Marvel's OVERdesign Problem
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- Опубликовано: 13 янв 2022
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The Marvel Cinematic Universe is a grand place where fantastical things occur and superheroes exist... but why does everything kinda look... samey? I mean we got norse Gods and teenage superheroes rocking cybernetic looking armor... so, what exactly is going on with the MCU right now? Let's nitpick the MCU's overdesign of superhero suits!
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Hello there
Clints new suit: "Tf u talm bout...."
@@captaineri.223 honestly I didn't really like that suit
Cool
Do You Really Know Anything About Movie
This may be an unpopular opinion, but I always liked Star-Lord’s costume. Yes, it’s not comic accurate, but it suits a guy who is holding onto his 80’s childhood. He’s got that red leather jacket, cool space helmet, and blasters that screams “Flash Gordon” like Tony called him
Facts he's so awesome
I'm pretty biased considering that I went as Star-Lord for Halloween when the movie first came out.
I agree completely
True
I feel its more important to create a design both practical and meaningful to the character rather than striving for "comic accuracy"
I once read a great advice in character design: ´´If a child can´t draw your character from memory, then it´s design is bad.``
That might be some of the dumbest shit I’ve ever heard
I kid can’t draw a soldier from memory
Solid! I literally have flashbacks to how I drew Sailor Moon costumes from memory after watching episodes in the morning. As a kid.
That a cool one
thats why kids remember cartoon characters more as their designs are simple yet distinct
Marvel Studios desperately needs to get more concept artists. The 1s they have now use the same design patterns on everyone's costume. At first I chalked it up to Tony designing all the Avengers suits. But it doesn't explain other characters who don't associate with Tony Stark and some are off world.
I noticed this too. Every villain has a robotic designed suit, or has the same exact suit texture as black widow and captain America, but the dude in this video already mentioned this.
I don't think the issue is the concept artists, look at Shang Chi he has some great concept art and suits that would be much better in the movie. I think the problem is more higher up.
@@1216Rockman Agreed
Nothing to do with the concept artists, they have some fantastic artists there who if you look at the "art of" books you will see create some really cool and completely different designs for the characters. Its up to the guy's approving those costumes. Some of the work by guys like Wes Burt and Jerad Marantz in particular look very different from what we see in the movies. They still try and push the character designs in many different ways but its up to the Director, and other higher up guys like Feige to give the final approval on designs.
Also the making of the costumes has some bearing on their designs too and can limit how far they can push it, although thats being fazed out with the heavy use of CGI instead of actual real world costumes.
The higher ups like those suits more so they always aprove those suits
The worst part of the love and thunder suit is that all the original teasers had this Viking like suit with a fur back to it, and in my opinion it looked great. I don’t get why they made it this gold and blue mess
Yeah I wish the Asgardians we’re actually gods not aliens with supernatural powers like in the comics.
Becuz marvel is like nah that thing sucks, why not we use the suit like power rangers and we add gold and blue on it and call it a day.
Im like fuck that suit though it looks like totally straight out of power rangers.
Even DCEU's aquaman suit is from the original cartoon with green gauntlet and gold scales on the suit
@@srikanthramprasad565 but they are gods though? what states that they aren't?
@@madladdie7069 the fact Odin himself claims they're not maybe?
@@wolfdragox5563 and he contradicts himself in the next movie.
It's crazy how much I remember people disliked Daredevil's black suit before the show came out back then but now it's like one of the most praised looks in all things Marvel. It's the cheapest outfit imaginable yet still effective as a badass superhero getup, mostly thanks to the wearer who knows how to make it cool
So true, it nails the gritty vibe too
Also the red suit wasn't great so naturally people gravitated towards the black one.
@@galactic85 the red suit was great
I've seen plenty of people complain about the netflix super heroes not wearing their costumes
@@galactic85 The red suit he gets in season 2 is fantastic. The one he gets at the end of season 1 though is pretty mid tbh
I agree with this for the most part, in my personal opinion the suits still need a practical twist in order to keep them from looking like caps suit in Avengers 1.
I like that suit
That suit looked horrible
I think the overall look of the suit is fine, but it could be slightly redesigned at least in the helmet. I think that hurts the visuals alone.
@@q4dxpq60 How? besides the godawful helmet
Best cap suit not even joking
The older Iron Man suits are some of the best cases in which something was "overdesigned"; they made him look more realistic instead of having the armor shaped like his muscles.
But it was overdesigned in a good way
The nanotech didn't look great and felt like a "contingency suit" from the look. The think you'd use if you, say, got thrown out a window unexpectedly?
@@teresar6348 I was referring to his original look in the comics when I said the muscle thing
I like the nanotechnology armor, it suits its concept perfectly. It looks how you'd imagine a "suit made of nano robots", that emphasizes the body's natural curves and is slimmer. It's not made by an assembly line, so it does not need to have distinguishable parts or look streamlined, and I think they got that vibe exactly right.
@@fabriciofazanoI agree. I just love how bright, futuristic and sleek it looks. Add on to that a completely new kind of technology and it really feels like a final armour. I love how modular the older ones feel too. It's a nice contrast.
Wanda's updated scarlet witch outfit is a pretty good balance between comic acurate and realistic. They even made the crown thing work
Agreed
Yeah, but kinda no.
I still think she suffers a lot from desaturation and excessive lines - like a Stark design. Not to mention the proportion of her helmety helmetish head thing kinda looked better when she was wearing a silly costume during that Halloween episode.
They could've done something more like that, mimicking Vision's look. Maybe even something more magical looking, avoiding straight lines (like chaos magic). It lacks something.
Well, respectfully, coming from a *comic* scarlet witch fan, I agree with the comment above me.. The unnecessary and frankly ugly lines on the headpiece doesn't really work. Plus her outfit was extremely dark and strayed from the comics by a lot. In fact, the only real thing they took into account was the headpiece. But you can let it slide considering she's the antagonist of the movie (Multiverse of Madness)
The red should be brighter
@@funnyguy-qs4ho darker looked better anyway
The X-men will be the mcu’s ultimate test for suits. Hopefully wolverine finally looks comic accurate.
or at least have his suit. the mask may be hard to pull off, but if cap can work without one, so can logan
@@jockeyfield1954 The mask is mandatory. Obviously he should take it off during intense emotional scenes to show off the actors talent, but during fighting scenes it is a must.
