatars Whisper on 1 or 4 (we allready established that these abilitys are worthless anyways) and play with Sobek + Acidshells and her Sonaragument - surely u can play other frames but in terms of AOE damage she plays in a good state - u r also relativly save cause of the Voidbubbles of Xatar and Silence so Enemys will attack u overall "less". If u wanna play Banshee cause she has a cool Abilitydesign in my opinion just try this out, its really fun. (Xoris with Melee Influence and Gas + Electric) works also good
Okey for now i agree with everything you said so imma hit Warframe and check for my self thank you for an excuse to keep playing
Silence is such a good survival tool... For limbo
I used to think volt was bad until they changed his description! XD I agree with you
Banshee doesn’t deserve to be in any bad frame talk. Sonar and silence alone make her at bare minimum b tier
i can't exactly agree or disagree with nekros.
like armour strip and extra cc with augment is good on terrify but like 1 is a bit questionable so maybe subsume... but as you said what are you gonna do with the armour strip? no nuking. (and the best thing i can think of is dark verse and i find subsuming dante questionable as is)
and then 4... i love the idea of raising dead people to fight for me but also like they don't exactly do too much
so most of the time i just don't even use nekros even though i love him
you have weapons.....
put nourish over 1. now your shadows have stagger, viral, and draw aggro. drop despoil and use duplex bond for 3 verglas' or burning claws killing defenseless enemies. they're slowed, distracted, staggered en masse, and are talking 20x more damage from your debuffs.
Banshee got very nice nails 💅👌🏼👌🏼
Loki, banshee, Chroma, Limbo, Nekros all deserve a Caliban rework.
they are all good frames, but outdated.
Loki should be a agent of chaos, his decoy if held should split into 3 decoys that run around and harras the enemies electric shots.
his teleport should be auto target.
Banshees 4th should be castable while running and shooting with a bigger radius.
her 1st should blast away unprotected enemies and drop on the floor the protected ones.
Nekros 1st should have a punch trough, each enemie hit should be added to the 4th shadows as a 7+
His 3rd should slowly apply sleep status to the enemies in the vicinity
chroma should select his element by holding each of the power buttons, his first should be castable in mid air making him hover and increase the 1st abilities strenght by 500%
Caliban got a rework this update man. Limbo and banshee work fine enough and just need small tweaks. Nekros and Chroma while with uses def do need some more bigger changes, with chroma having 2 good abilities and 2 shit ones, and nekros generally not bringing much other than insane energy and health for everyone else which, while great a good while ago and still nice to have, energy isnt that big of a deal anymore. For loki im eh on him, he fills a niche even if hes not the best at it.
I use banshee for disruption. I subsume gloom on her 4 and use her 1 with augment to armor strip. I'm just so used to using banshee for disruption i don't use any other frame for disruption 😂
Didn't you hear about Loki's agment: damage decoy?
True damage scaling with enemies and ALL status, Loki is not S tier but It not F
In game they are weak and outdated. But in actual lore,
Loki - How to kill what you can not see?
nekros - Raising an undead army to over run civilizations.
banshee - A scream can liquify you innards and shatter bones and concrete alike.
thats OP for me.
I use banshee for farming a TON of Lith and Meso relics. with the quake augment everything gets one shot. its boring but if you need relics fast then its excellent.
do you play darkest dungeon your oc looks like the bounty hunter
No, not at all and you need to branch out your definitions.
Nekros first:
As an ability frame, Nekros subsists off of something that outclasses pretty much every other frame in terms of potential; Enemy damage levels. As things are, nothing in the game can deal as much damage as your own enemies can, having them at your service is the easiest way to guarantee high damage, you also create a subservient list of eximi units, some of which can afford you extreme damage reduction (Guardian), Infinitely scaling single target damage (Jade Light) or even HP and Energy regen (Leeches), not to mention that higher drop rates in SP survival and SP alchemy not only gives the entire team easy cruising for modes that you can lose despite doing everything right by simply being unlucky enough, but that's not all.
Nekros' summons are close to or simply immortal and if you build him right or have the right teammates you have a permanent sleuth of about 11 entities drawing fire away from both yourself and your team. Overall this is an uninformed take that probably comes from lacking the resources or strategies to actually bring Nekros to his almost infinitely scaling potential. This not even to mention how teamwide energy and health generation (In the form of orbs nonetheless, which are not turned off by channeled abilities like other energy generation methods and stack with Arcane Energize, Energizing Shot, Equilibrium AND Amber Archon shards or Violet ones for essentially endless supplies of resources for no cost other than some HP and an augment) is simply the best possible support behind only Trinity hitting 4 and 2
Banshee's Silence and Sonar combo both disables enemy abilities making eximus units both predictable and unchallenging (Looking at you, health leech Bonewidow in Elite Archimedea) and boosts damage to insane degrees when copled with the right helminths or mods, all of this in a package that also includes armor strip and the worst single ability in the world, her 4 IS indeed worthless, but it's paired with 3 of the single most versatile and useful abilities in the game.