@@RustyBrickStudios
Cowlshaped masks that are supposed to be just fabric, like Wolverines, Daredevil's, Captain america's, and Batman's, do not work in live action because fabric doesn't work like that. Not everything that comics artists have come up with can convincingly translated into live action. They become helmets.
@@RustyBrickStudios the mask will look incredibly stupid
@@erikgain1294 They made Cap’s mask iconic. They can do the same for Wolverine.
That's why I love Moon Knight's costume. He looks like a horror monster turned into a superhero with a pure supernatural element added to it.
yeah it looks like somebody put a hood on a mummy
@@brodee0 that's exactly what Marc suit's is, a mummy with a hoodie and tactical Gear.
@Scruffy actually it is comic accurate. Yea most of the time in the comics MK is wearing a solid white suit but sometimes his suit had the mummy wraps on them too
The show is amazing, the suits were amazing, I wanted Steven to use the sticks he randomly pulled out of his”arse” but hey what can you do?
I especially liked Steven's suit. Mf be drippin
When I was watching The Eternals, I felt like those costumes were a bit of a missed opportunity. What I mean by that the costumes are cool individually but, in a group shot, they lose their individuality. The only ones I feel that avoided this were Thena due to her costume featuring so much cream and white, a feature that is distinctly hers, and Sprite's due to it feeling more saturated as well as contrasting her hair. Each character was given a specific colour but you can't tell because everything is so desaturated, meaning they blend together.
I know it would not have solved every problem, but I think it would have helped tremendously if the film had allowed these alien beings to be brightly coloured and show a larger tonal range than mid to dark. Feel free to disagree or give other ideas but I really think this would have helped set them apart more.
Imo, in Eternals, only Thena's and Ajak's suits look good, everyone else's looks like a mess. and I agree, they made the color desaturated as hell
To me, whenever they're grouped up together, they look like a team of power rangers
The fact that I don't even remember who sprite and ajak were I think Validates the video's point further😂
i am SO GLAD you mentioned how bad the iron spider suit is i was genuinely surprised that no one thought it looked bad or no one was talking about how bad it was
I thought I was the only one who thought it looked super bad. the large symbol, the unnecessary shoulder pads, the lights, how dark it is, it just looks so bad. I was so happy when Octavius tore it apart.
The colors clash way too much
i never liked it but i felt i was the only one thinking it looked bad and over time i got used to it bc i convinced myself i was just being a purist who didnt liked new takes on designs, now, i just dont like it, i think if at least the symbol was completely gold i would have liked it a bit more
@@wolfdragox5563 I was exactly the same. Now that I know there are others who feel the exact same I've gone back to my original opinion. TBH I hated the idea of the iron spider (Altho I do like the 4 arms) but when I saw the original comic design I changed my mind on that. It was that simple and they messed up and when they use CGI it looks AWFUL.
Also this sort of thing happens ALOT. I feel I'm alone on things and just after convince myself that its just me I discover its not an unpopular opinion.
A problem is that they deviated away from the “less is more” mentality that makes iconic suits iconic. By showing less, people are more focused on the colors, postures and emblems of each respective heroes i.e. Batman
There going more comic accurate this phase
@Chicken Nugget Yup.
@Mr7Reality *shut*
@Mr7Reality because mutants are not im the mcu yet and it makes her more distinct from mr fantastic who is coming later
@Mr7Reality Man with stretchy hands. Girl with stretchy big hands.
The biggest issue is that, for the past 5 years or so, you can clearly tell that most of the suits are design by the same person: Andy Park. He's a talented illustrator, but he lacks imagination when designing suits or at least has this tendency of drawing the same base lines (like the ones you pointed out or others, like the ones connecting the waist to the thighs... it's always the same for him). I would say that his basic design for everything is Ant-Man's suit.
Same as well with Ryan Meinerding. He is also responsible for designing some MCU character suits which I think actually that he just has the same vibes as Andy Park does.
Also although i agree they did all get their suits from the same tailor, tony stark and those who didnt do look different
He's the lead artist for Thor Love and Thunder.
Yeah...
They need to hire another costume designer at this point
1 guy? I mean his work is good but you'd think Marvel would hire more designers for each aspect of Marvel in mind
For me, the best costume cap ever wore was the one in the first movie. It looked practical which made sense for a soldier, while still being visually distinctive. There are some that matched the original comic designs better, but for live action, I liked it far better.
couldn't agree more, loving the practical straps, pouches and padding to make it look more "military" and fitting to the time period. Also the two vertical red straps resembling the comic accurate red-white stripes.
Cap america 1 costume is the goat, i wish thats the one he used in avengers 1, and would still fit what couson said about old fashioned
The thing cool about team-ups in the comics is that not only characters cross over, but also the suits that emanate every character's personality and their respective context. In comics, you can see a full handmade spiderman's suit teaming up with a dude in ancient Viking armor and another man with bleeding edge armor. On MCU however, all the suits have hexagons everywhere and seem to be made by the same Hollywood manufacturer
That's why I loved Tony and Cap's suits in Endgame. Tony's new suit has mostly uninterrupted gold on the upper part of his arms and legs and there are much larger areas that do not have have the lines. It looks so much better than his Infinity War Armor. that was so busy and yet so red it was hard to keep track of. And Cap's Endgame suit is so good because it added scales to the chest and shoulders and the lines actually followed the star shape in the middle. It's still a bit overdesigned, but it was such a welcome change that it didn't bother me at all and I personally think it's his best suit because of it.
Iron man's suit in endgame is just like the comics
@@muffinsdawg that's true, I forgot to mention that. That's the best part
That’s why it was called endgame
My favorite ironmans suit was Infinity war lol
@@unapersonamas5941 Not that you’re wrong for thinking that, but I’m calling cap.
Between the worst CGI for any Iron Man suit in the series (aside from maybe Civil War), and a design that’s so skinny and monochrome that it looks like he’s wearing a shitty CGI morph suit.
I agree strongly, because while I like the changed up and varied designs the mcu gives, and occasionally prefer them, I can't help but enjoy the more simplistic designs that comics typically bring. And sometimes it feels like too much, and the characters end up looking like polished action figures.
i think "polished action figures" do play a big part about why they are designing so many suits like this
Yeah, likeI love the designs used in MVC1 and 2, those designs are my absolute favorites
@@a.c3334 honestly facts
Then go read the comics then
@@darnellnoir then its just a nitpick no need to be passive aggressive then
I have always imagined there being one specific tailors in New York that specialises in hero and villain suits that makes everything for everyone in the mcu (besides from Stark of course). I’ve always found it really funny that even the newest villains and heros somehow manage to get their hands on these designer suits that would most likely be very expensive - that’s a whole creative process I doubt your neighbourhood villain is going to be willing to go through. Marvel should definitely make a film about a tailor shop like this though, it would be funny seeing the dynamics when a hero walks in and sees their arch nemesis in the same shop to collect their newly made suit.
You were right , latest episode from She-Hulk
That's nice but they should never make a movie about that. Maybe include it in a movie
There actually is a guy like that in the comics he appeared in a Spider-Man comic and the suit he designed actually was used for the Spider-Man’s last stand storyline.
He repairs the costumes of different hero’s and villains when they get damaged.
Moon Knight's costume is amazing. There are lines on lines on lines, but that's because it's modeled after the intricate wrappings of traditional Egyptian mummification. It's perfect for the character and makes a lot of sense.
Moon knight should be BLACK!
@@Polymerata did bro just say the moon should be black 💀💀
@@Polymerata so another batman
@@Polymeratabut mummy tape was white
Excactly my thoughts. It diverges from his classic comic look yet still is based on the more modern comics.
I'm so glad someone's FINALLY bringing this up.
I thought I was the only one that felt like the MCU overcomplicated everyone's designs. I think just most Marvel movies, even before the MCU existed, in general, would do the same.
I would call this try-hard design, it feels so forced at this point,
Yeah like the stupid black leather xmen suits
Thors original design was perfect and the endgame version was just as good now they've given him a goofy looking suit I'm tired of them ruining character designs
Yeah it always bothered me that spiderman had emotive eye lenses and how they moved creeped me out
@@theoutsiderjess4869 I’ve always been fine with that tbh, didn’t really bother me at all. It’s comic accurate too, and it’s not like they moved that much anyway . To be fair to you though, Spider-Man in the majority of media before Civil War didn’t have moving visors, so I get where you’re coming from.
Only time it REALLY bothered me was when he closed his eyes to fight Mysterio’s drones at the end of FFH lmao that creeped me out
I like how the Moon Knight trailer dropped just a few days after this video with what I think is one of the cooler costumes Marvel's put out recently. Yeah, the mummy theme does basically still equal "moar lines!," but at least they seem to be used a bit differently, with a more purposeful role in the aesthetic.
I fully agree with you. For me personally the Moonknight costume is the best live screen comic suit so far and while the lines are a bit distracting I still think it works and makes it beautiful.
Turning Moon Knight's costume into mummy wraps was one of Marvel Studios' best costume decisions; not only does it fit with the theme of death and rebirth, it is also a great way of making the suit thematically closer to Ancient Egypt without changing too much of it.
While I have similar tastes to the guy that made this video, his whole arguments are fucking garbage. Marvel has put out more banger suits than not.
The damn trio looked amazing in Endgame, Spider-Man never looked as cool live action as he did in No way Home.
I’m also really tired of constant bashing of the “iron spider suit” it’s not really a definitive version, that wasn’t full adult Peter. It would be weird seeing him in other colors, people already crapped enough on the whole iron boy Schtick.
Falcon suit looks cool albeit the fit is a bit weird.
Doctor Strange looks amazing.
Don’t know why he’s obsessed with that Thors look, he’s not “Thor Thor” anymore, now it’s Janes time and her suit looks pretty good and comic accurate.
Thanos, Antman, Black Panther, Vision, Loki, Winter Soldier. I really don’t see why so critical.
Oh wait he used Znyder as an example, I see why.
@@filiperocha4025 Shut up
It’s cool but falls into green lantern territory being all cg. His other suit is cool though.
Tbh I think it’s about getting the right balance. Something not too simple, and not too complex. Making the suits contrast just a little bit more to reflect the characters is a good thing too.
You can't blame them for "overcomplicating". Most comic accurate suits tend to look really goofy, impractical and very tight in a live action movie. Like captain america's suit in avengers one. All though it had good comic accuracy, it looked like he went to a Halloween store and bought the first costume he saw on the racks. When you picture a super soldier fighting a war in real life, do you think he is wearing a comical suit with bright colours or is he wearing dark heavy duty gear that looks practical for combat, a suit someone like captain america might actually wear. The only way you could pull of a comic accurate suit without looking horrendous is if it's done in some form of animation or drawing. Most heroes look iconic because of their costume, but the reason they didn't look so goofy was because they were only depicted in comic books. With art and animation you can bring a lot of things to life in that form that would otherwise look odd and weird in real life. You can't just take the same designs from the comics and put them right in the movies. It wouldn't capture that same magic that you would read in the comics. So when marvel tries to do these movies, they try and go for a more gritty look for their heroes that already have decent enough colours and I'm all for it. Another example for really terrible looking costumes is Ben Affleck's batman. His costume looks bloated, cheap, impractical and it just over all looks like you can't even take him seriously. Robert Pattinson's batman on the other hand looks like it was made by Bruce himself. It had armor plating, gadgets, utility and overall felt gritty and badass because it was like batman almost came to life in a realistic form whereas you wouldn't be surprised if Ben Affleck's suit had a "made in china" label stamped on to it. Comic suits look great because of their simplicity and basic principles, but you can't exactly replicate that onto a live action movie without making it look practical. The best comic looking adaptations I have seen for a superhero live on screen are spiderman and superman, the rest either look a lot different than their comic counterparts or they look like their comic version with little to no changes. Just my take.
While I agree that the “ ┐┌ “ design is definitely overused in costumes, I think it works well because it follows the natural shape of the actor’s body
Simpler character designs are the best character designs compared to overly dramatic and complicated character designs. For example Zoro from One Piece in the current Wano Arc is missing an eyeball; he has three earrings on his left ear; he has a slash mark over his left eye, and he wears a pure neon green Kimono, but if you had somebody like MCU costume designer designing that same costume then you’d have the character looking drastically out of place that he doesn’t belong any world regardless if it’s fictional or none fictional worlds.