Poor research does not excuse misinformation, but we all make mistakes and because of that I encourage you to try these things outside of what you are told is good.
Loki is just sad though, so hey, 1/3
Be better.
I would say it's a matter of play style but what do I know I only got like 200 hours at most lol.
I predict Nyx because she is a CC frame with bad CC and her "Terminator" build only turns her into a slower version of Oldkong, who was the worst frame before the beautiful GabeN cosplayer that is Pablo saved him. Anything I could want from her Oberon gives me and then some. (Her 1999 buffs cannot come soon enough.)
EDIT: Nyx was not even mentioned, but Oberon (who I consider a direct upgrade to Nyx) was made a dishonorable mention. Society. Bottom Text.
Subsuming shooting gallery onto loki and slotting in the augment disables pretty much every enemies AI.
Banshee chain finisher builds hit damage cap for goofy level cap scaling.
You can do the two things you mentioned on most other warframes
2:20 WUKONG CAN DO THAT?!
Yeah I didn't know that either 😂
That's the only reason i still have wukong
Koumei. Outside of hyper extended duration missions, Koumei is in the spot of being a less generally potent version of Lavos. Her 1 is best with low range while her 4 is the opposite. Her 3 is genuinely just a worse Mesmer skin and only becomes KINDA mesmer skin at home when you roll triple 6s. With oberon you can become the team’s support in arbitrations for safety nets and Archon Hunts. Hell, any mission against the sentient is made easier with Oberon as Radiation damage does more damage to robotic health, which the sentient are.
Koumei. My vote for least useful at the time of this comment is Koumei
Not all banshee builds use Glood. Some use Harrows's ability for easy shieldgate AND to cheese bullet sponge enemies, cause if you chain them uo and use Banshee's 1 on them they will lose half of their HP. Yes, any enemy that can be chained and affected by Banshee's 1 will lost half of their HP in just 2 ability casts.
Silence is even useless for lvling up warframes when you have the archwing nataruk method where you can lvl up in 2 minutes
Silence stops acolytes from using abilities, too, so that mfer violence won't be disabling your abilities and removing your buffs no more. Also, a lot of sentients don't have melee attacks, only ranged attacks that count as abilities you can disable. It's kinda fnuuy watching them being legit unable to do anything to hurt u.
Imo Chroma is quite high on the list of the worst frames in the game, dude only has an ability and a half going for him and even those are outclassed
I go for loki in circuit if i get doodoo weapons and spam radial disarm
I'm a main Nekros and his 4 skill shadow of the dead it's a good skill if you know about strategy. Shadow of the dead will litery call the atention of all the enemies towards the shadows i used this some many times on defense missions because the enemies stop focusing on the pod and they start focusing on the shadows i even have videos on my channel proving that
I agree on Banshee. Although I don't agree on that Silence is only useful for leveling. Silence is incredibly useful on frames that rely on CC to not die. Eximus abilities for Frames like Limbo or Vauban are a death sentence, so having the ability to disable them is very useful. But yes this does prove your point that silence is better used on other frames.
And people saying Oberon tbh are people that don't really know how to play him tbh. He's a no brainer pick in the Circuit to me because he keeps the team alive, strips armor in quite a big radius, provide status immunity as long as you're standing on Hallowed ground and makes enemies fight eachother which is extremely useful in high level excavation and Defense.
Silence for adaro leveling is not even the best and fastest way, out of range eximus killing on eidolon plains gives affinity way faster, no helminth, only archwing, a projectile weapon strong enough to 1shot. How to: Go up enough that the enemy AI freezes and shoot at them, while the projectile is on its way, get out of the archwing until the eximus dies, get back on the AW, repeat.
sht i was about to agree and hit the like if that was the real ending on banshee
Worst to me is Atlas. Cant nuke, stealth, CC, support, survive, one shot. There is no built to make any of his abilities meaningfuly strong or useful.
Nah man Oberon is outclassed and what he does got powercrept THEN HE WAS THROWN TO RAILJACK MISSIONS ONLY, AS AN ELITE DROP RANDOMLY.
He has no niche besides a second life i guess but even that takes an augment, all his augs besides carpet can be base and he'd still kinda just be mediocre but you still have the issue of you need like 200% in every stat for usability unlike most frames, i unironically stopped trying to use him after hp/armor rebalance because i cant spam big aoes overlapping on strip.
Chroma unironically got outclassed in everything and it's so bad his ward isn't that good besides cold being acceptable and his ult getting a random credit booster in an aoe, man needs an entire kit retool.
Loki is good for resource runs in open worlds, Nekros can run a summoner build and actually have an insane kill squad but no one knows theorem arcanes exist and desecrate spamming life orbs can be built around too while increasing team survivability.
I found any teammate banshee is great but idk refresh is needed especially with cyte-09 showing up.
The amount of warframe content creators who use calamity ost is wild
I can ONLY trust the opinion of someone with the handle "bob feet"
(Sidenote: I was the second of three people to like Caliban before the rework and while clumsy, and while it was mad appreciated, he for sure didn't need it from my perspective as a SP endurance player)
I like Warframes that aren't meta, because once you find a way to make them broken, the chances of them getting nerfed are low. In some cases there are buffs or reworks like Caliban or Nyx, and in other cases there's nothing, like Loki; but that's fine by me as long as those off-meta Warframes aren't touched so I can keep breaking them.
They rarely nerf "meta" warframes so it doesn't matter really
@gooder5587 wukong was a meta character and they nerfed him so much to a "Jack of all trades master of none"; to the point where I questioned whether his abilities were good enough to take him to the helminth for a troll build I'm doing with my excalibur to spam allies (like revenant and nekros). Now that I heard that they improved the AI of the ally that controls Nyx, I'm thinking of leaning towards her.
@@marianoretamoso4749 wukong was meta because of his slamming bug that was used in afk strats, so I wouldn't say it is a nerf when it was actually a bug fix
Valk without question, the only useful thing she does is tank which is done better by other frames without being restricted to an ever powercreept exalted weapon. you really like the melee speed? cool put it on literally any other frame or just use fury. like Valk's only niche is that she is a invincible frame but the energy drain and melee restriction just makes her a shit revanant at that point.
Lots of Banshee in the comments which I understand but not a single comment has said Trinity and I’m shocked because I personally think she’s absolutely useless
Im just happy Limbo wasnt mentioned as one of the worse
loki is usefull every two year when the plague star event is here
dude called nyx bad gg to this video so far
Im a primarily solo player and i play void cascade, so my viewpoint is different from most, but i think Loki is insane. Sure, his kit isn't that great cus he doesn't do self buffing or anything of the sort, but i don't think you need all that to have a great warframe. His kit works and he has multiple survivability uses, his cc is decent as well. What makes Loki great imo is the fact that he requires so little, and since iplay void cascade i can just mod him for a BUNCH of Parkour Velocity, which is the best mobility stat in the game. As for banshee, her silence is great, although she doesn't stun eximus, but her resonance and armor strip 1st are decent as well. As a kit i wouldn't say she is useless, unlike oberon which for me feels like he only has his Regen and status immunity when on the plants. His armor strip is goofy and inefficient and his 1 gives radiation weapon buff with the augment, but who tf wants radiation on their weapon...but yeah i can understand if ppl agree with you, with the power creep, having a simple kit no longer feels that great.
essaying, my bad...
I like loki too. But as a zephyr main, especially for void cascades I cant see any reason to not play zephyr.
Her 3 is basically invul and her 1 makes collecting orbs trivial.
I am currently asking me why play any frame besides zephyr. She does everything and can do everything. And that with almost zero invest. On her prime, I dont have a forma, helminth nor a single shard. And still I shred solo SP missions.
Oh and also my biggest problem with loki is, that his kit is plain redundand.
When you are invisible you are basically unkillable. Maybe a stray bullet or an aoe. Safeguard Switch is basically the same just without invisibility. Decoy does the same in preventing the enemies to attack you. But his 4 removes the weapons from enemies and forces them to go in melee. But why even bother about that when you are invisible, have a decoy or be plain unkillable with safeguard switch?
What I try to say is, he has 4 abilitys that all have the exact same output. Why do I need a radial disarm when enemys arent even attacking me?
Imo his abilitys all feel like they are good when watched alone, but together in a kit, they all dont synergyze well.
Ppl go out their way to hype revenant but then there’s Loki who’s just as immortal and has better CC
@@threedog27 What orbs? There are none on void cascade other than health and energy. The game mod with orbs that you described is called void flood.
hands down well all agree it is equinox, ive never seen 1 in my missions for like 3 years now lmao
Maim's her sole saving grace right now, it's extremely effective. Definitely needs a rework, but Maim alone puts her above the likes of Loki, Oberon, & friends on the 'needs a rework/slew of buffs' list.
Nekors is great. Id put him there but he is good
Worst one imo os koumei. it's hard to have all 4 abilities be absolutely pointless. At least loki has invisibility for example
As a banshee main... alright homie, you don't have to say it.
I recently got back to "maining" Loki, after his touch-up. I'm running three augments at once, an Energy Nexus, and a whole load of Archon Shards aimed solely at boosting mobility even further. Hushed Invisibility is a rare Exilus augment that gives sound suppression to any weapon. Safeguard Switch is an invulnerability that cannot be dispelled by any usual means, not even by The Fragmented One's beam. Damage Decoy is a nice status primer that draws away the aggro, survives far longer after the touch-up, and also totally breaks the AI of certain enemies. Radial Disarm is great at further reducing the odds of being hit, and works in tandem with Decoy to group the enemies tighter.
All-around great kit, focusing on versatility and adaptability. He is back to being one of my solid picks for most situations, and is quite dependable even in Elite Archimedea.