@@RoronoaZoro-ur6hr Isn't that becasue every designer will have a diffrent ideas and designs than the other? plus you're comparing an anime character outfit with life-action characters costumes and it doesn't make sense
@@OsamaMas Cosplayers prove that idea wrong on a daily basis and many times for a fraction of a Hollyweird budget.
@@erichurd7605 well not everyone can pull off a cosplay and most likely will look cheap and cartoonish even if it's 100% anime/comic accurate. I mean yeah they have money and they can do it and they probably did and it looked off 🤷♂️
@@OsamaMas judging by the name I'm not surprised why someone would compare that in the first place tbh
Even though it’s not a movie suit, I feel like Miles Morale’s main suit from the 2020 game is the perfect example of how to adapt a suit to look realistic enough but still maintain the classic look from the source material
I agree. Miles’s Classic Suit in-game is literally a perfect 1-to-1 recreation of his classic comics suit.
Maybe a bit off topic, but the color scheme is fricking awesome as well
Exactly, that was perfect.
Yes, but I think the miles morals suit from Spider-Man Into the spider verse is better.
@@JohnDoe-qj3iv true, but that suit has the advantage of being animated
As a graphics's designer myself getting into modding for Insomniac's Spider-Man I can totally understand the fear of UNDERdesigning. You wanna add enough to the design to make it feel and look different from the others, but you can't add too much to it so it becomes a cluster of okay ideas, at the same time you don't want to make a too simple design that people don't notice the details you added that make it shine and just becomes labelled as "too simplistic" aka underdesigned, so it's a very hard thing re-creating something that's already amazing.
Even tho the game is amazing, almost every suit is actually very overdesigned with lines and things, the Scarlet-Spider one is a good example of that.
Yes! I have been drawing my whole life, and drawing superheroes is always entertaining because of the dynamic poses and unique designs. When the first Avengers movie came out, I drew all six of them on all my notebooks and sketchpads. It was a breeze everytime because of the, as you pointed out, simplistic and easy on the eyes look of the costumes/uniforms. Then the overdesign problem. I got back to drawing superheroes after watching the Marvel shows and movies, and some had easy to draw designs like TVA Loki, Moon Knight, and sometimes Shang Chi and WandaVision Scarlet Witch (if I want to simplify their upper body design). But some are awful to draw on paper because of too many lines, or color because of too much vibrance. Especially hate drawing Iron Spider, Captain America Falcon, and Thor in Love and Thunder (especially THAT) because of the excessive lines and curves for detail. I just end up drawing their comic classic looks or the EMH cartoon designs. So yeah, as an artist, this does tick me off a bit.
This was a real problem in the 90s for comics (marvel and dc) with heroes “armoring up” and the 2000s seemed to lean into adding excessive paneling or patterns.
Don't forget the pouches and pockets😏
@@Hillthugsta and random straps/buckles
@@bimbgusbomgus2861 and leather.
dont forget the pouches
@@bimbgusbomgus2861 ooo and Gambit style visors
I agree that some are becoming more unnecessarily busy, at the same time, recently they've been making an effort to push more comic-accurate suits which are generally much cleaner and less busy.
I'm having doubts about that after this atrocity of a Thor costume was leaked.
@@LeadMetal82 concept art hardly ever comes out the same way in the actual movie
@@LeadMetal82 that's based on his classic golden armour
@@matthewplays7232 just because it's classic doesn't mean it's better. batman once had the emblem with the yellow background but that's not much better
@@leoalper4530 ok but what’s ms marvels excuse cause that outfit is something 😭
6:18 “but are they iconic? Are they memorable? No.”
Wow just like the Eternals movie
as someone who's making an animation with fictional character that have suits, this is making me feel relieved because my designs are way too minimalistic and I was starting to worry they didn't look like Marvel's lol thank you, this gave me an entire new perspective.
Honestly wished you talked about more of the Phase 4 suits. Think that at least with The Falcon and The Winter Soldier, they're fixing the basic design of Falcon's suit by taking him in the direction of Cap. His Cap suit seems to be on the right path. Also think Walker had a Cap suit that was easy at being well designed and distinct. Not the biggest fan of the white stripes yet but hopefully that suit is a beta design for an improved US Agent.
Hmm do you read comics cuz that's exactly what us-angent wears
Arguable, Sam's Cap suit seems a bit too flashy, more vibrant and overly stuffed but it's understable because Falcon is more equipped, however, it still looks a bit overproduced. I agree with Walker's though.
@@Mayhem.jester The idea is not necessarily that it has to be comic accurate but also simplistic. The white stripes being removed for them is just a subjective opinion.
His falcon suit was finally decent in the show too. In fact I believe it looks much better than his captain america suit
@@darn4285 yeah but how could you improve perfection
Although, I don't mind the MCU iron spider suit, I would have much rather seen the original comic-accurate one. It's simple shiny gold and red design was badass on its own.
Mcu isn’t the dceu. There is still time, o use to spend all their cards.
@@filiperocha4025 shitty designs = 0 use to spend all their cards. Ok kid
The problem w the red and gold iron spider is that mcu iron spider is like used by all throughout IW and end game, and having spider man, the most iconic marvel hero, stand next to all the marvel heroes, but wears a non original colors suit, kinda makes him feel like not the spiderman we knew.
@@zethrenbeltran4071 That is him throughout the MCU for me
iron spider is garbage
I think sometimes too much comic book accuracy makes the characters look goofy.
Aquamas first mantaray looked like a cool modernized version. Then they went back to the Comics and it looks accurate but also low tech so doesn’t have as much realism like.. that shit doesn’t look like it shoots lasers
Same, they throw me off
Personally I adored the costume design in Birds of Prey and The Suicide Squad (2021). Most of the costumes in BoP aren't exactly superhero suits but they're all vibrant and unique and look really cool, and Polka Dot Man and Peacemaker's costumes in TSS are so goofy and so perfect, not to mention Harley's first outfit in that movie which was CRIMINALLY underused. Both of those films have such cool aesthetics and I love it
I’m in 100% agreement...
Two things tho:
1) imo Endgame suits for Cap and Iron Man are flawless
2) Upgraded suit from Far From Home is in the running for my favorite Spidey suit (I love the glimpse of the classic suit but it’s so shiny and glossy I’m just hoping the next movies don’t have the same CGI problem you’ve pointed out).
How does it look shiny like to me it looks amazing like you can't tell the difference between when it's the real suit (which it's most of the time I don't know where that misconception comes from) and when it's cgi
@@spider-man500 how is it obvious
The suits in Endgame were designed perfectly
@@RabbiB0Y Watch a couple videos from the RUclips channel "corridor crew", they do vfx for a living and looking at it through their eyes has allowed me to appreciate good vfx even more. Tom hollands suit in homecoming only looks real to me when he's inside his house coming home and ned is there and the end with aunt may. Maybe when Tony picks him up out of the lake but its dark. Other than that its only when he uses the homemade suit that it works for me which thankfully he has during the climax
@@tylerm4405 Homemade suit was CGI half the time too lol
Totally agree, whenever I think about designing a character, I think about how easy it would be for a child to draw it. Not just recognize it but to completely recreate it from memory. This is inspired by the fact that Kirby takes just a few strokes and your done. The rest of his cast is just as simplistic. These newer movie suits, they feel like you need a degree to completely redraw it. And its harder to picture in my head which can only recreate the most simplistic design anyway. Like, those lines in the Tom Holland suits don't even register.
Well, all suits can't have a simplistic design. So they can see the original suits if they want to.
This is exactly how I thought about things but at the end, not everything can be that simplistic right? Can it
I think one of the problems that Marvel has is that their comic super heroes are generally not as well-known as DC comic ones. As a result when making films they have the option to add flavor to the character to better suit the movie settings
I liked the Iron Spider suit, personally. I think it pulled off making it look like it had a bunch of technology behind it. Like it looks like a mixture of an Iron Man suit and a Spider Man suit, which in the context of the MCU works perfectly.
But I'm also a fan of Final Fantasy games so clearly over-designed stuff doesn't bother me.
It's not even overdesigned. This guy just likes underdesigned stuff. You can't expect an actual life action costume to look like a stylised cartoon.
@@Carabas72 how is not having random excessive lines considered underdesigned to you?
@@XYZip1
The lines are neither random nor excessive.
What he's argueing for is Adam West style costumes.
@@Carabas72 The lines aren't completely random, theyre just a lazy attempt at streamlining the suits. And if I recall, he praised the dceu suits, which is very different from the adam west suits
@@XYZip1
The DCEU suits are uniformly terrible.
I love marvel movies but, I totally agree that DC makes suits better.
I hate marvel but I actually prefer their suits
@@keegan3839 did marvel did something bad to you mate!
Don't forget that Zack was behind all those suit, even the golden Aquaman suit
My problem with them is that their colors are so desaturated. I can barely tell Superman or Wonder Woman is actually wearing red and blue. Aquaman and Shazam were perfect. Embrace the bright colors and iconography
@@Sosuke_Aizen2.o Yes marvel is inferior because it's owned by Disney, before Disney it was at the same level. To each they're own right?
7:08 and don't even get me started on fucking Black Manta's suit bro. 100/10 straight fire, absolutely incredible.
YOU'RE SPITTIN
I think the costume department and director(I believe) even said that they wanted to have classic Black Manta on the screen, despite the oversized helmet being very corny/campy.
I love when the intricate details are done right. Wanda's costume is incredible. So is Moon Knight's suit. Also, the Dora Milage look is absolutely beautiful.
I love the simplicity of the Ditko-inspired Spider-Man Upgraded Suit from Far From Home, but I also love the amazing intricacies of the No Way Home Integrated suit (which is basically the Iron Spider suit just way better looking and mixing elements of the Upgraded suit with it)
That is the biggest piece of dogshit I’ve ever seen.
I think that we should give these costume designers a ton of credit and a ton of artistic license because that’s what we have given comic book illustrators for decades. If anything we should be advocating for MORE costume designers so that not every suit looks like it came from the same design sensibility. But otherwise, it makes sense to me that Tony Stark is making the suits for most of his teammates and that his own suit started out simple and became more opulent as the technology evolved. Designing a suit nowadays is more an exercise in world building than it is simple aesthetic preference. The fact that certain suits resort to novel tricks and trends probably has more to do with having only so much time and money to make a movie as well as the fact that you have to sell new toys to kids and new DLC to gamers.
@khandwa style sure, whatever they say goes… including what they already did and what we’re all complaining about lol.
Pretty much this.
Sorry but now anyone with a slight budget can get some really simple looking suits for Cosplay, and if done hastily it looks insanely cheap.
Take Daredevil’s design… it’s literally just a red suit… if we were to adhere to that it would just be red spandex, and it’d look insanely cheap. Adding panel lines, textured fabrics and variations in texture and color at least kind of breaks up the monotone look.
These are characters that were designed with the idea of being drawn over and over by different people over the course of decades, with deadlines so sharp they’d have to repeat those drawings sometimes multiple times in a single hour. They’re meant to be simple to replicate and easy to transfer from one pencilling artist to the other.
But when that’s translated literally to film it just looks cheap. Film costuming needs to tell a story like you said, it’s not just about aesthetic preference anymore… When I see Cap’s more modern outfits, they’re tactical, he looks like he can fight in modern combat relatively realistically. Then contrast that to the much simpler and more comic book accurate Dark Phoenix suits and I know with certainty which of these I prefer.
@@Slimshadow457 Exactly. Also the reason I think simple comic book outfits work is because of outlines and muscle definition. Those things can make a simple design look cooler, but in real life, you can't have black outlines and heavy muscle definition
I don’t mind the costumes. They just don’t need to be overly CGI all the time. Only use CG if it is needed and practical. The Iron Spider suit was fine but overused.
By the way, I hate the new Thor suit. Actually no, hates a strong word. I don’t like the new suit. It looks a bit too naff for me but then again this is just a bit of promotional art and by the time we get to the film and the way they debut or set up the suit I could be a fan of it because it fits the story. We shall see
the thing with the iron spider-suit made sense if you have a very strong suit whats stopping you from using the strongest one?
My problem with the Iron Spider suit is that the CGI for it never looked good on screen and the design is just way too busy to the point that you can barely make out the spider symbol most of the time.
@@wayothefro3249 bru you can say the same thing for iron man's cgi , why is everyone talking crap about the iron spiders CGI if iron man has pretty much the same cgi
wish they made the iron-spider suit as it was in the comics it was wayy cooler imo
and more distinct
That new Thor suit looks way too much like Wolverine.
For captain America’s suit in avengers I always thought that the suit might’ve looked good if it was made of leather partially or something and colors toned down a bit
They recently went back to the classic Spiderman suit and I think it looks pretty darn cool. I know Falcon's new Captain America suit is high tech and flashy and stuff but tbh I think it really works with his character (basically the falcon suit and cap suit combined).
Finally! Somebody finally notice that Marvel add a lot of unnecessary lines in their costumes design. Thank you!
I didn't really notice till about some years ago with Spiderman and his iron spider suit
Even though marvel has an over design problem, I think the Moon Knight costume looks pretty rad. I know it’s not too simplistic, but it has an Egyptian vibe to it with cloth. Cloth sort of like how Doctor strange wears his costume, it feels nice and fresh and definitely iconic.
but the show was boring AF
I think the simple explanation is to keep changing suits in order to sell more toys. No one will buy new toys if they basically look the same. Maybe there is a happy medium between new design but similar aesthetic.
Also it’s annoying to me when a character has a different suit each movie and sometimes they get a perfect suit at the end of the movie but they get a bad costume in their next appearance
This is what I’ve been thinking. I look at these MCU suits and it’s pretty much the same aesthetic. I like that Marvel are pushing more colorful costumes right now but it stills blows my mind that Hawkeye’s suit in Civil War is so muted when it’s clearly purple in the promotional art.
To each his own. As someone who read and loved a lot of 90’s comics runs featuring these characters, I really like the more elaborate style of costumes. Plus I like when each era, or in this case each movie in a character’s series, experiments with a new costume to kinda individualize each installment and tie the costume to that story.
I respect your opinion but the 90s?!
Do you remember when wonder woman got her black Canary looking outfit? Rock Thor? Or the over all thing of "every super hero needs a big metal armor" thing?
@@luigitrippitelli2333 I liked all of the above 😂 I know, I've got weird taste (or I'm just really into leather jackets)
Well if the late 2010's are a throwback to the 80s perhaps will get more 1990 influnced media in the 2020's.
@@TheBreadcrab and belts
@@luigitrippitelli2333 hey you forgot the "everyone is a stripper" faze in the mid nineties, or the spike covered characters with more edge than a teenage goth band playing in a razor factory.
Or the porn for ppl to young, poor &/or lame to buy porn comics, like anything Jim Balant did...
I didn’t even notice this was an issue lol
4:17 SAME!! 🫡
At first I was like “wtf the suits are cool “ but now I kind of see what you mean . The suits are getting so similar that even Peter Quill’s suit a person who had never set foot on earth for many years looked like he got his suit from the same tailor who made Ant-Man’s. We need more distinct suits
im sorry to burst your bubble but buddy starlord DOESNT have a suit, just his jacket mask boots and some jeans LMAO, at this point you guys r trying too hard to sound smart
@@ramensobs well technically it’s a Ravager jacket cause it has all the logos colors etc, since they always wear it whenever they do space duties you could say it’s basically his battle suit. Same rule applies to captain marvel since her suit is basically her Kree battle suit, Same thing with Sam Wilson since his falcon suit is just a modified version of his original Army uniform etc etc etc look man im not trying to sound smart or anything at this point people have been watching marvel content for 10+ years anyone can pull marvel facts out on the fly at this point. Bet u haven’t seen guardians of the galaxy in a while but u remembered Star Lord never specifically called his outfit a suit 🤷♂️
Also if anything this makes my point even more cause how in the world is a space pirate uniform similar to an outfit on earth? Peter could walk in to a club pre avengers and get away with it no one would bat an eye
@@judtsomeguy12190 ain’t no way youre comparing a jacket. a jacket with a bit of design on it to LITERAL SUITS. falcon’s suit literally has a robot inside of it💀 just cuz its a ravager’s jacket doesnt mean it can be compared to suits with supertechnology. please take a look at iron man’s suit and starlord’s outfit then please tell me atleast ONE thing that pairs it together other then “it looks like its from the same tailor🤓” shit
@@ramensobs see you had me for a second then you lost me. What they defined as a “Suit” is whatever the character wears when it’s battle time which is why they always have a “Suit up” scene. Yes StarLords jacket is just a jacket, but Hawkeye’s new suit is just spandex, Black widows suit is just spandex whatever the character wears when the fight goes down it’s marketed as their “Suit” which is why when u look up “Dr.Strange suit“ the first result you see is him in his robes and cape not him in the suit he crashed in, and not him in his wedding suit just robes. Also I didn’t directly compare him to Iron man I directly compared him to Ant-man and for good reason Antman’s suit is just leather with Pym Tech. The base of their battle suits is almost the same shit give or take the possibility Quill’s suit can withstand harsh planet climates.
The same thing is happening in video games at large. Look at games like Team Fortress 2, Left 4 Dead or Metal Gear Solid and then look at most modern games and how overdesigned most characters are.
Fr like warzone the only over designed operator for modern warfare was ghost Azrael skin and even that was good. Now we got sum skull dude idk the name of
The biggest costume problem for me is Thor's helmet. Why don't they ever let him wear for a fight scene. And you know what, I get it in some cases. First Thor movie and the Avenger's didn't need it, maybe they can tie it into his indescision to become King. Loki wears his horns all the time when he wants to be in charge, Thor puts it on when he feels he has earned the status. Boom, it would taken a couple of minutes of explaning and visual storytelling to make it work.
"Does [overdesign] detract from my enjoyment? No"
"Is this a nitpick? Yes"
Can't be much more straightforward than that
Ironically, when you say all the suits loom like they're from the same place it's because they, almost, all are at that point. Everyone in civil war except antman, black panther and bucky would have gotten their suits from either shield, which already was using stark tech for a lot, or stark himself. And bucky got his from hydra, which WAS shield.
Stark gives inputs, he doesn't supply SHIELD. He literally stopped manufacturing everything but only for himself because he did not trust other people with it, let alone SHIELD.
@@darn4285 he only shut down the weapons devisions of his company. We see in CA:WS that Tony gave shield his repulser tech for their new helacarriers. It's not a huge leap to assume the highly resistant and durable material used for shield uniforms, and later avenger suits, was also stark tech.
@@darn4285
No, Stark made tech for the Avengers. Remember his quote from Age of Ultron?
“Actually, he’s the boss. I just pay for everything, and design everything, make everyone look cooler.”
@@darn4285 He Literally said in one of the movies that he's the one that makes everybody look cool
I think an important thing to keep in mind with simple character design when it comes to characters like superheroes, is can someone draw it themselves. I think the best thing about comicbook heros is how iconic and easy to spot they are. If you asked a kid to draw Spider-Man, Superman, Batman you would most definitely be able to tell because the look alone is dedicated to that character and defines them. I feel bad for the kid who tries to draw that Thor promo art with 15 different shades of crayon 💀💀💀
I think also you'll notice that marvel knows it themselves (Halloween in Wanda vision, classic Loki, Thor's new growing up cut, spiderman's new homemade suit) and they want to give fans spicy moments of "comic" accuracy.
It's like 90s comics, more lines=cooler\better designs.
Next every character is going to have guns and belts.
I like both approaches and I don't want either to go away. I just like the variation in costumes for iconic characters. For example, the Batman Beyond suit is the best Batman design imo but adding details similar to the way the Spiderman PS4 game added detail to both 2099 suits.
Batman Beyond's suit looks better with a simplistic design instead of unnecessary detail.
@@doclouis4236 I mean it would look kinda weird. The reason why most simple designs for heros work in the comics and cartoons is because it's a drawing, and has its own art style. Also, there's a lot of black outlines around their costume. I guarantee if batman beyond's suit in arkham knight looked exactly how it did in the cartoon, it would look like a halloween costume since it wouldn't have any black outlines a comic would have
@@pizzatime4204 Look at Arkham City's design for the Beyond costume if you wanna talk about realism. And honestly, Arkham Knight's design is just a color swap of his default suit, kind of lazy.
But even the guy in the video disproved some of your points already since he gave examples of like the DCEU and the old Spider-man films suits.
Face it, the aesthetic for the suits in the MCU films is dull and boring. Lack of saturation, lack of individual design, completely all the same.
@@doclouis4236 to each their own bruh.i was just stating my opinion. Their is no objective stance and I'm fine with small details being added to designs like Batman Beyond or Spiderman 2099 that fit their world. Also I agree with most of what he said in the video I just don't agree that it's an across the board thing. I think the MCU and Marvels Avengers fits all the criticisms made in the video but outside of that I dont agree about any other costumes being overdesigned.
@@doclouis4236 imo the Arkham City Batman Beyond suit doesn't look good at all. It doesn't fit on Bruce and should look more sleek like an armor but that's just my opinion. Bruce is to big and the suit just looks like cloth which makes no sense for a suit that supposedly gives Batman Beyond superman level strength and jet boots. I imagine the suit looking similar to Ironmans Endgame suit but with half as much detail.
Totally agree with the point you’re making. I always think “would a little kid who likes superhero stories be able to more or less draw this character in a picture?” If not, I personally think it’s too over-designed
I have the exact same thought process. Ask a kid to draw the wasp's suit and he'll probably just scratch his head in confusion
@@poolgoldworldwild2163 exactly! Something I loved about superheroes growing up was being able to draw them in my own stories. Ain’t no way 10-year-old me would be able to draw anything resembling this new Thor suit
I started drawing because of Batman The Animated Series. The designs were simple enough that 5 year old me was able to build confidence drawing Batman and Robin and now I'm an animator.
@@jerdasaurusrex557 yup, I drew the whole Justice League when I was a kid. 😂
I could draw the iron spider chest piece with a bit of time when i was fairly little
Damn, I thought i was the only one that had these problems with the suits, its almost a relief to have stumbled on this video. Spot on with this analysis. Great video.
8:06 That's a bit of a stretch imo.
I also agree with most of what you've presented. Especially when you mentioned when the Avengers get together they look like they went to the same tailor and how DC does it better. I think DC realized how important individualism is... and not homogenizing those heroes when they get together. I personally think the "meshed/hashed" leather suits was overused on too many heroes that they don't stand out to me anymore.
can we appreciate that he is animating every single frame just for us?
Why do I keep finding you
There’s no animation in this
@@TheParagonIsDead who talked about an animation in this video mate? im saying hes animating a series just for our entertainment
@@tag6117 lmao wtf?
@@johntheanimator4317 what series
I remember when some people complained aboud the over saturation in details on Transformers.
I noticed the same some time ago in Tony's Nanotech suit, and it continued to present desings.
They aren't bad, but they left out the iconic colors and atractive desings as DC.
I studied marketing design in college. The V shape pattern you pointed out actually does have a specific purpose. The V shape pattern gives the illusion of strength and durability. They use it for the hero designs for that specific purpose. Vice versa, flip the V upside down and it gives the illusion soft and gentle. An upside down V design is used on many female products.
Shang-Chi’s is extremely disappointing. Looks tacky and uncomfortable and to me personally doesn’t resemble dragon scales at all. The concept art which I haven’t seen until now looked amazing though, curious as to what the thought process was on the change?
I assume his sequel will be more comic accurate so they'll go for a simpler and cooler suit for it. Maybe it's Shang Chi and the legend of the iron fist or the legend of the hand or whatever. I liked the hood design tbh.
My man was wearing Jordans and jeans while battling around a fcking dragon and handling ancient weapon rings, I couldn't stop thinking about it through the final battle
@@bryancordero6532 that’s kind of sick though
Marvel fun fact: After releasing Tale of the Zombie in 1973, Marvel trademarked the term ‘zombie’ for use in their comic books. They held the trademark until 1996 when they realised the trademark was almost impossible to enforce.
yea Mr.Obvious I:I
lmaoo
Is this why there's still the trend of zombie movies trying so hard to avoid saying the word zombie? A renmant of the time Marvel had the trademark?
This is how I felt about Marc's Moon Knight suit in the show- It's so much simpler in the comics, and imo, cooler! So glad they didn't mess with the Mr. Knight suit
Marc's moon knight suit looks fine?? I don't see how his suit is overdesign
@@nightmare_1874 mfs r reaching so hard rn
One of the few suits with excess lines that I think is great is the Flash's New 52 and Rebirth suit, as the lines flowed and accentuated the lightning that moved through his body as he moved.
i actually like the different designs, not OVERdesigns but different. i guess because im not the BIGgest comic book fan (i do like comics) is the reason why i think the og spiderman suit is being used too much. not saying that the suit is bad, i love the suit, but im getting tired of the suit. i liked the tasm 1 suit because it was different yet you knew from wich suit it was inspired by.
I loooved the TASM1 suit. It looked so real and the grip on the gloves was so satisfying to look at
@@andisfeliz
Yeah! If it had TASM2's eye lenses instead of the yellow/black one, it would've looked so much better
@@harshithn4810 Yep my biggest gripe with the TASM1 suit was that the eyes looked weird. Also the logo was barely noticeable so from far away it would often look like the suit didn't have a logo. Other than that I liked it. TASM2 suit was just way better
Cap's suit in Endgame is probably the best costume I've seen so far in the past 3 years, just because it feels simple but tangable. He's a super soldier, so he uses combat armor. But the scaly pattern still remains intact like the comics, just in a more practical way
I wish the red and blue was brighter but yes his endgame suit was pretty much perfect
@@galactic85 they should've used the age of ultra suit as a base, and then added scales and decreased on the red lines
wish it was a bit more blue tho
it looked almost gray at times tbh
@@jockeyfield1954 Yep. And the red is so dark it almost looks brown.
The two Moon Knight suis designs we've seen seem pretty good. Like, Marc's still looks busy but is still fairly simple, specially since it's like, 2 colours just smudged with dirt and whatnot. Then the Mr. Knight outfit is really simple, being just a plain white suit, white gloves, and a white mask with some thematic symbolism. I'd say the busiest part of Marc's design is his armor paddings. Like, they make sense but also look kinda wonky is certain shots.
I think it depends on the viewer. I personally like very complicated texture heavy suits, gives me a lot to look at.
Saturation.
i like detailed designs
@4:00 : "It looks like everybody got their suits from the same tailor"
Tony at the beginning of Age of Ultron "I design everybody's suits"
Sure doesn't work for Ant-Man and BP
Surprisingly, Doctor Strange new suit is more simple than his old. And while I love the overlapping clothe, it just shows that to make something look great, you don’t gave to change it from its origin.
Awesome video. I do like most modern suits, but I don’t like how over complicated they look. Imagining trying to make pencil drawings of them haha. Some designs work, but I’d like to see them try something more simple.
It might be an unpopular opinion but I actually like some of the more tactical outfits around the Winter Soldier era, but I definitely agree that too many suits just began to look like body armor or military wear in different colors. Like you said in the video the best part about superhero suits in the comics is the variation that shows off the character’s personality and background
I was walking in here expecting to get annoyed…but you know what, you right, you right. I dont hate anyone’s suits in general but you bring up good points. I saw Thor’s new suit in the thumbnail and rolled my eyes cause I happened to like the suit. I dunno, like, 7 min into the video when the suit pops up after you’ve made some of your points even I cringed a bit. Still love the colors, but yeah, too liney.
I noticed this. Last week I drew the
MCU iron spider suit. It took me nearly a week to make due to the many details I had to draw and redraw.
I think suits used to look simple in the comics, because... Comics were hand-drawn. As well as old cartoons. Making suit simple makes it easier for the artist. And now we no longer have this limitation in the movies, hence the increased complexity.
One of the best looking Thor fan concept designs that I ever saw that simply put they wanted Serious Thor back.
The design sported his braided beard from Endgame, his long but faded flowing hair, the body armor we see from Ragnorok and Infinity War, a coat of fur holding his torn cape, no chain mail sleeves, and wielding Stormbreaker.
I can’t remember where I saw the fan-concept design at, if it even was fan made or official, but that design looked awesome and realistic while maintaining a simple and unique look to his character. The design made Thor truly look like someone who had went through Ragnorok, Infinity War, Endgame, and faced off against a comic accurate Gorr, one who watched Jane die and became hardened by all his experiences. I honestly feel like that type of design for Thor is the one the MCU really needed after Endgame and yet they went for a bright and uninspired design in Love and Thunder that while it did look cool in its own right, it didn’t honestly fit Thor in my opinion.
4:49 Oh my God, thank you so much, I thought I was going crazy when I couldn't NOT notice it. The final straw was when I saw Netflix's Daredevil's red costume. Not saying its a bad thing at all, but if you use it for every character, it loses its charm. I personally think it mostly fits Cap, Natasha's and Clint's costume the most, mostly because it fits their "Somewhat regular human wearing the most efficient equipment" aesthetic
I almost completely agree however some of the new suits I am in love with, Moon Knight looks sick, Scarlet Witch is sick and the new hawkeye suits are pretty good too
I agree 100%. I hate how everything is "nanotech" and just forms around the character now. Call me old fashion, but I prefer seeing the character physically put on their helmet/mask. Seeing the front part of Iron Man's mask just lift up to expose Stark's face was gorgeous because that's how it was in the comics the majority of the time. I hated Cap's suit in the Avengers and I'm so glad they went back to the military-look. Can't wait to see the simple Spider-Man suit for the upcoming movies!
4:45
I'm glad someone was able to talk about this.
It was especially obvious in the eternals and even more so when they were trying to bring in Ms Marvel
Not only that but they're all glossy. All of them. It's like they all get the Iron Man sheen for no reason
4:27 best version of iron spider.
I don't understand why every Charakter/hero need a new suit for a new movie.
Just use the best and coolest desings film industry.
I had so much fun drawing the X-men black leather movie suites as a kid, I could remember them and it was fun to draw the color highlights
i 100% agree. i always thought DC nailed costume design, where the MCU just makes everyone look the same.
I always found that comic book suits look best when they have a centerpiece of some sort, while the rest of the design remains normal.
Like that's usually the chest symbol for most heroes, deadpool and the original black widow suit have their symbol on their belt.
Thor's Champion armor had the cool new futuristic helmet which i wish would come back.
And that focus on one stand-out piece of apparel is what they desperately need to give Shang-Chi, and each Eternal.
It's also why Spider-Man's PS4 design is well regarded. While the white spider is distinct enough, it has enough of the classic look to be recognizable as a spidey suit.
5:06 omg your right
Dude that angle shape is now on moonknight and Reed Richard's